Uncle JUICE
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Posts posted by Uncle JUICE
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I hate the lawyer meetings that are clearly not at a lawyer's office. Pretty sure the 3d time appearance lady and her weird boyfriend took their meeting in my grandmother's dining room. What legitimate lawyer has a glass top desk with no drawers? Also, I'm not letting a guy that looks like that defend me in court. Clearly not a lawyer, fairly certain his clothes were borrowed, unkempt pony tail, I mean geez. What a disaster.
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Perhaps ironically, the FEDRA commander basically described what happened in the power vacuum in KC. I wonder if we'll get some sort of look at FEDRA that shows us why so many people felt like they should be overthrown.
As far as this episode goes, I'm with whoever said they're all for characterization. I didn't and don't need another version of The Walking Dead, one of the shittiest shows to ever make it out of season 2. Stuff like this is what makes this show feel different. Plus Bella Ramsey is frigging destroying her role. No chance they thought she'd be as good as she's been, and I thought while the actress playing Riley was fine, you can see the qualitative difference between them when they're on screen together. Riley felt closer to a Nickelodeon actor to me. She's just not quite "there" yet.
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1 minute ago, 30 Helens said:
Although I’ve seen it described as a stand-alone/ bottle episode, I think this episode is anything but. It may not do much to advance the plot in a literal way, but it brings focus to what has been lost in the world these characters inhabit. A loving touch… the sweet taste of a simple strawberry…familiar, soul-stirring music… and the time to indulge in any small thing that brings joy… that is what has been stripped from the other characters, in their bleak surroundings and never-ending struggle to survive.
Among the number of good points in your post, this one sticks out to me. I agree that this isn't a bottle episode; the Bill and Frank stuff goes on for around 35 minutes. Everything else is Joel and Ellie. The remains in the pit, the stop at Cumberland farms, there's plenty of "current day" plot happening, it's just that the Bill and Frank story is so effectively told that it SEEMS like a lot more. I didn't think at all about what you describe though, and it's so true about how 'normal' their lives are, but when viewed through the prism of their world, it's a devastating look at what humanity loses. Glad you picked it up, I'm like you, no zombie shows (fuck off, Walking Dead), no video game exposure, I watched it because I like Pedro Pascal and Sunday nights have been slow since HotD ended.
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36 minutes ago, Dev F said:
How do we know that they didn't? If Sam got sick a few years ago, I'm assuming Henry sold out the resistance and FEDRA killed Michael a few years ago as well.
I guess I presumed that Henry telling Joel that FEDRA was in KC up until about ten days ago meant that Kathleen's revolution happened around that time, and again based on presumption (so, based on not a lot), I didn't figure that Michael was the only person they would have moved to eliminate via collaborator information. Given their rep and all, Michael seems to me a 'decapitative' strike, which would have been followed by a swift mop up operation, given the small band of people you're talking about in the 'resistance.' I guess I have the opposite slant on the "time" that you do: I figure everything in a world like this has to happen on a super-accelerated timeline because of the constant mortal danger around every corner. In any case, interesting to read a different take on it.
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13 hours ago, Raachel2008 said:
I'm a bit late to this, but I really really really wish they hadn't given Sam cancer (leukemia?). I think it was over the top and not realistic; let's say Sam had cancer 4 years ago, that would have been 16 years after the world ended, how did the medicine lasted? Who treated him? Did he had chemo? Radio? FEDRA provided him the entire treatment, anti-nausea medication, etc etc? Come on.
Kathleen was right when she said that kids die - and in this world they die from things we take from granted because we can 'cure' 'simple' diseases that killed children a century ago.. Like, maybe Sam had a flu, never got better, an boom, a full pneumonia getting worse and worse and Henry seeing his little brother this close to die went to FEDRA. Maybe he had a tooth abscess that got infected really fast and soon he was going into sepse. There. Way more plausible and IMO enlightening or how dire and hard is their lives.
What a frigging great point. I kind of glossed over this on my first watch, but on the two repeated viewings I've done (THERE ARE NO SPORTS I LIKE ON, don't judge me :)), it kind of bugged me too, and led to my "timeline" question on Kathleen. If Sam had leukemia two weeks ago, he looks pretty good now. But I'll forgive it!
13 hours ago, Raachel2008 said:Also, I disagree with the idead that her brother didn't accomplish anything. He was betrayed before he could do anything. Sam is healthy and ok, so we are talking at least two years post cancer.
So you think that Sam's cancer and the betrayal of Kathleen's brother was two years old? I didn't get that impression from the show. FEDRA doesn't strike me as a patient organization, I mean they're shooting infected on test results (How many Ellies has this cost humanity?). Plus the KC FEDRA apparently had a particularly brutal reputation among the QZ's. Seemed to me they'd be the kind of organization to take swift and decisive (if not the wisest) action in the face of resistance like that.
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9 hours ago, kassa said:
Sporty woman lines up athletic jock squad against guest services staff in full knowledge of how things will work out so she can set up her guaranteed camera time touching monologue about what a failure you are until she absolves you.
This should have been the episode summary when I hit "INFO" on my remote. It's insanely accurate. Well done.
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1 hour ago, mledawn said:
This is what occurred to me while Kathleen and Perry were talking in that bedroom -- how does she have such control over all of these people. She doesn't seem that spectacular. Perry often looked hesitant. Were he and the other lieutenants just leftovers from her brother's regime? They were loyal to her because of her brother's legacy?
Curious, as I don't know the answer, bit how long do we think it was between her brothers death and present day? I think it's less than ten days.
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2 hours ago, iMonrey said:
What? But Sandy said she got $10K per season for team building activities! Are you suggesting Captain Sandy told an untruth? 🧐
Well in this case she got reimbursed for the two uber drivers who took them to that very sad and very same gross beach. The volleyball net was already there.
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29 minutes ago, Shermie said:
I assume that clothing is available everywhere; stores and houses are full of it in all sizes. Anyone needing a new jacket or boots could go to a Walmart or a house and find something
I don't think I said what you quoted, but I can sure respond: I thought this too, but there's not a 20 year supply of anything of any use to people anywhere. My conclusion is that those stores were raided within the first year, and anything that would be of any use, clothes, shoes, weapons, tools, ALLLLLLLL of that would have been taken for hoarding purposes and used as leverage. Heck, look what Bill's first move was: steal then gut his neighbor's boat, head to the local Home Depot and grab as much as you could pack, and be quick about it. That was ver,y very early in the outbreak, before anyone could really organize. Between the number of people who died and the number who were infected, early on this would have been fairly easy. Particularly if you were a person who had capacity to store these things. Initially it'd be goods for sale for money, but money collapses pretty quickly, so then they become very high value trade items. I'd be absolutely floored if any big box store had anything left on any shelf. Food would be first, but that's very limited.
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18 minutes ago, Tachi Rocinante said:
When they were talking about "the kid had to die" who were they referring to? Henry made it seem like he had another brother or something.
I don't remember them saying the kid HAD to die, but Kathleen saying maybe he SHOULD have died. This I understood as her counterpoint to Henry's motivation, which was lifesaving cancer medicine for Sam (what he sold out her brother to get). Essentially she thinks Henry intervened on fate's behalf and everything that happened afterward, all the fucked up series of events, were his fault. She's not entirely wrong, either, I mean look at all the shitty stuff that happened to everyone involved over what turned out to be less than two additional weeks of life (if we consider that the pills transaction actually happened before the fall of FEDRA KC), and Henry ended up having to shoot Sam kind of seems like some sort of karmic punishment (if you're Kathleen pre-being beaten then infected by a clicker).
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I wonder how much of that has to do with people who've played the game vs. people who've watched the show. I've never played the game (not a huge 1p shooter guy and I definitely am not a zombies guy), so this is my only exposure to the story.
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10 minutes ago, Starchild said:
Ha, well I think we can all agree that there are actors in both cultures who are very bad at it lol.
Looking at you, guy who played Petyr Baelish and Mayor Carcetti.
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On 1/29/2023 at 10:24 PM, Starchild said:
Never played the game, so I don't know if Bill and Frank's story was shown, or if it was just told in backstory exposition, but...
OMG that was one of the sweetest, saddest love stories I've ever seen.
A nearly 20-year realistic-feeling relationship between two fully realized characters told in just over an hour.
This episode must win all the awards.
Maybe someone has pointed this out subsequently, but it wasn't in an hour. It was closer to thirty five minutes, somehow. THe hour would include all the Joel stuff that happens afterward, and Frank doesn't show up until well after we meet Bill. It's an insane display of unbelievably efficient storytelling, the kind of achievement that is so profound and so rare that it makes me feel like a terrible writer, because how could I ever accomplish anything like this!
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6 minutes ago, Capricasix said:
Also when Henry was about to give himself up, he said something like “I’ll come out! Just let the kids go”, and she said, “No, sorry 🤷🏽♀️” almost as if to say “Too bad, so sad - the kids have to die too”.
Agree, this one tiny exchange sort of stood out for me for some reason. The somewhat elongated "No," like a mom who's done negotiating with a six year old but isn't yelling or screaming yet, just chilling. I didn't take it as flippant though, for me it was more like "I have considered this already, and because I'm the one in charge, I'm afraid it isn't going to go down that way." THe same with her "I know why you did it," I really did feel like she absolutely understood his motivations, that she didn't necessarily disagree, but she had "won." Revenge or justice are close enough cousins that they might look the same, depending on perspective. I hate how much I love this show so far.
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THis was on again last night and of course I watched it. Caught the post-infection scene with Sam attacking Ellie and the aftermath. The dawning realization on poor Henry's face after Sam falls lifeless to the floor, that everything he'd done was for nothing, was really something to watch, nice job by that actor. I wish they'd have kept Kathleen around longer, I loved her performance, too. Her school marm tone was insanely menacing, from the second she hit the screen with that doctor Edelstein. When he said this has to stop, and she was like "You mean NOW it has to, right? Because you're in here." That's some good villainy.
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1 hour ago, Ilovepie said:
Gah! Nothing you have said here makes me want to survive the zombie/fungus apocalypse ;-p
Isn't that a choice in and of itself? It's the choice made by Bill, after all, isn't it? :) and don't worry, I'm fairly certain I'm overestimating my own survival skills. Pretty.much if there's no toilet paper, I'm ready to call it quits on civilization.
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1 hour ago, Ilovepie said:
I get what you're saying, but I do think there are enough people to live past meager subsistence - I mean, just the horrid filth is confounding. Sure you can't have new nikes but why stay in cities that have no way to support growing food and starting over? I know not everyone has the skills Bill had, but I personally know a lot of people just in my own life that possess engineering skills and even just tinker with things to a point that they could probably figure out how to make it work. If I know that many people, how are there zero people there that are trying to do what Bill has done? Lots of places in our own actual world have experienced catastrophic events and eventually they rebuild. I don't think the US would have collapsed to the level shown in this show or Walking Dead. But I am an optimistic person, so maybe it's my naivety that makes me think people would rise above. Maybe that's what draws us all to these shows - a voyeuristic view of how humanity behaves in an extreme crisis? Or, as I said in my OP, let me die first if this is the only outcome because I don't want to live like a savage hiding in a gross building eating 20 year old chef boyardee or killing people to survive......
I hear you, and like you, I'm an optimist with a lot of faith in collective humanity...but imagine how quickly that'd evaporate under the circumstances. How many times would someone have to take your resources before you not only refused to share them, but defended them aggressively against EVERY person? Even if you're in a loose "collective" of resource generation, how long does it take for one armed group to decide "Why should we start our own farm when it looks like these people have plenty of food right now, not six or eight weeks from now?" Then you know the outcome, arguemnts ensue and shit goes pear shaped in a realy hurry. It was Bill's LACK of faith in humanity, or his certainty about how terrible people would become, that saved him, that made him that "island" on his own. He took all that time to set up all that stuff after he was sure everyone had left. People with those skills would quickly become somewhat different, no? Like if you're an electrical engineer...what if the wrong person finds that out? There's a very thin line between "respected contributor to society" and "forced labor" in a place like this, I'd think. Or, other hand, you could withhold your skills so that, say, the pills manufacturing equipment locally just doesn't run, until you get exactly what you want. I think you're right on it, the appeal of these shows, zombie shows, is it forces us to imagine "what am I capable of, really" in a way.
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25 minutes ago, Absurda said:
I've been thinking about goods and such. In the first episode one of the FEDRA guys said in Atlanta they were manufacturing bullets and pills. So, there is some manufacturing going on. Presumably people are still able to sew since everyone has clothing that's not too ratty. It also seems that there is trade between the QZs and the outliers, probably raiders as well. They have apples in KC QZ so there must be some farming somewhere and trade with the QZ. Unless they have city garden plots. They also have beef jerky and, at one point, Ellie had a chicken sandwich so there's some sort of animal farming and meat production still going on. There may be some form of rebuilding and farming going on in places, we're just not seeing it because it's not part of the story.
One thing that does kind of bug me, though, is we occasionally see in the background some metal FEDRA signs with warnings or, in one case, a description of infected symptoms and timelines. The whole world fell apart and someone was still spending their time designing and making these signs?
Ugh, this show is going to kill me, it's another place for me to get bogged down in details like this :). So to the last paragraph, I'd conclude that the outbreak's worst days were at the very, very beginning, and then once enough people were dead, the misery and dangers people face daily changed and became more stable. After all, those QZ walls don't go up in a matter of hours, they're prison walls the span of city blocks, so clearly something must have stabilized to allow their construction, right? To me it seems reasonable that whatever's left of the central health authorities, the ones developing screening machines like the ones we see, would have no problem publishing signs aimed (futilely) to limit the outbreak. Now they seem quite out-dated, and really only exist for viewer information (everyone alive would know these timelines, maybe they just don't bother taking them down).
City garden plots are an interesting idea, but as a FEDRA managed resource is my guess, otherwise you'd be growing apples for people to just steal from your tree. And we sure it's BEEF jerky? :) The chicken I get (we see Bill has a coop, reasonable to imagine these are fairly common), but the bread gives me pause. As a non-game playing watcher, I really loved how the second episode's opening dovetailed in with the first and second episode details around bread.
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13 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:
Still, in some ways that is what I think more people would be like. I mean, where are the people trying to rebuild? Nowhere? No-one???? It's not the immediate aftermath here, it's 20 years!
This is the kind of thing that I find fascinating about this show. Initially I agreed with you: where's all the rebuilding, this was my main pushback on Walking Dead (I quit that shitshow in S3, I know it ended up with a ton of other problems), why aren't humans trying to out-think the walkers, etc. I think here this show is a little different because it very clearly lays out an absolutely STUNNING timeline of how things went to shit. Basically, Joel went to work on Friday morning, and by 11pm Friday night, the world had fallen apart, right? Planes falling out of the sky, army occupying the streets, who knows how many people dead? The rate of people dying or getting infected outpaced our ability to transfer data to each other to keep things going, and everything but survival went on the back burner. Like that kid's shoes, there's just no one to make them anymore. I think you're seeing people try to rebuild (FEDRA no doubt started out with this goal in mind), but the population is so decimated that specialized and industrialized skills are so few and far between that we just don't have the horsepower.
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10 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:
I wanted so badly to get a meme of Andre the Giant saying that!
I honestly do not remember Rachel having an issue with Camille, did I just block it out or was there some sort of confrontation between them?
No, Camille did. She went to Rachel with her tone to get validation that no, not every department head had a problem with her, only to be shocked to find out that Rachel DID have a problem, she just chose to handle it in a manner that's nearer to 'professional' than "get shitfaced and blow up your colleague in front of others and in public." Rachel didn't have time to make a big deal out of Camille's uselessness, and very likely addressed whatever her concerns were with Fraser (Camille's manager, Rachel's peer). I was delighted by the way Rachel handled Camille in this last moment, she wasn't an asshole about it, but she was clear. Good for her and what a turnaround by someone who two seasons ago was an absolute nightmare. Seems like she's dropped the stereotypical chef "tortured genius' rol and just likes to let her talent shine. This boat isn't doing her any favors.
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On 1/16/2023 at 9:13 PM, MyMaui said:
To see Ben and Camille do this again to Tony was disgusting. It's not funny to do that to someone and I don't see how they can laugh at it. Even the first time it wasn't funny. They both are are to blame and are sick for doing that too. If it was me, I would have kicked the bed on the mattress and then tore off their sheets disrupting them.
DIdn't this happen again last night? honestly, I'm watching it with Mrs. Juice, and I told her there is zero chance that's happening twice in my room. I'd have done everything I could to interrupt it. "Guys, no problem if you want to do that, but can we turn the lights on so I can watch while I beat off?" or "I think you should go faster, wait, let me check the angle." Or start making the same noises. Or cheer them on. Tear off a loud fart. The least that guy could do would be to pay the tab for his roomie when they went out the next time, then promised "I'll ask if I can use a guest room if it happens again, okay? My apologies."
No one faults you for being young, good looking and horny. It's the lack of consideration for others that sets you apart, you two.
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9 minutes ago, Oosala said:
I really love this mashup. Did you make it up @Uncle JUICE?
I wish I could take credit for it, but no :)
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One thing is for sure. There are no heroes here.
Alissa and Camille are BOTH assholes, there's no other way around that fact. One just happens to be a better worker than the other. THere's no reason at all to start with the "I hate you" stuff while you're getting ready to go out as a group, that's nothing but a fucking jerkoff of a person who I can't imagine spending five minutes with. She HAD the high ground, too. She could have just gone about her business, but she decided to actively be abusive to Camille. Add in her insistence on flirting with Russ when she knows there's a situationship developing, and I can't really deal with her. That said, 1000% certain she would absolutely fuck Russ into oblivion should she decide to do so.
Russ is another problem entirely, a much grosser one, and somehow Sandy better get that mess quashed. All of his interactions with the women are entirely inappropriate given his rank, and open the boat owners to liability in a lawsuit. Big red flag when someone working for you says "At least my boss has a crush on me!" at all, much less in front of other subordinates, that's bad news all the way around.
Why does the red haired funny stewardess wear a wig so ridiculous? Her tattoo on her arm is outstanding, which is unusual for this show.
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42 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:
I was taking yoga lessons in a tiny little studio and there was one person who would plant herself front and center, during shavasana she would breath so heavily it was distracting, during other poses she would burp constantly, like try and make yourself burp type burping, every exhale...I asked the teacher about it and she got mad when I asked, the instructor told me it was part of that person's journey, I did not ask about her journey I stated maybe have her off to the side because it was interferring with my yoga journey and suddenly I'm the asshole. The burping, extreme heavy breathing and the anti semetic, (it was really ugly and I am still the asshole, really?), things that person said made me re-think that class, I quit. Point is, if you are loud during yoga you know it, maybe it is better Tony be alone during his yoga journey.
Did you counter that maybe pointing out inconsiderate and / or racist assholes is part of YOUR journey?
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S05.E01: Life After Lockup: Habitual Offenders
in Love After Lockup
I think it was Stuttering John Melendez circa 1994.