Episodes You Changed Your Mind About!

[amensisterfriend]

Which episodes did you start up loving and end up kind of ambivalent about? Which ones were you initially 'meh' on and ended up loving? Do some episodes hold up better or worse than expected with the passage of time, multiple rewatches and the knowledge of what comes later in the series? I'm eager to hear your thoughts! 

[junienmomo]

I'm rapidly changing my mind about the whole first season.

The low production values made it look ugly, and the inconsistencies as they found their voice bugged me more than I was enjoying the story.

Now I'm starting to see how the L&L storyline was demonstrating more sexual tension than seasons 2 and 3, and that even Lorelai could see the possibility in Luke.

[amensisterfriend]

I totally agree that S1 has a lot of really blatant 'will they/won't they?!' sexual tension between Luke and Lorelai, which is actually surprising given the presence of Max (ugh) and Rachel and our knowledge that L/L don't actually get together until the very end of S4 :)

 

Speaking of S1, That Damn Donna Reed is an episode that I've done a total 180 on. I remembered hating it for the 'Rory as homemaker to placate Dean' stuff, and even the 'lost chick' scenes seemed kind of dopey to me and characteristic of the clunky lack of subtlety that characterizes S1 as compared to S2-S4. Recently, though, I rewatched it and was shocked by how much I loved it. I love Luke being open about his dad, the chemistry between Luke and Lorelai was among the best it was throughout the entire series IMO, and even the 'Rory as Donna Reed' stuff was a lot better (both funnier and more interesting) than I'd remembered. It left me with that happy post-viewing feeling elicited by my very favorite GG episodes. 

 

Thanks to the many Forgiveness and Stuff fans here, my opinion of that episode has improved for me as well, though parts are still a bit melodramatic and After School Special-ish for my taste. Similarly, you guys have helped me to go from just mildly liking to flat out loving Dead Uncles and Vegetables. I doubt any of you have the power to make me love P.S. I Lo..., Love Daisies and Troubdaours, Sadie Sadie or Keg Mex, though! ;) 

 

Let the Games Begin is another episode that I liked well enough when I first saw it in an 'okay, yet another good Plaid years episode...what's next?' sort of way, but that 'like' has changed to pure, passionate love :) Such brilliant acting and writing here IMO. 

 

I've changed my mind a a bit about There's the Rub. When I first saw it, I immediately ranked it among my top five GG episodes of the entire series. And while I still love the Paris/Jess/Rory scenes beyond the telling of it (and many other scenes as well!), the Emily/Lorelai stuff is more exhausting than captivating for me now that i know just how very, very often their 'two steps forwards, five steps back' dance was repeated throughout the series. Plus, I just CAN'T with Dean in this episode! 

 

I've also lost just a little love for The Lorelais First Day at Yale. It will always have a special place in my GG-loving heart, and I've watched it a scary number of times (this could be the reason for my becoming a bit weary of it!), but with repeated viewings the endless mattress blather, the awkward howling scene and the exaggerated stuff with the divorce attorneys all annoy me a lot more than they used to. And speaking of First Days, The Lorelais' First Day at Chilton is now harder for me to love based in large part on the ridiculous contrivance re. Lorelai "having to" wear that ridiculous outfit. I know that's ridiculous, but it really irks! 

 

And since I never get around to talking about later seasons...

 

Come Home and Women of Questionable Morals have improved for me to the point where they're both solidly in the 'love' category. 21 Is the Loneliest Number has some great L/L scenes, but otherwise it wasn't even a fraction as good as I'd remembered it. And a surprising amount of S7 improved for me with a second and third viewing...as long as I kept my expectations low and my hand near the fast forward button!

Edited October 2, 2014 by amensisterfriend

[Guest]

I've started liking Dead Uncles and Vegetables thanks to you people too. At first, it was always on my "worst of the season" list. Now I kind of look forward to it.

 

I majorly changed my mind on Diorama. When I first saw it, I think I proclaimed it the worst episode ever (of course, at that point, I had yet to experience the horrors awaiting me in Seasons 6 and 7).  Now I actually like it.  The scenes with Kirk living with Lorelai make me laugh and so does drunk Lane.  The stupid puns throughout the episode are some of the worst parts, and really any scene with Dean.

[TyranAmiros]

Road Trip to Harvard.  I never got the hate on TWoP for this episode when I first saw it as a High School senior.  I thought the B&B stuff was funny and I loved seeing Rory attend a college class.  I recently rewatched it as part of my marathon on Netflix and I got the dislike for it--Lorelai comes across as pretty awful throughout the episode.

[junienmomo]

After spending these last months yelling at the writers and producers of Bon Voyage, I think I get it, and I was wrong for hating it so much. 

My emotions took flight, and I found myself yelling at the TV, "How could you make me sit through Jackson's vegetable centerpieces and that horrible horrible amniotic speech, and not give me an 'I love you' or a wedding photo?"

This morning it hit me - the party is Luke's biggest Chuppah yet. He IS saying what he feels, just like he's said it for the past seven years, just like the book said. He let his actions speak, that's the romantic way to do it. (sheesh, could two people ever interpret advice worse than L&L? :)

It all began to fall together after that realization:

• Lorelai said at the beginning of the episode that she needs "someone who can feel, you know, show me how he feels" So Lorelai finally said (MOL) she wanted him still but needed to have him show her his feelings. She also acknowledged that IWALY was indeed a serenade once Luke walked into the karaoke bar
• Liz helping Luke one more time to accept his feelings for Lorelai "Oh and you're good with just being friends"
• Lorelai didn't know who organized the party. She even waited until her mother told her Sookie had called them and invited them, before Lorelai went to thank Sookie for the party. 
• When Lorelai walked over to Luke, it was with the full understanding that he had done it for her. No explanations needed
• "I just like to see you happy" was therefore a perfectly good response to Lorelai's look, and it closed the deal

While I'll never be satisfied with the way romance between adults was presented in GG, this episode makes sense to me and I appreciate it much more than before. 

[amensisterfriend]

I haven't fully changed my mind about But Not As Cute As Pushkin---as my first episode, it will always have a special place in my heart---but I have to admit that I don't love it as much as I used to. Luke absolutely freaking out on that poor nursing-home bound woman is WAY out of line, IMO, and a lot worse than his usual temper tantrums. I guess it's nice that he claims he's going to apologize to her afterwards, especially as it's VERY rare for Luke to offer to apologize, but that part of the episode still makes me cringe.

The whole dark day concept---and the idea that the only two people in town who Luke is legitimately close to are also the only two people not to know anything about this allegedly annual event---is kind of ridiculous.  

And as much as I love the Paris scenes (let's face it, I nearly always love the Paris scenes!), the stuff with Doyle is less enjoyable to me now that I know they were a couple for the rest of the series, and not one I particularly enjoyed, rather than just an amusing one or two-night stand.

I also think that much-loved scene with Logan, Colin and Finn staging an impromptu melodrama in Rory's classroom is far more stupid than funny, and I can't enjoy Rory's annoyed reaction with Logan and her valid point about how very different they are now that I know she's dying to be with him an episode or two later :)  

 

The Luke/Lorelai conflict and resolution re the boat was well done, IMO, and Anna Fairchild amuses me, but overall this isn't the special favorite that it used to be! 

Edited October 14, 2014 by amensisterfriend

[amensisterfriend]

Episodes I've grown to like more than I used to: That Damn Donna Reed (even as a non-Java Junkie, I think this has some of the best L/L chemistry of the series and is a very likable and revealing episode for Luke), Dead Uncles and Vegetables, The Ins and Outs of Inns (it's still not a favorite by any stretch, but has more good moments than I'd recalled), It Should Have Been Lorelai, I Can't Get Started, Let the Games Begin (Initially I just liked it---now i think it's brilliant!), Lorelai Out of Water (so many great little moments!), Say Goodnight Gracie, A Family Matter (no Liz-centric episode could ever be a favorite of mine, but this one is better than I used to give it credit for!), So...Good Talk, The Long Morrow, The Great Stink, Hay Bale Maze.

 

Episodes I like less than I used to: Lorelais' First Day at Chilton (I still like it, but the contrivance with the outfit and the fact that every freaking character comments on it is just ridiculous), Nick and Nora (I'm not sure I ever fully forgive Luke for what he says to Lorelai here and how he never apologizes!), Help Wanted (Richard/Lorelai bonding is nice; the town's ridiculously over-the-top reaction to Jess's minor car accident is all kinds of annoying) Haunted Leg, ADFKT, A Tale of Poes and Fire,  The Festival of Living Art (I just CAN'T with Zack here---and, ugh, the unwelcome reappearance of Nicole), the trilogy, Emily Says Hello, Lorelai? Lorelai?, Unto the Breach  

Edited January 7, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[junienmomo]

Episodes I've grown to like more than I used to: That Damn Donna Reed (even as a non-Java Junkie, I think this has some of the best L/L chemistry of the series and is a very likable and revealing episode for Luke)  

 

I just finished watching TDDR while I fixed breakfast this morning, and I was truly impressed by the natural dialog during the Gilmore dinners. Lorelai's discussion with her parents about where they should travel was so natural and not over the top. She really wanted to help them, not bait them.

This was always a favorite episode for the painting, the chick and Rory, but now it's also one of my favorite Gilmore family episodes.

TDDR is fast becoming an episode for my pantheon of (nearly) perfect episodes.

[amensisterfriend]

I think I've changed my mind about You Jump I Jump Jack. I used to despise it, and now I..well, 'like' may be too strong a word, but I definitely enjoy certain parts of it :) I still dislike the Luke/Richard scenes (Luke because he seems like such a dopey boor here---he can't even think of one book he's read?! He gets sloppy drunk with his girlfriend's father the first time they're spending any real time together?) and Richard because he's so snottily, manipulatively...Richard. But the Rory scenes are a lot more interesting than I had thought, and I love the teaser: "Honk if Emily Gilmore views your mind as her personal playground." 

[Guest]

The Bracebridge Dinner. The more I watch it, the more all the inconsistencies annoy me. I also hate that Jess destroys the snowman for Rory, the way Rory and Lorelai feel entitled to win, and just the over the top feel of the whole thing.

[amensisterfriend]

Such a good pick, deaja! Bracebridge is in the ever growing category of episodes (along with The Lorelai's First Day at Chilton, Lorelais' First Day at Yale, Pushkin and others) that I'm sentimentally attached to but probably wouldn't like as much if I first watched today. The Dean vs Jess stuff is typically silly, ITA re Jess destroying someone else's snowman just so Lorelai and Rory can get yet another 'win' in their lives is more annoying than sweet, and as someone who only enjoys the townies in really small doses, there's just too large a dose of them here. Plus, Lorelai being so petty re. not telling Rory about Christopher wanting her to visit bugs me more than it used to. (And is yet another example of the 'Chris being a  total and complete deadbeat' theory not holding as much weight for me as it does for most, as we see again here that Lorelai PREFERS him to father from a distance and to keep Rory to herself.)  I did like the Richard/Emily scenes at the end and, of course, love all things Paris, but overall the episode isn't the favorite that it used to be! 

[amensisterfriend]

One Has Class...

 

Back when I first watched the show, I remember praising it as an all-time favorite. Now, despite a few individual scenes that I adore, various parts of the episode annoy me. I don't really feel like Luke enjoying Lorelai's terrible discomfort in the classroom for a presentation she'd been so excited about was really in character...honestly, I always expect Luke to leap to his feet and inappropriately but amusingly rant at the annoying teens :) Lorelai's Louis Armstrong imitation is one of her 'bits' that irks me and feels like she and the show are just in that 'trying too hard to be cute and quirky' mode rather than letting it come naturally. Rory is kind of over-the-top, uncharacteristically awful to Shane---I get what they were trying to show there, but they could have done that scene a lot more subtly. And even the 'Butch' thing just doesn't match up with how I see Luke in high school. 

 

Always a Godmother

 

I've been slowly but surely changing my mind about parts of S6 (for the better...it had pretty much nowhere to go but up in my estimation!), and while this episode is understandably hated for Lorelai's inappropriate behavior at the baptism, I'm pleasantly surprised to see how much I enjoy the rest of it. The Lane/Rory scene was awesomely done, Lorelai and Rory meeting with the reverend was amusing and interesting to me (I'm always interested in even the most humorous and vague explorations of characters' spirituality or lack thereof!), and, lord help me, I adore Beau and relate to Sookie's issues with large family gatherings. 

 

The Long Morror

 

I've come to to adore it! 

[amensisterfriend]

I mentioned But Not as Cute as Pushkin before...but am rambling about it again, because I have weirdly conflicting feelings about this one and venting here is my therapy ;) 

 

Pros:

 

The best thing about this episode for me is that this is arguably one of the 2-3 post-S4 episodes during which Rory is most like the Original Rory who you guys know I really love and relate to. That alone would be enough to elevate it above nearly all other S5 episodes for me---though given my meh-ness on S5, that's damning with fairly faint praise :) 

 

I also like that Luke and Lorelai deal with interesting yet very relatable relationship conflicts here: acting in someone's 'best' interest even if it's not what he/she actually wants; the degree to which we can and should maintain our privacy and individuals habits/rituals while in a relationship; etc. I found the conflict well executed and really liked the resolution. If only the rest of their relationship had been written similarly! 

 

I know many don't, but I find overly eager Anna Fairchild amusing---more to the point, I find Paris' reaction to her amusing! 

 

An appearance of Terrance the life coach is always a plus for me. 

 

There are cons, though, that tend to irk me now to the point where I now sadly love this one a lot less than I used to...

 

Cons: 

 

The massive contrivance of Lorelai and Rory, the two people in town who knew the infamously reclusive, bitterly guarded Luke best by far, also happening to be the ONLY two people in town who never knew about his 'dark day' is just absurd IMO. I know this show takes some liberties with reality and I often don't mind, but for some reason this is one of those instances where we're asked to swallow a premise that just feels 'off' enough to take me out of the story.

 

Speaking of which, the whole idea of Luke designating an annual Dark Day sounds kind of dramatic, self-pitying and not totally in character. 

 

So I get that a lot of Luke's anger issues are played for laughs on this show and I'll readily admit that they bug me more than they do most GG fans (we all have our 'things', right?!), but him hollering at an innocent old lady here is really pretty awful  IMO and makes it really hard for me to have any sympathy for him throughout the episode. 

 

I'm not especially fond of Paris/Doyle, and knowing that this episode marks the beginning of the Paris/Doye coupling we end up getting for the entire rest of the series makes those scenes a little less enjoyable for me. (I'd have been totally fine with them being an awkward one night stand instead---this show seemed to rather naively believe that every guy who a girl sleeps with in college ends up wanting a serious, committed relationship with her, which...no)

 

The Marty stuff kind of makes me cringe now. 

 

is anyone else prone to changing your mind or just plain conflicted about this or other GG episodes?! If so, this is a safe place to vent :) 

[amensisterfriend]

...So I promise I'll stop talking to myself here, but I had to mention So..Good Talk. I remember being initially 'meh' on it, as I am on the vast majority of S5, but somehow on rewatch I grew to adore it, and it's easily among my favorites of S5 and of the last three seasons in general. It contains a lot of interesting ideas that were handled with a relatively light and clever touch: Rory trying to convince herself that she's the kind of person who can be comfortable with an open relationship; Sookie wanting to help her friend with a Girl's Night Out but figuring out that as a tired, married working mom these things often sound great in theory but are hard to manage in reality; Lorelai torn between how much she can and should truly communicate with Rory over how she feels about Rory's guy-related decisions; the illusion of having a 'good talk' when in reality a lot is usually left unsaid; Emily deciding that Lorelai determining who/what makes her happy is more important than her own ideas of who her daughter should be with, etc. 

[amensisterfriend]

Another one: Let Me Hear Your B--- (I still can't spell or pronounce this word!) Ring Out :) I initially dismissed this one primarily because it's from S6 (and a "rift" episode to boot!), and I was unable to envision myself genuinely loving any episode from that season. And I tend not to like anything that even hints of a love triangle, so the Jess/Rory/Logan scenes had me wary. But somewhere along the line I became totally obsessed with this episode. Not only do I adore it by significantly lowered post-S4 standards, but it's now probably in my top 10-12 episodes of the whole series. I really love AB's acting here and how she shows Rory slowly waking up to her current existence. I adore her dynamic with Jess in this episode maybe more than almost any other, and seeing how much he's evolved while still remaining so realistically, recognizably Jess-ish warms my heart. (It's weird, because even as someone who often enjoys Logan and Logan/Rory, I often find myself wishing this episode had marked the end of the Logan/Rory relationship.) I also love the Lorelai/Luke scenes in this one. The soccer team stuff is a lot of fun when you ignore that it's clunky foreshadowing for the show-altering OMG-Luke-has-a-DAUGHTER! revelation in the next episode, Luke is really likable in this one to me, and I love how Lorelai's issues with redoing the house and caring for Paul Anka are so symbolic of her angst over Rory. LMHYBRO is just so great in that uniquely GG way---smart, funny, subtly and not so subtly poignant, etc. As someone who's enamored with the Lorelai/Rory and Rory/Paris relationships, I would never have expected to like an episode in which we don't get either, so I'm still sort of shocked by how deeply I've grown to love this one!   

[lulu1960]

Balalaikas is one of my favorite episodes. My Luke loving heart really goes pitter patter in this one. He was just so supportive. I also agree about Rory wising up. Plus Jess's "Who should I send it to, the blond d**k at Yale?" is a favorite of mine.

[amensisterfriend]

Lulu, you'll be happy to know that I think Luke and Lorelai look adorable in their matching uniforms :) I also love the way Luke went from being reluctant initially to throwing himself into the project wholeheartedly and wanting only the very best for his soccer players---THAT'S the Luke I adore! And Rory's scenes with Jess and the epiphany his visit brings...*happy sigh*. Just when I think I've rid myself of my former literati obsession, the shows gives us that and reels me right back in! 

[Aloeonatable]

Balalaikas is also one of my favorite episodes. No surprise for those of you who know I love Jess. MV's and AB's chemistry was off the charts and they didn't even have any physical contact! I always liked the Rory/Jess friendship more than their love relationship anyway. They just seemed so comfortable together as friends.

[amensisterfriend]

I just rewatched the Ins and Outs of Inns (because of course I have to record GG episodes despite 1) owning the DVDs and 2) having several episodes on my computer and 3) having several more episodes already saved on said DVR), and I think I like this one more than I always thought I did :) I'm still not a huge fan of Mia or the whole town's over-the-top worship of her and the Lorelai/Sookie fight stresses me out, but there are some great individual scenes and moments in that one. I'm actually surprised more java jukies aren't fans of this episode, because there are some great L/L moments here---and the reveal that Luke is a sci fi fan is among my favorite Luke moments of the series!