ofmd

Tbh, I've been hate-watching this show for several seasons now... most seasons... I'm not proud of it, but here we are. And I hate pretty much all the characters equally, with the exception of Louise (blink if you need us to get you out, hon!).

Oooh, I might have missed that. I took it to mean that after a long time in Japan, he did return to England, like I think his real-time counterpart did. Your interpretation is more elegant. I agree with your post (sans Jarvis, whose performance imho had nothing to do with the writing), but most of all with this: ...to the grace the ending gave to characters like Buntaro and Father Alvito who in a lesser show would have been straight-forward antagonists throughout.

I really liked the ending. Most of all, how they acknowledged Toranaga basically being the same power-hungry ruler as everyone else (East or West). I'm not interested in watching battles. I understand many were hoping for the big one, but I didn't and was fine with their exposition. Also, the rapport Blackthorne and Fuji had in the end. Nice touch with Mariko's widower basically making peace with him. The Blackthorne actor was half-decent. He really was the weak link of this show... Yabu killed it too, so to speak. But before we mourn him too hard, let's remember he loved to boil people to death.

I mean, look at what they did to the Inca and the Aztecs. That was their MO and they were fairly restrained in Japan because that civilization was not as technologically disadvantaged as expected. >>So why has Mariko been anguished all her life about the death of her family Imho, it had as much to do with pride and loss of status as with grief, perceived injustice etc. I mean, the whole previous episode was about accepting or hating fate... As for the traditional Japanese religion, I hope we'll hear someone with more knowledge explain, but I think it was more like Shintoism, not big on the after life, more a pantheistic thing. (I'm sure my grasp is lacking.) I do think there must be more cognitive dissonance than for the average Catholic or Christian, trying to reconcile the two cultures.

Mariko has, from the start, been shown as someone who wanted to die, who would have committed seppuku in a heartbeat, had not her husband, and later Toranaga, forbidden her to do so. She was focused on two things: on dying and on helping the cause/ her liege lord/ taking revenge (hard to tell those things apart), preferably both at the same time. I do wish they had found a way for her to live on, but the show had built no foundation whatsoever for that, so I'm surprised anyone would doubt she would go through with it. (I totally effed up tenses, sorry.) I appreciate the show never tricked the viewer into believing that could change. I do hope Fuji will find a cause to live though. ETA: Apparently, Mariko is based on a real person: https://www.japanesewiki.com/person/Garasha (Gracia) HOSOKAWA.html https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hosokawa_Gracia I was going to ask if we would get to hear Mariko's death poem; here is the real one: 'A flower is most beautiful when it knows the time to fall. People are like flowers, I will die without hesitation.'

(Why does everyone pronounce it "show-gun"?!)

Idk, the way I remember it - which may be wrong - was far more trite than this. Essentially, she sacrificed herself to save Blackthorne's life because lurvvve. I certainly would have wished for a different ending, but throughout the series, Mariko has been portrayed as a very dark character longing for death. You know, if they had shown Mariko falling in love with the Anjin in this episode (instead of a long time ago, for no particular reason), I wouldn't have complained. It was the first time he showed true understanding for her and her culture and he was willing to act against everything he believed in, while the lord who had promised to second her failed to show up and her son refused her. This was a riveting episode. Plus, poetry.

I mean, he really might have read it... The Ilias, that is.

I agree. And I assume we won't see any or most of the arconia residents, as the season takes place elsewhere. :-( I need my Uma fix, and Howard, and the Detective! (Not an Arconian but unlikely to turn up in LA.)

My favorite moment: "'Those are your neighbors..." Mwahaha. I'm very confused. I figured this was all a great ruse, but am I really to believe he sacrificed his son and heir? Or was that just an unscripted bonus? I'm guessing Blackthorne's job is to keep Yobu busy and to bring the navy to the battle. The actor who plays Buntaro gave great performances, making a despicable character nuanced and almost sympathetic. Second favorite moment: "You will know what it means to be denied." I'm really thrilled to see so many unknown (to me) great actors. I even like Yobu's hamminess. Heck, I'd like him if it wasn't for his boiling kink.

She told Omi that the anjin's "thoughts were elsewhere" (i.e. not with Kiku) that night.

So much for "whatever happens in the willow world, stays in the willow world"! I knew that was BS. Although I don't quite get why dissent around the Anjin would be advantageous to her. Also, poor kiddo. I kept thinking Toranaga's brother was in on the great 3-dimensional chess plan, but after his nephew's death, probably not. Is the great plan to enter Osaka under the ruse of surrender, then take Osaka from within? I agree that the actor who plays Toranaga owns the show. Most others (sans the Blackthorne actor) are pretty good. Kiddo actor acted his little heart out, too.

Mothers of heirs have held power (until said heir came of age) in many cultures, I don't have a problem accepting Lady Ochiba does.

I'm 10 minutes in and he's still disrespecting her by calling her Mariko. Gah, I just can't with this Blackthorne.

I wonder what Toranaga's reasoning is wrt to the traiterous/ manoevering vassal. Is it really a wise idea to have this ambitious dude learn new military tactics? And have his son and heir, who is still inexperienced and hot-headed, iow vulnerable, with him? There must be a long-term strategy that I don't get.

I love the Toranaga actor, he's very good and charismatic. I wish I could say the same about Blackthorne. I dont gel with the actor. This, and the writing, makes me not like him very much. Not to mention the fact that he loves the freedom of the seas while his wife is left at home. (Not unrealistic, I know. Still.) And I find it hard to believe Mariko is already breathing heavily for him, bravery or not. He must still have a very obnoxious body odor, too... I doubt he's already taken to daily hygiene. Speaking of Mariko, I wonder if she is secretly a female samurai... I forget what they were called. And what exactly happened 14 years ago. This episode was weaker than the first two. And yes, the dialog of the dudebros at their respective rudders was cringey... ETA: Regarding Mariko's fighting skills, I seem to remember from documentaries that noble ladies did learn to defend themselves, including weapon skills, so it might just be that. Still leaning towards samurai though.

I believe second priest dude (I'm still learning the names) only translated correctly because he knew Mariko could have corrected him, which is exactly why she was present. And Blackthorne didn't know that yet, she had not spoken. As for her letting the priest call her Lady Maria, I assumed it was because she respected him and the church? ETA: Apologies if this got already cleared up in later episode threads, I'm playing catch-up with the show.

I thought he learned about the Portugese ports, and specifically about Macao, from a friend. From the priest he learned that the Regents had no clue about it, so he now was aware he had valuable intel. As for Blackthorne not bringing it up right away, I think ge'd gotten wiser and didn't speak out of turn. Or maybe that's what I'd like to think, I'm not all that impressed with him so far...

Good point, particularly as they introduced two of them with the identical phrase about the character being integral to the twists and turns etc. I can't imagine Longoria being in the same category though. Meanwhile, I'm getting my Uma* fix unexpectedly as I've started watching the first season of Feud. *Yes, I really need to memorize the actress's name! I did look her up on Wikipedia the other day and noticed they listed her appearance on OMITB as "(first season year)-2023", as opposed to something like "ongoing", so I really think the whole season will take place far away from the Arconia, NY, and our beloved weirdos within.

Wow, so according to that article, it's probably not even just a couple of episodes in L.A. Honestly, even if I didn't consider NYC and the Arconia integral to the show - which I do -, L.A. is one of the places I'm least interested in exploring... And while I approve of Meryl staying on, the cast is getting really crowded, particularly with someone like Longoria. I'm ok with Silicon Valley dude and don't know the other additions to the cast, but they already have fantastic other side characters I wish we'd see more of, like Uma, plus my favorite police detective, etc. Or even revisit the houseplant homies... Sigh.

That's a nice welcome for Selena! Unfortunately, knowing that the season or part of it won't take place in NY has pretty much killed my interest.

I was bored throughout a lot of the episode, particularly the drawn-out Miles interrogation. I found myself rooting for Team Torture & Excessive Violence, which was a first for me. I'd had a bad feeling about Dani for quite a while. She was shown as incompetent for no other reason than to showcase the egotistical a-hole mavericks I'm supposed to root for, she was drawn out of retirement for the job, and she had her return speech in the previous ep. So I'm glad she survived and got her grandma moment. After a promising start, I found the season disappointing. Not as bad as the Danny debacle, so that's something. They often seem to build such interesting premises, explore compelling, unusual themes, only then to shy away from them and resort to tired old tropes. A fight for workers' rights which could conflict with the mission? Nah, no way to tell that story in acompelling way, you need a black market story and yet another dumbass maverick/ man child and an old space cowboy with his own agenda to make things interesting. Or a Danny, hell-bent on destroying a mission, or whatever. It's very frustrating On a brighter note, I loved how well and realistically they portrayed the Margo/ Aleida relationship, maybe he most interesting and wholesome one of the show. And they managed to tell it with so few words... due largely to Wren Schmidt's fantastic, restrained acting. The love and respect, the anger, the final hug... Lovely and all very in character. Btw, what did Margo whisper to Aleida during the hug? That she'd be ok? I couldn't understand. (I'm not impressed with the content of her final voiceover though. Yo, feelings! Shoutout to Ed, Miles, and Dev!) Margo could have used those Brazil contacts right about now... Oh well. I guess that's it for her. A US prison is still better than a gulag. Which I hope is where Irina will end her days. Of course, for all I know, Margo could be tried and executed for treason. Also, Chekov's literal gun was kind of amusing. All in all, very few people left for me to root for, let alone causes. It's all about greed (on all sides) and purely technological progress. Yawn.

Wtf?! I may not have been entirely happy with season 2, but it was still wildly successful. I'm less and less interested in checking out new shows because I just know if they're good, they will get cancelled no matter how many viewers they attract. I really don't get what these streaming services are doing. FWIW, here's the obligatory petition and renewal campaign: https://www.renewasacrew.com https://www.change.org/p/renew-our-flag-means-death

In my book, it is the person in the relationship who has the responsibility of being faithful, not the other person. Do I think it's great to start something with a married or otherwise-in-a-relationship person? Of course not. (And I hope I never would.) But again, it's not her problem. The myth that the free person, usually the woman, is to blame and wrecking the home of an otherwise perfect family is very persistent. Numerous movies where the affair is depicted as the evil woman seducing the man with her wiley womanly ways, and the man is unable to resist because man, and then when she is discarded, sometimes she literalyl goes psycho and wrecks the home, kills the family pets etc pp. And I noticed that in real life, when women discover their spouse has an affair, they usually blame the other woman. Still. Anyway, back to Peggy and her boss. Imho, it was usually he who initiated the improper behavior, beginning with opening his door to her half-naked (for the era). But even disregarding all of this... As her boss, it is again his responsibility to avoid anything happening. Imagine if Peggy's parents were not wealthy, and she really needed that job! Even being well off, she still loved her work and feels she can't continue without compromising herself.

Yes, but in typical Fellowes fashion, all the regular characters (except for some of the evil ones) are not racist. Quite unrealistic.