Felicity Smoak: Bitch With Wifi

[dtissagirl]

Robbie booked 2 or 3 movies after Tomorrow People was canceled, it'd depend on his filming schedule.

 

But I wouldn't mind if Luke Mitchell -- who played John on TTP -- suddenly showed up in Starling to romance Felicity. *g*

[catrox14]

Ugh. Why all these VD/Originals crossover actors :(.  I'm irrationally biased against them for showing up in the Supernatural Bloodlines episode which was terrible and I didn't find the actors at all interesting (well maybe the one that played Ennis). I know, I know! It was one episode that was poorly written but the actors did not endear me to that side of the CW stable of actors. 

[Starfish35]

Robbie booked 2 or 3 movies after Tomorrow People was canceled, it'd depend on his filming schedule.

But I wouldn't mind if Luke Mitchell -- who played John on TTP -- suddenly showed up in Starling to romance Felicity. *g*

I didn't realize that. But yes, I certainly wouldn't mind Luke Mitchell either. ;)

[Morrigan2575]

Ugh. Why all these VD/Originals crossover actors :(. I'm irrationally biased against them for showing up in the Supernatural Bloodlines episode which was terrible and I didn't find the actors at all interesting (well maybe the one that played Ennis). I know, I know! It was one episode that was poorly written but the actors did not endear me to that side of the CW stable of actors.

The guy who played Ennis sucked, the only decent actors in the episode were the guy who played Kol on TVD and the dirty cop.

And if you're going to start knocking actors for being on The Originals/TVD might want to start with Stephen Amell.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[catrox14]

Amell was on VD for two episodes back in 2011. He was in 10 episodes of Hung after that and in several episodes of Private Practice after that and two episodes of New Girl and another series I can't remember.  I think of his stint on Vampire Diaries as just a blip in time for him. I liked Ennis, he was the only one that I thought sparked at all.  His accent was a little sketch.

 

But again, I already said I was irrationally biased from that "traumatic" episode of Supernatural. 

[Starfish35]

Ugh. Why all these VD/Originals crossover actors :(.

What actors are you talking about? I wasn't aware Robbie Amell, Luke Mitchell, or even Steve McQueen, were in that episode. And were Robbie and Luke ever even on VD/Originals?

Sorry, I'm confused.

[wonderwall]

Maybe Robbie Amell, since he seems to be out of a job right now?

I actually will be a little surprised if we don't see RA pop up on Arrow next season in some capacity.

 

Actually I think Stephen Amell said that RA has a couple of movies he's shooting so maybe he's branching out from the CW which is a good thing. 

[catrox14]

 

What actors are you talking about? I wasn't aware Robbie Amell, Luke Mitchell, or even Steve McQueen, were in that episode. And were Robbie and Luke ever even on VD/Originals?

Sorry, I'm confused.

 

I wasn't talking about Robbie Amell or Luke Mitchell. I was talking about the actors in the episode of Supernatural. I think two came out of the Originals/VD.

 

I think Arrow has done a darn good job of mining the right actors from the right genre shows and other sources with diversity in casting.  I like my pretty things to be diverse in both age and ethnicity. I'm already upset that they killed off Moira and Tommy who was approaching 30.

[KirkB]

Maybe it could actually BE Dick Grayson, having recently left Gotham (and Robin) behind, and it's during his time in Starling helping the Arrow he decides on his new identity of Nightwing.

[calliope1975]

Maybe it could actually BE Dick Grayson, having recently left Gotham (and Robin) behind, and it's during his time in Starling helping the Arrow he decides on his new identity of Nightwing.

 

 

Ooo, I like this idea. I don't know how hard DC is holding onto the Nightwing character rights. This could be a way to get around that. And Dick could vaguely reference his own upbringing/mentor if they don't (which I assume is the case) want to bring the Batman universe into play.

[statsgirl]

That could be a good arc, especially if DC is thinking to branch out with Nightwing into TV or movies.  But looking at those pictures of Steve McQueen, he looks too young, too much like a kid beside Stephen Amell.  It would look like Felicity is settling because being with Oliver is unthinkable.  (I know Grant Gustin looks young too but he's got the brain power connection with her.)

 

I wouldn't mind Luke Mitchell though.

[Carrie Ann]

Steven R McQueen is a series regular on TVD. Why would he guest star on another series, as a different character? Especially a potentially recurring character? Especially on two series that film at the same time on opposite sides of the continent? I don't remember any other series regulars guest starring on other shows on The CW (aside from TVD/TO crossovers).

 

I think this all started because he made a joke on Twitter or Instagram about being Nightwing, and people kind of ran with it, and he's been sort of teasing about it since then. I think the odds of that happening are very slim. And I love him as Jer, but...no. Even if he didn't have another job already. Just no.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Carrie Ann

[Velocity23]

Lol Arrow facebook page posted that pic also. 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1508688386028998

[Password]

Who's this Nightwing fellow and why does he seem a good fit for our fair Miss Smoak?

[dtissagirl]

That's not the offical Arrow FB page -- this one is: https://www.facebook.com/CWArrow

 

, Nightwing is Dick Grayson's superhero identity after he retired from being Robin, and wanted to be a hero independent from Batman.

 

DC has an upcoming book called Grayson in which Dick will be a secret agent, and his partner is gonna be Helena Bertinelli. No idea how that affects the live action rights to the character, though.

[Velocity23]

Bahaha there is too many Arrow accounts its starting to confuse the crap out of me.  

[calliope1975]

DC has an upcoming book called Grayson in which Dick will be a secret agent, and his partner is gonna be Helena Bertinelli.

 

 

I just finished the latest Nightwing run which I really liked. I'm not sure how I feel about Dick being a secret agent. Well, I do know how I feel about it, but I'll give it a chance.

 

Dick Grayson's is just as skilled as Batman/Oliver without all the brooding manpain. He has a fairly tragic back story (parents killed while he was an adolescent and he was taken in by Bruce Wayne) but he doesn't seem to dwell on the horribleness of the world. He's also funny, extremely smart, and depending on who's drawing him, pretty hot. In theory, I think he'd make a really good match with Felicity.

[Morrigan2575]

He's no longer Nightwing, now he's Dick Greyson Agent of SHIELD...errr Spyral (good one DC)

I seriously doubt Arrow will get the rites to Dick Greyson or any real/direct Bat Family member...maybe Jason Todd no one seems to like him anyway

Well I guess she can't be Huntress...

Edited June 5, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[Password]

Thanks for the update @calliope1975 and @dancingnancy. I think it would be a great idea to have some lightheartedness and humour from a dude other than Diggle on Arrow. The second half of season 2 became really dreary and resembled the first season pilot. I don't imagine Oliver would be particularly happy with another hero in the Arrowcave, although anything to annoy Oliver at this point would amuse me.

 

Though I wonder if they would make such a big Batman connection without planning on bringing in someone from Gotham. I guess you say Grayson separates himself from Batty so they don't have to even mention the Dark Knight. But I would think they wouldn't go there, particularly now with the Gotham series.

Edited June 5, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[dtissagirl]

I seriously doubt Arrow will get the rites to Dick Greyson or any real/direct Bat Family member...maybe Jason Todd no one seems to like him anyway

 

Oh dear lord, Jason Todd would be A TERRIBLE match for Felicity! *g*

 

Actually, S1!Oliver was a lot like Jason Todd, wasn't he? "Died", spent years away in several different places getting insentive training only to come back as a Batman-like vigilante, except with no qualms about killing folks. Huh. I had never realized that before. He was even called The Hood, while Todd is Red Hood in the comics.

 

But yeah. Dick would be a much better suitor for Felicity.

[formerlyfreedom]

Hey, everyone - this is the Felicity topic. If you want to speculate about where the show is going in the future, please take it to that topic. But this is where you should be talking about Felicity Smoak, okay?

[TwistedandBored]

So, Felicity got her Masters from MIT in 2006? Am I getting this right?

[Carrie Ann]

No, I think she only has a BS from MIT, which she got in 2009. That fits with her age being around 26/27.

[KirkB]

Couldn't she be one of those particularly brilliant people who started school early and so got her credentials early, or are there age restrictions for that kind of thing?

[TwistedandBored]

Sorry, I meant 2009. 

 

@KirkB, I was think of that too when I made the comment since Felicity is regarded as a genius in this show. I really think she did get her Masters in 2009. 

[wonderwall]

My head canon is: 

• Graduated high school at 16
• Graduated MIT 2 years later with a BS
• Then graduated with her Masters in 2009 (making her about 20 at the time)
• So now she's probably at least 25 years old

 

Also you have to consider Felicity's economic conditions. I don't think Felicity could afford 4 years of undergrad and another 3 postgrad. 

[Carrie Ann]

Did I miss her saying she got a Masters? I only remembered the "Felicity Smoak, MIT, Class of 2009" line to Nyssa and other MIT mentions. To me, that says a BS degree, because I don't think most people cite a class year for graduate degrees. According to this, she was 25 at the beginning of the season. 

[catrox14]

You might when you are trying to outdo Nyssa Al Ghul - Heir to the Demon.... I mean I know I would!

[statsgirl]

Yeah, the year of the grad degree is usually not cited because it takes everyone different lengths to finish.  You identify with your year of entry into the program, not of graduation.

 

There are researchships and scholarships for undergraduate and graduate students, especially at a place like MIT where the alumni can afford to be generous with giving back so I don't think money would be a barrier to her getting her MSc. 

 

But if she had it, why would she be working at QC in the IT department?  With an MSc, she could be teaching at a college or working for a think tank.

 

Here are the program requirements.  I think it would take her the full four years to do her Bachelor's, especially if she were working part time too. There is a special stream where they can do their Bachelor's and Master's in 5 or 5 1/2 years.  http://www.eecs.mit.edu/academics-admissions/undergraduate-programs/course-6-3-computer-science-and-engineering

[wonderwall]

GUYS. I know I said that I don't need Felicity to be a total kickass (physically)... but how awesome would it be if Felicity could shoot arrows by the end of season 3 (she probably wouldn't do it well but still :p)??? 

 

Ugh just picturing it makes me all excited :p

Edited June 7, 2014 by wonderwall

[catrox14]

I suggested  upthread that she should become BC 2.0 by end of s3.  I'm all for it!

[statsgirl]

Helena could do it very quickly with the small crossbow Oliver gave her.  I don't see why Felicity shouldn't be able to do the same.

[Danny Franks]

I think Felicity's proficiency with any sort of weaponry shouldn't extend beyond the use of a stun gun, personally. I'm not really okay with seeing her firing arrows about and leaping around like Oliver and co. That's not who she is, and I wouldn't want the show to try and force her into an active vigilante role. To me, it would feel awkward and I think it could potentially alter the character, and her dynamic with Oliver and Diggle, if the writers tried to push her into such a role.

 

But a stun gun or taser seems far more her speed. She could even design and build her own, given her techie predilections. Plus, they would be primarily defensive weapons, which would make sense to me. And as for any sort of vigilante costume? I said on TWoP that I'd be fine with her dressing up as a sexy vigilante for Halloween or something (I think we'd all be fine with that), but not to actually become one.

[Zalyn]

I thought I would bring the conversation over here because I was told this wasn't appropriate for the bitterness tag! :)

 

@slayer2, Then I suppose I see something in Felicity that you probably don't. I mean the way I take your comments, I think you believe Felicity is a relatively flat character... I guess here's my argument for her sake.

 

Well goodness, I missed a bit this past week!  I'm glad I've now been educated on what the bitterness tag is for; how ironic that there was pretty mellow bitterness until recently.

 

Anyway, I also appreciate your eloquent counterarguments regarding Felicity - I agree with everything, from the way her character interacts with others to EBR's portrayal.  It also doesn't hurt to see how well Felicity works with Diggle and Oliver too.

 

One thing I haven't seen reflected on as much is her relative lack of power - sociologists would talk about how she is in a socially disadvantaged position: woman, low-level employee, IT worker (greatly exploited in terms of wages, labor, etc), no family support or social capital (networks with powerful people) in a city ruled by oligarchs.  In the beginning, when Walter asks her to do some digging into the finances, Felicity really can't say no because she is at such a power disadvantage. Likewise, while interpersonal equity develops between Oliver and her, in the beginning (and arguably even now) there is a palpable social power difference.

 

That adds a unique level of vulnerability when she gets involved with Moira - Moira could basically crush her like a bug, and both actors definitely played on that aspect. If anything, the only person with less social capital on the show is Roy.  (Diggle not only is older and self-assured, but his military background gives him access to a lot of powerful networks of support and action)

 

I really admire the character personally and in terms of writing for that reason; that probably explains why the character resonates so much with many (but clearly not all) viewers.  And that's what I would have put in the earlier conversation if responses to bitterness were allowed.  :)

This is my dream (and I may or may have not actually written this scenario.) I know bringing Nightwing on is divisive, and I have doubts that TPTB could do a good job at it, but since Arrow is basically Batman lite anyway, I say let's go all in. My favorite thing about Nightwing is that he's fun, and I'd love to see that type of personality - confident but not brooding with manpain - sweep Felicity off her feet. I know that that Steven McQueen kid was basically campaigning for himself, and I don't know much about him, other than his lineage, so I can't say if he'd be the right person for the job. But since EBR seems to be a chemistry magnet, I don't think it would be hard to find someone appropriate.

 

*whistles*  I'll just leave this here...

 

http://archiveofourown.org/works/1398274/chapters/2930767

 

(Nope, wasn't checking out the Felicity-oriented fanfic, nu uh...)

[tv echo]

But a stun gun or taser seems far more her speed. She could even design and build her own, given her techie predilections. Plus, they would be primarily defensive weapons, which would make sense to me.

This reminds me of an episode of Angel when Fred decided to go home with her parents because she didn't feel like she added anything to Angel's team.  Then she discovered something and returned just in time to help the team defeat some giant bugs with this catapult device she invented.

 

Felicity's strengths lie in her smarts and not in physical fighting, although I agree that she should learn some self-defense skills.

Edited June 7, 2014 by tv echo

[doesntworkonwood]

Yeah, I feel that learning some defense skills are necessary for her, but I much prefer her behind the computer screen. She helps out on the field when she needs to and it's wonderful to see, but they should keep Felicity as Felicity, whose strength lies in her intelligence.

[KirkB]

While I can see why Felicity would want to know some self defense (that's a good idea for pretty much anyone) and it never hurts to tone and work out, I think she'd be aware of the fact she contributes a lot more through her brains than her brawn. Oliver and Diggle can go out and do the fighting, but combat skills don't do any good if they don't know WHERE to go. Carry a stun gun, sure, even pick up a bow if need be, but if their lair is secure there shouldn't be much need for her to do that. She's going to be monitoring police bands, countering security systems and directing Oliver on the location of his target. And let's face it, all the fighting skills in the world will only help so much. If Oliver Queen himself had been in the Arrowcave when Slade snuck in he would have gotten his ass kicked, there certainly isn't anything Felicity could have done at that time to stop him.

Edited June 7, 2014 by KirkB

[Zalyn]

 And let's face it, all the fighting skills in the world will only help so much. If Oliver Queen himself had been in the Arrowcave when Slade snuck in he would have gotten his ass kicked, there certainly isn't anything Felicity could have done at that time to stop him.

I'm a big fan of booby traps.  And I could see Felicity inventing and setting up some great ones in ArrowCave 2.0.  Learning basic self defense and, more importantly, how to move effectively in one's own body would be perfectly reasonable and effective; paired with a well-set up ArrowCave, Felicity could be very good on defending in a pinch.

[statsgirl]

But there are times when Felicity is going to be needed in the field, for example as bait for the Dollmaker, counting cards at the casino, hacking into a computer on the spot (e.g. Merlyn's) or working on something that requires being there.  She has to be able to protect herself, and being able to protect someone else would be a bonus.

 

 

 

One thing I haven't seen reflected on as much is her relative lack of power - sociologists would talk about how she is in a socially disadvantaged position: woman, low-level employee, IT worker (greatly exploited in terms of wages, labor, etc), no family support or social capital (networks with powerful people) in a city ruled by oligarchs...
That adds a unique level of vulnerability when she gets involved with Moira - Moira could basically crush her like a bug, and both actors definitely played on that aspect.

That's a very good point.  In a sense it parallels the physical fear that Felicity often shows, fear of heights, skydiving and landmines, of being bait for psychopaths like the Dollmaker or Slade, even of having someone angry at her.  Of fear of abandonment by the people she now looks on as family, Oliver and Diggle.  So when she deliberately puts herself in a situation where she could get hurt either physically, emotionally or financially because she feels that it is the right thing to do, it just makes me like the character more.

 

Maybe that's one of the reasons Felicity is a popular character, because she doesn't have it all but she's willing to risk what she has to do the right thing.

 

 

We saw Diggle and Sara helping Felicity train, but I have to wonder if Oliver is against it (remember the "What are you wearing?" line in 2.14 when she was working out?) because he doesn't want her out in the field.

I think Oliver is highly skilled at compartmentalizing, not one of the best traits but it does cut down on the amount of time spent thinking.  Sara trains in workout clothes -- Felicity sits at a computer.  He told Diggle that they could protect Felicity in The Odyssey and in the next episode she's wearing the Dodger's explosive collar and terrified her head is going to get blown off and shortly afterwards she's in a criminal's casino.  But did Oliver think that maybe she needs to be able to protect herself?  Noooo, that was all on Diggle and Sara.

[dtissagirl]

Wherever the new Arrowcave will be, I really think Felicity should at least know how to handle a few of the different types of weapons they store. No matter how secure the place is, I hope they realize that it can be found and invaded again, and she does spend a lot of time alone with the computers while the rest of the team is patrolling. Knowing how to shoot a crossbow might be safer than waiting for some evil dude to get close enough for the taser wires to reach.

[doesntworkonwood]

She should totally know how to look after herself. We've seen the situations she gets into, it makes sense for her to learn self-defense. But I don't want that to mean that she's out on the field every night.

I think that if she was going to fight someone, I'd prefer her to fight using her brains rather than brawn, so setting up booby traps in the arrow cave and more exploding phones would be fun, because that shows that you don't have to be physically strong or trained to be able to look after your self. 

[Zalyn]

Wherever the new Arrowcave will be, I really think Felicity should at least know how to handle a few of the different types of weapons they store. No matter how secure the place is, I hope they realize that it can be found and invaded again, and she does spend a lot of time alone with the computers while the rest of the team is patrolling. Knowing how to shoot a crossbow might be safer than waiting for some evil dude to get close enough for the taser wires to reach.

 

 

I think that if she was going to fight someone, I'd prefer her to fight using her brains rather than brawn, so setting up booby traps in the arrow cave and more exploding phones would be fun, because that shows that you don't have to be physically strong or trained to be able to look after your self.

I'm totally getting an image of a future scene where some semi-villain thinks (s)he's smart sneaking around the Arrowcave, and starts prowling up behind Felicity, who seems to be busy typing with her back to them.  Suddenly, she grabs a modified crossbow and shoots backwards over her shoulder - thanks to a mounted mirror - and pins them.  Then she calls Oliver about the "rat problem."  I think something of that level is entirely plausible - it was mentioned before with Helena/Huntress that a crossbow is fairly easy to use without much training, and the modification would be just geeky enough to fit. 

[Velocity23]

This gif makes me laugh so much! Poor Deathstroke being smoaked.

 

 

I know it probably wont happen but i would so want Felicity look like she does on this poster!

 

Edited June 8, 2014 by Velocity23

[BkWurm1]

I love her as a blond but she makes a surprisingly lovely brunette too (yes I know she's naturally a brunette but I'm so used to the blond I didn't think I'd so easily accept the new look)

[Danny Franks]

If she wanted to go undercover for an episode with that look, I wouldn't complain. I do have to say that I prefer her as a blonde though, despite the fact I generally prefer brunettes. In that pic, she looks a bit too much like a number of other young actresses I've seen (Kate Mara, Amanda Crew and even Jessica Van Der Gouw, to name a couple).

 

Hell, I wouldn't mind if they started having a bit of fun with the idea of her going undercover or pretending to be a damsel, and had her really preparing with elaborate disguises and outfits. A bit like Sydney Bristow, but with more uncynical fun. I imagine Oliver and Diggle would be, in turns, exasperated and charmed by it.

[tv echo]

I love that brunette look for EBR but I also prefer her as a blonde on the show.  The CW has too many interchangeably-looking brunette females with long wavy hair.  I remember watching the very first episode of Arrow and getting Laurel and Thea confused.  Not any more, of course.

[Morrigan2575]

I love Felicity as she is, I don't want them to turn her into generic badass fighter #4.  On the other hand it would be foolish for a person that's living this type of life not to get some sort of defensive training or picking up weapons.  I think saying she can never be a fighter or should never kickass will cause the character to stagnate but that doesn't mean it needs to happen anytime soon.  

 

At this point I'd like to see Felicity using a taser or even pepper spray and eventually moving on to handguns simply because it's something a normal person would use for protection.  However, I'd prefer to see more of Felicity winning due to her intellect and the fun, twists they could do on that theme.  I thought making Felicity the "torturer" in 2.20 was brilliant,  It was funny and different and allowed the character to shine in a realistic and unique way that was totally organic to the character.

[Velocity23]

I just want her out of those dresses and high heels a little bit. I want to see her in jeans shirt, flat shoes, you know dressed casually. Was kind of sad we didn't get to see those panda flats anymore, from the episode when Helena returned. 

[Zalyn]

I just want her out of those dresses and high heels a little bit. I want to see her in jeans shirt, flat shoes, you know dressed casually. Was kind of sad we didn't get to see those panda flats anymore, from the episode when Helena returned. 

Thank you!  I am a bit bothered by the increase in dressy attire for Felicity in S2; I don't have problems with a person being dressy, but it just doesn't fit with the types of activities she's doing or her originally established personality.  I get that she was posing as an Executive Assistant, but that should mean suits and blazers, not cocktail dresses, at the office. And while it makes sense for a formal event to be interrupted by Arrow Cave time occasionally, it couldn't have been every night. I worry that it's part of the "prettying Felicity up" since she's a fan favorite; the irony is that many liked her from the start because she dressed practically.

[statsgirl]

I'm ashamed that in the finale, Laurel wore more practical shoes (low-heeled boots) than Felicity did (spike heels??)

 

I appreciate that they wanted to make Felicity more conventionally attractive but too often they went overboard -- the really tight dress in 2x02, the pink boob dress, the bizarre ensemble in The Promise that made her look like CSI's Garcia.  I didn't like the cocktail dressy clothes in the Cave either; she shouldn't be dressing up for Oliver and Diggle there, she should be comfortable in jeans and cute sweaters.