The Bachelor in the Media

[dizzyd]

Saber and jade, please tell me you've submitted your applications! If you haven't already, please do so soon in case half the girls are recycled from previous seasons. And if Corinne is in there too, which wouldn't surprise me with all the interviews she's doing lately, please team up to make her look worse than she already does. This would be the best season for our PTV gang if you guys are on. 

[leighdear]

22 hours ago, Artsda said:

Britt from Chris's season got married today.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BY4CN8dAX6l/?taken-by=brittkarolina

It's nice to see her so happy.  Many people snarked on her for supposedly being a famewhore and swore she'd be one of those desperate for attention, making the rounds of all the Bachelor-related PR and media events.  Convinced she'd be shilling on Instagram and trying to get back into acting.  

I hope those folks remember how WRONG they were and feel dumb now for misjudging her.  But they probably won't. 

[Ohwell]

13 minutes ago, leighdear said:

It's nice to see her so happy.  Many people snarked on her for supposedly being a famewhore and swore she'd be one of those desperate for attention, making the rounds of all the Bachelor-related PR and media events.  Convinced she'd be shilling on Instagram and trying to get back into acting.  

I hope those folks remember how WRONG they were and feel dumb now for misjudging her.  But they probably won't. 

It's nice that she got married but that doesn't mean that people who thought she would be a famewhore, should feel "dumb," because many of these ex-Bachelorettes/Bachelors are just that--famewhores.  

So you're right, I don't feel "wrong" nor do I feel "dumb." 

[fib]

17 hours ago, leighdear said:

It's nice to see her so happy.  Many people snarked on her for supposedly being a famewhore and swore she'd be one of those desperate for attention, making the rounds of all the Bachelor-related PR and media events.  Convinced she'd be shilling on Instagram and trying to get back into acting.  

I hope those folks remember how WRONG they were and feel dumb now for misjudging her.  But they probably won't. 

I'm with @Ohwell - I didnt think she'd be a good bachelorette - but it was because I thought she was fakety-fake fake. Turns out, she was hiding a SEVERE eating disorder associated with anxiety the whole time she was on the show.  So her happy and sweet persona? Concealing stress that was literally eating at her.  She has also admitted she is an alcoholic and recovered cocaine addict.  So I don't think I was wrong.  In fact, I'm certain she would have been a truly awful bachelorette.  The difference is that now, I also think being the bachelorette would have been truly awful for her too.  The lead position is really tough and exhausting and stressful and lonely, and we all know the producers are unscrupulous.  I think they could have really pushed her to a point where she was not able to cope. 

 

That said, I'm really happy she is okay, healthy and seeking treatment for her mental health challenges.  Truly happy and proud she is speaking about them.  And proud she stayed away from this show.  

Edited September 12, 2017 by fib
Added nice coda that I always intended to include.

[chocolatine]

4 minutes ago, fib said:

I thought [Britt] was fakety-fake fake

That was my take on her too. The way she pretended to be into everything Chris Soules was into while telling the opposite to the camera, the way she still referred to the Bachelor season she was on as "[her] love story" after she'd been eliminated, all the faux-spiritual and gushy social media posts about her non-relationship with Brady (the guy who left the Bachelorette to pursue Britt after majority of the guys voted for Kaitlyn), it all reeked of insincerity. I find people like her really hard to take.

[ByTor]

1 hour ago, fib said:

 She has also admitted she is an alcoholic and recovered cocaine addict.

I never heard this about her.  I read the article, and there were only 2 comments made.  I have to share the 1st one, it's quite insightful IMO (I thought the same thing about the YouTube channel, btw)...

Quote

If she has eating disorders and addition issues, she obviously needs to get a handle on WHY instead of thinking about how the disease makes her feel now. Sure, telling someone is critical. You can't recover without speaking out. But she doesn't seem to have any grasp on what drives her to have such issues. She is literally doing a macabre twist on the humblebrag. "I'm even worse than everyone because I'm addicted to EVERYTHING". 

Every addiction is just a mental health issue that's hiding underneath. She sounds like she wants attention and the things she does are to make herself feel worthy of it. Controlling your body image through bingeing (Look, PEOPLE! That is how it is spelled. It isn't "binging".), then purging, using drugs and alcohol to become more alive, confident, more magnanimous, using a reality show to get noticed and then using YouTube after that to get more attention. She doesn't think she deserves people's love or friendship or attention so she is making herself seem extra "bad" by having multiple issues. 
This girl craves pity. Until she treats the underlying reasons why she wants everyone to notice her, nothing will get better.

[Sptembergurl]

I really hope Britt makes her marriage work. She seems like a handful but hopefully her husband will help her stay on track to lead a fulfilling life.

[nutty1]

Peter was on ET and explained why he didn't do the show..... damn, he is more handsome, if possible.

 

http://www.etonline.com/exclusive-peter-kraus-reveals-why-fear-stopped-him-being-bachelor-and-what-future-holds-87076?linkId=42137102

[Artsda]

Sharleen Joynt (opera Sharleen) also got married.  Nick, Calia, Andi, Chris Soules (who had to get permission to leave the state) were there.

http://people.com/tv/former-bachelor-contestant-sharleen-joynt-marries-andy-levine/

http://people.com/celebrity/chris-soules-smiles-sharleen-joynt-wedding/

[jade.black]

On 9/11/2017 at 6:54 PM, dizzyd said:

Saber and jade, please tell me you've submitted your applications! If you haven't already, please do so soon in case half the girls are recycled from previous seasons. And if Corinne is in there too, which wouldn't surprise me with all the interviews she's doing lately, please team up to make her look worse than she already does. This would be the best season for our PTV gang if you guys are on. 

Wellll I didn't have much say in the matter since I guess my friend went ahead and nominated me not entirely with my consent, ha. CH will need to sit her down for a very special talk. My luck they won't see it until next season and call me up for some lame lead like Ben Higgins 2.0. God, I can't believe my contact details are out there in the Bachelorverse. What is my life.

[nlkm9]

I bet they will have 35 women this time, rather than the usual 25 or 30. I dont care for Arie, but as always watch for the train wreck.

[NeverLate]

On 12/09/2017 at 6:41 PM, nutty1 said:

Peter was on ET and explained why he didn't do the show..... damn, he is more handsome, if possible.

 

http://www.etonline.com/exclusive-peter-kraus-reveals-why-fear-stopped-him-being-bachelor-and-what-future-holds-87076?linkId=42137102

He looked like he had something sour in his mouth. I suspect he thinks he's more special than he is.He'll be the bachelor eventually( yawn ) 

Edited September 14, 2017 by Hello Lady

[CindyBee]

30 minutes ago, Hello Lady said:

He looked like he had something sour in his mouth. I suspect he thinks he's more special than he is.He'll he the bachelor eventually( yawn ) 

Yeah I think it never occurred to him that Fleiss would pick someone else so now he's backtracking with the whole "I LOVED Rachel so I'm not ready to be the lead".  Whatever Peter.

[saber5055]

Chris Soules appeared in court today. His trial will begin Jan. 18, 2018 and is expected to last four or five days. According to local news, his lawyers are looking to toss out the case, or minimize the "seriousness" of his killing that man so Soules can walk free.

[nlkm9]

was it here that i read that Chris soules was at fashion week in NY? I dont get it--isnt he a farmer in Iowa? fashion week? lol

[TheFinalRose]

Quote

 

Peter was on ET and explained why he didn't do the show..... .

 

OMG. He is so not ready for the part: (from the ET article)

 

"Fear came from other people's opinions, which I don't know if I should guide my life on that, but I do take what people say very personally," he explained. "I'm constantly reading how awful I am for even considering being the Bachelor, so I let fear kind of guide me. I was afraid of what people would say. I was afraid of what people would think, and I was afraid of not being able to live up to the amazing standards that are the lead of that position."

The more he opens his mouth, the more he proves Rachel right that this show isn't right for him. 

[Ohwell]

13 minutes ago, TheFinalRose said:

The more he opens his mouth, the more he proves Rachel right that this show isn't right for him. 

Rachel might have been "right" but it wasn't her place to say it, especially on national television.  The producers would have figured it out or Peter would have just told them how he felt.  She was definitely trying to sabotage him, IMO.

[Mabinogia]

15 minutes ago, TheFinalRose said:

I was afraid of what people would think, and I was afraid of not being able to live up to the amazing standards that are the lead of that position."

Wait, did he just say this show has standards? Amazing standards? Standards that are to be lived up to? And he thinks he can't live up to these imaginary standards? Wow, Peter, get yourself into therapy STAT because you have no self esteem at all if you think you can't live up to the exalted position that the likes of Chris Soules and Juan Pablo, just to name a couple. have held. 

[TheFinalRose]

Quote

Rachel might have been "right" but it wasn't her place to say it, especially on national television.

Oh, I don't think Rachel was out of line at all saying what she did on national television as she was an equal partner in the relationship with Peter, and she and Peter were both equally working within the multiple constraints of the show. I believe she had every right to say if you can't work within the obvious constraints of the show this show isn't right for you. I don't think it's any worse than Peter's saying go have a mediocre life on national tv. Fleiss, as we all know, makes his own decisions in casting despite Rachel's opinion.

[Ohwell]

Well, we'll just have to disagree on that because I do think Rachel was out of line.  I think she was still butt hurt that Peter didn't propose, and that was her final shot at him.

Edited September 15, 2017 by Ohwell

[truthaboutluv]

10 hours ago, TheFinalRose said:

I believe she had every right to say if you can't work within the obvious constraints of the show this show isn't right for you. I don't think it's any worse than Peter's saying go have a mediocre life on national tv. Fleiss, as we all know, makes his own decisions in casting despite Rachel's opinion.

But that's just the thing though. What Rachel actually said, meaning her actual words, was not this awful thing in my opinion. Viewers just had all of their opinions and feelings after the finale and many ascribed ulterior motives to Rachel, that she was deliberately trying to sabotage Peter's god given right to be the next Bachelor. And of course that got her dragged as being so bitter and petty. And maybe that is what she was doing or not. But if you actually only focused on the words she said, the woman didn't say anything that was awful in my opinion. 

Rachel started her comment saying to Peter that he was always true to himself and who he is and she really respected that about him. But that yes, she felt that he was someone who liked to take his time with relationships and big life changing decisions like getting engaged and so because of that maybe the show wasn't right for him. That was it.  And lo and behold, Peter himself says this in his interview with Lauren Zima. 

 

Quote

"I needed more time for clarity. I'm the type of person who needs maybe too much time to process things when it comes to life and love...when I'm talking about my wife and my future, I want to take time to really think about it." 

How is that any different to what Rachel said about him on the ATFR?

Edited September 15, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[saber5055]

nlkm9, that was me who posted Chris Soules asked the court for permission to leave Iowa for NYC Fashion Week. That's what the local news station reported here, and Soules is local news. He was given two weeks "leave time." I was surprised to see he was at Sharleen's wedding, plus he was photo'd having lunch with Andi in NYC. I'm guessing he pumped Andi for more legal ways to get out of serving jail time for killing his neighbor. I'd love to know who he called while he hid in his house long enough for his tox reports to come back clean. Someone had to tell him about that. His lawyers are also asking that the dead man not be called a "victim," and any eyewitnesses who saw him drinking and buying liquor before the accident be barred from testifying.

[Mabinogia]

Guess you really can buy your way out of trouble. I think I hate him more than anyone who has ever been on this franchise after all this.

[RHJunkie]

14 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

But that's just the thing though. What Rachel actually said, meaning her actual words, was not this awful thing in my opinion. Viewers just had all of their opinions and feelings after the finale and many ascribed ulterior motives to Rachel, that she was deliberately trying to sabotage Peter's god given right to be the next Bachelor. And of course that got her dragged as being so bitter and petty. And maybe that is what she was doing or not. But if you actually only focused on the words she said, the woman didn't say anything that was awful in my opinion. 

Rachel started her comment saying to Peter that he was always true to himself and who he is and she really respected that about him. But that yes, she felt that he was someone who liked to take his time with relationships and big life changing decisions like getting engaged and so because of that maybe the show wasn't right for him. That was it.  And lo and behold, Peter himself says this in his interview with Lauren Zima. 

 

How is that any different to what Rachel said about him on the ATFR?

Perhaps if she hadn't done a series of TV interviews and at one point admitted that she didn't want to see any of 'her' guys be the next Bachelor because she feels possessive of them, perhaps less people would have felt like she was trying to sabotage one of 'her' guys chances to be the next Bachelor.

I don't think what she said was anything awful, but her comments just like on the show, suggested that Rachel cared more for the label and ring than she did the individual relationship. When you're more in love with the idea than you are with the person, you put yourself at a higher risk of seeing that relationship fall apart in the long run. Not saying that is what Rachel did (prioritizing the ring over the future of the relationship), but I'm saying that it's very easy to see why she gave that impression. Yes, there is a construct for the show in place, but those constructs are bent to the will of those who are there at any given moment. Some contestants leave by their own accord, contestants get eliminated before a rose ceremony, some leads choose not to propose, some leads break the rules of the group dates, some contestants go beyond the date formats that the show gives them so that they can get more time with the lead...I mean, didn't Rachel uncharacteristically take 3 guys to the finale instead of 2? She should know better than most that the structure of the show is not one that the leads and contestants have to live or die by. There is room for adjustment and at the end of the day, Rachel could have made that adjustment if she valued her relationship with Peter more than she valued the act of him getting on one knee and presenting her with a ring. To point out that the construct of the show is not for Peter is disingenuous to the reality that this show produces more failed engagements than it does successes. The odds are not in one's favour and if someone is open to possibly meeting their forever person on this show, even if it doesn't end with an engagement in the finale but ends up being a relationship that makes it to the alter, guess what, they still end up in the win column like the very very few others who managed to get engaged on the show and follow through with a wedding afterward. In the end, it would make no difference. Having had time to process what transpired between her and Peter and being able to build on her relationship with Bryan, for Rachel to call out Peter that long after for not being capable and/or suited for the show did in fact come across as bitter and petty. Her good friend Corinne went on a dating show with a boyfriend back home just so she could promote herself on TV and soak up her 15 minutes of fame. Rachel should know that there are far more egregious things one could do on this show besides ask to pursue a relationship beyond the cameras without rushing into an engagement.

[truthaboutluv]

I think I hate him more than anyone who has ever been on this franchise after all this.

Understandable, seeing as someone ended up dead. 

Edited September 15, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[Palomar]

18 hours ago, TheFinalRose said:

Oh, I don't think Rachel was out of line at all saying what she did on national television as she was an equal partner in the relationship with Peter, and she and Peter were both equally working within the multiple constraints of the show. I believe she had every right to say if you can't work within the obvious constraints of the show this show isn't right for you. I don't think it's any worse than Peter's saying go have a mediocre life on national tv. Fleiss, as we all know, makes his own decisions in casting despite Rachel's opinion.

I think it was actually a real moment where they were having an argument, neither was getting their way, and they lashed out at each other. They both took what the other said to heart when it was said in anger.  And of course the situation took over the ATFR show unfortunately, kind of like Nick and Andi's "fight" on ATFR when she picked Josh. 

[nlkm9]

21 hours ago, Ohwell said:

Well, we'll just have to disagree on that because I do think Rachel was out of line.  I think she was still butt hurt that Peter didn't propose, and that was her final shot at him.

i recall when Roberto was being considered as bachelor and Ali had a fit--I totally get it, even if its not a fair way to feel-- but I thought Rachel just hated the idea of seeing Peter be the bachelor because he refused to propose..

[chocolatine]

1 hour ago, nlkm9 said:

i recall when Roberto was being considered as bachelor and Ali had a fit--I totally get it, even if its not a fair way to feel-- but I thought Rachel just hated the idea of seeing Peter be the bachelor because he refused to propose..

Ali and Roberto had been together for over a year before they split up, so it's not the same situation.

[MakeMeLaugh]

On 9/14/2017 at 8:38 PM, TheFinalRose said:

....

The more he [Peter] opens his mouth, the more he proves Rachel right that this show isn't right for him. ...

Like that's ever been a factor for who becomes the lead ?--the show doesn't care if it's right for the star, it's whether the star is right for the show. And yes why is Rachel caring the tiniest whit about him or anyone else being chosen if she is engaged to another man? 

[Mabinogia]

8 hours ago, MakeMeLaugh said:

And yes why is Rachel caring the tiniest whit about him or anyone else being chosen if she is engaged to another man? 

I'm sure she's afraid he will fall in love and propose and it will confirm that he just wasn't that into her specifically. I think that if she thought Peter would propose to her, her season could have gone quite differently. She may still have ended up with Bryan, but I do think her feelings for Peter were strong enough that Bryan wouldn't have been a sure thing. 

[NeverLate]

On 15/09/2017 at 11:46 PM, MakeMeLaugh said:

Like that's ever been a factor for who becomes the lead ?--the show doesn't care if it's right for the star, it's whether the star is right for the show. And yes why is Rachel caring the tiniest whit about him or anyone else being chosen if she is engaged to another man? 

Apparently she was asked, I guess she didnt think lying was an option. :)

[nlkm9]

On 9/15/2017 at 8:25 PM, chocolatine said:

Ali and Roberto had been together for over a year before they split up, so it's not the same situation.

i meant similar emotions--the "I dont want him but noone else can have him either" type of emotions. 

[JudyObscure]

Mention of Ali and Roberto made me think of how much their relationship on the show was like Rachel's toward Peter.  Ali was always the one initiating kisses while Roberto held back looking a little uncomfortable.  He even actually pushed her off a few times.  I never thought he seemed that into Ali and I remember Roberto's father telling her Roberto could get any woman he wanted, and seeming to imply Ali wasn't quite beautiful enough.

Edited September 19, 2017 by JudyObscure

[saber5055]

Mention of Roberto made me remember he was always sweaty and his suits were WAY too small. "Rubber-toe."

[chocolatine]

23 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

Mention of Roberto made me remember he was always sweaty and his suits were WAY too small. "Rubber-toe."

Ali called him "Rah-bird-o". When they broke up, many of us on the old TWOP forum speculated that it was because he got fed up with her mispronouncing his name.

[nlkm9]

On 9/18/2017 at 7:57 AM, JudyObscure said:

Mention of Ali and Roberto made me think of how much their relationship on the show was like Rachel's toward Peter.  Ali was always the one initiating kisses while Roberto held back looking a little uncomfortable.  He even actually pushed her off a few times.  I never thought he seemed that into Ali and I remember Roberto's father telling her Roberto could get any woman he wanted, and seeming to imply Ali wasn't quite beautiful enough.

OMG!! I remember that now! his Dad was very condescending towards her!! 

[FrancesL]

On 9/15/2017 at 2:10 PM, RHJunkie said:

She should know better than most that the structure of the show is not one that the leads and contestants have to live or die by. There is room for adjustment and at the end of the day, Rachel could have made that adjustment if she valued her relationship with Peter more than she valued the act of him getting on one knee and presenting her with a ring.

I think  her feelings were a lot more complex than just wanting a ring. She wanted to be with someone who cared enough about her to see a future with her, and Peter's adamant insistence on not wanting to propose made her doubt his true feeling I think any woman in that situation would feel that way.  The ring is a symbolic gesture of a willingness to commit  and single season prior to Rachel's,  the guy was eager to propose.  Yes, it's not normal to propose that quickly, but in the context of the show, it is the norm.  Peter had no problems going on a show like the Bachelorette with all it's crazy rules, so it  seemed odd that he would suddenly have these principles about only wanting to propose once.  Proposing and Marriage in the Bachelor world, are not the same. I think there is an implicit understanding that the couples will need more time to date away from the cameras before deciding to take that final step.  People keep saying that Rachel should have been able to compromise if she valued Peter that much,....but I think that Peter should have also been able to compromise if he valued her that much too....and I'm sure that's probably how Rachel saw it.  (I can't blame her for that). Also, offering to propose as a "sacrifice" is probably the worst thing that you could say to a woman right before proposing to her! I just think that Peter was just too  wrapped up in his own emotions to see things from Rachel's perspective . Also, if it really was just about the ring for Rachel, then she would have accepted Peter's offer. 

On 9/15/2017 at 2:10 PM, RHJunkie said:

Having had time to process what transpired between her and Peter and being able to build on her relationship with Bryan, for Rachel to call out Peter that long after for not being capable and/or suited for the show did in fact come across as bitter and petty.

She had to watch the finale with everyone and face Peter right after watching it, so any processing that she might have done in the past, was probably erased by watching their breakup and having to relive that moment. I think they both made mistakes and said things they might regret, but I saw their reactions as very human and real, which is something I don't see often on the Bachelor franchise.  Plus, after everything Peter said with regards to his reasons for not proposing, it seemed inconsistent for him to even entertain being the Bachelor.  So I'm glad that Rachel pointed out that the Bachelor franchise wasn't for him based on what he said.  Whether it was petty or no didn't really matter to me, because I think that someone needed to say it.  As a viewer,  I'm inclined to think that Peter was truly sincere about his feelings and wasn't stringing Rachel along so he could be the  next Bachelor.....But I also know that some people are very good actors and very good at manipulating others, so I don't blame Rachel for wondering if his actions could have all been one big act and for deciding to call his bluff on live TV.  Or maybe she thought it would be too infuriating to watch him propose to another woman after insisting that the format of the show was the reason he couldn't propose to Rachel. Anyway, I can't blame her for how she felt and reacted in the moment. 

13 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

Mention of Ali and Roberto made me think of how much their relationship on the show was like Rachel's toward Peter.  Ali was always the one initiating kisses while Roberto held back looking a little uncomfortable.  He even actually pushed her off a few times.  I never thought he seemed that into Ali

Despite all of Peter's flip-flopping, I still got the impression that he was definitely into Rachel. In the beginning, he seemed camera-shy with the intimate gestures, but as the season progressed, he loosened up in front of the camera a lot more, and I'm sure there was a lot that wasn't aired  (just as a lot was omitted with Rachel and Bryan) .  I thought that Rachel was pretty good at telling which guys were truly into her. He was definitely more reserved than the others, when it came to big romantic gestures and statements, but I think he probably showed her that he cared in a lot of other ways, and Rachel recognized that. Even Kenny and Demario (in the midst of throwing shade) made comments about Peter to that effect.  I think that in the end, doubts and insecurities held both of them back and prevented them from compromising and taking the risk. 

Edited September 21, 2017 by FrancesL

[RHJunkie]

49 minutes ago, FrancesL said:

I think  her feelings were a lot more complex than just wanting a ring. She wanted to be with someone who cared enough about her to see a future with her, and Peter's adamant insistence on not wanting to propose made her doubt his true feeling I think any woman in that situation would feel that way.  The ring is a symbolic gesture of a willingness to commit  and single season prior to Rachel's,  the guy was eager to propose.  Yes, it's not normal to propose that quickly, but in the context of the show, it is the norm.  Peter had no problems going on a show like the Bachelorette with all it's crazy rules, so it  seemed odd that he would suddenly have these principles about only wanting to propose once.  Proposing and Marriage in the Bachelor world, are not the same. I think there is an implicit understanding that the couples will need more time to date away from the cameras before deciding to take that final step.  People keep saying that Rachel should have been able to compromise if she valued Peter that much,....but I think that Peter should have also been able to compromise if he valued her that much too....and I'm sure that's probably how Rachel saw it.  (I can't blame her for that). Also, offering to propose as a "sacrifice" is probably the worst thing that you could say to a woman right before proposing to her! I just think that Peter was just too  wrapped up in his own emotions to see things from Rachel's perspective . Also, if it really was just about the ring for Rachel, then she would have accepted Peter's offer. 

The context of the show shouldn't dissuade those on it from thinking of life beyond the cameras. Yes in the context of the show, the ring is the norm but we're well enough into this franchise to know that the ring itself is not the sign of commitment. The large majority of women who have received a ring have had to give it back or walked away without a wedding. The ring is absolutely no different from someone's word that they are committed, can see a future with you and want to pursue a relationship further so the notion that the ring is tied to the doubts of true feeling is not an acceptable explanation (imo) because that only suggests to me being too caught up in the fantasy that the Bachelor franchise creates for those on it. 

What makes you think that he suddenly had those principles on proposing? There have been bachelor/ettes and contestants who have admitted that they did the show to build a platform for themselves but they were also open to the experience of finding love. So why can't someone say 'I want to find love, I may not want to propose so soon but why not take a chance and see what happens?'. Again, I'm not entertaining this notion that these are the rules of the show and therefore there's no room for you if you can't live and die by those rules. 

And for the record, the compromise of asking someone to propose versus asking someone to pursue a committed relationship is nowhere near the same level of compromise. And no, after Peter's choice of words, why would any self respecting woman accept the ring when it was made known that it was only being presented to you as a compromise on their part? At the end of the day, I'm not saying that Rachel was driven by the ring, I'm saying the way she handled the situation made her appear to care too much about the symbolism of the act rather than the true quality of the relationship. It's very well possible that there were other things that gave her pause and the conversation about him not wanting to propose is what caused the big red flag to go up. It may not have solely been about the ring, but the way it was presented it came across as if the ring was the true point of contention between the two of them...and again, that's just how I perceived it. 

[JenE4]

Re Ali and Roberto: He was the original "I'll settle for second choice" pick. I mean, granted, I'm a bit more savvy about creative editing than I was back then, so perhaps it was just me falling for those rascally editors, but Ali was head over heels for Frank and devastated when he got back with his ex during hometowns. Not much on this show surprises me anymore, but I was shocked that Ali got engaged to Roberto mere days later. 

[FrancesL]

4 minutes ago, RHJunkie said:

At the end of the day, I'm not saying that Rachel was driven by the ring, I'm saying the way she handled the situation made her appear to care too much about the symbolism of the act rather than the true quality of the relationship. It's very well possible that there were other things that gave her pause and the conversation about him not wanting to propose is what caused the big red flag to go up. It may not have solely been about the ring, but the way it was presented it came across as if the ring was the true point of contention between the two of them...and again, that's just how I perceived it. 

I think it came across that way to a lot of people, and the editing probably didn't help. So I'm not disagreeing with that. I just think we interpreted things differently. Watching their interactions  made me think that his reluctance to propose made her actually question the true quality of their relationship and wonder whether he could ever get to the point of wanting to propose.   So I didn't see her choice as picking the ring over a quality relationship.  Being the Bachelorette is both a blessing and a curse. Yes, she had the luxury of having her pick of 20-30 guys, but at the end of the day, there's really no certainty of knowing whether or not her #1 choice would have also picked her over 20 women, had the tables been turned.....That reassurance comes when they really start dating with no cameras around.  And she discovers that she made the wrong choice, there's no rewind button.  This is why so much weight is placed on that symbolic gesture of a proposal, even when it wouldn't make sense in the real world and  why I don't blame Rachel for her choice.  If Peter was the Bachelor and he picked Rachel without proposing, I don't think she would have been plagued with the same insecurities. She would have probably been fine dating him, knowing that she was truly his choice. 

[thehepburn]

22 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

Re Ali and Roberto: He was the original "I'll settle for second choice" pick. I mean, granted, I'm a bit more savvy about creative editing than I was back then, so perhaps it was just me falling for those rascally editors, but Ali was head over heels for Frank and devastated when he got back with his ex during hometowns. Not much on this show surprises me anymore, but I was shocked that Ali got engaged to Roberto mere days later. 

 

It became obvious that Frank was her F1 when you take a look at her husband who looks EXACTLY like Frank! Whoa.

[MakeMeLaugh]

If Rachel had been on BIP she could have sat in on Wells's come-to-Jesus talk with Kristina about why would you even want someone who's not into you? IMO Rachel wanted to be able to say she knew Peter was the one the minute he stepped out of the limo but unfortunately for her, any feelings he had for her at that point just didn't develop beyond that first chemistry she thinks they had. I hope she truly loves Bryan and isn't settling just because she was so desperate to have a man who would propose. Nothing against Bryan or for Peter, but imo this ws the weirdest F2 situation ever.

[truthaboutluv]

Weirder than Desiree chasing after Brooks telling him how much she loved him and still loved him even if he was breaking her heart, but still accepting a proposal from Chris two days later? Frankly imo, I think at this point the narrative viewers built around this season is far more dramatic than the actual situation with the parties involved. 

Edited September 23, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[Earlfor1]

On 9/21/2017 at 8:06 AM, RHJunkie said:

The context of the show shouldn't dissuade those on it from thinking of life beyond the cameras. Yes in the context of the show, the ring is the norm but we're well enough into this franchise to know that the ring itself is not the sign of commitment. The large majority of women who have received a ring have had to give it back or walked away without a wedding. The ring is absolutely no different from someone's word that they are committed, can see a future with you and want to pursue a relationship further so the notion that the ring is tied to the doubts of true feeling is not an acceptable explanation (imo) because that only suggests to me being too caught up in the fantasy that the Bachelor franchise creates for those on it. 

 

And for the record, the compromise of asking someone to propose versus asking someone to pursue a committed relationship is nowhere near the same level of compromise. And no, after Peter's choice of words, why would any self respecting woman accept the ring when it was made known that it was only being presented to you as a compromise on their part? At the end of the day, I'm not saying that Rachel was driven by the ring, I'm saying the way she handled the situation made her appear to care too much about the symbolism of the act rather than the true quality of the relationship. It's very well possible that there were other things that gave her pause and the conversation about him not wanting to propose is what caused the big red flag to go up. It may not have solely been about the ring, but the way it was presented it came across as if the ring was the true point of contention between the two of them...and again, that's just how I perceived it. 

I agree.  I said this in the episode thread that Peter thought he was the lead and that Rachel was the contestant.  Rachel's principles and views were what guided her decision, and she made it based on her principles and feelings.  Peter should have walked away as he said that he would, but he kept pulling her back in.  If Peter were the lead and he wanted to have a relationship outside of the show without a proposal, and Rachel, the contestant, did, then it wouldn't be her place to convince him otherwise.   She either takes the chance or walk.

 

Rachel said at the beginning of her journey, she wanted someone who wanted the same thing she wants.  Peter didn't.   Peter knew what she wanted because she said so all season. They were not compatible in that regard. Why would she take the chance with someone she was not compatible with.  She stated that her love language was physical touch and quality time. Peter did not demonstrate a lot of physical touch.   Rachel is smart and I didn't see desperation to get a ring.  It was a symbol of taking a leap of faith.  Peter was not willing to do so.  Nothing more.  I truly believe that even if he was willing to propose, she would have still picked Bryan (watch, better one on one dates, meeting her closest friends).

Based on his post show interviews, he has made some inconsistent statements.  (One being that he never tried to reach out to her. He said he did on ATFR and Rachel admitted this as well.  In another interview he is over her and wanted to be the Bachelor, but he was concerned what people would say about him.  However, later on he stated there wasn't enough time to process what happened with Rachel and ATFR.  The most laughable one was that he wished that he had watched Nick's season because he didn't know she wanted a proposal so badly- she said it many times in her season.) These interviews were conducted after Arie was announced as TB. If I had whiplash reading the interviews, I could only imagine what Rachel was going through.

 

Speaking of ATFR, Rachel had no time to process what she had just seen with Peter as she watched the break up scene the same time as we did.  I felt she was very composed, as I wouldn't have been.  So her stating that the show wasn't for him was real talk.  He can't make quick decisions and stick to them, he is not quick on his feet, and quite frankly, he lacks the charm and wit to be interesting as a lead.  I hope I never see him as the Bachelor in the future.

[saber5055]

TMZ has two pictures up of Arie and one of the b-ettes on a motorcycle ride, then "making out" afterward. Filming began this week I guess. I'm already bummed that Fleiss never called me. I plan to be bitter about that until the (bitter) end of this season.

[nlkm9]

On ET last nite, there was a report that Peter was going to be in the Bachelor winter games "looking for love". I guess he is not ever going to be the bachelor!!

[ByTor]

3 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

On ET last nite, there was a report that Peter was going to be in the Bachelor winter games "looking for love". I guess he is not ever going to be the bachelor!!

I wasn't sure where to put it, but I posted a link to a People Magazine article discussing this in the Bachelorette in the Media thread.  Here it is if anybody wants to read it...

http://people.com/tv/peter-kraus-is-getting-another-chance-at-love-as-part-of-the-bachelor-winter-games/

Edited October 7, 2017 by ByTor

[DEL901]

Nick's got his first acting job:  http://people.com/tv/bachelor-nick-viall-guest-star-speechless/

[Wings]

On 9/18/2017 at 4:57 AM, JudyObscure said:

Mention of Ali and Roberto made me think of how much their relationship on the show was like Rachel's toward Peter.  Ali was always the one initiating kisses while Roberto held back looking a little uncomfortable.  He even actually pushed her off a few times.  I never thought he seemed that into Ali and I remember Roberto's father telling her Roberto could get any woman he wanted, and seeming to imply Ali wasn't quite beautiful enough.

Thanks for the reminder.  When they broke up I stuck up for Ali when many were blaming her for being a famewhore and kicking him to the curb because he was in her way.  Nope!  He and his family wanted him to marry someone Ali could never be nor wanted to.  A lot had to do with religion and the proper 'role' a wife plays.  And he was not Frank, there was always that.   

On 9/12/2017 at 5:41 PM, nutty1 said:

Peter was on ET and explained why he didn't do the show..... damn, he is more handsome, if possible.

 

http://www.etonline.com/exclusive-peter-kraus-reveals-why-fear-stopped-him-being-bachelor-and-what-future-holds-87076?linkId=42137102

It seems so clear he regrets not proposing now that he has had time to gather his wits.  I was surprised and pleased at his honesty saying he was worried what people would think.  He feared being ridiculed.   He has another chance now.

I have not read how Rachael and Bryan are doing but I do wonder if she will have pangs of not choosing Peter as she watches him on the Winter Games.   

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, wings707 said:

I have not read how Rachael and Bryan are doing

They seem to be doing just fine and are seemingly very happy with each other, despite having to constantly deal with people who can't move on from the season and so feel the need to constantly post on Rachel's social media account that she settled and how unhappy she really is but is just faking. So you know, the usual Bachelor Nation madness. 

 

Quote

It seems so clear he regrets not proposing now that he has had time to gather his wits.  I was surprised and pleased at his honesty saying he was worried what people would think.  He feared being ridiculed.   He has another chance now.

YMMV but I didn't get any regrets about not proposing to Rachel in that interview and more regret that he let the negative opinions of him being a hypocrite if he took the Bachelor position, essentially make him screw up the opportunity. That's what I think he regrets - that his hemming and hawing cost him the gig in favor of Arie because make no mistake, he wanted it. Obviously no one really enjoys being hated and most people want to be liked but it's clear from some of the things Peter said in that interview (and his recent meltdown on Instagram) that he puts a lot of stock, probably more than he should, in what random strangers think about him. And personally, in my opinion, that's not very healthy. Especially when he gets so much viewer adoration and yet he lets the little bit of criticism and hate he gets, bother him so much.

Edited October 9, 2017 by truthaboutluv