oliverwendell
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Posts posted by oliverwendell
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Also, removing the Darkness from Emma by having her kill him might make Emma not the Dark One, but it will also totally destroy her. Making her hate him won't mitigate the horror of having to kill the guy she managed to open her heart to.
While I agree with you it's highly unlikely Hook has been planning to kill the Dark Ones all along, I can't stop hoping that he has, and that incorrigibly optimistic part of me has to rebut your statement. Dark One Hook is probably not capable of seeing the long-term repercussions on Emma of goading her into killing him. He's still a Dark One, after all, and Dark Ones are not super capable of empathy. So I could buy him wanting to sacrifice himself and save her, but also being incapable of fathoming the emotional price she would pay. It's kind of like Emma being willing to kill Zelena to banish the Darkness and save Hook, or Hook being willing to kill Merlin to do the same for Emma (if that was his intent). In short, Dark Ones aren't really bothered by touchy-feely counter-arguments to their infernal methods, even when they are working for "good" ends.
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You will pry this Hook is tricking the darkness belief from my cold dead hands, A&E! Or until it blows up in my face next Sunday.
I am right there with you. This had better be a long con. A long, piratey con, in which Hook lures all the Dark Ones out of Hades so they can be killed en masse, which can (somehow) only happen if he goads Emma into killing him while they are on the terrestrial plane. Because if this is just him being a Darkness-infested asshole while Emma was such a noble Dark One, I'm going to have a tough time thinking he is worthy of her--even if he does do an about-face and sacrifices himself at the last minute.
(I will say, if this is a long con, he is doing a great job of the "goading Emma into killing him" part. I'd kill myself if I were her, even without his targeting her family in the promos for next week.)
Some are predicting this is all some sort of double-cross thing that Hook has going on, but I doubt it. The writer's will have Hook do many horrible things and then tell us he is redeemed and we will be expected to believe it with no action on his part. They'll just hit re-set.
Sadly, despite my desperate hopes, I have no confidence that this isn't going to be the case.
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The surprise evil is likely the whole cast of Dark Ones and Nimue. Oy, I fear the fuckery that Dark One Hook will get up to in both places.
Shouldn't we also be getting promo pics for this episode? Or did I miss them somewhere along the line?-
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Um, the ending of 5x09 made it very clear that Merida was headed back to Camelot to get revenge on Arthur.
In fact, I seem to remember a spoiler that she was going to try to get that revenge in 5x10. This episode is going to be packed. And not in a good way.
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she had filmed with Colin & Jen on Friday.
So that must mean that Emma and Hook are reunited in 5x13? That is what they are currently filming, right?
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Okay, big spoiler in that description, and I have to say I did not see that one coming. I figured Emma crushed Hook's heart to cast the curse (BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT A&E SAID IN THAT INTERVIEW DAMMIT), and I was busy trying to figure out how Hook was still alive (DO immortality? Heart splitting?). But if Hook crushed Merlin's heart to cast it, it had to have been really Nimue who did it, since Hook does not love Merlin best of all things.
My question is: Why does Nimue even want to cast the Dark Curse? Why does she want everyone to go back to Storybrooke? I can't think of a single reason why she would give a shit.
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Okay, yes, I'm now a wee bit excited about the season finale. I'm still worried they will have DO Hook commit atrocities he can't come back from. (coughMerlincough) But I'm less worried than I was. On this lazy Sunday afternoon I re-watched some clips from 4B, and they were really anvilling hard Hook's susceptibility to darkness during that whole arc. He must have warned Emma at least five times how insidious the darkness could be, and how easy it would be to give in to it. He's definitely not as strong as Emma when it comes to that, and the writers have never sugarcoated it. In fact, so blatant were the anvils that I think the writers may have been planning this whole thing as long ago as last spring, though I hate to give them credit for that much foresight.
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There was Head Rumple's line about Emma crushing Hook's heart "again" and the remark in an interview about how Emma has "a" heart in her chest.
I agree these could be breadcrumbs pointing to a heart crushing and a subsequent heart splitting. But I don't think that's what happened. What head-Rumple actually says is, "You crushed Hook's heart even more firmly under your impractical boot heel." That language ("even more firmly" instead of "again") I think could imply the metaphorical crushing Emma pulled by turning Hook into the Dark One against his wishes. Also, I can't find that question and answer about Emma's heart, but I seem to remember the question was "Does Emma have a heart" not "Does Emma have her heart," so A&E's answer "Yes" isn't really a case of them being coy about whose heart it is. Maybe someone can confirm?
Here's my current spec: since Dark Ones are immortal, could Hook be alive without any heart at all in Storybrooke? Here's how it would go down:
(1) Hook does evil, terrible, no-good things in Camelot as the Dark One;
(2) Emma realizes tethering him to the sword was a terrible, selfish mistake;
(3) She decides to correct that mistake by enacting the Dark Curse using his heart, knowing he will survive without it as long as he's the Dark One and knowing that, once everyone's back to Storybrooke, she can figure out how to get the Darkness out of both of them.
If that's the case, though, her plan to take the Darkness out of him in Storybrooke would be all kinds of tragic, because she knows he'll die if she does. But it's also kind of beautiful, because it would mean she loved him enough in the end to give him the death he wanted -- as a redeemed man, a hero -- back in the field of flowers. There would also be the added bonus in her mind of no one in Storybrooke remembering any of his evil, Dark One deeds, so he would be mourned as a fallen hero and remembered that way in the eyes of Henry, her parents, and everyone else. (Of course, being as how she's also a Dark One at the moment, she's willing to kill Zelena to accomplish this otherwise loving act.)
Or...maybe she's planning to pull a heart-splitting trick super fast right after she removes the Darkness from both of them in Storybrooke.
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Well, if they do share a heart (which, blechh), he's not going to be dead when he goes to the Underworld, because isn't that what sharing a heart means -- that if one dies, the other drops dead, too?
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I'm struggling to understand what Dark Hook could do in Camelot when Emma has the sword fragment that controls him
I forgot about that. Good point. Although Emma is also a Dark One, so she might not want to stop him from killing Merlin or getting up to other evil shenanigans.
When Emma held the sword to Arthur's throat, she said that it didn't control anyone anymore.
That was the united sword. When it's still in two pieces, in Camelot, I think each piece can control whomever is bound to it. So the dagger part can control Emma, and the blade part can control Hook. Right now, Emma has both parts. But who knows who might get their hands on one or both? Regina? Arthur? I'd feel a lot better about whatever havoc Hook wreaks in Camelot if he were forced to do it by someone else.
In Storybrooke, though, it's all on him.
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I know it's been brought up already, but I need to reiterate: JMO's Hook spoiler is clearly about CAMELOT, not Storybrooke. She mentions that this is as soon as the Darkness is within him, which is picking up from "Birth". I have no doubt whatsoever that he will be BEHAVING exactly the same in Storybrooke, but I think it'll be a ruse, whereas in Camelot it is almost definitely genuine, and I believe it'll be Merlin that he'll be seeking revenge on, and that he will kill him.
I agree with all of this except for the part about his Storybrooke actions being a ruse. I think Hook went waaaaay dark in Camelot, and did something terrible to Merlin. Something about the way Emma told him "Merlin can't help us now" when he asked about him in Storybrooke seemed so sad, like she was silently adding, "because you killed him, and I hope you never remember that".
Basically I think Emma wrought the Dark Curse to get them back to Storybrooke so she could take the darkness out of Hook AND wipe everyone's memory of what he did, so he could be spared the consequences of his own evil actions. A mere portal wouldn't have the memory wipe effect, which is why only the Dark Curse would suffice. The only thing I can't figure out is whose heart she crushed and how that person (because it's got to be Hook or Henry) is still breathing.
Also, I'm very sad that Hook is going to be immediately knocked over by the Darkness when even Rumple seemed to be able to hold it at bay for a little while.
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Merlin is shady AF, but so, so pretty.
I agree that line has got to be in there for a reason: somebody is going to be able to do it. I just don't think it will be Hook. I hope it will be Emma, with Hook's help and support, so it will be almost as though they do it together (i.e., she couldn't have done it without him).
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On my end, I keep going to this;I think this is important. For all its faults, this show doesn't just do lines like that. And going back through all the episodes, the dialogue is coming full circle.
i think you're absolutely right...and this might be the loophole they need to get him out of the UW.
I'm confused. First of all, I think it's Emma who's being foreshadowed here as the one who can control the dark without it eating up all the light, or at most the two of them working together. But even if it were Hook alone, how would that be a Get Out of Jail Free card for the UW?
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I think Emma poofs onto the Jolly Roger to stop Hook from killing Rumple at the last minute. No way does Rumple defeat him, and no way does Hook resist the darkness this early, so something/somebody else has to stop him.
I think Hook is fully intent on mayhem right up through 5x11, when he somehow summons all the Dark Ones to Storybrooke as part of his executing the spell to destroy light magic. If he does manage to resist the darkness, I think it's going to happen right at the end of 5x11 and right before he goes to the Underworld.
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There was something about how Hook will find out it's not Emma he should be angry at.
When I read that article my immediate thought was: he's going to find out he should be angry at himself. I think he's going to engage in some serious fuckery in Camelot, and when he finds out about it he will hate himself way more than he hates anyone else, even as the DO.
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Does anyone know if Game of Thrones will have a panel at Comic Con this year? I know they've gone every year previous, but I can't find any announcement or schedule that has them there this year.
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But on the other hand the realm has broken its vows to the NW. They're not sending aid when its needed, they've been left to fend for themselves. So you have to ask yourself if the realm has broken its contract with the NW is he really breaking his vows to secure its safety and future.
I agree. I hate everyone who was in on the stabbing, but this has always made me feel so sad for the NW. They're a bunch of castoffs and misfits who've been tasked with defending the very civilization that wants no part of them. They've sworn a vow that required them to give up every chance at a normal life and live in a frozen wasteland so they could focus on doing that. And now that the doom they've been watching for for millenia is finally upon them, they've been utterly forsaken by the people they're protecting. It's a wonder there's even 47 of them left, if you ask me.
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Aren't there still a fuckton of Wildling at the Wall? More than Thorne's 50 men a Castle Black.
I'm not sure about this. I thought they were heading through the gate to settle in the empty farmlands south of the Wall that Jon promised them. They agreed to fight with the Night's Watch against the White Walkers "when the time comes," but until then, they're just going to farm and try to survive. Plus, why would they hang out at Castle Black with all their children and old people who need shelter? I could be wrong, but I don't think they are on site anymore.
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Yeah, the writers have given GRRM another nine months to move his ass and get the book done. Although it takes about five months to edit a book (particularly one of this size) so he'll have to turn it in probably no sooner than October.
I do agree that that's why they wrote Jon's last scene to line up with the book's cliffhanger. But what happens after Season 6? GRRM will never have the next book done by Season 7. The show is going to end up spoiling the books -- or going off on its own trajectory -- eventually anyway.
It made no frigging sense that Jon is treated like he's just bringing the Wildings over out of the goodness of his heart rather than the actual reason.....they can be turned into an army that could destroy everyone in their path. They have Jon mention it to Sam but doesn't bother having a conversation with the rest of the NW.
Jon very clearly made this point when he told the NW why he was going to Hardhome. He said if they didn't bring the Wildlings south of the wall, they would become soldiers in the undead army, and that would be much worse than dealing with them as human enemies. Also there is no way the stabbers hadn't heard from the survivors of Hardhome what happened there. All of which makes their mutiny completely senseless to me as it was presented in the show.
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I'm disappointed that Thorne was in on the FTW knifing. I really liked the shading they'd given him as the season went along -- he went from a dick who hated Jon simply for being a bastard and a member of the nobility to seemingly developing a grudging respect for him. In that scene where Jon named him First Ranger instead of Head Latrine Digger the actor's expressions were brilliantly complex; I loved it. Then he threw Slynt under the bus. Then he let Jon back through the gate with the Wildlings. Then he told him he had a big heart -- even though he thought it would bring disaster upon them. I thought it would have been much more interesting to have him NOT be part of the mutiny, and in fact punish the mutineers, out of respect for protocol and the chain of command if nothing else. But nope. After all that interesting character development, he's just a dick in the end. Boo.
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Here's the link to the EW article:
http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-dies-interview
It sounds like Jon is well and truly dead. I'm actually pretty damned surprised. GRRM is one brutal fucker.
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So far, the most White Walkers we've seen have been four or five. Maybe those are just the commanders and there might be more. Who knows?
Didn't Craster say he'd fathered 99 sons? That's 99 White Walkers right there. Assuming that's what happened to those boys, which it sure seemed to be.
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Olly (all that foreshadowing) and Thorne stab Jon.
I don't think Thorne will be in on the stabbing. He's too much of a rule-follower. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to see him punish the mutineers afterward, even though he will be happy to see the last of Jon.
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I found the Night's Watch scene perfunctory (it was basically ~tension~ ) but that happens a lot on this show because they're juggling storylines and I'm assuming they'll get into a bit of debriefing next week.
That's what I thought, too. After last week, it would have felt weird not to at least check in with Jon and the Wildlings at some point in this episode, and the sole point of this scene to me was to show us they made it to Castle Black and Alliser let them in, and that's all. The courtyard scene lasts less than a minute and begins and ends while the Wildlings are trudging through in a long, ragged line (and a Giant is pulling focus, too). It just didn't seem to me to be a failure of character and/or leadership for Jon not to debrief the Night Watch in the midst of all that. I'm sure he'll tell them what happened at Hardhome expeditiously, and if he doesn't, I'll stand corrected.
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Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!
in Once Upon A Time
This would be great, but my fear is he's going to decide to make a sacrifice. Right at the end. Better late than never and all, but I would be much, much happier if he'd been planning all along to drive Emma away and make her hate him enough to do the killing that needs to be done. I'm honestly not sure I can forgive him otherwise. Those things he said to her were so awful, and if he killed Merlin just to get back to SB to kill Gold (as opposed to killing him to get back to the Hellmouth to summon the Dark Ones so he could end the Darkness)? Ugh. Plus, I can't help it, I need him to be as strong as Emma in his fight against the Darkness (or almost as strong; I get that she should be stronger because she's the Saviour) or I won't think he's worthy of her. And then this ship will be dead to me.