S02.E10: The Food of the Future

[cooksdelight]

A high-end, chef-driven restaurant for the 1 percent; a quick-service restaurant that serves snacks, desserts and drinks to the masses. Season finale.

[cooksdelight]

I with the guys had stuck to their guns about doing only sweets. Joe and Tim insisted on savory foods and they were a bomb. Did they admit "Hey, we gave you bad advice".... NO. I can see this being a very successful franchice with kids flocking to the place to watch all the smoke and tricks. We no longer have the ice cream man coming through the neighborhoods, these guys could be that. And as someone noted, not one kid was playing with his phone or tablet. They were all interested in what was going on in the restaurant.

[jcbrown]

I wish they had stuck with their dessert concept, too. This episode was unusual in that I did not hate either pair of chefs so Tim and Joe could not pick the ones I hated.

[ae2]

The savory food was never going to work. They should have ignored Joe & Tim on that. These guys were the first likable ones we've had in awhile.

 

Once you come on this show there is sort of a catch-22. Take the advice Joe & Tim give you and get criticized for 'not knowing what you want', don't take it and you get lambasted for not listening.

 

If these guys opened this up as a dessert shop in the middle of a family tourist area - Niagara Falls, Virginia Beach boardwalk, Coney Island - they could double their prices and make bank. 

[anonymiss]

Joe & Tim were smacking their lips over the spicy soba noodles but they didn't let Antonia taste that. Would have been easier to bolster the seasoning on their Asian menu than doing a desperation one from scratch.

 

I definitely agree I'd love if they could expand this show and somehow do both pitches and have more than Tim & Joe as the restaurant sharks. It's good now but it's clear they really are using their own money and they don't have a lot to go around.

Edited March 20, 2015 by anonymiss

[cooksdelight]

It would make for a good show if once they pick a team, they bring in an investor from that team's home city. That way, if Tim or Joe didn't want to invest in a place way out in the middle of the country, the guest judge had the option. They know ahead of time where the teams come from, they could have investors standing by to fly to L.A. once they pick the team.

I also agree that having a redemption show or series of shows is a great idea. Bring back people who didn't get picked to find out how they'd do.

I'd also like to see a follow-up show to see if any of these people got anything off the ground.

[Ronin7]

Why can't Tim and Joe just recognize what are the good things about what some of the contestants already have and then just let them expand on that.  Not everything has to be a full scale restaurant to make money.  I think the chefs would have been even more successful if they were given a chance to show off even more of the stuff they were already good at instead of wasting a lot of time and effort going in a direction that wasn't right for them. Imagine if they had shown off the floating truffle.

 

This is another example of how the myopic views that both Tim and Joe have are starting to hinder the development of the show.  Again, I think they should perhaps either expand the show to include more potential investors at one time or switch investors around.  Otherwise all we'll end up with are awkward concepts that only get investment if they can contort themselves into Tim and Joe's view of what is successful.  Of course, they must also do it in a way that doesn't seem too obvious, because Joe hates "Yes Men" and for that reason....I'm OUT!

[Bella]

There was a rather surprising (to me, at least) article in the Washington Post recently about how chefs don't like having desserts on the menu but feel they have to, and how desserts aren't moneymakers. I would have thought the opposite, but the data prove this point, and I don't argue with a preponderance of data.

 

So, independent of this show, I was thinking about where this trend might be going. Are there going to be dessert restaurants that are essentially expanded ice cream shops/bakeries? Some already exist, but will this be a growth area?

 

Then I saw this episode, which DH and I discussed at length last night over an expensive but shared dessert. He had read the same article but hadn't watched the show. Two things struck me: first, this team's dessert concept could be ahead of its time, which is risky, but inherent in risk is a reward. I think Tim might have seen both sides of that at the negotiating table, which is why he invested but at a relatively low amount. The second thing that struck me was that this concept could be expanded, though - if it even survives - that could be in the future after these guys open several of the dessert sites successfully. And the place I'd do the expansion to start would be with a bar. So how do you reconcile the kid-friendliness of the dessert place with a bar? I had a bunch of ideas, essentially involving being a catering side or pop-up restaurant for a while. But molecular gastronomy and cocktails seem like a natural match to me.

 

I'm way over-thinking this.

[Ronin7]

Yeah, I read something similar to that on how some restaurants don't really prefer selling desserts.  But I think it had to do more with the amount of time that people linger over their desserts versus the amount of time people take to just eat their starters an entrees.  Essentially, restauranteurs just want you to eat and go so that they could turn the table over and seat another party.  The logic goes that appetizers, entrees & drinks which are the main portion of the bill will take 45min to an hour to consume whereas dessert/coffee which probably only amounts to another 15 to 20% will take up almost the same amount of time or even longer.

 

I thought The Inventing Room guys should have just walked away from the deal.  He really did seem too desperate to get a deal done.  I think this was the first time a contestant actually put in more money than the investor.  50K investment from Tim?  Woohoo! So what? He's the barbecue guy, what does he know about desserts?  I don't really see what benefits they could derive from his participation.  In my opinion, not really a satisfying ending.  

 

Here's a thought: maybe at the end of each episode they could have either Tim or Joe give a brief explanation to the audience why some ideas might not work. Explain the risk/rewards, market trends and industry practices.  This way we might understand a little more.  At this point, we only get a little bit of the thinking.  Just because they don't invest it doesn't necessarily mean that it's a bad idea.  It might just be that they aren't interested and or it's not the deal for them.

 

Since the show is starting to get a bit repetitive in its fake manufactured drama, my thinking is that if it's not entertaining at least it can be educational.

[Bella]

I like that idea for the show, Ronin. I'd like to see more depth, and the "restaurant wars" portion is highly repetitive. (Anyone who's read my posts in other foodie forums might recall that I don't like restaurant wars, however, so I'm admitting my bias here.) Cut that and explain the money side of it more. After all, this is CNBC, not Bravo or the Food Network, and there's an assumption of information-sharing across the entire network.

 

The article is coming back to me - you're right about the lingering issue. My understanding is that all but the highest- and lowest-end restaurants assume a 90 minute stay at a table, which is about right for me and DH. But I've noticed that 1/3 of that is spent on the dessert, which is invariably shared. So they get maybe $6-8 for 30 minutes of our time. That's not good economics.

 

Also, I think there was an issue with the space taken by pastry chefs. I have less sympathy for that, however. Kitchens are packed tightly to begin with. If a restaurant can't spare ~8 square feet (I'm guessing) and some oven time for a pastry chef, they're doing something wrong. And if they need the space for seating, the margins are too tight and that's more indication that they're doing something wrong.

 

As for Joe checking out because he found the one guy to be a "yes man," that annoyed me at first. But if you're going to throw money at someone, it helps if you like them and think they're being honest, so I've come around on that. Joe might feel that toadies can't be trusted, and I'd agree. 

[cooksdelight]

Desserts are usually done in the morning before the lunch and dinner crew arrives. At least, around here in some of our better restaurants, that's what happens. So there is not an issue of the pastry chef being in the way or whatever. Plus, cake and pie has a longer shelf life as they are stored in a cooler and will be fresh for a couple of days. Sorbets with fruit, same thing. But the way this show is structured, everyone has to be there in a 2-hour window, which isn't realistic in my book.

[Ronin7]

It might seem that I pick on Joe a lot, but that's really only because I quite like him. I've read his book and been to a few of his places so I have respect for his experience and knowledge.  What I have a problem with is the way he seems to come off when he speaks to these people.  For the most part I honestly feel that the contestants "for lack of a better term" are quite decent folks who true or not are pinning their hopes on getting an investment from either of these guys.  

 

I have no problem with Joe being straight forward with these people about what he sees and thinks.  Even if he didn't invest, he would be helping them if he could explain in a straight forward manner what the issues are.  There really is no need to try to pose as the fake tough guy that doesn't take BS.  It's not like these people are here to scam him out of his money or something.  If he doesn't like the idea then tell the contestants why and then don't invest.  Just don't be a jerk about it.  His manner will not win him any fans as I believe that most people end up rooting for most of the contestants at the end***

 

***Exceptions being: The Lone Wolf, The Couple with the Blue Tree and the Brother & Sister still living with their parents.  Those people really did need to get their balloons popped! ha ha ha 

[cooksdelight]

That blue tree will stand out for me as the biggest waste of money. Ever.

[Bella]

Desserts are usually done in the morning before the lunch and dinner crew arrives. At least, around here in some of our better restaurants, that's what happens. So there is not an issue of the pastry chef being in the way or whatever. Plus, cake and pie has a longer shelf life as they are stored in a cooler and will be fresh for a couple of days. Sorbets with fruit, same thing. But the way this show is structured, everyone has to be there in a 2-hour window, which isn't realistic in my book.

 

The article said otherwise, and I've been at several open-kitchen restaurants where there's an active dessert chef - sometimes very active. At Volt, which is higher end than I believe the article meant but is still interesting, the pastry chef had her own little alcove out of the way of everyone else, but we could still see her. At times she was moving around like the wind, she was so busy. And even if it's assembly or heating of elements that are already prepared, that takes space and time, which is what the head chefs were complaining about.

[cooksdelight]

And that's the difference between a small town's restaurants and larger ones in bigger cities. :)

[Wings]

Just watched this.  Too sweet, too small a menu for even just the deserts.  I saw all of this coming, it was easy.