Geordiegirl1967

Thats what I meant. Wrong ep title. But my question was, is she meant to be the same character? I didn't think so, but someone up thread did.

was she meant to be the same character she was in Into the Mystic? I assumed they were just reusing the actress.

Haven't had time to read anyone elses comments yet (busy work day!) but just a flying post to say that I LOVED this episode. My Dean is back (didn't recognise him last week), great characterisation and writing, great performances from Jared and Jensen (OMG when Jensen/Dean said 'don't say that' like a little boy my heart just melted), great for the brothers relationship with each other and with Jack - who I am really enjoying. The Cas scenes were a pace dragger for me. I haven't got over my anger at the writers killing him then immediately losing their nerve and telling everyone 'oh but he is not really dead'. It felt manipulative and pointless, so I haven't been able to get on board with Sam and Dean's grief / guilt etc. And the way he is getting brought back (if that is him) is lame IMO. But the rest was excellent.

That makes no sense. Its like blaming a child whose mother dies in childbirth for their mothers death. Jack didn't ask to be conceived and he didn't deliberately kill his mother. He had literally nothing to do with Cas's death. So Dean blaming Jack for these things is illogical and grossly unfair.

He did that last week in the alley scene. He did that in the ep by referencing his own darkness and Dean saving him. Well Dean's attitude certainly isn't helping Jack, which quite apart from everything else is tactically naive. As they have no way to kill Jack and he is immensely powerful by FAR the best option they have at the moment is to help him, get him on their side and help him to control his powers. They may fail but the alternative is letting him go it alone or signing him up at the Knights of Hell School of Evil-Doing and Death Dealing. Dean scaring the kid, shouting for all to hear that Sam - whom Jack currently sees as his only friend - is using him (which is unfair as Sam is mainly trying to help him for genuine reasons which Dean knows full well) and telling him he is evil and will hurt people and he isn't valuable / worth trying to save is SOOOOO beyond reckless. Me too!!! Please no more making 1 or both of the brothers act ooc just to create drama for the sake of it. Good drama comes from consistent character development. That nasty, cruel and tactically dense version of Dean isn't one I recognise.

I disagree. I think it was absolutely Cas's decision to do that. He genuinely believed in Jack and his potential for good I think, and he knew that at that point the boys plan was to capture Kelly and potentially kill her/Jack or at least take away his power - so he needed to protect him. Whether his belief in Jack's goodness will prove true or a manipulation by evil-foetus Jack remains to be seen, but both Cas and Kelly connected with Jack before he was born and felt strongly that he was not evil. I hope he is right and Jack does not turn out to be evil as it is very much Sam's turn to be right on something. His judgement is constantly shown to be wrong and Dean's to be right (demon blood, Ruby, BMoL, the trials, not looking for Dean and on and on). It is time for a change. Sigh! I don't know why they bothered 'killing' Cas only to chicken out of outraging his fans by immediately telling everyone he would come back then bringing him back within 3 eps. It has been a pointless cheapening of what could have been some actual drama, and an excuse I suspect for some blatant fan service.

It is still doing great in the ratings for the CW. Actually ep 2 ratings were adjusted up so it matched the premiere in the demo at 0.7. There is always a drop from premiere to ep2 for any show / series. It is the nature of the thing. So to keep most of the audience from the premiere shows most people liked what they saw enough to tune in the next week. I'm certainly enjoying it so far, though less excited by this weeks ep which seems to be pointlessly separating the boys for, you know, reasons! http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/daily-ratings/thursday-final-ratings-oct-19-2017/ Edit - Oops - just saw you already spotted this. Apols

I checked on 31st and he followed him then. But you are right - he isn't there now. Tho he still follows Jared, Gen, Danneel and loads of others from the show including Jim M who he had a spat with the other day on Twitter. It is very odd. I don't know what is going on but he has definitely unfollowed Jensen in the last 3 or 4 days which leaves an even worse taste in my mouth about his behaviour. Whatever happened I am pretty sure it won't have been Jensen's fault. Looks like this is correct.

I haven't checked re the others but it is absolutely not true that Mark unfollowed Jensen. He still follows him and Jared. I checked. No. See above I have screenshots to prove this but they are too big to attach. So here is a link to when I Tweeted them https://twitter.com/Geordiegirl1967/status/869845737449848832

Totally! Its pathetic. In a lot of ways Twitter, Facebook etc bring out the worst school playground nonsense in supposedly mature adults. As I don't use Instagram I don't really know. Isn't it just for sharing photos? Mark almost certainly does share Misha's political views. America is generally MUCH more right wing than Britain (please don't mention Nigel Farage!). As for Jensen's Instagram - he came to social media much later than Jared. Could be Mark didn't know he had joined Instagram. Whatever the Mark/Misha thing (if it even exists) I think a much more interesting question will be how Mark P and Misha will get on (assuming Cas isn't dead) if Mark P is to take Mark Ss place as a regular. Misha is a VERY committed Democrat. Mark P strongly holds some pretty bizarre extreme right wing views (tax is theft, democracy=tyranny of the majority etc). I know as I have had some testy exchanges with him on Twitter when I have challenged some of his opinions. This isn't the place for a political discussion, but let's just say that Mark and Misha will vehemently disagree on almost every political question. They may get on swimmingly despite this, but I'd love to be a fly on the wall if they were to get talking about the issues of the day!

if it was an accident / oversight then you are right. But if Mark went onto his Twitter and actively unfollowed Misha but kept following Jared, Jensen etc then it certainly means something. I have no problem with the last 5 minutes of the finale, and I know of a lot of others who feel the same. I'm not dismissing your view on it. You are entitled to it. But it isn't true to say that everyone hated the end of ep23.

I'd agree except that Mark has unfollowed Misha on Twitter. As he still follows the rest of the cast and crew (the Js, Jim M etc) that seems a pointed action. Of course Twitter has been known to randomly unfollow people for no apparent reason so it could just be a glitch.

It certainly is. "Aspirational" implies ambitious. "Inspirational" is definitely a more positive word. Not sure what is going on with this whole story. I suspect its as straightforward as the writers decided they had no more ideas of where to take Crowley - which I actually agree has been a problem for a while, both for Crowley and Cas - so they decided to dump Crowley as the bad guy (tho half the problem has been that he wasn't that bad, except when he was truly evil (remember the ep where he killed people they'd saved?). It became very hard to track what we were meant to think of him) and replace him with Mark Pellegrino as Lucifer. Personally I think Lucifer is as played out as Crowley but that's just my opinion. Mark was initially just disappointed but then became seriously pissed because they didn't give Crowley the send off he thought he deserved, and in leading up to the switcheroo they made Crowley act like a blithering idiot (diverting Luci from the cage, all the stupid 'this is clearly going to end in tears' monologuing and gloating, followed by the inevitable (humiliating) hopping scene). Then they cut his line from the finale and made Crowley's sacrifice pointless anyway. Classic sour grapes, with some justification, but still childish to air his bitterness in public.

Really? Because that's EXACTLY how it sounds. Rowena was introduced ages ago. He didn't seem to have a problem with it. The writers ran out of ideas for Crowley (and Cas IMO) years ago. Did he leave? No. He only starts complaining when the writers decisions lose him his job. The analogies people are making with e.g. Js having very politely and tactfully expressed reservations about the writing are not valid. They do that because they want the show to be as good as it can be. But it's not blatently self interested and motivated by sour grapes. Sorry but Mark has gone down a lot in my estimations over this. Regardless of whether he actually has a point, it's not gracious or mature to react to it as he has.

To be honest I think he is embarrassing himself. Characters get written out of shows all the time. It's part of the business. So if you start biting the hand that feeds you like this the offers will soon dry up. He is clearly very angry but he needs to grow up. He has a point about the writers, but if he had acted like a grown up (as have Osric, Felicia, Richard, Tim O and all the other actors whose characters have been killed off (often stupidly & pointlessly!)) instead of a bitter baby he could stay on good terms with everyone, keep making £ from the con circuit etc. This way he's just going to get ostracised by the fandom.