HazelEyes4325
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Posts posted by HazelEyes4325
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4 hours ago, debraran said:
Re the custody battle, does anyone think D would want to parent 100% of the time. How many calls would be made anyway and is Sophie going to be the baby's surrogate mom? I saw that happen in a less affluent family. The gap was 13 years and she was given a lot of responsibility on top of school. She can hire someone but also will be damsel in distress.
3Oh, you see the baby just won't exist unless he or she can be an accessory for Delilah. You know, like her other two kids.
But, yeah, I can totally see Sophie stepping up as a second mother. On one hand...hey, if that's what she wants to do more power to her. But, if it feels like she *has* to mother this baby, just like she has to step up and be a mother to her own mother because Delilah refuses to be a mother, that's different. Lizzie Greene is a strong young actress and while I'd like to see her get more airtime, I don't want it to be as a permanent babysitter.
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27 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:
Essentially, you can see that the early episodes were made only to get the show on the air. Once it did, any plans that Nash had seemed to go out the window as his mind seemed to change while working on the following episodes.
The ironic part is that even though some of the story elements in the early episodes didn't work (Eddie and Delilah...), those were probably the best episodes of the season as they focused on the 3 men and their relationship with each other. Once that went out of the window, the show went downhill.
ETA: About what you said regarding Gary becoming the most popular character. I think the reason we saw so much of Gary and much less of everyone else is that Gary is essentially D.J. Nash. In other words, Nash is writing himself into the show through Gary. Nash can't relate as well to either Eddie or Rome, so we just don't see as much of him.
I may be way off base here, but everything I've read/seen/heard of D.J. Nash (who I hadn't even heard of before this show!) makes me think this guy can barely contain his own ego and we (the viewers) are all here to pay him homage.
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29 minutes ago, Dani said:
I think you’re exactly right. So much of what was set up in the first half of the season was completely dumped in the second half and it was a jarring transition. I suspect that it will hurt the show when people try and binge watch over the summer.
ETA: I do think that the transition could have been a good one for the show if it hadn’t been so poorly written. Instead of laying the groundwork they just started writing a different show.
You raise a good point that I hadn't considered. There are basically 2 groups of people watching this. Those who watch it week by week and those who binge it once it hits Netflix or once it is complete on Hulu. Personally, I was annoyed at the nonsensical turns of the show (I mentioned how it really didn't make sense how Eddie and Katherine's story developed. It seemed like a mouse in a maze who kept running into walls and then turning around and trying a new way) and I know from experience that these things are much more pronounced when you watch an entire season of a show in a short period of time.
I guess we'll have to see what the ratings are for season 2. I am expecting to see a noticeable dip.
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16 minutes ago, iwasish said:
I wonder if Jon hadn’t committed suicide, just how the baby story would have played out. Of course, If he hadn’t killed himself there wouldn’t be a show.
Its hard to believe that none of the mega financial mess that Jon created made the papers.
My guess is that Eddie and Delilah would have gone through with leaving their spouses. Then, a week later, Delilah will realize that Eddie is a child and Eddie will realize that Delilah wants him to provide for her and that would be that. Then the pregnancy would be discovered. If it were Jon's baby, a lot of groveling and trying to reconciling with spouses would happen. If it were Eddie's, we'd have two very unhappy people (and probably two other people who were glad to be rid of them). And, since this is Delilah, who she says is the father is not, so you know...
This might actually have been a better show for Nash to write. He seems proud that he has a soap opera and that's a soap opera. Instead, he has this other show with a great premise and loads of potential and it seems far too much for him to handle.
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I made a tongue-in-cheek comment in the Speculation thread that Nash has forgotten that Eddie is an alcoholic. Once I wrote that I realized how many of his "spoilers" didn't pan out...and I don't mean they didn't pan out in a "gotcha" way. Instead, it seemed like Nash just decided not to deliver on what he himself said (or what he said through the actors). I mostly pay attention to the Katherine/Eddie storyline as it is the only one that interests me, but there we have:
- Eddie would struggle with his alcoholism (this was mentioned, what? twice during the whole season?)
- Eddie would always love Delilah. That hasn't turned out.
- Someone would find out about the baby this season--although there is a possibility that DG said this thinking the entirety of the Eddie/Katherine scene would air during the first season.
Again, I don't think that Nash was trying to throw out red herrings or fool anyone. I honestly think he just didn't have a plan for the season and kept changing his mind on what he wanted to do. And it showed.
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27 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:
Here’s a theory-Eddie tells Katherine about the baby. She is rightfully pissed and says We are Done for Good and files the divorce papers. Delilah has the baby. Something comes up and the baby is Jon’s-birthmark, blood type, whatever. Eddie has lost on both fronts. Drinking relapse?
Possible. Although I think Nash has forgotten that Eddie is an alcoholic (thoughts on this in the spoiler thread).
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Okay finished that...I found it interesting, but probably not in the ways I should have.
First off, holy shit...was that William Shatner in the airport cart in front of the bar where Jon met Delilah? I went back twice and it really, really looks like him...but whyyyyy? I mean, 3 seconds on a camera is not Shatner's jam.
Now that's out of the way.
I have to admit that this episode felt really, really, really long. I checked how much time I had left several times and was shocked that I still had 20, 10, whatever minutes to go. I think what was actually accomplished in this episode could have been done in half the time.
When Delilah was watching that video and Jon said that she was the love of his life, I hope guilt was stabbing her. But, of course, it probably wasn't. Also, this whole "baby is early" thing is crap. If she had "less than 4 weeks" to go, she's full-term. That is NOT early. Secondly, I now have a bad feeling that we're going to get more baby daddy lies coming up in season 2, either that Jon is really the Dad, or that Delilah doubles down on that lie for Eddie.
Also, clutching your stomach when you have been fine all day IS NOT HOW LABOR WORKS! I get it, actual labor is...not that interesting. But I really wish that shows would quit using fantasy childbirth.
So, Eddie and Katherine. Magnificent acting on both their parts and, really, their acting has been topnotch all season. What hasn't been topnotch has been the writing. If you follow their story closely, it actually doesn't make sense how they got from point A to point B, which makes me even more convinced that Nash yanked the actors around on this story. I mean, it's jarring when you are watching a show and it is clear that the showrunner changed paths abruptly, but I can only imagine how frustrating it must be playing a role one way and then all of a sudden have to change your characterization.
Oh, and I was expecting (maybe because someone mentioned it here) that Eddie was making googly eyes earlier in the episode at Delilah. I actually didn't see that. I saw a lot of regret from him, perhaps both from the fact that his affair effed up his marriage but also--and probably much more likely--that he would never be a father to his (supposed) baby (I still can't get over the cruelty on Delilah's part to even ask this of him). That was actually some more good acting on Giuntoli's part (and, as a David Giuntoli fan, I'm delighted to see him doing so well in this show, even if the show isn't always doing so well for his character).
Here is my possibly unpopular opinion: I'm okay with the Rome wanting a baby storyline. I mean, it will fucking piss me off if Regina has a "change of heart" and "sees the light," but the set up of a couple agreeing to no kids and then one of them changing his or her mind is so, so common. I've seen it happen with my friends and in my own family. And I actually thought the dialogue around it was some of the most realistic this whole season. And, while I think Rome's stated reason for wanting a baby--to "put things in perspective"--is almost (but not quite) as bad as having a baby because you were too lazy to get Plan B when the condom broke during sex with your husband's best friend, I still found his change of heart genuine.
This may just be me but I want to see "real" (but fictional) people going through real problems. Trying to repair a marriage after infidelity is real. Trying to reconcile a relationship where one person has a change of heart about parenthood is real. Trying to accept and treat depression is real (and wouldn't it be nice if this show actually did that?). The whole Barbara Morgan/real estate/9-11 stuff is not real and I really don't want to see more of that in season 2.
ETA: One more thing I forgot. I didn't say anything about the airport and/or 9-11 scenes (other than WAS THAT WILLIAM SHATNER???) because everything I would say has already been said...except for one WTF thing.
When the guys were going to Vancouver for the game, why the hell did they have Eddie get their tickets? First of all, didn't Jon always take care of everything. Secondly, Eddie is not a functioning adult. Why on Earth would anyone think it would be a good idea to let him make travel plans?
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I'm finally watching this and I am, I kid you not, 1:03 in and I'm yelling "PIVOT!"
#friendsdiditbetter
ETA: At 1:11 we have an apartment swap so that a romantic couple within a group of friends can live together.
I'm now starting to wonder how many Friends did it better moments there are in this episode...
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When I was a younger adult, I read a lot, and I mean a lot, of Maeve Binchy. And then I just stopped. I really don't remember why.
I was thinking about this as I made an attempt to konmari the crap out of my TBR bookcase. The first book I picked up was something by Maeve Binchy I hadn't read. I looked at it, remember that I liked her way back when and that she is now dead, and put it back on the shelf. That was also the end of my attempt to konmari my TBR's (which overflow from that bookcase (yes, bookCASE).
Now, whether I'll go back and actually read that book remains to be seen.
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On 3/4/2019 at 11:28 AM, helenamonster said:
In my senior year high school English class, our final project was to pick a book from the Norton Critical Editions collection and write an essay on it (Norton Critical Editions are classic works of literature that also include a bunch of secondary sources at the back that give the works context and help with analysis). One girl in my class picked Moby Dick. When I was talking with my teacher about my paper, we got into a conversation about what other students were reading, and she mentioned the girl reading Moby Dick. My teacher's exact words: "I tried to get her to pick something else. She says she's enjoying it, but nobody enjoys Moby Dick." Even the English teachers are out here telling us to not bother with that one!
1When I was in High School, we had to read an abridged version of Moby Dick and our teacher started out by saying, "Trust me, this is much better than the real deal."
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42 minutes ago, iwasish said:
Just because she hasn’t mentioned any change in due date doesn’t mean she wasn’t told. The way this show seems to play fast and loose with the story line and facts it wouldn’t shock me if it turns out Delilah now knows it’s Jon’s and just failed to tell Eddie. It doesn’t seem like they even have much contact anymore. All that passion fizzled out pretty quickly. Despite Jon’s plea to “ love each other”
I want to agree with this. I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong and I actually wouldn't be surprised if this comes to pass. Let us not forget that Delilah claimed two different people were the father in one episode. She is far from reliable or truthful.
My only reservation--which is sort of a stupid reservation given this show--is that it just seems so far-fetched. I know, I need to manage my expectations here. But I can still see it. As you said, Delilah was done with Eddie the moment she could no longer use him to hurt Jon and I can see how it would work that she told him he was the Daddy because she wanted the support AND she wanted him in her orbit, not because he's actually the father.
Still, that would be soapy, beyond soapy. But, with Nash, soapy is apparently not a criticism as he seems rather proud that this is a soap opera.
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23 minutes ago, debraran said:
Babies though are never shown, not great for most stories and since Sophie and Danny are background, I imagine the baby will be even more.
1As I said before, if a show can't handle the kids they have appropriately, it has no business bringing in a baby.
24 minutes ago, debraran said:I wonder too, re Jon seeing them together vs just suspecting, made it easier for him to leave. Not that it was the main reason, but just was one less thing to worry about. I also think Ashley seeing them together in that ticket photo she didn't show Jon made her resent Delilah more. She has this great guy and look at what she is doing while he works kind of thing. Just wonder if that was part of her bad behavior. I'm sure it will come out later.
2I hadn't thought about it, but the Ashley angle really doesn't make sense, does it? If this were on paper (or in a different show), I think we would see some resentment or hostility from Ashley towards Delilah, as Ashley did know about the affair and was obviously fond of Jon, not to mention she seemed to see herself as his protector in a way. Plus, it seemed that Ashley was part of the Dixon family. Yet, we didn't see any of that here. It could have been bad writing or bad acting or I don't know what else, but it doesn't add up.
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11 minutes ago, ams1001 said:
Would he have been allowed to bring the wine bottle on the plane, even pre-9/11? It's not like he'd have time to pack it properly.
They have wine in California?! Do they hide in a valley somewhere so no one knows about it? 😉
Yes, he would have. Pre-9/11, I frequently brought wine in my carry-on. Even now, you can bring it on if you purchase it after going through security.
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2 minutes ago, iwasish said:
The baby arriving “early” opens the door to interesting possibilities.
Yes, but if the baby is 4 weeks early, that is actually only 1 week until full-term. Both of my children were born at 37 weeks for no reason other than that's when they came and it was all fine. Also, OB's are pretty good at determining how far along their patients are and if Delilah was off in her dates, that would have been discovered at her first or second OB appt.
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48 minutes ago, smartymarty said:
I meant to emphasize the five year span between the kids. Usually when people want kids, they have them closer together.
2Not necessarily. I know a lot of people who waited 3-5 years for a second or subsequent child because the wanted the older child in school at least part-time when they had an infant at home. And, as someone whose kids are 20 months apart, I can attest to the fact that having kids closer together is a lot of work!
I went back in the thread to see where this line of conversation originated and didn't see it. I'm assuming this was something about Jon and Delilah's marriage. I don't think the existence of only Sophie and Danny and their ages is indicative of anything, honestly. Well, except for the presence of birth control which plays into another storyline.-
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4 hours ago, cardigirl said:
As for the show turning away from Delilah and Eddie's relationship, that may have been the plan all along. Affairs often peter out when they are discovered. In the light of day, they lose the luster of the 'secretivenss' that makes them so exciting, Jon's suicide tarnished this relationship far more than it might have been tarnished had they both left their spouses and tried to start anew together. Sure their friends would have chosen sides, and for a while, they may have been outcasts from the group, but that might have steeled their resolve that the affair was 'fixing' whatever was wrong in their lives and sent them off looking for something else. Instead, the tragedy of Jon's death forced them to look beyond themselves and maybe see things a bit more clearly?
I hope that the second season can give an honest look at what it takes to try and put a marriage back together after infidelity. I don't think it is impossible for a marriage to survive infidelity but it requires real work, and real forgiveness, and real remorse.
1I don't know if the long term plan was to move away from Delilah and Eddie, but I doubt it because it seems like the show did an abrupt 180 right at about the time the first episode aired and the shows that turned around were being written. I realize I may be cynical on this, but that is the magic that is me. (haha!). In the pre-premiere press, they referred to Eddie as being the "one who has to figure things out" and I do hope that is the case, wherever that leads him. I do think that Delilah and Eddie are off the table, or maybe that is just hoping on my part, but I'm not entirely sure that Katherine and Eddie is what we'll get, at least not right away (I do still think they are endgame, just by how eager Nash is to satisfy social media opinions). Whatever they give us, though, I hope that they take the time to do it well--which is what I wish for every character on this show and it is something that has not happened in this first season.
As for your second paragraph that I quoted, I agree with you. Seeing Katherine and Eddie do the hard work is actually something I'd like to watch. It would require real growth from both of them and both actors are more than up to the challenge (I agree with whoever said it earlier in this thread that Grace Park and David Giuntoli play their roles far better than their roles are written. With one, maybe two, exceptions I think that can be said for this whole cast).
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20 minutes ago, Dani said:
That’s actually one of the reasons I think 9/11 was not the original plan. That and the fact that deciding to buy a bottle of wine in an airport gift shop is a really dumb reason to miss your flight. We do have wine in California.
Well, the original plan was for the season to end after 13 episodes, and that was the episode with Jeri and the real estate sale so, um, yeah...I think 9/11 was just sort of thrown in there.
Which makes it that much worse.
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On 3/1/2019 at 10:30 AM, LucyEth said:
I love the Katherine/Eddie getting back together storyline but not sure if it will happen. Didn't he tell Katherine he was in love with Delilah, and now he has to tell her that Delilah's baby is his, hard to come back from those two things. Also, once Katherine knows, not sure how long it will be before the rest of group will need to know including Sophie and Danny who I am sure will not be very happy with Mama D. I wonder how Delilah will feel when she finds out Eddie is trying to reconcile with Katherine?
If I remember correctly, Eddie never actually told Katherine he was in love with Delilah. She asked him if he was and, when he didn't immediately answer, she slapped him. So, he didn't say he loved her and didn't say he didn't love her.
As for how Delilah will react, I think it will be one of two things. Or, should I say, I can think of two conceivable outcomes but I wouldn't put it by Nash to come up with something absurd. Anyway, option one is that the show just sort of "forgets" that Eddie and Delilah had an affair. Or they just decide that everyone is completely over the affair and its ramifications and move on. This is obviously not realistic , but it would be typical for this show.
Option 2 would be to have Delilah go into full-blown manipulative narcissist mode (more so than she has been so far) and try to insert herself into their relationship in order to stop the reconciliation. This would be realistic but I think atypical for the show.
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4 hours ago, debraran said:
A fan also mentioned he has 2 family members checking social media and ideas mentioned a lot seem to get in. The John/Jon on a trophy for instance. Someone noticed it and he it was barely noticeable. (Not my middle age eyes) and they brought it up in the finale. There was something else with Gary I think. I know it gives them a smile and he likes that, but it's definitely not as tight as This is Us. He has the whole outline down until it ends.
I'm assuming you mean Fogelman has an outline and not Nash? Because, honestly, I'm not sure Nash has an outline for one episode, much less the entire run of the show!
But this both worries me and makes me snicker. So, Nash is one of those showrunners who follows whatever social media says. Well, I guess that's why Eddie and Katherine are now a thing because I really don't think that was his original plan (at least it is better than Eddie and Delilah!). Of course, now I feel more empowered to voice my grievances on FB and IG when needed since, apparently, he listens to that. And, I'll be honest, people started talking about 9/11 as a possibility on FB early on in the show. (I'm now half expecting the hairbrained "Delilah got the dates wrong and it is JON'S baby" theory that is so prevalent right now to actually happen!)
I know Nash is not the only showrunner who follows the lead of social media. However, I can't think of a showrunner of a *good* show that does that. TIU is not my jam, but I at least respect Fogelman for sticking to his own story.
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9 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:
I can buy he never mentioned it. If he mentioned it, he would have had to also talk about his friend dying and how he blamed himself. And Jon came off as the kind of guy who didn't like to bring up negative things.
I don't think that would have been the issue. I remember 9/11 and how, as if there wasn't enough news, news outlets tried to interview anyone who was supposed to be on the plane and wasn't. That information would have been easy to find (I don't know if it is actually of the public record, but it would have come up at least for insurance reasons) and the fact that Jon was able to just block that part of his life off just isn't realistic.
But, then again, what is realistic with this show?
To be honest, I can see how he didn't mention it...he was too busy spouting of pithy advice nuggets to his friends.
I think my biggest problem with the whole thing is it feels like survivor guilt was not Nash's original plan for why this happened. It was like he had this idea about a guy who commits suicide but didn't bother to think about until he needed to. Or maybe he had another plan and then changed it when 9/11 seemed edgier and/or more likely to cause an emotional response in the audience (you know, emotionally manipulative). In any case, at least 15 of the 16 episodes leading up to this don't really fit the narrative of survivor guilt.
This is the first season of this show--that sort of thing shouldn't be happening.
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1 minute ago, Dani said:
This is exactly they way I feel. The actual 9/11 scenes were fine with me but they way it was used overall felt like a gimmick particularly since the reveal was held until the last episode of the season.
It’s not enough to show that Jon nearly died on 9/11 and then try to link it to his suicide 17 years later. One conversation with Ashley is not enough to show that he was suffering from survivors guilt.
In the end I think that the dramatic reveal of the date on the newspaper was more important to Nash than creating a believable portrayal of the long term impact of 9/11.
I think my personal take on this is that 9/11 (and other events) should only be used if nothing else will do. Would it have made sense in the story if this had happened in any run-of-the-mill plane crash or did it specifically *have* to be 9/11. From what I've read (I promise I'll watch it soon), it doesn't sound like it. In fact, it might have been more plausible had it been a "regular" plane crash as, if it was 9/11, why didn't Jon *ever* mention that he almost died on 9/11. I could sort of buy that he never mentioned that he almost died on a flight from x to y on random date in 2000, but not that he almost died on 9/11.
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2 hours ago, cardigirl said:
As far as overusing 9/11 or the holocaust as a plot point, well, I don’t think it diminishes those events at all. And, in this case, I thought the Boston tie-in was very well done.
1I still haven't watched this episode (maybe later today?), but I did want to address this. With me, it isn't a case of shows using these tragedies and cheapening them, but rather not showing respect to the show when they use them. 9/11 and the Holocaust are always going to be horrible nightmares and one mediocre and self-inflated showrunner isn't going to change that. However, it does show how little respect he has for it.
I won't say that shows should never incorporate these historical events into their plots, but that they should be very, very careful in doing so. One recent show that I think used 9/11 very well was Travelers (on Netflix). I usually cringe when shows go there, but that one used it in a way that 9/11 is the only event that could have been used AND did so in a way that showed respect to the event and those who perished in it.
So, while it sounds like 9/11 was failed attempt here, I'm not one to say that it should be off-limits, as long as it can be handled well and with respect.
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I still haven't watched the finale (I might tonight or at some point this weekend, it just wasn't a priority for me today), but I did want to address the baby secret.
I do think that Eddie does tell Katherine and I think there are 3 ways it might play out.
- I'll start with what I think (hope) is a longshot that is currently all over the chat on social media. Because the baby is SO early (36 weeks is not that early--37 weeks is considered full term!), Delilah miscalculated the dates and Jon is the father. There are sloppy details which could make this work, but let's face it...OB's can determine how far along a pregnancy is and if Delilah was off with her dates, it would have come up before now. On that, I would say that this possibility is completely absurd and I would write it off except for the fact that this show is absurd and Nash is absurd and I can see him trying to do something stupid like this to get himself out of an unpopular corner.
- Katherine backs away from reconciling with Eddie once he tells her the truth. This one seems likely and, yet, too obvious for it to be likely. Plus, one of the many problems Nash has had this season is integrating Grace Park's character, who is popular among viewers. If it were to play out this way, there really wouldn't be any reason for Katherine and, more importantly, Grace Park to be on the show.
- This third one is probably the one I'd put my money on: Katherine accepts the truth and reconciles with Eddie--and convinces Eddie that he shouldn't give up his paternity and slaps Delilah with a custody suit. I'm not a fan of custody battles, so I'm not sure I would want to see this (to be fair, the baby turning out to be Jon's so that we can all just move on from here would actually be my preference), but I think it would be effective for Nash. It wraps Katherine into the main group of friends and it would give the whole show one theme to sort of center on. It would also create a lot of conflict between all the leads which, well, is "good television."
So, I guess we'll see in the fall. I do hope that Nash gets his head out of his ass long enough to realize that his show isn't God's gift to audiences and that, while he has a good premise, he actually needs to DO BETTER with it!
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1 hour ago, Dani said:
He really needs to stop doing interviews. It seems like he is cackling because he thinks that he is just so clever.
I wish he was a little more concerned with making sure that his show actually made sense.
He's not clever. He's LEGENDARY!
And yes, he needs to shut the fuck up. Is it just me, or is he giving more interviews than most showrunners? I don't follow TIU anymore, but I can't remember Fogelman talking so much. And Shonda Rhimes just seems pissed off when people ask her for spoilery interviews. And, honestly, I probably couldn't name the showrunner of most of the shows I watch, but this guy thinks the world revolves around him.
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A Million Little Clues: Spoilers And Discussion
in A Million Little Things
The two characters that he completely sidelined? Hmmm.
Putting on my pop psychology hat, that makes me think that Rome and Katherine are the two characters he'd *like* to see himself in, not that he actually does.
This really frustrates me because I still maintain that this show has a lot going for it: the premise is great, the acting (with one or two exceptions) is some of the best on TV, and I still think a good story can be salvaged from the ashes of season 1. However, nothing will come of it if Nash can't get out of his own way. If ABC really cared about this show, they'd convince Nash to bring in a co-showrunner, someone who can pull him out of himself and show him that this show is not his personal mirror.