Eastenders (BBC) - General Discussion

[Decider]

This summer on EastEnders.

 

I have to say that I am kind of disappointed with the apparent Stacey/Kush/Shabnam triangle but I'll reserve further commentary until we see how it all plays out.

[Wootini]

Oh my God, you are KILLING ME with that spoiler button. It's taking all of my willpower not to click it. One of the things I like about being a US fan of EastEnders is that I tend to naturally avoid casting and storyline spoilers. Makes watching the show much more enjoyable not knowing what's coming.

 

So I assume that Dean is the father of Linda's baby. Unless they're deliberately trying to mislead us by making it look like Mick is upset by those results. Of course, the whole time the nurse was talking about blood groups, I kept thinking that can't possibly work and they'd need to do a DNA test because Mick and Dean are brothers. And they're full brothers, right? Buster and Shirley are parents to both of them, yes? So they should have the same blood group, right? (I know nothing about biology, obvs)

[M. Darcy]

I know nothing about biology either but I would think that since they are full brothers they probably have the same blood type.  I wish they would just resolve this storyline because I just hate watching it. 

[Chip]

I wish they would just resolve this storyline because I just hate watching it. 

 

I think this so often about so many storylines...

[eejm]

Oh my God, you are KILLING ME with that spoiler button. It's taking all of my willpower not to click it. One of the things I like about being a US fan of EastEnders is that I tend to naturally avoid casting and storyline spoilers. Makes watching the show much more enjoyable not knowing what's coming.

 

So I assume that Dean is the father of Linda's baby. Unless they're deliberately trying to mislead us by making it look like Mick is upset by those results. Of course, the whole time the nurse was talking about blood groups, I kept thinking that can't possibly work and they'd need to do a DNA test because Mick and Dean are brothers. And they're full brothers, right? Buster and Shirley are parents to both of them, yes? So they should have the same blood group, right? (I know nothing about biology, obvs)

Dean and Mick won’t necessarily have the same blood type even as full brothers.  It’s certainly possible if they do, but it all depends on Shirley’s and Buster’s blood types as well.

 

A person can be one of four blood types: A, B, AB, or O. In addition, a person can be positive or negative for the Rhesus protein factor.  The Rhesus factor is what makes a person a positive or negative type – such as B positive. 

 

A, B, and AB are all dominant.  O is the recessive type.  This means that two parents who have A or B blood types can produce a child who is an O if both parents carry the recessive O gene.  AB does not carry the recessive O gene, because A and B are both dominant.  Parents who are both O type cannot produce a child of any other type.

 

Similarly, the absence of the Rhesus factor is also recessive.  Two parents who are Rhesus positive can have a Rhesus negative child, but two parents who are Rhesus negative cannot produce a positive child. 

 

So what does this mean for the Carters?  Well, in order for the paternity to be determined by blood type, Mick and Dean absolutely must be of different types (the same type would not exclude either as the father).  Linda must be of a different type than Dean, but can possibly have the same type as Mick as long as Dean’s type means he could not have possibly fathered the baby (Linda and Mick can both be AB positive as long as the baby is also AB and Dean is O).  Linda and Buster must either have different blood types, or they must both carry the recessive O gene to ensure Mick and Dean have different types (if both are O for example, both Dean and Mick will be O by default).  Dean must be a type that cannot possibly produce the baby’s type, either dominantly or recessively (If Linda is A, Mick is B, Dean is O, and the baby is AB, then Mick is definitely the father). 

 

In short, this method relies on a lot of exclusions and algebra.  The paternity could be easily determined by a DNA test, and they wouldn’t even need Dean’s DNA.  As there are only two possibilities for paternity, Mick can have his DNA tested.  That would either exclude him from paternity (meaning the baby would have to be Dean’s), or indicate that he is 99.99% the father (meaning Dean cannot be the father).  The only hang up there would be that paternity could not be tested solely by the sex chromosomes, which is sometimes done.  As Dean and Mick have the same father, they have the same Y chromosome, as does the baby. 

 

My guess on why Mick sunk to the floor when he looked at the results was because he was relieved at not being excluded as the baby’s father.  I have a hunch that somehow someone will know Dean’s blood type (Shirley, maybe?  Or Dean himself?) which will exclude Dean as the baby’s father.  That will kinda-sorta resolve the storyline - Mick will be the baby's father, Dean won't have any connection to the baby or hold over Linda, and everyone can start to move on.

Edited May 18, 2015 by eejm

[eejm]

Actually, scratch the bit about Linda and Dean having to have different type. Both could be the same blood type as long as both were Rhesus negative and Mick was Rhesus positive. If Dean and Linda are both A- while Mick and the baby are A+, then Mick would definitely be the father as two Rhesus negative parents can't produce a Rhesus positive child.

So yeah, complicated.

[Wootini]

That made my eyes glaze over and hurt my brain! :D

[Decider]

I haven't watched today's episode yet but I would bet everything I own that Mick is going to be the baby's father, mostly because

of the upcoming storyline where Shabnam reveals to Masood that she had a baby by Dean and Masood goes searching for his granddaughter.

[Wootini]

I have to admit that part of me was surprised at Dot's verdict, but the other part was like, "Well, okay, this way June Brown gets a little vacation and Dot can feel like she's atoning for her sin." So I guess it's a win/win in a way...

 

Also winning are the Carters. They can finally breathe without Dean up their asses all the time. Unfortunately now it appears that Shabnam has stepped right in it and now the poor Masood family are going to have to deal with Dean's obsessive tendencies. Ugh.

[M. Darcy]

That was my first thought also - June is getting a vacation!

[eejm]

Glad the writers did some research and make the whole blood type thing make sense.  Dean having type AB and Mick having O is indeed possible if Shirley and Buster are an A (with a recessive O) and a B (with a recessive O).  I feared that Mick would be celebrating Dean being an A or a B which wouldn't have excluded Dean as the father.

 

The idea that nomadic, flaky Shirley has kept Dean's medical records after all these years is a little tougher to believe, but I'll let that slide.  :D

[Decider]

eejm, I recall reading a mention somewhere that Dean's medical records could have been in some old papers of Kevin's that Shirley had Bianca clear out of Pat's attic a while back.

Edited May 19, 2015 by Decider

[eejm]

eejm, I recall reading a mention somewhere that Dean's medical records could have been in some old papers of Kevin's that Shirley had Bianca clear out of Pat's attic a while back.

 

Ah, that makes more sense.  I'm surprised Shirley didn't make a reference to that when she went to find them. 

 

Jeez, can Dean get any creepier?  He lets himself into the Masood's kitchen and tells Shabnam she needs to lock the door?  Clearly Dean has some ultimate boundary issues.  No wonder Shabnam was eyeing the kitchen knife.  I still have the feeling that it will come out that Dean actually raped Shabnam, which is how we'll get closure to Linda's story.

[Wootini]

That would be a bit of a stretch. She's only been acting twitchy about the baby, not any kind of sexual assault. But yeah, that whole kitchen scene was super-creepy. I also appreciate the way that Shirley and Buster are starting to twig to the fact that Dean ain't right in the head. I expect that because Shabs is a terrible liar and already screwed up her story, he's going to keep pressing until he finds out where the baby is, and then he's going to go and try to kidnap it and that'll finally be what gets him in jail and off the show. (At least, I hope!)

[eejm]

That would be a bit of a stretch. She's only been acting twitchy about the baby, not any kind of sexual assault. But yeah, that whole kitchen scene was super-creepy. I also appreciate the way that Shirley and Buster are starting to twig to the fact that Dean ain't right in the head. I expect that because Shabs is a terrible liar and already screwed up her story, he's going to keep pressing until he finds out where the baby is, and then he's going to go and try to kidnap it and that'll finally be what gets him in jail and off the show. (At least, I hope!)

 

Possibly, and Shabnam hasn't said anything about the night in the club being non-consensual.  But, given that Shabnam was very naive and also going against her religion by drinking back then, I could see her internalizing all of that shame if Dean had actually raped her, which is why she isn't recognizing it now.  She also subtly flinched at the table in the cafe when Dean tried to touch her hand.  It's just a hunch on my part, but I could see it happening.

[M. Darcy]

I also think it was rape.  And, its going to be the same storyline as Linda - with Dean acting like he's the victim in all of this.  Sigh. 

[eejm]

I also think it was rape.  And, its going to be the same storyline as Linda - with Dean acting like he's the victim in all of this.  Sigh. 

 

If Dean did rape Shabnam, I wonder if the situation paralleled that of what happened with Linda.  When he raped Linda, Dean had just been abandoned by Shirley, Lauren had dumped him, he was drinking a lot, Linda was attempting to comfort him, and he completely ignored her when she told him to stop.  We know he was drinking the night he met up with Shabnam, and he'd recently been released from prison.  Kevin had also died not long before that.  I wonder if Shabnam was trying to comfort Dean then only to have him ignore her when she told him to stop? 

 

I could also find it very believeable if Shabnam was comfortable making out with Dean but refused to go further, only for him to force himself on her.

Edited May 20, 2015 by eejm

[Wootini]

Well of COURSE Alfie has a brain tumor. Gotta say, when they won the lottery, this was the last thing I would've expected to ruin their potential happiness! :D But it's just so incredibly ridiculous that Alfie doesn't want to spoil Kat's dreams by telling her he might be dying. Seriously? I hate when people on soaps keep terminal illnesses from their loved ones. I hope when Kat finds out that she rips him a new one. Unless he's actually dying at the time, in which case, sympathy might be called for.

 

Also, am I the only one who wouldn't mind if Kush told Shabs to go do one and went for Stacy instead? Shabnam is SUCH a chore, and I actually thought he and Stacy were kind of cute together.

[TimWil]

I don't understand the animosity against Richard Blackwood on EE message boards. I think he's doing pretty well and is perfectly watchable. I don't see Vincent as a long term character, though.

[Wootini]

I don't know if I'm in the minority on this, but I'm actually kind of happy to take a break from Kat and Alfie. It can all get to be a bit much, you know?

 

But I guess I'm in the minority on Vincent, because I find Richard Blackwood fantastically charming and smarmy in the role. I think he's doing a great job. Plus, it's giving Donna more to do, which is always a plus in my book.

 

However, I would like the writers to PLEASE establish exactly what the hell Tam and Nancy's relationship is. Because it was SUPER awkward of her to still be hanging around the house with the Masoods once the baby news broke and there was all that drama. I totally would've shot Tam a look and just ducked out the back as quietly as possible. :D At least when she joined them to meet Kush's mom for dinner she asked if she was supposed to be there. I wouldn't think it was weird if we ever saw Tamwar and Nancy spending any time with each other aside from this. Then it would make sense he would want to invite her to family functions. 

[M. Darcy]

Why would anyone dislike Richard/Vincent? I'm enjoying his scenes.

I won't miss Alfie or Kat either. Mostly because I hate Alfie. Yet another time he is not telling Kat the truth. He's ignoring the fact he probably has a brain tumor. And if he gets sick in Spain? Kat will be alone with a sick husband and young kids.

[Wootini]

To be fair, this is completely in character for Alfie. 

Unfortunately. :P

[M. Darcy]

That is true. Plus I honestly don't think he is really sick - I don't see them killing off Alfie.

I wonder where the Nun disappeared to - maybe she ran into Kat's missing kid.

And boo to the show - why didn't we get to see Mo's wedding?

[Wootini]

I know, right? Is this the first time we've even SEEN Fat Elvis? Because in all the time I've been watching it I've only ever heard him mentioned. I don't remember him actually showing up at any point. :D

 

Although I got the impression that they were just engaged. So maybe we WILL get that wedding! 

 

And I would believe that Alfie is sick, but either the mass will be benign or they'll operate and have all the drama and then he'll be okay. I don't think they'd kill him. But they'll make him suffer, that's for sure!

[eejm]

I like Vincent.  I'd really like to know how he knows Phil.  Was it through Ronnie?  I got the impression that they knew him separately. 

 

Speaking of Vincent and Ronnie, I'm confused on exactly what happened between the two of them.  Ronnie maintains nothing happened, but during the Lucy death flashback episode, she kissed him when he gave her the gun.  And it was not a "thanks, you're an awesome friend" kiss, it was a passionate kiss.  I'd also like to know what Vincent saw in Kim.  Kim's actually improved as a character in my opinion, but I just don't see the two of them as a couple at all. 

 

I loved Kush's mom.  What a kook.  I don't think I'd want her as a regular character, but she'll be fun if she stays recurring.  She's a bit like Pam. 

 

I'm glad the Masoods are back in the limelight, despite the fact that Masood himself is going down the wrong path in trying to find Shabnam's daughter.  Actually, I'm a little surprised he took the news so well - I figured he'd hold more of a grudge. 

[Decider]

Wootini, that was indeed the first time we have ever seen Fat Elvis on the show.

[Wootini]

YAY!

He needs more screentime! (At least enough so we can find out why they call him Fat Elvis. The "fat" part I get, but he didn't look much like Elvis to me...) :D

[TimWil]

I don't think Carmel is a kook like Pam. I don't think she's who she seems to be at all. I think she'll turn out to be scary as s**t evil! Bonnie Langford really impressed me in tonight's episode.

[Wootini]

Can I just say that I don't give a monkey's about Ronnie and Charlie? (I do love that expression!) Their relationship seemed to happen off-camera, and they never had one iota of chemistry. I felt like they only got married because Ronnie got knocked up with his baby. And then out of nowhere Charlie sleeps with Roxy, and it turns out Ronnie might have had a little something with Vincent? WHO CARES? Ugh. Charlie is such a boring character and he's dragging the Mitchell sisters down with him.

 

That said, those scenes with Liam and Roxy were GOLD! Hilarious! :D

[Wootini]

Okay, not for nothing, but Ben and Paul's snog was HOTTT! :D

 

Also, that beaming smile on Ben's face afterwards was so delightful that I would like to hope that actually having sex with Paul will finally make Ben not act like a miserable little $#!t all the time. ;)

 

Poor Sharon. When will she learn? Clearly not anytime soon, since just hours after Phil forges her signature and steals The Albert away from her he claims to have found her biological father. Please. Sharon used to be able to see through his BS. What happened to her? Did the extensions cause brain damage? Sigh.

[eejm]

My first impressions of Paul are good.  There's a playfulness to him that is very appealing.  His scenes with Ben and Pam were sweet.  I even liked his budding friendship with Lola, and she normally annoys me.

 

I get the idea that it was not Pam's part in Laurie's death that chased Paul off.  Paul noticed Les and Claudette yesterday, but they were just walking and talking.  Pam and Les have known Claudette for a long time (something Paul would likely know), so the fact that they were talking shouldn't be that big of a deal - unless Paul knew that Les and Claudette had been carrying on an affair for sometime.  That would explain Paul keeping his distance and his cold attitude toward Les. 

 

Yeah, Sharon.  That's your biological father.  And I have some swampland to sell you in Arizona.

[M. Darcy]

Phil is just the worst.  Stealing Sharon's bar from her.  And, yeah, why is she believing him about her Dad.  He just happened to have the address.  Rolls eyes. 

Edited June 2, 2015 by M. Darcy

[TimWil]

Maybe Phil's claim that it was Richie Scott who'd dredged it up might have made the difference?

[Decider]

That man is not Sharon's father.  Phil being able to just produce him out of thin air is just way too convenient.  One of Ritchie's clients, maybe?

[Wootini]

Okay, I got really worried about Sharon, but this redeemed her a whole bunch. Going to Vincent and basically bypassing Phil was a strong move. (And as much as this was a super-convenient twist, I don't really mind it because it involves Vincent with even more people on the canvas, which can't be a bad thing) And just as I was worried about her buying this guy's story about being her dad (he wasn't terribly convincing) the twist at the end made me breathe a sigh of relief. I'm sure it'll backfire right in her face, but at least she's not as gullible as she's been seeming. Phew!

 

Speaking of gullible, Abi is an idiot. She clearly knows that Ben is lying to her about Paul, but is so desperate that she's convicing herself everything is okay. I can't wait for Ben to start sneaking around having sex with Paul and for Abi to go full-on Fatal Attraction nutballs over it! That's going to be awesome!

[Wootini]

Oh my God, I spent that entire episode wanting to slap Cindy into next week just so I wouldn't have to listen to her screech anymore. Someone hand me a jewelry box...

 

Seriously, though, I think everyone would be more than willing to look the other way if Bobby wanted to take out another sister...

[eejm]

Cindy clearly needs some kind of professional help.  This is *not* a normal reaction, even for someone in a tough position like she is.  She had Beth because she wanted something to call her own after feeling unwanted her whole life.  Obviously having a baby is tough on someone so young, but I get the feeling that Cindy isn't going to feel okay no matter what she does.  If she gives Beth to another family, she'll feel like she's abandoned the one thing that was "hers."  If she lets Ian and Jane adopt Beth, Cindy will constantly be reminded that she couldn't hack it as a mother as well as feel like the Beales wanted Beth more than her.  If Cindy keeps Beth, it's back to being overwhelmed with parenting. 

 

This is why I think this story will end with Ian and Jane adopting both Cindy and Beth.  Cindy's extreme behavior seems to stem from her feeling unwanted and without anyone to truly call "her" family.  Being adopted herself might not make everything all right, but I think it would give her some desperately needed security and the feeling that she's loved. 

[Wootini]

Perhaps.

But I still think I'd rather give Bobby another jewelry box. ;)

[TimWil]

OK, on another board there's an argument as to whether Lucy's murder was an accident or not. I say it was. I do think Bobby knew that his attack ended up with his sister dead, though.

I know this is a long shot but could there be a twist that Kathy is really dead and these meetings have been hallucinations in Phil's messed up mind?

Edited June 7, 2015 by TimWil

[Decider]

I know this is a long shot but could there be a twist that Kathy is really dead and these meetings have been hallucinations in Phil's messed up mind?

 

I am going with the theory that Kathy's husband Gavin is Sharon's biological father and that his connection to Sharon is that he was somehow involved with The Firm back in the days when Den Watts was hooked up with them, which would explain how Sharon came to be adopted by Den and Angie.

 

Ian and Jane are absolutely despicable people in the way they have treated Cindy.  I wanted to slap the both of theim more than once when Terry was getting ready to leave with Beth.  Whatever Cindy's reasons for not wanting to raise Beth, they are hers.  Ian and Jane have no blood connections to Beth and aren't even Cindy's legal guardians so this idea that their desires trump the intention of the birth mother just seems wrong to me.  At least Beth is out of their clutches now and in a good home with Bianca and Terry (and TJ, to a certain extent).

[Wootini]

The whole situation was just awful. Cindy was acting horrible, Jane and Ian weren't acting much better. And then there's Bobby lurking around the edges wondering if he's gonna have to take a jewelry box to someone else.

 

That said, if Ian was just going to throw Cindy out of the house, why didn't he do it BEFORE they gave up Beth? The whole thing would've been so much simpler if he'd just tossed Cindy out on her screeching little butt as soon as she started moaning at the top of her lungs about how no one listens to her. ;)

[M. Darcy]

I'm on Cindy's side in this one. They never seemed to listen to her issues about this or seem to pay attention or care when she said that she was upset.   She said at the beginning that it was going to be difficult for her to be in the same home with Beth and no one seemed to care.  And, nice, Ian. Throwing a teenager out of the house.

 

And, would you want your child raised by Ian and Jane?  Look how Lucy turned out, Bobby is a killer and they threw a teenage girl out of her home after Ian tells her she means nothing to him. 

[Wootini]

Oh yeah, Cindy was in the right on this one and Jane and Ian were in the wrong. She has every right to do what she wants with her child. 

 

HOWEVER, maybe people would have been more inclined to listen to Cindy if she wasn't such a screechy harpy about everything. ;)

[M. Darcy]

Well, she is 16. That's how teenagers communicate.

[Decider]

Ian has never been inclined to listen to Cindy, anyway, even if she had been reasonable about the whole situation.  She's always been a reminder to him of her mother and all of his failures where Cindy Sr. was concerned and Jane only cares that she'll spill the beans about Bobby.  Adopting Beth was all about getting a baby for Jane and appeasing the little Damien they have living in their house (Bobby).

 

So sad that Dot was not able to go to Nick's funeral.  

 

I am completely over this whole Ronnie-Charlie-Roxy foolishness.

[M. Darcy]

My question as if Nick actually ever had a funeral was finally answered. 

 

I think the only solution so the Ronnie/Charlie/Roxy triangle is for Charlie to date me.

[TimWil]

Isn't Charlie on his fifth accent by now? It keeps shifting.

[Wootini]

Really? I hadn't noticed. I don't really listen to him anymore. :P

 

I really resent this show for making me feel sorry for Ronnie. I mean, she's a pretty awful person and they're trying to make her sympathetic by having Charlie and Roxy being all close and stuff. Boo hoo. God, I can't stand this storyline.

 

Also, Masood really needs to calm his tits. I know he's all about family and stuff, but Shabnam made her decision, and he should respect it. Also, when he was asking Tam "Why would she tell Dean that their baby is dead?" I REALLY wanted Tam to respond: "Um, because Dean is a complete and total psycho and you don't want to have any connection to him whatsoever?"

 

Paul desperately needs a haircut, not a job at that place. He's cute and has a nice body, but I can't take that puffy hair. He has to wear a headband! Would you want him cutting your hair? Also, Lola, you can't really complain that Dean fired you since you LITERALLY JUST WALKED OFF THE JOB WITHOUT EVEN TELLING ANYONE YOU WERE GOING.

 

I'm also glad we had a break from Cindy. My eardrums thank you, producers. ;)

[eejm]

Also, Lola, you can't really complain that Dean fired you since you LITERALLY JUST WALKED OFF THE JOB WITHOUT EVEN TELLING ANYONE YOU WERE GOING.

 

It wasn't as though she had an emergency either - she was in The Albert drinking cocktails?  (Sorry, Phil - a Mitchell Emergency is not the same as an actual emergency.)  She also took two extended breaks from the job without really telling anyone when she'd be back either.  I can't believe she was stunned to be told she couldn't come back.

 

That said, what kind of training does it take to become a hair stylist in the UK?  It differs from state to state in the US, but generally students take classes as well as log in a certain number of hours on the job before they have a license.  Neither Paul nor Lola seem to have had any training, yet Dean chose between the two of them as trainee stylists.  Is this part of the Magic of Television , or is the process for becoming a stylist radically different in the UK than the US?

 

I'm glad Sharon seems to be getting her mojo back.  I've really enjoyed her over the past couple of weeks.  This makes me think Phil is actually a succubus disguised as a middle aged, constipated-looking bald man.  He sucked all of the life and campiness out of her, turning her into a major doormat.  As soon he finally told her the wrong lie (or too many of them), it's as though she instantly regrew her backbone.  (If Phil is a succubus, perhaps Sharon is a starfish for her regeneration powers?)

[jaytee1812]

There's basically two ways to be a stylist in the UK. You can get an apprenticeship and go to college one day a week I think for three, possibly four years. Or you can go to college I think for two years.

So if they're trainee stylists that would be realistic. Although I doubt they'll show them going to college.