seawind

And is it really possible to snort everything in sight during college (except you, Harper) and still maintain the grades needed to land these high-profile, high-paying jobs?

Oh I did, but it still didn't quite gel for me. But then honestly I wasn't really all that invested in his and Harper's story to begin with.

I'm still trying to figure DVD out too, but this I appreciated, because it was my first indicator of who he is other than a corporate mouthpiece. I don't think it was just the sweeping it under the carpet that was upsetting, though — Adler was DISGUSTING in his assertion that the issue of something as horrific and sensitive as possible systemic sexual harrassment in his company was beneath him and not worth his time and how dare you, and the fact that DVD retreated to the bathroom with the urge to vomit was something I could absolutely sympathize with. I do wonder if I was always extremely naive to think that any company out there might genuinely care about its employees, though. Having done the corporate thing for many years, I've never had a DVD/Adler-type moment but there's been plenty that have come pretty close.

Me either. It's more likely that they'd just deliberately run themselves into a plate glass wall over and over again until they bleed. Is it really so common these days for that many young hires to not only do that much drugs but also just snort whatever any stranger offers them without worrying one iota about whether it might, oh, I don't know, seriously harm or even kill them?

While I thought their final scene was well done, the brother seemed to be — whether justified or not — behaving like someone who had been convinced (brainwashed?) by others that his family was 100% toxic, and that he should have nothing to do with them ("I need to get back to my life," the phone call, etc.). And I was surprised that I really didn't care all that much. I'm not sure that any of it gave me any sort of additional insight into Harper or made any connections with the rest of the story.

I guffawed when Eric referred to Rishi as Kendall Roy. Spot on.

(raises hand) Which makes it even harder for me to totally buy how she not only seems to know how to play the game so well while only having been in the trenches for such a short time, but also how everyone with much more experience gets so taken in by her.

I wish I had a deep real-world understanding of the finance-speak on this show, so I could get more of a sense of whether 1) Harper is as smart about the business as she (or Eric, or Jesse) thinks she is; 2) if she IS that smart, WHY she is that smart (esp. given her apparent lack of higher education). At the least, she needs lessons in improving her fake smiles, because I'd think clients/potential clients could spot them a mile away...

I'm a bit late to the party but catching up with eps fast... I'm glad someone else is confused by Yasmin's timidness for most of season one...unless she really was just that insulated as a rich girl growing up and never experienced misogyny or being surrounded by (crude) white men running the show? I guess it's possible. Re: the new girl, it's very convenient for her that she gets post-pandemic Wyndham and 12-step Kenny to deal with. I highly doubt she'd be demanding (or getting) the same level of respect if she'd started the same year as Yasmin.

The clip from RW where Dominic said to Tami all those years ago to please not bring someone else into the situation says it all. She's not a high school girl who needs her boyfriend to come beat someone up who is disrespecting her. That was just RIDICULOUS. I feel bad for the other castmates having to be subjected to all that unpleasantness.

I thought about this same thing. Before the NY Homecoming show revealed that Eric wasn't there, I was thinking how great it would be if they could send all of them somewhere fun to make up for the Jamaica trip that the boys didn't get to enjoy back then. Oh well. At least Heather brought an entire bar along with her. :-)

I have my VHS tapes too, LOL! But have no fear... it's on YT :) Just look up "Real World Reunion 1996 MTV with commercials" Re: Beth, she said "You know what, Tami? You should know that you should never believe anything that you see in print." With a smile on her face, too. ETA: See the attached proof of said VHS :-) #oldschool

I just posted above about the reunion special they did in '96 on MTV; in it, Tami confronts Beth about remarks in the press that Beth supposedly made insisting that Tami married her husband for money. 😆 Which Beth, of course, denies, but not very convincingly.

I know, I know. But still. I just hate seeing my favorites miss out. Especially on top of BeckyGate. I hope they all eventually were/will be able to reunite with Eric. So here's something interesting: all this nostalgia made me go hunting for the recording of the reunion they did in 1996 on MTV with the first 4 casts. In that special, Tami and David saw each other for the first time since living together, and they talked and made amends. They made up! By the end of it, Tami was even standing with her arm around him. And while I remembered a lot about that special, I'd completely forgotten all about that part. So I wonder now, why was it treated on Homecoming as if their making up never even happened? (I get that back then, Tami still hadn't disclosed her body dysmorphia, but still.) And the other cast members were there as well (except for Dom and Aaron, of course), so they knew what took place and they also had the opportunity to speak with David and spend time with him. Did that reconciliation somehow go POOF by the time Homecoming came around?

Yes yes! This, 100%. I think that's why people don't trust her (it's probably only been a couple of people, but why does it feel like dozens have stated "I don't trust Beth?" LOL). Even if they think she's being genuine, there's just something about it that rings the alarm bells in the back of your head to give you pause.

I haven't thought about this cast in ages (but like others have said, once you dive back in, it's as if you can recall the entire show even though you can't remember what you had for lunch yesterday, LOL), but I think I may have finally figured Beth S. out: she's a follower (obviously), not a leader, but she very much always wants to be part of the inner circle of whomever the leader(s) is/are. And Tami, while she wasn't a Queen Bee, was definitely an alpha (your dog analogy is not wrong). I recall now that I used to find her talking heads a bit fake; now, I think that back then, she was projecting whatever image she thought she needed and saying whatever she thought she had to say in order to fit in with whomever was "on top" at any given moment, and that's why they read as a bit fake to me. That way, she would always be in with the good crowd, and could never be scolded or found to be "wrong" about something. (This is, of course, just my own humble opinion.) Plus I think she idolized Tami just a bit, and therefore she wanted her idol to think she was cool. It now helps me understand just how she pivoted so dang fast during the blanket incident (or maybe it was the bash of the door to her head); she was roaring along with everyone else (David WAS right about that) until Tami was able to express her objection in a way that didn't involve shrieking (and I'm not blaming Tami at ALL here; the way David was YANKING and DRAGGING her so forcefully, I would have been surprised if anyone in her situation would have been able to get out anything coherent until it stopped). The instant she picked up on Tami's mood, Beth's stance didn't just change; it changed to appear as if that's how Beth had been feeling all along. BTW, I still feel about that incident the same way I did back then: the blanket incident, with all its misunderstandings and ridiculous misuse of the word rape, should not have been the reason David was kicked out of the house; it should have been because of his MULTIPLE incidents of aggression, with the blanket merely being the final straw. And why does this miserable cast get a boat ride when the joyfilled, loving OG cast didn't? SMH.

I'm (VERY) late to the party, but just wanted to share my thoughts with the 3 or 4 people left who might read them, LOL... Agree with everyone about the nostalgia, the tears, loving the cast (sans Becky), Julie & Heather ruling reality TV, all of it. Having watched this during its original run, I freaking loved this, and I believe that the producers OWE us a few more episodes with Eric actually WITH the others (sans Becky). Or on a yacht (S2 cast didn't deserve that, just sayin') or remote island somewhere. Anywhere, I don't care. Because this was WAY too short. Like someone else said, we just got them back. :-( We need a reunion of the reunion! Kevin & Becky: 1) Becky's "excuse" that she was blindsided by the show running that clip is the biggest heap of BS going. It's a REUNION SHOW; clips are gonna be shown! Though, I was really surprised that THAT is the clip that was dissected, since before this aired, all the articles and talk were about Kevin & Julie's fight. 2) I agree about Kevin's maturity (thank GOD). This was, in a way, a bit of closure I had no clue I even needed. 100% agree about Kevin being right back in 1992 — except, at that time, his fake laughter and, more pointedly, his vile namecalling were so offputting that he himself made it difficult to absorb the points he was trying to make. One of the worst ways to sabotage your case? Calling women bitches and whores; once you do that, any credibility you have goes right out the window. Seeing that Kevin now knows that he didn't exactly present his side in the best way back then (and I do cut him major slack since they were all SO young!), combined with how maturely he handled things with Becky now, speak volumes to his character and to how much he's grown as a person. Thank goodness he was able to keep forging his path after the show ended, I never knew he got so much hate afterward. That makes me really sad. Thank god Twitter wasn't around then — good lord, could you imagine. 3) Becky, on the other hand... just, wow. Wow. My jaw was on the floor the entire time. It's all been said here already, except I do wonder if Norm wasn't the only one who told her to shut up and we just didn't get to see it :-) I kept talking to the screen: "Why isn't anyone trying to stop her? Why isn't anyone telling her to STOP INTERRUPTING KEVIN FOR CRISSAKES!!!" The fact that she did not let him finish ONE single sentence — not one — was just beyond the pale. So was "Isn't anyone going to help me?" WTF. I think I might like to be Heather in my next life. Can you imagine how different the world would be if we could all react (or, rather, avoid reacting) to BeckyGate the way Heather did — with calm, grace, and wisdom? The joy that woman brought was phenomenal, and I loved every second of it. Like others have said, put Heather and Julie in a show. They could watch paint dry and I'd watch them watch it, because you know it would be hella entertaining. Last thought: I remember watching the 10-year anniversary special and someone (an audience member, I think) commented on the fact that the other casts that were present (I think 1 thru 4 were there) seemed to still be exhibiting a lot of tension/drama/etc. but that the OG cast was giving off this vibe of happiness and love (paraphrase), sitting in each other's laps, lol. That is still SO true today. I still think it was much too soon after S1 for the S2 cast to be TOO strongly affected by "reality TV" in the same way that the later seasons were — by devolving into the "vapid, drunken hot tub party" syndrome — which I think makes it even sadder that the S2 cast stands in such stark contrast to S1. That group, even to this day, is an unhappy bunch (I say this after having watched all their reunion eps that have aired so far). They're still hard to like, or enjoy even a little bit (and they didn't even have Puck!). Even if you take David and the "blanket incident" out of the equation, you're still left with people who just didn't mesh very well together, and that's too bad, especially coming on the heels of our beloved OG cast (sans Becky, lol). It makes our happy crew stand far, FAR out from the crowd. I'm really just so happy that they're all healthy and (reasonably) happy, and I'll be there for the 30-year reunion with my VHS tapes in my lap.

How do you know that that's GRRM's ending? His ending could have simply been that Dany dies.

Well. That was that. At least it didn't make me want to vomit like last week's ep. So, just a few quick questions before I say goodbye to this show: How in the FUCK did they all know that Jon stabbed Daenerys? Are we supposed to assume that he told them himself? I guess that IS a very Jon thing to do. Yes, show, we see the little burnt horse toy that belonged to the dead child Arya couldn't save. Again. Boo freaking hoo. When Dany made her speech on the steps, she said something to the Blood of her Blood about having "saved" the people of King's Landing. Um... Speaking of, were they seriously talking about rebuilding King's Landing? Like, seriously? Where do you rent the construction equipment for that kind of cleanup in Westeros? HeyTyrion, don't be in such a hurry to send the Unsullied away; who else is going to be willing or able to do something about the thousands and thousands of corpses? I would have thought that with that extreme level of destruction, the city would be left to rot. Much like this season. That's right, I'm here all week, folks. So Sam went from library assistant to Grand Maester just like that? Whom did he have to sleep with to get that gig? I'm telling Gilly. Now, it's time to say goodbye to what will probably still remain one of my favorite shows of all time (for Seasons 1 - 6, anyway). In doing so, I feel apologies are necessary for many of our beloved characters: Drogon, so many of us thought you might not last this ep. You looked gorgeous, as always. I'm so sorry, Drogon, that the show took away your family. I hope you can visit Jon sometimes. Thank you, though, for burning the fuck out of that throne. For one brief moment, I saw Viserys looking out of Dany's eyes when she and Jon were in front of the throne. I'm so sorry, Dany, that the show Dracarys'd your character arc and turned you into a child murderer, because reasons. As you died, I thought about all the good you did across the Narrow Sea, and how hopeful and moving the ending of the episode Mhysa was, when you were surrounded by all the innocent men, women, and children you freed from tyranny, as they reached out to touch you and call you "Mother," and how triumphant and exciting it felt to watch you sail to Westeros at last, and it made me sad for you. I didn't need you to win the Iron Throne, but you did deserve better than you got. I hope you're with Khal Drogo and Rhaego now, and that Viserion and Rhaegal are flying high keeping watch over you. Peter Dinklage deserves every award ever. At least his acting got to shine tonight. I cried with him for Jaime (sorry Cersei, you don't get any of my tears ever). I'm so sorry, Tyrion, that the show decided to give you basically nothing to do this season. I'm sorry the show made you give up Varys. And I'm so sorry that they made you once again do what you thought was right by helping your brother and that they made you find his body, for we all know that if the show had continued the excellent writing and plot development of its first 6 seasons, Jaime would never even have been in King's Landing at that moment in the first place. I'm also sorry that they're apparently making you work in the Red Keep now, which I would have thought would be hella dangerous with much of the building demolished. I'm sorry that Brienne didn't cross out your name in the book on Jaime's page, where it still says that you killed Joffrey. But most of all, I'm so sorry that you never got to ride a dragon. You were always my favorite. I think I would have really liked Brienne finishing Jaime's page of his knightly deeds so much more if my last memory of her wasn't her weeping in her nightgown in that scene from Melrose Place that should never have happened. I'm so sorry, Brienne, that the show completely retconned Jaime and essentially turned you into a crying Padme from Revenge of the Sith. You deserved so much more than that (just as Pod deserves more than pushing King Bran around). I'm also sorry they left you in King's Landing instead of letting you be at Sansa's side, where you always believed you should be in honor of your steadfast service and devotion to Catelyn Stark. Raise a glass with me, won't you? Here's to Ser Brienne: a true knight of Westeros through and through. Speaking of Jaime...while this season has been airing, I've been looking back at some of the S1 & S2 eps and marveling at just how different Jaime was back then. Nikolaj Coster-Waldau did a phenomenal job. His character journey was nothing short of brilliance until S8. Jaime, I'm so sorry that the show assassinated your character this season. I'm so sorry that they sent you back to Cersei. We know that wasn't you. While I personally never thought that you were head over heels in love with Brienne, you did care for her and you two had something incredibly special, and you never would have left her like that. While it was completely in character that you could never fully be at peace with yourself due to your misdeeds and the way so many others thought of you for so long, it's beyond depressing that the show essentially s*** all over your hard-won character development in the end. You, also, deserved so much better. Rest in peace, Kingslayer. Cersei, Cersei, Cersei...I'm so sorry that the show gave you nothing to do this season except to stand around and look smug (a complete waste of Lena Headey's talent). I'm sorry that the show didn't have Dany turn Drogon and fly straight at you and burn you right then and there. But most of all, I'm sorry that you were denied the death you truly deserved, which was being dragged through the streets by all the commoners you despised so much. Shame. Shame. Shame. Ding. And speaking of the commoners...to the good people of King's Landing, I'm so sorry that the show made you burn to death for no reason at all. Dothraki screamers, Unsullied — I'm sorry that the show gave 2/3 of you honorable deaths in The Long Night but then apparently resurrected you in the finale, just so that Daenerys could have a large audience when she made her speech. Grey Worm, I'm sorry that the show warped your good heart and gentle nature to the extent that it did after Missandei's death. Missandei, I'm so sorry that the show turned you into a pawn. You deserved SO much better. Valar Morghulis. Varys, you also deserved better. I'm sorry that we never got to find out what the voice in the flames said all those years ago. Speaking of flames, I'm sorry, Sandor, that you ultimately died by falling into fire. I hope you're at peace now. Heading North...oh, Sansa. I really don't know how I feel about your characterization since last season. I'm sorry the show essentially turned you into a catty bitch. If they were going to have you go that route, I'm really sorry they didn't do it back when Littlefinger threw Lysa through the moon door, and you colored your hair all dark and looked so wonderfully Morticia Adams coming down those stairs in the Eyrie. I'm sorry we didn't get to see what could have happened if you and Petyr had stuck together after that and formed a devilishly wicked duo. It could have been so much fun watching you two scheme until you eventually had to pay the price. Instead, you're now Queen in da Norf. Yay...? And your sister. Arya, I'm really sorry that we didn't get to see you use Littlefinger's face to kill Cersei, and that they forced you to kill the Night King instead, because reasons. I like that you made peace with The Hound and that you're heading out into the world to explore the great unknown, but I just wish it felt a bit more triumphant than it does. You deserve, at the minimum, some peace. Bran, I'm sorry that...oh, wait, I'm going to go away now. Got some needless warging to do. The last of the Starks. Jon, I'm sorry that so many people didn't like how broody you were. I think GRRM gave you a lot of heavy responsibility and heartache in your character arc, so I totally get your broodiness. I'm NOT sorry that you were as honorable as Ned, because while it may be dull and boring to some, it shows that you were a man of good character. I'm so sorry that the show forced you to "love" Daenerys (I personally never saw any chemistry at all between the two of you), and I'm sorry that we never got to see you actually discuss how you felt about being her nephew. I'm REALLY sorry that the show didn't want to spend the direwolf budget so that we could have a scene with you properly saying goodbye to Ghost before you went to King's Landing. But thank you, Jon, for giving him a nuzzle tonight. I knew you wouldn't let us down, because you've always strived to do the right thing. Now, your watch has finally en– oh, wait, it's beginning AGAIN? JFC. Ghost, I'm really, really sorry that no one could be bothered to put a bandage of some sort on your ear stump or to clean the dried blood off your muzzle for the past few months. SMH. Tormund, I'm really sorry that you didn't get to make babies with the big woman. I'm sure you will never lack for company, though. You keep on being you. Joffrey, you were the best villain we loved to hate. I'm so sorry you're not still alive so we could watch more people slap you. Olenna, I'm sorry you had to lose your family and Highgarden to Cersei. You were as fierce as a Targaryen, and you lit up the screen every second you were on it. Margery, I'm sorry that you were wasted so long as a captive of the High Septon, and that even though you were smarter than everyone in the Sept that day, the plot demanded that people stand still even though you told them to move, and you had to just stand there waiting for the end. Loras, I'm sorry that you had to have that stupid symbol carved into you just moments before you died anyway. Davos, I'm sorry that boring, arrogant shithead grammar nazi Stannis cut off your fingers and ignored your wisdom. I'm also sorry you had to lose your son at the battle of the Blackwater because of him. And I'm so, so sorry about what happened to Shireen. I hope you live out the rest of your days peacefully and happily; if nothing else, being around the likes of Tyrion and Bronn on a daily basis will no doubt be highly entertaining and eventful. Melisandre, I'm sorry that the Lord of Light is apparently a d***. Jorah, I'm sorry you never got to make peace with your father. I'm sorry that the show didn't realize the crazy chemistry that you and Dany had. I'm sorry that she would look at you with sunshine in her eyes and love in her heart and yet she couldn't give you more. I think maybe you could have saved her. Rest in Peace, Jorah the Andal. Lady Mormont, I'm sorry that you were killed by a giant. If you had to leave us, you left in glorious fashion taking down that beast, and your passionate spirit will stay with us forever. The North Remembers. Ned, Robb, Oberyn, Hodor, and other good people of Thrones who left us earlier on: I'm glad we got to know you. I'm sorry you couldn't have been with us longer. To all the strong and honorable women of GoT: I'm really sorry that you didn't wind up owning the day in the end. It sure looked like that was going to happen back in Seasons 6 & 7, when it was mostly all women making decisions and planning to rule. And now you're stuck yet again with a male monarch — except for the North, of course. (Did you catch all those side eyes as Sansa announced the North's independence? Something tells me not everybody's going to love that the North can't play nice in the sandbox like everyone else.) And lastly, show...I'm sorry that you couldn't be bothered to edit the opening credits one last time to the extent that you should have. I'm sorry that GRRM didn't finish writing the books and, as a result, your creators would ultimately want so badly to be done with you that they would Dracarys the fuck out of all the incredible storytelling that happened up until the last season and a half or so. I'm sorry that so many of the narrative choices in the end just didn't make any sense. I'm so sorry that the double Ds betrayed you — and in doing so, betrayed us. I'm sorry that our final memories of you will be tainted by that. And mostly, I'm really sorry that we will never be able to fix you. The last two seasons didn't do you the justice you deserved, show. I'm more sorry than I can say that that will be your legacy. I'll do my very best to remember and honor you as you were when Winter was coming. And now our watch has ended. Good night, GoT.

I really don't know what I'm feeling right now. This was a visually incredible episode. But that may be the best thing I can say about it. I have no problem with the total destruction, and with more of a sad ending rather than "yay, the heroes saved the day." (Honestly I thought The Long Night would have felt more like this.) I have no problem if the story wants Dany to go mad. But this was forced, rushed, and unearned. I get what they were going for: first she loses Jorah, then Rhaegal, then Missandei, then Varys betrays her, then she effectively loses Tyrion, and then Jon "rejects" her. So Dany had nothing left but Drogon. BUT. That was not enough for me to believe that she would just BURN innocents by the thousands. The way they did it, It just didn't work. She had EVERYTHING — the city surrendered, she had her throne. When Drogon lifted off after the bells rang, I really thought she was going to head directly for Cersei. But no, apparently she just really needed to destroy her throne and burn all the little children along with it. Sigh. 😞 So you put the Golden Company OUTSIDE your walls? OK...because that makes great battle sense. Remember when 99.9% of the Dothraki were killed in The Long Night? Oh, wait... Remember when 99.9% of the Unsullied were killed in The Long Night? Oh, wait... I really hate that Varys died for nothing. NOTHING. (Unless one of his letters makes something happen next episode, I suppose.) One good thing in this episode: the scene between Tyrion & Jamie. Such great acting. Oh the other good thing in the episode: Sandor yelling "FUCKING DIE!!!!!" The double Ds robbed me of the joy of bringing Cersei down. I couldn't enjoy Cersei's comeuppance as much as I should have been able to when thousands and thousands of innocents were needlessly burning. They also destroyed Jaime's character arc. Broke my heart on that one. Remember how awesome it was when we had Dany, Yara, Olenna, and Mama Sand Snake in a room, and it was all women getting ready to rule the world? Good times. Damn if they didn't take a hard right from there.

THIS.

AAAGGHHH see I'm so mad I can't even get my castles right!

Oh yeah, WHAT THE FUCK WITH GHOST, SHOW??? I could accept you sending Ghost north, but he whimpers at Jon and you have Jon just frown at him? What in the ever-loving fuck was that? And you mean to tell me that everybody at Winterfell had time to clean up that absolute mountain of bodies in front of the castle and make all these perfectly neat funeral pyres, but nobody had 5 fucking seconds to wash the blood off of Ghost? The hell with you.

100%. The double Ds totally forced this, and it sucks big time. I'm so intensely disappointed right now I have a huge pit in my stomach. They just blew it. Completely. 😞