Jump to content

Type keyword(s) to search

D Angel

  • Posts

  • Joined


123 Excellent
  1. Non-renewal of the series was based on low rating, not show quality. And while I think they lost some audience beginning around S2 E4 which impacted rating, the difference was so small that the plot failures (too harsh, let's call them 'misfires') did hurt, they didn't help and the sophomore slump dragged the show down. If S2 had been as compelling as S1, Emmy buzz would have elevated the show's profile, viewers would have streamed S1 to catch up and made it an appointment as I did watch the broadcast (or at least stream) as each new episode was released. Either way, the show and cast and crew deserved better than straight cancellation after the stunning and unique S1, even with a mediocre S2. Good writing and plotting for the beginning of S3 would have quickly won the audience back.
  2. Jane Levy torched NBC for their decision to cancel Zoey's and not even shift it to Peacock: https://deadline.com/2021/06/jane-levy-zoeys-extraordinary-playlist-wrong-move-cancellation-nbc-crime-and-guns-1234774908/ The lady has a point, and not only because she carried the series and deserves better. It's been 25 episodes and hour programs take longer to build an audience. Someone should buy the show for another 25 episodes then rake in the money over time as people binge watch it. I remember how The Good Place had a great season 1, then spun its wheels durign some portions of seasons 2 & 3, but really kicked it into gear late season 3 and all of season 4. ZEP cold do the same if they get out of their funk and take any number of compelling narratives jsut sitting there.
  3. I suspect that Peacock passed because it is very expensive to produce TV shows, particularly with an established cast who need significant salaries to continue. Zoey's is an ensemble cast with a number of actors who can take other roles and whose agents probably started shopping them mid-season when ratings were down. I'm sure the cast wants a 3rd season of Zoey and enjoy working together, but for any outlet to fund the show it has to generate profit, or at least offer a fighting chance to do so. Zoey has a devoted following, but how devoted and really how large is hard to say. But if Zoey can find a champion with influence, soon, there's still hope. Recall that Family Guy was cancelled by FOX, then brought back after several years off the air, but earned a cult following and is still running after 20 years. Zoey Season 1 was some of the best TV I've seen in the last decade. Zoey Season 2 was blah, musical numbers notwithstanding. If Austin Winsberg can lay out a compelling story arc for two more seasons, he might find a home for the show since solid buzz would reactive S1 and S2 viewership just as S1 stoked S2, disappointing or not. But it could be that the Mitch driving story arc in S1 was all Winsberg had to offer, and without it Zoey is just an excuse for music/dance numbers -- as entertaining as they are. And lots of shows can make excuses to incorporate music/dance numbers. Family Guy does it all the time, just with cartoons. Family Guy works and hooks the audience with ruthless satire. Zoey S1 hooked the audience with a realistic and compelling narrative of the too-soon demise of a beloved family member. Zoey S2 had no hook at all. I've noted MULTIPLE times on this board and elsewhere that a Zoey spiritual journey to understand where her powers come from, why she has them, and what she's supposed to do with them, would make a compelling story arc. If I were a network exec, I'd tell Austin Winsberg to tell me how he planned to answer these questions, or no sale.
  4. I've created this topic since there isn't yet one dedicated to this discussion and what we would hope to get from a potential 3rd season. For my part, I only got to watch a little of the E! ZEP marathon over the long weekend. I happened to catch S1 E12 and rewatching just the first 5 minutes of that episode was a stark reminder of how much better S1 was than S2. Jane Levy was great and funny and sensitive. The pacing and dialog was great, and the musical numbers were very well integrated rather than forced. And the episode just got better (and sadder) throughout. The scene in that episode with Howie and Zoey eating ice cream at the kitchen table and discussing death was perhaps the best one of the entire series. I appreciated it more after some time passing but the heart and soul was what made ZEP S1 so great. And Zoey running into the MRI tech at the hospital when she rushed there because David (incorrectly) reported Emily in labor, and the tech sings a few bars of I've Got the Music in Me, added just enough intrigue to keep the mystery alive. Sadly, S2 never revisited that tease, since I'd expected Zoey to find it irresistible to pursue. The start of S2 was also OK, but the music seemed more forced and while the stated intention was to address the theme of grief, with the Clarke family's rendition of Carry On, that plot line already reached it's climax. I watched just E1 and E2 from the second season because the rest of the marathon was shown overnight. I only got back to it for E13, which seemed wrap up all the main story lines, except with the twist of Max hearing a heart song from Zoey. While the scuttlebutt was that the writers/producers intended an S2 cliffhanger, on watching the episode again they hedged to give the series somewhat of an potential ending ... just in case. But back to the last season 1 episode: It was so good that I'm hoping S2 was just a sophomore slump and that they can find their footing again and deliver drama and comedy, and compelling themes and characters in S3. Then they can call it quits since there's only so far they can take this premise. They can answer all the big questions and set the main characters on an "into the sunset" story arc for the remainder of their lives and maybe try to give the loyal audience some thematic ideas on hearing heart songs of others and employing that empathy in our lives. I told lots and lots of people of ZEP S1 and described it as more than the sum of its parts. I now know I was right about that. S2 was a huge disappointment as I doubt anyone who watched S1 would be just as happy with S2, unless all they cared about were the songs and dance routines.
  5. Thread to discuss a potential Season 3, either on NBC or shifted to Peacock.
  6. The plotting didn't help either. More ghost Mitch, bring back Howie, more Mo outside of relationship Mo (e.g. 'church' Mo), more therapy for Zoey, keep Rose, keep Maximo. Less SPRQ except for Simon, no Aiden.
  7. Great. Now Zoey will go around spreading what most people will think are hallucinations. A "send" power can only apply to Max and Mo and, if given a chance, her therapist. Boy would that blow his mind! But this opens up a curious possibility. Could the MRI tech at the hospital, who hinted that he was aware of the powers in a later episode, have accidentally transferred to her his power via the combination of his proximity to her, the MRI and the earthquake? Now that we know the power is at least somewhat transferable, I'm hoping this is the direction an NBC or Peacock ZEP Season 3 will take it. Nevertheless, if this is the case, boy it would have been much better to go this route in Season 2. Zoey could have tried to find ways to share her power if she knew it was possible.
  8. The Season 2 finale was the perfect composite of the entire season: Aimlessly drifting with a number of stellar moments. Every scene between Zoey and Mitch sizzle, just as they did in Season 1. As Zoey's touchstone, her father in whatever form would have been an excellent spirit guide for her if they had just had him in for a scene or two every few episodes, except of just the last two. What a waste! Not only is Peter Gallagher excellent, but Jane Levy proves her chops in the scenes with him, instead of just making faces. My ultimate take after reading some comments from Austin Winsberg is the standard Hollywood BS. Why do in four episodes what you can do in 13? Max, nobody, Simon, nobody, Max? Doesn't seem like much of a story arc to me. So the net result of 13 episodes is that Max has now heard a heart song for himself? That's the cliffhanger? Not very satisfying for sure. The Aiden detour was pointless. DMD is now just annoying (as is most SPRQPoint stuff). The "drone phone" is idiotic and Mo's relationship stories have become repetitive. On the plus side, I wasn't at all sold on the MaxiMo idea, but I've been convinced. It might work after all and be moderate profitable for the owners. Max's relationship with RoseAnne was engaging and made a whole lot more sense than his pining for Zoey. But hey, it's his funeral. Simon got to release his grief and get on with his life. He made the right decision to end it with Zoey and he's got a more appropriate career path. (BTW -- Zoey was never his "boss". He always reported straight up to DMD. It was a sour note when DMD even mentioned Zoey. Bad writing again.) Maybe now that the Zoey relationship stuff (and her grief "journey") is over, Season 3 will get past the sophomore slump and start producing truly compelling story lines. S3 will almost certainly be on Peacock -- since S2 ended with a thump instead of a cliffhanger -- but there are enough fans and people like me who recognized how special S1 was, along with just musical comedy lovers, to generate some Peacock premium subscriptions from ZEP fans alone. Nonetheless, I think Austin Winsberg and his writing/plotting team have run out of ideas. Dashing to the airport then not doing anything does nothing to avoid the cliche. If she really wanted to stop Max, she could have called him on his cell. Dabbling in social justice questions and post-partum depression and Zoey's depression and therapy just seemed to give the characters something to do. Where S1 dealt with real-life, S2 constantly reminded me I was watching a TV show. Maybe being a a writer makes me more critical of the narrative arcs than other fans. It's because of that, however, than I answer the comment above regarding Jane Levy's acting ability with my opinion that she deserved the nomination she got and more for S1, but she had so much less to work with in S2 that nobody's getting any noms for it.
  9. I can buy that SPRQPoint and DMD might have some kind of problem-solving competition to determine who gets hired. BUT, it seems that everyone there for the competition believed they were already hired and some (if not all) quit their jobs and or moved to SF to take the job, which they only would have done if they had received something in writing offering them the job without any conditions that they hadn't already met when they showed up for their "first day". So surprising them all with this new condition to secure appointment would constitute breach of contract since an offer letter and acceptance IS a contract. Now, employment in most states is "at will", which means they could all be fired on their first day, but I have no idea what the law is in California. But the contract is still in effect whether the company can't or won't actually give them a job and anyone not ultimately hired could sue for damages such as lost wages from a job they left based on the SPRQPoint offer, and moving expenses, lease obligations and so forth. If the company was simpy insolvent, someone taking all those steps only to find they weren't hired after all would probably end up with nothing. SPRQPoint has tons of money to pay settlements, not to mention the damage to their reputation from lying to new employees. There's no way corporate counsel would even let DMD set up such as scheme. So this episode premise fell flat for me and sounded more like a writer's ignorant notion of how a cutting edge tech company might work. Zoey said that Max was hired the "next month", perhaps because DMD and his lawyers realized they had screwed up, or maybe Max threatened to sue. Otherwise, this would have made an excellent S2 E4 show, not the next to last show of th season. As others have mentioned, getting Zoey into therapy immediately after her nightmares would have set up a very strong narrative arc for the rest of the season. Instead we got drifting. Entertaining, but not particularly compelling, unlike S1 which was terrific.
  10. Amen to that. Mitch's illness and decline is real. Zoey's power ... not so much. If it is real as opposed to a severe mental health issue, that exploration handled in a realistic way could be quite compelling. Mostly in fiction, supernatural abilities are handled either with cartoonish exaggeration (X-Men) or normalization with virtually no character affect (Star Trek). When done well, such as M. Night Shyamalan's Unbreakable or Logan, the result can be quite compelling. Zoey's power is certainly real to her and she's received multiple independent confirmations of its authenticity, even though she's the only one experiencing the heart songs directly. She can start the 'realism' with her therapist by sharing that information so he can treat her appropriately. So far, I'd say he knows but is naturally skeptical so he's ignoring this central issue in his recommendations (which are still sound, so far). Here's an open question: If you believed Zoey about her powers, what would you recommend she do?
  11. Despite all the plot setbacks, I'm hoping that S2 E12, Zoey's Extraordinary Session, will put things back on track. From what I've read, it's mostly a flashback of Zoey sharing some personal history with her therapist (hence: "Session"), which had to be from before she had her powers. So they may forego a lot of the heart-song interruptions for regular drama and comedy, perhaps giving Mandy Moore a week off after directing the previous episode. Peter Gallagher returns but besides that nugget they aren't sharing much. So I suspect the plot line in E12 will be Zoey finally doing some self-examination to discover why she now has this power and what she is supposed to do with it. Why Zoey? Was it just a random turn of the wheel with her in the MRI machine during the earthquake? Was she chosen by a higher power for some quality she already had? Obviously, her therapist hasn't watched the show for the first two seasons but these seem like reasonable questions he would direct Zoey to ask herself and try to find answers. Her powers don't help her romantic life and they weren't about coping with her dad's illness and death. I'm feeling kind of manipulated like Simon at this point, seduced with some comedy and the songs and dances, when I had high hopes the show would be about more than that. I rooted and felt for Zoey in S1, but so far this season the themes are haphazard and drifting. Either Zoey is special or she's just a high-functioning schizophrenic. Pick a path. The second half of S2 seems to be heading to a climax for one or the other. For Jane Levy's sake, I hope they make it good.
  12. Random thoughts on S2 E11, many of which were already mentioned above: 1) At least Zoey has enough self-awareness to know that she's been lying to Simon this whole time and continues to do so for selfish reasons. And at least the writers have enough self-awareness to finally make that explicit, or at least they read these boards. 2) Zoey treats therapy a lot like her job, which is not a good sign. Not sure I agree with her doctor that he reaction to Max potentially moving to NYC is about loss. Still seems more like Zoey's selfishness. But I still like her. 3) Her therapist should probably be more concerned when a patient describes having whaty professionals would recognize as visual and auditory hallucinations. Sure, the subconscience can be very powerful and Zoey is a high-functioning schizophrenic, but I'm not sure a professional would think that talkt therapy is enough. 4) Mo & Perry relationship issues were the most real part of this episode. Nuanced and touching, with both of them speaking honestly and without blame. But I'm with others here who wonder why they had the Perry character in the first place if this is the end. Was it just for his Lou Rawls-type singing voice? 5) Max should go to NYC and just marry Rose already. They are a great pairing and genuinely seem to care about each other. The writers gave Max what he deserved with her, when Zoey proved unreliable. 6) Good call (if totally ridiculous) for Maggie to simply go on a heater rather than devolve into a gamblign addiction. Seems also to have made her friendship with Deb closer than ever. Good for her! 7) All the SPRQPoint phone ideas are stupid. DronePhone least so, although a lawsuit waiting to happen. Not sure if it was a visual effect or they actually built a flying phone. Cool either way. Would never buy one. 8) Is ZEP still spinning its wheels? Less so than earlier in the season but still more than S1. I'm beginning to think the heart songs are getting the in way of good story telling. 9) BTW -- Maximo customers would know their food delivery is delayed. I doubt they would blame Maximo since they know what it's about. 10) No way Zoey is Simon's boss. DMD should just get off the elevator on the 4th floor, walk up to Zoey, and tell her that in case she didn't know Simon reports to corporate and just happens to have his office on her floor. Then he gets back on the elevator and we can all save the keystrokes. 11) ZEP now has too many characters to follow. In S3, they need to refocus with Zoey on a leave of absense from SP, Simon on a 4 month world tour of SP offices, max in NYC, and Mo taking a hiatus from romantic entanglements to focus on Maximo. David's back as a lawyer, Zoey has aunt time with Miles and tells him everything (even more than she tells her therapist), and she gets away from most of the heart songs. 12) Are we any closer to knowing a) where Zoey's power comes from, b) how it works, and c) what's the purpose behind it for Zoey? No, we are not. A whole season wasted as far as I'm concerned.
  13. Season 3, if it happens, could very well only be available on Peacock with their premium service. I think NBC knows that ZEP's following will go with it anywhere, but it just hasn't become the hit they hoped on the broadcast schedule. The advantage for the show's producers is that they would have more freedom to pursue less crowd-friendly story lines. The downside is less money for everyone. Unless they broaden the premise, ZEP is a four season show, tops. They've breathed a little new life into the main plot with Zoey FINALLY launching her spiritual journey to understand her powers. Absent turning ZEP into Quantum Leap, it's hard to see a) where they can take the show with Zoey's story as central, and b) how Zoey can have enough to do to keep the audience engaged, as good as Jane Levy is in the role. The supporting characters' lives are interesting, but without the hook of the heart songs, all their stories (except Mitch's illness and death) are pedestrian. I'm hoping the show will take the clue from the supporting characters who made the show sizzle in S1. Howie, his daughter, Mo's pastor, Bernadette Peters, etc. They brought her back, but in 'meh' fashion.
  14. I hate to say this, but we'll only get some kind of cliffhanger if the show is renewed for another season, which has to be severely in doubt. S1 got a lot of post-airing buzz and built an audience in streaming and deservedly so. I promoted a number of friends and family to watch it as "more than the sum of its parts" and not to dismiss it as another show like Glee. If S2 had been as compelling as S1, I suspect it would be renewed without question. But ratings are off and show quality hasn't been as good as far as drama is concerned (musical numbers might actually be better this season), which means fewer people are watching on streaming services. If it is a "cliffhanger", it's going to have to be something deeper than simply Zoey finally telling her boyfriend the truth. After all, she hasn't told anyone in her family yet, and she's clearly closer to them than to Simon. A more likely cliffhanger to get people intrigued for the entirety of S3 (if it happens) would be Zoey meeting someone else with a superpower and a fuller understanding of what Zoey's dealing with. I'd expect either a potential mentor or pier. My "place bets" question is: Does anyone think they will take the plot more in the direction of M. Night Shyamalan's Unbreakable, which carries a similar theme and premise of a seemingly regular person realizing they have a superpower? IMO it's his best film and, in a rare case for me, did not see the twist at the end coming.
  15. Unless I'm misremembering the opening, it was Simon who was pushing Zoey to be proactive since he was doing exactly that with whoever he was talking to (his brother?) on the phone before they sat down to breakfast. But then he changed his tune to backing off ... perhaps because he no longer had Zoey's undivided attention that he wanted. I also thiknk that making Simon so needy is a mistake. He is not that far removed from an failed engagement so he's a big boy and, frankly, Zoey isn't a go gaga prize, given her flakiness and aloofness. That more Max then a Simon. I also notice the Team Simon isn't jump and down with enthusiasm like they would be at this point last season. And Max is clearly more in tune romantically with Rose after years apart than he ever was with Zoey. But these seem perfectly suited as each other's backup if they are both single at 40. BTW -- If they ever need to retool the show, Zoey is already most of the way to The Flying Nun. Just sayin'.
  • Create New...