S07.E02: A Pirate's Life

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

When Henry finds himself in trouble, he calls upon his Storybrooke family for help, and together they set off on a mission to find Cinderella. Along the way, Hook is confronted by an unexpected foe who threatens the group’s success. In Hyperion Heights, Jacinda searches for a way to see Lucy with some unwelcome assistance from Henry, while Victoria Belfrey enlists the help of Gold and Weaver to push Henry out of the neighborhood.

[gik910]

My thoughts as I watched live tonight:

• That’s not how this works- that’s not how any of this works is what is happening in my inner monologue..
• That bottle would have been real convenient about one million times before.
• Who just makes a ballet recital a charity function at the drop of the hat? How is Henry in love with Cinderella- it’s been like maybe 24 hours.  
• What do Regina & Hook use as overnight moisturizer?
• Kinda love Weaver’s accent.
• Jacinda is super irritating.
• Hook lookin’ fine AF in those jeans and Oh - the return of old drunk Hook.  Why show? Why? Wait- really show?  This is what you thought we wanted? I can’t.
• You can’t just wave a wand if you don’t know magic. That’s not this works! Also, how many people called this scenario- of the another Hook? Come the F on.
• This Rogers/Weave situation is doing nothing for me.
• I like Tiana, so that’s something.
• Hearing about the characters we are not seeing is not fun. Hook would never suggest they go home like that - nor would Regina put up with it.  
• Hi Emma! How did you get here? CS baby! Although the image of her fighting off a gaggle of baby dragons is funny.
• 36 min in and not much happening- so that’s the same.
• Really Victoria, you can’t deal with him being a bartender for like a few hours. You are making a huge deal out of this (unless she like Regina before her knows who they all are- which boring).
• So there is a weird half-sister type situation now too? And our Hook will undoubtedly have a complex about this now. (Calling Alice as the daughter)
• “No- you don’t have a warrant” is a really easy thing to say.  This is supposed to be the “real” world.   But nice to know that Rogers is good people.
• There is the glimpse of Rumple I was waiting for.
• So our Hook is off in Storybrook and we have old drunk hook w/ a new face in Seattle?  And Regina just abdicated as mayor? And we will never see that CS baby?
• We are watching CSI: Ever After then?  I just don’t know if I can do this guys.

Edited October 14, 2017 by gik910

[scenicbyway]

OMG Wish Realm Hook is not real!  How would he exist in Henry's new realm?!  It makes no sense he was about to go after Emma till he found out she was preggo then all of a sudden "I have a daughter to find so nevermind?"  So apparently we will be seeing him get a love interest...anyone else think Cinders is his daughter?

 

The only thing that made sense was Regina staying with Henry (which I think was the plan for all 3 but Jen wanted out).

[Sarcastica]

I said I was done with Once, but with Jen coming back for one episode, I thought to myself, screw it. I'll watch, why not? 

I want that hour of my life back.

A CS baby that we will never see. Later show. Peace out. 

[bmoore4026]

Well, it was sad seeing Emma and Storybrooke Hook go.  I hope they can keep their happily ever after.

So, Seattle Hook isn't Storybrooke Hook.  Good.  Him having a chess rook is an obvious clue to whom his daughter is.

It's also interesting that Weaver isn't a bad guy, contrary to what we saw him doing in the first episode and what he did with SeaHook.

Stepmother will never be Regina, so the creators need to stop it right now.

[Rumsy4]

So, I felt pretty detached the first half of the episode, but the second half engaged me enough. 

You know what–I’m totally cool with the resolution. I always wanted it to be WishRealm Hook in HH (except, I wanted him to stay old). But hey–at least Captain Swan is happy in Storybrooke, and Woegina’s out of their and Snowing’s hair. Happy freaking Ending, everyone!!! 

I loved seeing Emma on-screen one last time, even if her appearance was short (as expected). But I loved that she and Killian helped WishHook get a second chance.

Oh--and I read a theory that WishHook's daughter is Alice, and I think that sounds plausible. 

So--Weaver's really a good cop. At least he's not going to boss around WishHook! But it still doesn't make Rumple interesting again.

I wasn't drawn-in enough to regularly watch the season, but I might catch an episode here and there.
 

Edited October 14, 2017 by Rumsy4

[scenicbyway]

Henry and Jacinda have no chemistry.  In every scene he inexplicably acts like he is in love with her but there is no spark.

Snow and Charming had extra spark because of the real life fairytale of Ginny and Josh.  It just seems so forced in the Henry/Jacinda scenes.

[OnceUponAJen]

I think I liked the idea that this was past and present Hook, and one would stay with Emma while the other went with Henry. I didn't imagine Old Hook reappearing again at all.  I'm glad Captain Swan got a happy ending, but this is kind of bizarre.

Still not feeling any chemistry between Henry and Cinderella. There's something to be said for the slow burn.

[formerlyfreedom]

Wow. Well, that makes this easy.

[PixiePaws1]

3 minutes ago, scenicbyway said:

  So apparently we will be seeing him get a love interest...

Not 'we' ..cos i am DONE...finally can let this show go. No interest in watching Not!Hook...i am freeeeeeeee.

Can understand why everyone looked so awkward ...the actors had to be thinking..WTF??

[sharky]

Am I the only one who liked the episode? I like that this isn't our Hook but a different Hook. I liked Hook vs. Hook. I LOVED seeing Captain Swan being Captain Swan.

Henry and Jacinda are a little forced, but I'll give it some time. It took me awhile to warm to Captain Swan too.

And I'm really looking forward to this Henry/Regina/Wish Hook team up. The three of them could have a really cool and different dynamic  

[Rumsy4]

6 minutes ago, scenicbyway said:

Henry and Jacinda have no chemistry.  In every scene he inexplicably acts like he is in love with her but there is no spark.

This was actually the first episode I watched this season, and I have to agree that Henry and Alt!Cinders have zero chemistry. 

Also, I'm totally cool with this being Wish!Hook in Seattle, but I have no freaking interest in seeing him get a love interest. But I think A&E did their best to preserve a happy ending for CS, and yet have Hook on the show. I will give them that. 

[Proteus]

I must be the only one happy with this. Emma and Hook are still together and will remain together. Good.

Rogers is not Emma's Hook. Good.

I'm fine with this.

[mtlchick]

Quote

Am I the only one who liked the episode? I like that this isn't our Hook but a different Hook. I liked Hook vs. Hook. I LOVED seeing Captain Swan being Captain Swan.

I wouldn't say I loved the episode, but 1) it was a step up from the premiere and 2) the second half started to get interested with the dual team up in the realm and HH.

It's enough to appease the CS fans.  No CS baby, but they're getting the happy ending so even if it's off screen, I'll take it. 

Still not feeling Cinderalla, her kid or Tremaine, but we got Not!Rumple in a Canadian tuxedo.  That has to count for something, right??

Edited October 14, 2017 by mtlchick

[Inquirer]

So we're getting more from the Wish Realm.  I hope this means we'll get Henry vs. Wish Realm King Henry some time down the line.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Inquirer

[OnceUponAJen]

Props to Colin tho' because there was a perceptible difference between the two Hooks even though they looked alike.

[formerlyfreedom]

Just to be clear, I have no issue that some may have enjoyed this episode. For me personally, though - I have no interest in following new Henry, new Hook, Regina, and Rumple, and definitely not any of the new cast, they just do nothing for me. So watching Emma and Hook go back through the portal, it was just a sense of relief - and that this isn't my show anymore.

[Inquirer]

OK, was anyone else creeped out by Regina giddily asking Henry "Can we make it an operation?"  at the end?  That was some inappropriate chemistry between what's supposed to be a mother and son.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Inquirer

[KingOfHearts]

Just what the hell did I just watch?

* I'm actually okay with Wish!Hook. The writers can do whatever they want with them and it won't be especially icky. It opens him up to multiple seasons and new storylines.
* When I saw Wish!Hook, I was desperately hoping that Alternate Forest would actually be the Wish Realm. Nope. It's one of the infinite grains of sand in the multiverse. Sigh.
* Jacinda continues to be an unlikable bitch.
* Victoria is one idiot of a villain. Mayor Mills would have figured out a frame job already. She wouldn't have had to go crying to Mr. Gold. She knew how to keep her composure and her head.
* Weaver's boring because he's just Rumple. There's nothing different about his personality or Robert's performance.
* Shut up, Henry. Even as an adult, he was still whining about himself.
* Has Regina done nothing in the past 10 years or so? She acted like she just saw Henry three months ago.
* Doesn't Regina have mayoral responsibilities to attend to? What's with these people and ditching their lives to put themselves in danger?
* Hyperion Heights was actually more cartoony than the flashbacks. It makes very little sense and no one acts like they're human.
* Stealing Victoria's watch? In Regina's words, "What is this? Amateur hour?"
* Overall the flow and dialogue was confusing. It's another Hook who gets de-aged and has a daughter? That's verging on twisting pretzels to make the plot work.
* Even though this was Emma's "curtain call", it wasn't about her and she was super passive again. She was just there to tie up a loose end. There wasn't much justice for her character, but what did we expect? I'm fine with the happy ending they gave her, but her treatment in the long run sucked.
* Finding Wish!Hook's daughter is really the only thing I find any remote emotional investment in at this point.

Oh look. They're ripping off the Jiminy Cricket episode next week. Joy.

Edited October 14, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[CCTC]

I know we complained about how campy Evil Queen was in the later seasons, but in season 1 she was more than just camp -- she could be a scary mix of rage and pain and did not deliver every line like she was twirling her mustache.  Same with Mayor Mills -- she was often quietly sinister and efficient.  I feel Lady Tremaine just chews the scenery delivering every line like she was channeling Ming the Merciless from a 1930's serial.   Also,, as mentioned on the other thread, it does not make a lot of sense why a step-grandmother would have this kind of control.   Still, even if it did, it just seems like a warmed up rehash of the season 1 Emma/Henry/Regina tug of war.

Jacinda and Henry seem to be channeling Ross and Rachel - not some epic love story.   Dallas and Goodwin played it like they felt totally thrown off kilter about what they were feeling and did not know why.  Their pull towards one another came off a bit deeper than the sitcom bantering of Henry and Jacenda.  Plus, we did seem them interact more as a team in their flashback scenes.

Henry came off really selfish with little regard for his family when that much time had gone without seeing them, and it seemed damn easy to jump realms.  Also, while I don't necessarily feel the actor is doing a bad job - but something seems a bit off about his performance.  It is like the actor is playing like "I am doing this fairy tale show" -- not necessarily quite tongue in cheek, but almost like he is in some game and not really connecting with anyone or showing any sincere emotions of feeling.

I like Lana and think she is a decent actress, but Regina really doesn't seem like Regina.  It is like they completely sanitized her.  Not that I want angsty Regina - but now she just seems to good to be true.    She probably worked best in 2A and 3A when she was trying not to be evil, but was not all unicorns and sunshine.  Since Hook is a different character, probably best to pretend  she is a different charter as well (and a different show).  I almost wish they would just have her Henry and Fake Hook go off and have old school adventures in the fairy tale realm  instead of dealing with the rerun of Season 1 and its curse (and Cinderella,, Tremaine, and Lucy).

Mixed feelings about Weaver.  Am somewhat interested in what his plan and intents are and if he is good or evil, but I have a feeling in the end it will following the same Rumple arc we have seen 20 times before.

While I would not have expected them to spend 5 minutes talking about how everyone is in Storybrooke, would have been nice to get even a small detail about Snow and Charming other than they were happy.  Guess Henry does not care about his baby uncle - who hopefully is not still a baby several years later.

[gik910]

3 minutes ago, Inquirer said:

So we're getting more from the Wish Realm.  I hope this means we'll get Henry vs. Wish Realm King Henry some time down the line.

Which means it was real, right? And Regina killed Snow & Charming...And that there is another crazy Rumple out there somewhere. 

I am actually ok that this is not our Hook - but that also means I have no emotional investment in him either.  

I actually like Roni so far. That's something.

[Sarcastica]

Just now, Inquirer said:

OK, was anyone else creeped out by Regina giddily asking Henry "Can we make it an operation?"  at the end?  That was some inappropriate chemistry between what's supposed to be a mother and son.

There was way more chemistry between Regina and adult Henry compared to Adult Henry and whatshername.

Blech.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

And that there is another crazy Rumple out there somewhere. 

I'd be all for Weaver being Wish!Rumple, but I doubt that's going to happen. I'd also be okay with Clone Queen being Roni, but they'd have to explain Robin's absence unless they brought Sean back.

[Watt]

Sigh. Idk. I didn't hate it but I did ff any scene with any of the new people. I'll wait and see what they do with Mader when she comes back. Do not like Cinderella.

[Mabinogia]

If the show ditched Cinderella, her annoying kid and her hammy overacting stepmother they might have something. But really, the new cast just sucks! I would love a show about Regina, Hook (any version) and adult Henry fighting against a Big Bad, but I just cannot stand Cinderella's voice, facial overacting and general presence. Lucy is obnoxious. and Lady Tremaine, I know that is the actresses actual accent but it always sounds so freaking fake. It did on Burn Notice and it does here. She is hamming it up, but not in a fun way like the Snow Queen or Regina, or even what this show tried to pass off as Maleficent (sorry, I will never get over the woobification of the greatest Disney villain of all time). I am trying to get on board again (I was off OUAT for a while but when I heard Emma was gone I thought I'd give it another try) but it sucks!

7 minutes ago, Inquirer said:

OK, was anyone else creeped out by Regina giddily asking Henry "Can we make it an operation?"  at the end?  That was some inappropriate chemistry between what's supposed to be a mother and son.

They had a million times more chemistry than Henry and Cinderella do, that's for sure. 

[SilverShadow]

They didn't ruin Emma's happy ending. THANK GOD. I can just enjoy the ride of the new season without having to freak out. Cindy is still ehh but I adore Drizella. Also with Hook's line about his daughter being locked in a tower I'm thinking it will be New!Rapunzel. 

[Rumsy4]

"Operation Next Chapter" was the best Adult Henry could come up with?? lol I think he should've gone for "Operation RequelSequel". 

I have to agree that the new cast seems pretty lackluster so far. They don't have the presence of the originals. 

[Writing Wrongs]

For me, the Seattle stuff is boring as hell. Nothing in it interests me. They have established absolutely nothing about this new world. This doesn't feel like Once Upon A Time at all.

I miss Robert and his stylish Mr. Gold suits.

[Lady Calypso]

I also was kind of annoyed with the episode, but I'll try to focus on the positives.

So, Rogers isn't our Hook, but Wish!Hook. I'm not a Captain Swan fan, but I am an Emma fan, so knowing that she still has Killian with her in Storybrooke is a nice thought. That's pretty much the only positive I have, because I was just groaning at Hook's whole flashback storyline. It also made Wish!Hook look undecisive. First, he's there to steal Emma away so he knocks out Hook. And then, when he finds out Emma's pregnant, he decides that he's going to return Hook to Emma because he has a daughter that he can't see? Eh, I'm fully expecting Alice to be Wish!Hook's kid. I thought she could have been Hook and Emma's daughter at some point this episode, but Wish!Hook's daughter sounds plausible. Plus, why wouldn't they have already introduced her? 

My other thought was Murderella, only because of the dumb shots of Rogers staring at Jacinda at the ballet recital. 

Adult Henry is just fine for me, but he seems to be trying to force a chemistry with Jacinda that just isn't there. I also roll my eyes at the anvils being dropped right on my head about them. 

Weaver's ok, I guess, but I really don't see his purpose. I think they could have done without another version of Rumple. I also don't mind Roni but I also grew sick of Regina, so I'm not really in it for the Enchanted Forest flashbacks with Wish!Hook, Regina, and Adult Henry. 

And yeah, Lady Tremaine/Victoria is too hammy, and not in an entertaining way. I just find her annoying. Enchanted Forest Drizella is much more interesting than Curse!Drizella too.

I'll end on a positive note: I liked Emma's appearance, as little as it was. I wish she got more to do and she wasn't so passive in her role, but I'll take what I can get. I came for this show for Jennifer Morrison, and I ended up staying for her. Now, knowing that this is probably her last appearance this season? I think I might start forgetting to tune in. 

[scenicbyway]

7 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

"Operation Next Chapter" was the best Adult Henry could come up with?? lol I think he should've gone for "Operation RequelSequel". 

I have to agree that the new cast seems pretty lackluster so far. They don't have the presence of the originals. 

To be fair, Henry wrote "Once Upon a Time" a book that was already written...interesting that it failed.

Also, how does Henry know Roni's "ok" to hangout with he and Hook?  Didn't they meet in the last episode?

If there's a picture of Emma in the book should there be pictures of Regina and Hook too?

[Writing Wrongs]

So the plot is about corruption and a book expose of Belfrey by Henry? WTF?

For a Jane Espenson episode, there wasn't much humor in it.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Writing Wrongs

[Souris]

28 minutes ago, saoirse said:

Just to be clear, I have no issue that some may have enjoyed this episode. For me personally, though - I have no interest in following new Henry, new Hook, Regina, and Rumple, and definitely not any of the new cast, they just do nothing for me. So watching Emma and Hook go back through the portal, it was just a sense of relief - and that this isn't my show anymore.

I haven't watched yet, because I was streaming something else live at the same time, but I followed along somewhat on my timeline.

Eh, whatever, the show sucks, the writing sucks. I'm just glad that at least A&E preserved CS's happy ending, and CS will be be happy and together and with a baby in fanfic. And I can read it without feeling conflicted or pained because the show effed it up. 

And even better for CS and the rest of SB? They're Regina-free and Rumple-free now! Basically, SB is THE place to be!

Now that CS have happily ridden into the sunset, and I don't care one little bit about anybody or anything else on this show, I can scream:

Edited October 14, 2017 by Souris

[Shanna Marie]

11 minutes ago, sharky said:

Am I the only one who liked the episode? I like that this isn't our Hook but a different Hook. I liked Hook vs. Hook. I LOVED seeing Captain Swan being Captain Swan.

I actually like this solution. Emma and our Hook are still together, happy, and by now have a child older than Lucy. Their story is "complete." But de-aged old Hook is at the start of his redemption arc, so Rogers isn't rehashing Hook's redemption story, and he has a different goal than finding Emma. It's a clever way out of a dilemma, keeping a character played by Colin without separating Hook and Emma. So kudos for a solution. I can see why Colin is liking this season. He loved playing Wish!Hook, and now he gets to play Wish!Hook on a redemption arc without going through all the makeup. I bet it's a fun acting challenge to play the same character with different experiences. This, strangely, gives me more of an investment in this season because I'm curious to see Rogers' arc and learn more about his daughter. I may stop watching in real time and make liberal use of the FF button.

However, very little in the present made any sense. There would be all kinds of red tape and processes to have a child taken from her mother. An adult's stepmother wouldn't be able to just take her child and deny all access. At the very least, there would be home visits by child services and a lot of court hearings to have Lucy taken from Jacinda and then assigned to Victoria as a foster parent. And I can't believe that Victoria would have that kind of power in a city like Seattle. Plus, I can't think of a ballet school that would allow their recital to be turned into a fundraiser like that. Shutting out the parents who pay tuition without them having to buy a $500 ticket wouldn't be good for business. Every time they switched over to that plot, I just went right out of the story, it was so ridiculous.

13 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Has Regina done nothing in the past 10 years or so? She acted like she just saw Henry three months ago.

I think this is where time is moving differently in different realms, so it hasn't been that long for the Storybrooke gang. However, I'm not sure how they're going to explain the fact that Wish!Hook and Regina haven't aged about ten years between this episode's flashbacks and the present. This is before Lucy was born, and Lucy's at least eight, probably closer to ten.

18 minutes ago, CCTC said:

Mixed feelings about Weaver.  Am somewhat interested in what his plan and intents are and if he is good or evil, but I have a feeling in the end it will following the same Rumple arc we have seen 20 times before.

Yeah, he may have supposedly been testing how good Rogers was, but he wouldn't have been on call with Victoria and her expecting him to do her bidding if he wasn't dirty. I'm suspecting he's setting Rogers up as a patsy. And, you know, it will be a bit less stressful to watch whatever they put Rogers through, knowing that he's not our Killian.

I'm really not feeling Cinderella/Jacinda or her relationship with Henry. I did like Tiana, though, and I thought she actually clicked better with Henry, probably because it wasn't so forced.

[Rumsy4]

I actually couldn't hear Wish!Hook very clearly when he was explaining his backstory about his daughter. Did anyone catch it fully? Also, did he have a daughter after the WishRealm was created, or was the daughter a part of the WishRealm? Why is no one worried about poor orphaned Wish!Henry??! 

Edited October 14, 2017 by Rumsy4

[thuganomics85]

So, the Cursed Hook in Hyperion Heights is actually the older, fatter Hook from last season, who has been made to look young thanks to Tremaine.  The real Hook is actually back with Emma in Storybrooke and they apparently have a child.  I guess I can live with that since it means they aren't going to cause more angst on that front (at least I hope not), and Emma/Hook do get their happy ending.  I do wonder what the original plan was had Jennifer Morrison decided to renew her contract.  Anyway, I actually think the flashbacks could end up being the most interesting thing with Regina, Henry, and Hook 2.0. banding together to find Cinderella and Hook 2.0's daughter.  And I'm guessing something is going to cause Rumple to get involved and that's how he gets cursed as well.

Other then that, all the stuff in Seattle continues to be dull.  Cinderella/Jacinda continues to be unlikable and poorly acted, Tiana seems to be stuck in the best friend role and make stupid frog puns, Tremaine is already getting dull and coming off like a pale version of every other villain on this show (not to mention the whole blatant Devil Wears Prada stuff, with Drizella clearly ripping off Emily Blunt's character), and Henry keeps being a doofus.  The only stuff I kind of enjoyed was Rogers/Weaver, but that's probably due to Colin O'Donoghue and Robert Carlyle always being great together. 

Still trying to keep an open mind here, but this is not a very impressive start.  I'm already missing the rest of the gang.  Even when Charming and Snow were being frustrating due to letting being "good" make them do dumb things, I still cared about them and whatnot.  But I'm have no investment here because even Hook really isn't the Hook I've been watching for the past few seasons.

[scarynikki12]

Well, my theory that Hook and Regina will get paired is still viable. I’m grateful it’s not Emma’s Hook but I still expect it to happen. 

Like @saoirse I’m officially out. 

 

[Terrafamilia]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Colin, you are far too good for this show!

[cappoe]

Yeah I'm out. Not watching anymore. There's no reason to.

I do not care about Regina nor Rumple nor have ever cared.

I sure as hell don't care about the carbon copy new characters.

I NEVER cared about any of the WR characters.

The writers even said WR is NOT real. So why all of a sudden are you bringing this shit in to think this is real. REGINA MURDERED WR SNOWING!? WR HENRY IS A FREAKING ORPHAN WITH NO FAMILY AT ALL!?

But that's not real!? What a convoluted mess.

The silver lining is this whole season is going to be ignored by everyone in the fandom when it ends anyways,lol. What a joke.

[Worsel]

I thought the way they were able to preserve Hook and Emma in Storybrook with a happy ending was well done.  

My main problem with the last episode and this episode is that there seem to be lots of magic beans where before there were none.  Let me see...first there was just one last magic bean that got used.  Then more beans were found (and grown) before all were destroyed.  Now out of the blue, Henry has a magic bean in the first episode of this season, and Hook has one in this episode.  It is really irritating when such a big deal was made about how there were no magic beans.

And I agree with others about the lack of chemistry between Henry and Jacinda.  I do hope that this Rumple is the Wish!Rumple as I think that would be interesting to see how he might find redemption in the absence of anyone who loves and believes in him.  Unless he is looking for Storybooke's Belle like Wish!Hook was looking for Emma - but then we'd be dealing with two Rumples.

[Shanna Marie]

It occurred to me that if time is passing differently in the other realm, and thus Henry aging while his parents haven't, then that could mean that Henry and Cinderella could have got together and Lucy was born and grew to her current age while Emma was still pregnant, so Baby Jones could still be a baby instead of a preteen. And if our Hook is happily in Storybrooke, they could always bookend things when the curse breaks by Henry calling home and Hook answering the phone, possibly while feeding or holding the baby, then have him call for Emma to come to the phone, and then we switch to Henry's side of the call.

I have to say that the Wish!Hook/Rogers twist resolves a lot of my concerns about this scenario, aside from Hook and Emma's ending. I hated the idea of Rogers' morality being tested when we already know Hook has become a good man, but it works if it's a Hook who's only recently had a second chance (and it says a lot about our Hook and him dealing with his self-loathing that he begged for the life of his other self). Him being partnered with Rumple's cursed (?) self isn't quite so gross, since they don't have the same history. Presumably, the point of divergence was Regina not casting the curse, so there still would have been the Milah stuff, but not the controlling Hook with his heart and nearly crushing it or hijacking Hook's sacrifice to get the Darkness back. There's also a lot of new opportunity for flashbacks, covering Wish!Hook's life from the time the curse wasn't cast. I wonder when his daughter fits into all that. And since the point of divergence is the curse, there's opportunity to get into the parts of Hook's past we haven't seen much of yet, like his time in the Navy or soon after he became a pirate, and it should still apply to real Hook.

3 minutes ago, cappoe said:

The writers even said WR is NOT real. So why all of a sudden are you bringing this shit in to think this is real. REGINA MURDERED WR SNOWING!?

That is an issue. Either it's real, or it isn't. If the people from the Wishverse are real enough to jump to other realms and have fully realized lives that are on a different path from their real counterparts, then Regina murdered the Charmings. If it's not murder because they weren't real, then Wish!Robin can't go and live his happily ever after with the Evil Queen in the Enchanted Forest, and Wish!Hook can't get a second chance, go on to help Henry, and get himself cursed into being a Seattle cop.

Oh, one sad thing about Rogers not being our Hook: I was kind of enjoying the idea of Hook ending up with more real-world police experience than Emma. On the other hand, our Hook remains 100 percent Hook, with no We Are Both, no cursed identity.

8 minutes ago, Worsel said:

My main problem with the last episode and this episode is that there seem to be lots of magic beans where before there were none.

Yeah, suddenly Hook seems to have a pocket full. And what was the deal with the portal in the previous episode? Henry was rushing toward a prearranged one (but then had time to go to a ball before it opened) and said he was going home, so it sounded like he popped by every so often, but then in this episode they're using beans to travel, and they don't seem to have seen Henry since he left.

[kingshearte]

1 hour ago, OnceUponAJen said:

Props to Colin tho' because there was a perceptible difference between the two Hooks even though they looked alike.

Haven't watched yet, but this doesn't surprise me. He's always been good with the subtleties — such as the time Rumple appeared as him to trick Belle into giving up the dagger. Looking forward to watching his work, seeing RealKillian and Emma head off into the portal, and ignoring whatever happens in the rest of this season.

[Miles]

"That is the last magic bean Henry!... except for these three we have lying around, that we can just burn to rescue you."

Ugh. The portal-inflation annoys me to no end. In season one Rumpel had to work for a hundret years and find a sucker to enact a dark curse for him, to travel to our land, to have some kind of chance to see his son again and now portals are a dime a dozen. The dark one couldn't find a magic bean in over a hundret years and now they are just lying around.

And the infinite realms, with infinite variations thing still irks me. That should cuase some existential crises in this characters, Rick and Morty style, but nope, nothing. Just glossed over to justify all the recasting and alt-characters.

 

So this is actually alter-Hook we have here. And I guess Emma doesn't know that Henry, alter-Hook and Regina are under a curse and that's why she's not there? I guess that's a better explaination than most of the alternatives? But how will they explain her not visiting in Seatle once the curse is broken and Henry can call her? Ah who am I kidding, this show will be cancelled long before that point.

 

3 hours ago, gik910 said:

You can’t just wave a wand if you don’t know magic. That’s not this works! Also, how many people called this scenario- of the another Hook? Come the F on.

I think it's a nod to the cinderalla animated sequels, where the evil stepmother gets a hold of the fairy godmother's wand and changes time. It's supposed to be batshit insane and rather good. Haven't seen it yet. Still, in the context of this show, pretty dumb. But we kinda did the same thing last season with Rumple's mother, so...

 

3 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

* Has Regina done nothing in the past 10 years or so? She acted like she just saw Henry three months ago.

She might actually have seen him three months ago. I don't think as much time had passed for her, Emma and Hook as it did for Henry. But I would have expected a bit more suprise at how much he had aged. At least more than a "you grew up".

 

1 hour ago, Worsel said:

Now out of the blue, Henry has a magic bean in the first episode of this season, and Hook has one in this episode.  It is really irritating when such a big deal was made about how there were no magic beans.

You forgot a bunch. Hook and Regina used one to get to Henry. Then Emma used one to get to them. And at the end of the episode Emma and Hook used one to get home. So that was three magic beans in total that were used in this episode.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Miles

[Last Time Lord]

I should have guessed that Rogers was Wish Realm Hook and not the Storybrooke one. I actually like him.

I'm curious if Jared Gilmore will be making more appearances. I was surprised he showed up for the brief flashback in this episodes after the gap bridging one last week. I find myself wanting Vengeful King Henry from the Wish Realm to show up and cause some fun.

If this was indeed Emma's Swan Song (sorry) I thought it was a good one.

[pezgirl7]

None of that episode really made any sense, it jumped around too much, and there were so many convenient plot contrivances. I'm kinda annoyed that this whole show is now going to be about fake, drunk Hook, even if he was magicked into looking like our Hook. I didn't want real Hook's happy ending with Emma ruined, but I just have no interest in this new Hook. Also, there wasn't enough Emma in this episode.

[Camera One]

The first two-thirds of this episode in Seattle was just atrocious.  It was even worse than last week.  Despite seeing Emma (which was really nice), the present-day plot pretty much sank this episode for me.

I remember the speculation a few months ago, that we might get the Wish Realm Hook on this show instead of the real thing.  Disregarding the effect on CS's happy ending, it was hard to fathom how viewers would connect to or care about the Cursed Killian if it was revealed to be a different person.  All things considering, I think the show needs to thank Colin's acting skills for making us still care about this alternate version.  If not for his acting, the "I'm looking for my daughter" thing would have been purely manipulation (which it was, thrown in after half an episode of mis-direct that he was a sleazeball wanting to get with Emma).  So Hook from the Wish Realm had a daughter?  That would have been in the Wish Realm, right?  Are people's backstories in the Wish Realm actually real even though they were created by the Wish?  I still have some trepidation about this route because it shows such utter lack of originality.  Now they get to do one of their favorite storylines - Captain Hook being redeemed - again.  I don't look forward to watching more of that retread.

This whole scenario makes Henry seem incredibly selfish.  He waited that long to call for Hook, Emma and Regina, and only because he needed help... so he hadn't been in one dangerous situation the entire time he had been away?  He's depriving his family of spending time with him, and for what?  How was Emma able to so easily come later?  The message in a bottle had a portal re-scheduling option?  And then Real Hook had another bean at the end.  So what's Henry's excuse for not visiting Storybrooke more often, if it's so easy to enter this All New Realm That No One Had Ever Been To Before?  Except it couldn't have been that hard, since Wish Realm Hook came here.

You'd think Lady Tremaine was The Evil Queen, with all her reinforcements and basically doing whatever she wanted in the Enchanted Forest Version #815.  And you'd think Seattle was Storybrooke with Weaver saying crap like "You're the only one who knows this town as well as I do" to Roni.  I still don't see much originality with anything in this requel.

I can't believe they had real Hook run a sword into one of those palace guards.  I guess the message is we don't need to care about those palace guards anymore.  I also didn't like how they had Hook telling Emma not to heed Henry's call because she needed to rest.  What was the point of that, if she shows up herself later anyway?  So Lady Tremaine had a past with Wish Realm Hook? 

The pathetic character motivations in this episode were galling.  Henry has a tantrum sword fighting with Hook at the beginning, and says "What's the point... I'll never be good enough."  What?!  If you throw in dialogue like that, you have to address it.  Does Henry have an inferiority complex?  Who cares, he's just the freak'in main character now.  Not that I wanted more Regina focus, but really - did she never consider HERSELF that she might want to leave Storybrooke and spend time with Henry?  She needed Henry to suggest it?  And then she pathetically begs for the Operation to be named?  If they were aiming for "sweet", they hit a completely different mark.   Regina should have gotten her own episode where she came to the decision to leave Storybrooke and go with Henry.  

Now, to the Seattle stuff.  I can't tell if it's the writing or the acting, because both were equally bad.  Officer Rogers goes to someone's house at 6am to ask about the lady in the book?  Ever heard of phoning Henry and setting up a meeting to talk?  They had Henry say a million times that he was sorry for what he did last week, but I still don't understand why he gave up Jacinda's location.  Without that, even I can't forgive him.  Can Jacinda be any more grating?  The lines are so lacking in subtlety.  It was Henry's fault that she and Lucy are separated, so why not take the money?  "I'm not a damsel waiting for a Prince!"  Who would say something that idiotic?  Does she want to see her daughter or not?  Though it's just one single ballet recital, so who cares, I suppose.  And Lucy isn't inclined to sneak away to say hi to her mom at the chicken place?  Why, because she's under lock and key?  In real life, no "friend" would ask a man their roommate just met, "Are you in love with her?"

Victoria is just pathetic, and whiny to boot.  I can't take any of her scenes seriously because they are so badly acted.  I mean, what a loser.  She couldn't drop a bracelet into someone's pockets without leaning on Weaver?   

I was simply bored with the usual Rumple stuff.  I thought they would explore something police related, but he was solely at Victoria's beck and call.  Oh of course he was impressed with Roger's "moral core".  Riiight.   "Up until now, our goals have aligned," said Weaver to Victoria.  But not now?  Why?  Because it was the surprise twist of the episode?

I did not understand the whole catering gig thing.  So Henry had so much experience as a bartender, that he got himself a job at the ballet venue with the ability to hire servers, which he did via app?  They put so little thought into making the plot make sense.  The reasoning for the "team" of Regina, Henry and Rogers at the end was convoluted as hell.  So Rogers had a case of a missing woman which seems to be a cover-up caused by Victoria, so now that he's a detective, he can dig and no computer can trace his unauthorized searches, so if Roni can name some people Victoria "squeezed", then Henry can write about it, even though he doesn't have a job at a newspaper.  If it's on social media, you don't need a Writer.  Roni or Rogers can also write about it because, you know, they're literate.

So the theme of this episode is "Second chances aren't given, they're earned."  How appropriate, A&E.  Consider your second chance not earned.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Camera One

[roctavia]

I like that they found a way to make hook not hook.... even if it makes no sense how old hook got out of the wish realm. I don't want that whole realm to be real.... but I can allow that old hook somehow managed to get out like robin did before the realm went poof... but I do hope this isn't a well they keep going back to when they want to bring in a new old character. It works once for Hook, but that's it. Leave the wish realm gone.

 

Have we ever met the evil step mother before in previous seasons? In other realms/as a different character? I don't recognize her, but I don't always pay the most attention to this show....

Still not sure what to think of hyperion heights..... but it may also be that I'm not excited about a whole season of no one knowing who they are thanks to a curse... since we've been down that road many times before.

[Camera One]

9 minutes ago, roctavia said:

Have we ever met the evil step mother before in previous seasons? In other realms/as a different character? I don't recognize her, but I don't always pay the most attention to this show....

We haven't met her before.  She's a brand new character.

[Artsda]

Love the twist that real Hook is still with Emma getting their happily ever after with their baby.

[roctavia]

11 minutes ago, Camera One said:

We haven't met her before.  She's a brand new character.

Thanks, I thought so... but she also looked vaguely familiar, but not? if that makes sense .... must be from something not once upon a time.

Edited October 14, 2017 by roctavia

[KingOfHearts]

The happy ending for Captain Swan leaves a very strange taste in my mouth. It's fanfic-y and fits very nicely, but it doesn't really mark a resolution to any long-standing arc. The pregnancy was tacked on, and even though Emma getting a second shot at motherhood is very important to her, that was just glossed over. We're not going to see the baby nor the realities of her pregnancy. She has never expressed wanting another kid before. Real!Hook didn't get a chance to comment on it at all. It's just fan service, really. Wish!Hook is a neat idea, but it's over-complicated. He had to be de-aged, transported across realms, and linked to a daughter. (Even more questions regarding the Wish Realm have now been raised.) This whole episode wasn't exploring characters. Rather, it was generating plot shenanigans to put all the ducks in a row.

If the Wish Realm and the multiverse weren't so blindly handled, we'd all have more faith in characters like Wish!Robin and Wish!Hook.

Edited October 14, 2017 by KingOfHearts