Jack vs. Other Immortals: Apparently There Can Be More Than One

[Luckylyn]

I couldn't resist the Highlander reference in the title.  @Captanne gave me the idea to start a thread dedicated to comparing Jack to other immortal characters.   After giving it some thought, there has been a lot of tv immortals mostly broody.  Is it my imagination or is it rare that anyone loves becoming immortal.  I feel like Jack could have been that joyful immortal but Torchwood is not designed to allow the characters happiness.  Jack in particular has been tortured physically and emotionally to a ridiculous degree.

 

I think Highlander did a good job of showing the good and bad of being immortal.  There were tragedies that were inevitable like Duncan losing Tessa and Methos losing Alexa but then you have a character like Amanda who is going to have fun with her long life even if she does also suffer bad experiences too.

 

With vampires, the good ones tend to be miserable about what they are and the bad ones are the ones who love their life.  Jessica on True Blood's thrilled reaction to becoming a vampire was a rare thing.

 

Henry on Forever keeps himself isolated to prevent his secret from getting out and I think to protect himself (it's implied his wife left him and thier son).  The only connection his allowed himself until recently is he's son Abe who worries what will become of his father when Abe dies of old age while Henry continues on and on.

Edited November 30, 2014 by Luckylyn

[Swansong]

On Buffy it seemed like if you were a good vampire (Angel) immortality was a broody drag where you didn't get to have any fun, but if you were a bad vampire then immortality was kind of a blast. Torchwood and I guess 2005 Doctor Who seemed to adopt this philosophy in that both the Doctor and more so Jack seem to treat longevity or immortality as an endless drag and chase a way anything good in their lives so they can brood some more about it. Jack in particular never seems to get to enjoy anything really. All his relationships suck or he can't seem to appreciate them when they potentially don't, he never seems to have any fun in his life. He lives in a tiny miserable hovel. He's a gorgeous, sex god who rarely seems to have sex. Just broods about how everyone outlives him. I think that's why I liked Highlander because the immortals could be broody and had tragedies, but they also seemed to be able to have fun some of the time. The Middleman had an immortal guy in one story. He took the have fun with it route, but of course he was also a baddy.

 

Definitely the trope seems to be that becoming immortal is a curse you have to suffer miserably through, which makes it seem like a self-fulfilling prophecy. In that bad things happen so you focus only on the bad and never really appreciate the good which reinforces the idea that immortality is bad because nothing good happens. But when something good happens you're too busy brooding to enjoy it and then it's gone which makes you miserable. lol.

[Luckylyn]

Definitely the trope seems to be that becoming immortal is a curse you have to suffer miserably through, which makes it seem like a self-fulfilling prophecy. In that bad things happen so you focus only on the bad and never really appreciate the good which reinforces the idea that immortality is bad because nothing good happens. But when something good happens you're too busy brooding to enjoy it and then it's gone which makes you miserable. lol.

That sums it up really well.  Immortals can't enjoy the present fun because they are always thinking about the inevitable end.  Jack couldn't let himself enjoy what he found in Ianto because he was anticipating the end.  Pre-Bad Wolf Jack was full of life and Post-Bad Wolf the joy has dimmed so much.  It sucks that the trope lets the villainous immortals have fun while the good ones have to brood.

[Captanne]

I think, because RTD crafted Jack after the RL Barrowman (who is full of life and loves love, apparently), Jack is the most tragic immortal.  Doomed to forever seek love and, by his own definition of self*, lose it.

 

WAH.

 

*By this, I mean, we are to understand from Doctor Who that Jack will be at the End of the Universe as the Face of Boe (open to debate, I know -- but I don't debate it.  I'm satisfied with taking it as canon that Jack is the Face of Boe.)

Edited November 30, 2014 by Captanne

[Featherhat]

Jack is the Face of Boe for me, no question. No matter how many times RTD tried to walk it back or joke it off. It makes total sense, and provides a good explanation for why yet another person is willing to sacrifice themselves for the Doctor's half baked ideas (Gridlock) other than just "because he just generally assumes moral authority. And I whilst I have issues with S3 I like the idea of a Jack that knows both Martha and the Doctor well, knowing that they are at the beginning of their adventures which lead to his old self again whilst he is dying.