S01.E06: Career Days

[PRgal]

26 minutes ago, bybrandy said:

So does that midlife crisis last for 30 years?    Because I'm thinking if I expect to live until 90 that my midlife crisis should be like 45... just saying.

 

 

Maybe a midlife crisis starts when you "feel old"/start not recognizing celebrities on covers of entertainment magazines?  I've been feeling that way for the past five or so years.  I'm 37.

Question:  Maybe my eyes were playing tricks on me, but was Rebecca driving an SUV-type vehicle?  I thought wagons were still the "thing" 30ish years ago.  We got our first SUV in the 90s. 

[kili]

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We have seen Kate, Kevin and Rebecca all have mementos of Jack.  Kate has his ashes.  Kevin and Rebecca both have necklaces.  Wonder what randall has?

I thought it was interesting that Jack works in construction and Randall went blind while trying to renovate the house. I think that part of his over-zealousness with the renovations was likely an attempt to connect with dead Jack.  Maybe he has some of Jack's tools?

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It also interesting all the personal one on one interactions, the heart to heart moments, we are seeing with the kids this season is with Jack much more than their mom. 

Which brings back the episode where Rebecca ranks their parenting efforts and gives herself higher marks. Rebecca seems a little delusional. She gets the mechanics of being a parent, but not the emotions. The distance from her children in this episode was palatable. She ignores the babies in their cribs and is performing music (her old career). The kids play as she looks at the report card. She talks to Jack, not them about the ice cream. She and Jack talk about Randall's schooling - she does not speak to Randall about it. She is primping herself in the mirror while carelessly talking to Kate. Her one true interaction with a child in this episode is to force an ugly jumper on Kate while telling her she must wear it because it is the only thing that fits (and is clean).  While I'm sure there are plenty of times when she does interact with the children off-screen, the show is telling us that she is often remote. 

Even at the pool, it is Jack who interacts with the children. Rebecca talked to others about the children and she yelled at the children, but she never talked with them. She is a good at the mechanical aspects, but she seems to provide little for the soul.

The kids must of felt Jack's loss greatly. He's not perfect, but he really connects when it counts. 

The kids are 8. Maybe Rebecca should have gotten a paying job to help pay for that school. She might feel a bit more fulfilled. I learned how to do my own laundry at 8 and Kate could then have clothes she wants to wear. Jack could get his dream job. Everybody would be happier.

[JudyObscure]

21 minutes ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

The mom of Randall's African American can tone down the attitude a bit.  I understand what she is saying, but both Jack and Rebecca's initial interactions with her over a simple question, this episode and at the pool, were so off putting and negative. 

I noticed that when they met at the pool the first thing Yvette did was yell at Rebecca for not asking her advice, and this time the first thing she did was yell at Jack for asking her advice.  Then of course she didn't skip a beat before giving her answer in that pedantic, any fool would know, tone of voice.  There are lots of things to consider before  sending your child to a "gifted" school and it's not the right thing for every single child who tests high.  My husband went to one and he was under high pressure and subject to bullying all through school.  Every year we get begging calls for contributions and  this year they said tuition was up to $12,500 per year, even allowing for deflation, it's not money you just "figure out," as Rebecca put it.  That's real money not a riddle.

[PRgal]

17 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I noticed that when they met at the pool the first thing Yvette did was yell at Rebecca for not asking her advice, and this time the first thing she did was yell at Jack for asking her advice.  Then of course she didn't skip a beat before giving her answer in that pedantic, any fool would know, tone of voice.  There are lots of things to consider before  sending your child to a "gifted" school and it's not the right thing for every single child who tests high.  My husband went to one and he was under high pressure and subject to bullying all through school.  Every year we get begging calls for contributions and  this year they said tuition was up to $12,500 per year, even allowing for deflation, it's not money you just "figure out," as Rebecca put it.  That's real money not a riddle.

I'm surprised they didn't even mention financial assistance.  I don't know how established Randall's school is supposed to be, but most have bursary programs for families who meet the qualifications (usually based on family income.  The Pearsons might qualify since they're single income).  I guess the writers didn't come from private schools.

Oh, and $12.5K/year?  That's considered modest in some cities.  Private schools in, say, NYC are probably close to $35-40K+...for day students.

[GodsBeloved]

9 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Coach Taylor was a pretty good dad :)  Plus, he's married to the amazing Tami Taylor.

Yep yep. 

I love the complicated simplicity of this show. 

I felt Kate when I saw those stairs. I workout with a group of ladies and our coach has had us running the bleacher stairs plus something just like what Kate had to climb. He calls it the human stair master and like Kate I call on Jesus when facing that monster.

Jack really is awesome and he and lil Randall were my favorite part this episode.

And did I feel Kate when she saw that S on Becca's shirt then checked out the XL on her sweater. 

I groaned when Kevin slept with Olivia but thanks Olivia for saying it won't happen again. I want Kevin to have a Beth/Rebecca in his like not an Olivia.

[biakbiak]

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Which brings back the episode where Rebecca ranks their parenting efforts and gives herself higher marks. Rebecca seems a little delusional

Rebecca only gave herself higher marks when he was drinking, she said when he was sober and all there he was the better parent.

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Oh, and $12.5K/year?  That's considered modest in some cities.  Private schools in, say, NYC are probably close to $35-40K+...for day students.

Today but not in 1988. I have friends who went to NYC private schools graduating in the mid 90s and it was 15-18k range.

Edited November 2, 2016 by biakbiak

[PRgal]

7 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

Rebecca only gave herself higher marks when he was drinking, she said when he was sober and all there he was the better parent.

Today but not in 1988. I have friends who went to NYC private schools graduating in the mid 90s and it was 15-18k range.

Okay, I wasn't sure if you meant then or now.  I think my parents paid $14-16K (Canadian) for me back in the mid-90s.  The school now costs 31K.  Based on inflation, tuition should "only" be around $22K or so.  Again, there should be some sort of assistance program for families. 

Edited November 2, 2016 by PRgal

[GodsBeloved]

1 hour ago, absnow54 said:

I know this show is about bringing on the tears. But I'm still laughing at Jack's "All of my kids are exceptional" with the immediate cut to present day Kevin being a dolt. It reminded me of that line on Arrested Development when Lucille says "I love all my children equally" and then they cut to earlier in that day when she says "I don't care for Gob."

Kevin is an exceptional dolt LOL and yes to Lucille loving all of her children equally. 

[GodsBeloved]

1 hour ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

The mom of Randall's African American can tone down the attitude a bit.  I understand what she is saying, but both Jack and Rebecca's initial interactions with her over a simple question, this episode and at the pool, were so off putting and negative. 

I will have to watch it again but my intitial impression was Yvette had a so you asking me because I'm black attitude. I thought yes he is and isn't that's what he's suppose to do the same way Rebecca was suppose to introduce herself to you and the other black mothers at the pool.

[Lady Calypso]

6 hours ago, Badlands said:

I love this show, but the inconsistency with the timeline drives me crazy.

In the first episode, the Big Three were celebrating their 36th birthdays. Thus, when they showed the scenes when they were born, it must have been 1980, right? Well, in an EW interview, the creator said it was 1979. That would make the modern day scenes to be 2015, but okay.

Then, last week they were talking about the possibility of having kids during the Steelers - Rams Super Bowl, which took place on January 20th, 1980. Kate mentioned she was conceived during the Super Bowl, which would mean the Big Three would have been born in October, 1980. All right, maybe the creator just misspoke when saying it was 1979.

However, tonight when the showed Randall's report card, I believe it said he was born in June of 1981 (I erased it, so I can't go back and check). So that would make it a 17 month pregnancy and make the modern day 2017.

Also, they showed a flashback last week of Rebecca watching what appeared to be the 1969 Super Bowl with her family as maybe a ten year old child, but she would have been 18 years old in 1969 (in a 1980 scene, she said she was 29 years old).

Am I overthinking this? Yeah, I thought so.

I do think this is a continuity error thing. If I calculated right, all the kids would have been born in September either 1979 or 1980, but it's definitely September. I'd have to go back and check out the report card myself, but I do think they might be born in 1980, despite what has been said earlier. I guess after they got picked after in 2016, they had to change what they had initially in the pilot as 1979. 

2 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

There were false notes in this one, chiefly the crashing of the funeral.  Very, very tacky and offensive and they could have just as easily had the memorial be for someone Olivia knew from the theater community.  Sex in the mourner's home, keeping it classy.  The Career Day cringefest was a little over the top.  But it may have been Rebecca that bugged me even more.  It's not realistic for her to have been working on her music in the same room as sleeping triplets.  If you have a sleeping infant, never mind three of them, the last thing you do is make noise.  Even worse was Kate's comment that everyone in sight still to this day hits on her beautiful mother.  Even if it was hyperbole to get through to Gemma, I thought it was a tad too much.  She's not that great. 

I agree. In a way, I think Kate and Kevin are very much alike even in their taste in love interests. Both Toby and Olivia could be seen as pushy, maybe a little overbearing but I guess that goes to show how many self esteem issues both Kate and Kevin have. Now, Olivia/Kevin aren't technically dating (yet) but Olivia telling him that they'd never sleep together is just an omen that they will be sleeping together again. I'd love the twist of her never sleeping with him again, though. 

Rebecca's parenting methods is definitely distant in some way. Jack is definitely the better parent when it comes to connecting with his kids, but without Rebecca, I don't think Jack would be nearly as close with his kids. He'd have to balance both connecting with them and disciplining them. We can see in this episode, when he gets advice from Yvette. So maybe Rebecca's too hard on Kate and maybe even Kevin. I definitely see why Kate/Rebecca are estranged. They've been planting those seeds since the pilot. But she definitely has sacrificed a lot to take care of those kids, even making herself the bad guy in many situations while Jack's lucky enough to be the more fun parent. But it was good to see that even Jack had to make his own sets of sacrifices for his kids. 

And once again, poor Kevin. We hear from him that him and his dad built models together, but we don't see it. And clearly, that affected his relationship with his dad. Even despite saying all those things about Jack, I wonder how close they were. Kevin seems the most detached from his parents, even before Jack's death. Rebecca hasn't even had a one-on-one scene with little Kevin yet! I really hope we get one next episode, because now we've gotten Kate/Randall having deep scenes with both parents, while Kevin's barely gotten one scene with Jack. It's still only the sixth episode, but it's still pretty sad. 

[kili]

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Kevin is an exceptional dolt

When he allows himself to use it, his Interpersonal intelligence is very high. It was an interesting parallel in this episode where they explicitly talk about Randal hiding his Logical-Mathematical intelligence, they also show Kevin hiding his intelligence. Kevin acts like a dolt most of the time because he suppresses it, but it came out in spades with how he connected with the widow, his nieces and Kate. William sees it too.

[GodsBeloved]

9 minutes ago, kili said:

When he allows himself to use it, his Interpersonal intelligence is very high. It was an interesting parallel in this episode where they explicitly talk about Randal hiding his Logical-Mathematical intelligence, they also show Kevin hiding his intelligence. Kevin acts like a dolt most of the time because he suppresses it, but it came out in spades with how he connected with the widow, his nieces and Kate. William sees it too.

I won't argue with any of this. Adult Kevin is probably my favorite of the big three.

[Enigma X]

Like most everybody else, I love Randall and his family. Jack, though, is my favorite character. Loved this episode and Jack with little Randall.

I also got second-hand embarrassment from Randall's singing.

[Biggie B]

I really, really enjoyed seeing Kate without Toby. As a matter of fact, I completely forgot about him as a character on this show until I saw the previews for next week. As others have mentioned, it was good to get a little more background on Kate - that she had a job prior to being Kevin's PA, that she isn't really in touch with her mother any more...good stuff. I would assume that regarding her mother, we'll eventually get to see how and why their relationship fell apart.

I don't like Olivia very much either. I get what she was trying to do but what a messed up way to do so! Jeez! And yes, as another poster pointed out, what if someone there had recognized Kevin from his TV show?? When Kevin had the scene in the kitchen with the widow, I completely did not buy it...well, not all of it. I definitely felt Kevin's genuine sadness when he talked about throwing away the models and crying, but the rest of it fell totally flat for me, especially when he and the woman embraced. Kevin's crying didn't seem honest to me - I felt as if he was thinking, "I'd better lay it on a bit for this poor lady, so that she doesn't feel alone in her sadness." Not that Kevin didn't truly feel sad/wistful talking about Jack - he did. But this lady was a total and complete stranger (as was her husband!) - would you cry about your deceased dad to someone you completely didn't know? I was on board up until that moment - when they hugged - it just seemed weird to me, but again, I get the whole point of that entire part of the story.

Circling back to Kate for a minute, I do very much like that she has this job and it seems to be going really well. She's clearly smart and good at what she does, and likes doing it! Which ties in to her brother Randall. I loved that he said, at the end, that he likes his job. Good! As for Kate, the only bummer is that if her new job continues to go so well, she won't soon (or ever) be moving east to reunite with her brothers. I really , really want to see her with Randall, I feel as if that's a missing piece of the puzzle. I don't want the show to be three mini-shows under the umbrella of their parents. Although Kevin's acting situation has nothing to do with Randall, he is for now living with him and even if/when he gets his own place in NYC, he'll be close enough to see Randall whenever they want to get together. Kate's so isolated from both of them now; I don't want the thread that ties them together to unravel completely.

I did feel bad for Jack, giving up his dream of having his own business, but of course he did it for Randall (and yes, add me to the chorus of people singing that  child's praises! He was simply wonderful as young Randall, wow!). It will be interesting to see how the relationship between Jack and Miguel goes. I hope Jack doesn't end up simmering in resentment; that would be depressing.

I very much like William, but he's sort of becoming this magical unicorn - he was a civil rights activist, a poet, a musician who played with some of the most famous musicians in the world, he's amazing with his granddaughters...yes, yes, he was a drug addict, but he sure has been redeemed every which way to Sunday! I don't wish him ill will - he's already got terminal cancer, that's about as bad as it gets - but sheesh, his halo is sort of blinding. I say that lovingly, though; he's a great character and the actor portrays him beautifully.  I do wonder where his cat is, though...

Edited November 2, 2016 by Biggie B

[ZaldamoWilder]

10 hours ago, bybrandy said:

Randall and Jack in the office was the first time somebody chopped onions while I watched this show.    

Kate's conversation with the kid was heartbreaking and her negotiationg for a better job was awesome.

I even liked Kevin during the pickle scene.

Olivia is kind of terrible, but unashamedly so... which makes me kind of love her.

Randall telling everybody about his recital... oh Randal... it is a mid life crisis but it is just a little one so eat your waffle.... no seriously I love Randall and Beth more than words can say.   

At my house this scene kicked off our allergies something fierce.   That was heartstring pulling at its finest.  One of those parenting moments that you question your own behavior in.  I thought oh my God he's super over the line right now, forcing Randall to do what he clearly doesn't want to do to get to him to answer the question.  Greater good and all but it was uncomfortable to watch once that baby started crying.   Both of them nailed that scene.

8 hours ago, izabella said:

I was happy to see Randall smiling with the other kids when he started going to the new school.  Even though he's the only black kid there, it makes sense that Randall would fit in better with kids who also might like wearing ties.  I thought it was great that Jack was capable of seeing things differently, though first Yvette had to point out how his reasoning was flawed.

Kevin and the widow in the kitchen broke my heart.  I'm neutral on Olivia so far, but thought she was awful for crashing that memorial.  That was so incredibly rude, insensitive and just plain wrong.  Worse, she didn't see anything wrong with it and didn't care.

Loved seeing Kate doing her job well, and how she handled both mom and daughter. 

This is what is most disturbing about her romcom memorial-crashing.   It had shades of budding sociopath in it.  Worse still was Kevin realizing he'd been manipulated and being ok with it.....for a job?  He says (about the widow) she's not a character in a play Olivia, she's a person.  Then smashes on top of the coat pile on her bed.   Nice.

6 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I call BS on Beth not understanding what Randall does, since they've known each other for so long, and Beth is a smart, inquisitive person. Also BS that parents who are commodities traders are supposed to be such a rarity at the girls' school that nobody knows what they do. It's a wealthy school district in the NYC suburbs - I bet half the parents are in fincance. If anything, the firefighter mom seemed more out of place. I thought Randall's song would have been hilarious if its purpose had been to show that even people in "boring" jobs don't take themselves too seriously, but if he really thought he had a hidden musical talent, that's delusional and sad.

Did I understand correctly that Jack ended up working for Miguel? Usually when you get promoted and "take people with you", that means they report to you, at least in my experience. If that's the case, that gives another nuance to Rebecca ending up with Miguel.

I loved seeing Kate without Toby (where is all that assertiveness when he's being a pushy asshole?), but apparently it was at the cost of having to see asshole Olivia "teach" Kevin not one but two "lessons". Barf.

 

I don't think she doesn't know what he does, but more like Randall himself, finds it difficult to articulate in a way people can digest easily.   Maybe it's a more-than-one-word-title kind of thing.  My guy has described my occupation to other people in several completely unrelated and inaccurate ways since we've met, which regularly leaves me in conversation with somebody who says something like:  I understand you're a wall street analyst....(Regulatory Compliance, it's not even close) but it's just easier to nod along and be Chandler Bing.  

1 hour ago, kili said:

Everything I know about Commodities I learned from "Trading Places". Randall's job isn't that complicated that Beth wouldn't be able to understand it. Granted, Randall does do a pretty bad job of explaining it most of the time, but his song might have broken it down for most people if they hadn't been cringing from second-hand embarrassment. The weather can effect the profitability of commodities like agriculture. Bad weather means bad crops which means bad profits (although even super good weather can have an impact due to bumper crops flooding the market and driving down prices). You can buy weather based derivatives to cushion the effects of weather. Farmers, theme parks, festivals bet part of their potential profits to ensure they don't experience part of their potential losses if the weather is bad. It smooths out their revenue. That's why the corn farmer is doing in the song. I suspect Randall is an analyst, because he doesn't seem like a broker.

It is a little hard to tell because he butchers it, but I think Randall is attempting to play the same melody as his mother did when they were babies (and Kate plays when they are 8).

The expression on Kate's face when her mother says that if she ate ice cream every day, Jack wouldn't be able to pick her up.  Rebecca wasn't thinking of Kate, but you could see little Kate thinking that her Dad wouldn't be able to pick her up one day. Rebecca was also not thinking when she said that ugly brown thing was the only thing "that was clean and that fit". She should have just left it at it being the only "clean" thing.

We never did see Jack help Kevin with that model. Kevin built it all by himself. Despite Kevin having to develop a strategy at age 8 to try to get some of his father's time.

Kevin really is Jack though. He has a great ability to connect to people (when he lets his walls down) as demonstrated with the grieving widow. That pickle talk session was exactly what they both needed. Olivia was a jerk, but at least she figured out a way to connect with him instead of just yelling at him like the director.

So Miguel mooned over his employee's wife until that employee died and he married her? Ick. 

When did Randall find time to hire the neighbour lady to teach him to play the piano? He talks to William when everybody else is asleep (that's why they don't start the lessons then) and announces his new teacher at breakfast? Did he run into her during his morning jog? Good call on NOT having William teach him. Randall strikes me as a perfectionist, so having a new family member teach him could potentially have problems.

Kate is very good at her job. I wonder how long it takes Toby to start complaining about all the time she spends working because planning that ball is going to take up even more of her time than she spent on her old job (where he got bitter when she spent an hour trying to find a hotel for Kevin).

 

I was just coming to ask why Randall didn't think it was a good idea.   William's going to die soon? He didn't want it to be his last memory of his bio dad?  He doesn't want to be that close to him after all?  Music was his parents thing and he doesn't want William to intrude? I couldn't figure it out,

1 hour ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Another well done and interesting episode. 

Its apparent that despite him being the adopted one, Randall is the one now closest to his parents and likely was closest to them when younger..  Lives near them.  Randall turned out like his dad and enjoys it in terms of his job.  Despite Jack's dears of the new school making Randall feel more different, this episode seemed to indicate it was a turning point in him becoming closer to his parents. 

I am assuming Kevin threw out his models when Jack died because Jack never really helped him with the models, just seemed to always say he would and then never did.  The models were a reminder once his dad died of lost opportunities  with this dad

It also interesting all the personal one on one interactions, the heart to heart moments, we are seeing with the kids this season is with Jack much more than their mom. 

I am still not sure when Jack died.  We can speculate based on the vague references but nothing more. 

We have seen Kate, Kevin and Rebecca all have mementos of Jack.  Kate has his ashes.  Kevin and Rebecca both have necklaces.  Wonder what randall has?

Mandy Moore is certainly attractive, but she has never struck me on this show as super hot.  I realize part of what Kate state was saying about her was childhood projection and based on her own insecurities, but asking if she is a model when she was sick with the flu?  A bit much. 

The mom of Randall's African American can tone down the attitude a bit.  I understand what she is saying, but both Jack and Rebecca's initial interactions with her over a simple question, this episode and at the pool, were so off putting and negative. 

+

39 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I noticed that when they met at the pool the first thing Yvette did was yell at Rebecca for not asking her advice, and this time the first thing she did was yell at Jack for asking her advice.  Then of course she didn't skip a beat before giving her anI noticed that when they met at the pool the first thing Yvette did was yell at Rebecca for not asking her advice, and this time the first thing she did was yell at Jack for asking her advice.  Then of course she didn't skip a beat before giving her answer in that pedantic, any fool would know, tone of voice.  There are lots of things to consider before  sending your child to a "gifted" school and it's not the right thing for every single child who tests high.  My husband went to one and he was under high pressure and subject to bullying all through school.  Every year we get begging calls for contributions and  this year they said tuition was up to $12,500 per year, even allowing for deflation, it's not money you just "figure out," as Rebecca put it.  That's real money not a riddle.

See I wasn't gone say nothin lol.   Ya'll know I'm already in my feelings about Yvette's tone problem.   She is to me what Toby is to most of you.   The thing was I didn't even object to her message, but whoever's idea that delivery is?  No, no and furthermore, hell no. 

15 minutes ago, GodsBeloved said:

Yep yep. 

I love the complicated simplicity of this show. 

I felt Kate when I saw those stairs. I workout with a group of ladies and our coach has had us running the bleacher stairs plus something just like what Kate had to climb. He calls it the human stair master and like Kate I call on Jesus when facing that monster.

Jack really is awesome and he and lil Randall were my favorite part this episode.

And did I feel Kate when she saw that S on Becca's shirt then checked out the XL on her sweater. 

I groaned when Kevin slept with Olivia but thanks Olivia for saying it won't happen again. I want Kevin to have a Beth/Rebecca in his like not an Olivia.

So I get what we were supposed to get here but I thought even the fictional comparison was unfair if Kate never realizes that she's looking at a tag in children's sizes compared to a tag in adult sizes.   A girl's 8-10 XL and and adult S, not that far apart.

[DrSpaceman73]

It does annoy me on TV shows when finances come up about say a private school, its always, "we'll figure it out".  What does that mean?  You are magically going to find thousands of extra dollars in your budget?  I know here it meant Jack took a promotion, but it didn't seem to be that big of a promotion to pay for private school

My daughter goes to private school high school, its expensive, basically as much as college per year. I am sure it was then too.  We can afford it, but I think I make more money than Jack/Rebecca would and we didn't have triplets to raise. 

[ZaldamoWilder]

30 minutes ago, GodsBeloved said:

I will have to watch it again but my intitial impression was Yvette had a so you asking me because I'm black attitude. I thought yes he is and isn't that's what he's suppose to do the same way Rebecca was suppose to introduce herself to you and the other black mothers at the pool.

Right.  Like, which is it?   

[ChromaKelly]

23 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

I very much like William, but he's sort of becoming this magical unicorn - he was a civil rights activist, a poet, a musician who played with some of the most famous musicians in the world, he's amazing with his granddaughters...yes, yes, he was a drug addict, but he sure has been redeemed every which way to Sunday! I don't wish him ill will - he's already got terminal cancer, that's about as bad as it gets - but sheesh, his halo is sort of blinding. I say that lovingly, though; he's a great character and the actor portrays him beautifully.  I do wonder where his cat is, though...

Yes to all of that. How did William play with top musicians? Give me a break! I'm really starting to eyeroll about William.

[kili]

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I was just coming to ask why Randall didn't think it was a good idea.   William's going to die soon? He didn't want it to be his last memory of his bio dad?  He doesn't want to be that close to him after all?  Music was his parents thing and he doesn't want William to intrude? I couldn't figure it out,

Learning how to play an instrument can be a frustrating experience. We haven't heard that one of William's many careers consisted of being a music teacher and we can guess that Rebecca tried to teach the kids how to play (and Randall failed at it - why would she teach Kate and not the other two?). Having an unrelated professional teach him to play will likely lead to less drama. Less "well, I'd know how to play if you hadn't dumped me at a fire station" and more "that isn't working for you, let's try this different technique."

I'd be stunned if that chi-chi school they sent Randall too didn't have a music program as well. I don't know of a kid who went to a private school with ties and suit jackets that didn't have to take at least a year of music (with real instruments, not plastic recorders). So, Randall likely failed to learn how to play twice (maybe he played the sax in his school band). Given his attempts to sing/play at careers day, I would call it an epic fail.

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How did William play with top musicians?

Maybe that's where he got addicted to drugs. He was pretty with it when he started out on the bus. Experimenting with friends after a gig might be how he started, but he couldn't handle it.

Edited November 2, 2016 by kili

[Enigma X]

Yeah. I am thinking that the writing for Yvette is very inconsistent and a tad stereotypical. I got what she meant in The Pool episode but wished that would have been achieved in a different manner. In this episode, I was thinking Jack is sort doing what you wanted Rebecca to do, yet that is wrong to you too.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I really love this show.

I don't think of myself as a "sappy" person, but you know what, maybe I am and I just don't want to face it.  I just don't normally WATCH shows like this.  My bread and butter is things like "Curb Your Enthusiasm" where you can bet dollars to donuts you'll never cry.  (I'm using a lot of cliches I've NEVER used before; could be using them wrong.)  My mother never cries and my father always cries, so I think I am in the middle.  Once in awhile, I cry.  I think I'm hormonal and PMSing but I will say that I cried three times this episode.  I don't remember exactly each time but here's when I felt the most.  

1.  Sterling K. Brown as Randall.  Randall waiting in the wings for his presentation.  I could barely stand it.  The excited look on his face.  I could barely watch him he made me feel so much.  Then Randall's excited look to his father when William offered to teach him piano.  JUST STOP IT.

2.  Milo as Jack, with baby Randall.  (The actor playing Baby Randall, is he fucking brilliant or am I just a hormonal puddle who adores kids?! I hope they're both true.)  Milo was great.  Bravo.  There's the scene at the office then there's the STUPID SCENE WITH THE TIE I CANNOT BEAR IT OH GAWD.

I honestly think I hate 'corny' stuff but I don't find this show that way at all.  I wonder what ultra cynical people think of this show, because I sort of thought I was one.  I don't know. I guess I'm not.  I really love this show a lot.  I'm really happy for Milo because I only saw him on Gilmore Girls and loved him, but I never followed his other shows.  I'm really proud of him.  I feel like we've watched him grown up, which is not at all true for me since I got into Gilmore Girls like 2 years ago.  

I'm really impressed with the writing, and Sterling, Milo, and the kid who plays Baby Randall really knock me out - I'm a huge fan of acting and I pay a lot of attention to it.  Bad actors make me sick and almost angry.  We thought Jack and Kate were the close pairing but Jack's storyline with Randall is fucking amazing.  It's just so smart.  I'm inspired by the writing.

I really hate Olivia but meh, I think we're supposed to, I don't know.  It's okay to have unlikeable characters.  Toby makes me angry because I think I'm confused about what the writers think or want me to think.  With Olivia I think it's kind of cut and dry.  She's a harsh person who is supposed to make Kevin see another side of himself.... I guess?  To shock him awake?  To make him realize better acting?  I don't know.  However, in my 'real' life all of the bad people in my life only hurt me and did not help me.  

Every storyline on this show is interesting and makes me think.  It's a deep show - I love how @Amethyst said "It's not black and white".  It's hard to say what's right and it's hard to say what's wrong.  It is never spelled out for you. (This is like what Grey's Anatomy spelled out it was supposed to be like every single episode - even the show's title spells it out for you - not to knock that show, it is a good show.)   There are shows that I'll watch that I'll feel zero desire to read anyone's thoughts on it or share any of my own.  But this show I love reading all of your posts every week; love it.  

Edited November 2, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[luna1122]

I'm fairly cynical but also cry easily. This show hasn't made me cry yet, tho sweet, precious little Randall, his face crumbling as he admitted he didn't want to seem different from his siblings so they won't hate him...that came close. That little boy kills me.

I do think the show is richly, deeply cheesy and often manipulative, which are things I generally despise, but I also think the quality of the cheese, and the acting, direction and writing, elevate it from Velveeta. I like it. I keep coming back. I feel invested in these people. 

I agree that William is becoming a little too mystical. I too rolled my eyes at him playing with top musicians...tho, did he say FAMOUS, or TOP...what was his descriptor, I can't recall? He might have just played with really fine musicians who are not famous.

I think Kate's description of Rebecca being the most beautiful who ever beautifuled and who still has men fall at her feet at age 66 or whatever is likely more her own vision of her, based on growing up and her own insecurities, than reality, tho I do think Mandy Moore is beautiful.

[J0nas3]

For me, what got me with Yvette was that Jack talked about how white the smart kids school was, and Yvette went immediately to "you want me to say as a black person that it's okay not to send him there!" Maybe he just wanted to talk to you about it, get your perspective, without saying what he was going to do, or have you assume the worst?

Edited November 2, 2016 by J0nas3

[ElectricBoogaloo]

4 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

It's not realistic for her to have been working on her music in the same room as sleeping triplets.  If you have a sleeping infant, never mind three of them, the last thing you do is make noise. 

My aunt was the exact opposite. As soon as her baby fell asleep, she deliberately started making noise because she didn't want the baby to need silence to sleep. She would get out the vacuum, turn on the tv, or generally just make noise in the normal to loud range. By the time the baby was eight months old, my aunt was able to take me to the Hard Rock Cafe (hey, I was 12 so it seemed cool at the time) and my cousin slept in her stroller the entire time with all that music blaring. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

I don't think she doesn't know what he does, but more like Randall himself, finds it difficult to articulate in a way people can digest easily.   Maybe it's a more-than-one-word-title kind of thing.  My guy has described my occupation to other people in several completely unrelated and inaccurate ways since we've met, which regularly leaves me in conversation with somebody who says something like:  I understand you're a wall street analyst....(Regulatory Compliance, it's not even close) but it's just easier to nod along and be Chandler Bing.  

You're a transpondster!

Edited November 2, 2016 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Calamity Jane]

Well, 30+ years ago I was lusting for a minivan to replace my 2-door Celica; we never did buy one, but it was before my second child was born in 1984.  I don't remember SUVs until a bit later - wagons or minivans were the choices in the mid-80s, plus a few hatchbacks.  

[Jx223]

10 hours ago, pennben said:

. Maybe they decided after filming that it would be better if Jack died when the kids were younger than implied by Kate in the last episode?

Maybe that is what happened. But I wish they would kept Jack alive until the kids were in their 20s. I would have liked to see him around longer, and they could have created more storylines for him.

10 hours ago, twoods said:

 

Beth and Randall continue to be the healthiest couple on TV. I am riveted by all their scenes. Next week we finally get to the fractured Kevin and Randall relationship- can't wait for more tears.

 

3 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

 

Its apparent that despite him being the adopted one, Randall is the one now closest to his parents and likely was closest to them when younger..  Lives near them.  Randall turned out like his dad and enjoys it in terms of his job.  Despite Jack's dears of the new school making Randall feel more different, this episode seemed to indicate it was a turning point in him becoming closer to his parents. 

 

Out of all the children, Randall definitely seems to be the happiest and the most balanced. I think this is because of several reasons. I believe that out of all the children he may have (though possibly unknown to him and others) made the best out of the limited time that he had with Jack. He had his issues, but it seems like they didn’t negatively affect his relationship with either parent. He felt loved and felt like he got a nice amount of attention from each parent. It seems like he is closer to the parent that is still living, Rebecca than the other two are. He met the love of his life at a young age, and she has been there supporting and helping him grow as a man. He also has two children that he loves. And he now has William, who is dying but has become another person that is apart of William’s support system.

Kevin  and Kate come across as two people who are still deeply affected by their father’s death (and especially in Kevin’s case) still feel incomplete. Whereas as Randall seems like someone who is very happy with his life in spite of being dealt some rough hands early on. It seems like (at least so far) he is satisfied with the way he was raised, and doesn’t hold grudges towards his parents. I believe he was also devastated by Jack’s death but ultimately feels like Jack did the best that he could as a parent with the time he was given.

Granted we could see Randall show resentment towards Rebecca if he learns about her secret regarding William. But right now he seems at peace with his parents and most of their decisions. His conflicts are mainly just with Kevin and William right now.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Jx223

[Primetimer]

And Al Lowe loves this show as much as a human heart can.

View the full article

[random chance]

2 hours ago, Biggie B said:

I do wonder where his cat is, though...

This murky cat situation reminds me of a scene from the Tom Hanks movie Nothing in Common where they shot a commercial about an old lady who gets a last minute ticket to spend Christmas with the grandkids, and he nixes it because the old lady had a cat. He said everyone who sees that commercial is going to wonder if the old lady just left her cat there to die.

51 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

I agree that William is becoming a little too mystical.

Really, at this point I have to wonder why this guy didn't manage to kick heroin and raise the child himself.

37 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

My aunt was the exact opposite. As soon as her baby fell asleep, she deliberately started making noise because she didn't want the baby to need silence to sleep.

Your aunt did that kid a major big favor.

[joanne3482]

The vehicle looked like a Jeep Woody which was out from 84 - 91, which would fit the show's timeline, and I could see it making sense since they lived in a northern climate that got snow. 

Quote

Maybe that's where he got addicted to drugs. He was pretty with it when he started out on the bus. Experimenting with friends after a gig might be how he started, but he couldn't handle it.

 In my mind that's pretty much what happened. He went one way and the 'top musicians' went another. But I also agree that he is becoming a unicorn. 

[Jodithgrace]

Quote

I very much like William, but he's sort of becoming this magical unicorn - he was a civil rights activist, a poet, a musician who played with some of the most famous musicians in the world, he's amazing with his granddaughters...yes, yes, he was a drug addict, but he sure has been redeemed every which way to Sunday! I don't wish him ill will - he's already got terminal cancer, that's about as bad as it gets - but sheesh, his halo is sort of blinding. I say that lovingly, though; he's a great character and the actor portrays him beautifully. 

I too, rolled my eyes a bit at William, the multi-talented. As soon as I saw him at the piano, I absolutely thought, "of course he plays the piano and sings."  I think the only thing that saves him from being the "magical negro" of the tropes, is that the family he's with is also black. If this were a white family who took in a black homeless man, who turned out to be this mystical person who teaches them all lessons about themselves, our eyes would all be rolling out of our heads.

Don't get me wrong, I love him too, and the actor is excellent. But I think that adding in the musical talent was just a bit much. I mean, if he had been introduced as a musician, that would have been different and quite convincing. He could have been scribbling lyrics in his notebook, but they made him a poet. And then a civil rights activist. This music just came in out of the blue.

[llewis823]

6 hours ago, KateeBar said:

As a last note - didn't miss Toby at all. That is the one part I could do without. I'll take Jami Gertz scenes over Toby scenes any day.

This times 100!!!

[kili]

Quote

Really, at this point I have to wonder why this guy didn't manage to kick heroin and raise the child himself.

He seems to have gone clean shortly after giving up Randall. I think that day he was overwhelmed by the situation and the loss of Randall's mother.  Had he supports, he might just have been able to do that seeing as how he was able to turn his life around. If he'd kept Randall without supports, it would probably have only made it worse. Dealing with the grief, getting off drugs and taking care of a newborn is not an easy road.

Quote

The vehicle looked like a Jeep Woody which was out from 84 - 91, which would fit the show's timeline, and I could see it making sense since they lived in a northern climate that got snow. 

Plus, Jack worked in construction so an SUV might make some sense.  I had friends with Toyota SUVs  (4Runners came out in 1986) - they did a lot of camping.

Did Jack end up at one of those architectural firms where they generate common plans that people around the country buy? If his firm was doing designs for construction work for nearby developments or individual customers, you would think he would get out of the office once and a while to go to a job site. Man, did he ever sound unhappy when he was describing his job in the car.

[ZaldamoWilder]

1 hour ago, luna1122 said:

I'm fairly cynical but also cry easily. This show hasn't made me cry yet, tho sweet, precious little Randall, his face crumbling as he admitted he didn't want to seem different from his siblings so they won't hate him...that came close. That little boy kills me.

I do think the show is richly, deeply cheesy and often manipulative, which are things I generally despise, but I also think the quality of the cheese, and the acting, direction and writing, elevate it from Velveeta. I like it. I keep coming back. I feel invested in these people. 

 

Me too.   Including last night's episode I haven't cried yet (that's not meant to be as proud-smug as it sounds).  I think that I'm supposed to is getting in the way, but I do notice that, generally, with tv and/or film, as soon as I hear the music, my innards pick up a bullhorn and tell my tear ducts "we hear the strings and/or horn sections, hold your fire" - baby Randall and Jack came very very close, but then:  sob music.

p.s. luna I love your dairy analogy lol.  Velveeta shouldn't even be a food on its own but as one of the 4 cheeses in Auntie Patti's mac n' cheese?  Girl.  

50 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

You're a transpondster!

LOL!!  The quiz.   My people.  I didn't know if ya'll would get it if I said transpondster/Chenandler Bong.  

Edited November 2, 2016 by ZaldamoWilder
run-on love

[DrSpaceman73]

That's "Miss" Chenandler Bong. 

 

Or maybe it was Mrs.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DrSpaceman73

[ZaldamoWilder]

lmao!!!

[izabella]

1 hour ago, Calamity Jane said:

Well, 30+ years ago I was lusting for a minivan to replace my 2-door Celica; we never did buy one, but it was before my second child was born in 1984.  I don't remember SUVs until a bit later - wagons or minivans were the choices in the mid-80s, plus a few hatchbacks.  

I have many fond memories in my friend's Ford Bronco in college in the late 80's...so many road trips, so many concerts!  That Bronco was ancient, so probably an early 80's purchase when it was new.  SUV's were around, but they weren't popular with soccer moms and weren't called SUV's like they are now.  The minivan was King in the 80's for families.

Edited November 2, 2016 by izabella

[JenE4]

"If you own a faaaaaaaaaaaarm and need to know the future price of coooooooooorn" is surprisingly catchy. My daughter and I were singing it for the rest of the night. As always, Randall and Beth had me rolling with the song, Beth's "Just look away," Randall's realization that he "missed a montage" when comparing his practice/performance to what happens in the movies, and of course the reveal of his mini-midlife crisis piano lessons.

On the flipside, young Randall just broke my heart. That kid is just too damn adorable--and his little quivering lip that he doesn't want to be different. Oh, man, you're killing me, little Randall! I was most struck how his parents are so focused on him feeling different about being black, but he doesn't even seem to care what the other kids say in school (that only bothers Kevin). Randall just doesn't want to be seen as different from Kate and Kevin by his parents--throwing his grades because of ice cream!

Speaking of which, ooh, that was also rough seeing Kate seeing her mother worried about getting fat from ice cream and Rebecca saying to Kate that she has nothing else that fits, then Kate comparing their clothing sizes. It's sad knowing that we're watching a mother destroy her relationship with her daughter with emotional damage, knowing to this day their relationship is strained because of it.

i'm still not finding myself connecting to Kevin. It was nice seeing more backstory, and I get that his story is supposedly just as emotionally fraught as the other two. This was supposed to be his big episode, but, eh. Ok, Kevin, we get that you didn't get attention because you didn't have any problems, but you were jerky to your brother as a kid, and you are just as self-centered today--crying over pickles didn't change that for me. But, Rebecca is a strong contender to be even worse than Kevin, so you have that going for you in my book.

Edited November 2, 2016 by JenE4

[ClareWalks]

3 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

Speaking of which, ooh, that was also rough seeing Kate seeing her mother worried about getting fat from ice cream and Rebecca saying to Kate that she has nothing else that fits, then Kate comparing their clothing sizes. It's sad knowing that we're watching a mother destroy her relationship with her daughter with emotional damage, knowing to this day their relationship is strained because of it.

I mentioned in the Kate thread how little things we do or say around our kids can make such a difference. How many moms do you know who say things like "I want to lose weight" or "I shouldn't eat that," without even thinking about how it affects our kids? I felt bad for Rebecca because although she was screwing things up, she was doing what a lot of folks do without really realizing it. I like that Rebecca isn't a perfect mom and I hope it shows women watching that our kids pay attention to that kind of stuff and it sends a message that isn't great.

[Jx223]

3 hours ago, GodsBeloved said:

I will have to watch it again but my intitial impression was Yvette had a so you asking me because I'm black attitude. I thought yes he is and isn't that's what he's suppose to do the same way Rebecca was suppose to introduce herself to you and the other black mothers at the pool.

Yvette seems very protective and maybe even a little possessive of Randall. At the pool it seemed like she kind of tried to block Rebecca from getting to Randall when Kate expressed concern about him going missing. She said something along the lines of "he's fine, I got him". And then when Jack came and picked him up at her house, she said something like she loves having him over/would like to keep him longer.

 If Jack dies when the kids are still young I could see her playing a bigger role in his life. I could see young Randall wanting to escape and run off to her house more while Rebecca is struggling to hold things together as a widow of three young children. I wonder if Yvette is married. And if so maybe Randall might develop some sort of bond with her husband and continue to bond more with her, while he’s grieving.

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Cardie said:

My impression was that when he signed on to work with Miguel, that dream died. It's part of the poignancy of Jack's early death.

 

Especially with the episode where he was at the bar drinking, it was after this move, it would appear from the kids ages and him wearing a tie.

11 hours ago, izabella said:

I was happy to see Randall smiling with the other kids when he started going to the new school.  Even though he's the only black kid there, it makes sense that Randall would fit in better with kids who also might like wearing ties.  I thought it was great that Jack was capable of seeing things differently, though first Yvette had to point out how his reasoning was flawed.

Kevin and the widow in the kitchen broke my heart.  I'm neutral on Olivia so far, but thought she was awful for crashing that memorial.  That was so incredibly rude, insensitive and just plain wrong.  Worse, she didn't see anything wrong with it and didn't care.

Loved seeing Kate doing her job well, and how she handled both mom and daughter. 

I hate this character.  She's awful.

I don't mind Toby usually, but it was nice to see Kate getting a storyline that didn't involve him.  Also, her scene with Rebecca and the shower was so sad - a sweet scene but ended so sadly.  Then combine that with her statement that she and her mom don't talk much because of all of it just made me sad. :(

[ChromaKelly]

More thoughts:

I'm with you all who weren't digging Yvette this episode. Jack was doing what he should be, consulting a black parent for advice in the situation and she was all "you just want my black seal of approval". Maybe she's supposed to have a sarcastic/dry streak and it wasn't coming across? IDK. As I mentioned, I'm also a white adoptive parent of a black son and I would have felt quite blindsided by that, even though she kind of recovered at the end of the exchange. However, the fact that Randall will see even fewer black students at the private school is a true consideration. I know this is just a TV show and they don't have episodes to devote to this, but there are other options to consider besides this one private school and public school. I was also surprised that the public school counselor would advise them to put him in private school. Is there no GT program in public school?

I did not realize till reading this thread that Kevin and Olivia were having sex at the widow's house. WTF? Who does that?

 

[voiceover]

3 hours ago, Biggie B said:

...would you cry about your deceased dad to someone you completely didn't know? 

Why not?  Confiding deeply personal things to a total stranger (like the guy sitting next to you on a 5-hour flight) may not be for everyone, but it is an easy and pretty much guilt-free form of therapy (that's part of the definition of therapy, in fact).  You get to blahblahblahhh about your issues, from your perspective, to someone who doesn't know your history, and who may even look interested and not interrupt! Can't guarantee that reax from a sibling, a best friend, a co-worker.

[Tiger]

I dont have a problem with what Yvette said, but with how she said it or rather how Bathe played the scene.  If Yvette is now a family friend to the extent Randall is going to her house and Jack is picking his kid up from her house, she should not still be doling out solicited advice with such attitude.  

Jack raised a genuine and heartfelt concern with someone he apparantly considered a friend, yet Yvette acted like he just walked up to some random black woman's home and asked some superfulous question.  

As I said before, I liked Bathe on Boston Legal years ago, so Im hopeful she can bring some of that same likeability to this role.  

Regardless, I want a scene with Bathe in age make-up in a present day scene opposite Brown.  

Edited November 2, 2016 by Tiger

[monakane]

Yeah. I am thinking that the writing for Yvette is very inconsistent and a tad stereotypical. I got what she meant in The Pool episode but wished that would have been achieved in a different manner. In this episode, I was thinking Jack is sort doing what you wanted Rebecca to do, yet that is wrong to you too.

I don't know why she didn't invite him into her bedroom to discuss it. That was a missed opportunity.

[Arcadiasw]

4 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I noticed that when they met at the pool the first thing Yvette did was yell at Rebecca for not asking her advice, and this time the first thing she did was yell at Jack for asking her advice.  Then of course she didn't skip a beat before giving her answer in that pedantic, any fool would know, tone of voice.  There are lots of things to consider before  sending your child to a "gifted" school and it's not the right thing for every single child who tests high. 

 

3 hours ago, GodsBeloved said:

I will have to watch it again but my intitial impression was Yvette had a so you asking me because I'm black attitude. I thought yes he is and isn't that's what he's suppose to do the same way Rebecca was suppose to introduce herself to you and the other black mothers at the pool.

I thought Yvette's second appearance would be better than her first but I'm starting to roll my eyes at Yvette. She's becoming one of those people.

[ClareWalks]

12 minutes ago, Tiger said:

 

I dont have a problem with what Yvette said, but with how she said it or rather how Bathe played the scene.  If Yvette is now a family friend to the extent Randall is going to her house and Jack is picking his kid up from her house, she should not still be doling out solicited advice with such attitude.  

Jack raised a genuine and heartfelt concern with someone he apparantly considered a friend, yet Yvette acted like he just walked up to some random black woman's home and asked some superfulous question.  

 

Between that exchange and her defensiveness toward Rebecca at the pool, I'm starting to think "continually, casually accusing white people/friends of racism" is her defining character trait. I hope we see a scene that proves me wrong. I agree that it was smart of Jack to at least have a concern about such a white-washed school environment for Randall, who wants to fit in. But ultimately it was wise to go with "fit in with other gifted kids" over "fit in with other black kids," if that is the choice to make (especially since his other school was very white, too).

[kili]

Quote

My impression was that when he signed on to work with Miguel, that dream died. It's part of the poignancy of Jack's early death.

Quote

Especially with the episode where he was at the bar drinking, it was after this move, it would appear from the kids ages and him wearing a tie.

The drinking scenes were before Jack accepted Miguel's job offer to fpllow his promotion (and give up his dreams). That was the episode where Randall is shown getting off the school bus and being teased by Kevin's friends. The reason that Jack took the promotion was so that Randall could go to his special school, so he would no longer be getting off the school bus with them by the time the promotion was accepted.

Also, during "The Pool" Jack mentions that he has stopped drinking (although he could have had relapses, but it seemed in context of the drinking discussion in the previous episode) and they did not meet Yvette until The Pool. In this episode, Yvette is a family friend. So, some time has passed since the scenes of Miguel and Jack in the bar.

[PRgal]

4 minutes ago, ClareWalks said:

Between that exchange and her defensiveness toward Rebecca at the pool, I'm starting to think "continually, casually accusing white people/friends of racism" is her defining character trait. I hope we see a scene that proves me wrong. I agree that it was smart of Jack to at least have a concern about such a white-washed school environment for Randall, who wants to fit in. But ultimately it was wise to go with "fit in with other gifted kids" over "fit in with other black kids," if that is the choice to make (especially since his other school was very white, too).

I think the 80s was when (white) people started being overly sensitive - which often makes minorities feel uncomfortable (e.g. Yvette).  I mean, ASSUMING makes you-know-what, right?  It's like the whole "you went to a prep school?  How did you like THAT?" question I often get from non-private school white people.  :S At least that's the vibe I get.  Ummmmm, many such schools are 25%ish Asian - especially in the upper grades when there are international kids.

The Pearsons definitely made the right decision sending Randall to another school.  I wonder how Kate and Kevin felt, though.  And Kate, especially.  She's the only girl, the "fat one," and I doesn't seem to stand out at anything compared to the two boys (okay, Kevin's a bad actor, but still, he was on a hit sitcom).

Edited November 2, 2016 by PRgal

[SlackerInc]

I like Olivia, and don't really see a problem with the memorial-crashing.  It's not like they made anyone feel bad.

I am so fed up though with this trope that for gifted kids to succeed in life, they need to go to private school.  (Despite loving the show in general, this bugged the crap out of me about the premise of Gilmore Girls.) I honestly believe that gifted kids (like mine, who go to public school) will do great wherever they go, and their good grades and high test scores will get them into elite postsecondary programs.  In that sense, I see the whole private school thing as something close to a scam.  Look at all the high profile graduates of our school!  Well, sure, because all the elite parents are scared not to go this route, and they don't realize their kids would have done great anyway.