doctor destiny
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Posts posted by doctor destiny
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13 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:
Because there is an uncomfortable subtext of "this poor hot girl was just trying to be nice to her disabled neighbor and now she's saddled with a nice but creepy autistic man and his creepy feelings." The show wants us to think that Shaun's expectation of dating Lea is simultaneously endearing and pathetic, when it's actually reasonable and logical given their relationship and the context of everything that's happened.
People say they cry each episode but I've only really cried once watching TGD and it was contemplating exactly this. It was so personally painful. I cannot or rather I will not believe that this is all set up by accident by a tone deaf writers' room. I know that Freddie Highmore has read Neurotribes. Mark Rozeman is autistic and there are likely other auties in the room. This was the writers' room that gave us the pitch perfect god-awful autism martyr parents in 22 Steps. There is a reason why "Heartfelt" had the worst ratings in Season 1. It showed Shaun to be incredibly brave in a social setting but also a bit pathetic and the pain of seeing his pain and his being bullied by Resnick made me very uncomfortable. I wonder how "Carrots" will do. Shaun is a man and deserves the dignity as such. I wanted to shout at him "don't do this, you'll get hurt!". But I also think it's very deliberate.
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6 hours ago, Fable said:
Shaun was a little annoying this episode. I am not a Lea fan, but she did put her cards on the table about not living with Shaun and why. He would not accept her decision, and I don’t like using his autism as an excuse. He also has to learn to respect boundaries. Same thing with Glassman. I know Shaun cares about him and I appreciate that because I am sure Dr. Glassman has done much for him, but again, it’s about boundaries.
I’m not looking forward to Shaun and Lea as roommates. This is not just annoying, it is becoming silly…dancing around about being roommates? This arc is the least interesting part of the show, and it doesn’t really seem to fit into the narrative.
I think one of the main points of this episode is to showcase those traits of Shaun that are annoying. Tactless burns, starting a conversation without introducing himself, all the annoyances that Dr Glassman told Shaun off for, nagging persistently, obsessional behavior...They are taking their time to flesh out all the characters in the second series.
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14 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:
Well, Lea continues to find new ways to be an insufferable dick. "Do you think about dating me? I know you do. Well even though I've spent the past two weeks throwing a tantrum that you're not obsessed with me, I just want to take this opportunity to reiterate that I don't have feelings for you and never, ever will. Also, you will have to get used to me having sex right in front of you. Because I'll never see you as a viable option. You get it, right? BUT your attention fills the black hole that is my ego so let's end the conversation by talking about how much your friendship means to me in a way that's just sentimentally ambiguous enough for you to misinterpret romantically and keep your hopes up. :)" How many times did they go back and forth about renting the apartment? And for Lea to be fighting it tooth and nail the whole episode and then at the last minute change her mind is just a mess of mixed signals. Look, no one is entitled to date anyone. Able people shouldn't feel bad or guilty for not being attracted to disabled people, as long as the disability isn't the only reason. But you have to stop acting flabbergasted we have feelings when you go out of your way to actively cultivate them AND constantly insinuate those feelings might be reciprocated.
You hit the nail on the head for me. Beautifully written criticism I have to say. I kept wondering all episode where are they going with this? I have to think that with at least one autistic writer on board in the writers' room this is all completely deliberate. I mean Resnick mentioned the autistic man as pet theory the other week and now, well, here we are. I felt that I was punched in the gut wondering if this was going to happen to my wonderful autistic kids too. It was almost viscerally painful. Why did she kiss him while drunk (yeah that happens), then say when sober she'd kiss him again if she hadn't brushed her teeth, then kiss him prior to leaving and then turn up again. What happened in Hershey???? No, I can't believe it's a ham-fisted slow burn. Shore doesn't go linear surely? Yeah I get she isn't leading him on and rightfully doesn't want to give him false hope - but then why did she give false hope before? As she would say, "not cool".
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2 hours ago, possibilities said:
But it's way more feel good to say that mom made a tough decision even though it's for the best, than it is to suggest that it doesn't have to be so tough if we didn't consider disabled people to be discards best pawned off on others and warehoused out of sight.
..which is what happened to Shaun. And on communication, he's the one actually with the most experience. He says things, notices things in the episode from Mac's case to Glassman but no one seems to listen to his views or sees his observation. They are still discounting him as people with disabilities often are (because this time he is a doctor - one of them but not one of them - and not a patient). Is the failure an inability of Shaun to adapt to the world or the ignorance of neurotypicals in dealing with these issues? That's also one of the key themes of the show. I know parents of older kids that have ended up in group homes. They love their children fiercely but also recognize that they made the right decision for their child based on their personal circumstances. They did not make the decision remotely likely and decisions were driven by the age of the parent and the size of the child now adult. Even with respite care and in-house support it is unreasonable to expect older parents to be able to cope. For sure there are halfway house solutions. But they sometimes don't work for personal circumstances.
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On 10/26/2018 at 3:03 AM, TurtlePower said:
Lea picks and chooses when to acknowledge Shaun's autism and I don't think she fully understands it. I hope they show her becoming a bit more educated about it and more conscientious about how she interacts with Shaun. Maybe we can come to like her again, but the way she's going now, not so much.
She's human. I don't think she does understand but like in the episode "Apple" she is coming to understand better. It's a process. The dramatic point of the relationship is I think the miscommunication that goes on between neurotypicals and autistics. I think the writers are very ably showing it goes both ways. Lea's failure to understand Shaun is on a par with his misunderstanding of her situation. I think they both love each other but need to work out how to communicate with each other first. It wouldn't occur to Lea that Shaun wouldn't tell her about dealing with Dr Glassman's illness. She's made the same unconscious mistake that Shaun made not wondering what happened to Shaun in San Jose. Ostensibly he seems unchanged but he's been through a lot. If she had known she would have behaved very differently. Likewise with Shaun. I'm just not as negative about this. She doesn't treat him like a pet. She is his friend. Give it time.
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3 hours ago, Brown12051 said:
It was clear that "Gabi", played by Brenda Isabel Santiago (apparently in her first TV/movie role) is a Downs Syndrome patient.
I think she may have Down Syndrome but was reported to have had a serious brain injury in the first series episode "Pain". I really enjoy their stepping up here. When Melendez first sees Mac he notices and reacts immediately but that is only to calibrate how he should communicate with him the most effectively. He thinks of him as a human being who needs help. Period. I think they did a brilliant job in this episode. I'd love to see more people with disabilities represented.
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Did the calendar in the flashback say August 2006? Or was it August 2008? If "third time is a charm" would Shaun have been 14 then which makes him 26 now or maybe he went there later? The two calendars show different years. I *think* the second one say 2007 and it looks like winter so maybe he was there for quite a while. As to the overlap with Maddie, she died 13 years prior in 2017 ie. 2004. Presumably Glassman was taking a working sabbatical or something after her death and the break-up of his marriage. Maddie never knew Shaun I think. It was part of the hallucination.
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2 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:
You have the characters confused. Kenny was Shaun’s neighbor (played by Chris D’Elia) after Lea moved out.
No I don't. Kenny pretended (largely) to be Shaun's friend, took his money at the carnival, rejected him when he was embarrassed and now it looks like stole his TV. What is Shaun's IQ? 160? More? But he was gulled by Kenny. That is a frighteningly common occurrence with people with Aspergers. My son could read at 3 years old. His inheritance is going into a trust.
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9 hours ago, Pink-n-Green said:
Wasn't that whole thing with Kenny just weird? There really wasn't any reason for that character to exist.
No unfortunately that's not true. There is a girl with Aspergers in my home country. A group of girls at her high school pretended to be her friend. They made her take off her top, took pictures and posted them online. When the parents asked her what was the worst part, it was because she thought they were her friends. It doesn't matter how smart an Aspie is, they can be gulled by ill-intentioned people. It's a real thing that happens to a lot of autistic people. So I have to think about putting any assets I might have in a trust for my kids who have very high IQs. They nailed this one right on the head with that storyline. Also, Shaun was very lonely at the time and vulnerable. I hope to god my kids never find themselves in that position.
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A nice mix of different styles of episodes. This complements the first three very well and is another solid episode in a solid series. Being part of the autism community I know a lot of parents whose kids may not be able to live wholly independently when they are gone. Parents who worry what will happen when they get old. This was a beautiful episode that explores the love we have for our kids but also the lifelong commitment that is asked of us when we get the diagnosis. My kids will be fine but I have to calibrate how much their NT sibling should be in the background to look after them when we are gone. It's not fair but it is reality. There are a lot of Kennys in the world (and hooray for his comeuppance) and I worry like hell for my socially clueless Aspies. Melendez's equivocation is absolutely beautifully played. His best acting yet. Glassman's guilt is powerfully played out and you can see why he was driven to help Shaun.
Shaun and Lea? David Shore is playing with us but also trusts us not to need as much whizz-bang visual effects now we are more invested in the characters. (Either that or they ran out of cash with the set upgrade?). Are we the going for the odd couple? Friendship? Romance? Nothing is black and white in this series. Let's see where this goes.
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Did anyone notice that the film that was on was Flatliners? Also the $1 bill on Melendez's desk from last week. I like the little subtle playful touches in this series.
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5 hours ago, izabella said:
She also could have let him know ahead of time that she was coming, and could have stayed in contact with him while she was gone.
She did stay in contact. She sent him a playlist in episode 15 "thinking of you and trees". There is an interesting article from autism advocate, Sara Luterman, https://slate.com/arts/2017/12/with-the-good-doctor-autistic-protagonists-finally-have-the-freedom-to-be-jerks.html which explores the fact that Shaun can also be a jerk, being as we all are jerks sometime. There is also a saintly toxic disabled trope of inspiration porn that the series is gently debunking as well. However bad she was, Shaun was almost as bad which allowed Lea to be honest about how she was feeling. Something is up, perhaps enough to justify a cold call? Who knows? I'd like to. I'm still in. The great thing about series 2 is that it has all been painted in shades of grey. Andrews is a monster about scheduling...but maybe not. Melendez being sexist...but capable of being extremely gracious. Dr Glassman a great man - but also in Aoki's terms manipulative. And Shaun. The Good Doctor. Undoubtedly a good man but not a saint. Hence the theme of series 2 - his greatest weakness is his greatest strength. Lea isn't a saint either but neither she is she a one-dimensional pixie villain. That's really not David Shore's style.
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2 hours ago, possibilities said:
I honestly don't know what Lea was talking about. She doesn't want to be judged? Sounds to me like she doesn't want to be accountable.
Something happened. Not sure what but it can't be good and she needs a friend. A real friend. Of course now Shaun is ready to listen she isn't willing to speak...I loved that they explore the pet theory which does happen. And the look on Shaun's face when he realizes the truth of Morgan's final statement. None of us are (is!) perfect and nor is Lea but she DOES love him and she DOES treat him like a man. You see the threads on twitter about "protecting Shaun at all costs"? Or "she will take his virginity". That makes me shiver. If he chooses to have sex with Lea it will be as a fully consenting adult. Treating autistic people as, well, people is at the heart of the autistic civil rights movement.
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On 10/5/2018 at 12:36 PM, dcubed said:
My 22 year old nephew, who is autistic, refused to visit his father or his beloved Nonna at the hospital. Both had open-heart surgery about a year apart. He even refused to see them when they were fine and recovering in rehab. He just wanted to see them at home and he didn't even want us to talk about them because he would get so upset. It is clear he has a deep love for both but he cannot express his fear and sadness well. He avoids any and all things that are emotionally upsetting. He is more moderate on the spectrum but I don't find this particularly unbelievable.
Agreed. We *know* Shaun loves Dr Glassman deeply. Shock over the diagnosis and an urge to find a solution almost caused a patient's death. My son gets upset by lots of things. He is generally in control of his emotions but occasionally lashes out. He is very empathetic but it doesn't come out the same as neurotypical people. The one fixture in Shaun's life is at risk so it's not surprising at all that he is in a state of denial. The same one as : "I don't want love" or the one that makes it difficult for him even to consider dating given his prior experiences. All that fear and pain comes out in the next episode.
I really liked the episode but more when it related directly to Shaun. When confronted by his fear of Dr Glassman's illness he makes the decision to be with his surrogate father. He overcomes his sound sensitivity at the homeless camp and Jared (of course they do this as he is about to leave for good) finally understands a bit more of what makes Shaun tick including the throwaway fact that he has been homeless (too). I hope the drop in ratings is just a natural thing and not about viewers not being able to accept that their socially clueless genius is going to grow over the hopefully many series this will be on.
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Apparently there is a deleted scene where Andrews apologizes to Jared and asks him to stay. It's going to be in the DVD but had to be cut due to the length of the episode. He isn't a villain. He's got what he wanted...and be careful what you ask for as being senior management can be a real drag. As for Lea, give it time. We don't know why she is back. Like most peoples' girlfriends it doesn't matter what you think as long as the person (Shaun) loves her. And he does.
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The promo for next week's show shows Shaun's belief that Lea is only feeling sorry for him. He talks about not wanting a relationship. He is lying to himself. I believe he doesn't know what he wants or how he feels - except one thing. He doesn't want to be hurt again. And who can blame him after going through so much pain? I think the whole set up, like the skeevy Kenny, is to explore that very idea that some people think that being nice to a disabled person is a free pass and/or is for want of a better phrase "virtue signalling". Shaun knows that happens and apparently is trying to bury his feelings again which is unhealthy. But David Shore who wrote 2x02 is never linear. I mean this is the guy who invented Dr House. I'm betting there is a great back story and that actually Lea does love Shaun. She is just human and impetuous. She shouldn't have turned up that way. That was stupid. But she did. Now I wonder what happened to bring her back?
I recently went to the Civil Rights Museum in Memphis. There was a picture of activist Hill Harper (aka Dr Andrews) there and it got me thinking about autistic rights. I bought a fridge magnet for my son who is autistic: "I AM a man". Shaun Murphy is not a child in adult's body. He IS a man, not an avatar. He isn't perfect either. My son will grow into a man and I hope that he has healthy relationships with people who treat him like a person. I think in the end Lea treated Shaun as a man when others were not and while she is not to everyone's tastes, she is actually a good match for him. I was on twitter with Mark Rozeman who is a writer on the Good Doctor and also happens to be autistic himself hoping that his voice would always be there to make sure that Shaun was portrayed as a man, not just a list of symptoms (like that awful first series of Atypical). He said no absolutely the writers' room were very aware of that. So let's give David Shore some credit in creating imperfect characters. Remember this was the same team who brilliantly nailed the Autism warrior parents in 1x5. Let's see where this goes...
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Yes! A takedown of autism martyr parents. Someone in the writers' room has been reading up on this one. As an ex-martyr parent myself who has mellowed into acceptance of my two incredibly able sweet autistic kids, I can see where that comes from. Treating autistic adults as adults. Score! Note, vaccines do not cause autism, extreme diets are detrimental and wrapping up your auties in cotton wool doesn't do them any good as some day you won't be there for them. Nice acting, Coby Bird as Liam.
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This whole episode makes me think that Shaun's problem is not autism at all. It is undiagnosed PTSD. Imagine being able to have instant recall of all your traumas as a video playing back in your brain. Sheesh that would be hard.
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This episode is the apotheosis of Shaun's character, one that I was sure was going to lead to a falling off in the following episodes. He has a brilliant idea showing his complex ability to compute in 3D that is broadly accepted and then worked on. He is getting respect from his peers for his talents. Being allowed to close the child up at the end of the episode is Melendez treating Murphy like any other resident who has had a good idea, well executed. He is growing and learning and being accepted. But the hero's journey is never straight. The mind-blindedness of Glassman to this growth is a nice contrast, setting up for a big conflict later.
Some nice developments for Claire as well. Smart, methodical and with a spark of creativity, she saves the day while preserving (pun intended) her integrity as a decent human being.
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Loved the phrase where Shaun talk about his mom's pancakes. Another one of those viewers-know-more/different on the outside than the inside situations. What happened after those pancakes with Glassman at the diner in Wyoming after Steve's death? Overall I think the show has done a pretty good job of balancing the pros and cons of autism. For many autism advocates, autism is seen as just another genetic variant. It's a nice progression for Shaun from "you can never get rid of it" to accepting that his eidetic recall and skills help him be a better doctor, even a good one. So much of his arc has been getting away from self-loathing towards his own personal self-acceptance.
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Another one of those more questions than answers episodes though I liked this one a lot better than other commentators. Shaun doesn't like lying but he is a pretty good liar by omission. He doesn't say that he hasn't phoned in to Dr Melendez. He changes the subject. Likewise he turns the question of his time as a student away by asking about what Lea does. Because lots of things don't add up. Is it possible that Shaun went to college early given his already strong technical knowledge and abilities? Could he actually be 25 and not the 8 years at university 27/28 year olds that are his peers? Where DID he go to medical school and why was he living in Casper afterwards? What happened after the pancake breakfast? Where did he live? Will babyface Highmore do his own flashbacks to med school in future series? Or will all this be swept under a carpet because it all doesn't quite add up?
Overall I liked this episode. Yes it tried to push too many new things in too quickly but both strands of the story were strong IMHO.
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One other thing. Have people been noticing the Easter Eggs in the series? Like the "House" advert on the bus as Shaun goes into work. The Autism Acceptance infinity symbol in the titles. The Autism Speaks poster in episode 18 in the hallway and the Autism Awareness poster in episode about lies. I'm sure I'm missing lots of other ones.
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I think the understanding part was understanding how to let go and be himself, not understanding Quinn. And obviously the being different on the outside than on the inside comment pertained to Shaun as well. The show takes us along as secret interlopers into his mind. Claire and Glassman are really the only people at the hospital except the viewers who have insight into how wonderful that mind is.
The nice thing about knowing a lot of autistic people is that you surround yourself with people who don't generally care about other peoples' differences. It's quite refreshing. There are all sorts of people out there who are in the out group including many on the spectrum or trans or both or whatever. The whole premise of the show is acceptance. Even the infinity sign at the beginning of the show is the sign for the autism acceptance movement. Shaun learns and grows in his understanding of a child who has been pushed by ostracism to the point of suicide. I think meeting Quinn is a nice rounding addition to his new experiences and the point is not made too hamfistedly.
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I really didn't like this one at first but then I realized why. The Resnick character is going to take over as the primary antagonist now that the older doctors are coming to accept Shaun. She is a "pain" but she is not always wrong. And we as viewers, like Glassman, need to accept that the character is evolving, constantly trying to be better. He heeds Resnick's advice in the end. Having social anxiety and putting yourself in the position of trying to talk to people at a party is an act of bravery which also shows up Shaun's problems. How many of us have turned away when in the presence of an adult acting strangely or making inappropriate comments? Fundamentally, Shaun Murphy is an autistic man, not a child. Part of the acceptance, not awareness movement is to look beyond those behaviors and just accept people for who they are. It was a nice development in Dr Andrew's arc to recognize this act of bravery and support Shaun.
S02.E06: Two-Ply (or Not Two-Ply)
in The Good Doctor
I so agree. It's like the writers had painted themselves into a corner. It's painful the gaslighting in order to create the slow burn. I think they will end up together and they would be very good for each other. And that's important to show that Shaun provides something Lea needs as well. God, I hate it when people patronize my wonderful Aspie kids. I also think Lea is deliberately played as annoying to highlight that it's hardly just a neurodiverse trait.
I quite like the friendship interactions as it does bring more depth to our understanding of Shaun's dynamics. Freddie does a great job of playing an Aspie with PTSD. Sometimes I think the PTSD is his greatest challenge.
He basically wasn't there for a large amount of time she was. He was avoiding any confrontation and working 36 hour shifts and/or sleeping at the hospital.