Snowblack

Jon Snow and Mance Rayder, Season 4, Episode 10 Mance: He was their king. Last of a bloodline that stretches back before the First Men. Jon: Grenn came from a farm. Mance: Mag and Grenn Jon: Grenn and Mag I love Jon Snow's way of showing that Grenn's life is just as important at the last king of the giants.

I just realized that Arya heading across the sea to Bravos means she won't be reunited with her wolf. :( I had so hoped they would find one another, and Arya would have a link to her family other than the tool she uses for killing.

When Bran and company started through the root tunnels, I started chanting "Benjen, Benjen, Benjen." I had such hope! :( I guess the old guy will have to do. So I'm wondering whether the multitude of crows that gathered when the White Walker came for Gilly's baby were in fact controlled by the old man. I assumed that when he spoke of "flying" he meant crows. But the thought that it was dragons is an interesting one, especially since the black dragon is AWOL and going through his teenage rebellious years.

Thanks for sharing the music Shimpy. Anyone else?

I'm rewatching the episode now, and my first thought is thank goodness I didn't see the "Previously On" my first time through. That would have ruined it. What a perfect ending to a great season! The Starks are making a comeback! All four of them are poised to truly come into their own in season 5. I expected many things, but I never suspected Arya would leave the Hound to die a lingering death, that Brienne would meet up with Arya, and that Arya would refuse to join her and run off to Bravos instead. What a wonderful series of twists. Dany's scene was heartwrenching. So much for Breaker of Chains. And Tyrion! I'm so proud of him, taking care of business before he goes. I didn't expect Varys to become his traveling companion. I would love to see the adventures of Tyrion and Varys. I just hope Varys has a good Plan B after leaving everything behind in King's Landing. I loved the moment of decision in his eyes when he heard the bells tolling. It reminded me of the scene between Tyrion and Varys about bells before the battle of Blackwater. And I guess Tyrion has done Cersei a great favor, and Loras Tyrell and even greater favor. The question is whether Cersei will find a way to oust Margaery before she marries Tommen. And whether Jaime is doing anything more than using Cersei. Let's hope that's all it is. Stannis was a surprise. I expected him last week. Lol. I like the discussion between Stannis and Jon. I guess the good thing about Stannis is that he is willing to give respect when respect is due regardless of station. And Mance Rayder's refusal to bow was laudable. I enjoyed that he was true to his principles, beaten or not.

I think the final scene will be Bran finding...something. I don't know whether he gets north to that tree or if he just finds more people to help him on his quest. But I think it will be a breathtaking final moment that opens the door to many possibilities in the north for next season, just as the White Walker staring at Sam did.

Random thought: Now that we know there are mammoths north of the Wall, and we already knew there were Zombponies, when can we expect to see Zomammoths? *shudder* That's a scary game-changer.

The show built this up so much, week after week. 100,000 Wildlings bearing down on the Wall as the Night's Watch leadership does nothing to prepare, and then the pivotal episode is more the first skirmish in a siege than an epic battle for the north. Had this been an episode 7, I would have loved every moment. Except for the slow reaction to Giants and Mammoths, of course. So I'll put my disappointment aside, and revel in the wonderful acting and storytelling in this episode while looking forward to the finale. The one thing that's still nagging me is Mance Rayder's plan. First, he attacked one of the few fortresses along the Wall that is even manned. Jon Snow told them which are guarded and which aren't. If the end game is to get your 100k men south of the Wall, why not pick a tunnel under an abandoned fortress? Second, why light a massive forest fire behind your forces? Why let the Night's Watch know you're coming? Send a warged bird with a message for your forces south of the Wall instead. Then attack without warning. The forest fire also gives them nowhere to retreat, and will presumably advance towards them, leaving their forces with no cover. The only positive I can see tactically is that the smoke might obscure the Wildlings' movements. The problem with that is that the Wildlings need to breathe. So I'm dubious about Mance's whole approach here. I wonder whether his ego and his need to best his former brothers hasn't gotten the better of him. One thought did occur to me about defenses for the next wave of the Wildling attack. The Night's Watch should have lined the tunnel with the dead, so that the Wildlings would have to battle through 100 or more zombies to get to Castle Black. That would have been a great force multiplier once the gate was successfully pulled from its hinges. But instead we get Jon Snow, the lone hero, heading North to miraculously stop 100,000 people whose only hope of survival is getting to the other side of the Wall.

Wow, I didn't even notice it. What a huge oversight. They made a big show of him handing over his sword (why not just wear a different one to begin with), and he leaves his only potential ally behind. Pontoon, I totally agree about Thorne. He led well and acted bravely all his arrogance in the previous episodes. What a great way for that character to go. There were so many other great deaths. Two of Jon's friends...I liked Grenn. I wish they had done more with his character before his death. I never cared for Ygritte, but her death scene was so good. The way Jon smiles at her, and you're not quite sure whether you see the same happiness returned in her face as that arrow pierces through her...it was perfect. They love each other despite the cruel circumstances, and it's a beautiful moment. Him cradling her body in the middle of a raging battle isn't so great. I liked Tormund fighting with all his might despite all being lost. To me, this was really Sam's episode. I loved him parsing the Night's Watch oath at the beginning. He missed his calling. And he's finally become a man. It was clear that Jon had come into his own, but Sam's transformation is unexpected and welcome. Now he needs to take Gilly and run. Unfortunately, I don't think he will. When Aemon was talking about a certain lady using her wiles on him, did anyone else think of Olenna/Emma Peele? Lol. Targaryans were all the rage, you know. It's a shame Aemon abdicated. I think he would have made a decent king. But who knows, maybe madness manifests itself with power and he made the right choice. Looking ahead, if Jon Snow's plan works, I'll be completely disgusted. All the tribes have come together for the sole purpose of fleeing south, and Jon thinks they'll go home if Mance Rayder dies? That's nonsensical. He left his wolf, his sword and his brain behind.

Sam Tarley, Season 4, Episode 9: "I'm not nothing anymore."

My initial reaction is that it was a good episode, but somehow I expected something more epic. The Wildlings' plan north of the Wall was a forest fire and yelling? Really? And the NW used the scythe on half a dozen climbers. Seems like a waste. I liked Ygritte's death though. Nicely done. And the mammoths were great. Otherwise, I'm a bit underwhelmed.

gingerella has an great point. Why does Mance Rayder only see the Night's Watch as an obstacle rather than a potential ally? He has united a number of tribes that have no doubt fought against one another at various times. So why isn't the Night's Watch just another tribe that he needs to unite in order for all of them to survive? I guess he in counting on the unyielding "Starkian" nature of the Night's Watch leadership preventing any sort of truce. Or maybe there has been enough slaughter over the centuries by the Night's Watch that an alliance is unthinkable. But it does seem odd, given the sort of threat all the Northerners are facing. This Winter is the very type of event that unites groups with completely different interests. Speaking of the White Walker invasion, what exactly is it they mean to do? Are they just going to kill everyone and turn them into zombies? Steal every baby in sight and turn it into one of them? Is there something they can do to turn Westeros into the Land of Always Winter? I don't have a feel for what their end game is.

Great spec! I have one you left out. Tywin: Worried about his legacy. Pro: Could get Jaime to leave the King's Guard and take his rightful place as Tywin's heir in return for allowing Tyrion to "escape." Con: He hates Tyrion's guts and may well believe in Tyrion's guilt. Also another pro for Varys: Could send Tyrion to allies in Easteros. Tyrion can join a traveling band of actors or a carnival and can send Varys information from all over Easteros. Or not.

This is a good point. The White Walkers are taking their sweet time. I assumed that as winter swept south, so would they. And we already have snow at the Aerie, so it seems like it's about time. The show definitely needs to get the Wall battle done this season and get on with events in the north. In the Roose and Ramsay scene, Roose Bolton is so pleased with himself and all the land he controls. And the Boltons are presumably moving their base of operations to Winterfell (the "new home" comment to Theon implied as much). It makes me believe that the Wildlings and White Walkers will be upon them next season. One thing this show is good about is not letting anyone rest on their laurels enjoying the fruits of victory for very long, and the Boltons are no exception. I think Moat Cailin may be the last victory the Boltons will have for the foreseeable future. Roose talked about how far he controls to the east, south and west, and he's about to find out that the one direction he gave no thought to is the most important.

I just rewatched most of the episode, and it's a different experience the second time. First of all, Alfie Allen is brilliant as Theon/Reek. The first time through, I didn't catch on that Bolton's forces were heading towards Winterfell in that last scene. Ugh. That's going to be heart-wrenching to see that flag raised over Winterfell. Roose Bolton's smug proclamations about the North just set up the chaos I expect next season as Wildlings ravage the North. The tables will finally turn, and he's going to have his hands full. But as horrible as the Boltons are, they might be just the people who can strike fear in the heart of the Wildlings just as the Wildlings strike fear in the hearts of average northmen. Both sides are utterly barbaric, and are well matched in that sense. Who would think I would ever hope for Winterfell to get overrun (again)? Even the second time, I laughed out loud at Arya. She is delightful. And the Hound looks to be in much worse shape than I noticed the first time. He was resting the arm on his injured side on the pommel of his sword, but that whole side looked just a bit droopy. I'm afraid the Hound won't be with us much longer. :cry: I'm not certain whether they got turned away from the Bloody Gate. If I were the gatekeeper, I wouldn't let that pair pass. So I think they're once again going to be wandering Westeros. The question is whether they will run into Brienne and Pod, the Hill Tribes, or Sansa, Little Finger and Robin before the Hound's inevitable demise. I've said before that I think Brienne would be a great mentor and influence for Arya, and I would love to see them meet up. I don't think the two sisters will meet, but imagine Arya's face if they did. Last she knew, Sansa was marrying Joffrey, and here she is with Little Finger, totally transformed. What an incredible scene that would be. I was laughing out loud this time at the beetle story when I realized that Cousin Orson is GRRM. He kills every living thing within reach without regard to merit, karma, beauty, good, evil...none of it matters. He is going to smash the life out of it. Gungh! Gungh! Gungh! And if there's one you like, he'll wait till you're watching to smash it. EXCEPT not Tyrion. Tyrion let that little isopod go on its way, and I felt a certainty that Cousin Orson isn't going to squash him. Finally, Ellaria's cape is quite clever. I hated it the first time I saw it, but then I realized that the peaks on her shoulders are meant to conjure a viper's ridges above its eyes. Looking at her is like looking straight into the face of a viper. "Don't leave me alone in this world." "Never." Ugh. Heartbreaking. I didn't watch the final battle. I'll save that for a night when I don't want to sleep. Lol. Oberyn needs to be avenged.

I'm betting on episode 9 being an epic battle episode a la Blackwater, even though they'll likely find time for other events too. I'm wondering who will be left once the battle is over. I get the feeling it's going to be a blood bath. I don't think the Night's Watch can stop the Wildlings from coming though to the south. They can just hope to survive the day and keep them from overrunning Castle Black. Bolton can inherit the Wildling problem as they head south and get his own taste of a ruthless adversary. I hope there is some force to back up what remains of the Night's Watch before the White Walkers arrive. Honestly, I don't care whether they kill Tyrion or he escapes. The outcome is essentially the same. I'm betting that Tyrion will escape, but I'm a lot less confident in my prediction after last week's certainty that Oberyn would prevail. I'm hoping they don't kill Shae in front of Tyrion before whatever happens to Tyrion takes place. Tywin did say Tyrion's whore would hang, and I think he meant it.

Poor Jorah. He's not even Friend Zone material anymore. I would like to see him turn up again, and I think the Golden Company might be just the ticket, especially if he hasn't had the opportunity to stash away some gold. I don't know that Stannis' scrutiny would extend to the members of the mercenaries he hires to fight on his behalf. If he were to judge sellswords as harshly as he judges his followers, he wouldn't have any fighting force. He would undermine his entire purpose in seeking funds from the Iron Bank. And yet, he does seem that inflexible. Lol. It's tough to get much accomplished when your world is as black and white as Stannis'. But I do hope to see Jorah return to Westeros, and possibly fight at the Wall. Imagine him meeting Jon Snow, who has the sword that was once Jorah's birthright. Maybe he could redeem himself, although this show doesn't leave much opportunity for redemption.

I think no matter what happens to Tyrion, Jaime's alienation from his family is now complete. One way or another, Tyrion is out of Jaime's life. The only positive thing he has left is Tommen, and the two don't seem particularly close. I have the impression that this alienation will lead to some dramatic events, whether it results in Jaime's death or another Lannister's,

I'm still delighted at the twist. I never saw it coming. What a terrible death. This show has its own rules that characters need to play by. I think one of them is not to become overly consumed by the need for revenge. And it makes me wonder whether Arya will back away from her "list" before she is destroyed by it too. I wonder whether there will be any repercussions for the Lannisters for Oberyn's death. Oberyn was mature and circumspect about not holding the wrong people accountable for the misdeeds of others. But I don't want to generalize to all Martells based on him. After all, he is the Tyrion equivalent of that family, and we would be fools to judge the Lannisters based on Tyrion. The reality is that the Dornish have Myrcella, and they are obviously formidable warriors. It will be interesting to see how this plays out next season. As for Arya, I think she was laughing at the Hound getting denied his ransom again. Everywhere he goes, he is denied. And it's all bad timing. It is rather funny, actually. And now what? Who will pay for her besides Tywin? The Hound is certainly in a bind now. And assuming they were turned away at the gate, will they run into Brienne and Pod? I can't wait to find out!

THIS is why I love this show so much! I can't stop laughing at how wrong I was. What was I thinking? I love, love, love it! What's even funnier is that the first think I thought was "well, of course someone will rescue Tyrion and spirit him away before he's executed." Which is exactly what I thought about Ned all the way back in Season 1. I LOVE THIS SHOW!

I was rewatching episode 7 last night, and I noticed Sansa's hairstyle in her snow castle scene. It struck me how much it looked like the style from the feast scene at Winterfell. And I think her hair's evolution throughout the series tells the tale of where her heart is. It starts in the simple style of the north to the complex "sausage" style found in King's Landing while she is under Joffrey's spell or control, and then to Margaery's style from High Garden when she is betrothed to Loras and befriended by Margaery. And now a return to the simple pinned back style of the North in a scene where she longs for her home. A clever touch, seeing her come full circle that way.

I love it, Arry, especially the call on Ygritte killing Gilly! Except someone from the Night's Watch needs to be there to see it for it to have any effect. I could see the Wildlings attacking the town where Gilly is to draw out the Night's Watch. Smaller raids haven't worked, so they might try something more ambitious. I think Jon might be put in a position to need to kill Ygritte. Again. And when I wrote the word "again," it made me think that this time Jon will kill her in an act that shows he's not the kid he was at the Fist anymore. And it would be the perfect heart-wrenching ending to their relationship. I still think Tywin is going to get it before the season is out. Oberyn came to King's Landing with two targets. He's about to get his shot at the first, the Mountain. If he (and therefore, Tyrion) survives, I think he may take his shot at the second. I think that Tyrion may collude with him to create the perfect situation where Oberyn gets a shot to kill Tywin. Then maybe (hopefully) Tyrion could find refuge in Dorne. I would love for the trial plot line to end with Tywin dead and Tyrion finding acceptance somewhere warm and tolerant like Dorne. But this is Game of Thrones, so I shouldn't expect any happy endings.

You're right, DWP, Sansa doesn't fit with the other names. And actually, Arya is a bit different too. It's possible that Ned chose the boys' names and Catlyn chose the girls' names. Maybe Sansa is a family name in Catlyn's family. The only names in her family I can think of are Catlyn, Lysa and Edmure, so that's not very helpful.

True, Stannis doesn't know about the wildlings, but the prophesy in the flames was a great battle in the snow up north, IIRC. We don't know whether he was battling wildlings or white walkers, so we don't know the timing. But Stannis knows he needs to gather an army and get to the north. Unfortunately for Jon, the wildling army numbers in the tens of thousands. As far as I can see, there are only three scenarios that can save Castle Black. The first is trapping most of the wildlings north of the wall, which would involve sealing the tunnels and hoping the wildlings don't have a really good plan B. The second is massive reinforcements from either northern houses or Stannis, which would make for an epic battle. The third is a truce of sorts with the wildlings. A truce is hugely problematic. I don't think the wildlings have any intention of standing with the Night's Watch or anyone else to fight the White Walkers and whatever else is up there. I got the distrinct impression that their attitude was the same as Osha's: get as far south as you can, as fast as you can. I would be surprised to see them agree to stay north and fight. More importantly, it would be disastrous for the Night's Watch to grant the wildlings passage to the south. We've seen that the wildlings have no second thoughts about murdering and pillaging and cannibalising the people they encounter south of the wall. And whether they stay near the wall and fight or go south, I got the impression that Mance Rayder doesn't have good control over their actions. These are diverse people, just like the Hill Tribes. They've bound together out of necessity, but they aren't disciplined, principled troops that will forego their needs and wants to obey a central command structure. For the Night's Watch to knowingly unleash a horde of tens of thousands of wildlings on westeros is akin to unleashing the Dothraki on westeros, at least as far as the common people are concerned. I don't think Jon would do that, but that the scumbags currently in charge might. And it would be a wholesale dereliction of their vows to do it. I think Jon will make a stand against the wildlings no matter what. And I think that stand will be incredibly costly, even if he survives the battle. The only question is whether the main force of the wildlings ends up north of the wall, south of the wall or dead when all is said and done.

Awww, I'm liking the Ned's past love scenario. It's hard to imagine him having a liaison with her after he's married to Catlyn, but it does seem more plausible than him hooking up with a random woman he meets while off at war. I've been thinking about possibilities for a battle at the Wall. We don't know whether it will happen this season, but it kind of seemed to be going that direction before Joffrey's death and the whole trial thing grabbed a prominent role. I had been thinking that Stannis' troops might swoop in to save the day from the overnumbering wildling army, much as the Tyrells did at King's Landing. But we haven't seen much movement from Stannis. From the opening credits, the Wall looks far north of Braavos, and Castle Black looks like it's at the midpoint of the Wall, so it would be a very long journey for Stannis and his mercenaries. Bolton's forces being trapped south of the moat would be helpful for him, so at least he wouldn't have to face them on his way there. But what about the Karstarks and other bannermen whose troops left Robb before the wedding, and therefore are still alive in the north? It seems like too much for three episodes, even though travel in this series seems to be remarkably fast and trouble-free. Then again, maybe Stannis isn't planning on going north yet, and his focus truly is on King's Landing. If that's the case, and Castle Black is overrun, the north will be a disaster. It seems to me that the wildlings would leave a swath of destruction in their wake every bit as devastating as that left by the Mountain and the Lannister troops. Ad hoc troops of various bannermen wouldn't do much to slow them down, considering their numbers. So where are our wildlings? It appears that there are relatively small numbers south of the wall...a few hundred at most. Is their plan for those south of the wall to take Castle Black and then open the tunnels beneath the Wall when Mance Rayder lights his fire and sends men into the tunnel? Maybe the Giants can scale the Wall simultaneously. I don't know that they would fit into the tunnel to wrench open all the gates, as Jon was imagining. Or are there only gates at either end? If there aren't gates in the center of the Wall, the giants could definitely get the wildlings into the tunnel. An alternative that occured to me is whether Mance's "biggest fire" is some sort of fire-based attack that will actually melt a section of the Wall. He doesn't have wildfire, as far as we know, so I'm having trouble imagining what that would be, other than a sustained attack with burning projectiles, whether from giants or catapults. It's seems short-sighted to destroy part of the Wall to get to the other side if the reason for doing so is scary monsters pursuing you. But we know that steel doesn't stop the White Walkers...remember the sword shattering? Maybe they can shatter all the gates and waltz right under the Wall. So Jon's idea of sealing the tunnels with ice is actually a decent idea. My only other thought on wildlings being capable of creating massive fires or fire weapons is that it would make a great weapon against the zombies. The other scenario that occurred to me is if the wildling army masses at the Wall, and is then trapped between the Wall and the White Walker/zombie army. Do the Night's Watch help, or do they sit back allow them to destroy a large portion of each other's armies? It would be pretty epic. But it's too much to hope for.