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Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
in Arrow

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Genki

Genki

 

I've been genuinely trying to figure out why intelligent people (like the vast majority of posters here) are continuing to watch this season, and this helps.  I don't really give a crap about SA.  I mean, he's a hot guy and a good actor, but I don't know him.  I know Oliver.  I've spent, with flashbacks, nearly six years getting to know and care about Oliver.  So seeing this man who has been through so much, and who has come out of all that hell trying to do good, get so completely shit on, completely horrifies me.

 

Because the elements that make the show great and the potential to be great again are still there. If they permanently damage the show, which they haven't yet, IMO, then I would drop it. This year did try my patience greatly, like many others'.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about EvilOliver. It does not seem that interesting to me. I can't see Oliver going full evil even with the Mind Control drugs, so the brain washing will not last, IMO. I think evil Oliver could be interesting if he let loose on that tight superhuman control that Oliver normally has, but I don't think they will go there with that storyline. So I worry about Diggle/Oliver hope they pull something that, if not quite saves this season at least redeems it a little.

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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

Challenge accepted.

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NumberCruncher

NumberCruncher

Because the elements that make the show great and the potential to be great again are still there. If they permanently damage the show, which they haven't yet, IMO, then I would drop it. This year did try my patience greatly, like many others'.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about EvilOliver. It does not seem that interesting to me. I can't see Oliver going full evil even with the Mind Control drugs, so the brain washing will not last, IMO. I think evil Oliver could be interesting if he let loose on that tight superhuman control that Oliver normally has, but I don't think they will go there with that storyline. So I worry about Diggle/Oliver hope they pull something that, if not quite saves this season at least redeems it a little.

This...especially the bolded. I've been MAJORLY frustrated with this season and can't wait for it to finally be done because I'm tired of seeing all the characters I love get treated the way they've been treated but I can't quit the show because I badly want things to get back on the right track. The H.I.V.E. storyline and mystery of Felicity's dad is intriguing to me and so I'm willing to give Guggenheim one more chance if it means I might finally get a Diggle-centric and a Felicity-centric storyline outside of just being support staff to the masked characters, or in Felicity's case, the arm candy of the male superhero flavor-of-the-month.

I think it's too late to save S3 so I just want this LoA/Al Sah-him/Malcolm arc done without too much collateral damage. I worry about how badly the EPs will screw up Oliver and Diggle's friendship in the process. I've learned to expect the absolute worst with these producers/writers so as to not be get my hopes up.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

I've been genuinely trying to figure out why intelligent people (like the vast majority of posters here) are continuing to watch this season, and this helps.  I don't really give a crap about SA.  I mean, he's a hot guy and a good actor, but I don't know him.  I know Oliver.  I've spent, with flashbacks, nearly six years getting to know and care about Oliver.  So seeing this man who has been through so much, and who has come out of all that hell trying to do good, get so completely shit on, completely horrifies me.  

 

I'm still watching this season because I still love the characters (Oliver, Diggle, Felicity). As much as they get shit on, I still am invested in these people and am invested in knowing where they end up. I don't think that the show butchered the characters (not yet and I hope not ever) and as long as they're the characters I know and love, I don't think I can ever really quit the show. 

 

This is the only thing that the writers have going for them. The core 3. And I think that's why a vast majority of the people are even still watching the show. That being said, I don't trust the show one bit. BUT, I'll suffer through whatever I can to watch Felicity, Diggle, and Oliver's story. 

 

 

The fucking yellow crayon speech.  So Oliver is actually seriously contemplating hanging with the group of dudes who (1) stabbed the shit out of his sister; (2) tried to murder Felicity; (3) were the cause of everything with Roy; and (4) ruined his life.  This show, man, this fucking show.

 

Oliver is screwed either way. Hang out with assholes, or not hang out with assholes and have the people he loves most be in danger (you saw what Ra's did to Thea). People act like Oliver CHOSE to be a member of the league, but was it even a choice? I don't think it was. It was more of a necessity. 

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Guest

Guest

Thea at dinner with Diggle and Felicity is all I've ever wanted. Yay! The people Oliver loves the most all together.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

 

In the clip, Team Arrow as well as friends and family remember someone who seems gone to them: Oliver Queen. It looks like happier times are being recalled, and the whole gang (including Diggle and Lyla’s baby Sara!) is together to toast the man who brought them together.

 

:*(

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wonderwall

wonderwall

I can't wait for Diggle/Lyla/Felicity/Thea dinner + that Diggle/Felicity hug. That's the kind of interactions and scenes I wanted after Oliver died in 3.09.

Nah they had to force Ray on Felicity that's why we didn't get it. *eye rolls*.

 

At least we're getting it now? :)

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NoWayOut

NoWayOut

There's a three week time jump right? Felicity and Thea have been staying with Diggle and Lyla the entire time. Felicity wasn't all alone in her apartment and Thea wasn't stuck with Malcolm for three weeks. Don't try to convince me otherwise.

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TrueMyth

TrueMyth

Thea at dinner with Diggle and Felicity is all I've ever wanted. Yay! The people Oliver loves the most all together.

Yes!

 

Wait... "The people Oliver loves the most all together."  If anyone tries to blow up this gathering, I will cut them. 

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wonderwall

wonderwall

There's a three week time jump right? Felicity and Thea have been staying with Diggle and Lyla the entire time. Felicity wasn't all alone in her apartment and Thea wasn't stuck with Malcolm for three weeks. Don't try to convince me otherwise.

Yep yep yep. 

 

ANyone who even tries to convince you otherwise isn't a person to trust.

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kismet

kismet

HOLY SHIT!!! A DINNER WITH DIGGLE THEA LYLA AND FELICITY?!?!!?

FINALLY :')

The question becomes how are the writers going to manage having a whole dinner without thea & felicity having conversation?. Its really gonna test their skills! :) Joking aside, I m really excited for the dinner FINALLY! ! Now if my emotions can handle it is a whole other story.

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TanyaKay

TanyaKay

The fact that Thea and Felicity will actually talk to each other makes me incredibly happy, even if this moment comes at a sad point in their lives, I am just glad that they are talking to each other and hopefully are there for each other

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Now I'm thinking that Oliver isn't fully brainwashed/indoctrinated/whatever, but just pretends to be Evil!Oliver in order to survive.  Maybe he hurts Diggle in order to save his life.  He was told to "eliminate the threat", so if he didn't do anything, someone else in the LOA would've killed Diggle.  So it could be that Oliver stabs Diggle severely enough that Diggle appears dead (like the Roy death fake-out), but Diggle thinks that Oliver really did try to kill him.

Edited by tv echo
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Chaser

Chaser

Now I'm thinking that Oliver isn't fully brainwashed/indoctrinated/whatever, but just pretends to be Evil!Oliver in order to survive.  Maybe he hurts Diggle in order to save his life.  He was told to "eliminate the threat", so if he didn't do anything, someone else in the LOA would've killed Diggle.  So it could be that Oliver stabs Diggle severely enough that Diggle appears dead (like the Roy death fake-out), but Diggle thinks that Oliver really did try to kill him.

That's where I am. I think Oliver is going to have to do something terrible to save Diggle's life. He hasn't fully 'ascended' yet so there may be something of him still there. 

 

I really don't want a season of these guys at odds. In some ways, I think it would hurt more than Oliver and Felicity at odds.

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Danny Franks

Danny Franks

Aww, now I'm going to have to watch for all the D/F and F/T scenes...plus Lyla and Baby Sara

Anyone else find it ominous that the clip ends on a picture of D/O from the wedding?

 

I find it amusing that the producers were seemingly too cheap (or not smart enough) to get SA and DR to pose for an actual photo, rather than taking what looks like a still from the episode and trying to make it look like a photograph. 'Aw, Johnny, this picture of you and Oliver sort of staring off into the middle distance in distraction is so cute. Let's frame it and put it on display!'

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

I find it amusing that the producers were seemingly too cheap (or not smart enough) to get SA and DR to pose for an actual photo, rather than taking what looks like a still from the episode and trying to make it look like a photograph. 'Aw, Johnny, this picture of you and Oliver sort of staring off into the middle distance in distraction is so cute. Let's frame it and put it on display!'

Oliver was too late to do posed photos. He and Diggle had a conversation about it in the ep.

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foreverevolving

foreverevolving

Oliver was too late to do posed photos. He and Diggle had a conversation about it in the ep.

Yes, but at the same time I sure both SA and DR have at least one picture of the two of them looking like normal people and not a still.

those small stuff matter, for example I remember when Out Of Sight (starring George Clooney and Jennifer Lopez) came out in 98, there's a scene where Lopez character visits Clooney character ex-wife, on her mantel the ex had a picture of clooney character, however you could absolutely tell this picture was not some still but an actual picture taken of clooney to use in the movie, or one he gave Steven Soderbergh permission to use.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

Yes, but at the same time I sure both SA and DR have at least one picture of the two of them looking like normal people and not a still.

those small stuff matter, for example I remember when Out Of Sight (starring George Clooney and Jennifer Lopez) came out in 98, there's a scene where Lopez character visits Clooney character ex-wife, on her mantel the ex had a picture of clooney character, however you could absolutely tell this picture was not some still but an actual picture taken of clooney to use in the movie, or one he gave Steven Soderbergh permission to use.

Seems they meant for it to be a candid or something. IDK, I'm not going to nitpick something like that. Maybe they didn't think they'd need a framed photo when they were shooting the wedding?

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Danny Franks

Danny Franks

Oliver was too late to do posed photos. He and Diggle had a conversation about it in the ep.

 

If someone is wandering around a wedding reception with a camera, you're never too late to pose for a simple photograph.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

If someone is wandering around a wedding reception with a camera, you're never too late to pose for a simple photograph.

 

Generally speaking, yeah. But perhaps whoever wanted a closeup of the wedding pic came up with that after the wedding was shot. It probably would've been a good idea for them to get a few candids, but...meh. I don't think it's a big deal.

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CabotCove

CabotCove

(edited)
I've been genuinely trying to figure out why intelligent people (like the vast majority of posters here) are continuing to watch this season, and this helps.  I don't really give a crap about SA.  I mean, he's a hot guy and a good actor, but I don't know him.  I know Oliver.  I've spent, with flashbacks, nearly six years getting to know and care about Oliver.  So seeing this man who has been through so much, and who has come out of all that hell trying to do good, get so completely shit on, completely horrifies me.

Invested in actors & some characters to just stop watching (yet). The show hasnt reached The Vampire Diaries levels of bad though, that I left.

 

Is that even the same kid?, she looks a bit Asian here. Really cute kid though. Good to see some Delicity bonding.

Edited by Conell
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HighHopes

HighHopes

About the photos, at my sisters wedding during the reception (and the getting ready part) the photographer pretty much just took candid photos since we did all of the posed ones earlier. So my sister would print out and frame candid style photos.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

It looks like Felicity's wearing the same dress in the dinner scene that she's wearing in the pic where Digg's hugging her, so I guess maybe he invites her over because she's upset? 

I personally wish that Digg finds Felicity in the Arrow Cave, they have an emotional moment with just the two of them and then Diggle says "Let's go back home, Lyla's making dinner" -- Because Felicity and Thea are staying at his place. I just need them to. Shhh

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statsgirl

statsgirl

(edited)

I love the idea that Diggle and Lyla have Thea and Felicity over for dinner to do a not-dead-yet wake for Oliver.  It's a bit of balm on how angry I still am about Felicity being shut out at the end of Draw Back Your Bow.  Having Felicity and Thea there, who don't live together and would need separate invites, also points out how apart from the core group Laurel still is.

 

 

Anyone else find it ominous that the clip ends on a picture of D/O from the wedding?

I'm sure it signals a cut to present day Oliver and how Evil he's become.

Because the elements that make the show great and the potential to be great again are still there. If they permanently damage the show, which they haven't yet, IMO, then I would drop it. This year did try my patience greatly, like many others'.

Same here.  Killing Moira and killing Sara and spending all that time on Laurel and Ray made me wonder if I should just cut my losses.

 

And then we get a couple of episodes like Broken Arrow and The Fallen, and I see those pictures of the dinner in the next episodes, and I'm right back hoping. For me, the Oliver/Diggle/Felicity combination is not just Original Team Arrow, it's the core and the heart of the show and somehow that combination of actors sucks me in and makes me keep hanging on for them.

Edited by statsgirl
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Belinea

Belinea

So if the wedding involves two prominent characters does that mean we can rule out anyone we have not seen before? 

 

At the end of the day that were to mean:

 

Oliver and one of the girls (Nyssa, Laurel or Felicity) or Thea and Roy. I'd be surprised if it is T/R because he won't be back next season and I don't know how funny it would be to have Ray officiate that wedding. 

MG said he thinks the wedding makes sense storyline wise so I am going with Nyssa over Felicity. Laurel would not make sense to me right now (or ever)

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calliope1975

calliope1975

I can't wait for Diggle/Lyla/Felicity/Thea dinner + that Diggle/Felicity hug. That's the kind of interactions and scenes I wanted after Oliver died in 3.09.

 

This is why I can't give up on the show yet. These are the type of character moments I love, and paired with fun action sequences, is the show I fell in love with. This year has been really trying, and I'm bummed that I had to skip episodes just to get through the season, but then I see stills like these, and I'm sucked back in again.

 

 

If someone is wandering around a wedding reception with a camera, you're never too late to pose for a simple photograph.

 

Excuse you, we didn't have time for Digg/Oliver pictures at the wedding; we had to spend time watching Phony Stark make it all about himself. :P  Heaven forbid we stop trying to make Ray happen.

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

I find it amusing that the producers were seemingly too cheap (or not smart enough) to get SA and DR to pose for an actual photo, rather than taking what looks like a still from the episode and trying to make it look like a photograph. 'Aw, Johnny, this picture of you and Oliver sort of staring off into the middle distance in distraction is so cute. Let's frame it and put it on display!'

This is TV convention that I've seen repeated over and over in shows for year and years.  In this day and age of digital photography with a camera in every phone it makes no effing sense not to take stills on set.  Instead they use stills and it never ever looks normal.  Why? Why?  Someone please explain this to me.  Are pictures - even ones used in the making of the show not included in contracts??

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statsgirl

statsgirl

I wonder if it's something that was added after the wedding episode was shot.  Suicidal Tendencies (317) is four episodes before Al Sah Him (312), so the script for this one would still have been in the early writing stages.  It would probably only have been later that the writers thought about putting into the dinner scene at  Diggle's, even they had even thought of a dinner at Diggle's then, a framed picture of Oliver and Diggle to up the ante.

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tarotx

tarotx

I think they must be going to use the fact Laurel has no real relationship (no perhaps an almost a hostile one) now with Oliver and a growing friendship/training relationship with Nyssa. It's the only thing that fits in my head.

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foreverevolving

foreverevolving

(edited)

SWERVE: We find out that Digg/Lyla's nuptials were not legal because Ray was not really an ordained minister so they have to do it again.

Except it's the couple first wedding. Dig and Lyla were married before, divorced and than remarried. so even if the wedding in 3x17 wasn't legal because of ray doing it, if they get married in 3x22 it will still be their 2nd time around.

 

 

About the picture: but did they had to use a wedding picture? they could have used any candid picture taken of Oliver and Dig at some personal event like someones birthday party or some holiday. they could have asked the actors if they have a joined picture they would be willing to provide. it's really not that hard. the picture really didn't have to be one from the wedding. and I bet yea it doesn't say so on the script, that the picture has to be the one from the wedding.

So really it's the prop department fault.

Edited by foreverevolving
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statsgirl

statsgirl

The wedding picture makes it more poignant though.  Here they were brothers, Oliver was Diggle's best man, to contrast with however Oliver is going to hurt him in the next couple of episodes.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

The wedding picture makes it more poignant though. Here they were brothers, Oliver was Diggle's best man, to contrast with however Oliver is going to hurt him in the next couple of episodes.

Yep, that's why I called it ominous, we know something happens between O/D in 321. Seems like a pretty big anvil right there about the bromance.

MG said he thinks the wedding makes sense storyline wise so I am going with Nyssa over Felicity. Laurel would not make sense to me right now (or ever)

In 321 Ra's sends Oliver to kill Nyssa. Going from Eliminate the pretender to the throne in 321 to you two must marry in 322, doesn't make much sense to me, storywise. Edited by Morrigan2575
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