[S04.E09: I Know What You Did Last Summer]

5 hours ago, Iju said:

i have so many feelings about the sex scene. 1 (and most importantly), i just realized i can never see a single SPN sex scene because i freaking watch it with my mother and 15yr old sister. so there's that. i can say i'm not happy at all about that, hmph.

I wouldn't worry about it. They're short and really not much to them. Personally, I don't think you missed anything.

[S13.E12: Various and Sundry Villains]

9 hours ago, takalotti said:

Wait, Casmodeus has been checking in "every day"? Since when? This whole time that Cas has been prisoner, or just sorta recently? Because if he’s been checking in "every day" this whole time, then it makes even LESS sense that S&D didn’t update Casmodeus with finding Jack during the events in The Bad Place (if they had, Asmodeus would have shown up, so we know they didn’t),

I would guess that they did update fake Cass on finding Jack and losing him again. But, why would've Asmodeus have shown up. By the time they updated Cass it would've been all over. I mean, they found Jack and almost immediately had angels on their asses then ended up in alternate universes in a very short span of time. I don't think they had time to call Cass and tell them anything in the midst of it all. In fact, I would guess Asemodeus knows everything the Winchesters know, he just learns it after the fact.

5 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Okay, I confess. *I* don't know what fifth base is and I never even heard of it before this episode. And I've read tentacle porn. (AO3 tags have ruined me).

Google it!

[Spoilers With Speculation]

1 hour ago, Wayward Son said:

The more I think on it the more I think it’s just gonna be a pagan God or perhaps the Empty. I can’t think of how the “hungry” descriptor would fit an AU Guck since IIRC he doesn’t eat souls, flesh or anything like that? 

Well, he doesn't in our "dimension."  Judging by Amara, I think it likely he could if he chose to, though. 

6 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Weren't some of the Gods from 5x19 people-eating types?

All the pagan gods have been people-eating types. That's how they power up; through human sacrifice.

[Spoilers With Speculation]

24 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Gabriel can only be killed by an archangel using the arch angel blade.  Ketch knows he can't kill Gabriel.

Oh, I'm sure if the show wanted, there can be other ways to kill an archangel.

[Fun 'n' Games: Last One Standing]

Garth

[Spoilers With Speculation]

4 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

Episode 17 synopsis is out.

 

A hungry God with a capital G... Are we about to find out there is more than one Guck in addition to more than one archangel etc? Could it be a reference to the empty? Or am I reading too much into the use of the capital G and it’s just gonna be a pagan god. 

The "from another dimension" is what stood out to me. It could be a different universe Chuck? More likely a pagan god, but... .

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

Sounds like the start of a redemption arc for Ketch.

Or, that Ketch decides to try and kill Gabriel. More likely he lets him go, but... .

[S04.E07: It's the Great Pumpkin, Sam Winchester]

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

I guess I'm lost then because Gonzo's quoted iju and replied to them. I guess to me if she was replying to you she would have quoted you? But I shouldn't speak for Gonzo.  So I'll just bow out. :)

I realize Gonzo was replying to someone else, not me. Iju's comment was replying to my original comment. Gonzo asked a question and I felt like I needed to clarify my original comment.  So, I clarified. I guess I didn't realize I wasn't allowed to respond to anyone who wasn't directly quoting me? 

[S04.E07: It's the Great Pumpkin, Sam Winchester]

5 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

She was replying to iju, I'm pretty sure. Maybe the quotey thing is being weird.

Iju's comment was replying to my original comment.

[S04.E07: It's the Great Pumpkin, Sam Winchester]

31 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Are you saying that having a healthy sex drive makes Dean (or anyone) a pervert?

No, If you read the first post in the thread, I was saying when Dean was lusting after the teenager it skeeved me out--not with the computer, but after the apple bobbing incident when he's watching her ass and such. Then he had some comments on which cheerleaders were legal too that I found borderline gross. I never said Dean was a pervert, but he's a 30 year old man and was lusting after what he thought was a 16-year-old girl--this was before he knew she was a centuries-old witch.

At the time I said the comment--four or five years ago--there were multiple cases of 13- to 14-year-old girls being tossed around a group of 30-to 40-year-old men and then being dropped when they became of legal age in this supposedly forward-thinking and idyllic little community I live in. I knew a few of the girls and their stories were very sad and I remember being pissed off at local men and women--educated men and women--sitting around coffee shops blaming these little girls and saying it was all just natural harmless fun. What were these men supposed to do, those girls were just trash. 

Anyway, I know the show wasn't saying Dean would actually have sex with a teenage girl, they were just making a joke. It just hit a little too close to home so I commented on how I just didn't find it funny.

[I'd Like To Thank the Academy... Someday: Awards, Nominations and Recognition]

27 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

This one bugs me, too. Dick and Davy Perez essentially copied Reservoir Dogs. Not sure why that garners best direction  I got what they were doing so I don't need a lecture on what that style is. or was doing.  IMO, it works in a feature length film. Not in a 42 minute commercial filled TV episode. Of the SPN episodes in s12, I would have given best direction to Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets, Asa Fox, Regarding Dean, or Twigs and Twine and Tasha Banes.  All Along the Watchtower had major pacing issues so I won't include that one either.

I'm not sure I'd say it was best direction of the season simply because I don't care for that style, myself, but I can see why it was nominated. Spleight was given a script that required he adapt certain Tarantino techniques and he did his homework and used those techniques well. The direction may not have been completely original, but I would say it was creative and, most of all, it's memorable simply because it is was something different than the other 22 episodes of the season. 

I would've picked the Goat Dude episode for best direction, myself. There was something striking about the look of the episode and I think Phil Scriggia did a great job of capturing the feeling of a dying small town in middle America. But, then again, it's a visual style I happen to be drawn to. No gimmicks and fancy visual effects, just simple camera work. 

[S04.E02: Are You There God? It's me, Dean Winchester]

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

Make that 2000 years which makes Dean even more skeptical.

Oops! I meant 2000 years. Stupid fingers not hitting the keys hard enough.

[S04.E02: Are You There God? It's me, Dean Winchester]

7 hours ago, Iju said:

he didn't immediately believe in angels as soon as he saw castiel though, he still said that he could be a demon in this episode.

Of course he didn't believe Castiel immediately, that would've been foolish of Dean, IMO. No one has seen an angel in over 200 years, I'd have been skeptical too.

[S04.E02: Are You There God? It's me, Dean Winchester]

7 hours ago, Iju said:

it's just weird to me. when castiel said that Lucifer was real too, he was shook. like um dean where do you think all these demons come from lol. but maybe he really does think they act on their own and have no leader.

According to the demon Dean was trapped with in Sin City, demons do act on their own and did not have a leader until Yellow Eyes brought them together and gave them a common purpose. After he died, there was chaos among the demons until Lilith stepped up and brought them back together again. Lucifer's been off the board for eons at this point; he's been locked in a cage where no one can get to him.

Like I said, IMO, Dean believes in what he sees. Lucifer is no more real to him at this point than God is because he's never seen them. He's not saying there isn't a possibility they do exist, but until Dean meets either of them, they are an idea, not a reality to him. 

I think this season will be interesting for you to watch. I think you might find both Heaven and Hell are not exactly what you think they are.

[Dean Winchester: aka Squirrel]

OMG!! I forgot it was PIE day. Now I'm going to go sob in my room because I didn't get even one forkful of deliciousness today. 

I need a time machine to write this terrible wrong! ;)

[S04.E02: Are You There God? It's me, Dean Winchester]

8 hours ago, Iju said:

and as for the last comment, that's exactly what i'm talking about. dean doesn't want this "God" because he has that same idea that many have, if God exists then he must be and do A B and C. if he hasn't, he's not real. he has the same fairly tale view of a God who always saves him, angels who are by his side, everything keeps him safe.

IMO, it's really just as simple as Dean believes in what he can see. He didn't believe in angels until one showed himself to Dean. Now he believes in angels. Dean will only believe there is a God, IMO, if and/or when God reveals himself to Dean. Having faith in that God is different than believing he exists. 

[I'd Like To Thank the Academy... Someday: Awards, Nominations and Recognition]

53 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Sticking to that, can you honestly say that the 2017 episodes of Supernatural are the best written shows in television?

I know you didn't ask me, but I say I don't think S12 was the best season of Supernatural, but I think the writing was actually quite good and nuanced compared to most shows out there these days. I think there were pacing issues and some production issues, but IMO the writing was pretty good for the most part. Of course there are some episodes I could've lived without, but that's true of every single show I've ever watched.

If you want me to compare it to shows of old, though, no, I wouldn't say Supernatural is the best written show ever on television. But these days, TV isn't really about the writing, IMO. It's about pushing boundaries, being shocking and seeing how many effects you can cram into one itty bitty episode. So, yeah, I find Supernatural exceeds most shows because they still to put care and feeding into the writing, IMO.

2 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Is it better than Lucifer or Agents of Shield? Arguable, I can't say because I don't watch those shows. Is it better than GoT, This Is Us, Stranger Things?....Not really. 

Personally, I find that GoT is sorely overrated. I do enjoy the show, but not for the writing. I love the production design and how great the show looks--and I enjoy a couple of the actors immensely. But, I'd say Supernatural's writing is actually far more nuanced and layered--even now in it's 13th season--than Game of Thrones ever has been.

This is Us, I only watched about half of the first season but thought the writing was terrible. The acting is superb, but I couldn't take the maudlin writing or that I felt like I'd seen this show on TV at least two or three times before.  

Stranger Things? I watched the first season and liked a lot about it--mostly the kids they cast and the nostalgia--but, again, I think the writing kinda sucked. It meandered all over the place and piddled out into nothing by the end. I still haven't worked up the interest to watch the second season.

Going further than what you bolded:

• The writing for Sherlock is terrible, IMO. I enjoyed the first series enough, but by the fourth I just found the plotting lazy and annoying and the acting isn't all that great either, IMO.
• Agents of Shield: I only watched one season and found it to be typical superhero TV. There was nothing really wrong with it, but I think SPN blows them out of the water in the writing department.
• Lucifer, never watched; never felt compelled to.
• The Blacklist: watched quite a bit of the first season, but it just wasn't for me. I'd didn't think there was anything particularly interesting about their writing, though. I'd take Supernatural at it's worst any day of the week.
• The Good Doctor? I watched the first season and I think the writing is actually quite good for this show, but I haven't been compelled to go back for some reason. Have no idea why. Probably just got really busy and if something isn't in my face when I have time to watch, then I'll probably watch something else that is. But, I'd put the writing for it on par with Supernatural even though it's kinda like Game of Thrones and like trying to compare apples and oranges.

So, yeah, I would say that Supernatural's writing stacks up against most shows out there and I can see why it was first on this particular list. A differently list, though, and I might have a different opinion. 

But I do agree with @SueB, this board is by no means a representation of fandom as a whole. There are plenty of people who are happy with the show and just happen to visit a different site--or are happy to just watch the show and only read other people's opinions rather than comment themselves. And, in my experience, the unhappy have far more to say than the happy.

[S04.E02: Are You There God? It's me, Dean Winchester]

I don't really think of Dean as an atheist, but more a realist. I think he has faith in many things and believes there is something bigger than him out there, he just doesn't put his faith in those things that haven't proven to deserve his faith. 

14 hours ago, Iju said:

also dean refusing to believe in God was just stupid from the get go, i hate that reoccurring part in the plot. besides the fact that demons are literally fallen angels, they use latin chants that use Jesus and the name of God and use HOLY WATER for pete's sake. if there is evil in this world it has to be good. it's just logic.

 

While I agree there is a certain balance to the universe and if there is evil there should be good too, I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that angels are good. This is Supernatural where the "lore" isn't always the truth and, generally, the supernatural is bad.  As I've said many times before, logic and reason really have nothing to do with this show. ;)

13 hours ago, Iju said:

again that's what makes dean stubborn. as soft as sam is, he's more on the logical side than dean. sam has never seen angels either but it's just logical to assume that if there are demons, there are angels. 

Well, I'd say Sam needs to believe there is a God and something bigger than him; Dean doesn't. I don't think it has anything to do with logic on Sam's part, myself.

[SuperNormal: Public Appearances, Tweets, Media And Other Social Media Of The SPN Cast]

14 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

It's like the entertainment circuit suddenly woke up and realized there's this little show that's outlived most others and it's not even ensemble and has this huge passionate fan base that's done awesome fundraising and stuff and has these charismatic and talented actors and steady ratings.

Its about time we got noticed. 

Yes, it's good for our guys to get their faces out there. 

Yeah, that's been my thinking too. The boys seem to be very surprised by all this sudden attention too. I definitely don't think it's been planned PR to start getting their faces out ther in preparation for the end of the show as much as them taking advantage of the industry suddenly taking notice of them. That's not to say that S14 won't be the last and/or they're also preparing for that, but I just get the feeling they're enjoying being noticed after 13 years of hard work.

[SuperNormal: Public Appearances, Tweets, Media And Other Social Media Of The SPN Cast]

I think The Talk is likely just due to them being in LA for Paleyfest and will probably just generally promote the show.

If they are doing an announcement at Paleyfest, I don't think they'd want to bum out their audience by telling them the show is ending. If there is an announcement, I suspect it will be something fun...like another crossover event or that Wayward and Supernatural have both been picked up.

TBH, I think they're getting so much press over Paleyfest because they're screening the Scooby episode. 

[I'd Like To Thank the Academy... Someday: Awards, Nominations and Recognition]

1 hour ago, Wayward Son said:

If it helps, the impala still would not have won even without him.

Not that I really care one way or another, but we don't know which way the ones who voted for Lucifer's Corvette would've voted if it wasn't on the ballot. It could be all those votes went to Baby and they won by a landslide; or it could be the Arrow Cave got them all; or they split between all the choices. We really don't have enough data to say one way or the other here.

[Ratings And Scheduling: I Can't Do This Alone]

35 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

I don't think we've ever got an 0.5 before have we?

Yes, last spring when all the ratings on the network tanked. I don't think the 0.5 is anything to worry about--it's spring and the ratings always decline some in spring--as long as we stay in relation to the other shows on the network and hold our No. 2 spot, I think we'll be okay.

37 minutes ago, scribe95 said:

Viewers were up a bit. Which demo do we focus on again? The 0.5 or 0.6?

It's the 18-49 demo that advertisers are most interested in. 

[S13.E15: A Most Holy Man]

21 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

My question is:  if Chuck is off partying with Amara, all the archangels are either dead or MIA, and all the angels are too busy reorganizing/fighting with each other, who was it who was watching (and saving) the priest?  Isn't it more likely that it was just random chance than a result of his faith?

Isn't that what faith is all about though? I mean, yes, I would say it was just random chance, but I'm a heathen who has no faith. 

Just now, Mulva said:

About halfway through the episode, it occurred to me that they could have just tried to steal the blood directly from Greenstreet instead of the mobsters.

Oh, I wondered why they didn't think of that the moment Sam got all antsy about being hired thieves--seemed like if you were going to steal, might as well steal the item you actually need rather than something you don't. But, I'm weird that way.  I guess since Greenstreet didn't have the blood, it was all moot in the end anyway, though.

7 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

I think if they managed to avoid the Leviathan, mobsters are nothing to worry about.  I know they had to take some unhappy measures (like hiding Baby), but other than a few minor changes, they didn't hide very much.  And there were a lot more monsters than mobsters, with more power.  

Yeah, I'm not sure why Sam or Dean would be particularly scared of the mob after they've went up against angels, demons, the Devil himself, Leviathans and God's angry little sister...the friendliest mob guys ever really don't seem like much of anything to me. Dabb seems to have a hard time getting the stakes high enough to build the tension. It was the same thing with First Blood last season. 

[S13.E15: A Most Holy Man]

31 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I feel like a moron.  Maybe my mind was wandering.  Maybe I was just living int he moment.  Maybe it's because I'm not catholic.  But, I never gave one though to the priest being the most holy man.  So, I can't really fault SAm and DEan for not doing so.  

I wouldn't say I fault Sam and Dean for not considering the priest--but he was a little too good and too faithful that I find a bit curious neither considered it--I fault the writing. I think the scene would've played out better if Sam started talking about how he looked the priest up and felt like he was someone doing good things and then Dean's line of needing one last thing from him--cut to Dean holding the little jar of blood in the bunker. I think requiring a literal title from the Pope was just a bit too...well, literal, for my taste and made the scene a bit too long and tedious with all the unnecessary yammering. 

[S13.E15: A Most Holy Man]

I think they should refrigerate that little bottle of blood before it congeals... .

Well that was entirely unexpected. I can't say it was bad exactly--they did good with the noir look and all (kudos to Amanda Tapping on the direction), but lacked a certain core Supernatural feel to it somehow. It was strangely appealing at times, but there really was no mystery and the episode never built into anything. It just meandered from one not-so-bad guy to the next and then the bad guys got dead. 

Anyway, I think this could've been a stellar episode with just a bit more care and feeding. I don't think it was a bad idea, just not a fully realized one.

11 hours ago, Katy M said:

I don't know why Sam was so outraged that they should be thieves or whatever. They did the same thing just a few epis ago in Scorpion and the Frog. And they also did it (with complete innocents, which was not the case here) in Meet the New Boss.

[...]

That was conveniently convenient that the priest was named a most holy man by the pope. It makes me wonder how these spells can tell different blood types apart. Like how is a virgin's blood different, and a most holy man's and a MOL legacy. Whatever

First, yeah, Sam's attitude was completely nonsensical. From day one, they've been con men who work around the rules to get the job done. What was different about this one? They were stealing from the mob? Please!

And second, of course, I knew he would be "the most holy man" from the moment they found him on the ground, but I think they could've--and should've--figured that out by themselves considering his actions. It was kinda dumb that they needed him to literally have the title. Is there no subtlety left anymore?

[Spoilers With Speculation]

18 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

So with one day to go what’s everyone final bets, who is the holy Man referenced in the episode title? 

My bet is still on Dean especially after the reveal it’s the blood of a holy man required and Dean’s blood was already the key ingredient of a spell this season. 

What about the rest of you?

I'm banking on it being neither Winchester, nor random. I don't know who it will be, but I'm not so sure it will be random.

Oh, and BTW, I don't think they're stealing the blood. I think they're stealing something that will get them to the blood; like an artifact of some sort. But Sam's attitude is nothing short of perplexing. I mean, they aren't thieves generally, but Sam is acting like he did back in S1 about the credit card scamming...which, I was under the impression he'd grown up and accepted the way of their world years ago? 

Anyhoo, can't beat a little chicanery! ;)