MajesticMariposa

Ugh. What a complete waste. How could they completely kill all of that momentum that was built from Thurs/Friday? The editing was awful. Not looking forward to this week like I expected. -JMW looked really pretty in pink, and LSV looked handsome in his blue. Whoever picked out Thomas' jacket/shirt obviously ran out of inspiration.💀 -How odd to skip straight to the plane. Also, how odd to not show any conversation between Thope. I guess I'm supposed to believe that brief exchange on the plane was the only discussion? We've barely seen Thomas' POV throughout this whole storyline, which is fine, but it would be kind of nice to know what's going on. What'd they do after they left the cafe? Just lazy. Hope has blown up everyone's lives with her impulsiveness. Would've liked to have seen some immediate followup. -What happened with Steam? Steffy didn't know he went home until she randomly texted him on the plane? They just parted and went their separate ways after all of that? 🙄 -Andrea Bocelli is legendary. Awesome. Bridge is reunited for life. Great. There was no need to spend 80% of the episode on them, especially when it was obvious all those scenes were filmed in LA. That should have been cut with an extended scene released. Also, how incredibly selfish to have everyone waiting on you. -Liam must be exhausted. Still don't care about his tears. -I'm going to assume all the Lope fallout will happen in one day. Otherwise, I don't see how Liam could keep his trip secret. Also kind of sad that Hope apparently has no idea who is taking care of her kids (or Thomas for that matter). You'd think she would check in. -I hope a pap snapped a pic of Steam and Thope and of Liam crying.

Hope has a big heart and genuinely believes he has changed. They have (brief-ish?) romantic history. She feels gratitude for his contribution in saving HFTF. She has admitted that she finds him attractive, funny, etc. I don't think it's completely out of the realm of possibility for her to act on this underlying impulse and just give in. There are a lot of parallels to the Wyatt/Paris storyline (Side note: It was kind of icky for $Cupid to offer Lope to take the same yacht Hott used for their honeymoon for a romantic getaway.😐) I think we're going to see that on Monday. What I got from the scenes and lack of dialogue is that they (Hope) decided to just enjoy the day and revel in their shared happiness. I don't think she's made a choice. She acted on her desires and just decided to indulge her desires for a moment. She's not going to upend her entire life. The internal conflict will come later after the moment ends. I don't see how he has any right to take Beth. One, he asked Thomas to look after her when he was in prison, which (I would hope) means that Liam believes that Thomas has the capacity to be a good person. Plus, I don't know how he could specifically take Beth without impacting Douglas or even Kelly, who presumably spends time with her uncle. It would be kind of weird to "protect" one kid and not the others. Totally agree. I think the fallout is going to play out super quickly. It's annoying that they imploded Braylor for this and then fast-tracked Bridge in Rome just for this angst. I feel like the conflict with their kids could be played out just as well without a romantic connection. They really need to settle the older generation. It's exhausting. On another note, now that there's an "avenue" for Sally to return to LA, I think it would be cool to reintroduce the Spectra clan and have her and Thomas start their own fashion house. The show is in desperate need of some more characters and dynamics. Fingers crossed that that's what's happening with this story. It has the potential to blow up everyone's lives if handled the right way and doesn't even necessarily require a Thope pairing to do it.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have a soap opera! 🤣🤣🤣 I didn't think anything could top seeing Liam's face crack yesterday, but I was wrong. I don't care what happens after this. Yesterday and today more than make up for the 3+ months of whining and repetition. My Thope heart is happy. It doesn't even matter that I know where this is headed. Seeing the Waffler cry was enough to buy my soap loyalty for the next few months. (Of course his first instinct is to kiss Steffy and ruin someone else's life.🙄) I didn't even mind Bridge. This is why I watch soap operas! I got everything on my Rome wishlist. All that's left to make it extra sweet would be an awkward plane ride back to L.A., but they'll probably skip it. That's okay. I won't be greedy lol. Perfect way to end the week! 🥂Ciao!

A separate post about the last few episodes since my other post was so long lol. Funniest line of the day goes to Brooke (to Thomas, re: the need for Thope to be "ambassadors" to maintain the peace between the two families): "There's no need for that. We're all adults." 😂😂😂Sure, if the definition of adult is strictly being over the age of 18, then sure. You're all adults lol. Second funniest line of the day goes to Thomas for thanking Hope for "inviting" him to Rome. Um, he's the lead designer. He doesn't have to be "invited" to the fashion preview for the work that he helped create. 🙄What an odd, unnecessary line. Third place goes to Hope for telling Steffy that Liam doesn't tell her how to run HFTF. Maybe, but it sure hasn't been for lack of trying lol.😂 Runner-up goes to Brooke for her line on Friday to Hope about muses and Greek/Roman mythology and how Thope is going to the birthplace of it all, purely for Hope's WTF look of incredulity.😂 Final thoughts: I no longer have the wherewithal to comment on Liam's whining campaign. Someone should remind him that Thomas is the reason he and $Bill got out of jail and that he asked Thomas to look after Hope and the kids when Liam was in jail. Even if it was out of some misplaced guilt about Vinny, he still did it (and ignored every other option at his disposal), which must mean that on some level he does believe there is goodness in Thomas. (Everything Thomas did after this was small potatoes compared to everything he did before.) And who does Liam think he is to try to interfere in his wife's moment and try to stop Thomas from attending? Imagine the lead designer Zooming in to Rome.☠️ If you're that worried, hire a bodyguard or a PI or something. (Though I do find it interesting how the dialogue has switched to focus on Hope's fidelity rather than her well-being. Even Brooke was telling her that she needed to "respect your marriage to Liam" instead of the usual "Thomas is a big bad monster and everyone must be shielded from him." Within the context of a soap opera, I don't see how anything Thomas has done is unforgivable. Across both sister shows, there are numerous characters who have done far worse who are somehow allowed to walk across the screen and date without backlash. It's one thing to dislike it, but I've seen people on other forums and social media sites have veritable meltdowns over Thope, going so far as to tag actors to spew hate and to email people at CBS and send them nasty letters. Some of the stuff I've seen is actually horrifying. And most of these people claim to have been watching for decades. In that case, where is all this self-righteous morality coming from? They should know by now how this goes. Regardless of whether it's a moment or something more, Thope (if they even do anything) will not be a permanent pairing. I hate saying it, but some of these people really need to touch grass. (Note: I am in no way talking about the people that hate Thope or Thomas, etc. I am strictly referring to the people who have taken their hate to the "real world." The fact that KKL had to write a tweet telling people to calm down about Braylor is embarrassing.) Is it just because it's Hope? Idk. I like the creative choice to slowly reveal more of Thomas' face in Hope's fantasy as she allows herself to even more slowly admit the truth to herself. I also like how we clearly see that she is "the boss" of the fantasy, which goes back to my earlier point about Hope being frustrated that people are treating her like a child and not allowing her to make her own decisions in peace. I admit that a lot of my love for Thope is because of the chemistry between MA and AN. I doubt this would have worked with PF, but who knows? They are both so talented, but I specifically doubt that MA will stick around much longer. Not only is his talent being wasted, but he just seems so beyond the soap opera genre in general (and I don't mean this as a knock against anyone else, because soap opera acting is difficult, no matter how goofy it might seem sometimes). I hope he gets a chance to expand his career before his window closes. All that is to say that reason Thope is finally being explored may be because they want to "use" that chemistry while it is still available. Lastly, poor Hope. Everyone just needs to leave her alone and let her have her Hot Girl Summer in Rome. 😭😭😭

Same. I usually lurk, but there's been so much wasted potential with the current storylines that I've wanted to get my thoughts out in "public" more. There was absolutely no reason for Braylor to end, especially when the episodes immediately following the fallout were essentially completely detached from the blowup. There were a million other ways to reunite Bridge that could have left the friendship intact. They clearly went out of their way to give Bridge these flirty, "pact-breaking" moments, so why not just continue that thread? Why not have Taylor develop a relationship with someone else? Why not have her realize that the pact (🙄) was keeping Bridge from fulfilling their "eternal love" (née "destiny")? Brooke could have been contributing to the line/company in some way in an effort to ignore her heart and prioritize the friendship, which would have laid the groundwork for her joining the group in Rome (not that she needs a reason beyond supporting her daughter, but whatever). Taylor could have eventually given her blessing for Bridge and told Brooke to join him in Rome, which would bring us to where we currently are anyway. It's time to settle the grandparent-and-above-aged people and start better developing the younger crowd so that there's actually a chance of the show continuing for another 9,000+ episodes. Foreign popularity can only hold on so long, and most of the other countries are years behind anyway, so it would be a while for them to even feel the effects. There is enough conflict between Thope, Carter and Katie, Batie (which should have been running along this but has been crickets), RJ's return (maybe he could've been involved and paid someone to date Taylor? I'm over parent-trapping but at least it would get him involved), Sheila's pending escape, Thomas rebuilding his life, Liam spiraling, maybe something with Paris (she could've discovered the aforementioned RJ scheme, though admittedly that would have been a repeat of the Quarter thing, but whatever)...the point is that there are other stories going on and the friendship did not need to be sacrificed. If anything, if it must have ended, I would have instead they at least wait until Thope is actually a thing. Between the two options, I would rather see them feuding over their children than over Ridge. Re: Thope. Yes! Totally agree with everything you said. There is so much potential for a good, nuanced story here that could incorporate so much history and all the things Hope has been forced to hold back all these years. This story may be about Thope but it's not about "Thomas and Hope," it's about Hope and all her pent-up frustration--specifically, her frustration with everyone around her (aside from Thomas, at the moment) treating her as though she is a child unable to make her own judgments and decisions. It's weird because Thope is both 'too late" and "too early." On the one hand, I want something big to happen between them in Rome, and on the other, I think it would be better if, like you said, Thomas were to turn Hope down. The last time Hope seemed to have fun was when she was with Wyatt. I can't remember enough of the handful of scenes DB and AN have had to have an opinion on whether they have chemistry, but within this grand narrative of Hope "taking back her power," I think it would have been interesting for her to "take Wyatt away" from the woman who helped orchestrate her baby's kidnapping. After that ended and there was a release of the pain from that time and a release from the need to be perfect in comparison to her mother, then they could move toward Thope once Hope isn't so "clean." Idk. I typed a lot, but your post inspired me lol.

He did, though. It was during the episode when Hope told Liam that she had changed her mind about working with Thomas. (I think he had discussed it with Wyatt?) He says something along the lines of Steffy "making Hope go along with" rehiring Thomas, and Hope points out that Steffy wasn't the only person pushing. This entire arc seems to be focused on Hope's agency and her ability to make decisions as an independent, mature fully formed person when everyone around her constantly treats her like a child. There was all this talk about "pressuring Hope" when she has said countless times throughout this entire thing that she made the decision to save her line. No one forced them to work together. In fact, this is brought up again during one of Liam's rants to Steffy (can't remember the episode offhand) and she says something along the lines of "everyone is watching Thomas" and "I wouldn't have brought him back if I thought she would be in danger." This was all said during the "friendship" phase with Hope/Steffy and Braylor, so there's no real reason to doubt her sincerity in that moment, and Liam himself agrees that she wouldn't knowingly put Hope at risk. A few episodes after that, I believe Steffy asked Hope and she said everything was cool. The real issue is that (a) everyone seems to be unable to accept that Hope is capable of having "feelings" for Thomas without his interference and (b) Hope seems to think that having these feelings will tarnish her in some way, when really, as long as she continues to "manage them," it doesn't have to be anything more than a fleeting fantasy. Sadly, she feels so much pressure to be nothing like her mother that she is spiraling, and she apparently has no friends she can talk to without judgment. This even goes back to when she was trying to build her relationship with Deacon a year or so ago and everyone kept telling her to not trust him, etc. She kept talking about how frustrating and demoralizing it was for everyone to dissuade her from building a relationship with her dad and how it feels like no one trusts her or her judgment. This has been building for a while, and her frustration is only getting worse.

This actually brings up an interesting philosophical question, and I would be interested in hearing other perspectives about this. Personally, I think there's something "magical," for lack of a better adjective, about the "reformed villain" attaining their formally corrupt desires through "legitimate" avenues. Sort of a "reward" for finally being good and making the point that good things happen to people who do good things. This is a simplistic summary, but you get the point. This might be too deep of a discussion for a soap, though, with all the narrative wiping and musical chairs and whatnot lol. But yeah, I just think if the original "victim" of the transgressions (i.e. Hope) has forgiven and wiped the slate clean with the "villain," there should be no issue with the person receiving those original desires, though I can see the argument that those original desires should be forever lost to that person. From a production standpoint, Thope has been teased on and off for like 5 years, and I think it's important to kind of tick that box and answer the question of whether this is something that can actually work narratively. Whether or not it works, who knows? But I think the audience (those in favor and those opposed) is somewhat "owed" an answer after all this time and to see what that moment would actually look like. Really hoping to get some more thoughts on this! I think it's a really interesting discussion! 💖

You definitely are not the only one. Annika and Matthew have great chemistry, and I'm excited to see where the Thope story leads. Liam and Hope have been together for...4 (5?) years now, I believe. It's time for a change again. Regarding Thomas' transgressions, nothing he has done is any worse than what most of the other characters in Soap Opera Land have done, and they all are somehow able to serve as romantic interests without any hoopla. I don't know when or why Thomas somehow became the face of the Baby Beth situation, but I'm over it. If Flo, who orchestrated the kidnapping from the beginning and who was compensated for a stolen baby (don't care if she "gave the money back") and posed as a birth mother to a woman in Hope's life (what kind of sick logic is that?) is able to have her slate cleaned because she donated a kidney and is involved with Wyatt...anything Thomas did should be moot. Beth was gone for nearly a year (8/9 months I think?). Thomas found out near the end, and although his main motivation was to force Hope into a family with him and Douglas, he also had the motivation of not wanting to rip a child away from his sister. Regardless, if everyone can somehow accept and support that Wyatt is engaged to the woman who stole his niece, I don't want to hear anything about what Thomas did. Don't even get me started on Quinn (sorry, "Eve"), who was somehow allowed to become the Forrester matriarch after assaulting and kidnapping Liam (aka "Adam"). I took a very long break after that. Anyway, the only thing that Thomas can really be blamed for at this point is anything that happened after the brain tumor discovery and maybe his treatment of Douglas, though again we've been told (ad nauseam 😜) that he has repaired that relationship. The Parent Trap stuff he pulled has been done by nearly every character who has parents who aren't together, and Emma was texting and driving on Mulholland of all places. He drugged Liam, but I can't remember if anyone else ever found that out. The Caroline stuff was forgiven. The mannequin was because of the tumor...I'm sure I've forgotten some things, but yeah, it really doesn't matter when people who have done worse (Bill, Ridge, etc.) are walking around scot-free. I don't know if I necessarily want them to be in a relationship, but I don't get all this outrage when there are other characters who have been in relationships with men who have done similar (ex. Adam and Sharon on YR--but again, Thomas did not actively participate in the kidnapping). I am a younger viewer (early 20s) who has been watching the show with my grandmother on and off my whole life but faithfully for the past 9-ish or so years (around the time Quinn and Wyatt debuted), so a lot of my knowledge of the history is from my grandmother or the wiki, and there's some truly awful stuff that seems to have been swept under the rug, so I'm not sure why this should be different. TK and KKL definitely have strong platonic energy, but if the showrunners want them together, they need to do it and be done. I'm assuming RJ was brought back to reignite the parent trapping--whatever. Their status needs to be settled and left alone. Scott Clifton is an amazing actor. He's always great, and he's great with subtle reactions and expressions that would look cartoony on most other people. The other episode when he put 2+2 together about Hope's sudden passion was magnificent. But yeah, I don't mind Liam but he's definitely irked these past few weeks constantly whining and moaning to everyone about Thomas. Literally in the span of one day, this never-ending day which has spanned over a week for us--he has whined to Wyatt, driven across town to moan at Thomas, driven back to work to whine to $Bill, then gone out of his way to drive to the cliff house to whine to Steffy (after whining to her for weeks already) under the guise of visiting his daughter.🙄Of course he came at bedtime so he could corner Steffy and whine some more. She didn't seek him out and blab about Hope. She exploded because she was tired of the whining, as anyone would be. Now Hope is projecting and throwing her under the bus to cover her own lies when not too long ago she was also asking to Steffy to advocate on her behalf and convince Liam to accept Thomas. I suspect their newfound "friendship" will disappear when/if Bridge reunites. 🙄 Anyway, that was a lot. I'm taking a break until the It seems that we're stalling and running in circles to get to that point. I get that repetition and reiteration is necessary for soaps so that anyone can theoretically jump in at any time, but this is ridiculous. I haven't felt this annoyed since the Baby Beth storyline, and the words "changed," "not the same person" and "feelings" have all been added to my list of trigger words. It's too much. My brain needs a break. Anyway, that was my long-winded way of saying you aren't alone lol. I usually only lurk on this board since most people have opposite opinions, but I recognize that I don't have the same history with the show as most viewers do.💖

I know lol. I've watched soaps forever. Just reacting to the current (non)storyline. I don't think bringing RJ back and reinforcing the tangled family tree was the right move when they're building up to a romantic Thope pairing. JMO.

Does anyone else find it odd that they decided to bring RJ back when they're in the process of setting up Thope? Obviously, Thomas and Hope aren't biologically related, but sharing a biological sibling with someone should be enough to kill any lusty feelings IMO. The optics are icky (it's a soap, but still). If they were so desperate to bring RJ back, it should have waited until after the Thope affair began and then we could have the "half-brother rivalry" or whatever. I'm getting flashbacks to the yucky feelings I had when Wyatt and Katie were a thing. RJ's presence is a reminder of how homogenous the gene pool of this show is, which was not needed at all. It's extra annoying because now we're going to have weeks of repetitive, awkward dialogue to remind us how everyone is related. Ugh. So desperate for new, nonfamilial blood!

Not sure what this means. It's cold in the studio, and the twins who play him have different hair lengths. Not sure why the hat bugs so many people. I, for one, appreciate this tiny attempt at continuity considering everything else we have to endure. Also, I'm just glad we have a real baby and not the burrito blanket.

As a younger viewer, I enjoyed watching all of the throwback episodes, though I admit it is a bit surreal to see episodes that aired before I was born. It sounds...arrogant (for lack of a better word), but it's difficult to imagine the show being around before I watched. (I had no idea our current intro was a twist on an old one--it makes me hate it a bit less. lol) It's like seeing old photos or videos of your parents...difficult to imagine they had a life before I came around. ;) It was also nice watching the old episodes with my grandmother and seeing her enjoyment. She got a real kick out of filling in gaps and explaining certain story lines to me. I've been watching B&B (and Y&R) for 5 years, and this show has been a huge part of my life, cheesy as it sounds. It carried me through my final years of high school and now was I prepare to finish college. Everyone thinks I'm crazy for watching these but there's something appealing about soaps and how they air daily. I didn't realize how much I missed the show! I watched the catch-up episode, though I really didn't need it, and thought it was handled cleverly. I love the theme song and loved how it was incorporated. I loved watching out for all the "social-distancing" moments. I assume that's why we have these bad wigs? Safer than actually styling the hair and can be done ahead of time. I really loved Zoe's wedding hair, so the difference was kind of stark. As excited as I am for Carter to have a storyline beyond officiating weddings, I'm not sure I want him to be in a relationship with Zoe. He seems too...mature (?) for her. I'm not sure how to articulate what I'm thinking exactly, but something is off about the pairing. Idk. As a Steffy fan, I'm really excited for her to have a new guy. I was hoping they would bring Leo back, but the new guy seems okay. As long as he doesn't turn out to be another long, lost relative, I'm happy. Not everyone needs to be related! I have no interest in the Sally/Flo story line, the same way I had no interest in the baby switch or the Quinn redemption story line, so I will continue to fast forward through those. I am not interested in a Flo redemption story. I'm excited for the new episodes and to return to my lurker status on the forum. Looking forward to reading everyone's thoughts!

Loved today's episode! Quinn's giddiness was so infectious--I was giggling alongside her. Of course Brooke blamed Thomas. For some reason, everything is his fault. I know most people here hate Ridge, but I love the character as well as TK, so I was happy to see him have a chance to really express himself today. I don't see what he did with Shauna as the same as Brooke's kiss with Bill. Ridge was open about his involvement with Shauna, and it happened when Brooke and Ridge were on their "break," so I don't see the issue with it. Regardless, Brooke doesn't get a pass for kissing her sister's husband (AGAIN), even if Bill is the one who initiated it. The fact that he just stood there in silence killed me. Who makes out with someone to comfort them? Have any of these people ever heard of a hug? A pat on the shoulder? An invitation to get some food? Anything that doesn't involve swapping body fluids? I know the show will probably be annoy me again next week, so I'll just keep this one on the DVR for a while to remember better days.

Today's episode was amazing! I haven't felt this great about the show since The Slap Heard 'Round the World ™ 🤣 Of course, we all know this means we're about to enter a six-week slump. A part of me was hoping Thomas would outsmart them and go through with the wedding, but I'm glad they didn't do that since it would mean dragging this storyline out even more. Now our drama will be about Bill and Brooke's "secret," which should be lovely, I'm sure. I know I'm at a party for one with my love of Thomas, but a part of me hopes he comes back for revenge. All the actors were amazing today! This will be one I keep saved to the DVR for a while. ♥️

God, this show is so stupid. I'm so sick so soap operas placing the blame solely on the woman when someone cheats. Steffy initiated the kiss, sure, but Liam was more than capable of pushing her away. Maybe direct some of your venom at him, Hope. And I guess we are to assume that "let me show you what's in my heart" scene, where Liam initiated a kiss with Steffy, was supposed to be left on the cutting room floor? He kissed her! But apparently now he is claiming to have never stopped loving her? And Hope is just supposed to believe that those two have been living together all this time without any funny business going on? And all that family talk, with absolutely no mention of Kelly? Oh, that's right. This show seems to believe a man can only be committed to a biological child if he is married to the mother--evidenced by the fact that Liam has been missing out on all these "moments" and "milestones" with Beth. But when he missed out on all those moments with Kelly, it was okay? It's okay that Kelly will only see her little sister for no more than 30 minutes at a time because Hope is too insecure to let her spend the night and comes to snatch her away the moment Steffy is within two feet of her? Don't even get me started on the #Brill kiss. I'll admit I am a fan of that pairing, but there is this thing called subtlety. There was plenty of opportunity to lay breadcrumbs of their attraction rekindling and it could even been tied in to the Sally story (ex. Katie pulls away because of the secret, Bill starts spending more time around Brooke) and we should have seen Bill more prior to this, more connected to the Thomas story (ex. Bill and Ridge fighting over Thomas, Bill threatening to call his sister, etc.). This kiss came out of absolutely nowhere and instead of being happy, I'm annoyed. There is so much more I could say, but I'm honestly getting more and more pissed off the more I think about it, because there is no reason for this. I realize it's difficult to write a script for basically every day of the year, but come on. It was done before and if someone were to put in even a modicum of extra effort, it could be like that again. Ugh. *Apologies for any grammar mistakes. I'm too annoyed to read over this and edit.