S07.E16: Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges

[John Potts]

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Bashir's trip to Romulus puts him at odds with both Romulan Intelligence and Starfleet's covert Section Thirty-one.

 

 

OK, I'm sure we're meant to see Bashir as being in the right, but I can't help thinking that he was hopelessly naïve and that I'd much prefer somebody like Admiral Ross was looking out for my interests (which I guess, as he's an Admiral and Bashir is just a Lieutenant - he is!). "You're spying on our allies!" - well, DUH! Not only was Sloan 100% correct that that was a temporary thing that could (and in the event of the Dominion's defeat, probably would) change and that maybe it's a good idea to find out who might be an enemy before they launch a surprise attack, but if he thinks spy agencies don't as a matter of course "keep an eye" on what their "friends" are up to, he's even more naïve than I imagined. You have to imagine Sloane's, "Let's make a deal, doctor - I'll spare you the 'ends justify the means' speech and you spare me the 'we must do what's right' speech," was him letting his exasperation at Bashir showing through. It's a shame Sloane never met Garak, because I'm sure the pair would get along famously (they might try to kill each other, but I don't think either would take it personally!).

I hadn't realised that Senator Cretak was meant to be the same character that we met in Image in the Sand - not only because she was recast, but because it's hard to see why she would be up for promotion having failed to get the missiles through to the Bajoran moon and worse, nearly provoked a conflagration with Starfleet in the process (and besides, anyone who got entangled in a Starfleet operation and was stupid enough to get caught probably shouldn't be promoted!). But I do have to wonder why (other than it might derail the plot) Bashir never went to see Admiral Ross following his "aneurysm" - he seems to be about to and then decides it's a better idea to talk the Cretak. It's an odd choice, not just because he has the perfect excuse as a Doctor to go see him, but also because at that point Bashir considered him an ally - you'd think he'd consult him before running to a potential enemy. Also, an aneurysm? You have to admire that 24th Century medicine that you could be expected to recover from that overnight (presumably it wasn't meant to be anywhere life threatening like the brain or heart).

[iMonrey]

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Also, an aneurysm? You have to admire that 24th Century medicine that you could be expected to recover from that overnight (presumably it wasn't meant to be anywhere life threatening like the brain or heart).

Yeah, I had a similar reaction to Sisko making a crack about leaving his teeth in a glass next to his bed like his grandfather in a later episode. Really? In the 24th century people still have to wear dentures when they get old?

I had trouble with this episode because I did not remember the introduction of "Section 31" in the previous season. To have everyone talking about it like it was a known thing made me think I'd missed something. I did remember "Inquisition" once I went back and looked it up but they didn't make enough of an issue out of it, IMO, for me to remember it. 

[readster]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Yeah, I had a similar reaction to Sisko making a crack about leaving his teeth in a glass next to his bed like his grandfather in a later episode. Really? In the 24th century people still have to wear dentures when they get old?

I had trouble with this episode because I did not remember the introduction of "Section 31" in the previous season. To have everyone talking about it like it was a known thing made me think I'd missed something. I did remember "Inquisition" once I went back and looked it up but they didn't make enough of an issue out of it, IMO, for me to remember it. 

The problem with Section 31 after they reached out to Bashire that it started becoming a known fact that it even existed in the first place. At least on Enterprise you got how it existed and why not many people knew who they were, but after this, as Sisko said: "People are shocked they even exist, but at the same time, there seem to be those who WANT it to exist." 

[Maverick]

 That was my biggest problem with Section 31.  Here is an organization that has existed in secret since before the birth of the Federation itself.  Presumably not even other intelligence agencies like the Obsidian Order even know about it, otherwise they would have publicly outed it to discredit the Federation and paint them as hypocrits.   But they spill everything to one man they're trying to recruit, who turns them down cold and immediately tell his superior, a Bajoran officer with direct ties to the leader of her government and a Founder who can information extracted from him by linking with one of his people.  If Section 31 were really this clumsy in their recruiting efforts, they would have been outed centuries ago.  These people should have had a psych profile on Bashir showing how idealistically loyal he is before even bothering to go to the station.  One no one would ever be inducted directly into an organization like Section 31.  They would have some sort of cover operation--like a fictitious classified operations division of Starfleet Intelligence--to test people's ability to keep a secret.  They'd be given assignments progressively more questionable to see how far they're willing to go to protect the Federation.  Only when they proved able to handle the methods of Section 31 over a period of time would they be let in on the whole thing.     Even if they did their recruiting through this ridiculous method, they would surely erase the subject's memory if they turned the offer, since we've seen such technology is readily available and Section 31 would have no moral qualms about using it.  

[readster]

On 8/28/2017 at 9:59 PM, Maverick said:

 That was my biggest problem with Section 31.  Here is an organization that has existed in secret since before the birth of the Federation itself.  Presumably not even other intelligence agencies like the Obsidian Order even know about it, otherwise they would have publicly outed it to discredit the Federation and paint them as hypocrits.   But they spill everything to one man they're trying to recruit, who turns them down cold and immediately tell his superior, a Bajoran officer with direct ties to the leader of her government and a Founder who can information extracted from him by linking with one of his people.  If Section 31 were really this clumsy in their recruiting efforts, they would have been outed centuries ago.  These people should have had a psych profile on Bashir showing how idealistically loyal he is before even bothering to go to the station.  One no one would ever be inducted directly into an organization like Section 31.  They would have some sort of cover operation--like a fictitious classified operations division of Starfleet Intelligence--to test people's ability to keep a secret.  They'd be given assignments progressively more questionable to see how far they're willing to go to protect the Federation.  Only when they proved able to handle the methods of Section 31 over a period of time would they be let in on the whole thing.     Even if they did their recruiting through this ridiculous method, they would surely erase the subject's memory if they turned the offer, since we've seen such technology is readily available and Section 31 would have no moral qualms about using it.  

How extremely true. Plus, you add in that they had no "real headquarters" since they had to keep moving. As Julian found out in Luthor's memories, they had pieces in high ends of various governments, but never had a main central HQ to keep from getting shut down. Yet, here they get outst by Julian and now, others are looking for them and when Luthor died, basically Section 31 died with him because everyone else was: "Oh gee, super bad ass is dead, now what do we do?"

[rmontro]

On 8/7/2017 at 6:25 AM, John Potts said:

OK, I'm sure we're meant to see Bashir as being in the right, but I can't help thinking that he was hopelessly naïve and that I'd much prefer somebody like Admiral Ross was looking out for my interests

Totally agree.  Between this episode and his idea in the previous episode that the Federation needed to surrender to the Dominion now to save lives, I sure wouldn't want Bashir running things.  But I guess this serves as the follow up to the Section 31 that we were promised to get.

This episode drew on a couple of past episodes, both Inquisition and The Quickening.

Now I see they begin a 10 part ending to DS9 with the next episode.  I'm pretty sure I've never seen these so I will watch with interest.