Soap Operas

[WhitneyWhit]

I hope it's OK to start this. I know the current soaps as well as a lot of former daytime and prime time soaps have forums here, but I thought it would be interesting to have a catch all topic about the genre where we could discuss soaps in general.

One of the things I've always wondered is what is considered a successful daytime soap opera in terms of length. My mom and I were actually discussing these the other night when talking about some short lived soaps but then realizing some of them actually lasted quite a while when you compare them to prime time series such as Loving, which lasted 12 years and Ryan's Hope which lasted 14.

[tessaray]

An interesting question. I think back in the early days, there were so many more of them and they didn't last forever - though a lot of that was due to the transition from radio to television.  I'm not sure what the average was.  I have the following website in my RSS feed reader and am always kind of amazed at the soaps I never heard of.

https://www.welovesoaps.net/search/label/History 

It's funny but when I first skimmed the question I was thinking that you meant half hour vs. one hour vs. ninety minute format until I saw years. It's too bad that the half hour soaps mostly died out first. The genre might not be down to 4 daytime soaps if there were some half hour dramas other than B&B.   

[Collinwood]

Capitol didn't last very long, but they had a great cast.  I particularly enjoyed Carolyn Jones.  I have never understood why it or Santa Barbara didn't last longer.

[tessaray]

SB had a pretty great cast too. 

[tessaray]

I never watched CBS soaps until all my favorite NBC and ABC soaps had gone under or become unrecognizable **cough**GH**cough** so I'm not sure I agree with the rankings but it's an interesting list. I'd never heard of some of the shows.     

The 30 Best Daytime Soaps of All Time

[Joimiaroxeu]

Came over here per @tessaray's comments on the B&B forum.

So, why are daytime soaps dwindling? I still basically think it's two things: their storylines are too repetitive, and, they can't compete with reality TV which is now being delivered in multiple formats which include social media and streaming platforms. At this point I think the remaining soaps are mainly being kept alive by people who grew up watching them and people who've been loyal fans for decades. I doubt the remaining soaps are getting many new, younger viewers and think the daytime soap fanbase is largely aging away.

Also at this point I think there's an unspoken contest between ABC, CBS, and NBC to have the last soap standing. The networks will do the least they can to keep these programs alive to the bitter end.

[tessaray]

@Joimiaroxeu - I agree that soaps are way too repetitive.  And that the networks are just biding their time until their audience dies off, because if they wanted to keep it competitive they would do something to lure in new viewers.

I've always thought that one easy way to do it would be to air (or re-air) a soap in the after school/work - dinner time slot where they air sitcom reruns and game shows now.  I know I'd catch B&B on Pop on my tablet sometimes just for background while I was cooking, even though I had the episode on my dvr.  (Before Pop took it off.)   

[Anna Yolei]

On 5/1/2019 at 6:14 AM, Joimiaroxeu said:

At this point I think the remaining soaps are mainly being kept alive by people who grew up watching them and people who've been loyal fans for decades. I doubt the remaining soaps are getting many new, younger viewers and think the daytime soap fanbase is largely aging away.

I'm 33 and I'm near the extreme younger end of soap viewers. Most people my ages were into Passions or DOOL in high school, if they even got into soaps at all. On Tumblr (which is where most fandom activity in general resides), the only thing I see with any real traction re: soaps is the Teriah tag and the recent passing of KSJ, but mostly I see a lot of posts wondering how these shows (but mostly B&B since it's got a worldwide audience) have stuck around and why their parents were so crazy about them. 😞

Personally, I think a new show written by new, younger writers in tune with the issues that millenials and Gen Z kids care about would be the best route to revitalize the genre. You can keep some old tropes but give them some updated twists:

Long lost kid? The dad sold his seed or biomom donated her eggs for some college money, something that had gotten popular when I first went to college 15 years ago. 

Love triangles? Obviously those will go nowhere, but we can at least diversity that to include more LGBTQ people without keeping them so isolated from the rest of the cast. Y&R is somewhat decent about this in giving Mariah and Tessa their own lives that aren't entirely about one another, but you can be sure that neither will ever have another female love interest, which is sad. 

Diversity in general: yes, please! Instead of sticking you one Family of Color one one day a week as supporters of other stories, give them stories celebrating heritage. Despite how cheesy and rediculous the Brad Nazi Hunter story was, it gave us the story of him and Coollen reclaiming their Jewish heritage. We really, really need more of that on TV right now. 

And even beyond racial diversity, how about disability depiction? No more bipolar-as-plot-device as an excuse for the inexcusable, but more as a journey of self discovery. Think Rebecca from Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. 

Corporate intregue: very few have fantasies of the corporations like Jabot and Worldwide and Forrester Creations, but we could definitely follow people do start ups or small business or even a military retiree starting a new career for themselves. 

Pregnancies: let abortion be a viable and okay decision that villains and heroines alike decide on and not something that drives women into mental illness. Period. 

That's just off the top of my head. 

As for the formatting itself, I'd also be fine with three days a week like what the canceled ABC shows did when they went online. And definitely keep them to a half-hour. Especially if the show were on an online platform like Hulu, you can do a lot with a full 30 minutes without commercials. 

On 5/1/2019 at 9:29 AM, tessaray said:

I've always thought that one easy way to do it would be to air (or re-air) a soap in the after school/work - dinner time slot where they air sitcom reruns and game shows now.

That's a smart idea, too. With computer apps, I don't know that networks would even bother with that. CBS with their pushing of the All Access feature certainly wouldn't. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

Personally , I think a new show written by new, younger writers in tune with the issues that millenials and Gen Z kids care about would be the best route to revitalize the genre.

I don't know how young their writers are but aren't the CW shows covering this? Or trying to, anyway. The Dynasty reboot is a straight up soap opera and not a relatively good one. It would never survive as a daytime soap.

[Anna Yolei]

2 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I don't know how young their writers are but aren't the CW shows covering this? Or trying to, anyway. The Dynasty reboot is a straight up soap opera and not a relatively good one. It would never survive as a daytime soap.

I've only ever watched fifteen minutes of that show, so I wouldn't know. 

But the way daytime TV (or the Bell shows at least) with teen kids/ young adults being either way too invested in their parents' love lives with no hobbies in life like Steffy, Thomas and especially RJ or with the rather dated writing given to Reed and the Ashby twins of Y&R...that milkshake ain't bringing the boys to the yard either. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

I used Dynasty as an example since it's the only thing I watch on CW. It seems like their whole lineup is aimed at younger people and all their shows are serialized to an extent. But I don't think any of them have year-round seasons. That's where I think the daytime soaps lose younger viewers, not to mention the relatively conservative approaches the broadcast networks have to take with language, violence, and sexual situations. They can't compete with reality TV or cable/streaming/social media platforms.

[Dr.OO7]

On 5/1/2019 at 9:14 AM, Joimiaroxeu said:

So, why are daytime soaps dwindling? I still basically think it's two things: their storylines are too repetitive, and, they can't compete with reality TV which is now being delivered in multiple formats which include social media and streaming platforms. At this poi

Not only that, I find what cable is offering to be much more interesting and more quality.