Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[floridamom]

I don't think that Anna would talk much with any of her sisters about this, but I do wonder what about her own MOTHER? I would think that her mother would stick close to her and support her own daughter and at least hear her out and talk with her about this horrible mess. I, also, if I were Mrs. Keller, would cross examine my husband, who is a human being and NOT INFALLABLE. What did he exactly know about this prior to the marriage? If Anna's mother is not there for her, I don't have much respect for her either.This woman seems to be a nice, meek, shy person, but I think she also is a doormat like the rest of them.

Anna needs a good friends OUTSIDE of this belief system.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

They certainly WANTED to be. And I'm sure Josh thought his sins would never find him out. That's a classic DC mistake.

 

Well I am just not sure how DC enters into it unless you equate DC with politicians and they are everywhere! 

[Apple Clark]

Yes, I don't think it ever crossed Anna's mind to leave Josh. Even if she did, I don't think there would be a divorce. I wish I could give her a little more credit, but I really don't believe she's imagined the possibility of danger to her own kids either. I think she's basically been hoodwinked all the way through this saga. Before the courting started she was given a very sanitized version of the story and being the trusting, obedient and indoctrinated soul she is, she believes it all to this day.

 I wholeheartedly agree with this, but it makes me sad. Josh did a horrible, horrible thing, but his parents not only kept it hidden from the public but also his soon-to-be wife. That makes it 10x worse. If they had cancelled the show when it happened, gotten ALL the victims therapists, and written a formal apology to the victims and their parents (if there were outside victims. I swear I'm not trying to speculate about them), it might be more forgivable. 

[Wellfleet]

They certainly WANTED to be. And I'm sure Josh thought his sins would never find him out. That's a classic DC mistake.

 

Agree with Foghorn. This is not unique to DC. Could have happened - does happen - everywhere and anywhere people want to step into positions of power - at all levels. Nothing new under the sun...

Edited June 5, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Darknight]

Does this make Josh impure? And how will Joshie support his family of 6. No way tlc is going to let him come back on. If JimChelle shunned him for the sake of the show and he can't show is face at Republican events anymore. So it's back to the car lot? Going to real school and getting hired. Or write a tell all and go against the family

[Sew Sumi]

Could the "therapist" possibly be Clark Wilson? (sorry if this has been asked before)

While Clark Wilson is ATI, I believe he is based out of Alabama, not Little Rock. 

[Churchhoney]

Agree with Foghorn. This is not unique to DC. Could have happened - does happen - everywhere and anywhere people want to step into positions of power - at all levels. Nothing new under the sun...

 

Exactly. What it really is is Greek Tragedy 101.

 

Some might think of it as a DC story because the more prominent the main character, the bigger and louder the fallout. The more power he/she has over others, the more the fallout affects many people, including the audience at the play. Beyond that, though, it's just the human story. Yet another reason why the Duggar story has had staying power on the front page.

[GEML]

Would the Duggars really have as much staying power if they hadn't gotten involved in politics and pranced around the country saying the other types of lifestyles were harmful to children? If Josh himself just had kept his car lot in AR? It would have been a two week story, tops.

[yogi2014L]

Anna has sisters outside of the cult right? She hopefully can lean on them. I agree Pris doesn't seem like the one to go to. I could def see Josh leaving her, I don't think she would leave him. Josh is not somebody who is used to being shit on much less by the entire world- We already have seen that he cannot control himself whether it be with fondling or food- I forsee him being withdrawn, maybe start drinking ect.

 

This has to be eye opening for Anna- I hope that she takes this, learns from it. And while she might never leave Josh, she might realize that being under-educated and unemployable is not all it shakes up to be when your husband turns out to be a dud. She cares about her kids and will want them to be able to take care of themselves. I don't think Mack will suffer the same fate as Anna. 

 

If anything good can come from this, maybe those poor m'kids will be able to escape the cult and not be destined for a life of being barefoot and pregnant and in poverty. 

[JoanArc]

 

I forsee him being withdrawn, maybe start drinking ect.

The thought of Alcoholic Josh scares me. Especially for Anna and the kids.

[fireice13]

I do wonder if Anna will make sure her kids are more educated and able to stand on their own if need be; especially her daughters. She might think that she couldn't go anywhere, but she'll make sure her own daughters don't end up in that situation. I can only hope she thinks that because sometimes in these cases, instead of opening someone's mind they just close it further.

[NextIteration]

Is the expected babe a girl?

[Readalot]

Is the expected babe a girl?

yes, a second daughter.

[graefin]

I do wonder if Anna will make sure her kids are more educated and able to stand on their own if need be; especially her daughters. She might think that she couldn't go anywhere, but she'll make sure her own daughters don't end up in that situation. I can only hope she thinks that because sometimes in these cases, instead of opening someone's mind they just close it further.

I think it's interesting that many people seem to think that Anna is having some kind of crisis of faith or wants to leave but can't or will do things differently for her daughters. What indication do we have that she and Josh are not reacting to all this attention the same way his parents are--convinced of the fact that the "liberal media" or "people with an agenda" have launched an "unprecedented attack" on their family, that what Josh did might have been wrong, but the publicizing of what he did is *more wrong*? I would guess they would just further insulate themselves and dig themselves deeper into their delusional, disturbing ideology.

[GEML]

She's also the closest one to know how dark of a place his mind is. Sure, there are plenty of wives who never know. But I think she went into the marriage knowing, and that means she's watching. Doesn't mean he's never done anything, but if he hasn't, she may feel really angry that people don't believe them. This would be the first time she's dealt with a world that doesn't automatically believe her (unlike Josh and the older Duggars, who had dealt with this previously.)

[Churchhoney]

Would the Duggars really have as much staying power if they hadn't gotten involved in politics and pranced around the country saying the other types of lifestyles were harmful to children? If Josh himself just had kept his car lot in AR? It would have been a two week story, tops.

 

Well, actually, I meant that the combination of the fact that this is a quintessential human story plus being a political story -- which has fallout for other people -- is why it's been in the headlines. It's got staying power because it's got so many facets, those being the top two.

[Missy Vixen]

Does this make Josh impure? And how will Joshie support his family of 6. No way tlc is going to let him come back on. If JimChelle shunned him for the sake of the show and he can't show is face at Republican events anymore. So it's back to the car lot? Going to real school and getting hired. Or write a tell all and go against the family

I know this sounds insane, but Smuggar will have gainful employment very soon, if he doesn't already have another offer.

 

Look at the sheer numbers of others within that party that have committed some pretty heinous acts and are still getting jobs, consulting things, whatever. They're going to use him as a symbol of a "good man who made a mistake and was Taken Down by the Liberal Media." Much fundraising will follow.

 

IMHO, of course.

[Kiss my mutt]

He could get a job with Gothard.

[Ms Lark]

He could get a job with Gothard.

Or Hobby Lobby.

[CofCinci]

I wonder what the paparazzi bounty on pictures/video of Josh is right now?

[floridamom]

Um, if I were Anna, I would be publicly humiliated. How could she have gone on their TV show more than once pontificating the joys and benefits of "Josh and I having kept pure" for the on God had for us spiel? Clearly if she knew that "hers" wasn't the first one that he had touched or seen, she would have knowingly and publicly been lying with statements like that. Anna, honey, your ecstatic honeymoon night experience was a fraudulent and counterfeit one. Sorry to tell you so.

[Fallacy]

I don't know what to say about Anna other than that I feel bad for her. The woman is pregnant and dealing with three small children, which is more than enough for most to deal with, and now she has to deal with the wreckage and devastation caused by Josh, the man she clearly loves. The whole situation is terrible for her and her children.

[mbutterfly]

I've been thinking about how Josh's physical appearance has aged recently. He's gone soft and doughy. Remember his reaction when Anna surprised him with the pee stick. I don't think that was rehearsed. Josh knew this was coming and he was sick with fear.

[Lukeysboat]

I've been thinking about how Josh's physical appearance has aged recently. He's gone soft and doughy. Remember his reaction when Anna surprised him with the pee stick. I don't think that was rehearsed. Josh knew this was coming and he was sick with fear.

I have wondered that same thing.

Because I just can't keep track ... When is Anna due with M4? It has to be very soon, right? I wonder how the birth will be handled in the media. It makes me a little sick to think about it, honestly.

[CofCinci]

I've been thinking about how Josh's physical appearance has aged recently. He's gone soft and doughy. Remember his reaction when Anna surprised him with the pee stick. I don't think that was rehearsed. Josh knew this was coming and he was sick with fear.

Weren't all his kids in bed with him in that scene?  Yuck.

[Seashell Lover]

Anna is due very soon early June and I feel sorry for her going through this shit and soon to deliver a new baby. I hope her labor and delivery goes smooth.

[JoanArc]

 

Meanwhile, in Ohio, at the Alive Christian music festival, the fanblog says that "Josh and Anna Duggar and family; Jill and Derick Dillard and family; and Jessa and Ben Seewald" will attend and have a Q&A session.

I emailed Alive when the scandal broke, but never got a reply. I'm be kind of surprised if the girls still go. They didn't deserve to be dropped, and will need the money, but I can't imagine going on stage, even with a friendly audience.

[Seashell Lover]

If I had the money I would go see Boob and Clown Car in Denver as I have some questions I want answered. Not that I would get a truthful answer but just to see their reactions when I asked them questions.

[CarolMK]

I thought that Anna was due sometime in early July. I'm actually wondering where she'll have the baby...are they still in DC til the end of July or have they moved and we just don't know of their whereabouts at the moment? Somewhere, I read that they were renting their house until the end of July.  TLC will probably not be filming the birth, but who knows what TLC is thinking now.

[Ljohnson1987]

I feel bad for Anna in some ways, but in others, I feel like she's so stupid for knowing about this, before she married Smuggar, and just writing it off as nothing.

[JessDVD]

Anna is due July 10. I know that off the top of my head because I'm due 3 days later so the date stuck in my head. :-)

[AmyFarrahFowler]

I thought that Anna was due sometime in early July. I'm actually wondering where she'll have the baby...are they still in DC til the end of July or have they moved and we just don't know of their whereabouts at the moment? Somewhere, I read that they were renting their house until the end of July.  TLC will probably not be filming the birth, but who knows what TLC is thinking now.

 

Wasn't Anna newly postpartum when they moved to DC? Sad that she has to do it again, unless he makes her leave prior to her delivery. That shit right there sounds exhausting and now she has to do it again.

[Fuzzysox]

He could get a job with Gothard.

Oh he can come live in Chicago and live next to TFDW!!!! Woohooo

[HumblePi]

I feel bad for Anna in some ways, but in others, I feel like she's so stupid for knowing about this, before she married Smuggar, and just writing it off as nothing.

I just think that Anna, like the rest of the 'children of the corn', was sheltered as much as the Duggar's growing up. But this is what happens when you shelter children to such an extreme. Maybe if Josh was allowed to go to a regular school (not home school) and interact with girls his own age, he might have been more respectful towards them. Even if he was allowed to mingle with other Christian teens his own at a youth group and allowed to have a girlfriend, I doubt that this whole thing would have ever happened with his sisters. He went through puberty without any privacy to masturbate because he shared a bedroom with his nine brothers. Maybe Michelle and Jim Bob wanted their children to retain the 'faith of a child' because that turns off critical thinking.

 

I think Anna was raised much in the same way as Josh. Anna has a sweet personality but there's a childlike quality to her. She and the other girls never matured emotionally, not even a little bit. I feel very sympathetic towards Anna, she just had no chance to grow into a mature woman, she was only groomed to be a breeder.

Edited June 6, 2015 by HumblePi

[anewpradabag]

As a mother you protect your child at all costs this is a biological program, unless you are inherentry flawed. ANNA HAS NO EXCUSE!!!!!!

Edited June 7, 2015 by anewpradabag

[Darknight]

Gothard doesn't even pay well

[parisprincess]

I can't help but wonder if Josh is going to feel at all uncomfortable around Ben and Derrick the next time the tribe gets together for one of their big pregnancy announcements, gender reveals or births.  After all, he got to feel their wives up while the husbands couldn't even hold hands before becoming engaged.   

[Marigny]

I feel bad for Anna in some ways, but in others, I feel like she's so stupid for knowing about this, before she married Smuggar, and just writing it off as nothing happened.

Honestly, though, did she have any real alternatives? Their culture is set but in a way that gives these kids the illusion that they have choices but do they, really? 

[NikSac]

I have wondered that same thing.

Because I just can't keep track ... When is Anna due with M4? It has to be very soon, right? I wonder how the birth will be handled in the media. It makes me a little sick to think about it, honestly.

 

Bolding by me - hopefully not at all, but it'll be interesting to see.

[GeeGolly]

I think Anna was raised much in the same way as Josh. Anna has a sweet personality but there's a childlike quality to her. She and the other girls never matured emotionally, not even a little bit. I feel very sympathetic towards Anna, she just had no chance to grow into a mature woman, she was only groomed to be a breeder.

I think they have all matured quickly in these past few weeks.

[Aja]

"The librul media is persecuting my family on accounts of our Christian values" is a hell of a lot easier to cling to than "the entire foundation of my life and everything I thought I knew is sick and wrong." I'm sure Anna, like everyone else in the camp, is feeling heartbroken for her wonderful husband, a position that gets reinforced heavily by everyone around her. 

 

Just based on personal experience--I'm not a genius, but I'm smarter than Anna, and I wasn't raised in a cult, unless you count the Air Force as a cult. I was married for 20 years  and when I got divorced it was an unexpected identity crisis so intense that there were a few times I doubted I'd survive it. And that's ME, a (relatively speaking) normally-raised, extremely impure-before-marriage, not-trying-to-be-mean-but-genuinely-more-intelligent-than-Anna-Duggar, totally aware of the outside world and alternative lifestyles and philosophies and yadda yadda yadda. Oh, and I never had children. So it is completely impossible for me to wrap my head around that situation. I'm thinking "librul media" is the only way to go for Anna.

Edited June 7, 2015 by Aja

[Oldernowiser]

Exactly. Not to mention that JimBob and everyone else inside Camp Duggar is going to double down on "us versus the world." It's the oldest political science strategy there is: create loyalty within by exaggerating the enemy without.

That strategy will work for a while...until the reality of scarcity starts to set in. Then even JimBob and his almighty threats of eternal damnation may not be able to keep the group from fragmenting.

[elainebenis]

Exactly. Not to mention that JimBob and everyone else inside Camp Duggar is going to double down on "us versus the world." It's the oldest political science strategy there is: create loyalty within by exaggerating the enemy without.

That strategy will work for a while...until the reality of scarcity starts to set in. Then even JimBob and his almighty threats of eternal damnation may not be able to keep the group from fragmenting.

 

I expect the family to fragment, maybe not next week but eventually.

 

I think money (or lack thereof, to be precise) will be their primary downfall. Educated speculation says that TLC paid the family one check that went into the Duggar Trust to be divvied up and doled out by JB. (Those engaged/married get their own TLC contracts/checks). What's a mystery is how JB doles out the pot o' TLC cash. Equally between all family members? Based on screen time? Based on fan popularity and ratings? According to need? Allowances? Do Duggar males earn more than females? Have JB + M been sucking off 'management' fees a la Kris Jenner? So, so, SO many ways to feel resentful and shortchanged in hindsight, once, as you say, scarcity sets in.

Edited June 7, 2015 by elainebenis

[Sew Sumi]

Anna is due very soon early June and I feel sorry for her going through this shit and soon to deliver a new baby. I hope her labor and delivery goes smooth.

She's actually not due until early July. I don't think they ever confirmed her exact due date, but I want to say it's somewhere between the 3rd and 10th. I don't think they're going anywhere until M4 is safely delivered, much like what happened with the move to DC right after Marcus' birth. 

[zenme]

I'm imagining Anna is with family, and I'm guessing it's with the Duggars.  She is very vulnerable right now, and my guess is that she doesn't want to be alone, especially if she's in the  cocoon of Duggar denial and minimization. 

[GEML]

I think Josh and Anna are in DC. There were pictures of the flying into National, but I don't think there are pictures of them leaving, and I think there would be. They could be in the RV, but I don't see what being in AR does for them right now. Despite the wagon circling, I think there is a lot of anger towards Josh for having brought this upon the family in the first place. I don't see golden boy - I see a someone who was denied who he was at every turn, even when he did something really disturbing.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

I can't help but wonder if Josh is going to feel at all uncomfortable around Ben and Derrick the next time the tribe gets together for one of their big pregnancy announcements, gender reveals or births. 

I kind of hope there's always a possibility in the back of Josh's mind that one day, one of these guys isn't going to be able to contain his anger and might haul off and slug Josh. I'm not advocating physical violence - although I admit I'd find it understandable if the husbands wanted to punch Josh - but I hope that fear is in the back of Josh's head, just as his sisters had to live in fear that at any point he might sneak into their bedrooms & sexually assault them.

I hope Ben doubles down on his working out and bulks up....just to intimidate Josh.

Since Josh is the oldest, he knows where all of the family's skeletons are buried.

I am starting to think part of the reason they are SO focused on how Josh has changed, Josh confessed, Josh was so sorry, etc. is because JimBob & Michelle are scared that he might just start spilling any other family secrets.

[GreyBunny]

I don't feel sorry for Anna.  Even if she didn't know the full extent of what Josh did when she married him, it's out there now and if she chooses to stay, she's now part of the creepshow.

[Happyfatchick]

I really hope J&A are with family somewhere safe from media, but only because of Anna and the kids. I wouldn't care, really, if Josh was trailed until he's wearing diapers in a nursing home, but I hope the media is respectful of the children. They are so so screwed. Maybe THEY should consider mission work in some remote location. It's going to be a tough life for awhile. I still say, eventually, there will be a "redemption tour" and he will support his family by sharing his testimony in churches all over the nation. It'll be 3-4 years before he can do that, until the scabs heal. But it'll happen.

[Loves2Dance]

I really hope J&A are with family somewhere safe from media, but only because of Anna and the kids. I wouldn't care, really, if Josh was trailed until he's wearing diapers in a nursing home, but I hope the media is respectful of the children. They are so so screwed. Maybe THEY should consider mission work in some remote location. It's going to be a tough life for awhile. I still say, eventually, there will be a "redemption tour" and he will support his family by sharing his testimony in churches all over the nation. It'll be 3-4 years before he can do that, until the scabs heal. But it'll happen.

Given that the media won't leave celebrity children alone when they're simply going to the doctor or having a temper tantrum, I'd say Anna and her kids don't stand a chance. The second they come out of hiding, they're doomed. The only good thing is, they don't live in DC anymore or a place like Hollywood so most of the vile people will disappear quicker.