S08.E11: You Made a Choice to Be Good

[miss-vanilla]

1 hour ago, doram said:

Bonnie and Caroline had discussed the plan so it's fair to assume that they were both in agreement with the steps/details i.e. Damon taking the Cure after Bonenzo were dead. The only change Caroline made to the plan when she discussed it with Damon was to include Cade in it.

 

I don't care if Caroline agreed or not, it really has nothing to do with her, this conversation should have been had with Damon because he and Elena are the ones affected by this.  I wonder how Caroline would feel about the cure being used to kill Cade now that Stefan is the one carrying the cure?

Basically this whole storyline has been about putting a mirror up in front of each and everyone of them and showing them exactly who they are and given the right circumstances they are all intensely selfish. They are all hell bound according to Cade's entry requirements. The conflicts between the gang right now are rooted in the fact that they are all striving for their own happiness consequences and friendships be damned. Every single one of them.

[miss-vanilla]

3 minutes ago, doram said:

Bonnie doesn't need to "discuss" anything with Damon. He doesn't have any claim to the cure and she doesn't need his permission to take it. I still find it hard to buy this argument that she's being selfish because she isn't - once again - sacrificing her own chance of happiness to make Damon's more secure. If this was an either/or situation - if only Enzo or Damon could have the cure - then I can squint and see how, somehow, Bonnie claiming the Cure that she made possible in the first place, was an act of selfishness.

I completely disagree with this so i'm moving on.

[PinkRibbons]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Yes, I remember that made no sense to me at the time either. Vampires can turn off their humanity and stop feeling guilty. Humans can't turn off their humanity, so wouldn't a vampire who becomes human again carry all that guilt about the terrible things they did as a vampire?

I think the idea behind that one (though obviously they weren't clear about it because they never are) is that the vampire heightened emotions make the guilt a lot worse than it would be in a human. Plus it might be easier to live with something you've done once you can't possibly do it again. And lbr, once you're human it's probably fairly easy to put yourself into the mindset of "that was a different person entirely, because they were motivated by vampire issues". (That last bit would be helped by the fact that no uber-emotions would be breaking through the way Normal!Stefan can't seem to keep out the guilt of what he did as essentially a different person.)

Edited February 5, 2017 by PinkRibbons

[Aeryn13]

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To assume that the girls didn't sit down to have this conversation seems like a tremendous leap just to make Bonnie out to be selfish and/or deceitful in this.

I have no problem with Bonnie not being a perfect saint, she has given enough. So my intention is not to insult her here. But I think the opposite about the girls having a talk about it. With the way this show runs, my money is on not.  

[TigerLynx]

I didn't think Bonnie was going to give Enzo the cure without talking to Caroline, Damon, et al. about it.  I thought Bonnie was making sure first that Enzo definitely wanted to take it before bothering to go further.  That was the point of Enzo doing all the things he had ever wanted to do that day.  Bonnie wanted to make sure Enzo really wanted to be human again.  Then once again everything went FUBAR, and it became a moot point.

If they wanted me to believe vampires everywhere would be lining up to take the cure, they shouldn't have made being a vampire so easy and enjoyable in this universe.

I kept wanting Caroline to say to hell with everything, and go find Rick and her children.  When Caroline and Damon were discussing Cade, and moving onto Plan C, I was thinking, "Caroline look where you are.  When it's down to you and Damon Salvatore trying to fix things, it is time to get the hell out of Dodge."  I had the same thought about Bonnie and Enzo.  "Get as far away from Damon and Stefan as you can because if you don't, you will end up dead again."  Then Stefan ripped Enzo's heart out.

[DigitalCount]

Can I just say, I freaking loved this episode. It was pretty much TVD as I remember it--or want to remember it--with incredibly pretty people being forced to make bad or horrible decisions, trying to think their way through impossible odds against an old dead guy with an evil plot, and then getting kicked in the gut repeatedly.

Both Enzo's death and Bonnie's reawakening were pretty heavily foreshadowed, so no huge surprises there, but I was surprised that Bonnie cured Stefan. I was thinking she would fesmatos him while he was manhandling her, but it makes sense to have the situation be more dire and hopeless, so of course she couldn't get her powers back until after it would have helped immensely to have them.

I appreciate that they acknowledged Bonnie's existence being suffering on this show. And fwiw, I see Bonnie's plan for her and Enzo to enjoy being human together and then for Damon and Elena to have the same thing afterward as pretty fair. It's not like under normal circumstances Damon would be taking the cure before Elena woke up anyway, so...?

Interesting that Damon and Caroline are both vampires and Stefan and Elena are now humans. I'd never suggest that Damon and Caroline get back together, but I'm worried that Stefan and Elena might eventually. I can't see Bonnie surviving the series (because of course not), so Elena is going to be around in one form or another and soon. I think I just tend to pick the wrong characters to back, because the ones I like (Bonnie, Caroline, and grudgingly Enzo) always end up worse off.

[Aeryn13]

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If they wanted me to believe vampires everywhere would be lining up to take the cure, they shouldn't have made being a vampire so easy and enjoyable in this universe.

No kidding. Though I continue to be baffled how Lexi and Rose, two old vampires, appeared to be the only shmucks who never scored themselves a daylight ring. Enzo was captured basically five minutes after being turned and in captivity for 75? years and even he seemed to have a daylight ring immediately upon his escape.  Even Klaus was seen to make nice with witches here and there and he already had one. It seems super-easy for vampires. Especially since they are apparently all great in the sack with all that experience.   

[ByTor]

So now that Stefan was injected with Elena's blood, he has the cure, and now only his blood can be used as the cure?  Why?  Did I miss something?  There's no way that little tube of blood sucked all the cure out of Elena.  So if human Elena would have injured herself and bled unknown to the MF crew, the cure would have been gone?