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MountaineerBro10

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Danielg342

Danielg342

On 2/12/2023 at 10:19 PM, JMO said:

I ended up binging the season over the past week.  Overall, I think they did a decent job of telling a relatively cohesive story and keeping up the tension and interest across ten episodes, although I suspect watching them all at once helped quite a bit.  The performances delivered by the actors playing Voit and his wife were impressive, and I can see why they might want to bring Voit  back next season.  

Perhaps the episodes would have been better if they were all watched one after the other. Maybe Season Two will be structured in that way. I don't know why CM didn't drop all the episodes at once, like many other streaming shows do.

Only other story point I'll make is that the network storyline muddied the overall storyline somewhat. We were all in on it in the first few episodes, but by the second half, the network got barely a mention. There was more focus on Elias Voit and his family and the toll his activities placed on them than on the supposed serial killer network.

It would have been far more fun to explore a single serial killer who has found a way to be elusive- while staying active- for over twenty years. In real life, Ted Bundy mixed up his methods to throw off investigators, and let's not forget he actually nearly escaped conviction. CM has never had a Bundy-like character that mixed up his kill methods, which they could have explored with Voit.

Making him a family man would have added another intriguing wrinkle. Since most serial killers are unmarried, exploring one who is and how he hides his murders from his family would have been interesting. It also gives the criminal an added layer, so there's more to the criminal to explore other than "how will the BAU catch him?" Does Voit target people who wrong his family? Does Voit kill to get out of the tediousness of family life?

...and so on and so forth.

We explored bits and pieces of that, but we really should have gone deeper.

On 2/12/2023 at 10:19 PM, JMO said:

I do think the team was too small (and missing one notable genius), hence the need to bring Bailey, and then Will, along on the case.  Hope they are able to remedy that next year without acting on the implied threat to somehow bring Will onto the team.  No.

I don't believe the team is too big. It has too many people who do the same thing. What differentiates Tara from Luke, other than their anatomy? Or even JJ from Tara and Luke, outside of her family? Rossi and Prentiss all had things to do relevant to the case. So did Garcia. JJ, Tara and Luke were just investigators, none of whom brought unique perspectives to the investigation which would set them apart.

Reid, Hotch, Morgan...even Blake, if they had bothered to expand on what she could do...they all brought unique perspectives to the investigation which made them valuable. This kind of development was never made with the newer agents, of which I'll group JJ with because she only became an agent after Erica Messer took over. I don't know how you rectify all that now without resorting to writers pulling things out of their rears, but this lack of uniqueness is what drags down the team.

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MrWhyt
MrWhyt

how dare Paget Brewster show her age!

threebluestars
threebluestars

I will die on the hill that I liked JJ better as the media liaison. I liked having that bridge between the team and the family - it really helped the dynamics, and I think it's a major reason why I pr

Danielg342
Danielg342

At this point, Matthew Gray Gubler coming back might make this train wreck bearable again. Of course, that said, why would Gubler want to waste his talents on a platform that is so far beneath his abi

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

(edited)

Seeing stuff out there - re: S2 - about how Garcia's 'love life will remain "complicated"' and something about a 'love triangle'.  🤢


Unless they get MGG back for S2, there is no way I ever plan on watching the soap opera of Garcia's 'love life'.   No thank you very much.

Edited by iRarelyWatchTV36
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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

Since its been totally silent - seemingly on all fronts, let alone the one I'm referring to - for like 2/2.5 months, I'm guessing the chances of MGG coming back for the next season are about nil?


Or maybe I'm making something out of nothing, IE its just too early for real speculation.  Have they even started production on the new season yet?


And now the WGA has gone on strike (again), so that'll pretty much halt any production for however long that lasts.

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Danielg342

Danielg342

I remember just after the season concluded Paget Brewster said that "filming will resume in a few months". Well, it's been (by my estimate) "a few months" since then and I have not heard anything.

I'm personally anticipating another fall release date and another ten episode run from Thanksgiving to Valentine's Day, like this past season. We'll see what actually happens.

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

On 5/4/2023 at 11:14 PM, Danielg342 said:

I remember just after the season concluded Paget Brewster said that "filming will resume in a few months". Well, it's been (by my estimate) "a few months" since then and I have not heard anything.

I'm personally anticipating another fall release date and another ten episode run from Thanksgiving to Valentine's Day, like this past season. We'll see what actually happens.

All depends on how long the current WGA strike lasts.

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

(edited)

After looking around the internet a bit, it seems there's a tiny bit of chatter about the chances of MGG coming back as Reid for CME s2.

In an interview he gave for some of this other projects here very recently, he was asked about revisiting the Spencer Reid role on CME.  He answered that he would "be honored!" and "maybe it could happen" now that his own personal schedule isn't quite so packed as it was previously.  Also heavily hinted that it turns out that the strike made a return possible.  Had there been no strike, his schedule wouldn't have allowed time for him to be able participate in any of the filming for CME s2.


Maybe there's absolutely nothing there and he's just blowing smoke, but it at least provides a little hope for those of us who need it.  Not gonna hold my breath, but I'm down to give it a try if they can get MGG/Reid back - and hopefully for much more than as just a 'special guest star' for like barely a cameo in 1 or 2 episodes.

Edited by iRarelyWatchTV36
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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

5 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Aw, that's a shame. I'm hoping it was his decision, at least. There's only so many ways they'll likely be able to write him out, but I still hope he gets some kind of decent send-off, whatever they do. 

Did Will have a cancer-scare last season? I can’t remember much.

With Will gone, are they gonna go with JJ/Reid route to satisfy the fandom?

Josh Stewart is out of CM and his wife (Alexa Davalos) is no longer with FBI Most Wanted. Fresh start for both.

I seriously hope Kirsten Vangsness will not co-write any of new episodes. Penelope-focused episode is so unbearable. 😩

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Annber03

Annber03

17 minutes ago, Snazzy Daisy said:

With Will gone, are they gonna go with JJ/Reid route to satisfy the fandom?

Heh, if that's their plan, it actually wouldn't go over well with a good portion of the fandom, at least not in the areas where I spend time. In my fandom corner, I'm in an extreme minority of fans who actually does like them as a pairing. Mind, I never actually expected the show to put them together, but I would also hope they wouldn't kill Will off just to make that happen. At least, that's not how I'd write that kind of setup if I were in charge and they were going that way. 

Plus, there's also the fact that it'd probably be easier to do the whole JJ/Reid thing if Reid were, y'know, there, and as of now I've not seen any indications he's going to be back, so....

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Danielg342

Danielg342

Evolution hinted at marital problems between JJ and Will, and that is my preferred route as opposed to killing off Will. The "LEO married to the job who loses their romantic marriage" hasn't really been done from a female perspective, so that would be a nice storyline to explore.

Plus, AJ Cook is hot and does the whole "deer in the headlight" thing so well...seeing JJ have to go back to dating could be a fun storyline to watch.

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

(edited)
On 1/17/2024 at 6:39 PM, Annber03 said:

Heh, if that's their plan, it actually wouldn't go over well with a good portion of the fandom, at least not in the areas where I spend time. In my fandom corner, I'm in an extreme minority of fans who actually does like them as a pairing. Mind, I never actually expected the show to put them together, but I would also hope they wouldn't kill Will off just to make that happen. At least, that's not how I'd write that kind of setup if I were in charge and they were going that way. 

Plus, there's also the fact that it'd probably be easier to do the whole JJ/Reid thing if Reid were, y'know, there, and as of now I've not seen any indications he's going to be back, so....

Either both sides are doing an amazing job of keeping it under wraps, or its looking increasingly like MGG will not be returning to the series in any capacity.  I mean, how would news that 'big' stay quiet for this long otherwise?


Shame, if so.  Especially now that "Jencer" could be a potential route they could take things, if JS/WL is truly officially out.

Edited by iRarelyWatchTV36
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Annber03

Annber03

17 minutes ago, iRarelyWatchTV36 said:

Either both sides are doing an amazing job of keeping it under wraps, or its looking increasingly like MGG will not be returning to the series in any capacity.  I mean, how would news that 'big' stay quiet for this long otherwise?

That's why I tend to find all the "Okay, but will he be coming back/is he coming back?" speculation kind of amusing. I get people wanting to see favorite characters back and all, but also...if he really were, one way or another, we WOULD eventually know. Either it'd be an actual story on some entertainment site or there'd be a spoiler leak or some other kind of hint. Or, if he really were kept as a hush-hush surprise, we'd find out at the end of whatever episode revealed his surprise return. 

It's not impossible for shows to keep something like that a secret in this day and age, of course, but it's extremely hard to do. And of course they're never going to rule anything out definitively, both because they may genuinely be leaving that door open in case he does return and also because they need that possibility to dangle at the audience to get them to watch (and entertainment sites will play up that teasing as well). 

So yeah, while I get people wanting him back, and while I too would like to see him show up if he were interested in doing so, the constant questions and speculation aren't going to magically make him show up, and those people will often wind up being disappointed in the end anyway. If he shows up, we'll know. Until then, why focus on something that isn't likely to happen anytime soon? 

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Danielg342

Danielg342

I feel that Will's imminent departure is to do nothing except give JJ "womanpain". The writing for the past several seasons has leaned on JJ having angst for quite some time, but we've never really had a moment where JJ had to really lose herself and let out her emotions. Kind of like how the writers seem to give Joe Mantegna multiple excuses to raise his voice in a bid to give Rossi a "strong, emotional presence", we seem due for an Emmy-baiting, bawl-her-eyes-out moment from JJ.

Which...I don't know. I think JJ as a character has done far better since the writers gave up the whole "Mary Sue" thing in S10 and made her someone for whom the job takes an incredible toll, but a crying scene is no joke. I mean, since AJ Cook got to Hollywood she has to have some skills, but I find those moments of pure, unbridled sadness are difficult to pull off, even for the best of actors, and I'm not sure I would say AJ is up there in calibre.

So I'm fearing the trainwreck that is coming.

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

‘Criminal Minds: Evolution’ Sets Season 2 Premiere Date At Paramount+; First-Look Photos

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Paramount+ has slotted Thursday, June 6 for the season 2 premiere of Criminal Minds: Evolution. The first two episodes will drop on June 6, followed by new episodes weekly on Thursdays. The streamer also released some first-look images.

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The new season picks up following Season 1’s shocking finale as the FBI’s elite team of profilers investigates the deadly mystery of Gold Star. As the conspiracy unfolds, the Behavioral Analysis Unit (BAU) is met with an unexpected complication when serial killer Elias Voit negotiates a deal that transfers him to federal custody in the BAU’s own backyard. The team faces its biggest threat yet and cannot emerge unscathed from the mind-bending consequences. 

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

Matt’s Inside Line: Scoop on FBI, S.W.A.T., Chicago Fire, PLL, Mayfair Witches, The Way Home, The Rookie, Criminal Minds and More

Q: What’s going on with Tyler in the new season of Criminal Minds: Evolution? I love the character.

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As you may have already read, recently upped series regular Ryan James-Hatanaka’s POI is sticking around as not just a possible romantic interest for Garcia, but as a “consultant” for the BAU. What will that look like, though? As showrunner Erica Messer put it during my visit to set, “That character can do things that the rest of the team can’t really do with their badge and gun.”

 

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

Inside Line: Scoop on Chicago Fire, Doctor Who, Criminal Minds, Evil, Ghosts, NCIS: Tony & Ziva, Fire Country, Whose Line, The Old Man and More!

Q: Any information on what we can expect from Criminal Minds‘ JJ in the field this season?

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I don’t know if this falls under “in the field” per se, but you should be very excited by the closing scene of Episode 1.

 

Q: Is there anything that can be said about the absence of Will this season of Criminal Minds? Will it be explained thoroughly, or will his character still be “there” just in passing comments?

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I am a couple of episodes into the new season, and thus far Will has been… busy with work.

 

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

On 5/19/2024 at 7:07 AM, iRarelyWatchTV36 said:

Who's the guy between Rossi and Prentice on the poster?

That's Tyler Green (played by Ryan-James Hatanaka).

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JMO

JMO

So odd that they spent so much time on JJ's home life last year and now Will is just "at work".  

Without a guarantee of another season, sure seems like they might have wrapped up all the loose ends this year.  

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

‘Criminal Minds: Evolution’ Scoop on Rossi’s Past With Gideon’s Ex-Wife

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Felicity Huffman will be guest starring as Dr. Jill Gideon, beginning with the seventh episode. Jill is a brilliant biological psychiatrist, who agrees to help the FBI’s Behavioral Analysis Unit investigate a murderous conspiracy theory. She is reluctant to return to the bureau’s elite team given her complicated history with Rossi and her dead ex-husband, but soon realizes her specific skill set could help them uncover another clue to the elusive Gold Star mystery.

 

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

‘Criminal Minds: Evolution’: What Josh Stewart’s Absence Means for JJ & Will

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“Yeah, we really enjoyed that run last season and then this season again, because it’s only two weeks from last season and it’s sort of a bullet train of a year, we know that he’s on an assignment, just like there’s always another case, just like we always have another case,” Messer explains. “So we’re not going to see him this year, as he posted, but we’ll figure out what that means for future seasons, if we get future seasons. But for this year, the timing, none of it worked.”

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So that means we shouldn’t be expecting JJ to become the latest member of the BAU to suffer a tragic loss at home, right? “No, I mean, not in Season 17,” confirms Messer.

 

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

Cool news on already getting the renewal for s18, aka s3 of CM: Evolution.


Maybe foolishly holding my breath for something that won't ever happen, but if it isn't already in the plans/works for this season, they have to get MGG to at the very least make a cameo appearance next season.

Would be kinda nuts if they got 3 (at least) seasons after the initial 15-season run and arguably the 'face of the franchise' never made even a quick guest appearance in its further continuance.

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JMO

JMO

Please.  My eyes can't roll back far enough in my head.  I worked in a high pressure job for forty years.  No one smoked.  And there were only a very few who couldn't keep the "F bomb" out of the professional setting.  

It amazes me sometimes what the uninitiated think happens in the real world.  

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millennium

millennium

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As Tyler herself tells TVLine, “Prentiss is under such intense pressure, trying to navigate these issues, that she’s up there smoking. And the news is so bad that [Tara is like], ‘I have to smoke, too!'”

Message:  Women in charge can't handle pressure.

One thing the scene did accomplish was to end my years-long Emily Prentiss crush.   The first girl I ever really kissed smoked, and it was one of the most repulsive experiences of my young life.   Never again.

8 hours ago, JMO said:

Please.  My eyes can't roll back far enough in my head.  I worked in a high pressure job for forty years.  No one smoked.  And there were only a very few who couldn't keep the "F bomb" out of the professional setting.

In the episode thread, I remarked that the show must have sent them to junior high to learn to smoke and curse during the interval between seasons.   It's ridiculous that they're taking a victory lap about this.

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Danielg342

Danielg342

I remember a few years ago Erica Messer complained that she wished Criminal Minds wasn't on broadcast television because she wanted the show to be "edgier".

I criticized her then for it and I'll criticize her for it now.

Being "edgy" doesn't make a show good. Your show gains nothing just because you can bare the human body, show more blood, swear up a storm and (apparently) have characters smoking cigarettes (I didn't know smoking cigs was banned on broadcast TV, especially given how many times I see broadcast TV characters drinking beers, but, whatever). Just like with anything else in the story, what you decide to do has to work for the plot.

That's not the only thing about shock value, albeit that is the most important aspect of it. The other thing about shock value is that I have seen it used far too many times by lazy writers and producers in a bid to get eyeballs, so I'm extra cynical about anyone who tries to be "shocking".

Far too many times I've seen writers think they don't need to write a good episode because they have this "amazing scene" where someone literally blows up "real good" with blood and guts and all kinds of nice stuff flying everywhere.

Newsflash: shock without substance is boring.

As it pertains to CM, I've never understood why it needed shock value in the first place. Perhaps the only thing it could have benefitted from is that when we have a serial killer who likes to carve a body in a specific way, it might actually benefit to see the carving instead of having the characters talk about it.

Then again, I feel such a benefit is tangential and I'm not sure the gains in the narrative are worth the unease the audience would feel upon seeing such a thing. Does the audience need to, say, actually see a Celtic cross carved in someone's buttocks or does a character talking about it do enough for the plot?

I'm going to close with one final note- some of you might wonder why I haven't posted any reviews for this season. It's not because I haven't gotten around to it- it's because I haven't watched it at all so far.

...and, frankly, I'm not sure I ever will.

I'm not saying this for attention or sympathy, but I've been battling depression for a while. Going through it, I think about all the things that I did to bring me joy in my life and I think about if those things still really bring me joy, and if it's worth the energy to seek out that joy.

Truthfully, I don't know if CM really brings me any kind of joy anymore.

Anyone who has followed my reviews knows I haven't rated the show well for literally almost a decade. I don't know how many "F's" and "D's" that I have but I'm sure it's a lot. I'm not really sure I've truly enjoyed the show since the end of S5.

I soldiered along, I thought, after that out of a sense of obligation, but what I realize now is that I soldiered along because there were at least characters and the odd story that I still cared about. Even then, the main characters who I did like- Morgan, Elle, Gideon, Hotch, Reid and Simmons- had more to do with the actors portraying them than any actual great characterization, with the exception of Reid and Gideon because I think they're actually great characters.

The rest of the cast I feel may have had their moments but they were all, mostly, middling to average at best. They may have made an episode or a scene somewhat watchable, but they rarely made anything memorable.

Still, I figured last season I'd give CM another chance. Maybe it's because I didn't want to give up on CM so quickly. Maybe it's because I wanted to see how CM would navigate being on a streamer as opposed to broadcast TV.

Or, maybe I remembered the few moments of greatness I'd seen from the likes of Joe Mantegna and Paget Brewster, and I hoped, with a more streamlined cast, they could given more opportunities to shine and help the show recapture some of the magic it had lost.

What I saw was something completely different. I complained once before on these boards that the show's cast reeked of actors being on the show because they're seeking a payday they can't get anywhere else.

Last season, I think, really played out that way. Honestly, I felt like I was watching the FBI's "Geriatric Ward", because all I saw were characters who were uninspired, clearly over the hill and well past their prime.

Worse, none of the characters the show brought in to "freshen" the series did anything to benefit the show, let alone elevate it. Zach Gilford and Ryan-James Hatanka are fine enough actors, but their characters added very little. Nicholas D'Agostino did an okay job as Bailey, but Bailey was hardly anything more than your garden variety obstructive bureaucrat.

Then there were the stories...or lack thereof. It was presented as "a serial killer with a killing network" but it meandered between showing flashes of that network mixed inside a story of Elias Voit and his troubled family. It went everywhere but got nowhere, as the writers couldn't be bothered to explore any of their stories despite not having the time restrictions that broadcast TV gave them.

What's inside those stories were hardly any better. The characters swore a few times, each time awkwardly because the curse words were shoehorned into the speech. Garcia gets told not to date a material witness (a storyline that was already absurd) and, when she does, nothing happens.

Then there's the show's continued overreliance on "damsels in distress", or, what they really happened to be, were "disposable victims". Those victims- which could be shown cut up in all their glory- were mostly male in what is a clear (and extremely misguided) attempt at gender politicking in trying to subvert the "monster misogyny" trope (one that actually has a basis in reality).

Worse at the obvious attempt at preaching was their uselessness in the plot and their utter disposability. Scenes of victims- male or female- screaming and getting cut up add nothing to the narrative, and it'd be better just to have the dead bodies if the characters will do little more than be the serial killer's target practice.

Which is bad enough...but the show decides these disposable victims can be "clues" in the case, treating them as mere puzzle pieces in a grand puzzle. The show displays no remorse, no sympathy and no attempt to really make the victims feel human at all. They're just there so the BAU can use them to solve the puzzle and claim a "happy ending" when they stop the serial killer at the final moment, without so much as a mention or a nod to the countless lives that were lost in their reckless, callous wake.

All in all, I looked at last season and I felt like I'm just watching the worst of CM from its final years, all multiplied by 11, without anything redeeming about it.

...and I sat there and looked at it and thought, "why do I want to sit through that again?"

It's sad for me to think that a show that had once captivated me endlessly and inspired me to pick up a (metaphorical) pen and write could have fallen so far, but it's the truth.

I don't see a show that has any magic, boundless potential and any hope that it could recapture that magic and capitalize on its lost potential.

All I see is a burning wreckage, a husk of what once was, with nothing at all useable or salvageable.

I wish the CM people well and I hope they are happy at what they're doing...but, unless something drastic happens between now and next season, I can't see any reason to come back to these smouldering ruins.

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

Matt’s Inside Line: Scoop on Walker Finale, The Bear, Presumed Innocent, The Way Home, Melrose Place, The Rookie, Criminal Minds and More!

Q: Are we going to see how Criminal Minds‘ BAUGate impacts the rest of the team and JJ this season?

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Suffice to say, JJ is still very much on edge about the whole deepfake porn thing, and that pent-up frustration leads to her well-teased, long-awaited first eruption with an F-word this Thursday.

Bonus scoop: More smoking Prentiss ahead! Indoors! But seriously, this week is a very intense episode. Things happen.

 

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Danielg342

Danielg342

Are these writers 12 years old or something? Why is JJ swearing and Prentiss smoking such BIG! DEALS! OMG!

Based on what I have read so far, this season has sounded so ridiculous. I don't feel too bad for checking out.

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JMO

JMO

Hey @Danielg342, I haven't watched any of this season either, though I will probably do it at some point.  But I did read your post, and wanted to say that I wish you success in your battle with depression.  I'm sure you know you have a lot of company, even if that is small comfort at times.  Pulling for you to get and stay healthy---and for CM to remember what it is about!

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

Not watching, just following along on the forums - that said .....

Hell of a time for Will to be "too busy" to make any screen time this season, what with his wife dealing that deepfake porn stuff.   Unless they are going it on purpose, by manufacturing the tension to fully drive them apart because 'he wasn't there/around when she needed him most' kinda thing.


I've long since given up trying to understand the CM writers room, no sense doing it now.

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Danielg342

Danielg342

23 hours ago, JMO said:

Hey @Danielg342, I haven't watched any of this season either, though I will probably do it at some point.  But I did read your post, and wanted to say that I wish you success in your battle with depression.  I'm sure you know you have a lot of company, even if that is small comfort at times.  Pulling for you to get and stay healthy---and for CM to remember what it is about!

Thanks @JMO for the support. I really appreciate it. 🙂

So, because CM made me depressed, can I sue them and force them to make me their showrunner? 😋

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

(edited)

Between these sneak peeks and the synopsis of the episodes, even without watching I'm starting to wonder what this show even is anymore.

- PLI/UST/jealousy relationship drama angst between team members (Garvez)
- Prentiss getting high to deal
- Rossi being driven to delusion about a criminal
etc.


Why does it feel like this show is turning into a prime time streaming soap opera?!

Edited by iRarelyWatchTV36
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