JenJenBosco

First, I didn't know how to move my comment to here after I wrote it, but it occurs to me that it didn't really discuss the episode, so maybe it should be moved? I don't know. Anyway, I want to preface this by saying that I don't want him to become a killer, I know there are a lot of fanfictions or fanfic writes that liked to support this idea that he could become a serial killer that they would never be able to find, but I never liked that idea. However, I think he does have depression, especially with what you said above. The only people he has in his life are his co-workers, and he's consistently taken away from them at regular intervals. I wonder if this constantly happening is making him wonder if they are only his friends because of work. Do you they seem him or call him when he's off? We don't know. I've wondered if he feels betrayed by the 100./30 plan, given that he didn't actually kill anyone, and he spent time in prison for no reason. If these were the old writers who were interested in his character or at least appeared that way, I would say that they could help him the way you suggested and he would get better, but with these writers, I don't think they want him to get better. I think they would assume that it would be more fun to write him as going off the deep end. Anyway, I hope I am wrong because I just can't deal with a serial killer Reid.

Although I haven't been watching since I found out that Spencer went to prison last year, and this is why: After Maeve, I had hopes that Spencer could come back and still get to be happy. Over the course of season 9, I figured that he just needed time, which makes sense given that anyone would need time after that. In season ten, it seemed like they weren't interested in giving him happiness given the only story line he had was Gideon's death. Season 11 was the same thing, his mom was getting worse and there was a chance that he could get that illness, too. When I found out about the prison, I figured that now, there's only a few options for him before the series ends: Previously, there were times when I thought there was a chance that he risked his life so much was because he felt like he had nothing to live for. I could see him letting himself be killed by unsub, killing himself, or becoming a psychopath. I just can't see him bouncing back after everything he's been through. It's certainly not what I want, but I do understand why he would do it. And if what everyone has been saying is true about his behavior in this episode, I think the writers might actually be going there with him. After all, not everyone gets a happy ending. Elle and Gideon both got partial happy endings. Everyone else who's left at least had someone else in their lives, but since it's been made clear that Spencer wants a family, kids, and everything else, but it keeps getting denied to him since Maeve. Prior to that, he seemed perfectly happy on his own. After that, it's like he had a void in his life, this experience he's had lately between prison, being on probation, and not feeling connected with the team anymore, I can see him just giving up. They need to stop beating him up, but at this point, even if they stopped, it might be too late.

I can't really explain what it is about Psychodrama that I don't like compared to the other two, I suppose it just kept switching around. He was a bank robber than a sexual sadist then a child killer because of his mom...It's just felt a little all over the place to me. However, like you said with P911, it has really good moments. Also, agree that Perfect Storm is definitely the best of the three. Now, I really want to hear Spencer go on and on about Soap Operas, at first I was surprised he'd be interested, but I imagine that he likes just about everything. Also, I dislike his hair too, but I like the glasses, and I enjoyed Spencer and Elle in this episode a lot. Throughout her time on the show they made an interesting and good pair. I think this was the first time Hotch realized that he might be missing out on his son's life. It's never stated, but I do wonder what would have happened if he hadn't made it for Jack's delivery (I assume he made it), but given their cases and leaving suddenly, I do wonder if he almost missed it or did miss it...what then? Was he there for sonograms and other things? Was this the first thing he missed? He clearly missed his first steps (at least that's what he said in the episode, right?) As for Morgan: I like the idea of Spencer reuniting with Lila and that being the reason for studying the maps. I'd like to believe that however short-lived it was they were together for some time, however, I headcannon that he has had other people in his life besides his mom but no one knows because he's a private person. Maybe it's because of all his trauma, he needs more than the team. As for the team members, I honestly wonder about it because of scenes like the one with Gideon and Hotch or the one with Elle and Hotch (in Unfinished Business). Just like watching Garcia sadly turn off the screens at the end of Perfect Storm, it shows how awful things can get, and that they need to decompress sometimes. -> I don't think I could do it, and I wonder how they do it. Although, I think this is one of the reasons why: Anyway, yeah it's been months, but I did get the chance to watch yesterday, and I should have more time now, so hopefully more soon! I also loved hearing your thoughts as well.

Psychodrama: A serial killer in the making...I liked the start of this. The escalation was interesting. This is the first time where we see Haley since the fisher king, and it's Haley upset because Hotch was missing and not answering the phone. "I know this job is important to you, but we're important, too. ...I don't want you to wake up one day in some random city and realize that you don't know your own son." -> I do understand her point, and I think that Jack really was the turning point for her. The point where it was no longer about the couple, but about the family. I loved the conversation from Spencer's question, "What would you call him?" "Pervert" "Scumbag" "Ass--" "Please let's focus" I like how they have been discussing how to hit the ground running in these cases lately...and each member says "Okay I should do this or that" until the options are out. "Keep it clean and don't call me honey" -> that made me laugh. I enjoyed Garcia's little freaked out pacing that lead to the lifts realization. I think really enjoy the Morgan and Gideon pairing. I've noticed this in previous episodes, but I really do. I also enjoyed Spencer explaining the geographical profiling even though it only narrowed down the possibilities to a few hundred thousand. I did like how the bank robber was cocky enough to do a wheelie as he got away. "He did almost everything that you predicted." "It sucks to be right." While I enjoy the analysis of this episode, I'm not a fan of bank robbery episodes, and I am not fan of this weird situation that the unsub does. I did enjoy the pause to see Hotch watching wee little Jack walking and kicking a ball soccer player in the making....Morgan just shrugged it off "So fill a new one when you get home". I liked seeing Hotch's struggles throughout the case. I do enjoy when they get more than one guy. I wonder why Spencer has been studying a lot of LA maps...there's no follow up to why he says this? Why did Morgan not use the key when it was offered to him? I thought it was weird the Hotch had the authority to tell the paramedics not to given him pain meds after shooting him. I did enjoy the end scene. Everyone asleep except Hotch and Gideon. Hotch telling Gideon that the trainees toured the BAU and they all want to be a part of the BAU, and he said it was a great job, but he didn't tell them, "I didnt tell them what it's like to spend their life in this hell." "It's fun, isn't it?" "I mean who's to blame for a guy like Shepard? His mother? Society? All of it, none of it? it's gets worse and worse with each case." "Save one life, we save the world." "Yeah. Well, one thing I didn't tell trainees." "What's that?" "We do not get paid enough." I liked this conversation because it makes you wonder how (if it wasn't the TV thing) these people are able to continue for so long. Anyway, I did not like this episode after the last couple. I don't really know why.

The Perfect Storm: This team of unsubs have been working on this for years, which is interesting as things change throughout the years. Which puts them in the BAU's radar. It's funny that Jacksonville thought it was 1 unsub, while the BAU jumps up to 2 unsubs, but it ended up being 3. I thought the reason for the videos suddenly being sent were interesting. ->The team were upset that the new victim's mother went to the media. I find it interesting that it increased the time between the kills. I liked that the team didn't just focus on the victims they knew about, but searched for other possible connections and victims using victimology. I liked the mentions of other pairs and the understanding of the 'Perfect Storm'. I also enjoyed the profile scene. I really feel for Garcia in the episode, but I liked that despite not being okay, she managed to be totally professional. -> I loved her surprise that it wasn't Morgan calling, but Gideon. Also, loved his compliment after what happened with the Fisher King. I thought it was interesting that the wife pretended to be a victim and was the dominate personality. It certainly added a twist to the story. -> i thought it was interesting that the team felt bad about asking her to be in a room with Tony, and she ended up being the killer... I liked the fight with Tony and Hotch's "What you couldn't wait?" I enjoyed the moments meshed together as the team separate groupings figure out that Amber was the Dominate. "Believe me, she'll never be the same." Only 1 in 8 abused become the abuser...that's interesting. Overall, I thought this episode was interesting and kept my attention, I was certainly surprised by Amber's position as the Dominate the first time I watched, and I liked the reactions by the team at the end. "At least the families will get closure." "And we did save Tiffany Pierce."

I watched P911 today. I really liked this episode. It's different than the usual cases since it doesn't involve serial killers. It focused on the internet's involvement in helping getting children... I enjoyed Katie, and I wish given that she was a member of the BAU that she could come back. Also loved that she joked about herself at the beginning. "Really? I heard she was a bitch." "No one ever called you that, Katie." "Well, not to my face." "We don't need to worry about paperwork, we have Garcia." -> interesting. I liked Elle's accidental text bringing her back in...and loved the conversation with Spencer and Hotch. "Yesterday I found myself looking forward to watching a soap opera..." "Which one?" "I need to go back to work." LOL I liked the mentions of warrants being approved, and that I liked the mention of Katie wanting to use her first name...it's more personal. I liked the surprise of the kid doing that to himself. I really like JJ and Garcia together, they seem to make a good team, and I can see why they hang out outside of work, and why Garcia is "Did they teach you that in FBI school?" "Nah, they taught me that in Brooklynn." At some point, Gideon sends Morgan away from the pedophile, and I wonder if he was beginning to put the pieces together on "Come on Genius, do something genius-like." I like that they helped Kevin, and found another pedophile in the process, so that at least there wasn't just one bad guy being put away. It sucks that the Media ruined things for the team, even if they eventually used it to help them. Katie's struggle with moving on to the next kid makes me wonder more about how the team deals with choosing one case over another. I thought it was interesting that they had team run out of time, and yet, still save the kid. I also felt for the mom at the end, she's going to have a hard time reestablishing a close relationship with the son she lost when he was one-year old. I wonder if the mom ever gave up on the child? or did she always wonder what happened? Hotch said something interesting to Katie at the end there, "You know, Katie, no one has ever been doing this as long as you have, maybe it's time to get out?" "I don't know if i can anymore." It makes me wonder if the team members wonder the same thing. Overall, I really enjoyed the case and episode.

I loved that, too. @Mislav By the way, it probably didn't show through my response, but I did love your questions, they were all good questions.

@MISLAV Oh, I know the plot doesn't make sense, but I love the episode that it doesn't bother me. I never really think too deeply about whether or not the case makes sense, as long as I enjoy the way the team gets there. It was fun to watch the team figure it out. It was fun to see how the clues fit together. That was enough for me to enjoy it and consider it a great episode. I understand all of those questions, and had I been trying to piece it together and wanted it to be logical, like a real story, I would have liked it less, but I wasn't, so I enjoyed it.

I did like the continuity of use those two in the season two finale, and yes, perfect for a new fan. Oh yeah, she did. I guess I was just curious as to why there weren't official consequences, but at least she learned not to play at work. They were totally cute in this episode, and I agree about the hat and the hair. Yes, I think that's why he didn't visit often, it can't be easy, knowing that he can't do anything to help her. I think that's why he committed her in the first place, he knew that there was nothing he could do, and it was too hard to see her everyday. Exactly, that's why it's weird to me, too. I agree that the Gideon was lying to himself when he came back, but someone else should have seen that he was lying to himself as well. I think this was the first time that he's realizing that he might not have what it takes to keep doing this job. Oh, you know what, I did remember reading that somewhere. I think it is Grant. I agree with Hotch on this one, too. She needed rest.

Exactly! I totally love it. It would have been nice to see more of Gideon talking through his decisions after finding out Elle would make it, but sadly, they didn't. I think part of his arrogance is that he thinks he knows the line that would cause the unsub to break, and feels he's got the control -> like in Broken Mirror. However, he's so arrogant sometimes that he forgets that it could backfire and someone could be put in danger, like here. I just think Hotch or someone else should have said, 'hey, this is not a good idea to push him, he knows where we live...etc...' -> clearly he could cause them problems with all of the information he had if they didn't catch him. Especially since it was clear that Gideon was having issues. Yes, I feel that way, too. It's unbelievably nice that everyone shares with Reid, and it shows that they truly care. I definitely think the butterfly thing could have come up during their date, and I do think his reaction to the poem is sweet. Despite Garcia saying, "Your mom read you valentine's day poems, hello therapy." Although Reid didn't even notice. I love Morgan's protectiveness. He clearly cares about the team and would do anything for any of them. Also, yeah, we don't find out about Morgan's dad for a while, right? But now when I rewatch, I notice it, and it's my own headcanon for why they got so close so fast. I agree here. It was so strange about her adoptive family, I wonder if there was more to it than what was said. Also, I felt for Garner, he never realized what he was doing would scar her for life, and that he couldn't find peace because he wasn't able to save his family. His delusion was so real, that he thought he was doing the right thing. Yes, I like that the team trusts him with the secrets, and Garcia keeping his. I do think Garcia's support helped him make that statement to Garner knowing that Hotch and Morgan could hear him and for once, he was allowing them into his personal life. I get the sense that he kept everyone at a distance as much as possible. In the season 1 thread, I mentioned that he once said, "That is exactly what I get for trusting someone, it gets thrown back in my face." -> It's clear that he isn't as trusting as he appears, and yet, here he is trusting them with his biggest secret. For some reason, Morgan gets the credit for being reckless, but if you think about it, Reid is truly reckless. He was reckless here, in Derailed, and in some future episodes as well. I feel like the team is always asking that question of him. That ending was just unbelievably awesome. I thought the same thing, "I really like this team" Is that the song that's playing? I didn't know the name of it. I love reading your replies, as well. Also, hopefully, I'll get to watch more episodes soon!

I totally believed that this episode would be a great one to get someone interested. I absolutely love the Fisher King. Oh! you're right, I think it was Sarah, I forgot that she was key to next season's finale...that makes so much more sense now. I would absolutely love an hour or two just watching them on vacation. I was a little surprised that Elle and Morgan went together, but maybe they really bonded in Charm and Harm, which was why he invited her. I wish Reid had taken Morgan up on his offer -> I would have loved to see it. As for Hotch, it was hard to watch knowing what's in store for him. As for JJ and Garcia, I was surprised they didn't do anything with them, like introduce family or something or even have them take a break together for coffee or lunch or something. Maybe Garcia was needed by other teams, but what they showed us was that she wasn't needed since she was playing video games at work. -> I am surprised she didn't get crap for that. Yes, it was a little sad and surprising that he shows up at the place, stands maybe 50 feet from her, but can't bring himself to talk to her. We know that he's struggling with the possibility that he could inherit it, and we know that it was just him and his mom since he was ten, so it's clear that he's had a lot to deal with. Especially because he was watching it on his own. I know, right? We never saw the team react to it, they save her the year before, she's finally getting her life back and none of them react to that. I really feel like they should have. Also, Rebecca in the second season finale states that she met everyone but Gideon (I don't think she met Elle though, either) so they obviously all went to the hospital to check on her, so shouldn't they have cared a little more? Yes, I can't believe the FBI hasn't protected her computers by now, however, it's been so long since I have seen the Replicator that I don't remember if she forged ahead like she did here. Truthfully though, the FBI should have noticed this keeps happening and fix it. I totally loved that from Hotch giving Elle his jacket, and Elle's reaction to Reid knowing what to do. His random knowledge was very appreciated here. Ahh, that could be the case. Actually his statement to Hotch about having nothing left gave me the impression that he was about to completely lose it again. -> Gideon's been through alot this year, and even more next year. Aww, I never thought about the foreshadowing for later seasons, but now, I can see it. The Hotchner family, they were doomed from the start. And yes, it is eerie. I know, he was so adorable figuring this out. I kind of wished we'd seen more of Anderson, he kind of pops in and pops out. Do we even know his first name? Yeah, she had it rough, I can't imagine having to stay up that long, but her statement to Hotch in this episode when they first arrived back at the BAU was pure determination that she wouldn't sleep until they caught the guy. Finally, yeah, I like the difference in the episode, but overall it was just a little too weird for me.

Thank you, I'm still excited whenever I watch it, even knowing what happens. -> I forgot about all of the cute character moments, and I realized that I used to really like Garcia and Reid's friendship.

I am totally confused by Hotch's arrangement for childcare as well. As you pointed out, they can get calls in the middle of the night, what happens then? Did Jessica move closer as well? (I was under the impression that she lived a decent amount away since Haley says "with you coming to visit it was easier to get him to take off" which implies that she doesn't live all that close, at least to me). -> Henry makes sense because he has his dad. LOL at your comment, the one time they go on vacation and bam -> death. I felt so bad for the team, they are all excited and then devastation. Maybe this is what started the no vacations thing?

Season 2: Fisher King part 2: I love that beginning scene about the book they are searching for. I love the clarification that Spence's memory is things he's read mainly, less on things he's heard, although he can recall things he's heard well. Liked Gideon taking charge finally. -> not just chilling in his office. Love Gideon saying, "If anyone can put this together, you can." To Spencer. I think it boost his confidence, although he states, "It's impossible." at first. I love the discussion about how he searched out the specific things that were difficult to find. -> helped to figure out the book. I liked the conversation with Spencer and Garcia about the likelihood of something being in the databases. -> now, it's just assumed. Loved watching the background of the screen as Spence figures out the book. I liked that he found someone who could help with the code by having four libraries looking. Also, liked the anagram. The looks on the four of them when the unsub says, "Agent Greenaway did not have to die like that," was intense. I liked that they took charge of the crime scene. When it comes to one of their own, they defend them. I always wondered why Gideon told Hotch that it wasn't his fault, but doesn't take any responsibility himself. Although later on Gideon does wonder if it was the right thing, the press conference. However, he basically just assures himself. Loved the scene with Spencer figuring out the poem, and I loved the look on Garcia's face as she realizes that his mom is a sanitarium patient. Poor Diana having to face her fears when the FBI shows up and makes her Fly to D.C. I loved the scene afterwards with the two of them. "I should have realized it sooner...no one knows that JJ used to collect butterflies, except for me. People tell me their secrets all of the time, I think it's because they know I don't have anyone to betray them to...except my mother...I tell her pretty much everything." "I don't think anyone would mind." I was sad to learn why he writes her a letter every day. And the look on Garcia's face when he asks, "Did you know that schizophrenia is genetically passed?" is just sad. Also, loved that Morgan assumed Reid figured it out and they were wasting their time until JJ says "Elle was shot" and he immediately turns around to go the hospital until JJ convinces him there's nothing they can do at a hospital and they should continue on. It really shows how much he cares...at least I think so. "Hotch said not to". "I don't give a damn what Hotch said". I do like Elle's scenes with her dad. I wonder if that's why she bonded with Morgan, who also lost his father that way. I'm surprised that her mother put everything in the garage...as are the agents, it's strange. "Parents don't give up, ever." I still don't understand how he can claim to love her, and hold her captive. I loved that Reid and his mom were key and that she took the key off the board, which was why Reid had it when they saved her. I also loved that when Garcia realized that Garner was at Bennington, she didn't tell Morgan and JJ, she kept the secret. -> they used to have a cute friendship, what happened? "The only way for the organization level to be this high, is if he believes it's real." -> that's scary. Loved Hotch and Morgan saying, "Don't do it." Totally loved Reid, "My mother is paranoid schizophenic would would forget to eat if she wasn't properly medicated and supervised." -> the looks on Morgan and Hotch's faces are interesting...a lot like Garcia's. It's sad that he couldn't share that, probably because he was afraid of those looks. "Hotch, Morgan, I think maybe it would be better if you waited downstairs. Mr. Garner and I are going to talk alone." Hotch whispers, "What?" Morgan: "Go ahead and Talk, Reid but we're not going anywhere." -> again, I am proud of the team for sticking together. Loved Hotch and Morgan basically pulling Reid out of the house after Morgan gets the fire off of him. "What the hell was that?" "He had a bomb!" "And you didn't think we should know that?" "I told you to go downstairs." "You didn't say bomb, you left that part out!" Then Reid calls to stop so he can think, and figures out where he's hiding Rebecca, and they save the day. -> very actiony. Loved Morgan saying, "How do you know that?" "The KEY the Key, the youngest one holds the key, tell me you have the key." Totally love the end of this episode, Elle survives, kind of sad that her last words to her father were 'I hate you, daddy.' Reid and his mom have a cute moment, and all is well. -> fantastic premiere. Love the ending scene with the team as well, "Thank you everyone you did well." "Well, we could have only gotten so far without, Mrs. Reid." "Have you read any of the material?" "I've had them read to me." Also, loved Gideon with Elle at the end, Morgan and Garcia, Reid and his Mom, JJ erasing everything, and Hotch with the wall. -> and that song at the end was fantastic. So, in case anyone was wondering, I love this episode. Up Next: P911

The Fisher King 1! I love the opening with the team. Gideon: "Seriously, don't call." -> I feel you, Gideon. Who was the woman he had a date with? Elle and Morgan on vacation together, a little weird, but kind of cute. Elle mentions that they have other teams. -> not really mentioned, again. Also, first appearance of 'Pretty Boy' nickname, also Morgan's concern is cute. I love that Morgan offered it to him, too. Clearly, Morgan has come to see him as a friend. I think it's funny Hotch is happy his vacation is about a chore list Haley has created for him. I loved their talk about the past, this is why I am convinced they were holding onto their past selves, but at least they had happy moments. Poor Garcia and JJ, no vacations for you. A little disappointed to see Garcia gaming at work, it should be an issue. "When was the last time you had a date that went that well?" -> Too bad that date was fake by the unsub. I love the introduction to Spence's mom, and knowing how difficult it is for him in that short scene with the nurse. The love of writing and reading, and that she feels his cases are his adventures. Bennington looks really nice. I really love how happy all of them seem to be at the beginning before a psychopath brings them back. This is the first time that there's a stalker after the team, but certainly not the last. All that room in that house, and he kept her in the basement? Poor girl, it's even worse to know her fate in next year's finale. Why the hell would the unsub call in the middle of the night? What if Hotch forgot everything of didn't answer again? Do you think Elle or Morgan ever went back to that resort? I loved that Garcia's reaction after she realized she'd been hacked was to fight back unlike in later seasons -> I think in the 'Replicator' she just freaked, no? I liked that they each got a piece of the puzzle. A phone call, a head, a body, a key, butterflies, etc. "You think I didn't see that, I don't know anyone in Jamaica." -> Gideon is beyond pissed, and totally confused about the body. I liked Morgan and Hotch's instant defense of Elle. -> true friends, no just co-workers. BAU lawyers and Hotch to the rescue, even out of the country. Again the suit in even in Jamaica, damn Hotch. I loved Garcia in this episode, she kicked ass when it comes to resolving the problem when someone attacks her grounds. Did Morgan get anything? If he did, I didn't catch it. Why did it take Reid longer to get back? Was it because he didn't get the key until the next morning, while everyone else were notified around midnight? "Reid, do not even go away, again." -> I loved the smile by Reid at that. "Definitely an Indiana Jones movie." -> LOL, Elle. "Five people fishing." - yup that is definitely what you're doing, Hotch. Fishing for an answer. One Rule : "Only the members of your team may participate in thy quest." I still don't understand how Gideon could sulk when everyone else finds a way to deal. He's supposed to be the leader...honestly, I understand why the next year leads him to leaving as well. Surprised it didn't happen sooner. Haley shows up with a note from the unsub, and I am surprised she doesn't look more freaked. This could be part of the reason that she starts pushing harder for Hotch to quit. -> she went into hiding at a hotel after the delivery. That had to be scary. Love that the message is a book code. -> love that Spencer says he has no idea which book, but does eventually figure it out. Too bad Gideon broke that rule, and it would almost cost Elle her life. Poor Anderson has no idea that Hotch wanted him to stay with her, meanwhile Gideon sulks. Notice, Elle doesn't even make it to her bed. Great ending to the season, definitely would have kept me watching to come back when the next season starts in September. Except that I didn't have to wait. On to Season 2

So, I am finally watching Secrets and Lies, I didn't really like it the first time, so I wonder if it'll be any better this time. Gideon has connections to the CIA, weird, and the CIA making it look like suicide, weird. Although I do like that he knows he needs his team. He works for the CIA, unofficially, weird. "Call me cynical, but given that it's 2 AM it can't be good." "You are a genius." It's kind of weird they all walked into the office at the same time. -> even at 2 in the morning, Hotch is in a suit, damn. I liked Morgan explaining to Reid why they weren't handing over their weapons unlike they would have usually done so. I love that Garcia is on a list. It's too funny, poor JJ had to stay with her. "I think that's exactly the kind of thing that got you on their list." -> LOL, I like JJ and Garcia working together. "21 and 22 are here with us." "What if it's one of them?" cue worried looks. Luckily for them, it wasn't 21 or 22. I liked the discussion on what can make you turn your back on your oath to server your country...everything you believe in to be a part of the BAU, CIA, etc. -> Do you think that Elle went back on what she believed in when she killed William Lee? or is this different because it's turning against the country as a while? "It's not all physcobabble, I get my fair share of action." -> too much in the later seasons. Also, do we ever hear about Clooney, again? This episode has a very strange tenseness that was just weird. Maybe it was knowing they were trapped with the unsub or something similar...I don't know. It's just weird. "What do you think it would take for someone to betray their country?" interesting question. Another episode where Reid no problems at a computer, he found the container with the heat scanner, and directed them to the container. Morgan's WTF look in the container is funny as hell. Although I am still not a fan of the episode, I like the misdirects of thinking it's the other agents, when it was the leader guy all along. "The only beach you'll see is the one on a post card I send you from my vacation." -> Except Gideon takes a vacation in the next episode and goes to the woods, and also hates the beach. lol. Up Next: Fisher King! -> one of my all time favorite episodes.

I agree that it was implied that Haley had an affair, but since we didn't know for sure, it seems like the divorce was more of a punishment. Especially if she was still in love with him. If she had an affair, then it could be that she generally needed a there all the time partner, which would make the divorce make sense. I never understood Jessica either, she supports Haley in her passive aggressiveness, and stating it was his job that was the problem, and then she offers to help him keep that job after blaming the job for her sister's death, and death of their marriage? It makes no sense. Now that I think about it, there are a lot of holes in the story. Too bad they didn't use Route 66 to address that issue while Hotch sees Haley and the Reaper again.

Ahh I think I see what you've been trying to say. You think that she never truly accepted his job, she was pretending that she could, and thought having a baby would fix the issue (because Hotch would be around more for the child). That actually makes a lot of sense. If she was pretending to herself and others that she was okay with his being away all the time, then it is sort of irresponsible to wait until after the baby is born to say something. ->As if she should have realized it sooner. Now, for me, I believe that I can deal with someone who's busy or isn't around all of the time because I like to write or read alone, I don't need to be with them all of the time, and would enjoy the time they are away to be by myself. However, it is different strokes for different folks...obviously Haley would be more like your friend. On the Hotch as a father note, I do think he's a great father, and focuses on the quality of time rather than quantity of time -> to me that's what's important. If I didn't see my partner all week, but the time we did spend together was about us than it wouldn't bother me. -> like I said above, if she still loved him wouldn't getting to see him a little mean more to her than not seeing him at all? As long as it's good quality of time, it should make up for the missing time. However, I look forward to hearing more when you get back!

@Annber03, I completely agree with you, and it's why I can see her side. It's one thing to assume that you can handle difficult things like that, it's another to experience it, all of the time. @smoker, I understand being on Hotch's side of things, especially because he's the main character, she's the side character, it's easy to see that he is an amazing agent, who is needed by the team and has saved lives, consistently. It's easy to side with him because we see that is NEEDED by the team. However, I wished that they were more scenes to explain the situation. I feel like the problem is that we don't see the transition from the happy, expecting couple in the pilot to the woman who passive aggressively attacks his devotion to his work in Machismo, which continues until the fight in 'In Name and Blood' and results in their divorce. One thing I never got was that Jessica states (at some point in the series) that they didn't split up because they fell out of love, but because of his job. Which to me, completely sucks. If Haley still loved him, why not find a way to accept that she couldn't have him the way she wanted to, seeing him sometimes versus not seeing him at all, seems stupid to me. On the other hand, if she had fallen out of love with him, then it makes sense so that she could find someone to be her everything. -> I don't know if I am making any sense with that. Either way, still wished that we'd seen more.

This is true, we have no idea how long they were married or anything like that. Just that they'd been together since high school. However, focus for school is different than focus for work. At least, I feel like it is. I'm an engineer, I had to focus at my school work because it's not easy, however, I treat my work entirely differently than in school. My work ethic at work is a lot more focused than I ever focused on schoolwork. Because with school, you get a bad grade, you can make it up, with work, you lack on a case (for Hotch) or a project (for me) and it affects other people. I can totally believe that he became ten times worse when entered the workforce than when he was just in school. However, I've never been to law school, so I can't be certain, it's just my assumption. Also, I think the problem is that we know that they are pushing forty and should know each other well by now -> I think he'd been in the BAU for at least 8 years, so she should have known the truth. However, I think that we don't know enough to really evaluate the situation...which is why they are both at fault, regardless.

I think the reason I sympathize with Haley is because they fell in love when they were young, and both were holding onto their past selves rather than their current selves. They both grew and evolved to be different people than they were originally. Neither wanted to let go, but it's evident that they aren't the same people they were when they fell in love. Although I disagree that they had the baby during a shaky marriage. I felt up until Machismo, where she is being passive aggressive -> which I disagree with entirely (if you have an issue, talk about it), They were happy and in love, and not having a shaky marriage. I totally thought she was completely supportive. I think having Jack made her realize she wanted them to be a priority and Hotch's priority wasn't the family. Should she have known this? Yes. Should they have talked about it? Yes. However, they obviously didn't talk about it or didn't agree and it ate away at her until she couldn't do it anymore. I'm not on either side, they are both at fault for this, all I am saying is I understand both sides. Why is she being a hypocrate? I only ask because I am confused, and I am still working my way through rewatching, so I haven't gotten that far so maybe I am forgetting. The problem is that she didn't emotionally blackmail him into leaving. They disagreed, they filed for divorce, and there was nothing about "if you leave the team, we can still be married", wouldn't that have be necessary to consider the divorce emotional blackmail? I don't know, again, I could be missing something. I totally agree about JJ's attitude in "Damaged" and I sort of felt for Haley in "Pleasure is my business" because of that line reference. Honestly, even understanding her point of view, I'm not on her side in Machismo because she was being passive aggressive. "It's your wife." "Go ahead go, they need you, it's fine." I'm just saying I understand both sides. Also, This is what I was trying to say as well. When you're young and in love, especially when you're still in school, you don't see work ethic or anything else that might contribute to your home life.

I can agree with that. I don't think Haley had a job until after the divorce, and since she was with him since high school, she probably never imagined that he'd have a job that would take him away so much, but while it was just the two of them, I think she was fine. I honestly think it wasn't until she had Jack that she realized she needed his presence at home, and he wasn't there. I wonder if there were multiple little things that he missed leading up to the appointment that Hotch missed causing Haley to be even more angry leading up to the moment when she felt the FBI had let him down when he was suspended without pay, and he still chose to go back. -> I wonder if she would have been more understanding had he not been suspended. Given what we know about their job and the expectations to leave at a moment's notice, and be gone for days, I completely sympathize with Haley. She dealt with it for who knows how long -> I think the earliest case that Hotch was on that has been mentioned is 1999? So at the very least it was 8 years(?) when she finally had enough...and given that they likely held off on kids because of him and his job, I think that might have also contributed to her issue. Regardless, everyone has their breaking point. Besides, as a side note, It's not like he's a doctor, who may get called away, but comes home that night (or next day if it's the middle of the night), when he gets called away, he's gone for days. Which reminds me, I still don't understand how Hotch was able to convince Jessica to take care of Jack at a moment's notice whenever they have to leave on a case before he left.

Even though I am not a child, and am an adult, and even though I always went to class or finals that were on my birthday, when I got this job, before I realized that I had it as a holiday off, I was planning to take off my birthday -> if I was absolutely needed, like they needed me last week because I was the only one who could do the job even though I was majorly sick -> when I finally went to the doctor, he told me if I had pushed anymore I could have ended up with pneumonia -> I still went in to work, and would have on my birthday if it was necessary like that. However, if it's just a normal work day, and there are others who could help out in my stead, I have no problem taking it off, even if I don't have any plans for two reasons: one, because even though I love my job, the people, and what I do -> I didn't work hard to get there, not to like it, It's still work, and if I can get paid not to work on my birthday by taking a vacation day, I will, and two, because from the moment I get into my car to head to work (not including getting ready time) to the moment I get home, is thirteen hours, I commute 1.5 hrs one way, and honestly, I don't want to deal with other people on the road or the train or the people in the city, on a normal day, why would I want to do it on my birthday? Shouldn't we be allowed one day to do what we want -> even if it's to do nothing? Obviously, @secnarf, you disagree, and that's okay, I just hope you can respect my opinion as much as I respect yours. Back onto the topic at hand, I feel like it was slowly building in Haley from the moment she was likely put on bedrest. Think about it, even one of the unsubs stated that Hotch's sick pregnant wife wasn't enough to keep him home. I think she tried to reconcile the fact that she would basically be a single parent since Hotch would have to leave all the time, and found that she couldn't do that. On this, I think if her family had been supportive, she probably could have gotten through it, but I get the sense from Jessica in this episode that she isn't supportive...at least not at this point in the series. Yes, I think Haley was rather harsh with Hotch, but if we had seen more of her, we could have understood how she went from the happy woman showing off her baby to the team to the woman in "In Name and Blood" that wanted Hotch to have nothing to do with the BAU. Anyway, I still haven't watched Secrets and Lies, yet, but I will.

I don't I explained what I was trying to explain properly...my company is different since it is a bonus that he feels is necessary -> I don't know any other company that does it. We were only 50 people, now we're 150 -> we merged with another company recently, and maybe that was why he felt it as something doable. What I was trying to say, was that many people I know purposely take their vacation time (or an extended weekend) around their birthday, therefore, they would take their Paid Vacation Time not just don't show up because of their birthday -> they take it as part of their vacation time. -> I still don't know if I am making sense, so I am going to stop. Morgan didn't take off for his birthday, it is stated in Profiler-Profiled that he takes off every year for his Mother's birthday every year. Also, isn't there a few other times where other members take off? Like you mentioned, Rossi, and I think Hotch takes Jack to Disney World, and Reid takes off for his mother, JJ takes off for maternity leave, Elle is off for recuperation (although that's different), I feel like there could have been a discussion like only one of them could be off at a time, unless it's like "Fisher King". I get what you're saying. Neither Gideon nor Rossi care much about their families, and Gideon, especially, did not understand that Hotch was trying to be a family man. And since it wasn't a particularly bad case, and Gideon took the lead anyway, why did Hotch need to be there? -> I think that's what I am focusing on. Again, Sorry if I'm confusing you guys about the holiday-birthday thing, and whether Hotch took the time off as vacation time or not, sometimes, I am not that great at explaining things.

I understand that, really I do. Maybe I am coming from a different perspective, but I do understand. However, Gideon could have handled it without him, I never saw a reason why Hotch, himself was needed, to be completely honest, and as Haley said to her sister, he took time off, so Gideon should have tried to do it without him. However, I do also find the series has made it clear -up until the later seasons- that none of them could really take time off...although I believe Morgan took time off in season two (a week) and it's stated that he does it every year, which suggests that it is allowed. Anyways, I concede. I know have cops in the family, I know about holidays and so forth, my main argument was that I was under the impression that he took earned vacation time off. -> although as you stated that might not mean much in their -or your - line of work.