EyesGlazed

It was funny! I was just projecting my own issues onto your joke. : )

I thought you were going to say the moral is never, never, never have kids! That would have been pretty funny. Agreed. Soapy? Check. Actors I like to watch? Check. Bad behavior to shake head at? Check. I'm in. This is an excellent point, and an important one. It looked like Harry was lashing out in rage after first watching Hugo swing a wooden bat at his kid, and then being kicked in the shin. So does that make it better or worse? Worse because Harry can't control his temper even with a child? Or better because this was an extraordinary circumstance and Harry wouldn't act that way normally? Like others on this board, I grew up in an era (60s-70s) when it was considered okay to physically discipline out-of-control children. My third grade teacher had a paddle which she occasionally used, lightly. My mother did spank me a couple of times. One time was when I was about 6 and I hit the 11 year old neighborhood bully in the head with a stone! I was only trying to throw it to land by his feet and scare him, but wouldn't you know it, just that one time my arm was major league baseball worthy and I pegged him in the head at 25 feet. He was fine, but went crying home to his parents, who then came to our house, and my mother was the maddest I've ever seen her! Spanking and grounding ensued. But I will say that kid never bullied me again.

After I watch this show I want to take a shower. Everyone in it beginning with Annalise is morally disgusting and most have horrid personalities too. Counselors on the board, you've made a valiant effort with the COTW, but this show bears as much resemblance to a real legal practice as an acid trip. I know it's not supposed to be a documentary, but still it's laughable. My favorite line of terrible dialogue was Annalise's retort to Hannah: "Incest is best!" Which we used to say to each other as children to tease and to gross out. This is supposed to be an adult woman's zinger?! And then the writers add the crowning touch "Put your brother to the test!" Which sounds even more nursery rhymey, and also even grosser. Hope Viola got a big tall drink after that scene. As I write this I realize I'm now hate watching this show.

Well I thought everyone would be safe in this episode because the show killed Beth in the previous episode, BUT NOOOOOOOOOOO. Damn you, show. Someone posted upthread that TWD has fewer and fewer places to go: more deaths, more evil live humans, more scary dead humans, more talk about how tired everyone is of this world, more deaths. I agree. How do they end TWD, with Rick and Michonne driving a convertible off a cliff after the rest of CDB has been killed?? The show is starting to seem pointless and just bumming me out. I still don't get why Tyreese was so hugely compelled by the photos of the kids. I kept looking for clues, like one kid wearing a "Bob's our daddy" t-shirt or something. It was just photos of two kids. Why did he have to stare at them until he lost track of where he was and got bitten??

This. I was getting tired of the show's frenzied pace and cardboard characters. While I still think the show is too Shondalized -- meaning too much plot frantically crammed into every episode, too many "watch me push the envelope!" sex scenes, too many characters who never have a moment of normal behavior -- this episode was quite an improvement. Also I'm eager to watch Marcia Gay Harden. If TPTB keep it up, I may keep watching. That actress is Alysia Reiner, who played the assistant warden on the first season of Orange Is The New Black. She was terrific in that as well as a superbad, sexy politician type who was a crook but also kind of cool.

Radiochik, I liked Michelle's dress too. Yes it had a lot of fit problems but I attribute that to the ludicrously short time the designers are given. Michelle had some really good ideas in that dress: a beautiful color, an interesting neckline, flowery/feminine detailing on the torso and skirt. And she was so smart about the photos from the waist up. Btw, when my sister got married she chose fuchsia cotton a-line dresses with sweetheart necklines for the bridesmaids, and we all looked fantastic. (We were in our 20s so the odds of looking good in any dress were higher then, but still . . . ) As for Alyssa's penis comment about Michelle's dress, these judges see fricking penises or vaginas everywhere they look. They can't seem to get through two episodes in a row without discussing someone's genitals or theoretical genitals. I can't say that I liked Sonjia's dress, but like Michelle's at least it was interesting and had some good, innovative ideas in it. Unlike the other three dresses. OTOH, I love Cat Deeley and it was a very pleasant surprise to see her on this show. I just wish she could have done all the judging and the other 3 had sat silently. Ha ha I know! And I loved that they showed Michelle reacting to that news with the tiniest of smirks. She clearly had the same thought. Fabio, you are a sweet, talented guy, but it was your time to go. You just aren't the best of this group.

I am in the tank for this show; I'm enjoying all the characters and all the actors and most of the music. Especially because I've always been a fan of Taraji, and now she's getting a big juicy role to play and a lot of scenery to chew and she's owning it! I think all around the acting is pretty good, so I must disagree respectfully with our esteemed recapper. She's not giving the show the soapy props that it deserves. So much word. And you can see how Lucious is beginning to respect her and want her again. I agree with this too. It's unfortunate that these days, showrunners feel they have to cram 15 plot developments and 10 shockers into every episode to hold the attention of us kiddies. Maybe they do thanks to the Shonda Effect, I don't know. But I like that this show has slowed down a bit from the frantic throw-everything-you-got-at-the-screen tactic of the first two episodes. The Kinksters are much more interesting than expected. Rhonda gives me a kick. I liked her sassy "white girls can be brilliant too" to Cookie at the photo shoot. And her love of perverse role-playing of the other woman (women?) And what about that BJ Towel that she keeps handy for when her man needs to be soothed into taking his meds?? Awesome!

I get you and it's a good point. But the show never portrays the Girls as doing anything right, or practical, or kind or adult, except that very occasionally they are good to each other. To me, it would be more poignant, and realistic, if we saw them occasionally succeed or do something cool, and then f** up again. That's what growing up is.

I thought the workshop scene was great. I too have participated in such a workshop (as an undergrad) and your natural tendency is to be really defensive about your writing. Especially since, as is often the case with young writers, your stories tend to be about you and about events and people that you've encountered. In fact, I learned something about myself from hearing my classmates discuss the main character in one of my stories, which was basically me. That said, are we going to see any character development at all from Hannah? We've watched her f*** up over and over in New York, and now we're going to watch her f*** up over and over in Iowa? Most twenty-somethings mature somewhat over the course of a few years. And that said, will any of the Girls ever do anything right? It's getting a bit unrealistic and frustrating that they are all such f***ups. I do have some hope for Shosh. She might actually get a job and keep it.

Good points. I didn't particularly want to see Marnie getting her salad tossed, but I wanted even less to see all the gratuitous tits and ass on Boardwalk Empire, Game of Thrones and Marco Polo, to name just a few. At least the female nudity in this show is in service of developing a female character instead of titillating the bros. Hee.

I like Zanna's outfits! There, I said it! To me, living in NYC and having several friends in the fashion-magazine biz, her outfits are the kinds of things that the girls at Vogue and Bazaar wear. Zanna's sometimes-fried blonde locks are pretty standard Vogue material too. It's a contrast with Heidi, whose looks tend to be Hollywoodish or Las Vegas-y, not to mention insanely short. I find Zanna's looks more interesting and creative. Guess I'm feeling contrary today because I disagree with this too. Sonjia's designs are consistently different and fresh. Yes, I wouldn't pick her runway outfit to wear to a resort, but I appreciated the use of contrasting fabrics and shapes. It was a lot more intriguing than Justin's off-the-rack snorefest. And her swimsuit was THE BOMB. I loved Jay's caftan to pieces and thought Isaac's critique was B.S. I would wear that in a heartbeat. It was the most eye-catching, versatile, easy and resort-y outfit that anyone sent down the runway.

Totally agree. I said the same thing a few pages back. It was Laverne Cox using these men to make her version of a PSA: look America, gay love! I wish they'd said "no thanks, we're grown men and how we pursue our relationship is none of your business." Now I somewhat hate her, which is unfortunate because I used to like her on Orange is the New Black.

I actually hated that moment. She wasn't interested in the straight couples, she was just intent on treating the two gay guys like lab rats. Did you kiss? Did you want to? Show us now! Look everybody, two gay guys kissing! What a lesson for America! I found it disrespectful. Word. I don't understand Fabio's win for these same reasons. Mizrahi actually made fun of the look. I don't remember any of the other judges loving it unreservedly. His real guy model looked uncomfortable in it. So how did he walk away with the prize? But what do I know. I liked Michelle's look. Maybe it helped that her guy was super hot and could wear clothes well. I especially liked the sweater. The zippers made it interesting and they called attention to the guy's great shoulders. And cashmere, mmmmm on a man. The pants fit very well. Yes maybe there were a few too many buttons or snaps or whatever they were, but I still liked them. I also liked Dmitry's outfit. Fabio's and Jay's looked like costumes to me. Maybe I'm too hetero and old to get it, but if a guy showed up on a date with me wearing either of those outfits, I'd laugh my ass off. And I'm not even mentioning the women's looks because they were all lame in one way or another.

Looking at the photo from Tara's review, I just realized that Will McAvoy is going to age into Lipless from Homeland.

This show sure doesn't pull punches about the price of infidelity. Having Noah and Allison screwing in Noah and Helen's marital bed was a certain turn-off for the audience, and clearly was meant to create disgust. Frankly I don't think either one of these characters would actually do this. It was a plot development to gross us out. Presumably to illustrate that these people are out of control. But having said that, I still find Helen not as sympathetic as most on this board seem to find her. I don't know why. Because she seems entitled? Because she lets her insufferable parents call the shots in her marriage? I just have never warmed up to her. God Allison, I don't care how drunk you are, how could you sleep with Oscar? Just ewwwwww.

If I were Carrie, the primary concern on my mind would be who to do first: hot Pakistani Khan or hot CIA Quinn. Maybe Khan first, as she may not be in Pakistan much longer. Or maybe Quinn, as he may not be alive much longer. Oh, the U.S. station is decimated and her dad died and she's rediscovered affection for her baby? Whatever. Priorities. This episode did succeed in making me clap my hands to my head and scream WHAT THE F--K!? when Dar Adal was in the car with Terrorist Shithead. Good job, show.

As others have made thoughtful points about the central adult relationships in this episode, I will just add: what is up with those Solloway kids? Why are they so heinous? No seriously, what plot points are they serving? I caught myself having a little sympathy for Martin when he looked so downcast during the report card conversation, then quickly remembered that this was the kid who FAKED HIS OWN SUICIDE JUST BEFORE A FAMILY TRIP to freak out his family, and also the kid who deliberately set loose a horse that was the property of people who had given him a job and been kind to him. Ugh! For the first offense alone, I would have cancelled the little bastard's summer vacation in Montauk and taken him straight to therapy, with extra algebra tutoring on the weekends. And Whitney has been presented as a near-sociopath in dire need of counseling (I guess Martin will get his turn when he becomes a bully instead of being bullied? ), with crappy values and poor impulse control. Other posters have speculated that she is pregnant and is or will be in a relationship with Scotty, but I think we are supposed to be inferring more from her. So what is the point here? That the Solloways are horrible parents, that Helen's parents are horrible grandparents, that the Solloway marriage is bad for the kids? I'm just very curious. p.s. I still like Noah more than the rest of you guys do! : ) p.p.s. Random observation: Cherry deciding that SHE wanted to keep Allison's son's chest of toys rather than deferring to Allison (and especially after Son #4 asked ALLISON what she wanted to do with the chest) was extremely annoying.

Dear heavens, I have now learned that one episode of a series can reach into your brain and destroy any enjoyment that you'd derived from the prior four episodes of said series. I'm calling it the Shenandoah Syndrome. E05 was all kinds of crap. The Maggie-Jim reconciliation was the opposite of magical; it was limp, undramatic, inane and unbelievable. The Will-versus-dad's-ghost debates were rehashed Sorkin tropes from Seasons 1 and 2 that irritated me for their pretentiousness the first time around, and the Ghost Dad scenes had no relation to the plot lines in the current season, except that Will happens to be having these hallucinations while in prison. The Sloan smackdown of Bree's stalker-site was fine, but it was overly easy and not a credible issue for a real news network, as opposed to a Gawker. Charlie's flapping around yelling at everyone was not true to his character and was just telegraphing "imminent heart attack and/or stroke!" and "gala funeral coming soon!" Mainly, this episode was the worst kind of writerly sermons-via-characters about "problems" that are the obsessions of the writer and are not central to the larger societal issues addressed or to the series that he's supposed to be writing. And that of course brings me to the worst offender, the campus rape storyline. The "problem" that Sorkin discusses via Don (and poor Don! I hate that he was made the mouthpiece) and Mary is the possibility of false accusations of rape. Which is a statistically tiny part of the enormous, virulent issue of sexual violence against and coercion of women that affects all ages and races and ethnicities in our country, and a culture that encourages the silencing, discrediting and shaming of women who complain about it. I'm frankly nauseated that Sorkin would decide to take on that issue and then use his bully pulpit to lecture us about the poor guys who may not be able to get a job. And Sorkin just added to the disproportion. This. And this.

I really liked this episode. I'm very sick of Reacon, but the rest of the show was great. To wit: 1. Juliette and Avery. Normally slapstick humor on TV leaves me cold, but the stalking-and-being-busted scenes were quite funny. Juliette looked like R2D2 with a scarf. I'm quite worried about that baby however. One of the show's main plot lines has been Juliette hooking up with various inappropriate or nearly-appropriate men. The Law of PrimeTime TV says that after she's a mother, she can't do that stuff any more. I just don't see her and Avery and a healthy baby together next year. Though I do wish for it, show! 2. Layla full-on redemption arc and Jeff possible redemption arc. I love what they're doing with Layla (and I loved her beanie boho look!) She's gone through a lot of development, and even her worst reactions have been somewhat understandable given her circumstances. I like it that she and Will have become friends and allies. And NiceJeff! What?! I hope it works out for these two and that he doesn't do something sleazy to her. 3. SAG performing together. That was pretty damn good. 4. Zoey's new life, and the actress's. I agree with those who wanted a happier ending for Zoey, like showing her on tour. But good for the actress to move on to a better part. What was NOT GREAT: Thank you John! I couldn't believe my ears when they started singing that.

I couldn't agree more. I was shocked that he didn't get B3'd for a long coat with essentially no back below the waist. It was so unflattering and, as you point out, impractical. It really looked to me like he ran out of fabric. The back wasn't "slit" so much as nonexistent. What this episode needed was Heidi giving some reality-check commentary. She would never have let Justin get away with that dreck and she wouldn't have cared if he went all big weepy eyes on her. Fabio's coat grew on me the more I looked at it. I wish PRAS did the close-up look at the garments by the judges the way PRO has started to do. Fabio's collar/neckline in particular was flattering and fresh. I couldn't quite tell what colors he was using - think it was navy and a little dark blue mesh? In any case, it would be more flattering on a pale redhead like Fergie than some of the drab blacks and grays the other designers were using. Speaking of drab grays, Jay's coat had so much potential with the contrast between the yellow and gray, but then he bollixed it up by over designing the hell out of it. Finally, they should have sent Sam home (much as I like her) instead of Benjamin. I actually liked his fabric and found it very London-y. He did mess up with the flounce and the weird context-less pockets, but at least his coat was well tailored. Sam's was just a droopy mess.

Okay, as a long-time New York City resident, I have to confess that I was shrieking with laughter at the idea that there was this enormous hushed chapel space at City Hall that Mac and Will could populate with musicians, a priest, a trellis with flowers on it, and a wedding party. Ha! More like a desk in front of a harried civil servant with 30 other people in line. But then I read this from the NYC Clerk's Office website (and yes, I have too much time on my hands): Go figure! It would have been fun to see Mac and Will checking the "line-management system" to find out their wait time. Could they ask for an emergency line jump based on imminent arrest? Or we could have had Don and Will buying a costume ring and matching his-and-hers "I got married in NYC!" T shirts. Yes, yes and yes. Sorkin, PLEASE pitch all of this to cable TV. I want to see these characters over and over. HR Guy was too busy stalking Sloan and Don and forgot to reclaim Hallie's security pass. Jim: You're a pretentious douche. I hope that in the season finale you get detailed to cover the Kardashians full-time.

No it's not. The hospital cops were living just fine, eating well, sleeping in beds, using their recumbent bikes (!!!) and traveling freely in and out and around the city in their fleet of cars. The Ricktatorship should have moved right on in. They would quickly have cured any remaining bad cops of their bad habits. ("Stop!" "You won't stop?" BLAM. "Shut up".) Exactly. Too bad, as other posters have pointed out, that that plot development wouldn't suit Kirkman's taste for nihilism and debauchery on the road. I agree with this too. Beth wasn't a superhero or a badass or particularly smart or cunning. She was just a normal young woman coping with the new horrible reality. In fact, when she exceeded her skill set (stabbing armed police officer with teeny scissors in fit of anger) she got killed.

Great points. And once again I have to ask, can't these people conceive and execute a plan that WORKS?? I get that the series is supposed to be nihilistic and dark, but it's starting to be comical that everything they do turns to s**t. Well said, I agree. And it would have been interesting to see the new, strong Beth interact with the group after her experiences. Ah ha ha! kj4ever, you nailed it. I like to think that the hospital community really will improve now that Dawn and the "bad cops" are gone. And does anyone else think that Rick & Co. were a little precipitous in rejecting the offer to live at the hospital? The Ricktatorship group is finally back together. They have no place to live. They outnumber and out-badass the cops and wards. The hospital has food, medicine, shelter and beds. Yet the Ricktatorship prefers to travel randomly in a fire truck?

Re the hostage exchange: could we just once, just one time, get to see this group conceive of a plan that ends up WORKING? Seriously, show. It's almost getting unrealistic that these guys can't seem to accomplish anything at all. I'm very sad about Beth and I found the other characters' grief very affecting. I was enjoying Beth's character development and rooting for her to rejoin the group as a more grown-up member. But Nooooooooo! Sometimes it seems this show exists to masochistically mess with our feelings and cause us to watch TD for therapy, thereby further increasing AMC's ratings. (And weeping Emily on TD was heart-breaking! I'm beginning to dislike Kirkman not just for killing off characters but for banishing actors from the family they've created for themselves in Georgia.) Does anyone know what Beth meant when she said to Dawn "I get it now"? What did Beth get? And why oh why did Beth think it was a good idea to stab an armed person in the neck with a little pair of scissors? What did she think that was going to accomplish? Co-sign with those who don't understand why people are all hopped up over "MORGAN!!!" whom we last saw a few years ago. Is he a magical wizard or something? Finally, I'm going to go ahead and admit that I kind of understood Dawn and didn't hate her. She had established her own version of the Ricktatorship in the hospital. In her view, she was trying to keep people alive and law and order functioning. So she made sicko compromises that she was ashamed of, and played factions off against each other, and killed fellow officers, and told herself that it was all for the greater good. As I'm sure Rick does. Also Dawn was badass in her own way. But Dawn definitely blew it by insisting that she get to "keep" Noah. Quit while you're ahead, lady!

I knew this f'ing show would get good in its last season just in time to disappear.