Lavignac

But... didn't Snuffleupagus already appear at the Wall, herded by Wun Wun and Mag the Mighty to try and pull down the gates?

I really liked Brienne's first clue, the incongruous huge warhorse in the "Mont-Saint-Michel"-like monastery... You're now ready for another favourite chapter of fan speculation, Clegane fate to come... I also much preferred Cat o'the Canals VS Daeron, than the show's cartoon-like gore-fest with Meryn Trant. Poetic justice in the show just hits you in the face, unsubtle; poetic justice in the books is more... Poetic!

Didn't the Crown also owe the church (would that be sept?) Actually, I believe they would refer to the organization as The Faith. This line of thought makes me intrigued to see whether they'll show the Starry Sept in season 6, and what architectural style they would adopt for all of Oldtown.

A) Gendry VS Edric Remember that Edric Storm was kept first in Storm's End, then on Dragonstone, neither of which were in Lannister control at the time of the King Herod-like massacre. Would it have been too complex for casual TV audiences to have understood, or at least accepting that? I don't think it would have registered on many viewers' radar: Edric would have appeared only in season 3 when the massacre was in season 1. Thus, I discount (but all bastards were massacred!" as a reason for cutting Edric from the TV show. I believe it has much more to do with simplifying the cast, re-using the well-known and well-liked Gendry. It's just unfortunate that they had to convolute the jet-pack-travelling plot and character-assassinate the Brotherhood Without Banners to do so! B) "... You'd be my Lady" I disagree that the line's intent was perfectly clear. As a book-reader, I myself wondered what the intent was when I heard that line, I re-listened to the scene several times to perceive the inflection and nonverbal postures, and I participated in discussing it on the internet. Did the writers want to infuse some ideas of romanticism there? Not likely, but not impossible. That would have been intriguing. Different 'Shippers existed in the ASOIAF fandom long before the show came on: Ashara & Ned. Lyanna & Rhaegar. "San-San". Book-fueled ships are not necessarily the same as the show-fueled ones, depending on age ajustements, physical appearance and how some scenes play out. An example I have in mind comes up in book 5:

And the Spitball Wall protects the Unsullied from the dreaded Bookwalkers.

You mean... doggy-style? Sorry, just couldn't control my giggles over this combination... Welcome to the circus.

Sorry, I'm just saying' you will have fun someday in your reading if you keep in mind Jon and Sam's parting scene, even though your character distaste might make you push it out of memory. To experienced readers:

Ooooh the baby switch. Now you see why some people were heavy-handed in mentioning interest/importance of Mance's women, Val and Dalla, and their absence from the show. Season five: You've already read it, but now you may re-read Sam's last chapter with Jon having that switch in mind! ".... The things I do for #duty#!" Edit: Oh the Dumbhair, Nimble Prick and your other nicknames crack me up!

Fringed sleeves? I remember the funny misunderstanding on the Unsullied thread when someone heard French Sleeves...

Sorry, got to comment / correct the Season 6 "spoiler" mentioned: Now, for actual readable new contents ;-) The Horn of Joramun was a really poignant sub-plot that added life to the North storyline. It didn't even require actual Fantasy elements being shown, no special CGI required. It's just discussion of n important prop! Sam's lobbying was a great coming-of-age story. He has shown great talent and usefulness in a planned way, not by accident. Although the raven in the pot makes one wonder whether Sam had more unseen help!

Wow, this is the moment... StillShimpy, welcome to the dark side of the Spitball Wall... I'm going back to this major question that the Unsullied tackled, does the show's story hold on its own?... and the variant, does it hold up to the books?.... Now your perceptions have gone through all of those different phases. I assume from your comments that you are getting to the point that you feel the books' story is so much richer... and the reason you began to read the books is that you were getting disappointed by the show's internal story; but I would enjoy reading how you would express your thoughts on your own at this moment? Is the show just too bleak for you to recommend it at all as engrossing entertainment?

I agree with Shimpy that Arya's dysfunctional upbringing is much better paced in books than on TV. It's not that surprising. From the top of my head, the characters who were the most short-changed in their characterization/evolution in this whole adaptation are: Arya, Jamie, Sandor, Stannis, . Then there are also the cases where reduced screen time wasn't an issue, but they elected to transform the characters' personalities significantly... Cersei, Robb, Loras, . Both of those lists make for some character decisions that are essentially the same in the show as in the books, but that seem less earned, justified, poignant and believable. Unfortunately the trend has increased in later seasons. Dont't mistake me for a show-hater... I'm not endlessly discussing everything that went RIGHT in the adaptation, though there is a lot of that as well.

Shimpy, I am most interested in your comparison of the hairnet / necklace plot. I remember how big a deal it was on the Completely Unsullied threads, that you guys felt the plot using Sansa as an unknowing poison-bearer was ridiculous... Do you really feel the different form, hairnet rather than necklace, makes it more believable? You still need a great talent at sleight-of-hand by the Queen of Thorns to pull off all the steps, and it's so easy for anything to go wrong... I thought your main comment on that today would be: "Nope, still don't buy it". By the way, wouldn't you just see Loras in the future do to Brienne precisely what Brienne did to Stannis in the fifth season, for exactly the same murder? That would be priceless.

Concerning the tunnel under the wall at the Nightfort: I remember when in the show it boiled down to: an open tunnel that's always available, you clearly see light at the end of the tunnel, and Sam just happened to read about it. It stretches disbelief that over the millennia, no wildling has stumbled about it and shared the discovery. Hence, i disliked the adaptation choice. I get it that they wished to tone down the high fantasy, but they could have made it so Sam found a padlock code or whatever medieval-equivalent seekrit maneuver in his books. And to add to the common speculation about the magical weirwood door, one wonders whether anyone who learns the password will be let across, or whether the door detects magically the truth of the oath and that the person belongs to the Night's Watch.

Ah, the Elk rider... In the chapter Shimpy read, did they refer to him by a name/title/descriptor yet? I assume the showrunners went "no-way" on the elk- riding for CGI budget and "cartoon" expectations like book-Daario, but couldn't he have appeared on foot? His absence on the show made several fans puzzled about what this means for his importance, like any cut character... Robb's supposed Jon-legitimizing letter has also fuelled lots of fan hopes and discussions, it was a fist-pumping moment for me! Edit: Since Shimpy did notice the strangely insistent murder of crows, allow me to point out their appearance on the show, reshuffled to the scene where Sam became the Slayer...