Birdie

Was the robotic arm just the camera though? I might be wrong. But I seem to remember Elizabeth saying things like, “Aesop, down…Stop.” And then she’d shoot a separate laser thing to do the actual surgery. Like, the robotic arm wasn’t a scalpel or any instrument for cutting or suction or whatever. But I agree. Romano deserved better; he could’ve been made into one of those hardass, but great teacher characters (I seem to remember a little moment between him and Gallant where they’re both in the lounge and Gallant is studying. Romano suggests a better text to read from, and I think also tells him a bit about the surgery Gallant’s reading over). As for the person above who mentioned Abby: It’s known that I don’t like her either, but I remember it as you remember it. I remember her brushing off Coburn’s “tell it like it is” sponsor advice. I remember interpreting the fact she went to meetings across town or different places or whatever line she fed rather than the one Coburn suggested as her lying as well. Her coming back from rehab and getting her conditions for returning to work, and the meeting where she was told she’d have to start all over when she got back from Croatia because they couldn’t monitor her there. Ugh, and Luka’s pushy and sexist confrontation with Coburn. I must’ve missed the same “chunk of time” you missed, lol. But I think the person you’re debating either is remembering something different or interpreting it differently. Maybe they’re referring to offscreen? Like, because she agreed with the review board to go to meetings and all the conditions they laid out that she was working the steps and such? 🤷‍♀️

Lydia and Al were cute together, and so were Jeanie and Reggie. I really wish the writers would have allowed Jeanie and Reggie to have remained happy together. I can’t think of any “later” relationships I cared about. It just became a revolving door of ER hook-ups where everyone passed around each other. ETA: I did think Morris and Claudia together were cute and glad she wasn’t part of the ER. I keep remembering that ep where she’s at his apt, and she says about the paint scheme, “What is up with the brown? It’s like fifty shades of feces in here.” And then Morris sets about painting the walls. 🤣 And of course their meet ugly when we’re first introduced to Claudia as the undercover cop.

Oh, I totally forgot Keaton! *slaps forehead* You’re right; I didn’t think they were bad together. I saw some chemistry there too. And, yeah, I didn’t count Lucy in there, but I, too, am glad that went nowhere. I liked her when I first watched the show (as a character, not any love interest), but she doesn’t grow on me after rewatches. Re: the Morris and Banfield ep mentioned above - that is a good ep. Won’t say anything more because don’t want to spoil it for the watcher above.

Ugh, the Kem eps have begun to repeat on Pop. (It doesn’t help that I just don’t like the character either). How come almost every woman they tried to pair Wyle with on this show, he had zero chemistry with? IMHO, the only romantic interest he clicked with was Christine Elise as Harper. Rebecca De Mornay? No. Julie Bowen? Nope. Maura Tierney? Ha, no. Mädchen Amick? Meh, ok, there was maybe a little something there. This isn’t really a commentary on Wyle’s acting (though I’ve seen him in things other than ER, I haven’t been “blown away” by anything; he’s good 🤷‍♀️ ), but more so on the casting directors, I suppose. Because he had chemistry with Jorja Fox as friends with Doyle and Maria Bello (wish she’d stuck around, but then I wonder what TPTB would’ve done to destroy that relationship if Anna and Carter did eventually get together). And I think he and Ming-Na connected well, but I’m glad Carter and Chen never got together because I think it’s important to depict healthy, platonic-hetero relationships. I’m sure there are those that disagree with me though. Again, just my little opinions.

I never thought Mark and Lizzie were terrible together until they threw Rebellious Rachel in the mix. Could’ve done without that mess. Though the spiciness in her personality was lost when she got with him; it was just a very stark contrast to the flirtatious and gregariousness with which she came into the show.

McCrane def deserved better, so much better. He deserved better than what they devolved his character into, and he deserved a better send off. I originally started watching 9-1-1 because she’s on it! :) Thanks for the feedback on JM’s book; pity she didn’t dish more on her ER time. Like you said, funny stories, not mean gossip or anything. More along the lines of the stories George was telling on the cast zoom get together. I still laugh at the story he told about the director yelling at the guest lady, “YOU GON’ CRY!” And then she couldn’t, and she tells George, all mortified, “I just couldn’t cry!” And he tells her, “No, but I bet you do on the car drive home.” 😂

Let me preface my responses with I don’t have first hand knowledge of AA or NA or any addiction rehab program. I’m sure some spouses might do this, but the sponsors, if put in that position, should do what Coburn did. (I think) she kept Abby’s confidence, and told Luka to talk to her himself. As far as Luka’s comment about her husband, uh, well, Luka, perhaps her husband leaving was a blessing for her, and being alone and focusing on herself allows her to continue her sobriety as well as provide support to your wife - even when it appeared Abby didn’t really want her support because it meant confronting her faults. Like the worst thing for a woman is to not have a man in her life 🙄. I am by no means a Sam fan at all, but she was well within reason to confront Abby and ask if she’d ever been drunk at work. We see that she has as they show a flashback to some episode to where Abby’s uncharacteristically addled and clumsy in a trauma. I don’t think there’s mention of Carter having a drinking problem; I think he abstains from drinking (for the most part - he does drink that champagne with Gamma in honor of his grandfather) as a part of abstaining from narcotics. I guess he figures it’d be easier to abstain because now it’s been established he has an “addictive personality” - he could probably easily develop a drinking problem. Remember, he wouldn’t even take OTC painkillers when Susan told him at yoga “if he was gonna be a tough guy about pain, he couldn’t complain” before she knew what he’d been through. I think him going to AA was just a means to bring him and Abby together. I mean, if this were a smaller town that only had an AA meeting to go to rather than NA, I would think any meeting is helpful, but, yeah, Chicago is going to def have NA meetings too. And ER decided to completely ignore the rule about sponsors can’t be of the opposite sex (something Abby herself even tells Carter). So, yeah, a ploy to bring Carby to fruition.

Carter is O-; they needed more universal donor blood. I only remember because I am O- as well, and I try to donate whenever I’m able. Both because I can give to everyone and because it’s the only kind I can take, lol.

I am one of those “new generation watchers” JM spoke of - I watched ER for the first time as a HS senior a couple of years ago. It was a nostalgia thing for my mother; sort of a “here’s what I dug when I was your age” type of thing as ER premiered during HER senior HS year. But it was the first time my mom watched the whole series. But JM is right regarding the show’s technology: I totally didn’t really notice the ancient or lack of technology. I don’t think I really noticed the missing cell phones in the early seasons until that guy, Susan’s patient with the giant ass brick looking one, or when I saw Benton using the pay phone. But the giant change in technology from then to now doesn’t take away from the show at all; I’ve always maintained the earlier seasons are my favorites. I guess that’s one way the show is timeless. And Carter’s speech from Lockdown. Damn, how appropriate is it for now. “It’s not about taking away your rights; it’s about keeping you safe.” I loved all the banter between all of them. GC obv talked way more than everyone else, but it wasn’t in a rude way, and every thing he said was nearly always lifting somebody else up and giving kudos to someone else. Or telling a hilarious story. 😄 Omg, the clip they showed of him as the long-haired “police officer by day, rockstar by night”! He’s like, “I don’t know why it didn’t take off.” 😂 When they mentioned Deezer D, I had been thinking, “I would so love to have him here as a part of this.” I bet he would’ve had some fun stories to tell and great things to say. 😢 I would love a part 2 with McCrane, La Salle, Stringfield, Freeman, Gedde Watanabe, Sharif Atkins, and Benrubi. And the woman who played surgical nurse Shirley all those years! But, yeah, I really enjoyed those 2 hours. 😊

I can understand your point. But, up until then, it was always Carter bending over backward to be there for Abby, canceling his plans for her, choosing to go with her to fetch her mother over his girlfriend (I use that loosely though because, really, how serious was he about Rena?), trying to rearrange his work schedule to go here or do this or that for her, etc. Also, you’d think she’d have the forethought to make sure there was no alcohol in the limo if she was set on bringing Eric to the funeral and keeping him in the car. And Eric is an adult; Abby had tried and tried to help him and her mother. You can’t force someone to want or accept your help (an adult anyway; sure you can force a kid); her mother finally accepted she needed her meds for life in order to stay steady, but Eric wasn’t there yet. When was the point supposed to come where Abby wouldn’t be killing herself emotionally trying to save her brother? I don’t have experience with mentally ill family members, but it just seems like at some point the healthier thing to do for yourself and your life is to step away - not necessarily forever but for the time being. Is Abby supposed to be his babysitter for the rest of his life? Somehow I don’t see Luka being too pleased living with Abby, Joe, and Abby’s brother all in one house...what a strain on the marriage that’d be. Perhaps Carter should’ve considered all the points you made, but I think at that point he himself was getting pushed to the brink being tied up in Abby’s family drama, and then you throw Gamma’s death on top of him (the one person in his family who he always had a steadfast relationship with, regardless of whether they saw eye to eye or not). (There isn’t meant to be any snark in my tone toward you; I’m aware over the internet things can come across incorrectly. I am genuinely interested in your reply and perspective to my questions),

My problem with Abby was first) she had a complete personality transplant between when we first meet her and when she shows up as a series regular. First meeting she’s Carol’s cheerful, encouraging OB delivery nurse; second go round, she’s this cynical, bitter-ass med student/ER nurse. It was just a complete 180, like the writers forgot how they wrote her in the twins’ birth episode. Second) she was a Mary Sue who was “great” at everything, and even her “faults” were written so as to be sympathetic and make her appear like this heroic martyr. (“Yes, she’s morose and fatalistic and her self-esteem is taking a hit and she struggles to stay sober, but she had a tragic childhood full of responsibility at a young age and now she has to again take on so much responsibility and she’s just afraid of people getting too close” ugh). She questions residents’ and attendings’ authority, but somehow, she always ends up being both righteous and “right.” She’s doing procedures no med student should do, both on her own and at others’ suggestion (Abby can do it; she’s soooooo smart and advanced), and they always end up correct. And it’s always in the better interest of the patient (even when the PATIENT DOESN’T WANT IT). 🙄 And everyone agrees on Abby when they’re doing the “rank to match” thing. And then when they’re talking about patient satisfaction scores, somebody says, “Abby is the only one with decent scores” because of course she is). And the Neonatology attending tells her she’s “one of the best med students she’s ever had” and thinks she should go into the field. Somebody mentioned the ep where Gamma died, and how Abby made it all about herself and her brother. I remember Carter being incredulous that Abby was going to run off to Eric when HE needed HER (for once), and he says, “go, go get your brother; my grandmother will still be dead” and walks away from her. I applauded his clap back 👏 I was glad he finally said something to her. And somebody also said something about Sally Field as her mother. Ugh, yes, that ep where she brings everyone orange juice and bagels in that ridiculous dress and shoes and she begin banshee shrieking “Abbyyyyyyy! Abbyyyyyyyyy!” I have to mute the tv until she’s finished.

I have some questions about a couple of episodes recently shown. Maybe somebody can answer them. 1. Wouldn’t they know Mark never shocked Fossen given the readout of Fossen’s heart rhythm? I would think there would be a spike in the reading when he shocked him, but he shocked the air. Wouldn’t that not show anything on the reading, so Mark couldn’t lie his way out? 2. Luka “explains” Nicole’s kleptomania as her “inability to trust people.” Like, what? I think an overwhelming amount of people on earth can say they have trust issues, but they have no compulsion to steal. I admit I have no experience with psychology. Hoping to take an intro course this summer though. 3. Carter having to turn his grandmother into the DMV because of her recently diagnosed condition. Do doctors really have to do this in some instances? I am a Type 1 (juvenile) diabetic diagnosed at 11, and I just had to promise I’d check my blood glucose before every time I got behind the wheel (I wear a CGM which makes it easy). And I wear a medical bracelet. But is there a list or something doctors are aware of when they have to report a patient? Sorry for all questions, but I know there are a variety of experienced people on the board that might help answering my curiosity.

So, I have “All in the Family” on Pop going kinda in the background as I work on school stuff before my first class of the day. I do like this episode in addition to “Be Still My Heart” (though in that episode Abby had barely arrived on the scene and was already showing she “knew more” than everyone else when she was arguing with Carter about doing heroic measures for that old woman even though the patient didn’t want it). But these episodes will always signal when the series started to wane with me, and the magic I felt among the cast and stories told was ebbing. I’ve seen the series all the way through already (probably a couple of times), and it’s always these episodes where I begin to get a bit sad for “earlier times.” Because these episodes signal, for me, the Era of Abby is imminent. 🙄 McCrane, Innes, and Kingston acted the hell out of this episode though. It still gets me with the scene with Corday and Romano and nurse Kit when Lucy is having the PE. And Weaver starting the ball rolling by finding them. And I’m not a Benton fan (arrogance, way he treated women - Jeannie especially sometimes), but him charging down the stairs, slamming into the cop to get to the trauma room to Carter hits as well. But, if the series “went downhill” or “lost its mojo” for y’all, at what point was it? Just curious.

Lol, yeah, it was. And Carter trying to spin a tale of Benton apologizing for mistreating him as Benton is coming out of anesthesia. 😆

Yeah, Wendell ends it because Carter doesn’t love her - or at least can’t say he does. I’m not sure how long the two had been dating before she told him she loves him in that ep. It may have felt to Carter a bit premature? I don’t know And Carter’s like, “I had a baby with her. I’m just supposed to cut her out of my life?” Yes, Carter, people do it all the time. You are not beholden to her for life because she birthed your stillborn child. If he’s going to date another woman, there need to be boundaries. Answering the call in the middle of the night IN BED with your current girlfriend was a dick move. I’m with Wendell; I wouldn’t stand for it either. But I think she still had an inkling there was something there with Kem because of the previous phone calls he received, but she never expected him to take a call while she was in bed next to him.

I choose to believe this as it would come full circle as Mark did a fair share of mentoring Carter when the latter was a med student. Kem was always so damn flaky to me. So wishy washy about things, demanding way more of Carter than he did her. He’d try and talk to her and she’d just whine and cry, “I can’t! I can’t!” Also, Kem was so up in Carter’s business regarding money (like when he said he’d pay for the woman with AIDS for meds when Kem wouldn’t put her in her program, bitching at him for doing so and mentioning also paying for her children’s meds). But she had no qualms with Carter dropping $9000+ on a plane ticket to Tokyo he wasn’t even going to use just because he had to see her off at her gate and not just in the airport lobby. Also, get a damn grip, Carter. 🙄 I saw the episode today where Banfield is taking hormones to try and have a baby. And she’s injecting them in the freaking public break room, and I’m thinking, “you can’t do this privately in the bathroom?” And then Neela calls her on it saying something like, “if you wanted it to be private you wouldn’t do it in the break room.” Banfield’s lame excuse is that “it’s 5:30 AM; I didn’t think anyone would be in here.” Uh. It’s a major trauma center ER - 24/7 service. How many personal phone calls/letters/correspondence did staff receive at the very busy and public front desk? And Carol faxing the all important letter in the very public fax machine? And Benton, Carol, and Kerry getting caught doing ultrasounds on themselves?

I thought that ep was boring as well. With the exception of the eps where Mark goes to California to his parents’ and even the Benton in Louisiana ep, I don’t enjoy the eps that are out of the ER and don’t include the whole cast. But I think Liotta won an Emmy for the guest appearance...? 🤷‍♀️ Not sure. I didn’t like his return either. His first arc with Mark wasn’t terrible; I though he and Edwards played well off each other. But his return and the spat with Susan didn’t do it for me. And I agree with everything said about Brenner. The man was repugnant. And using the molestation angle to possibly “explain” his behavior - no, that doesn’t get to be explained away. It’s an insult to victims of molestation as well to insinuate that. Also, the fact that he’s Anspaugh’s nephew, who is Chief of Staff (?) or whatever (I think?), and he’s hired reeks of shady nepotism, no? Like he’d be teflon if Laverne ever did go forward and complain about his treatment of her.

I would think so. And isn’t this the same Luka who came back from Africa all “we need to cut costs”, “we need to not do so many needless tests”, yada yada yada. Seems like an unnecessary skull X-ray to entertain some punkass kid would be costly. 🙄

Right, which is why I could only see Neela changing (or striving to change) for that one shift. My freshman year of college was 2019-2020, and I went to a few of those mixer things (pre-COVID obv) telling myself to be gregarious and outgoing. And I was able to for the most part, but only for the duration of the mixers. I couldn’t sustain it (I wish I could but, alas, I am an introvert). I wonder why the show changed writers so often? Did writers leave to work on other projects or were they booted off? Also, random side note, did one of the writers really like The Dixie Chicks or something? Because their music and several references to them are used. I agree with Carter though; not a fan of The Chicks music, lol.

I don’t find it hard to believe Neela’s abrupt change in personality (at least for the one episode) especially when faced with the prospect of being ranked in the bottom and not being chosen to continue at County. I kinda saw Carter’s talk with her as lighting a fire beneath her ass. But I agree about it being stupid the attendings waited that long to give feedback. If Carter, Lewis, Kovac, etc were good teachers/mentors, they would have noticed patterns and problems and been checking in with the students every so often. Even informally, like quick chats and catch-ups in the lounge or whatever. On an unrelated note re: Deezer D - Malik is my favorite nurse. Honestly, I liked the “background” nurses a lot more than the mains (Abby, Sam, Carol).

Lol my mom and I sometimes refer to him as Fast Food because he’s fat and greasy looking. I’ve seen Donal Logue in others things, most recently Stumptown, and though he’s a grizzly old man, he’s much better than ER. The ER Make-up and costume people did him no favors. And his long, unwashed hair didn’t help.

Didn’t Luka’s way of thinking after coming back from Africa (re: finding quick, non-expensive ways of ruling out illnesses) actually almost kill a guy? It was a guy who came in with nausea and stomach pains, but then he starts to feel better, so Luka sent him home. He ends up coming back with a ruptured appendix or something...? Sam always got on my nerves. The first time we meet her she’s “so badass” 🙄 and jabs that syringe into the guys neck. She’s also “so badass” when Romano grabs her, so she wrenches his prosthetic off. During one episode she’s being brought to task for some infraction (I forget what) and Kerry has discovered she’s left all the jobs she’s had before before the hospitals could fire her, and she tells Kerry something to the effect of “I’m a great nurse, and I don’t need this job. I can find another job at another hospital easily.” And Kerry says, “Something tells me you’ve used that explanation before.” So clearly her “badass-ness” made her a not so great employee. I hated any storyline with her and her son. When he was shipped off to that boarding school, I was like “thank god maybe we won’t see him anymore; just mentions of him. Wish they’d done this sooner.” Re: Carter and Kem. I always felt he was more invested in the relationship than she. Even before they lost the baby. To me Kem was looking for more of a sexual relationship with no strings because presumably Carter, at least at this point, was not thinking about moving to Africa. So I figured Kem thought they’d have fun and when he left, they’d be done. But then she got pregnant, so that tied her to Carter. Then they lost him and that tie was broken, and traumatically at that. So I always kinda thought Kem was there just because of the baby, but Carter was there because he wanted a real relationship. But she irritates the hell out of me. i’m glad Carter never got back together with her. And Susan mentions she’s divorced from Chuck (another terrible character that made me question what Susan ever saw in him). So I like to imagine that Susan got her early personality back from seasons 1-3 and got together with Carter.

I think part of Benton wanting to out Doug for missing the tumor in the boy’s leg and telling the grandfather was in part due to his reluctance (at first) to pursue the allegations he had against Vucelich manipulating data to make his study look better. He saw a “softer” opportunity to do something he perceived as “noble” and good; one that wouldn’t potentially obliterate his career. I think Mark (?) actually called him on it in that respect - something like, “it’s easy when it’s not your butt on the line!” or similar. I recently watched an episode where Benton’s privileges have been revoked by Romano, so he’s out looking for a job but finding it difficult. A doctor he interviewed with tells him he will probably have trouble finding work locally, implying Romano has been trashing his reputation throughout Chicago’s medical system. is this legal? Can previous employers trash talk a previous employee to potential employers? Can they only do it when they’re contacted regarding the job applicant? But this ep made it seem Romano might have been talking to people unsolicited...

Re: Carol. I just watched one of the eps of her “possibly going to med school” arc, and it begins with her snapping at her mother for being “dismissive” and not “encouraging her to dream” (or whatever) and not believing in her. But her mother didn’t say anything of the sort! Her mother cooked her breakfast, and I forget what she said, but it wasn’t anything remotely bad or dismissive. But Carol loses it, and yells, “You’re always doing that! Making me feel like I’m not good enough! Or I can’t do anything!” Like, uh, your mom didn’t say anything like that. I think this is also the same ep where she questions Doyle’s orders of giving a patient meds that will increase his cardiac output, but further impair his kidneys. It takes Doug to get her to do her job of carrying out the doctor‘s orders. Ok, yes, Carol, you took the MCAT and did well on it, but Doyle took them too AND actually completed med school. Carol was so jealous of Doyle being younger than her and from the same stomping grounds but having to take direction from her. Re: Ruby. It was a lot to put on Carter to take care of Ruby’s wife. Vucelich all bIt admitted at the beginning when they were discussing treatment and how one treatment will cause problems and them treating those problems will cause more that it would be futile. Then when Carter came to him, Vucelich likened Ruby’s wife to a sinking ship and Carter was rearranging the deck chairs. Well, he and Benton gave Carter no support. The two didn’t want to deal with her, so they pushed it onto a med student. Carter tried, and he even gave Ruby his pager number to contact him. And when Ruby pages him in the middle of the night (when he’s already not getting enough sleep because med school), he doesn’t try to rush him off the phone. He patiently listens to Ruby’s concerns. Yes, Carter should’ve been more forthcoming and upfront and honest regarding Ruby’s wife, but he was a med student. I don’t think it all should’ve been put on him. And Carter tried to rectify his past mistake by being upfront and honest later about Ruby’s own treatment.

I didn’t know she died! Wow, just read about it on wiki...pulmonary embolism ☹️ I keep going back to the scene where the gravity of Mark’s dad’s situation is confirmed - Mark is in the X-ray reading room along with that radiologist, and he puts his dad’s chest X-ray up. The look on Mark’s face just sucks the air out of the room, and the radiologist, before he knows it’s Mark’s father, comments about how bad the patient has it. Edwards and John Cullum had great chemistry as son and father.