[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

On 3/5/2024 at 5:59 PM, KittenPokerCheater said:

Did Sonny sleep with Karen when she was underage too??

 

I think there is a word for that when a grown man in his 30s plies an underage girl with drugs to get her addicted and uses her for sex.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

I remember everyone laughing when Sonny killed the Russian at the meeting of the Five Families because of how laughable it was all performed. It was a goofy scene.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

1 hour ago, Artsda said:

Jagger should just let Sonny be shot. 

You’d think, given what Sonny did to an underage Karen and how he tried to murder her and Jagger, that he wouldn’t care if Sonny lived or died. Why even bother bringing the character into the canvas if you’re going to ignore his ugly history with Sonny and just turn him into another mob sychophant?
 

With everyone enabling Sonny it’s almost as if Guza never left.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

1 hour ago, Sake614 said:

True enough re the recasting but in the case of Blair, her ethnicity was never a factor in the storyline, I loved Mia Korpf and was shocked when I saw KDP the first time, but MK was only there for a short time.

Given the century of Hollywood whitewashing non-white roles by casting white actors (a criticism Anna May Wong levied at Hollywood in the ‘30s, and it’s still a problem to this day) I don’t see any reason to handwave recasting any non-white character with a white actor just because the white actor was good or the story didn’t demand the need for a particular ethnicity.

You can make a world of excuses for why the shows do it but the issue remains this shouldn’t be excused for any reason. This show is known as “Generally White Hospital” (per Jordan’s original portrayer) precisely because of the mentality that leads to shows recasting non-white characters with white actors.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

On 2/5/2024 at 3:09 PM, nilyank said:

In other news, Jagger is back. Blonde and blue-eyed. He must be really, really underco ver

OLTL recast Blair with a white actress and GH recast Sage and Zander with white actors so it’s more of the same that’s been going on for decades. It’s as annoying as it’s ever been.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

40 minutes ago, KittyQ said:

So Sonny gets to go home because Cyrus was a "bad guy"? Is that the way the law in PC works? You can break the law and commit crimes with little or no consequences as long as the victim isn't pure as the driven snow? What if the perpetrator is just as bad as the victim (ex. Sonny vs. Cyrus)? Shouldn't that be a draw, and Sonny has to be charged as much as if he'd beaten up an "innocent" person (admittedly hard to find one in PC). 

Doctors Steve and Matt went to jail (seemingly indefinitely) while Sonny walks around free because reality warps and shifts around him.

Sonny going to jail for 5 minutes for murdering AJ didn’t even have an impact on being able to be let go immediately after being arrested.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

5 hours ago, Asp Burger said:

Dobson (when Kristina was a baby) came a few years before the lung cancer, so it couldn't have been that, but I would buy that it was punishment for something. Awful story.

Correct. Dobson came during the Zander years (as an attempt to be close to baby Kristina) while the cancer storyline was during her romance with New Jerry. But Guza seemed to loathe Alexis for some reason and he allegedly hated that she became pregnant with Sonny’s child.

Allegedly Guza was going to have the child as a product of SA by Johnny (who basically had the role Max played for so many years afterward) but the actor who played him balked and he was written out by way of conspiring with Lorenzo Alcazar.

[Spoilers and Speculation: Clink Boom and Cheese Fondue]

2 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

I have not watched with any regularity for at least a decade now (where did the time GO?!), but if these previews are supposed to want to bring lapsed viewers back, it failed in a most spectacular fashion!

The show seems even worse than when Guza had the reigns. Even Guza had characters who disliked Sonny on the canvas (albeit they were “bad” for not liking him and not worshiping at the altar of Guza’s messianic Borg), while now everyone on the canvas mandated to kiss his feet and act like you must like him (even the woman he kidnapped with the intent of taking her unborn child and murdering her after the birth).

Anna and Robert are buddies with the guy who shot their daughter? Bargain basement criminal, as TR famously called him. And the WSB needed Sonny? Faith, Lorenzo and Johnny all proved you can circumvent going through Sonny.

I’m guessing the show still only appeals to the people who think the entire show needs to revolve around Sonny and the mob.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

56 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I know your post was meant to show how horrible Mooby is, but it was a different AJ hung from a meathook-to force him to give up his parental rights; Original AJ, Sean Kanan who reprised his role was fired because he was fat*.

*Bitter still, because this was done to re-hire Burton's ass after Carlivati fired him.

I think they were just goofing around because of how ridiculous the show was about constantly mocking AJ’s weight instead of giving him a legitimate storyline. That said, I still remember BW’s poignant words about how AJ never seems to catch a break no matter who plays him after SK and GH parted ways.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

31 minutes ago, perkie1968 said:

I'm pretty sure were heading towards a fugue state scenario for Sonny because he certainly looked confused as to why Dante would be arresting him.  

"It's all Nina's fault that she made a phone call and now Cyrus is in the hospital and poor poor claustrophobic Sonny has to sit in a cushy cell at the PCPD while Diane snarks at all the law enforcement.  

Considering he shot Lorenzo and Carly as Carly was giving birth to Morgan without any legal repercussions, and nearly blew up Kristina with a car bomb only to punish her for it, I can see why Sonny would be confused why he’d face any ramifications for beating someone up when he never suffers consequences for his actions.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

It is weird how Bobbie barely featured on the show in recent years (only doing slightly better during the early days of RC’s tenure, memorably reminding Carly that she was lying about why she lied about Michael’s paternity when she was pretending it was about protecting Michael from the Quartermaines), and now Carly is talking about how it’s unfair for Nina to live while Bobbie is dead (because of the SEC plot, which is a bit odd as TB’s Carly ratted out Sonny to try to force him to leave the mob so it’s not like she’s never done something like this before).

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

2 hours ago, perkie1968 said:

Shawn:  agreeing with Alexis, "I will go before the parole board so I can found who did shoot at Hayden that day"

I guess the show will forget that Jordan caught Shawn attempting to assassinate Drew, then, since attempted murder is supposed to be a crime and not something that's just excused if you're doing it for the Corinthos mob.

1 hour ago, tessaray said:

I know babies aren't popular but in a way I like that they are thinking of the future with a new generation. They gutted the various families so badly over the last decade or two.  

I'd say the issue is in how those baby stories are handled. The Crypt sex baby tale, where the two people responsible for AJ's completely unnecessary murder had sex on his crypt, wasn't exactly something that was warmly embraced for obvious reasons, and Maxie was reduced to a caricature where she basically begged Nathan at one point to have sex with her so that she could have meaning in her life since the writers forgot about her ambitions, goals and dreams the moment they made her pregnant (that the first child she had was Spinelli's, which RC admitted was originally done to lazily bring the characters back together, did not help and was just awful).

Giving Sonny two additional children he didn't need (one of whom is basically "upstairs" where Liz's children used to be), and having Michael as a father after he forsook AJ to live his life as one of the many enablers of his father's murderer, wasn't really needed. I'd say the reception would be different if the stories weren't usually garbage and/or if someone other than Sonny or one of his enabling progeny were involved. There is no love in the afternoon to root for with these stories. That there seem to be so many baby stories on this show does not help, either.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

22 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

They could, though, if the writers wanted it to happen. But the writers don't. It's too bad, because there could be a lot of drama in it. 

MB doesn't want Sonny to leave, which is likely the biggest reason why we will never see that. The show has had Sonny and Jason leave the mob in the past - albeit temporarily. Jason left to explore the world (when SB tried his hand at becoming an actor outside of soaps, and I know someone a few years back what Robert Redford had to say about SB's acting). Sonny was forced out by Jason when he started dating Emily. But MB has made it clear that he likes Sonny in the mob, and there are times that the character has admitted that he remains in power because he enjoys the power.

The writers do enable MB, to the detriment of the show, and it's why characters like Lorenzo Alcazar and Johnny Zacchara (who are written to not be that invested in their life of crime and leave their criminal lifestyle to go legit) end up being brought back, since Sonny needs an antagonist. But since Sonny must always win, it's not entertaining, especially for fans of those characters who have to see them trashed in the name of Sonny and Jason (and I can't imagine why anyone who likes Sonny would enjoy watching the same exact storyline unfold over and over again).

While Carly may oppose Sonny over power, it'll likely be no different than when Jason was the one who opposed Sonny - there will be a conflict, Sonny might be on the losing end but things will result in the two coming to terms (and Cyrus would be the easiest solution to lead to that conclusion). I highly doubt that MB would settle for Carly being in power over Sonny for the long-term.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

6 hours ago, KayVeeTeeVee said:

Oooh, that's a good one!  Sonny basically 'stole' not only baby Michael from AJ (Monica's son) but borg Jason (also Monica's offspring) as well.  Will Jason allow Mayberry Mike who Dances with Brooms to be who he wants to be, or will his loyalty to Carly win out.  Now THIS is finally an interesting turn of events.

That would be a reversal. Sonny didn't accept Jason Morgan as a different person the first time he lost his memory (during the days of Lorenzo Alcazar). And when Jason 2.0 (who was later rectonned into Drew) was revealed, Sonny expected him to become Jason Morgan again (and did lead to the unintentional hilarity of Sonny telling Jason 2.0 that it was okay for him to speak badly to Carly because he's treated her far worse).

For all the crap the Quartermaines got, Sonny was never any better. Admittedly he was much, much worse - repeatedly. Would Jason be any better now that the roles are reversed?

Although this does remind me how the show is pretty much recycling plots at this point with the mobster with amnesia plot and Carly attending a meeting with the Five Families as the representative of the Corinthos mob. I wish the show would delve into new territory rather than retelling old stories.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

36 minutes ago, Bringonthedrama said:

I thought for sure it was going to turn out to be a returning character to GH, like Jerry Jax or a SORASed Lila Rae (blaming Jason for her father's death) or even Johnny Z. 

Lila Rae shooting (preferably killing) Jason would be the only way I'd want to see that character on the show. I don't ever want to see her sacrificed to the Cult of the Holy Hitman.

20 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Probably Diego.  No, I won't get over it.

I wonder who the TMK was originally supposed to be before GW took the helm during the writer's strike (I doubt whomever Guza randomly picked out of a hat, like he usually seemed to do, would have made any more sense).

At least Diego being responsible allowed Jason's mob activities to have a consequence, even if Diego killing Georgie made absolutely no sense (it's too bad GW didn't undo Guza's decision and have her turn out to be alive). And for Monica to blame Jason for what he's done wrong a change instead of making excuses for him, even if it was sadly short-lived due to the current nature of the show.

21 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

Spinelli proved himself to be the ultimate asshole today, with the face he made when he found out Jason went back into GH to save Britt.  He argued that better for Britt to die than for Jason to "ruin" his and Carly's plaaaannnnn.  Too bad he didn't take a bullet right between those beady eyes.

Spinelli is as awful as ever. Like I've said before, Spinelli should have been the one to go to jail instead of Matt (a doctor who committed the "crime" of stopping a serial killer who was in the middle of killing people, because this show has never made sense in recent years).

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

11 hours ago, ulkis said:

One other thing LW wants is Jason and Carly retcon sex and conceiving Michael ... if that happens we will know for sure LW has bribed/wheedled someone.

FFS... why? Why does she want that? Baby Michael's heart issue was a callback to AJ. There is literally no reason to pull such a recton, especially on a show that gives Jason far too much story as it is. From that to that interview where she talked about how the Corinthos family should be the center of the show (because eating the show for two decades isn't enough, apparently), I just can't...

This show went from (under Guza) Jason badmouthing AJ for not magically knowing immediately what baby Michael liked (which isn't surprising since the blinking robot robbed him of those opportunities), to (under this regime) Carly badmouthing dead AJ despite how Sonny murdered him while Carly covered it up.

Rather than giving into something ludicrous, what would be nice is for AJ to have at least one kid who actually cares that he's dead and doesn't forget him to kiss the feet of the man who murdered him. Someone who denounces Michael and the robot uncle who has never really cared about the Quartermaines. If Sonny can have a million children on this show (including one from creepy crypt sex), I think AJ should have at least one who gives a s**t that he's dead and doesn't romanticize the mob. I'm just putting that out into the universe.

[Spoilers and Speculation: Clink Boom and Cheese Fondue]

2 hours ago, sunnyface said:

So it looks like RH is going to be reincarnated as another 'mostly peaceful' mobster thug.

FFS. You could have RH as a doctor (even someone like David Hayward), as a Cassadine (in which you can go in a myriad of directions), as literally anyone or anything on the planet, and on a show that's allowed the mob to eat away at it for two decades (with a mumbling misogynistic mobster and a malfunctioning robot who only blinks) you chose to have him as another mobster? I hope the Novak rumor is wrong. This show does not need more mob content eating up the canvas.

2 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I suppose it's better for RoHo than playing Gentle Farmer Franco, but this show doesn't need another mobster. 

This show didn't need another mobster years ago, much less now.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

2 hours ago, Cheyanne11 said:

That's been the schtick for decades now--that Sonny is the leading crime boss of the eastern seaboard, which is absurd given all the things he supposedly won't transport (guns and drugs being the big two).

Under Guza and RC it was only drugs, and now it's guns, but the anti-gun stance the new regime has makes no sense considering how they still play around with guns on the show. I agree that it's absurd, but even putting aside the lack of realism or credibility about Sonny's current business I'd say it's due to how the story frames the 'accomplishments' of Sonny and Jason. Their schtick is silly because it's always the same story - a powerful foe comes around (Moreno or Sorel), it's made to appear that victory would be difficult if not next to impossible (Lorenzo or Anthony), and then victory is easy because the foe is dumbed down to make such an accomplishment possible.

When Sonny and Jason gain their victory completely unearned, why should anyone care when they win? And after two decades it's become even more boring and uninteresting because you can see the story beats a mile away. The only person who seems invested in these mob stories is MB, who seems to dismiss anyone who mentions how Sonny never pays for his crimes as "Sonny haters" and thinks that the same storyline that was done to death when Guza was still around is the story that should dominate the show, no matter how many viewers this alienates.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

2 hours ago, Katy M said:

I still don't understand how a town the size of Port Charles supports 5 mobs.  And why it isn't way more violent than it is.  I mean, it's plenty violent, but that's just usually because of random serial killers and rapists.  Not mob related violence.

The idea, during the Guza days, was that it was pretty much the 'Five Families' - five Italian mob bosses of New York, the kind you usually encounter in wiseguy films set in New York City (TB's Carly even refers to them as 'wise guys' at one point during the story with Luis Alcazar). Sammy Tagliati and others who were not named. They usually met at Pozzulo's, which in those days was in a vaguely defined area. The only exception to that was the Escobar family, with both bosses of that family, Miguel and Juan, being killed by Jason (as Miguel suggested Sonny should be killed because he was causing trouble when Jason ousted him due to the Sonny/Emily relationship, and then Juan wanted revenge for his brother's death), and their territory being taken.

The Godfather-esque makeup of the Five Families primarily changed when RC took over, who included a Russian boss as a representative and Ms. Wu, but never actually explained anything about the current Wu family (it was basically a callback to the Asian Quarter storyline except without delving into current events, which is also why Brad's family was basically invisible).

Nothing about the Wu family has been explained. Admittedly, the Asian Quarter pretty much disappeared right after the story, and it was only dipped into in recent years, mainly for the scenes at the restaurant Noodle Buddha, to say that Jason is a 'dragon,' because of course. 🙄

If you're trying to make sense of it, you're probably making more of an effort than the writers ever did. 

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

7 minutes ago, driver18 said:

I love Cam, but I admit I'm kinda confused about the comments upset about this happening to him. This is kinda a good thing in that it shows the interest the show/writers have in him. This is a soap. Terrible things happen to characters all the time. Cam/Lipton is clearly a young favorite. He's gonna get big storylines. 

Because the show treats people who dislike Jason very poorly. It's favoritism that has existed for decades. Zander, Lucky, Monica- a lot of characters end up being vilified when they oppose Jason so that Jason can look 'good' in comparison, and of course Cameron has to be angry for the 'wrong reason' rather than being allowed to be upset at Jason for what he did to Zander. Monica was turned into an alcoholic simply to frame her as being in the wrong against Jason and force her to forgive him for blaming him for Emily's death (despite how he is responsible for what happened to her).

9 minutes ago, driver18 said:

And, really, if you look at it one way, it's Jason's fault he got shot. If he had just told Cam the truth instead of his whole cold stone act, Cam wouldn't gave gone after him.

Except that's never going to be how the show handles it. When Jason started a war against Lorenzo (who was trying to save his son from an incident that Jason was also involved in), Lorenzo was framed as the bad guy despite not wanting to get in a fight with Jason and simply wanting to protect Diego. Jason is never allowed to be treated as the bad guy even when he's in the wrong.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

29 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Ahh thanks for that

No problem. The odd thing is it was pretty much the same story as now - Sonny was thought to be dead by most people, there was a rival in town, and Carly stepped in to represent the organization during a meeting with the Five Families (and even swung a bat around during the meeting).

31 minutes ago, Daisy said:

that would be interesting but i don't think anyone on the writing staff knows much about the actual Good Ole Days. I know others have focused on it - but this waxing poetic on Franco just doesn't sit well with me. (Tumours and whatever aside).  I don't know why i can hand wave ava (Mostly because i didn't watch any of the other Ava stuff when she was horrendously bad so I only know THIS Ava. I remember James Franco Franco so even Elizabeth being all "I love you smootchies" bugs me. 

Franco is one of the most bizarre story decisions that RC made. While it's obvious he wanted to do his own version of Todd with minimal effort (as in a tumor instead of doing a redemption storyline, like the one that was done with Todd), I can't really understand why he thought that a character who was a serial killer, and committed so many heinous acts against people in town, was the proper choice. He could have created a brand new character instead (like a Cassadine).

There is no real redemption arc (like with Todd), and a lot of fans felt that his occasional comments about feeling bad were pretty hollow because we never really saw it for the most part (and he was still willing to cross lines, like when he almost murdered a witness to him and Nina - or when RC even admitted he toyed around with having Franco say to Carly that he lied about not having Michael assaulted during the storyline where they breakup, but he thought that might go too far for fans). It's like RC was drawn to these characters who did horrific things but didn't want to go through the steps of making it reasonable for them to interact with people (as with Dr. O, whose actions with Faison were pretty much handwaved for reasons).

I get that some fans softened towards Franco because of Elizabeth (and how the show had not given her a love interest and romance they were invested in for years, but instead ones that were used simply to blow up in her face), but especially when one considers what was done to AJ and Duke (and it was said that even Ric was almost killed until the network intervened and Silas was killed instead), I see the problems with how the show goes out of its way for one character while being willing to toss much more developed and long-term characters out of the window with no real care.

42 minutes ago, Daisy said:

i  will never not understand how people just don't smack Carly on a regular basis 

Monica should have done precisely that to her and Sonny after the reveal of her son's murder came out, and when Carly acted like Monica would want to come over to Sonny's house as if she has no reason to be angry at him.

And Laura, Anna, and Ava are fine with Carly, for... reasons.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

Just now, Daisy said:

let me get this straight 

for weeks Carly whinged that she couldn't do the 5 Families meeting so this is why Jason had to escape prison. But now Jason got shot and couldn't go, so Carly was still able to go and was awesome at it (because naturally) so Jason didn't need to leave prison at all. 

When TB's Carly went to a meeting with the Five Families, one of the reasons that things did not go pair-shaped (at first) is because one of the mob bosses, Sammy Tagliati, was romantically interested in her, and she still made a mistake that was only averted due to police intervention.

1 minute ago, Daisy said:

So then what the ever loving hell was the point?(whatever Cyrus is trying to kill him. Cyrus can try to kill him outside of Jail)

'What the ever loving hell was the point?' should be the show's catchphrase at this point.

2 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Honestly now Jason (should) go to prison for a long time for escaping police custody. but life will kill that dream i dreamed so there we are. 

Jason should (and a better show would have allowed the truth about Zander's death to come out and to allow Cameron to be angry at Jason for valid reasons), but since this turned into the show where Carly kidnapping a woman was turned into some heroic act that she deserves a medal for, I sadly doubt this show will veer into any sensible or logical direction.

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

3 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

I would think Diane wouldn't take it, given Jason is her client.  

Diane represented Todd and Johnny when the two hated each other, and she did represent Franco pre-tumor removal when Sonny hated him (which I think is because she's pretty much one of the only attorneys on this show so she ends up being the de facto attorney of choice, even if the logic is questionable).

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

9 minutes ago, Benji said:

It's a CUTE backwater town !  If they were going to try to present Nixon Falls as this cute and wonderful place, they should have made the Tan-O a pub or cafe or diner instead of a dark bar that never has any customers. Then at least it would make more sense for Mike to be making sauce. But then I guess they would have to pay for extras to be customers at the place. 

They haven't been able to afford those kind of things for years now, and they put their focus on the wrong things (like regurgitating the same mob takeover story that they've been doing since Sonny came back from his self-imposed island exile about two decades ago). That reminds me of a point JE brought up years ago: "But here’s the problem with soaps: The bar keeps getting lowered. This is the golden age of television. I stream a lot of great shows on Netflix, plus I’m addicted to HBO, Showtime, FX, AMC, BBC America. That s**t is remarkable! And then you put all that up against our soap operas and the disparity just gets bigger and bigger. It makes me crazy. This is not the best that we can do. Yes, there are limitations in daytime with budget and time but then we need to write material that accommodates those limitations. Don’t write shootouts on the pier. Don’t write explosions and fires. If you don’t have the time and the money, make the stories small and intimate and heartbreaking. I also find it completely irresponsible to play guns the way do on GH and as often we do."

[Episode Discussion II: The TFGH]

17 minutes ago, Gigi43 said:

Ava: Give it a rest, you  kidnapped an old lady.

Laura: Well in Carly's defense she was well cared for and happy.

 

What the fuck am I watching?! I hate this show.

So kidnapping a woman is okay as long as Carly is the one who does it? WTF? I miss Laura holding Sonny and Jason accountable for being mobsters after Lucky "died", and finally acknowledging how terrible they were. I miss Laura not liking Carly, and refusing to put up with her antics. I miss Scotty hating Sonny and not pretending that Jason was anything but a killer. I miss Robert being on the opposite side from the 'bargain basement criminals.' I miss Kristina being able to note that Sonny being a mobster was not a good thing (and that was under Guza, who'd have you believe that Sonny and Jason pooped puppies and peed rainbows). I miss Michael having a personality and hating Sonny and Carly as Michael Alan Quartermaine, when he was capable of having independent thought and had a functioning brain (when he was making snarky remarks and figuring out Morgan's treachery almost instantly, whereas now he's letting his mother lead him around by the nose, speaks with a baby as if that's his only friend, and has the intellect of a rock). I miss when it seemed like Lucas might actually be a part of the show, rather than relegated to the shadows because he's a gay character on a show that only pretends to care about LGBTQ+ people when it wants a pat on the back.

So much about this show is disappointing in so many ways.