Tikichick

It just occurred to me that the transfer of assets into LLCs in Anna's name will likely be raised as a negative factor in a bond hearing, particularly if the timing was in the wake of the raid on the car lot.

I haven't seen anything to demonstrate that he's trying to control Jill on this issue. Doesn't mean it's not happening, simply means I haven't seen anything.

Don't forget it's not just lawyers. Even though the lead attorney on the case specializes in these types of cases, he's not going to be putting in the legwork on the data dump of discovery. They will be paying expert(s) for that. Their fees are not cheap. At a minimum in a case like this I would expect the initial doc and data review to cost 30k, possibly more depending on the volume of information. If the expert(s) are going to testify at trial they are also well paid for their time, much of which will include waiting for their turn to be called in, and they will be paid accommodations and per diems as they will no doubt come from somewhere else. Data exchanged must also include things that could be considered or proven exculpatory as well. The prosecution is required to turn over any evidence that the defense could point to as demonstrating innocence, and the defense experts are going to be going over everything with a fine tooth comb for that purpose as well. Experts for this kind of technical deep dive are not cheap.

IMO it has a lot to do with the reason Derrick sought JB out in the first place. I suspect Derrick was in a place to really be feeling the absence of his father in a palpable way, it led him to seek a spiritual path, where maybe he felt inadequate in that area, eventually seeking out a mentor with a reputation of great faith who happened a father to 19. It probably seemed ideal and too good to be true. He didn't see that, wasn't prepared for it, until he hit the brick wall at mach 10. Seems like the JB unmasking hit Derrick precisely where his big boo boo already was.

I'm unable to assess Derrick's need to be in control from this issue. It seems to me that for Derrick JB is now like whatever it was that made the guy change from an ordinary person into the Hulk. Like waving a red cape in front of Derrick. If that ever improves it's not going to be anytime soon IMO. So far nothing's attracted my attention to suggest that Derrick is operating in a controlling position with Jill. From what I've seen so far, Jill's as liberated as she chooses in regards to her husband and in regards to the customs and beliefs she grew up with. Seems to be more akin to, you can take the girl out of the country, but you can't take the country out of the girl.

Not offering a bond hearing at all absolutely would be a point any appellate attorney worth his salt will include in a bid for an appeal. It won't be the only factor pointed to I'm sure. If you're familiar with the appellate process you know that they swing on a very intricate web of minutiae and technicality and really aren't about what most people commonly assume. Being forced to remain locked up without even being afforded the opportunity of a bail hearing so that you can have unfettered access to assist your attorney in your defense? Yeah, that's a pretty key appellate issue that's going to be raised. Note, that's a completely different thing from saying a judge MUST grant the bail. I certainly didn't say Josh had to be released, far from it. The insular, self employed, asset laden, covert financial network of this family will definitely cut against his release. They also have to tread gingerly as far as family ties as far as father of seven, tight knit family, etc. given the number of minors, the number of residences and properties, etc. Those types of things that normally cut one way in a bail hearing can also cut the other in a case like this. I don't work in a federal setting so I wouldn't hazard a guess on how a judge will come down on the issue of bond. Everybody's been hanging on every word of every statement released by family members. Make no mistake, at the very least JB & M's got approved, if not outright composed, by Josh's lawyer -- in no small part specifically with an eye to the posture that can be presented to the judge at a bail hearing. His attorney made damn sure they didn't say anything the prosecution could present to the judge and lead to a denial of bail. I suspect everyone in the family was asked to either remain silent or was given very specific boundaries it would be appreciated if they could remain within if they made a statement.

I think the cryptic comments and tweets are signs of an enraged individual who has thus far been stopped from saying what he really wants to see. Animal howling in pain, the fury of a woman scorned -- that's what I think is bubbling in Derrick. I think what we see is what he is absolutely incapable of keeping silent. What I don't think we're seeing is that overall he is effectively being silenced none the less, whether it looks like it to us observers or not. I understand the common perception is that they've made the break, they got paid off, they're split from the family, there's nothing stopping him from dropping the pretense and just saying what he wants to say. I think he is still being silenced in a way that he's not happy with. What's the only logical reason he still isn't fully speaking out? Obligation to Jill. Jill hasn't just turned off her feelings for her family. Jill hasn't even abandoned teachings of her family that she understands she can't even defend, but still she clings to them. She hasn't given up her feelings for her family. She may not want a relationship with all of them, but I do believe she very much wants a relationship with several of them. JB has been able to control that still. Depending on the fallout of current events JB may have lost leverage to maintain the iron grip on many of the siblings. IMO the sticking point is going to be that Jill truly loves JB still, even if it's true she's furious with him. IDK how that ever works out cleanly given JB's need to control and Derrick's fatal wound in that regard. In the end I don't think it will be Derrick who tells the tale publicly. I do think that whoever does will have gained an understanding of the financial misdeeds from Derrick.

The judge may have absolutely zero intention of offering bail, or may already know that if offered it will be at such a level that JB will absolutely swallow hard before committing the necessary assets. Not offering the hearing at all could be an issue at the appellate phase, where an appeals lawyer could use it to demonstrate the Court did not appreciate he was innocent until proven guilty and therefore a conviction needs to be overturned and at least remanded for a new hearing. I'm fascinated by the fact in a case like this where data is key and massive amounts of data would be expected that the pretrial is only scheduled one week before the scheduled start of trial. Even in ordinary circumstances that is surprising. Under current conditions where courts are facing a tsunami of criminal backlog in particular as courts attempt to resume normal operations it shocks me that it's scheduled this way, knowing that pretrials frequently bring up issues that require rescheduling of trials. In a case like this I'd expect the defense to be informing the judge at pretrial that they need more time to prepare and go through the significant volume of evidence. Courts are operating at levels these days where they cannot afford a hole in a calendar because the time allocated for a case sits open because a case had to be rescheduled.

I've said for a while now that I think Derrick was completely devastated when he understood who JB really is, and that disillusionment and hurt fueled his rage. He didn't approach the family seeking Jill, or a bride for that matter. He sought out JB as a mentor and spiritual guide, I think from a very sincere and vulnerable place. Sometimes the best we can hope for when we suffer a trauma that strikes at our core is a very gnarly scar. Derrick is far from that level of healing IMO. I'm also hesitant to definitively state that Derrick has been lying, retconning, etc. about what happened regarding being on the show because the telephone game has been distorted for so long by so many over social media that it's pretty difficult to sort out at this point -- especially since distanced observers on SM have zero firsthand info. What I would bank on is JB acting in JB's best interests, even if it was taking directly from his own children. That has been made possible by JB 's perpetual headship, and I have no doubt he's completely invested in seeing to it that it continues that way. I wouldn't put it past JB to be leveraging control over many of the adult children via finances. He's the guy who engineered the system which stacked the deck against them to be unable to support themselves in the first place! He enjoys the lady bountiful pretense -- and the accolades for his business acumen and financial wizardry. The previous Josh downturns applied pressures that made it necessary for him to do some fancy steppin' to keep the farce from being revealed. Some of the married ones faced pressures and suddenly had questions. Derrick had enough education and experience to understand way too much -- and was completely leveled that the guy he put his trust in to guide him on a godly path was a phony. Then his mentor had the nerve to try to play hardball to get everyone in line. No wonder JB attempted to erect a firewall between Derrick and the others. Derrick could connect the dots between their complaints and what they just couldn't understand. Josh's fallout might have knocked down that firewall now, too. I'm actually a little surprised that this turn of events hasn't spurred Derrick to start dropping cold, hard facts openly. I do believe they will come out, but at this point it's anyone's guess which Duggar or Duggar adjacent gets angry enough to spill the whole cup of tea for everyone to see. I suspect that if we on SM were really privy to hard facts we'd only be dragging Derrick about abhorrent tweets that have absolutely nothing to do with the family.

Clearly. He does however tend to live as much of his existence as possible in spaces he creates and controls, therefore ensuring he's always the biggest donkey braying the loudest, with all the "smaller" donkeys expected to listen and nod their heads in agreement. Watch what happens whenever he's in a place where his money, fame, connections are meaningless and participation requires knowledge he doesn't have, forcing him to take instruction like he's one of the other donkeys. It's obvious very quickly the ass doesn't know what to do with himself.

I doubt law enforcement would inform the family per se. I've started to consider if possibly Josiah was subpoenaed to testify in front of the grand jury, giving some insight into what was happening to the family as a whole, or parts of the family that were unaware, etc. ETA That's awkwardly worded. Not that Josiah would have testified as to the family, but being subpoenaed and testifying would have offered the family some insight into what was happening regarding the raid. With hindsight it's kind of noticeable that within the past couple months there have been some noticeable changes from several of the married couples, or tenseness. And that last episode that aired, the "Easter" episode, was just Twilight Zone. JD and Abbie were distinctly there to participate, but not a single comment aired from either one? The awkwardness was palpable. Jessa and Ben seem very tense. Joy and Austin were discussed for a little while, although that also could have been related to their daughter needing to be examined by a specialist. Jinger and Jeremy have been a trainwreck it seems no one can stop gawking at. I doubt we'll ever know who knew what when, but it is interesting.

I've started to wonder if they actually got looped into Josh's situation over the past month or two and that's helping propel this wild change in behaviors and attitudes, and lack of attempt to promote the book at all? If you think about it, they're not the only married couple to make some unexplained changes of direction over the past couple months. If it's true that charges were brought after a grand jury hearing I'm wondering if Josiah happened to be subpoenaed to testify -- leading to the abrupt disappearance from social media from their family?

Somewhere Jeremy has literal steam coming from his ears!

Channel and time, please!

I for one would dearly love to observe the dynamic between JB, his regular legal stooges and the showstopper who really knows what he's talking about. I know the regular stooges are attorneys and can handle some legal matters, but they're of JB's ilk, or at least enough where he's comfortable enough to call upon them to conduct business. Are they smart enough to recognize that they need to shut up, get out of the way and let the showstopper do his job? Will they convey that to JB if he has doubts and thinks he'd like to stick his oar in? Contemplating this really amuses me because I know JB's personality doesn't take well to not being able to dominate and control how things are going to happen, or being face to face with the idea he's not the smartest guy in the room either.

IDK about feds specifically, but my local experience here is that prosecutors will not make deals on anything regarding sexually abusing children. It's so beyond the pale of civilized society that it's unquestionably recognized as being impossible to make deals if you want to survive politically. I have no idea if the political aspect is equally acute in the federal arena or not.

I had asked about the COO back when I first heard discussion of the warehouse. I believe someone stated that because where they live isn't technically under the jurisdiction of the local municipality they didn't have to obtain one and someone else suggested that JB probably handled it by using his pull with local officials. If the warehouse situation is as discussed, one way or another they are going to be forced to rectify the living quarters, either by CPS home study, or local officials being unable or unwilling to cooperate with JB anymore. ETA Another aspect of the warehouse I had questioned before went beyond windows. It's a portion of a building, a building that from pictures seems to imply is being used for other purposes, including activities regarding vehicles, which have emissions that can be deadly. There are specific ways that the living space has to be separated from the garage-type space to protect the occupants from vehicle emissions. I don't know all the technical aspects throwing up a wall alone won't do it, there are specific requirements to manage that. There also has to be a full height firewall between the garage-type space and the living quarters all the way up to the roof. I may not know the technical details, but I am aware of the need for these safety protections. Does anyone think any of the Duggars knows and understands the technical requirements and how to achieve them better than me? I personally doubt it.

I absolutely have no clue. My suspicion on the money is that JB has squeezed a lot of the show money to invest ever more in real estate. So over time it's very likely the real estate earnings could definitely be the major revenue driver, however in my mind it's likely the show made a lot of that investment possible in the first place. Of course JB's real estate empire originated with his parents originally, so it's not as if he produced it off the sweat of his brow in quite the way they like to mythologize. I think the other business ventures we've heard about like car lots are largely scam operations, which is apparently justified if you're fleecing the godless heathens and not true believers.

First off, if the windowless warehouse abode is true, I don't suspect that will be an option much longer if CPS comes a calling and does a home study. I'm not sure the TTH will be an option CPS would approve either due to the en mass sleeping arrangements and children being required to bunk in common spaces with grown adults. That means a new residence may be necessary. There are LLCs in Anna's name apparently, but how easily will they be liquidated and available to procure new housing? Even once housing is secured, food, clothing, utilities for that many is going to be expensive. CPS is also going to push for all medical visits to be up to date and probe the education being provided. Any way you slice it, that many kids is expensive. It's pretty clear, even amongst a family where it seems no one is gainfully employed, Josh definitely didn't add to the pot. Joe's family is rapidly expanding. Jessa's getting ready for number four with not much evidence of a steady income stream coming in. Sure, they should have been making money off the show, but I like many assume it went into a communal pot controlled and doled out by JB as he chose. I don't really think any of them should bank on the show providing anymore -- despite the siblings bearing absolutely no responsibility for what Josh did.

IMO JB is too greedy and territorial to have revealed that level of information to anyone and risk anybody having the possibility to snatch the keys to the kingdom. A lot of potential financially related information Josh might have had some knowledge of at one point is now becoming ever more remote and very likely the statute of limitations has tolled. At this point Josh's more likely threat would be mud he could publicly fling, however by virtue of his charges it's not likely respectable, mainstream media of any standing would give him the time of day.

What's interesting is that, especially when the sons marry, it's very nebulous as to how they are able to support their households apart from the Duggar teet. Every baby Josh and Anna added definitely was felt by all the rest relying on the family grift, because there's absolutely no way he provided anything beyond but headaches, heartaches and shame for his family.

Aside from Jana, who at her age is definitely very much an outlier in their cult norms as a 30 year old single woman, are there any other Duggar females of marriage age right now? The fact that a string of girls got married then and it's a line of the boys marrying now might be more about who's actually of marital age when. Back when the first scandals hit JD seemed destined to be an outlier like his twin.

Double jeopardy protection was intended initially to protect citizens from government harassment and potential persecution of endless prosecution, rightfully so. If there is a way to demonstrate the 3 murders are part of one criminal transaction and that the prosecution had the information about the third murder and chose to hold back on the charge as a deliberate end run around jeopardy attaching it will likely be overturned. Sometimes there can be what seems like an exception to that idea if there's a crime spree that crosses jurisdictions. In that case one jurisdiction may choose to go first with prosecution, with the second waiting to proceed until the other jurisdiction concludes its case. It's common especially when dealing with substance abusers who are deep in active use to see bursts of criminal charges happening very close in proximity to one another, yet in fact be completely different cases. There's no problem with jeopardy attaching in those cases because they aren't considered part of the same criminal transaction, even if they're committing the same crime repeatedly, i.e. breaking into homes over the course of a month or two.

Theoretically JB could stash Josh in one of the properties he owns elsewhere -- provided it meets any other requirements about proximity to minors. As far as Jana being his monitor, that would be pretty outrageous after the whole side hugs, accountability partner, chaperone charade they've preached for how many years. Not to mention she shouldn't be ready at JB's command to be deployed when and where he dictates.

I don't know about anyone else, but purely based on observed personality traits I would absolutely tune in to watch 100% unfiltered and candid fly on the wall views of how this plays out behind closed doors with Austin and Joy,