Burn Notice - General Discussion

[MissL]

5 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

I never did either. Fiona always seemed way more into Michael while he never seemed interested in her.  Also, Fiona always seemed like she didn't really know Michael or understand him. Which is odd given however long the dated in the past you'd think she'd realize at some point he wasn't violent, blowing stuff up guy she seemed to think he was like. In that one episode where they pretend to be car thieves to go after guy who assaulted their client's sister Fiona says something about how this cover ID reminds her of the guy Michael pretended to be when they met and she wonders if that was who she fell in love with. You really would think this would be the light bulb on the relationship. That Fiona never actually fell in love with Michael. But his cover ID. It makes sense but it never comes up with again. For supposedly in love with Fiona he never makes the effort when their dating he forgets to make dinner reservations and doesn't take her out on dates. I have no idea why they are together. The way they play it out. It really seems like they would have been going in the used to date and end up as friends. 

Yes! I've watched more episodes since I posted and I think what really bothers me is how much she has to push and push to get him to make forward moves in their relationship. She blackmails him by endangering her own life just to get a key to his place. I think we were supposed to see it as necessary for her to do because he was so repressed and afraid of commitment and that he wouldn't agree to it if he didn't really want it but it just came off as he just wasn't that into her.  He never really seemed to make the effort and she chased constantly. It really seemed like a male fantasy of a relationship with a beautiful woman with her doing all the work. Was it all male writers? 

whew I feel a little better that I'm not all alone in this! 

[andromeda331]

11 hours ago, MissL said:

Yes! I've watched more episodes since I posted and I think what really bothers me is how much she has to push and push to get him to make forward moves in their relationship. She blackmails him by endangering her own life just to get a key to his place. I think we were supposed to see it as necessary for her to do because he was so repressed and afraid of commitment and that he wouldn't agree to it if he didn't really want it but it just came off as he just wasn't that into her.  He never really seemed to make the effort and she chased constantly. It really seemed like a male fantasy of a relationship with a beautiful woman with her doing all the work. Was it all male writers? 

whew I feel a little better that I'm not all alone in this! 

Your definitely not alone in that. I didn't like that Fiona was always the one chasing Michael and trying to push him into a relationship, then push him when they were in the relationship. The key thing was odd because he was complaining about her breaking in and it seemed like they were going to be working together for awhile. All the first season Fiona's chasing him, she gets him to take her to dinner in the pilot but its in exchanged for her dealing with the FBI outside. She tricks him into finding out why he left when they had to keep talking while they looked for the bug in his place. To get him to talk about whether she's a friend or something else she has to wait until after he deals with Bly.  But doesn't have anything to say later when they do talk its just so obvious he doesn't want to be in a relationship and yet for some reason Fiona doesn't give up. She doesn't see it. In the first episode of season two when they break up. Michael doesn't act or give any sign that he just broke up with someone he loves after Fiona says her stuff he just says that was what he had been trying to say before. That's what he says to someone he's suppose to be in love with? There's just never any sign that he is. No emotion, nothing. I really thought at that point they would drop the romance and they'd end up as friends. Fiona came to Miami tried to restart their relationship and it didn't work out, but stays and they become friends. I really wish they had. We have so many scenes of her trying and pushing Michael and so many of him really not caring or interested in doing anything with Fiona outside a job or friendship. I hated how much she had to push and keep pushing and really wasn't getting anything or much in returned. They should have gone with Fiona the same way they went with Sam, giving her boyfriends, relationships and we didn't always have to meet the guy she was seeing, like we never saw Miss Reynolds or barely saw Veronica.

[FormerMod-a1]

I agree with all you've all said.  I lived Fiona, as a character, in general.  Loved her, in fact, and her love of guns and explosives.  I also like Michael , as a character, in general.  I hated them together, especially early on.  Part of it was the relationship was so one sided, and that she kept pushing and pushing.  I was like "let it go!" "take the hint!" "why are you wasting this much energy on it?".  But, she couldn't hear me. 😛  Later on, once they were solidly together, it was fine.  I didn't love it, but it didn't seem to interfere with my enjoyment as much.  Maybe because all the pushing and endless talking about it subsided, too.

[andromeda331]

8 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I agree with all you've all said.  I lived Fiona, as a character, in general.  Loved her, in fact, and her love of guns and explosives.  I also like Michael , as a character, in general.  I hated them together, especially early on.  Part of it was the relationship was so one sided, and that she kept pushing and pushing.  I was like "let it go!" "take the hint!" "why are you wasting this much energy on it?".  But, she couldn't hear me. 😛  Later on, once they were solidly together, it was fine.  I didn't love it, but it didn't seem to interfere with my enjoyment as much.  Maybe because all the pushing and endless talking about it subsided, too.

I kept asking those questions too. I love both characters. They were really great. I think about Michael's different advice often. But didn't like the relationship and it really didn't make either of them look good. Fiona kept pushing it and never taking a hint and Michael kept not caring or showing any interested then when they did date seemed to never understand that meant actually dating. Going out to dinner and on dates.  They had no chemistry. Another odd move was the show trying to make a big deal out of Fiona's and Jesse's kiss when it was to keep the mark from being suspicious when they followed him to his money manager and they had even less chemistry then Michael and Fiona.

The show was so much better when it focus on the clients. It was just so much fun watching them figure out how to target the mark and destroy them. All three played their parts so well. Jesse too when he was added onto the show. I loved seeing Maddie getting involved and helping out. I love Michael teaching his client's son David how to fight his bully and getting to see David beat him up at the end of the episode. Or when Michael's trying to take down the guy for Detective Paxton and ends up coming clean to Tommy after Tommy cut them out of a job that would have gotten Michael, Fi and Sam killed. The different techniques like reverse interrogation.  

Edited May 4, 2019 by andromeda331

[andromeda331]

I love the voiceovers. They were so good and so many were so funny. Like in season two in Burn and Turn when he realizes he's being watched and races back into Nefzi's shop and makes the remark about can't breath you might be having a panic attack or that someone is pumping nitrogen gas into the room.

I like when he points out stuff like why sending an attractive woman to distract is a bad idea because everyone wants to hang around and instead send an annoying person.

Or in the second episode (technically third) when he steals the identity of the guy who was scamming retirees. He doesn't just give back money to everyone he scammed. He uses it to contact known terrorists on unsecured lines, threaten federal judges and insult the local drug cartel. Quentin's going to get beaten up so much in jail.

[Kiddvideo]

Started a rewatch over the weekend. I'd forgotten about some of the characters I loved like Barry, Bly, Larry, and Brennan. Clients of the week are so much better than the burn story! I need to figure out when to stop watching, though. I'm not clear on the sequence of events any more, but I remember not liking the show very much after Michael went back to work for the government, and I was really unhappy about Nate's death. (I never watched the finale, so Maddie is still alive in my Burn Notice universe.)

[andromeda331]

4 hours ago, Kiddvideo said:

Started a rewatch over the weekend. I'd forgotten about some of the characters I loved like Barry, Bly, Larry, and Brennan. Clients of the week are so much better than the burn story! I need to figure out when to stop watching, though. I'm not clear on the sequence of events any more, but I remember not liking the show very much after Michael went back to work for the government, and I was really unhappy about Nate's death. (I never watched the finale, so Maddie is still alive in my Burn Notice universe.)

I usually stop when Anson shows up. There are a couple episodes after he goes back to working for the government that aren't too bad. But once Anson shows up I hate him and everything that follows. He's yet but another shadowy person who shows up and knows everything, scary and pulling all the strings. Then oh wait there's someone else. I really don't care. By that point I was sick of that part of the story. I really thought when Michael went back to his old job he'd end up deciding he liked helping people in Miami and being able to work with Sam, Fiona and Jesse. Jesse went back to his old job and ended up quitting realizing that but Michael's story just veered off. The cases of the week were always my favorite part. Seeing what they were going to do to fix each problem. From the crazy theft to the cool international dude, to a drunk guy who sobers up and becomes the scary religious fanatic with a gun. They were so much fun and so funny. 

[Raja]

On 4/13/2020 at 6:01 AM, Kiddvideo said:

Started a rewatch over the weekend. I'd forgotten about some of the characters I loved like Barry, Bly, Larry, and Brennan. Clients of the week are so much better than the burn story! I need to figure out when to stop watching, though. I'm not clear on the sequence of events any more, but I remember not liking the show very much after Michael went back to work for the government, and I was really unhappy about Nate's death. (I never watched the finale, so Maddie is still alive in my Burn Notice universe.)

That is about the point where I start reading the episode descriptions looking for MacGyver meets the a-Team story and skipping the CIA master arc stories. However to me  Maddie's sacrifice for her family was the dramatic cap of the story

[Kiddvideo]

I saw “The Fall of Sam Axe” in my Prime recommendations. I’d heard of it before but never seen it. What a great movie! I really enjoyed how it showed he could be counted on to do the right thing even if it weren’t for Michael or an old Navy buddy. Nice companion piece for the show, but stands on its own as well.

[andromeda331]

19 hours ago, Kiddvideo said:

I saw “The Fall of Sam Axe” in my Prime recommendations. I’d heard of it before but never seen it. What a great movie! I really enjoyed how it showed he could be counted on to do the right thing even if it weren’t for Michael or an old Navy buddy. Nice companion piece for the show, but stands on its own as well.

I love that movie. Sam was great in it.

[Hava]

I just binged Burn Notice, and I am now obsessed. What a fantastic show. I wonder why they haven't had any follow-up movies like Monk or Psych. 

While there were a few episodes I enjoyed in the final season and while I appreciated the show's ambition in going for a darker and more serialized final season, on the whole, I don't think it was successful. For one thing, the pacing was off for the story they were trying to tell--Michael's turn and then sudden reversal were too rushed to be believable. 

For another thing, this season ruined Fiona's character. I know that Fiona is not too popular of a character, but since she was one of my favorites in the first 5 seasons, the writing for her in the final season was really disappointing. Her actions made absolutely no sense. Why was she angry with Michael--he didn't choose to work with the CIA again, he had to do it as part of a deal to keep everyone out of prison? How the heck did she move on so quickly from Michael--you're telling me that the woman who was willing to die by Michael's side in the season 4 finale is now able to fall in love and move in with somebody else after only 9 months? Even if she was able to inexplicably move on, why was she acting like an unsympathetic asshole to Michael, who it was clear to anyone was really struggling with this mission and needed support?

 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Hava

[Hava]

On 5/4/2019 at 1:02 AM, andromeda331 said:

In the first episode of season two when they break up. Michael doesn't act or give any sign that he just broke up with someone he loves after Fiona says her stuff he just says that was what he had been trying to say before. That's what he says to someone he's suppose to be in love with? There's just never any sign that he is. No emotion, nothing.

To be fair, in that episode where Fiona breaks it off, Michael has a voiceover where he basically states that he misses her scent when she leaves the room. And when they hook up in season 2 (after Michael thinks she may have died in the fire), he's the one who wants something more and Fiona is giving him the cold shoulder.

Although I was a huge fan of Michael and Fiona, I will agree that Michael was a terrible boyfriend. I kept waiting for Fiona to break up with him in season 5 when it became clear that he wouldn't put the work in to spend quality time with her outside of jobs and life/death situations. But she just kept sticking around.

Also, season 7 pretty much wrecked their relationship and the final episode couldn't really salvage it. 

Edited December 27, 2023 by Hava

[andromeda331]

6 hours ago, Hava said:

I just binged Burn Notice, and I am now obsessed. What a fantastic show. I wonder why they haven't had any follow-up movies like Monk or Psych. 

While there were a few episodes I enjoyed in the final season and while I enjoyed the show's ambition in going for a darker and more serialized final season, on the whole, I don't think it was successful. For one thing, the pacing was off for the story they were trying to tell--Michael's turn and then sudden reversal were too rushed to be believable. 

I don't think it was either. I didn't like Michael shot one of his friends for the new group. Michael always tried to avoid killing anyone and while he was sad he still did it. The powerful mystery group made no sense. I really don't like them killing off Madeline or faking Michael and Fiona's deaths.

Quote

For another thing, this season ruined Fiona's character. I know that Fiona is not too popular of a character, but since she was one of my favorites in the first 5 seasons, the writing for her in the final season was really disappointing. Her actions made absolutely no sense. Why was she angry with Michael--he didn't choose to work with the CIA again, he had to do it as part of a deal to keep everyone out of prison? How the heck did she move on so quickly from Michael--you're telling me that the woman who was willing to die by Michael's side in the season 4 finale is now able to fall in love and move in with somebody else after only 9 months? Even if she was able to inexplicably move on, why was she acting like an unsympathetic asshole to Michael, who it was clear to anyone was really struggling with this mission and needed support?

I agree. You don't go from willing to die with someone to angry and ready to move on so quickly. I don't know why she was so mad. It was to save the rest of them from going to jail. She's the same person who was always mad at everyone else for using Michael. 

[Hava]

6 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

I agree. You don't go from willing to die with someone to angry and ready to move on so quickly. I don't know why she was so mad. It was to save the rest of them from going to jail.

I would love to interview the writers to ask them what the hell they were thinking in the writing of Fiona in season 7. It makes absolutely no sense, and I've tried really hard to make sense of it!

[andromeda331]

21 hours ago, Hava said:

I would love to interview the writers to ask them what the hell they were thinking in the writing of Fiona in season 7. It makes absolutely no sense, and I've tried really hard to make sense of it!

So would I. I don't know what they were doing with her. 

[Hava]

It seems to be unpopular among fans, but I loved season 5. I really liked how Michael and Fiona moving in together was not a throwaway shipper moment, but something that actually had plot significance because it upped the stakes for Michael.  I also actually enjoyed watching Michael being selfish and willing to cross moral lines to save Fiona--I think it was an interesting development because, up to that point, he was such a Boy Scout that it became kind of boring for me. 

I also really enjoyed how Jesse was finally fully integrated into the cast, and he became one of my favorites this season.