Captain Danny Ross: Incompetent Ass or Just Misunderstood?

[WendyCR72]

In watching the Ross years, it completely baffles me how the man made captain.

 

Yes, I get every single character on CI has had moments of frailty, idiocy, and questionable judgment on a good day, but he drove me crazy, and often ended up with egg on his face. (Recruiting G/E in helping his "friend", Kathy, only to try to impede the investigation and having the result backfire; accusing Goren of murder in "Frame" AND getting Rodgers to blab about his subordinate.)

 

I'm rather shocked that Goren didn't sue his ass or Logan didn't lay him out in "Senseless".

 

That said, I do know some liked the man, which, okay. So, love the man or not, discuss him here!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Misunderstood? Please. He was an arrogant blowhard, who thought he was better than he actually was, and nothing but the puppet of the brass.

[WendyCR72]

Misunderstood? Please. He was an arrogant blowhard, who thought he was better than he actually was, and nothing but the puppet of the brass.

 

Well, you know we agree. But in the interest of having both sides represented, that's what I went with.  :-)

 

And did it suck the man died? Sure. But it doesn't/didn't make me like him any better. You can be a good leader yet still support those you lead without being a puppet for the brass upstairs. See Jimmy Deakins. Maybe if Ross spent less time being that puppet and truly trying to balance those two roles, he would have been better off.

[Maherjunkie]

I liked him but thought he was a dick in Blind Spot.  Declan made a mistake but he was still a respected profiler.  Learn from him douche.

[BigDfromLA]

I think Eric Bogosian is an outstanding and very underrated actor. He should have received an Oscar nomination for "Talk Radio". He was that good. Watch it if you haven't seen the movie.

 

I think Ross despised Goren both personally and professionally. He felt that Goren walked all over Deakins (which I agree with) and probably felt he had a mandate from the bosses above to get control of the loose cannon Goren. I think he also felt intimidated by Goren's flashes of brilliance. Ross seemed to have a much warmer relationship with the Jeff Goldblum character than he ever had with Goren. The only time I remember Ross EVER cracking a smile is in the opening theme when the three are walking out of the building.

[WendyCR72]

Ross did act like a dick in "Blind Spot", but not just with Gage. He did try to butter Alex up against Bobby. But then it extended beyond then. I don't care what excuse he gave Alex in "Frame", for instance, about "the question needing to be asked" (if Bobby was a killer). He WAS a coward - as Bobby accused him of being, and should have confronted Goren directly.

 

And he sure as hell had no right to mine info from Rodgers about him. (And Rodgers was an idiot for doing so. Bobby could have sued her ass. HIPAA, anyone?)

 

And I admit that it irked me how Ross got more story and airtime than poor Deakins did in 5 seasons. But then, Deakins trusted his people and was no "helicopter captain", so...

 

ETA:

 

Quote

He felt that Goren walked all over Deakins (which I agree with)

 

I disagree here. Deakins seemed to RESPECT Bobby's abilities. And he even would occasionally mock them ("the magic gut speaks!"), but it was clear that he TRUSTED Bobby and his uncanny abilities. And the warm relationship Ross had with Nichols was, IMO, the same Deakins had with Goren (and Eames). I even recall an episode (while investigating, but still) where Deakins joined G/E at a bar for drinks, too.

 

I just saw simple trust, respect, and camaraderie. Especially since it was just G/E whom Deakins told of his retirement personally. It showed me he did have high esteem for them. Even called them "my best detectives" or some variation thereof, IIRC.

 

I DO think Ross was JEALOUS of Goren and not just his abilities but was frustrated by the fact that Alex supported him, even through the lowest of lows, which...oh, well.

 

And as much as I dislike Ross and will agree that he and Goren were never besties, I don't think he DESPISED Goren. At least, not professionally. It was G/E he wanted to look into the situation with Kathy and was the one at that war recreation where the judge was killed and had G/E also look into that. It seemed like Ross tolerated Goren's abilities (again, along with Eames' own attributes) when it was useful to HIM. What that says about Ross, if anything, I'm not sure.

[Xeliou66]

Ross was an awful character, a pompous, arrogant egomaniac boss who didn't trust his squad, belittled and insulted his detectives, and was overall an unprofessional douche. He weakened the show, replacing Deakins with him along with the writing change made season 6 such a HUGE dropoff in quality form the first five seasons. 

I hated how Ross got so much more screentime than Deakins, with him participating in interviews, going to crime scenes, going to the morgue etc. I never remember Deakins going to the morgue one time and he very rarely interviewed suspects or went to crime scenes, Ross did it every few episodes at least. 

Ross should've been fired for getting Rodgers to give him Goren's personal information, and I hated the way they tried to force a relationship between Rodgers and Ross. 

When Ross was killed off, I was just glad he was off the show. 

[WendyCR72]

5 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

When Ross was killed off, I was just glad he was off the show. 

I wasn't upset Ross died. But it did give VDO/KE some good scenes.

As for Rodgers, I normally liked her, on this show and the Mothership. (She was crusty and acerbic, but witty!). But I completely got why Bobby went apeshit on her in the morgue in "Frame" for blabbing to Ross, especially since it was supposed to be confidential. Still, I blame Ross more than her in the end because Ross made her believe everyone was in danger. I did like how Eames was able to get Goren to go for a walk, though, and didn't presume to apologize for Goren to either of them.

The only time I can recall Deakins in an interrogation was in "Yesterday" in S1, when G/E were investigating one of Deakins' cold cases and he went to rattle an old suspect.

[Xeliou66]

Yeah I liked Rodgers overall but I didn't like her in that episode, I thought Goren was in the right, and yes I think Ross manipulated her into giving out confidential information because that's what Ross was, a manipulative douchebag. 

Yeah that's about the only time I recall Deakins going into the interrogation room, but he did talk to suspects/witnesses sometimes, usually in his office, I can think of several examples of that, I'll go to the Deakins thread to post those examples because this is the Ross thread but it's definitely interesting to compare as Ross had so many more scenes interviewing people and going out in the field. Deakins went to crime seasons about a couple of times a season at most, Ross did it all the time. 

[WendyCR72]

22 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah that's about the only time I recall Deakins going into the interrogation room, but he did talk to suspects/witnesses sometimes, usually in his office, I can think of several examples of that, I'll go to the Deakins thread to post those examples because this is the Ross thread but it's definitely interesting to compare as Ross had so many more scenes interviewing people and going out in the field. Deakins went to crime seasons about a couple of times a season at most, Ross did it all the time. 

Ross still acted like a detective. Deakins seemed more leader like, to me. I do recall Deakins going to a scene where one of the suspects was found dead, too. In S1's "The Enemy Within", the episode where the paranoid old man locked himself in his bathroom and died in a fire orchestrated by his son and a partner. The partner was the one Deakins, Goren, and Eames went and found dead.

But I agree the man didn't get to "play" nearly as often as Ross did.

[Maherjunkie]

I bet that's why he left the show.

[WendyCR72]

5 hours ago, Maherjunkie said:

I bet that's why he left the show.

Could very well be. Or maybe Jamey Sheridan just wanted some different acting challenges. Either way, I missed Deakins! Still wish he and/or Carver could have somehow popped up for S10.

[Xeliou66]

7 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Ross still acted like a detective. Deakins seemed more leader like, to me. I do recall Deakins going to a scene where one of the suspects was found dead, too. In S1's "The Enemy Within", the episode where the paranoid old man locked himself in his bathroom and died in a fire orchestrated by his son and a partner. The partner was the one Deakins, Goren, and Eames went and found dead.

But I agree the man didn't get to "play" nearly as often as Ross did.

Yeah I remember that time, he also went to the scene at the crematorium where all the bodies were buried in the back in Dead, and in Yesterday he went to the crime scene where Rick, the guy who helped Jay Lippman bury the body of the girl in his basement, was pushed off the building by Lippman. He did go out in the field in dangerous situations sometimes, such as in The Pilgram on the raid, in Magnificat in the raid on the house of the Arab guy who originally suspected, and in his final episode he went on a raid with Logan and Barek. He didn't go to crime scenes often and I can't remember him interrogating someone in the interrogation room in any other episode than Yesterday, although numerous times he did participate in interviews with witnesses/suspects in his office, examples include : The Faithful, The Good Doctor, Suite Sorrow, Beast, No Exit among others. Another time he talked to a suspect was in See Me, he talked to the victim's brother in law, the mentally ill guy who claimed to be ex CIA in the holding cell along with Goren and Eames. 

Ross on the other hand went to about half the crime scenes starting with his first episode, and regularly participated in interviews, interrogations and morgue visits. He was a helicopter captain who didn't trust his detectives and liked to micromanage the squad.

I don't think Deakins ever went to the morgue or had a scene with Rodgers, which made the Rodgers/Ross relationship even stranger. Zoe Callas went to the morgue some as well, I don't think Hannah did though. 

I wouldn't doubt that Sheridan decided to leave because he got tired of the role without getting much to do, same with Courtney B Vance as Carver leaving at the same time. Both characters were underused and sorely missed, and it pisses me off how the pompous jerk Ross got so much airtime while Deakins was so underused. 

[wknt3]

22 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Ross still acted like a detective. Deakins seemed more leader like, to me. I do recall Deakins going to a scene where one of the suspects was found dead, too. In S1's "The Enemy Within", the episode where the paranoid old man locked himself in his bathroom and died in a fire orchestrated by his son and a partner. The partner was the one Deakins, Goren, and Eames went and found dead.

But I agree the man didn't get to "play" nearly as often as Ross did.

I wonder how much was trying to write a different style and how much was just trying to replace Carver's screen time? They had one less main character and couldn't give the leads more material so they made the Captain more hands on as a result.

21 hours ago, Maherjunkie said:

I bet that's why he left the show.

16 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Could very well be. Or maybe Jamey Sheridan just wanted some different acting challenges. Either way, I missed Deakins! Still wish he and/or Carver could have somehow popped up for S10.

Or some combination of the above as well as stated reason at the time (being tired of the commute from LA and wanting to see his family more.) I also wouldn't be surprised if his health issues played a role. One of my co-workers had Bell's Palsy and I saw what they dealt with. I can only imagine that dealing with that as an actor must have been very taxing.

[Maherjunkie]

I thought that was a temporary problem.

[WendyCR72]

6 hours ago, wknt3 said:

Or some combination of the above as well as stated reason at the time (being tired of the commute from LA and wanting to see his family more.) I also wouldn't be surprised if his health issues played a role. One of my co-workers had Bell's Palsy and I saw what they dealt with. I can only imagine that dealing with that as an actor must have been very taxing.

I had no idea about the commute thing. With his also being away from his family, I can see why Mr. Sheridan may have decided 5 seasons on the show was enough. LA to NYC on the regular had to take its toll. I wonder if that at all contributed to his Bell's Palsy?

Good that he was still able to act with that. The eye patch look actually worked for him.  :-)  Although, in all seriousness, I am sure it couldn't have been easy.

Ross filling Carver time I'm not sure of. Or, at least I don't believe it was the original design since the show did make some noise about Caver being replaced by Nona Gaye (Marvin Gaye's daughter) who, ironically, never made it to air over "creative differences with Theresa Randle popping up in S6. If I were to guess, since neither lasted, I think popping in for a scene or two just wasn't worth it to them, hence the parade of the recurring nameless ADAs from then on out, if they appeared at all.

(Still was amused at the Carver lookalike in S8 in "Identity Crisis".) It sucked for all playing the ADAs, but I really can't blame the leads. CI seemed to be much more personal from word go, which meant more character introspection. And, if not that, more criminal stuff since this show was said to be from their POV. So something had to go, and the ADA was it. At least, that's just my take.

Back on topic of this thread, Danny Ross seemed to have no use for the ADAs, either. I wonder if that would have been the case had Carver remained?

[WendyCR72]

3 hours ago, Maherjunkie said:

I thought that was a temporary problem.

I looked Bell's Palsy up. It is said to not usually be permanent. But, in some cases, it doesn't disappear.

[Xeliou66]

It was stupid to get rid of Carver and the legal side IMO, the show was successful at focusing on the criminals and their motives and psychology while still having Carver and the legal stuff. The show greatly weakened without him. I do think having no ADA did give Ross more screen time. 

[wknt3]

6 hours ago, Maherjunkie said:

I thought that was a temporary problem.

 

2 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

I looked Bell's Palsy up. It is said to not usually be permanent. But, in some cases, it doesn't disappear.

He does seem to have made a full recovery fortunately. It's just having seen it up close I can only imagine how much effort it must have been - there were some articles at the time about he had to work very hard enunciating in order for his dialogue to be understood and I think it very well might have been undersold to avoid making producers wary about hiring him for future roles. Combined with everything else (the commute, the chances of getting a raise as a non-lead on a Dick Wolf series if you stick around, the BTS issues seeming to start rearing their head) I could see it being a factor even if he wasn't dealing with the symptoms any longer.

[WendyCR72]

21 hours ago, wknt3 said:

He does seem to have made a full recovery fortunately. It's just having seen it up close I can only imagine how much effort it must have been - there were some articles at the time about he had to work very hard enunciating in order for his dialogue to be understood

He must have really practiced because I barely noticed a deficit in Jamey Sheridan's diction. I did notice, though, that he had a slight droop to one side of his mouth. I have to credit the show for not writing him out completely while he battled Bell's palsy and wrote it in instead.

As for screen time without the ADA, I think it not only went to Ross, but Rodgers seemed to be almost a semi regular on CI versus the Mothership. The matter of writing for two sets of detectives probably made things a challenge, anyway.

[WendyCR72]

"Betrayed" was on on WE about an hour ago, and Ross just makes me want to punch him. (Nothing new, but...) It's obvious he is overly involved with Kathy Jarrow and kept trying to explain away crap he'd normally demand G/E (or L/W) to follow up on. He should have stayed out of the case.

And I sort of felt badly for Rodgers there. Here she was, looking over a body of another woman Ross was all whacked out about, and yet...weren't Ross/Rodgers "dating" or whatnot?

I mean, I have watched this plenty, but I must be in a mood, because Ross' assiness really stood out on this watch.

[Xeliou66]

Ross was an asswipe all the way through. He routinely berated his detectives and treated them like idiots while only caring about his own career and the politics of it. Betrayed was one of his worst episodes, he repeatedly intervened on behalf of Kathy Jarrow and let his personal feelings get in the way of the case. I hated the whole Rodgers/Ross relationship as well, they had no chemistry and I thought Rodgers could be with someone a lot better than self absorbed arrogant asshole Ross. 

[WendyCR72]

On 3/4/2018 at 3:01 AM, Xeliou66 said:

I hated the whole Rodgers/Ross relationship as well, they had no chemistry and I thought Rodgers could be with someone a lot better than self absorbed arrogant asshole Ross. 

Since Rodgers was practically a regular cast member on CI, TPTB probably thought having a relationship with the captain of Major Case made sense. But...eh. And like I said, in "Betrayed", Ross was so up Kathy's grill, I almost felt angry on Rodgers' behalf, and I didn't even really like them together.

It's really too bad Lennie/Jerry Orbach didn't live long enough to make another CI guest appearance and flirt it up with Rodgers, instead. I liked their banter. And, hey! Rodgers did say he took her to the opera. (Which also doesn't seem Lennie's style, but I bet he did it to make Rodgers happy.  :-) Which...awww.)

I always did wonder what Rodgers saw in Ross. Because I don't have a clue. Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

[wknt3]

2 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

It's really too bad Lennie/Jerry Orbach didn't live long enough to make another CI guest appearance and flirt it up with Rodgers, instead. I liked their banter. And, hey! Rodgers did say he took her to the opera. (Which also doesn't seem Lennie's style, but I bet he did it to make Rodgers happy.  :-) Which...awww.)

I'm sure he would take her anywhere she wanted to go. :-) And hey - maybe he reconsidered his stance on opera after Green convinced him of the merits of La Boheme in "Kid Pro Quo"...

Quote

I always did wonder what Rodgers saw in Ross. Because I don't have a clue. Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

Maybe she loved his one man shows at the police benefit galas?

[Xeliou66]

3 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Since Rodgers was practically a regular cast member on CI, TPTB probably thought having a relationship with the captain of Major Case made sense. But...eh. And like I said, in "Betrayed", Ross was so up Kathy's grill, I almost felt angry on Rodgers' behalf, and I didn't even really like them together.

It's really too bad Lennie/Jerry Orbach didn't live long enough to make another CI guest appearance and flirt it up with Rodgers, instead. I liked their banter. And, hey! Rodgers did say he took her to the opera. (Which also doesn't seem Lennie's style, but I bet he did it to make Rodgers happy.  :-) Which...awww.)

I always did wonder what Rodgers saw in Ross. Because I don't have a clue. Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I have no idea what Rodgers saw in Ross, Ross was an obnoxious bureaucrat and self serving douchebag, I thought the whole Rodgers-Ross relationship was stupid and forced and I was glad they didn’t go into it much, it was a stupid idea.

I do wish CI had had more crossover characters with the other shows, other than Rodgers they rarely had crossover characters, it would’ve been cool to see Briscoe and Green with Goren and Eames again, or see an SVU crossover, Munch and Goren together would’ve been awesome.

Edited March 7, 2018 by Xeliou66

[WendyCR72]

On 3/6/2018 at 7:33 PM, Xeliou66 said:

I do wish CI had had more crossover characters with the other shows, other than Rodgers they rarely had crossover characters, it would’ve been cool to see Briscoe and Green with Goren and Eames again, or see an SVU crossover, Munch and Goren together would’ve been awesome.

Munch could have said to Bobby, "You look a lot like an unfortunate guy named John Lange who had a run-in with a train during a case in Baltimore..."