Lilacgirl128

The thing that I keep thinking about with everyone returning from the Snap, what about those people who died immediately after the Snap due to the repercussions of the Snap? The people who died from cars that crashed from drivers disappearing, planes crashing, etc. Do they get to come back? What about people who died in the weeks or months after the Snap due to whatever problems the Snap caused by removing all the living things. Do they get to come back? Or was it just the people that disappeared into ashes? Or is it like "Sorry Joe, mom died from being hit by a car on the same day as the Snap due to the Snap, but even though the 'driver'of the car who hit her came back, she's still dead. Sucks to be us." And I was accepting the time travel stuff, going with they just created alternate timelines in each of the times they went back to, until that move with oldCap on the bench. And then it all started hurting my brain...

So Wanda and Clint decided to willfully destroy other peoples property however they saw fit. Scott too, with the plane and the gas truck. Even Steve with the walkway or whatever he dropped on Peter. Team Cap sure didn't have respect for private property. Vision seemed to be the only on Team Iron Man who did any damage and that occurred as a last resort to stop the fugitive from getting away. I can't remember if Tony just disabled the helicopter at first or if he blew it up, but with that amount of damage and Tony it isn't like he wouldn't be fully prepared to pay for damages he caused. Were Clint, Wanda, Scott, or Steve even thinking about the damage they were causing. Or did they think because they had a righteous cause they didn't have to worry about that.

I think it is very telling that Steve talks about trusting individuals and them not letting him down so far. But people let Tony down all the time. If you really look at the movies, it is always institutions that betray Steve (the US government to some extant in the first movie, Shield is the second, and the UN here). However Tony has always had both the money and the power (in the the form of his company and his genius) so he can't be betrayed by institutions because he knows there is always a way around what ever they have done to you if you have money and power and the patience it takes to use them. Hence his saying we can change the Accords later, because he knows that he can get it changed by virtue of what he, himself, and the Avengers collectively, mean to the world, they just have to appease the public at this moment. I mean he kept Sam and Steve out of trouble for the first bit of their helping Bucky in Romania so there was wiggle room. The current Accords are just an over reaction to some things that have gone down, but things can eventually be calmed down and the contingemcies get worked out. Like he and Natasha point out, it is happening whether they want it or not so might as well get in and change what they can. While Steve gets betrayed by institutions, people are always betraying Tony, starting with Stane in the first movie. Even in this movie he gets betrayed to some extant by both Natasha and Steve. I mean he is betrayed by Captain America! He can't even trust the worlds paragon of virtue. So it's no wonder he trusts institutions over individuals. He won't be blindsided by what institutions do to him, and he knows he can always find away around them eventually. But people, he let's people down and they let him down. I would be surprised if Tony truly trusted another individual besides Rhodey ever again (and even Rhodey betrayed him somewhat in Iron Man 2, but there were extenuating circumstances that I am sure Tony forgave). I think Steve would have gone as far as he did for anyone he sees as family, but I think it would have been with more consideration of the consequences for anyone else. With Bucky there just is no thought, there is just nothing he wouldn't do and no one he wouldn't go through for Bucky.

After watching the movie again today I was even more appalled by the complete lack of communication between everybody. There is just no way that the UN got together to create the Accords without the world, and by extension the Avengers themselves, knowing and it being all over the 24 hour news networks and being debated constantly on social media. Plus the Avengers just don't seem to communicate, especially Steve and Tony. So much could have been fixed if they had just talked to each other like teammates would. Also the logistics of how everyone is getting around is strange. How long do all those London to Vienna to Bucharest to Berlin trips take, because they seem to be like 15 minutes away from each other in the movie. And did Clint really go from his farm to Upstate New York for Wanda then to California for Scott and then to Germany. Was all this flying commercial? And they did it all in 24 hours? Tony at least has the Quinjet for his trip to NY and back. And then how slow are Steve and Bucky flying the Quinjet to Siberia. In the time their trip takes, Tony goes to the hospital with Rhodey, gets an initial diagnosis, flys a helicopter to the Raft (which appears to be in the middle of what I assume is the Atlantic Ocean), meets with the prisoners, and then flys to Siberia himself, getting there not long after them. Plus they are in his Quinjet, why did he even need to go see Sam about where they were going, shouldn't he be able to track it? After Bruce flew off with one you would think he would have put in a better tracking system in the Quinjets(though my head cannon was that he could have tracked Bruce, he was just respecting his wish to disappear, which this movie seems to dispell if Tony is not lying to Natasha). And when Tony says "so was I" about being Steve's friend that wasn't how I saw their interactions on screen. They have a weirdly intense relationship but I wouldn't call it friendship. They don't seem to have talked ever when not actually on screen and those aren't exactly friend type talks they have been having over three movies. And so much of this movie could have been fixed if they had just talked to each other. The communication was so bad between all the sides, UN, Avengers con, Avengers pro.

I see a lot of places talking about how the difference between Steve and Tony with the Accords is that Steve accepts responsibility for the Avengers actions and Tony just wants to put it in others hands, but that doesn't make sense to me. When has Steve actually accepted responsibility for what they have done. Telling Wanda that what happened in Lagos is on him isn't taking responsibility, taking responsibility is accepting the consequences for your actions, like for instance be willing to accept what the people and countries you have hurt are trying to tell you and maybe being open to some kind of dialog with them, ie an international accord. Did Steve even talk to the Nigerian or Wakandan governments after what happened to apologize and see what they needed from the Avengers for what happened? Did he help with Sokovia or Washington after what happened? What about the void that SHIELDs disintegration left? Has he ever faced any of the consequences the world has faced since all of this Avenger stuff started? Because it seems to me that Tony has always been a little better on the dealing the actual repercussions of what happens in the Avengers world and therefore has never been the one who doesn't take responisbilty.