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Dean says he isn't ready to be the next bachelor. I liked what Dean had to say about his father's religion and tolerance. I could see him being the next bachelor. While I think Kenny had many of the right ingredients to be the next bachelor, his downfall could be his inability to pull back on the cursing when he's feeling emotional. They kept bleeping him last night when he was addressing Lee. While I doubt he'd have a reason to curse as the bachelor, I think it would be seen as a strike against him by ABC execs.

When white cashiers "behave badly" toward me, it's usually when they are rude to me. My husband will walk over and they'll say "Good morning, sir, I'll be with you shortly" and then always says "Oh, you're together?" in a an embarrassed tone. We've also experienced cashiers pretending to be busy when I'm waiting on a different line. When my husband walks over to me, they will say "I'll take you next, sir." This has happened many times. I've also walked over to my husband and had cashiers say "I'll be with you in a minute, please step aside" in a nasty tone, and they get really flustered when we say we're together. I've been asked to show ID when white white customers have not - though it's true that all customers are asked to show ID when buying alcohol at our local NYC Whole Foods. But you would know about my experiences better than me because you're an actual cashier, right?

Thanks for posting this video. My husband is white and we've embarrassed several white cashiers for doing similar stuff to us. Rude white cashiers become flustered when they realize they've behaved badly while another white person is watching. O/T but I hate the word uppity. It's usually followed by the "n" word when referring to Black people. It's also not surprising that Rachel's parents might be considered "snobby" and "uptight" by some since most Black people who aren't shuckin' and jivin' are considered "snobby" and "uptight". This is the world educated Black people have always lived in. I wear my perceived "snobbery" like a badge and I hope Rachel's family does, too.

This is very interesting. When my husband said it, he was very sure of his opinion, while I wasn't as sure about mine. I just didn't see Peter's lack of interest as strongly as others have. Good point. To me, and my husband, Rachel seems incredibly clingy with Peter. And her face seems to light up when he's just standing there. I also thought she said she could see herself with him in the first episode, or something like Peter was the kind of man she was looking for. With Bryan, I always feel as if she's enjoying his attention and accepting it because no one else is offering it to her with as much enthusiasm and confidence.

I thought the spoilers were that the final two were Bryan and Peter.

After watching the latest episode, both my husband and I thought it was very clear Rachel preferred Peter. We think it has been clear from the beginning that Rachel wanted Peter. I missed a chunk of the show because I refused to watch episodes with Lee after reading about his racist tweets from 2016, but every episode we've watched showed that Rachel wanted Peter more than anyone else. But she clearly wanted a proposal more than Peter, so Peter's inability to say he was falling for her, and couldn't guarantee a proposal, seemed like a deal breaker. This news that Bryan is nearly 100% her choice doesn't surprise me right now. For me, Peter could have said "I'm pretty sure I'll dump you in a few days if you choose me", and I still would have chosen him over Bryan after meeting Bryan's family. There were so many red flags during that visit, I ended the episode feeling super depressed that Rachel either didn't see them, or chose to ignore them, because she wanted to be engaged so badly. Even my husband, who is also a first-time viewer, was screaming at the TV "Run, Rachel!" during Bryan's hometown visit. Bryan's mother gave us "mother-in-law from hell" vibes. I was turned off when she said something about the importance of Bryan choosing a woman who can be part of their family. Rachel countered her with "I want Bryan to be part of my family, as well" [paraphrase], and his mother dismissed that and changed the subject. A woman who is more concerned with making sure her son remains close to her than his own happiness, well, she is not a woman I'd want as my child's grandmother. But I have to say what turned me off most was when Rachel expressed concern about his mother and Bryan brushed it off by saying the issues between his mother and his ex were really more on the "other party's side" than his mother's. It seemed cowardly and unchivalrous to me. I don't know how badly things ended with the ex, but a gentleman would just not talk about her rather than blame her for a disagreement she had with an obviously overbearing mother. Someone upthread wrote that Rachel should push for them to live in Dallas and I agree. My husband is solidly in the camp that Peter had zero interest in Rachel. I'm in a different camp. I thought he was being cautious. I thought there was interest, but he was beginning to realize he didn't enjoy the process. I kept the door open to be wrong since the earlier news that he had put in his yearbook that he wanted to be on The Bachelor (or something like that), made me wonder if he really was playing the game all this time to ensure he was chosen as the next Bachelor. So this news that he has met with ABC producers is slightly disappointing because it means he was possibly insincere through this process. It's one of the reasons I can't be a regular viewer of a show like this. I just keep wondering if the contestants are just trying to get to the final 3 so they have a shot at being the next lead.

Thank you! Of course editing makes it difficult to tell whether she's serious, but keeping in mind that his last girlfriend left him because of his mother... While I think Peter is not the right choice for Rachel, I think he could be the better choice over Bryan because no one needs in-law drama.

Omg! I missed that. Wow. If she chooses Bryan, she's crazy.

I started watching the show again after learning that Lee was sent home and I'm surprised that I no longer care if Peter is Rachel's final guy. These last two episodes, he didn't seem that interested in her. He strikes me as the type of guy who needs/wants to be 110% impressed by the woman he's dating, and even then he might dump her after learning she only flosses once a day, or something super picky like that. I'm disappointed Bryan is probably Rachel's final pick, even though I think he's attracted to her. His comment about his mother and ex-girlfriend was a major red flag for me. This last episode, I was really rooting for Matt and Adam. Matt, Adam and Kenny always struck me as the most genuinely interested in Rachel. Matt seemed to really want Rachel to visit his family and it made me wonder if he felt she'd see something new about him in his hometown surroundings that would make her choose him. I wondered if he felt she would love his family, or that his family would love her. He just wanted that hometown visit so much.

Thank you for responding to the original comment so I can now forget I ever read it.

I just read the news and I'm so disappointed! The show didn't have a fair shot. Even a show with great reviews would probably suffer if it took a week off after only 2 episodes aired. And by keeping it off air until July 8th, ABC is guaranteeing the show will lose more viewers. Yet Bachelor in Paradise has resumed filming and hasn't ben cancelled. SpoilerTV posted info about episode 5. I agree the show is moving slowly. I hope Heather Mitchell learns a lesson from this when she gets a new show. Does anyone know how many episodes were filmed? I'm hoping we get to see all of them, so we have some idea what they were planning to do with the story. Since the article I read at TVLine indicates the cast contracts expire next week, I guess there's no chance they'll even film episodes to finish out the season. I agree ABC wasn't the place for this. I loved Galavant - another diverse period piece - but ABC didn't know what to do with it. Edited to Add: Shonda had also created a show about the Gilded Age for ABC, but ABC did not go forward with it. I was very disappointed about that since I was looking forward to her version of the Gilded Age. There were plenty of wealthy Black Americans around during that period, but they're rarely mentioned, and I was sure Shonda would. At the time I thought ABC was squeamish about airing a Downton Abbey type show that featured Black people. But ABC's new head of programming is Black (Merrin Dungey's sister), so maybe it's advertisers who don't like seeing Black people in period dress.

The more I think about it, I think I'm okay with this twist, even though I don't fully buy Benvolio has such strong feelings for her. I don't really like love triangles because I start to lose respect for everyone involved the longer it goes on (I'm looking at you Scandal). I feel the person in the middle is being unfair by stringing two people along, and I feel the people waiting for the choice to be made are stupid for not moving on. So maybe Benvolio's "love interest" will make things a bit more even. I assume Benvolio and Rosaline will fall in love at some point, so I hope the fact that they have feelings for other people will make the who-falls-in-love-first aspect of the story more interesting. (I will be shocked if Benvolio and Rosaline don't fall in love by the end of the season.)

I enjoyed this episode. It set up a dynamic between Benvolio and Rosaline that makes me curious about their future. I agree that his "love" for the prostitute isn't 100% believable. It feels to me as if the writers couldn't think of another reason he would be so against marrying Rosaline. I think hate between the Montagues and Capulets, as well as the constant bullying from townspeople about their marriage, seems to be enough to me, but I guess I can see how it could become less believable after they've spent more time together. I also think Isabella is gay. and then I watched this episode and feel almost sure of it. Her line about not needing men and their sons was a big clue, I think.

The marketing behind it was amazing. So amazing, it beat out Saving Private Ryan for Best Picture. At the time, I thought that was shocking. (I'd have to watch both again to see if I still feel that way.) And though I really like Still Star Crossed a lot, I don't think it can be compared to Shakespeare in Love. People were in love with that movie before it was released because of the cast and Miramax. Whenever ShondaLand comes out with a new show, the critics are on it. Critics went after Shonda/How to Get Away With Murder without even realizing it wasn't Shonda's show. One journalist even said it was another Angry Black Woman show and she had to point out that it was actually a White man's show being produced by her company. (Still Star Crossed is Heather Mitchell's show - long time producer on Scandal.) I remember reading the article after seeing the movie and feeling so frustrated that I couldn't reverse the damage I was sure it did. I also listened to a podcast by two British film critics (Kermode and Mayo) who did address the issue. I think they had criticized Belle before seeing it for that reason, and then saw it and returned to interview the director and Tom Wilkinson. Sorry for the Off-Topic conversation.

Unfortunately, the media did the same to a movie called Belle a few years ago. It was a terrific movie, but The Guardian wrote a piece about it - before the writer had even seen the film - that, if I remember correctly, indicated the slave storyline was factually incorrect. I know a few people who decided not to see the movie because of that article until I told them the article mischaracterized the movie. I had wondered if this was happening to Still Star Crossed before it aired. So I should clarify that certain critics were going to hate this show no matter what once Romeo & Juliet were introduced because some people feel you just shouldn't toy with classics. The fact that the iconic couple is interracial here probably didn't help matters. In any case, for whatever reason, I feel the show got a raw deal. It has its flaws, but it isn't as horrible as some have made it out be. I've seen many comments about how much fun people are having with it.

Interesting. I read Romeo & Juliet in 9th grade, little over 30 years ago, and my husband read it in 11th grade. We both felt there was too much of their story. I agree the nature of the story makes it difficult to please Shakespeare scholars and Shakespeare novices, but I still personally think the media would have been less harsh on the show if there had been less focus on Romeo & Juliet before they died.

Thank you! I feel much better. I wasn't following basketball (and didn't even know it was on ABC), so I was worried SSC had to do re-edits, or something, for episode 3 and needed to be pushed for a week. It's bad luck for the show that it has to miss a week after only 2 episodes, but at least it isn't due to production issues.

I didn't realize there was a 2nd page to the thread when I posted my comment, otherwise I would have quoted you. Yes! I agree the pilot suffered from the focus on Romeo & Juliet. If they had only received 5 minutes at the beginning, Still Star Crossed would have been viewed and reviewed as its own show, not a Romeo & Juliet retelling, or whatever it's being called. One TVLine commenter mentioned she didn't like Escalus, Rosaline or Livia and I thought "Oh, you don't like the Black characters..." I agree that much of the dislike for this show has to do with the "blind casting". People make me sad. I just asked about this in the media thread. According to TVGuide.com, they are re-airing the pilot. I'm curious why.

I agree this is what happened and it sucks. The show isn't as bad as I thought it was going to be thanks to the media the show received before it aired. I still think dedicating the first 30 minutes of the pilot to Romeo and Juliet was a mistake because early viewers began to associate the actual play too closely with the show, not allowing the show to be its own creation. I've also noticed some people on social media don't realize it's an adaptation. I like Benvolio and Rosaline together and look forward to seeing where this goes. I really hope it isn't canceled, but the curse of everyone jumping on the "This show is terrible" bandwagon is making me nervous. Right now it seems cooler to hate this than admit it isn't as bad as they said it was.

Does anyone know why the third episode is airing June 19th instead of tomorrow night? I'd wondered if ABC was airing a special, but I see they're re-airing the pilot.

I agree with you. Except Josiah since I don't remember who he is. After reading about Lee being a racist pig, I removed the show from my DVR; not because I like Lee and feel disappointed, but because I deal with racism every single day of my life and I don't want to hear a bunch of men who have decided to find a wife on a TV show discuss it, or argue about it. Their thoughts are important, of course, but this is not the platform for it. But I caught bits and pieces of last night's episode because I couldn't help myself (including Lucas' and Blake's embarrassing exits, and Iggy telling Rachel about Eric, etc.) and I was thinking about the men who seem genuinely interested to me. Bryan has made it clear from Day One that he wants this. That's the only reason I'm a little hesitant to put him in the genuine category. I feel that no matter who the bachelorette was, he would have said and done the same exact things. But, he is clearly attracted to Rachel and interested. Fred is genuinely interested. So interested, I started to feel sad for him when they were on the Ellen Show and he realized some of the guys kissed Rachel. I believed him when he said he had crushed on her and was really into her. And I felt badly for him when he expressed frustration that she keeps bringing up that he was a bad kid. (I hope I have the right guy here. Please correct me if I'm wrong.) And I agree Kenny is genuine, too. The surprises for me are Alex and Jonathan. Alex's admission that he peed in the pool was a mistake, in my opinion, but he strikes me as someone who would bring Rachel home to meet his family and work hard to make her feel comfortable. And Jonathan's admission that he thinks about sleeping with Rachel seemed honest and goofy - no acting for the cameras there. Unfortunately, this news that Peter is not the winner has turned me off enough to decide I probably won't return for the last episodes of the show. If I liked Bryan, I would want to see their final episodes, but I don't. (ETA: I was reading the posts in the episode thread and it seems Bryan was good in this episode. Maybe my opinion of him would change if I watched longer. Maybe after Lee is booted...) I'd like to see their trip to Switzerland, but I'll just feel sad if Rachel and Peter have a terrific date there. I'll check back to see if the spoilers change again.

Again, I think you may be right. The national attention will hurt him. I see People magazine has picked up the story, as well as Fox. I assume the evening entertainment shows will cover it tomorrow. All I can hope is there isn't any serious racist drama in future episodes. My guess is that there is, and that's why the story was leaked now. But, my gosh, if I wanted to see a racist "country boy" screaming at Black men on TV, I'd turn to Fox or MSNBC or CNN. I don't need a reality show about shallow love connections to do it. Yes, exactly. It has taken the franchise 15 years to cast a Black lead...for reasons. I'm going to assume one of those reasons was a desire to avoid issues of race on a show that is meant to be mindless escapism. So why introduce a racist? Especially when the men, as you say, are unprepared for it. That is not entertaining at all. It also makes it clear that we have another candidate who isn't on the show for Rachel. Speaking for myself, as a Black American woman, I wasn't upset over the DeMario stunt. Like Rachel, I was more annoyed with producers for pulling it. I know the show needs drama to keep viewers watching, but I didn't think this stunt was compelling or natural. If the media continues to discuss this, I hope they address everything so he's exposed for being a generally horrible person. I thought his comment about America becoming an urban Vietnam and men using their second amendment rights was appalling.

I'm sure you're right. I was willing to stick around if it turned out the show runners were blindsided, but the DeMario stunt makes me agree that they probably knew who he was from the beginning. It reminds me of the fictional show UnReal, which was created by a former The Bachelor producer, I believe. In season 2, they had a Black American bachelor. One of the producers sees an opportunity for drama when the police pull the bachelor and his cousin over, and it goes awry. I stopped watching the show after that. It was ironic the show runners were trying to make a statement about the fictional producer's misstep because of her naiveté about race and managed to make their own real life misstep that displayed their own naiveté with their tone-deaf storyline about two Black men having a near-deadly run-in with police without following it up in the next episode. It was a weirdly stupid decision on the show's part. If the producers of The Bachelorette thought it'd be fun to cast a racist White man vying for the affections of a Black woman...well, maybe they've underestimated how much some of us are willing to deal with? They've certainly lost 3 new viewers. When I told my mother about it, she said she wouldn't be watching anymore. My husband bailed after the second episode, but I was pretty sure he would still watch with me. Not anymore. Oh well. I was thinking about only tuning in for the last couple of episodes to see who was in the final group, anyway. If I read Lee has been kicked off next week or the week after, I'll probably tune in again sooner.

I just signed in to post about this. The Huffington Post did an article, as well. He compares the NAACP to the KKK. He tells men to get a dog instead of a woman. He writes that he hates Islam. He makes a disparaging comment about the gay flag. He writes that America is becoming an "urban Vietnam" and they should practice their second amendment rights. The fact that this man is now a contestant on a show to date a Black woman turns me off so much. I'd like to know a bit more about their vetting process and hope this gets more attention.

Thanks for your entire post. It's hysterical. When Kenny started talking about his daughter the first time, I could see Rachel lose a bit of her smile. I think Kenny is attractive and he seems kind, but a single 31 year old woman as anxious to be married and start a family as Rachel is probably does not want a 10 year old daughter before you've even had a first date. Plus, Kenny's making it clear that his daughter comes first. Why would a young woman with several attractive men to choose from choose the man with a pre-teen who already has a personality, as well as her father's full attention? I felt sad for Kenny when he was talking about his daughter because he loves her and is proud, but I thought it was a mistake on his part.