RainOnToosdays

I have no problem with anyone going to D.C.. The way I see it, CDB has been stumbling aimlessly around the same vicinity of Georgia for two years with no purpose or plan other than to keep being alive. As some of the characters have touched on, that's no way to live; even Carl is bored with such a pointless existence now. They can go because they actually believe; they can go because they simply want to believe; they can go because regardless of what they believe it's something to do, a purpose & a goal. They can go because there is no reason not to go - stumbling northwards should be just as easy as stumbling in circles. I like Gabriel. (I so want to call him Father Gabriel but would that be right? He's dressed like a Roman Catholic priest but are Episcopalian priests called Father? Are they even called priests?] His crack about stealing their squirrels had me LOL. Also when we first met him by the rock - I don't remember the exact dialog that led up to it but someone was questioning his faith or something - and Gabriel said (again, don't have the exact dialog so paraphrasing) "I asked God for help. And you came along and saved me." Good point, Father! He seems to have been passing time by copying the bible by hand. Did you notice Carol flipping backwards in his notebook to Genesis? I thought that was a nice touch what with Daryl talking to her about new beginnings. And Daryl taking time to eyeball the painting of The Last Supper. Ahh, someone about to die, someone about to be a traitor. Who may be who is open to interpretation. I still can't give a hoot about Tyrese. Don't know if it is the character or the way the actor is playing him but he is just tiring and uninteresting to me. Bob was just starting to grow on me a little bit. I am not sad that he is dead though. I think they strung his death out too long but I did love his maniacal "TAINTED MEAT!!" scene. Sasha is neither here nor there for me. The romantic relationship between Sasha and Bob did nothing for me. Neither did Tyrese & Karen. Both "relationships" seemed too quick, without enough time or backstory to make me feel anything between them or care. Must be genetics that both Sasha and brother Ty fall so quickly. I guess I'm a little slower on the uptake then most here because it never dawned on me that Rick & Co were planning on doubling back to the church. I was trying to decide who was going to be the hero - Carl? Father Gabriel? - but it was so dark I wasn't really even sure who all was still in the church. Rick showing up was totally unexpected for me. I hate that Glen & Maggie went with Abraham. Makes zero sense to me. I could live with the writers splitting up the group again so soon but that was, IMO, a ridiculous way to do it. I can't decide who Daryl might have with him but I don't think it is Carol or Beth. I sort of think he has a young person or young people plural with him (he's always had a soft spot for the kids because noone ever came looking for him when he was lost right?) but any more on that would better belong in the Speculation thread. I'm looking forward to Beth rejoining the group and finding out what happened to her and seeing what happens from here. I get that there is an awful lot of Beth-Haters out there and I even get why .. she has no point. But .... think back to other characters .. there were an awful lot of Carol-Haters too because she was seen as weak and useless and not contributing anything to the group's survival but look how far Carol has come .. the writers have made us stand up and take note of Carol and the tide has turned, the majority seems to be pro-Carol now. You could say the same of Carl and even Michonne. Give the show a chance to evolve the character and who knows, she may be our next fan favorite. I agree that the actress playing Beth does not seem to be on the same level as the other actors but it could be she hasn't been given any good scripts to really work with yet. I am more than willing to give Beth a chance because hey, back in Season 1 and 2, we all pretty much thought Carol was a useless abused housewife and Carl was just a stupid bratty kid ... That said, Beth could also end up as another Tyrese .. no matter what the writers do we just can't summon up a care for the character. And that reminds me ... There were no goodbyes between Glen/Maggie and Rick & Remaining Gang. No sad words, no hugs, no handshakes and see ya' soon/ be safe .... I didn't like that but hmm.... Thats' how Beth was isn't it? If I recall, she said she didn't do goodbyes, to her "boyfriend" at the prison before he went off and got himself killed. ETA: Forgot one thing ... The ad for next week with Beth .... isn't that how the whole series started? With Rick waking up alone in a deserted hospital? Freaky.

Well, I would think if you have someone below the boobs they are going to have much more leeway to twist and squirm and get momentum going by lunging forward from the waist to get away. Held as pictured there's little room for upper-body movement.

I am firmly in the camp that doesn't think Carol killed Karen & David, for all the same reasons already mentioned. I think Lizzie did it and Carol was covering for her, but she wasn't totally sure herself it was Lizzie until the events at the Grove. I think Carol's expressions when Lizzie was playing with the Walker and when she killed Mika - horror and confusion and sadness and regret all mixed up (McBride is awesome!) - were not just because of the current situations but because it cemented for her that yeah, Lizzie really did do Karen & David too. Coming to that realization, without any more doubts, is what made it easy (and I use that word very lightly) for her to kill Lizzie. She then falsely confessed to Tyrese because she is a caring person and she wanted to comfort him with the knowledge that Karen didn't suffer (even though a lie). I think at that point she was so distraught and without hope that she was OK with dying herself thus why she basically gave Tyrese permission to shoot her. But the big wuss once again failed to come through, and he didn't shoot her.

I'm one of those people. ;) I prefer to hang everything I possibly can. I just find it so much more efficient that way. I don't even have a lot of clothes but I like being able to open the closet and see everything at a glance and just grab whatever is saying "wear me!". I don't like rooting through dresser drawers or items stacked on a shelf. Doing so means you have to have an idea of what you want to wear first and I never do. And since everything can't be on the top, you have to keep taking things out and refolding to put back after you've found something you like underneath. Also doing laundry is much easier when you can simply put everything on hangers, don't have to neatly fold everything and decide what drawer to cram it back into. I'm lucky enough now to have a large closet all to myself (not actually a walk-in but it is big enough I can duck into it and change my shirt). I have everything on hangers except pants, which is one thing easier to fold then hang, and they are on the sole shelf inside the closet. I have one four-drawer dresser which holds my undergarments and jewelry. My husband has his own, smaller, closet and a dresser which same as mine, holds just undergarments, and bottom drawer for toiletries as there's no room in our tiny bathroom to store anything. I'm one of those people who like space just for the sake of space, I like things to feel open and uncluttered, so I would put the dressers in the closets if they fit. I think dressers are inefficient for clothes storage and the tops usually just become catch-alls for clutter. Also must add, not only is my closet and dresser not in the bedroom, they aren't even on the same floor as the bedroom. The perks of this arrangement far outweigh any inconvenience though. Which is why I don't get the HH's who can't fathom the idea of possibly, ya' know, using the closets in the guest bedroom. Is it that hard to go to another room?

Ahhh, thanks, that explains it then. I never knew (obviously) that they had been bitten first. I should figure out how to turn the CC on on my TV so I don't miss these bits of dialog.

I still don't think Carol killed Karen & David as it makes no sense the way she left the bodies but lets say she did definitely without any doubt did do it ... Why all the hate & disgust towards her for it when Michonne confessed to killing two innocent people as well yet noone is batting an eye about that? Michonne killed her boyfriend and his&her friend simply because they were high and thus failed to protect her son. It was a vengeance kill, for their passiveness, rather then a protective kill because they were threat, as in Carol's case. Carol's kills were for for the greater good, to protect her home & family. And her victims were dying anyway and the killing spared them more suffering. Michonne killed two healthy, able-bodied people and then let them turn into walkers which she then further degraded by chopping them up and chaining them up and using them as decoys. All for her own personal reasons, not for the greater good of anything. I like both characters but if we compare their murderous exploits, Michonne is clearly the more warped of the two.

Thanks, All! have edited original post to include all your new info. :)

Reading all the comments about watches in the No Sanctuary episode thread left me confused and curious. As LilySilver said, what does it mean? So I thought I'd start a thread to track the time pieces; their history, meaning, where they are turning up, who's giving them to who, etc. And to record new sightings of new or familiar time pieces. Because it does seem to be a "thing" on the show. Hmmm. Here's what we have so far. (I don't know how many times we're allowed to edit a post but I'll try to edit this one with corrected/new info as it is provided.) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Herschel's Pocket Watch: Owners 1) Herchel's Grandfather 2) Herschel [received as gift from Grandfather] 3) Glen [received as gift from Herschel] 4) Alex the Termite [stolen from Glen] ?) Current owner/whereabouts unknown but would seem Rick or Maggie has it since they were seen using the chain from it inside the boxcar at Terminus. Plot Points/Prominant Scenes: 1) Episode "Judge, Jury, Executioner" - Herschel gives it to Glen as a token of his approval. Herschel's watch came from the old country and had once belonged to his father too. When he gave it to Glen he told the story because handing watches down from father to son is a tradition, a "thang" signifying the reaching of adulthood, or in Glen's case, being accepted by Herschel as a son, as someone who connected him to his daughter. An intended one. Herschel included in the story that he had pawned it to pay for a night of drinking that he no longer remembered. His wife had bought it back. Those were the days! 2) Episode ??? - At the prison Glen brought it out when asking Herschel for his blessing to marry Maggie. 3) Episode "A" - Ric somehow spots it in Alex's pocket at Terminus and all hell breaks loose. 4) Episode "No Sanctuary" - Rick was using its chain to saw a dagger of wood away from the structure of the boxcar. He used the dagger to free himself in the slaughter room and stab one of the butchers. Just in the nick of time, I might add. After Rick was taken from the boxcar, Maggie was shown using the chain to saw off more wood pieces. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Rick's Wrist-Watch: Owners 1) Rick 2) Sam [received as a loan from Rick] *Sam was the hippy kid Rick and Carol encountered on a supply run. He later turned up in Terminus and was slaughtered. 3) Carol [took it off of the souvenir table in Terminus] 4) Rick [returned to him by Carol] Plot Points/Prominant Scenes: 1) Episode ??? - Rick tells Sam & Ana to meet him and Carol in two hours so gives Sam his watch to keep track of the time. 2) Episode "No Sanctuary" - Carol sees it on the table in Terminus and picks it up. 3) Episode "Strangers" - Carol returns the watch to Rick. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Carol's Wrist-Watch: Owners: 1) Ed 2) Carol [received as a gift from Ed] 3) Rick [received as a gift from Carol] ?) Current owner/whereabouts unknown Plot Points/Prominant Scenes: 1) Episode ??? - Carol gives it to Rick because Rick had given his to Sam. 2) Episode ??? - Rick places the watch on the nightstand next to the bed he rests on, in the house where we meet Joe's gang. He picks it up before diving under the bed to hide. 3) Episode "Strangers" - Rick tries to give it back to Carol but she doesn't want it. Assuming then that either Rick is still in possession of it or it is abandoned at the church. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Other Random Time Things in No Particular Order: 1) Episode "A" - Rick asks Herschel what time it is and Herschel responds its always right now 2) Episode ??? - The first watch discussion round the campfire ... followed many shots of Dale fussing with his watch. Someone asked Dale why he always was handling it and noting how meticulously he wound it every day, how silly it seemed in their days without time. Dale went into a long philosophical answer to the effect of "it signifies all that once was, now that we're in the walker world" (I got this pic of Dale's watch from doing an image search for it but I notice it doesn't seem to have a winding-knob so wondering if it's accurate?) 3) Episode ??? - There was a clock in Rick's hospital room that had stopped. Rick noticed it. 4) Episode ??? - The governor set a meeting time of noon for Rick to turn over Michonne. At the time I thought it was the first time anyone had actually set a time for anything. *** A pocket watch was featured in the opening credits for a season or two. *** Season 2's theme song had to have been Pink Floyd's Time. *** Throughout the series Herschel repeatedly stated that they were alternately running out of time, that this is the time, or that the test of time would prove.

Dr. Mark "McSteamy" Sloan (Eric Dane - Gray's Anatomy): because everyone else is getting their eye-candy in, and he's a Dr. Lucas McCain (Chuck Connors - The Rifleman): experienced military man, excellent shot, all-around decent guy, and more eye-candy in case I get tired of looking at McSteamy. Isis (Joanna Cameron - Isis): because she is the "dedicated foe of evil, defender of the weak, champion of truth and justice!" and also a teacher. Plus I loved her as a child so would be fun to hang out with her. Xena (Lucy Lawless - Xena): because of course. Lassie: because neither living nor dead could sneak up on me with a dog around and when that dog is Lassie, heck, she could get me out of any jam. ;)

Mother Superior and Fairy Godmother. (Hmm, That makes Fairy Godmother Superior.) Not once but twice now, when neither cast nor audience had any idea where she was at or if even still alive, she has miraculously appeared out of the blue to save the day. No explanation, nothing; some other character just turns around and poof! Carol has magically appeared. (Actually, she has disappeared and reappeared three times, the first being in the prison when Daryl found her an ep or two later. But that time when she reappeared she wasn't yet Magic Fairy Godmother Superior Commando Carol.)

Thankyou. I wasn't 100% sure but was pretty sure there was almost no time between Rick telling him and everything going to hell. He didn't have time to even process the news let alone decide what he wanted to do about it. If I recall correctly the only other person Rick told was Maggie. And I think Herschel, but he's dead so that doesn't matter now. Noone else knows what Rick did to her. And In watching the reruns this weekend, I noticed that when Carol first reunited with Tyrese and the girls and he asked her something like "where were you?" she did not rat Rick out, she simply said he went back to camp and she stayed to keep looking for things. I loved that.

I don't remember exactly when but they did show a close up of Alex' head on the table which showed a bullet wound in the forehead.

Though I'm still mad at AMC for making us wait eight months for a new episode - way too crazy long to make a fan base wait for a TV show to continue (not to mention risky) - I have to say that the premiere was quite satisfying. The opening scenes in the slaughter area - from being brought in there bound and gagged to the final moments over the trough - were so terrifying and gruesome I could only intermittently watch with one barely-open eye, just enough so I would know when it was over. I really hope this is not a harbinger of how brutal the series might become. All the Walker killing is just silliness; no matter how many new & grotesque ways they dream up to show Walkers being dispatched it's still watchable because we know Zombies aren't real and that even if they were, they are just mindless unfeeling things that can't feel fear or pain so who cares, we can just sit back and maybe even giggle a bit because we know how silly it is while we marvel at the job done by the makeup and special effects teams. Walkers killing humans is harder to watch because whether the humans are good guys or bad guys we know they feel terror and pain and it's a horrible way to go. But again, Walkers are just mindless things, there is no evil in whats happening, there is no boogie man behind it. Though the deaths are gruesome there is no human element behind them, no thought, no maliciousness, no evil. Humans killing other humans in horrible ways and for no apparent reason - that's were it gets unwatchable because now we're dealing with sentient beings perpetrating the horrors and that is F'ing scary! All of the comments I've read on the internet and heard in RL re the terrrible Termites focus on their cannabalism. Something they do to the victims after they are dead. Eating human flesh is a taboo most humans wouldn't even consider crossing but it was practical and the Termites were nothng if not practical. Yes, EWWWWWWW, but the victims are dead at that point, they aren't feeling anything. The unthinkable unforgivable horrifying terrifying aspect of the Termites is what they did to their victims while they were alive and how they killed them. The torture of making them watch what was going to happen and the sheer brutality of the method of death, without so much as a flicker of empathy or any human emotion at all really... that is the stuff nightmares are made of. I get that TPTB are trying to use THEN to show us that the Termites were also subject to extreme brutality by other inhuman humans, but ya know what? I don't care. I don't want to see it or hear about it. Showing us more gruesome brutality to excuse/explain the gruesome brutality they already showed us is too much. Rick & Co should have went back and killed every last one of them as Rick wanted. I really hope the show doesn't make us suffer through more flashbacky "THEN" scenes. Past that, I really enjoyed the premiere and look forward to a new season with everyone reunited, save poor Beth who thanks to the darn spoiliing ads AMC ran all weekend we already know is still alive somewhere. Commando Carol was great! Though I was a little distracted by how pretty her hair looked as she wreaked her havoc. It looked a bit orange, too, like she'd gotten into some of Sgt. Abraham's dye. Which reminds me, in watching the reruns during the weekend marathon I couldn't help but notice Daryl's hair in his scene with Rick outside the car the morning after their reunion. It was completely and rather unnaturally-looking black but he had an obvious grey patch in his beard! Cracked me up. And about the length of Daryl's hair and it always in his eyes and probably distracting to his aim so why doesn't he hack it off .... To me it fits his character traits. For someone who is closed-off & guarded and uncomfortable with feelings, hair is a wonderful thing to hide behind, both literally and psychologically. I don't think we'll see a short-haired Daryl until he's undergone total transformation mentally into being more sure of himself & more comfortable showing emotions. I melted with everyone else when he reunited with Carol, not just because of the embrace but because HE initiated it; our man Daryl who has so far been rather adverse to touching/being touched just went all-in. He may be getting that haircut soon afterall. ;) And I agree with those who said the head-nudge thing was rather cat-like. Apropos given Joe's talk re being indoor or outdoor cats. Tyrese. Sigh. I have not yet been able to muster up one iota of interest in his character. I don't really want him to die but I wish he could just sort of fade away into the background or somehow go the way of Chuck Cunningham. Rosita hasn't had any purpose or much screentime yet, I could take her or leave her, but Sgt. Abraham and Eugene I rather like. They're entertaining and add a bit of much-needed lightness to things. I'm undecided on what Eugene's story is but the fact that he still sports an 80's hairdo, is socially enept, and liked videogames, doesn't rule out the possibility that he was also a highly intelligent scientist. Just look at them boys on The Big Bang Theory. ;) Oh, one more thing. Is anyone else bothered by all the people left in the boxcars? We heard them screaming and calling for help so we know there was more than just that one bad dude they let out. With Terminus abandoned and overrun with Walkers those poor people are going to die a horrible death, locked up in those hot cars with no food or water. Ugh. I hope they can work in a scene sometime this season that lets us know they all got out somehow.

Re-watching the encore ep airing now. At the beginning, when Carol and Tyrese come up on the kid with the walkie-talkie, the kid is saying "... Alex didn't get but I get it .. the chic with the sword is a weapon with a weapon" or some such. Which makes it sound like Michonne killed Alex in the chaos before they were all herded into the boxcar. (Ric didn't kill him, he tossed him aside before he started shooting.) Edited to say - maybe he said "is a weapon without a weapon", implying since she was unarmed Alex let his guard down and she killed him bare-handed at some point? I don't know, don't have Tivo or whatnot to go back and rewatch to listen to the line again.