Bewitched - General Discussion

[David T. Cole]

Episodey!

[David T. Cole]

Amusing or crazy-making?

[David T. Cole]

I'd get that nose fixed.

[henrysmom]

Does anybody know of a show with more replaced actors?  Of course there were the two Darrins and the two Mrs. Kravitz.  But there were also two Louise Tates, and two Darrin's fathers (with Darrin's father one coming back after Darren's father two did a few episodes.  So four repeating characters having different actors.  And I think I may be missing some.  Anybody know of others?

[smiley13]

I think Aunt Hagatha was played by more than one actress as well.

[Chai]

I love Dick York as the best Darrin! He had chemistry with Elizabeth Montgomery and he acted as though he really loved her. Dick Sargent only came across as angry to me. It was the only emotion he ever showed. 

[Chai]

Endora was quite the character!  Her fury over her daughter marrying a mere mortal almost drove her crazy! The way she managed to mangle his name each and every time..... DUR-WEED! She seemed to have almost absolute power as far as her powers were concerned, but she could never fight back against the fact that Sam and Darrin really loved each other.To Darrin she was an absolute b!tch as a mother in law! lol

 

One of my favorite scenes is her interacting with Darrins father and getting along famously, much to his mothers dismay. 

 

Nothing was too good for her daughter or granddaughter.

[CherryAmes]

Absolutely agree Chai. Aside from the relationship with Samantha I always felt that underneath it all the Dick York Darrin actually liked Samantha's family -with Dick Sargent it was as if he hated them. 

[pandora spocks]

It's funny how time and maturity changed my perspective of Endora.  When I was a child during Bewitched's original run on TV, Endora seemed like quite the bitch.  I even rooted for Darrin.  Fifty-odd years later, I view Darrin as an oppressive asshole and Endora as a fun-loving gal who wanted Samantha to have better in her life than living the "mortal way."  I guess my opinion change stemmed from seeing enough oppressive assholes in my personal and professional life.  A well-placed zap would have came in handy.

[Blergh]

pandora,

   I don't disagree that Endora definitely wanted Sam to be a 'creature of the wind' but, alas, Sam had TWO masters- Endora and Darrin!  Sam seemed to spend the entire show believing that she had to please both of them and, in doing so, she could somehow guilt each of them into making peace with the other. Alas, while that's a funny concept in sitcoms, this sort of thinking often proves the ruin of many a family. I always wish there had been a episode in which Sam told BOTH of them off.

    All that said as malevolent as Endora could be, she was easily the most interesting and fun character, IMO- and it's to the show's credit that they respected Sam's bond with Endora enough to scuttle the idea of having the Darrin Switch be from Endora's spell with only the viewers but not Sam knowing.

[Blergh]

It wasn't just Sam's family Darren #2 hated. He seemed to hate everyone to the point that when Sam wound up saving his own parents' marriage, he seemed mad at HER!

  Still, even before the Switcheroo Darren seemed to have lost virtually all the bemused infatuation he had for Sam in the early years [and a low point was when Sam dunked a drunken 'masher' when she thought Darrin wasn't around and, rather than be happy she could take care of herself in his absence and or even slightly upset at the 'masher' for putting the moves on his own disinterested wife, , Darrin#1 behaved like a #2 re the 'No more witchcraft' scolding]!

[Kev]

pandora, I love your acknowledgement of Elizabeth's nom de plume.  

[SilverShadow]

Thirded. Darrin 1 and Samantha seemed like they did well and truly love each other. Especially in the first few seasons. Season 1 was very grounded and used its magic as a metaphor for real conflicts a young newlywed couple might face. In Season 2 the showrunner changed and it got a bit more wacky, and the trend continued from there. But yeah. Dick York's character was more frazzled and generally didn't start things with Samantha's family without being provoked. Lets not forget his first impression of Endora was her threatening to turn him into an artichoke and Maurice more or less killed him and had to be persuaded to undo it. I always liked that he was nice to Aunt Clara (who was find of him) and he and Uncle Arthur got along okay too. Darrin 2 was always just mean, to everyone, and often with no reason. Including Samantha! There were times she actually seemed to be afraid of him. Not worried about his feelings or his reaction, but scared of him.

 

The original Gladys also gave you the sense that she wasn't really a bad person, just too nosy for her own good and looking for some meaning in a fairly unremarkable life. The second iteration of the character had no real redeeming qualities. And Esmeralda had none of Aunt Clara's charm and was just an annoying sad sack.

 

I think generally all the characters got more snippy and hateful as the years went on, actor change or not. Basically the only post-season 3 episodes I like are the ones with unique plots or a focus on Serena, Maurice, Uncle Arthur, or Tabitha.

[magicdog]

I certainly wouldn't do what Sam did and let it go to waste!

 

I'd never have to worry about cleaning the house, getting whatever I needed (see a cool outfit in an ad and reproduce it for myself), and giving a little just desserts to those in need of it.

[SilverShadow]

For starters I'd make my student loans and credit card debt dissapear. Besides that, riches, travel, maybe just a touch of world domination....you know, the usual. Hee.

[Happytobehere]

To me, virtually any post Dick York episodes are unbearable. IMO, he represented what Darrin was supposed to be, a normal guy who unexpectedly and unknowingly wound up married to a witch. All of his reactions always seemed rooted in reason for the most part. Sergent's Darrin always came across as a mean-spirited, unreasonable jackass. I understand illness sidelined York, but did they have to get such an awfully unlikable replacement?

I also agree that Esmerelda was a bad fit for Aunt Clara, who like York had to be replaced.

[Chai]

I agree! Back when twop was still active a poster on the bewitched board went so far as to say Darrin #2 acted in a way that he could believe that Darrin would actually beat Sam behind closed doors!

I also got the impression EM tired of doing the series. Her acting just wasn't in it in the later seasons and to me it showed. The early seasons are my fav to watch.

[legaleagle53]

To me, virtually any post Dick York episodes are unbearable. IMO, he represented what Darrin was supposed to be, a normal guy who unexpectedly and unknowingly wound up married to a witch. All of his reactions always seemed rooted in reason for the most part. Sergent's Darrin always came across as a mean-spirited, unreasonable jackass. I understand illness sidelined York, but did they have to get such an awfully unlikable replacement?

The thing is, though, that the "replacement" was actually the original choice for the role.  The only reason Dick Sargent didn't play the part from the first year is that he was under contract elsewhere at the time.  Had he been available then, Dick York would never have had a shot at the role.

[SilverShadow]

So I recently got the complete series on DVD (it's relatively cheap at 25.99 on Amazon) and I'm contemplating starting from episode one and going through every single one. Yes, even the Sergant years.  Though I may need some alcohol for those.

 

I was wondering if anyone would want to join me? I was thinking going at like 4-6 episodes a week. It would be fun to watch with fresh eyes and discuss with fellow fans.

[Happytobehere]

The thing is, though, that the "replacement" was actually the original choice for the role. The only reason Dick Sargent didn't play the part from the first year is that he was under contract elsewhere at the time. Had he been available then, Dick York would never have had a shot at the role.

This may be true, but to me, York portrayed the Darren that the original narrative that explained what happened. Sergeant's Darrin seemed angry to the point of being verbally abusive. While we will never know, I suspect that had Sergeant been the original Darrin, the show might not have lasted long enough to need a replacement had he suffered York's fate. However, it is equally plausible that angry, borderline verbally abusive Darrin would have been the norm and the show would have worked anyway.

To me, the Darrin by Sergeant as being all-day angry and hostile is always capsulized in the episode with Adam and his magic. The little boy would not use his powers until Darrin gave him the go ahead. That always struck me because that to me said the baby, and he was still a baby (2 or 3) knows to associate fear with his father (Which begs the question of why Adam was mortal in the awful Tabitha series? Did Darrin scare the warlock out of him?). York's Darrin was basically taken aback with the reveal that Tabitha was a witch and said something like, "You don't mean what's her face?" He wasn't even angry when Tabitha kept zapping him back in the house whenever he left because she missed him. Sergeant's Darrin would have erupted into rages.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Happytobehere

[legaleagle53]

Very fitting, too, since the show just celebrated its 50th anniversary.  I'm in.

[SilverShadow]

Hey, one person wants to join in! That is at least one more than I was expecting.  I'm going to be at NYComicon next week, which will slow my watching slightly. So, legaleagle53, and anyone else who wants to go for it, how about between now and Oct 17th we try and get through 1X01 "I, Darrin, Take This Witch, Samantha"-1X10 "Just One Big Happy Family" and after that we go to a per week basis?

[legaleagle53]

I'll have to see whether I can hunt the show up on Hulu. I don't have the DVDs (and even if I did, my DVD player doesn't work anymore), nor do I have Netflix.  Of course, I've watched all the episodes so often after growing up with the show (I'm just a few years older than Erin Murphy) that I can probably discuss them all from memory, if nothing else!  :)

[SilverShadow]

Season 1 and the first four episodes of season 2 are on Hulu for free. If we have problems later on we can look for other solutions.

[Jynnan tonnix]

kinda sounds like fun...I don't watch much tv at all (as in weeks at a clip go by and I forget it's even there), so a lot of what I DO watch ends up being stuff I remember fondly from my youth when my memory is jogged by something like this. I have Hulu and Netflix, but don't really know how to work the DVD player without messing up all the settings, so I stay away from that :)

[henrysmom]

I'd like to watch along.  Though I don't think I'll last through the last years--this show got pretty bad towards the end.  Then again, it might be fun to rewatch a remake of a York episode followed by a Sargent episode.  I have to admit it nearly killed me when I had to very reluctantly admit that Sargent did a good job with his take on "Darrin the Bold".

[henrysmom]

I watched "I, Darrin, Take This Witch, Samantha" last night and thought I'd post my thoughts.

First off I was struck by how gorgeous Elizabeth Montgomery was, especially in the opening scenes, when she keeps bumping into Darrin.  And that was a cute little sequence.  I couldn't decide if their continued meetings were accidents or arranged by Samantha.  Does anybody have thoughts on that?

 

The scene where Samantha tells Darrin she is a witch pretty much encapsulated why I love Dick York so much.  So befuddled and clueless, but so sympathetic and willing to listen to Samantha.  Yeah, he was a little ticked at having this bombshell dropped on him after the wedding.  Who wouldn't be?  But he wasn't nasty about it, just a little put out that he had to learn this after they were married.  I can't even begin to imagine how Dick Sargent would have played this scene.

 

 

[Kev]

 

And that was a cute little sequence.  I couldn't decide if their continued meetings were accidents or arranged by Samantha.  Does anybody have thoughts on that?

It was pure happenstance. Samantha wouldn't have done that to him. 

[legaleagle53]

One important thing that this episode establishes (and that fans tend to forget) is that it was Samantha who first proposed giving up witchcraft, not Darrin.  In fact, she even said after she told him that she was a witch that she hadn't intended to do any more witchcraft for his sake, before she was forced to do some in order to prove to him that she really was a witch.

 

Keep that fact in mind any time we see Darrin get bent out of shape in the future over Samantha's habit of using witchcraft  whenever she felt it convenient to do so.  He's not trying to enforce an arbitrary ban that he forced on her -- he's reminding her that she broke a vow to him that she herself had proposed.  As later episodes will make clear, both of them knew that Darrin couldn't really stop her from using witchcraft if she was determined to use it, and that she therefore really held all the power in the relationship.  Moreover, as she would frequently remind him, she really did prefer to do things the mortal way most of the time simply because that was the way SHE wanted it; if not, she would simply have left him long ago.

Edited October 12, 2014 by legaleagle53

[maplebrew]

What would I do with magical powers? Abuse them, I suppose.

[lucindabelle]

I've always thought it would be fun to be invisible. Not so sure why, really.

I'd magic lots of money so I didn't have to work.

[henrysmom]

It was pure happenstance. Samantha wouldn't have done that to him.

 

 

That was kind of what I was leaning towards.  I think it is interesting that the witches in I Married A Witch and Bell Book and Candle (supposedly used as the basis/inspiration for Bewitched), it took magic for those women to get their mortal.

[henrysmom]

I got a chance to watch "Just One Big Happy Family" and thought I'd post my thoughts.  My first reaction was just how scary Maurice was. Endora could (and often did) change poor Darrin in various ways, but I don't think she ever actually destroyed him like Maurice did.  But I did like the charm Maurice Evans' brought to the role.  You can see why Endora fell for him (and why she left him too--charm isn't fun when it is being used on other women).  And though everything is fine and dandy at the end of the episode you still know Maurice is never going to accept a mortal for a son in law.

 

I did have one question I hope others will weigh in on.  There is a scene where Maurice is apparently unsuspecting of the horrible truth that Darrin is a mortal.  There is a cut to a scene with Darrin in the bar, then the scene cuts back to the house.  And all of a sudden Maurice has a birth certificate and a pill bottle proving Darrin is mortal.  Do you think Maurice knew all along and was just messing with Samantha?  Or was a scene just cut?  It has always kind of jarred on me when I watch this episode.

 

Boy, on the in-law front, the Stevens sure didn't have much luck, did  they?  Darrin and Endora were at daggers drawn from pretty much the moment they met, and Darrin's mother was just horrible.  I always found it odd that even after years with Darrin (and two kids) Samantha still called her in-laws Mr. and Mrs. Stevens.  I can imagine calling her MIL Mrs. Stevens, but her FIL seemed like a nice enough guy (with both of the actors portraying him, though I liked the first one best).  Oddly, if I had to pick one of the three "bad" in-laws to be my own in-law, I think I'd pick Endora.  She'd be fun to spar with, she might turn me into a werewolf or whatnot, but she'd always change me back.  But to have to deal with Mrs. Stevens' sour face and judgmental tone...I'd even go with Maurice over her.

Edited October 16, 2014 by henrysmom

[SilverShadow]

I watched "I, Darrin, Take This Witch, Samantha" last night and thought I'd post my thoughts.

First off I was struck by how gorgeous Elizabeth Montgomery was, especially in the opening scenes, when she keeps bumping into Darrin.  And that was a cute little sequence.  I couldn't decide if their continued meetings were accidents or arranged by Samantha.  Does anybody have thoughts on that?

 

The scene where Samantha tells Darrin she is a witch pretty much encapsulated why I love Dick York so much.  So befuddled and clueless, but so sympathetic and willing to listen to Samantha.  Yeah, he was a little ticked at having this bombshell dropped on him after the wedding.  Who wouldn't be?  But he wasn't nasty about it, just a little put out that he had to learn this after they were married.  I can't even begin to imagine how Dick Sargent would have played this scene.

 

Finally starting to play catch up as I try and go through a giant load of laundry.

 

"I Darrin Take This Witch Samantha" is an incredibly good pilot. It introduces all the characters and the core concept while still standing strong as a stand-alone episode. Darrin's aunt who thinks she's a lighthouse and the "Avery Nicholas John" spell both get callbacks later on. We also get the first instance of Samantha saying "Good." It is interesting how much the first half plays up that Samantha's young and inexperienced considering that even the Sheila stuff introduces one of the core commandments of Bewitched "Thou shalt not fuck with Samantha Stephens." Speaking of Sheila, she gives some vintage "Mean Girl." Lying about the party's dress code, damn. And I never realized when I originally watched as a kid just how much of a Jackie Kennedy vibe she's giving off.  And Sam's revenge magic is excellent and I love how she starts small but as Sheila gets more and more obnoxious she ramps it up.

 

"Be It Ever So Mortgaged"-Another good one. We get a lot of Endora and Samantha's relationship, and the introduction of the Kravitzes. We also get the first version of the "We are quicksilver" speech and the running gag of Endora refusing to acknowledge Darrin's name. I really like the extended home decorating sequence. Also Darrin wanting so badly to make a good impression he terrifies Gladys.

 

"It Shouldn't Happen To A Dog"- Yeesh this one is painful to watch. This one of the occasional reminders that yes, this show was made in the era Mad Men is set in. Darrin eventually comes to his senses but it sucks that the happy ending is that the asshole signs with the agency.

[henrysmom]

"It Shouldn't Happen To A Dog"

 

 Oh, wow, this episode.  Just painful.  From Darrin's "what did you do?" because of course it was Sam's fault that the client was a groping pig to his "a regular wife would know how to handle these situations".  Dang, I hated him in this episode.  He did come around, but it took actually seeing the client groping Samantha for him to react.  Just nasty.

 

"Be It Ever So Mortgaged"

Ah, the introduction of the Kravitzs, with the wonderful Alice Pearce as Gladys Kravitz.  For me the show just lost something when Sandra Gould took over the role.  Her Gladys was just mean and nasty.  With Alice Pearce in the role, you could see her as a friend as well as a nosy neighbor.  

Edited October 20, 2014 by henrysmom

[legaleagle53]

 Oh, wow, this episode.  Just painful.  From Darrin's "what did you do?" because of course it was Sam's fault that the client was a groping pig to his "a regular wife would know how to handle these situations".  Dang, I hated him in this episode.  He did come around, but it took actually seeing the client groping Samantha for him to react.  Just nasty.

 

"Be It Ever So Mortgaged"

Ah, the introduction of the Kravitzs, with the wonderful Alice Pearce as Gladys Kravitz.  For me the show just lost something when Sandra Gould took over the role.  Her Gladys was just mean and nasty.  With Alice Pearce in the role, you could see her as a friend as well as a nosy neighbor.  

And Sandra Gould would have been the first to agree that she was no Alice Pearce.  She and Alice had, in fact, been good friends, and after Alice's passing from cancer, Sandra was devastated.  In fact, once, someone accidentally called her "Alice" on the set, and it upset her terribly.

[henrysmom]

I had no idea Sandra Gould and Alice Pearce were friends!  Interesting to know.  I wonder if the different direction the character took was Gould's idea or the producer/writers.  

 

I have always admired Gould's obvious love of the show.  In the interviews I've seen with her she always seemed so proud to be connected to the show, so while I never liked her version of Gladys Kravitz, I always liked the actress herself.  I always enjoy seeing actors proud of the work they do, and not bemoaning how something ruined their career.

 

 

[SilverShadow]

Gould's always seemed super sweet in interviews etc. from after the show ended. I think what happened was season 2 was already a bit 'wackier' than season 1 and season 3 pushed that even more so when Gould came onboard they wanted "interfereing nosy neighbor" and the earlier depth got lost, which is a shame.

Edited October 21, 2014 by SilverShadow

[henrysmom]

I have noticed that even in season 4 (Dick York's last) the character of Darrin has changed slightly.  He loses patience with Samantha and Endora a lot quicker than he did in earlier seasons.  I can actually see how it was a natural progression to Dick Sargeant's even less patient take on Darrin.

Edited October 21, 2014 by henrysmom

[legaleagle53]

I had no idea Sandra Gould and Alice Pearce were friends!  Interesting to know.  I wonder if the different direction the character took was Gould's idea or the producer/writers.  

 

I have always admired Gould's obvious love of the show.  In the interviews I've seen with her she always seemed so proud to be connected to the show, so while I never liked her version of Gladys Kravitz, I always liked the actress herself.  I always enjoy seeing actors proud of the work they do, and not bemoaning how something ruined their career.

 

Kasey Rogers (the second Louise Tate) was like that as well.  She very proudly declared herself to be "the First Lady of Advertising" and loved to support the show every chance she got -- in fact, she had always wanted to do a proper updated sequel revolving around the grown-up Tabitha.  About the only thing she hated about the show was the dark wig that the producers made her wear during her first few seasons with the show to ease the transition for viewers from the first Louise Tate.  She was so glad when she was finally allowed to get rid of it and show off her natural red hair in the final couple of seasons.

[prican58]

Antenna TV just aired the first 2 episodes. I watched the pilot and I was impressed. Yes, EM looked incredibly beautiful then, and she never really lost that beauty. I grew up watching this show, even though I don't remember the early seasons well. I remember Alice Pearce's Mrs Kravitz but it must have been her later years.

 

What I loved about TV back in those days was how the tv studios took advantage of the talents of old Hollywood character actors like Pearce, George Tobias and Agnes Moorehead. So many careers were extended at least for a little while. TV needed experienced actors as well as new young talent (hence the tv studio system and its stable of contracted players) and where else but the Land of Hollywood Character Actors were you going to find them.

I always thought Agnes was so glamorous on Bewitched, especially in the color episodes. The flowing gowns, eye makeup and coiffed hair. Later on when I discovered Classic films I was surprised to see she was almost always portrayed as the plain spinster type. I've seen pics of her as a young woman and she had something.

 

Anyway, I also prefer the York eps to the Sargent ones. These early episodes make me realize that York really was a bit older than EM. Never gave it much thought back in the day but now it's like an anvil.

 

BTW, what do you all think about Jose Ferrer's voice over narration? Interesting touch,  

[SilverShadow]

The snarky psuedo-documentary narration is in the first two episodes and episode four, which makes me think it was originally supposed to be episode 3. Other details like Sam only having two cups and saucers and the phone not being connected when in episode 3 she's throwing a fancy dinner party, support that. I think the narration's cute and works well in the pilot especially, but it's probably for the best they dropped it. 

[henrysmom]

I did enjoy the fact that in one of the early (maybe the second episode) season openers Sam is foundering around making breakfast and making a mess of it (fixed by witchcraft of course) and just one or two episodes later she flawlessly puts together a dinner party (without witchcraft).  She sure caught on to the mortal life fast.

[legaleagle53]

For her, that was half the fun -- the challenge of learning to do things the mortal way and the sense of accomplishment when she did!

[SilverShadow]

I agree. But I think it was also very 'human' (so to speak) that when her efforts results were less than perfect she gave into temptation to fix her mistakes (though this happens much more in the first handful of episodes than later.)

[henrysmom]

I love the episode later in season one where Samantha conjures up Ling Ling, the cat turned model, to star in Darrin's latest ad campaign.  And guess who shows up to dinner?  Ling Ling, who proceeds to drink soup right out of the bowl like a cat, and eats an entire tray of sardine hors d'oeuvres.

 

There is another pushed to the wall and having to use magic instance in this one, where Darrin invites (or is forced to invite) the Tates, the photographer, and maybe the client over to dinner.  And poor Sam has nothing in the house so she has to whip up dinner with magic.  And of course, who walks in during the process but poor Mrs. Kravitz.  I feel for the woman--she had to think she was losing her mind when she leaves a house with bare counters, comes back ten seconds later and there is food all over the place.

[SilverShadow]

A brand new Bewitched series will begin airing on NBC, starring Tabitha's daughter!

 

 

Coming on the 50th anniversary of Bewitched‘s debut, the new version is a reimagining of the original series two generations later. It centers on Daphne  — Samantha’s granddaughter and Tabitha’s daughter — a single twentsomething witch who has always used her magical powers to conjure herself the perfect life. But she soon realizes that the one thing she cannot conjure and control is the one thing she wants most — real love.

Edited October 23, 2014 by Lisin
Fixed topic typo

[henrysmom]

Oh dear.  Considering how badly both the Tabitha series and the movie reboot went, I have serious doubts about this.  I saw in another news story that Christina Applegate is said to be the lead choice for the role.  I love her, but have to think she's a little too old to be playing Samantha's granddaughter.

[SilverShadow]

They said 20-something. Perhaps they mean for Tabitha?

[legaleagle53]

Considering that Tabitha herself would be in her 50s now, she could easily have a 20-something daughter.  And don't forget that witches don't age at nearly the same pace as mortals, so mother, daughter, and granddaughter would all still look about the same age.

 

As for the Tabitha series and the reboot, the former was ruined because it threw established canon out the window by making Adam (1) a mortal, (which was genetically impossible) and (2) too close to his sister's age -- if Tabitha was between about 24-26, as the show implied, he shouldn't have been more than about 18-20 and still living at home or in college, not 24-25 and hanging out with Tabitha in Los Angeles.

 

And the problem with the movie was that it wasn't really a reboot of the series any more than the Brady Bunch movies were a reboot of that series.  The movie was actually more of an homage to the original series that played with some of its original concepts, but with an entirely different set of characters and plot at its core.  A true reboot or sequel to the original series has yet to be attempted.

Edited October 23, 2014 by legaleagle53