S01.E17: Secrets & Lays

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

Grace romances an old flame (guest star David Sutcliffe) while in Vermont and tries to hide the fling from Will.

[Primetimer]

Grace plans a winter cabin getaway to distract Will from his ex-anniversary with his ex Michael, but ends up finds something to keep herself warm.

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[sinkwriter]

I think you're wrong about this episode. I mean, maybe not about the unhealthiness of Will and Grace's co-dependent friendship, but about the fact that you said it was worthless or a nothing episode.

I can remember really liking this episode when it first aired, and one of the reasons is because I think it showed something we had not really seen yet back then: that gay characters have long relationships just as straight characters do. Most times, shows used gay characters as punch lines and side kicks and pretty much treated them as sexless - as in no one producing TV seemed to want to demonstrate that gay characters actually have sex and have enduring, loving relationships. Instead they were used as victims, or silly/sassy joke generators, or the types to flirt wickedly with straight people, and maybe have one-night stands. But rarely were we shown gay characters in loving, lengthy relationships, or shown the result of the break-up of one.

So I thought this was a step in the right direction socially because it quietly and thoughtfully showed that Will had had this incredibly meaningful, lengthy relationship with Michael, and that it had meant something to him, and he - like anyone else would, gay or straight - mourned the loss of it. I felt it helped to nudge the audience forward just that little bit more, so that gay characters (and gay people in real life) could be seen with these kinds of eyes, that there is no difference. To cheesily borrow from Lin-Manuel Miranda, to teach people that "love is love is love is love...," or to borrow from Karen Walker, "Gay, straight, bi, Thai...," it doesn't matter. We all feel the sting when we have a big break-up; we all love and care about our partners. Which seems like a "duh" sort of lesson, but so many people never really think about what they don't personally experience, you know? And given the lack of respect or understanding for gay people back then (and still now in many ways), I thought it was a needed kernel to be planted.

And at the time, my own best friend was really struggling with trying to figure out whether he was gay or bi, and what that means, and what people would think that means... so I really appreciated this show showing him that it was okay, no matter what, and telling him, "Look, this guy Will is gay, and he had a boyfriend for 7 YEARS. You can have that too. It's okay. And the people who love you will want to see you attain that sort of happiness."

As we see in this episode, where it showed that his well-meaning friends (even Karen, LOL) were sensitive to that enough to be willing to do as Grace asked and go on this trip.

So I think you should give this episode more credit. That is all. :)

P.S. Campbell definitely looked mm-mm-good. (LOL)

P.S. For all the reasons I listed above, that is why I was pissed when the re-vamp of this show ruined and essentially re-wrote what Will's relationship with Michael had been. Such BULLSHIT. Okay, now I'm done talking. ;)

[VioletMarx]

On 5/10/2018 at 4:54 PM, sinkwriter said:

I think you're wrong about this episode. I mean, maybe not about the unhealthiness of Will and Grace's co-dependent friendship, but about the fact that you said it was worthless or a nothing episode.
 

Totally agree. It's a cute, funny episode. It has some good lines and character development.  It's a sitcom.

On the whole, I feel like Tara and (especially) Kevin kind of actively dislike W&G and I'm not sure why they're the ones doing a podcast about it. It's a silly sitcom that can veer into the absurd, but they try to rationalize it out every week like it's an episode of Dateline. Kind of takes all the joy out of it. JMO.

[Gothish520]

On 5/15/2018 at 3:59 PM, VioletMarx said:

Totally agree. It's a cute, funny episode. It has some good lines and character development.  It's a sitcom.

On the whole, I feel like Tara and (especially) Kevin kind of actively dislike W&G and I'm not sure why they're the ones doing a podcast about it. It's a silly sitcom that can veer into the absurd, but they try to rationalize it out every week like it's an episode of Dateline. Kind of takes all the joy out of it. JMO.

Yessssss