Xenith22
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Those wraiths are very convenient. They come looking for Hunter Z. but aren't around when Barry's mom is killed and there are several speedsters mucking with the timeline.
If the Wraiths were looking for Zoom where were they when he was knocked ass backwards into the breach aka their home? For that matter I am still trying to understand Team's plan? What were they actually hoping to accomplish? I mean have we not established that Zoom has been running back and forth between the two Earth's for awhile now? Why would it have taken any time at all for him to return and snap their necks?
Also the claim that they could not turn the Magnetar off without destroying the Earth seemed dumb...I mean did the thing not require a power source to run? Was that power source not speedsters? How was it going to have the energy to destroy the Earth without that power? And why could you just not blow the thing the heck up it's not like the device itself was an bomb... Aaaaaargh.
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Wow I am shocked. No, not about the massive stall the writers threw up. What I can't believe is that they actually FINALLY had Iris take the initiative to talk to Barry alone without Joe first giving her a look/nod making it look like he was pushing her to do it like he did every other freaking time this season...
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"My name is Barry Allen. For the past two years, I have gone on many adventures. Made new friends. Visited new worlds. And learned what family is all about. And because I feel hollow inside, I'm going to choose not to learn any lessons and recreate Flashpoint. You know, the launching pad for a company-wide reboot that would led to another reboot inside five years. Right now, I'm looking to surpass Rip Hunter as the worst time traveler in the CWverse. That's Rip Hunter, a man who recruited Leonard Snart to save his wife and son, then took Mick Rory because why not?"
Maybe Gideon can point Rip and the Legends into hunting down and stopping Barry as their next objective...
Seriously though Flashpoint doesn't make sense here? Sure while technically it was Barry saving Nora that caused Flashpoint it wasn't actually the fact that Nora lived that was to blame for 99% of events? The major changes to history were caused by two things the first was Barry pulling the entire Speedforce (aka a vital cosmic force interwoven with all reality) into himself in order to defeat Zoom in that instant. The second was Zoom himself altering some events since he was now a paradox independent of the Flash. There was nothing about the way that Barry ambushed Reverse Flash that to me indicated it necessitated that he absorbed the full speed force to do it? I mean he certainly would not have needed to because we have already established that Barry is now much faster than Thawne was at this point in time with how easily he dispatched his time remnant? The RF as paradox thing also runs contrary to what we saw with Eddie's death removing his existence. RF can not dramatically muck with things without endangering his own existence (assuming Barry even still becomes the Flash)?
There is no guarantee (in universe) that Barry will become the Flash again. I mean at this point he could only sort of hope that since Earth-2 Harry also built and exploding particle accelerator that it meant that Earth-1 would have had he not been killed by Thawne because of Speedforce destiny? (Assuming he did not piss off the cosmic force that is the Speedforce which flat out told him to get over his mom's death and that he would have to accept more losses in the future and move forward...and he just did the complete opposite.) Clearly he needs to become the Flash again...because even if there were no particle accelerator explosion and thus no metas on Earth-1 Central City to deal with there is still Earth-2 and Zoom. No Barry as Flash means he has just completely screwed over that entire world, and that he better hope that Zoom does not get bored without discovering Earth-1 and thus decide to use his hamster wheel of doom over there using his time remnants as power (why did he really need Barry if he can create easy clones of himself whom could conceivably combine their energy?) to wipe out the multiverse...
On a different note...Barry took the time to show up and support Oliver at Laurel's funeral. Really not cool that Oliver or Felicity would not reciprocate and support him at the funeral for his freaking Dad. There better be a really good explanation of Arrow tomorrow.
*sigh* I just hope we are done with must run faster that so-and-so plots because they could not be anymore BS. I mean when you can already run fast enough where you break through the barrier of space and time...how do you actually run faster without breaking through the barriers of space and time? *shakes head*
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4 hours ago, MarkHB said:
The problem with bringing Supergirl to Earth-1 on a permanent basis is that many of the things that drive plots on Arrow would be easy cleanups for a Kryptonian. They can handwave her away sometimes, but that wouldn't hold up for a full season arc. So I have a hunch that the folks in National City will be staying on Earth-K for a while yet, except for occasional crossovers.
Meh, you could also say a lot of Arrow's plots could be easily be handled by the Flash and that Kara's problems could be handled by team-ups with Superman. It really is no different than the actual comics where all the heroes are in the same universe, but yet most of the time in their own books they deal with their own sometimes life, city, and world threatening issues without the aid of more powerful allies. So I see no reason why if they want to they can't just crisis everything together (just as long as Superman himself somehow gets left behind in another universe since they can't actually ever do anything productive with him. *Unless the new people in charge of DC movies are not such major hard a$$es about TV using alternate versions of characters that appeared in movies like the previous regime?*)
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I also wasn't too terribly impressed with the episode as a whole. The Felicity and Friends sections were entertaining.
Come on CW Seed just make it happen already...guaranteed hit.
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2 hours ago, AyChihuahua said:
She was perfectly safe in the dome with the rest of the Vichy assholes. If everybody else in the whole entire world would have died, she'd have been fine. I don't understand why he went down to save her in the first place instead of guarding the people who were actively thwarting the big bad.
Except Oliver did not know she was safe. All he knew was that he could not reach her and then Felicity got a text from Thea that simply said she was being held prisoner by HIVE and Merlyn - 911. (Malcolm arrived before she could provide any more details) I can not exactly fault Oliver for thinking that maybe she was not safe, because although Malcolm would likely not kill her or want to hurt her too bad Darkh is currently like a crazy demigod planning to end the world. There is no guarantee that he would not kill Thea at anytime and even Malcolm would have been powerless to stop him. Felicity even essentially urged Oliver of the danger Thea could be in and essentially sent him off on this rescue mission.
Also keep in mind this is not long after Oliver just lost Laurel whom he deeply cared for, and of course this is not long after Felicity dumped him. Sure she came back to the team in light of the current situation, but she still made her feelings known to him that they could not continue to work together so once the current crisis is over and Laurel has been avenged it's possible he realizes Felicity may leave his life again for good. Thea is Oliver's last surviving family member. Can you really fault him for feeling a need to save her and not wanting to lose one of the last important people in his life right now? For that matter keep in mind that the only way to fight against Darkh's powers is by thinking happy thoughts. Would knowing his sister is a prisoner and potentially dead at any time not be a potential hindrance to that? There was nothing he could do at the loft other than stand around and wait to potentially be ambushed. Really it should have been Argus that had an small army watching Felicity's loft since apparently there are no other competent hackers in the US capable of working on this situation...
Totally agree about Oliver. When that guy said that Star City had failed them, I wanted Oliver to yell "Then move to another damn city!"
Speaking of those people once they are back with the main civilization is any of them going to report that Malcolm Meryln is alive and palling around with the Green Arrow? (Yeah I think we all know the answer to that...)
Quote11. This makes what, the third Big Bad to walk into the loft? Fourth, if we include Malcolm? (Ra's, Vandal Savage and Damien.) I know it's a really awesome loft and those large fireplaces are gorgeous, and that you're on a show that hates building new sets, but really, I think you guys need to find a new place. It's even easier to break into than the Arrow Cave, and that's really saying something.
Poor Slade must be feeling left out, all he got to see was Laurel's dingy apartment. That needs to be rectified.
Quote*Of all the Bad Guys around this season, the first death that seemed to take was Ruve's? Not Malcolm or Brick or Murmur? (Okay, keep Brick; I like Vinnie Jones.) Not cool. ( If I am wrong about death taking a villain permanently before Ruve, then I apologize in advance.) Alas, the fatal shoulder strike takes another TV character.
The first major bad guy death was Conklin on the island. If you are not counting Flashbacks then how about Andy Diggle?
QuoteI was seriously watching the Anarky scene thinking "why are they trying to stop him? no really, why?"
Well I mean this week Anarky planned to not only murder Darkh's daughter (whom they do not know is evil) but also to blow up the dome under the city, which was not only going to kill all the people in the dome but countless others in Star City up above? Speaking of that, I am really not happy with how Thea seemed to brush off responsibility for that. I'm pretty sure it was her carelessly fired arrow that did it, so her gallows humor seemed really inappropriate after potentially having killed that many innocent people.
QuoteI'm pretty much Tom Amandes biggest fan, but didn't Noah kinda threaten to murder a bunch of people in his last appearance? I'm not sure how serious he was, but that's not really the kind of guy you want around your young daughter.
Except Felicity is not a young kid anymore. She is an adult capable of making her own decisions, and she knows full well what Noah is capable of (and if there is something particularly horrendous she does not know then Donna could have told her everything so she could make a more informed decision). I don't fault Donna for leaving him in the past, but Felicity deserved to be allowed to make her own decision as to whether she wants to pursue any kind of relationship with her father now.
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Okay so Benoist (obviously), Harewood, Jordan, and Leigh (big sigh of relief as she along with Benoist & Flockhart were among the vocal about remaining in LA) have now all posted/tweeted positive things about the renewal and so we know are all aboard for the move.
24 hours later and still it seems no one else has managed to confirm if Flockhart is staying besides that one THR article... That is worrying especially when the Deadline article specifically deleted their mention of her being still onboard from their renewal article not long after it was posted.
FOX officially passed on Zoobiquity so we will see if that means Peter Facineli might consider returning for S2 after all. He was almost definitely out move or no move had that gotten picked up.
Mehcad Brooks is the only other major cast member (unless you count Jenna Dewan-Tatum who as just recurring status has likely not been approached yet) who has not tweeted/posted anything about the renewal. So dare to dream a little longer that he will choose to focus on his music career...
Now all I want to know is, will CBS air repeats of the first season? Will it be available on demand, or will on demand for the first season be available on CW?
I would be shocked to see CBS rerun any Supergirl episodes as the first airing ratings were not that good (hence their non-renewal) and they have no reason to want to drum up any interest for a show on a competing network now. However the first season will likely continue to be On Demand and at CBS.com thru at least the summer. (until they have a new batch of "current" shows to replace it and other cancelled stuff with on their site). After that I expect that it will almost definitely be moved to Hulu. (Which is where Arrow, Flash, Legends, etc are)-
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Maybe with the move to The CW, the Supergirl cast will find themselves being transported to the Flarrow universe (The Flash/Arrow/Legends, for people who don't know those shows) and they'll conveniently forget Jimmy there. Just transport the main cast, Cat's son Adam, Eliza Danvers, and Maxwell Lord. That way, easier to have crossovers with the other shows instead of having it just be Barry.
Yes I want them to Crisis or otherwise transport at least National CIty onto Earth-CW (Braniac anyone?) at some point of the season sooo bad. I think it would have story potential for the cast.
Kara - Could actually be the lone survivor of Krypton on this Earth (depending on where Non is imprisoned) as Clark and Metropolis would remain on Earth-CBS. She would arguably be the most powerful hero on the planet. No more Superman shadow hanging over her, no more wondering why she doesn't call her cousin for help dealing with a major crisis or having to make him job so she can save the day.
Cat - Would find herself going from the powerful self proclaimed Queen of All Media, to someone that no one outside of National City has ever heard of, she would have to essentially rebuild her reputation and contact list from the ground up.
Max - Would be in an similar boat of having to make a name for himself again, although I would imagine he might be able to invent something big to make a name for himself relatively fast. You just know there would be trouble with Palmertech.
Alex, J'onn, (and possibly Lucy) - Would find themselves working for an organization that the Government does not know exists or would not feel the need to fund since alien incursions have not been a common occurrence to this point on Earth-CW until now. Would they be absorbed by Argus? Would they try to operate in secret and if so how would they be funded? Would the DEO just drain away remaining funds losing all their staff and resources until nothing was left? Does J'onn have a source of income stashed away that could keep the doors open for awhile? Or would they be forced to do something drastic like allow themselves to be funded by a private party like Max Lord?
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1 hour ago, stealinghome said:
They're just going to have to punt some shows to summer (I'm guessing Reign is a good candidate) and/or order 13-16 episodes of a few shows. I'm guessing Crazy Ex, iZombie, The 100, and maybe Vampire Diaries and The Originals might get that treatment.
I mean, you know that Supergirl, Arrow, Flash, and (I'm guessing) Supernatural and Jane the Virgin are getting full seasons. That already leaves 7 shows to share 5 slots, 8 if they renew Containment, and I think the CW has already picked up 4 pilots, which takes them to 11/12 shows for 5 slots. They're just going to have to order short seasons of a LOT of stuff. Heck, now that I look at the numbers, maybe even JtV gets a 13-episode order....
First, Containment was just given the axe.
Next there are other scheduling possibilities, they could be planning to start airing original programming at 10PM instead of continuing to sell it to local/news programming?
Or wasn't there something said awhile back that CW wanted more year round programming? (ie new summer shows instead of 90% British imports and constant reruns of stuff like Whose Line.)
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52 minutes ago, benteen said:
AV Club did bring up a good point about the nuke. If you use it, then you have to treat it as a huge deal afterwards. With acknowledgement on the other Arrowverse shows.
Quote2. And speaking of consequences, kudos to Arrow for genuinely upping the stakes/death count for this season's finale - and for not holding those stakes back for the season finale. I'm interested to see where the show goes with this.
Meh. A small town we never heard of, with not a single character we ever met was nuked on the other side of the country. Sure if such an event happened in real life it would be a major deal, I mean in addition to the 10k instantly dead you have the nuclear fallout for miles causing countless more deaths illnesses and rendering the area uninhabitable for at least half a century, the media would talk about nothing else for months and it would be talked about for years, there would be presidential speeches, there could be major political repercussions over the US/Argus building tech to hijack other countries missiles, there would be a manhunt maybe even a deploying of the national guard, etc. But none of that is really relevant to Arrow or the Flash.
At most I think we are looking at Felicity having major guilt issues over the deaths of the people in that town. (Which I'm not even sure how far down that path they will go). If she still owned Palmertech I could see her maybe trying to divert resources to finding ways to deal with the fallout or tech to help survivors. Given the whole radiation thing though I can't see her moving there to help as there is not much she could really do in person though as it's not like she has actual medical training/knowledge. Other than that though Oliver is going to kill Darkh nullifying any kind of extended manhunt, which I guess could/should potentially make Green Arrow a major national figure/hero? Finally in the future we will probably have a villain or two appear who were mutated/gained powers by the explosion or else lost loved ones because of it because that sort of thing happens a lot in comicbook universes and of course it would serve as an opportunity to revisit Felicity's (and probably Oliver's because issues) guilt over the matter at a later date.
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Okay so first of all this little gem from that first Donna/Quentin conversation set my stupidity sense ablaze:
Donna: Why would you have to protect her if she was a superhero.
Quentin: Now exactly, you see.Hey umm Donna, Quentin...I know it's been awhile but remember that one time when Darkh murdered Laurel and said it was payback for your going against him? No? Yes? Because call me crazy but I think the argument that just because Laurel dressed up in leather at night meant that she could have handled herself against Darkh seems somewhat flawed when your consider that he uh killed her? To me that pretty effectively proves that Quentin was indeed right in believing that despite being Black Canary she still could not hold her own against Darkh and may indeed have needed his protection to last as long as she did. Am I missing something here?
With that said I would think there still would be an absolute shit load of character/conflict of interest issues justifying the force not wanting anything to with Quentin if he knew the truth about Laurel mainly stemming from the time he had been the head of the anti-vigilante movement while knowing full well his daughter was one of said vigilantes and said nothing and possibly aided in who knows what illegal crap. Plus assuming Ruve has not revoked her anti-vigilante stance post Laurel reveal how could the police really think they could trust Quentin to do his job and not help out the people Laurel ran with at night? Honestly I am not sure how he was not going to be locked up for admitting he has known...
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On a completely different and unrelated note...did anyone else think it sounded waaaay too much like everyone but Donna was saying Raven sperm? They really should have come up with a better name...
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Poor Wally. If he hasn't figured it out already, they need to just let him in on the 'secret'. Joe trying to test him was funny, though. Quit breaking your kids' mugs!
So after the explosion Iris tells Wally that Barry is gone...and that is that? No questions? Surely to god he will put things together on his own when Barry shows up again right?
Quote4. Speaking of which, even the ghost of Barry's mother got into the "Run Barry Run" thing. I guess the Speedforce really does want Barry to do what everyone on the show keeps telling him to do.
What I found hilarious though was that there was then no actual running involved...instead he slowly took an couple steps to the portal and strained to reach Iris' hand because dramatic effect? (accompanied by CGI that would make many 90s shows cringe.)
QuoteUm...is there a reason they're not letting Barry and Iris kiss? It seems like they're purposely holding off on that.
Was this either a winter or season finale? Because there is your answer... Seriously though I would have thought if Iris was really thinking of Barry in that way now, and that she had recently thought he was dead and unsure if he would ever be back that she would have planted one on him at his return? Whatever...
QuoteIf it takes Caitlin not being there to get Iris this much to do, then I say go ahead and turn Caitlin into Killer Frost and remove her from the team. She was not missed at all in this ep, imo.
Eh, I don't think that's really a fair assesement. Caitlin's absence had nothing to do with how Iris was written? I mean what did Iris do that Caitlin would have definitely done instead? Really I think her absence was strictly about not knowing what to do with her. I mean having her escape or contact the gang yet again would have made Zoom look like an even bigger idiot. We've been playing the Caitlin tries to get Hunter to be a better person game for weeks now and did not need yet another plot of that. So what was there for her to do that would have not felt completely extraneous?
QuoteSo... the speed force is a person? Entity? I just went with it, but they really didn't explain. And I haven't read the comics.
QuoteSo is the "speedforce as an entity" a real thing in the DCU or was that just Barry's mind trying deal with his own shit ?
That's a pretty loaded question... Freaking DC writers never seem to be able to make up their minds. Basically the speedforce is another plane of existence, and it is sorta sentient in that it does choose who gains access. It also usually has a subconscious pull that tries to make people in it not want to leave. (Which seemed pretty absent. I mean Iris was seemingly used just as a physical connection to pull him back, instead of being an emotional connection that kept him from losing himself and willingly becoming part of the speedforce? Not to mention it seemingly even telling him he can leave at anytime...)
However I do not recall it ever actually directly conversing with someone like this? Now the use of the word "we" opens up the possibility that Barry was in fact not conversing with the speedforce itself per-see but with dead speedsters who had become part of it....as it is essentially the speedster's version of heaven. Of course the changing form thing is new. However where things really break down is Barry's mother. The show tried to imply that really was somehow the spirit of Barry's mother which made no sense unless she herself had secretly been a speedster? And if it wasn't Barry's mother then the lying about it and somehow knowing about the book she read to him as a toddler gets kind of creepy (not to mention the physical contact like stroking his face).
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4 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:
Lady Fortuna (also Oliver's password to get in the casino - I had to close caption to understand why he was playing for tuna) was wonderfully cast and acted.
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Sorry, it had to be done after the show pulled that mcguffin out of its you know what...
I also couldn't help but notice the similarity to Supergirl and how the contrivance of positive thinking magically freed everyone in the city from Non's high tech mind control. So now I can not help but wonder the sequence of events... Did they really each come up with using essentially the same major plot contrivance on their own? Did one set of writers come up with this on their own and the other show stole it? Did they brainstorming it together? I just want to know who to blame the most...
Quote6. Arrow, I'm not against all of this "Laurel was like my sister!" stuff, except to pull this off, it had to be earned. Diggle and Laurel had maybe four or five one on one scenes, if that, during the course of the entire series, only one of which was a personal conversation in a relaxed setting. We never, for instance, saw them hanging out at home or getting coffee. Laurel had more of those moments with Nyssa, Thea and even Felicity. It's one thing to have Oliver say he's going to get revenge, but with Diggle, not so much.
Yeah, I think we essentially have to just assume there is a lot of stuff we did not see. Basically what I am thinking is that the two may have bonded a good bit during the approx 6 months between S3-S4 where Oliver and Felicity were gone. It was just Diggle, Laurel, and Thea who were working and training together during all that time so I could definitely see them developing a much closer bond than before when they were just Oliver's subordinates and not forced to really interact with each other on a meaningful level. Although I do agree that show then really failed to do anything with that afterwards, outside of the one moment where they briefly rebelled as a team against Oliver taking over full control again, it was never referenced or shown again in any way... Pfffft stupid show.
While I'm back on Questionable Things, did we ever figure out how, exactly, H.I.V.E. is powering up this underground cave thing, which is now providing sunlight, power for several houses, and occasional barking dogs?
Evil thoughts...duh!
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Regarding the legacy of Black Canary. First of all the general public does not know about the change between the Canary and Black Canary. So the first thing people heard about Canary were the rumors/whispers of her defending women in the slums. Now Sara was quite good at working from the shadows. So not a lot of people ever really saw her. Even during Slade's siege of the city I believe most of her fighting was not done in view of any members of the public.
Which is why I believe the first major public appearance of Canary was actually Laurel during Brick's reign of terror. At that time it was the Black Canary (along with Arsenal) who initially stood in front and lead the charge against Brick to take back the city. (Sure she did not accomplish much during the actual fight, but the people there were probably too busy fighting for their own lives to notice).
After that she ran with the Arrow for a bit after his return, although again everything she was involved in happened with no one around. After the death of the Arrow in prison she was next publicly seen fighting and preventing one of Ra's minions from activating his bio weapon amidst a fleeing crowd. Then came her showing up to aid in the evacuation of the train station before the Ghosts could blow it up. I think it's fair to say she was a pretty established hero at this point because all of this stuff would have been reported by the media and gotten around by word of mouth.
That's not even counting the various villains that Team Arrow took down, which I'm sure Captain Lance upon adapting his pro-vigilante stance made sure that BC received her fair amount of credit for. Because you need to keep in mind that the general public did not often get to witness these things going down. So they were not privy to how often Laurel's BC was actually ineffective/useless or got her butt handed to her. For that matter they did not even get to witness the team dynamic. For all they knew she was an equal partner to the Green Arrow as absurd as that may sound to us TV viewers who got to see everything.
So yeah for at least a year (going on two if you count the rumors during Sara's tenure) the Black Canary did have an established rep as a hero to the general populus of the city. She may have even been a symbol of girl power. Someone up thread joked about how Evelyn bought at duplicate of her costume at an S&M shop, that may not be too far off. I would not be surprised if Arrow/Green Arrow and Black Canary costumes were not actually mass produced and sold at various stores as icons of the city. Now did Laurel actually warrant this status? Certainly not, but with that said Laurel as Black Canary did try to do the right thing (When she started down the vigilate path does not count for this since she was not doing it as BC). She put on the mask risking her life night after night to save others despite minimal training. She also managed to do this without ever killing unlike the Arrow. (So like Green Arrow she was an easier hero for the public to endorse). And while it was not often she did have her occasional moments where she legitimately helped to save the day. So yes, Evelyn putting on the mask and publicly assaulting and attempting to murder seemingly innocent (to the public) people was certainly counter to the image of BC that Laurel had established.
Not to mention that the very idea of the Black Canary going rogue like that reflected badly on all of Team Arrow and would serve to make it more difficult for the citizens of the city to ever fully trust them lest they suddenly turn on the city too. So defending what BC stood for was important not just to honor Laurel but for the future of Team Arrow.
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Quote5. Wow, the difference between the number of attendees at Tommy's funeral versus Laurel's was….pretty stark. Especially given that Tommy's funeral presumably happened just a few days after a significant section of the city was destroyed, which presumably would have kept a few people busy. I'd let this go except for one factor: given that Oliver specifically wanted everyone to know Laurel's identity, why didn't he make sure that more people – and in particular, the reporters – were there? I realize the camera wanted to frame Quentin and Donna without people behind them, but they had room on the side and the extras were presumably still milling around, so, odd.
Honestly I'm not sure why Ruve wasn't there which would have ensured plenty of press. I mean think about it, she was using Laurel's death as the primary figurehead of her anti-vigilante campaign? Would it not have made sense for her to be there with the press to further emphasize it? Not to mention the bonus that her presence would have likely enraged Team Arrow increasing the chance of them doing something stupid to further her campaign.
Baby Canary's collar was upgraded to work with her vocal chords and to increase the range and pitch. Who did this? We never find out and nobody seemed particularly interested in it either. Even though this person improved Cisco's work and is therefore presumably more capable than Cisco.
Meh, for being upgraded Thea still recovered from it absurdly quick...TWICE.
QuoteAnd Oh shit they are totally going to ruin another bird too
The main DC comics division already did that when they took what was deemed the breakout character of the Nu52, had her turn traitor and then vanish without explanation never to be seen or mentioned again. Seemed appropriate that a popular character the TV series badly mishandled was replaced by a popular character that the comics badly mishandled.
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Elena has been popping pills all episode -- antibiotics, I guess, for her injuries. But they are never mentioned at all, yet they seemed to make a point of showing her take them
This was just to emphasize how badly injured she was (since you couldn't actually tell by looking at her.). This is the reason that Sascha was the one that volunteered to out himself to the media, because Elena believed she was too injured to survive the change to do it herself.
I find it REALLY hard to believe that the Mayor is cool with a werewolf in the midst of town -- like it happens every day -- when until that point in time the humans had NO idea that werewolves existed.Yeah, to be honest I would have expected someone to start shooting much sooner...
Alexei doesn't even get a follow-up (did he piss off the writers) so who the fuck knows what happened to him, and neither did Paige. At least Zachary Cain made it out alive.Alexei was shown to be on the road with Zachary Cain in the flashforward. (It's blink and you miss it but he puts something in the back of his pick-up truck then gets in the passengers seat)
Elena still hasn't wiped the blood off her face (because of the vision she had, I guess) and pours gasoline all over the StoneHaven basement and Jeremy joins her. Funny, in her "vision", Elena was sitting in Jeremy's chair drenched in blood and Jeremy was no where to be found as StoneHaven burned. So did Elena change the future, or was her vision always full of shitI hope Jeremy has somewhere else to live? I mean why did she need to burn his whole house down just to destroy a bookshelf of scrolls in the basement?
Elena tells Konstantin that change is coming (all while the blood continues to drip down her face) and he better get on board, or she will reveal the names of all the Russian wolves to the Moscow authorities. And that there are no more Alphas, blah, blah, blah. All the Russians pack up and leave (see what I did there ? Pack up, since they are wolves).Yeah the no more packs, no more alphas thing made zero sense. What has really changed other than that they are now more likely to be hunted by normal humans who are afraid of them or believe them guilty anytime there is an animal attack? I mean they will still want to keep secret the fact that they are wolves. Just because Elena chose to disband her North American pack has no bearing on what any other pack in the world will do....
Also it seemed like Konstantin had most of his pack with him. Elena is lucky he didn't just choose to call her bluff or even just stay in America.
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Huh...so I guess there is a limit in how long after a post you can still edit something.
So one final point for the Cat Knows column from this season at the end of the finale...
- Cat promoting Kara to any job she wants and giving her a private office.
Let's examine this shall we. Cat says she is doing it because Kara is the best assistant she has ever had. While it's possible she has had a string of abysmal assistants before Kara, we also know that Kara has not been a great assistant for her. Sure when she is there she is excellent at her job and goes above and beyond what Cat asks of her, but as previously mentioned due to her double life she misses work A LOT. So much so that Cat actually felt the need to hire a second assistant to do Kara's job when she was not there. Most employers would be firing someone like Kara at this point not giving them a promotion!
Now let's talk about that promotion:
The first thing is that Kara is to hire Cat a new assistant. You know so Cat can actually have an assistant that is at her beck and call at all times during normal working hours which she knows she is not ever going to have with Kara.
Next Kara gets to choose to do pretty much anything she wants...which again from an employer perspective seems absolutely nuts. But essentially what this does is give Kara an non-essential job since whatever job she chooses will not have existed before now. (Unless Kara wants to be the fashion reporter...which seems unlikely without more Red K exposure). So basically anytime Kara has to leave due to Supergirl stuff she won't be leaving anything important/urgent to be done at work. And there is nothing at work that prevents Kara from being able to leave whenever she needs to without permission. Yet Kara still gets to experience the sense of personal fulfillment at work of doing something she likes and being able to interact with people like Cat as a normal person.
Finally there is the fact that she gets a private office that is set well aside from the rest of the newsroom. There are now at least two other open desks in the newsroom Siobhan's and Kelly's that Kara could have been relocated to in order to do her new job. Yet Cat gives Kara her own office? Think back to Livewire/Siobhan's attack on Catco which was only a couple days ago in universe time. Kara was not there at the time, but even had Kara been at her desk outside of Cat's office in plain sight of everyone what could she have done? There was no chance she could have slipped away to change into Supergirl, so she either would have just had to stand by and watch or else expose her secret identity to everyone. Cat may have even figured after the fact that this is why Kara was not there at the time to protect her and instead was relying on James to trigger his watch to call her if Livewire showed up. (too bad for her that James is dumbass and ruined that plan by getting too close). With Kara's new private office that would not be a problem. If a supervillain shows up in the bullpen targeting someone like Cat she should easily be able to slip away and change unnoticed with as far away as her office is now from the action, not to mention the additional privacy an office provides to have any secret conversations related to her other life (since Cat likely does not actually know about the room on the other floor that she uses for such purposes).
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I wondered if that was going to happen because Kara won't be her assistant anymore. Actually prior to now I think it was very hard for cat to let Kara know she knew she was Supergirl because she can't order Supergirl around. But now that she moved her out and gave her a position where she isn't ordering her about like a slave she could reveal she knows more easily.That may be part of it, but I think it's only a small part of it? I mean going back to the first time that Cat accused Kara of being Supergirl, Kara chose to quite her job rather than come clean to Cat. (Sure things weren't quite that simple due to Cat's ultimatum...and lack of tact. She also never should have referred to Kara as a story even though I do not believe she was planning on publicly outing her at the time.) But on some level I think that Cat was still hurt by the fact that Kara whom she had known for 2 years and had begun opening herself up to (which like she told Supergirl in the penultimate episode she never does) would not trust her with her secret. So at this point now I think Cat either wants to become close enough with Kara that Kara will open herself up to her about her secret on her own, or else there is part of her that is afraid that if she lets Kara know she knows again that Kara will once again start to pull away and she could lose her only true friend?
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I honestly think there's zero chance. I think basically if a character has already been claimed by the "Snyderverse", then the Flarrowverse (and even more in particular the Supergirl sub-portion of it in her own alt-Earth) probably doesn't get to use it. While the multiverse thing can and is used to explain duplications (including we already know, another Flash Snyder tossed his weight around to get to use), I think in terms of "branding", they want to try and maintain as few duplicates as possible. Oh, we know there's another Superman... but we can't see him. We infer there's another Lex Luthor (because at a minimum Lexcorp has been mentioned I think), but can't see him. We know there's another Lois Lane. We suspect the Synderverse had it's own Jimmy Olsen, but he was quickly killed and tossed out of the story like garbage. And Waller is a key to the entire Suicide Squad movie--a movie that Warners is hoping will be received well enough to overcome a lot of the bad press over Batman v. Superman. So I'd say they're likely to want to "protect" the branding on Waller. Even if she has appeared in pretty much every other DC project in movies and TV in some form over the past 20 years.
I dunno, in the case of Arrow they had already created their own versions of Waller, Deadshot, etc whom were played by different actors and had already established back stories/personalities/MOs and thus did not fall in line with the planned movie versions. I think this might be a different scenario. If you got the actual movie actress and did not do anything to contradict the movies version of the character then I suspect the Warner suits would be all for it. Because then you are just essentially promoting their movie by potentially interesting more people into seeing it by interesting people in the character (of course a new movie trailer or special sneak peak scene could also be used to further push the branding during the episode.) For the same reason I actually suspect that the show may have even been allowed to have Cavill appear if they wanted to...you know if not for a pesky thing called a budget, and the fact that the show runners have stated they don't like characterization of his Superman in the movies and that he does not fit in with their vision of their world.
Taking this to the Cat Grant thread.I wondered if that was going to happen because Kara won't be her assistant anymore. Actually prior to now I think it was very hard for cat to let Kara know she knew she was Supergirl because she can't order Supergirl around. But now that she moved her out and gave her a position where she isn't ordering her about like a slave she could reveal she knows more easily. -
There's no way ABC takes the blame if this was Stana's decision to leave. Whether she made it clear during last negotiations, made scenes about it on set, behind closed doors, etc. ABC would throw her under the bus right quick to get the fans favor. Nope. ABC is sticking with budget cuts and the fan uproar which leads me to believe it was the networks decision. And Nathan's if those rumors are true
That was my first thought at first until I really thought about it. If ABC were to have thrown Katic under the bus then she would have surely fired back. She would have done interviews and revealed the real reason she left. If that was that Fillion was an ***hole then you've got a potential problem.
Networks are used to playing the role of the villain. They cancel beloved shows, let go of actors, and cut budgets all the time drawing the ire of fans. That does not usually stop people from watching shows on the network. Stars on the other hand are integral to specific shows. People will actually not watch shows over an actor they dislike starring in that show.
Nathan tries to come across as a nice guy in all his interviews. He's been a bankable star for the network. Currently all we have are anonymous source rumors about the show and the relationship of Fillion and Katic on the set and behind the scenes. A lot of people probably never even heard the majority of those rumors beside the casual mention of a feud between the two (with neither party being painted badly or more responsible) There is no way for the general public to substantiate any rumors and to know how much to believe and what is made up.
Stana speaking up could potentially change that. If she were to paint a vivid picture of him as an unlikable person that could potentially really hurt the show by turning people off on anything involving him. That's why it would have made the most sense for the network to tell Katic to keep quiet while they shoulder all the blame for a made-up financial reason. She gets to walk away without being hounded by media questions and having to revisit and unpleasant experience on the set time and time again instead being able to immediately focus on whatever her next career move is. While the network moves on to Castle season 9 and accepts the normal amount of irrelevant hate from fans.
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So like I said last week Kara uses her superior speed, flight, super breath, and heat vision to keep her sister at a distance while she comes up with a plan...what do you mean that isn't what happens? I mean surely to Rao she would not immediately try to engage her more skilled Kryptonite covered sword wielding cousin in close-quarters combat. *shakes head*. At least her eventual attempt to trap her cousin with the girder showed her trying to use her head a little, and provided a believable way for Alex to hit her sister with a strong blast of radiation setting up the killing blow.
Fortunately for Kara...J'onn apparently while bleeding to death flew all the way to pick-up Alex's mother and back and is mentally shielding her. Not only that but while shielding her he also managed to use his powers to scan the entire city for Alex/Kara. And even better he did all of this while also apparently masking himself from Indigo's presence somehow. (Remember last episode how she knew the moment he entered the city...don't worry the writers probably forgot about that too).
Originally I was proud of myself for fanwanking that the Kryptonite radiation interfered enough with the Myriad signal waves around Alex allowing her mother to be able to talk her down? I mean that seems at least plausible compared to her mother just being able to talk her down without needing any kind of special equipment to reach her? *sigh*
I feel another major rant coming on...
Sure the idea of fighting the mind control with Hope was incredibly cliche and Kara's speech made me roll my eyes until they made about 3 complete rotations in my head. But I had a whole week to prepare myself to accept all that and so I did...
Yet...remember when we were told the plan was to piggy back off the Myriad signal in order to reach people? You know the Myriad signal which is being beamed directly into people's brains. That sort of made sense. If you are beaming two different messages into peoples heads then maybe you could weaken/drown out one with the other. How the ***** did this become a television message instead? I mean for starters I would have sworn that most televisions come with an digital only tuner? So ummm...they would not be picking up her signal? For that matter how from an old abandoned TV station did they override every single DIGITAL channel in National City? And what about the people that were not near a TV? I mean sure Catco as a news place (supposedly) has TVs on everywhere...but what about all the other people at their workplaces. Most offices do not have a TV running in every room to distract their employees from doing their jobs. Oh that's right the "S" crest was also beamed to their phones (which Non's mind zombies would be checking why?) . Because all the people in Catco just snapped right out of their trances when they saw Kara's chest. That's not even accounting for the fact that just days ago Supergirl was declared a public menace. Sure she made an effort to save a small group of strangers from being crushed by a helicopter and they responded in kind...but is National City really such a giant hive mind (pre-Myriad) that every single person now views Supergirl as 100% beacon of hope that would be able to break through Myriad's programming? *bangs head against the wall*
After Myriad is shut down everyone is all happy and thinks its over. This is why I question as to how much news Catco bothers to investigate... I mean hello would the Krytonian dictator who was responsible for the mind control not potentially still be a major threat who was likely to do something drastic in retaliation? Also how was Catco not all over the wave of headaches post brain control?
Nice try show, but just because James claims Superman could not have saved Kelly does not make me believe it. I mean I would like to think he would have at least TRIED something. Okay done with this topic and I ranted about this last week and there is soooo much fresh stupidity to rail on this week.
Case in point...Kara mentions that the DEO is currently looking for Non and Indigo.
Waiiiiit a minute...are you actually telling me that Non/Indigo and Fort Roz (where they have clearly always been) are not even anywhere near National City? Wasn't Max's whole plan centered around dropping a Kryptonite bomb on them? And he had no clue at all where they were? So he was just going to bomb the middle of the city, kill Superman and possibly Kara along with a few hundred thousand people...and he had no idea where Non and the signal was actually being broadcast from?!?! SERIOUSLY SHOW! It's bad enough that Max came up with this completely terrible plan that was doomed to fail...but even President Carter (schedule permitting) apparently authorized this strike without knowing where Non actually was. SERIOUSLY. The only other alternative was that they were going to wait to verify the target...which then meant the casualty estimates and all that angst was a giant crock of BS. AAAAARGH. Do these writers work for the Kryptonians? Are they trying to make my brain explode from an aneurysm?
Apparently Superman is still unconscious for no apparent reason or reason that will ever bother to be explained...because shut up that's why. In all seriousness though I thought from a creative standpoint this was a potentially bold move to fix a major problem with the show. Non did something to Kal while he was under his control and thus Superman's absence never has to be addressed again as an issue on this show. A simple if inelegant fix to get Kara out from under her cousins shadow once and for all as well as maybe add some emotional fallout next season as the world deals with Superman no longer being around, and Kara deals with losing her last biological family member. Wrong again....Kara is never shown being even a tiny bit worried about her unconscious cousin in this episode for some reason. Also for some reason they decided to immediately wake him back-up so once again next season we will need to continue to ask why he is not around to deal with a major world threatening terror, or to ever help Kara deal with emotional trauma in person. Instead they will have to find yet another contrived way to put him out of action repeatedly or ignore the SuperElephant in the room
Hey remember that time that Alex was declared guilty of treason and sentenced to Cadmus....because the writers seemingly forgot that she was a fugitive too as there she is working at the DEO again without anyone batting an eye or any mentions of pardons.
Kara demonstrates that she has a power we never knew about...the power to make jewelry invisible? We can see Kara's neck in her costume. You really expect me to believe that she was actually wearing her mother's shiny silver necklace around her neck the whole time. Nope.
It also bear mentioning that having known the exact moment that all human life on the planet will die...Kara waits until there are under 10 minutes left on the countdown to face Non. Awesome...
Non's whole army is asleep....well that is absurdly convenient.
How come ripping Indigo in two kills her ? Shouldn't she be able to just dissolve into pixels and hop into someone's smartphone or a tablet with WiFi or a walkie-talkie ?Right? Remember what a big deal it was last time that she was like a living computer virus and not a person? Apparently no one on the show remembered that. I mean Kara and Max were lamenting how she would be all alone without back-up...when pretty sure between Winn and Max they probably could have whipped up something to help deal with Indigo in the four hours they had.
For that matter remember how it was just last episode J'onn whipped her into that shed which blew her up and yet seconds later she reassembled herself none the worse for wear because data can not be destroyed like that ? Ugh. So yes J'onn ripping her in half causing her to blow-up was dumb enough....but then she apparently somehow put herself back together in order to die? Soooo much stupid. For that matter...did Laura agree to guest star only if she never lost a fight to Melissa? Once again Supergirl played no part in defeating her...
Didn't the last time Kara used her heat vision for that long that powerful cause her to loose her powers? (Hint: The answer is yes. Jimmy even told her that Clark told him that is what happens when you drain your cells of that much solar energy. She clearly expelled as much energy if not more against Non as she did Red Tornado...)
Yet...Kara who showed tremendous strain lifting the likes of an airplane and skytram car earlier this season having seemingly just used most of her solar energy can suddenly lift a one million ton (per General Lane) prison colony into space.
The hits just keep on coming as Alex suddenly knows how to fly a Kryptonian vessel...which putting aside the absurdity of that out of nowhere development....how did she even get Kara inside the pod? I mean seriously. Alex dies if she opens the tiny escape pod. Also this pod was designed to hold one 13 year old girl...so how did Alex muchless also Kara fit inside? This is the cockpit...
Did we miss a scene showing that Kryptonian escape pods have giant robot hands that she used to pluck Kara from space and carry her back to Earth?
Kat gives Kara a promotion to do anything she wants...again there is no way she does not know her secret ID. Just a few weeks ago she felt the need to hire someone because Kara was not around enough to actually do her job properly. I am intrigued as to what Kara will choose to do? I mean surely reporter is just waaaay too obvious and cliche (although obviously it does offer the most story potential)? Advice columnist? (*shivers at the memories of Charmed*). Photographer is likely out. There is an opening for an Fashion columnist....but Kara hardly seems the one to fill that unless she lets her dark side out to play more. What else is there that offers story potential?[Q
Nice that Cat finally got "Kara" right . . . assuming "Kira" wasn't on purpose.Am I imagining things or we not already told by another character that it was done on purpose as a power/status thing? Not to mention that I believe Cat called her Kara when she was dating Adam.
My first guess is that it is Kara's father Zor-El is in the pod. I mean this whole season focused on her Mother/Aunt...so it only make sense especially with the Jeremiah story next season that Kara's biological father be involved to create conflict for her? I think we can rule out her mother? I mean if the reports are true that the actress essentially screwed them when she had to leave earlier than planned are true...then I do not see why they would consider going back there again so soon? Kandor just seems too soon after we just dealt with an army of Kryptonians (even if she never had to fight more than 1 at a time). OMG what if it's Streaky? How epic would that be... Her dad built an escape pod for himself or his wife and the cat jumped in and accidentally launched it.
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I'm fairly sure that even if the computer controlling the cells is destroyed, having thousands of humans physically and mentally at your disposal, you should be able to repair the main computer or come up with brute force ways to free the prisoners at the DEO,
Sure he probably could have tasked people to repair the console, but probably decided at the time that it was not worth it. He wanted to see what the humans brain power could accomplish so it would have been wasting resources by taking them away from solving the big problems. Especially after Kal-El fell easily under his control as he may not have been expecting that and thought taking on "Superman" would require a significant fight and thought having unfamiliar species might provide an edge?
Indigo was putting the notion of using Myriad to rule beyond Earth. Who knows what lifeforms are out there beyond Earth, or if Kryptonians in SGverse can breathe in space unassisted or what? Anyway, it could be conceivably useful to have various aliens at the ready in case some of the species prove to be Myriad-proof.Yes Indigo may have had plans to go universal, but presently Non is the one in control of things and he was initially strictly focused on Earth. Even now if he is thinking bigger he probably still wants to finish conquering/saving Earth before moving on to the next planet so there is not really a rush until the time comes that he is ready to move on.
It also could be just a vendetta against the DEO or an aversion to the notion of superior beings imprisoned by lesser beings, or other things.Keep in mind that the majority of the DEO prisoners are likely the prisoner from Fort Roz, ie beings that were imprisoned by the Kryptonians? While Non and his people were jailed for trying to save their planet through drastic means....that is not the case with many of the other Fort Roz prisoners who were drug runners, murderers, cannibals, etc. So I don't really see that he would be too fond of many of them beyond being a means to an end?
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Well she probably could not fly quite that fast while carrying someone as normal humans would not be durable enough to survive that but yeah she can still surely fly faster than their fall speed. I was also actually thinking that she could have smashed through a window after catching James/Winn tossed em inside leaving her hands free to catch Kelly and land her on the ground. Worst case scenario James/Winn walk out of the building again, but by then Kara should have her hands free to be able to catch them again without problem. Not really sure what the limit of her superbreath is either, was also thinking maybe she could have tried using that to try to slow Kelly's fall or buy her a little more time by blowing her back up...couldn't have hurt to try something as Kelly was guaranteed dead anyways with her doing absolutely nothing.She is fast enough to grab each of them individually, and put that individual person down to the ground and pick up the next one. She can fly at Mach 2, after all.It slipped my mind, but you're right. Kara knocked out Lucy and then left the DEO, right? So unless she tied everybody or stuck them all in cages, what's to stop them from waking up and opening the cages anyway?
I also keep coming back to the fact they have Kal under their control and are just leaving him wandering around the city, while hoping Alex in her powered suit will be enough to stop Kara.
Kara completely destroyed the main control panel, so I am assuming that is why the prisoners could not be released again? (Of course then I have no explanation for what she did with Maxima if she could not open a cage to put her in?) Really though I have no idea why Non would have actually wanted an army of rogue criminal aliens. I mean if his plan was just to conquer Earth then so far it seems Kal, Kara, and J'onn are the only heroes on this version. Non already has at least a dozen loyal Kryptonians and an Coluan to deal with them. So he really did not need them, and odds of them falling in line for an extended period of time seem kind of slim. I mean they are criminals after all...cannibals, psychics, etc. Why risk it?
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This one I know. Kara always calls her Ms. Grant but Supergirl has called her Cat.
Supergirl also always calls her Ms. Grant out of respect too. The one and only time she called her Cat was when she was under Red K's influence (at the start of the conversation where Supergirl tossed Cat off the balcony). Cat was surprised and even commented on the use of her first name.
"I wouldn't assume anything, Cat"
"Did you just call me Cat?"
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S04.E23: Schism
in Arrow
Yeah about those missiles detonating in space...I could be wrong but as far as I know that would also have not exactly have been without catastrophic effect. First of all ICBMs are not normally given enough power to be able to completely escape Earth's atmosphere...so the vast majority of these things likely had to be exploding in the upper atmosphere. Back in the 1960s when the US was conducting their tests detonating a couple nukes in space (trying to alter the Earth's magnetic field...because even the scientists were apparently really high back then), the resulting blast created an EMP wave that knocked out a couple satellites and a good bit of electronics in Hawaii. Oh and these tests are also attributed to possibly creating the greatest hole in the ozone layer. Now take these couple missile tests and multiply them by thousands and spread them all across the globe. Best case scenario no more functional satellites, more than half the planet goes back to the dark ages technology wise, its coated in nuclear radiation, and oh everyone is probably dead in a couple years as the ozone layer has been severely decimated allowing the sun to completely cook us in that time?
They mentioned it more than that. It was mentioned about Oliver feeling guilty about it, and Oliver mentioned the dead people before he killed DD as one of the reasons he was willing to kill him.