Spoilers and Discussion

[camussie]

The last two episodes all about baiting/mocking fans.  I just don't buy that they care all that much about Sam/Mercedes shipper's feelings when they openly mocked about every fan base out there including one where one half if the pairing is dead.  

 

Sure Mercedes "giving her blessing" ends Sam/Mercedes but I have no illusion that they are doing it all to try and let Sam/Mercedes fans down easy.  They are doing it to clear the path for Sam/Rachel as cleanly as possible.  It is as cheap and contrived as making Brody a gigolo to clear a path for Finn/Rachel.  

Edited February 2, 2015 by camussie

[ComfySweater]

4 million? Really, I would say it's less than that.

I missed by an hour and Worlds Funniest Fails got somewhere around there. Glee got somewhere under 2. Sorry. My bad.

[SevenStars]

Falchuk specifically tweeted a Samcedes fan asking if Samcedes would find happiness together with "they are and will end up very happy", minus the together. It was not subtle. There was probably a reason for that and this is it.

 

So you think this tweet was him trying to be nicely let Samcedes fans down ? Seriously? I don't see it that way but whatever. 

[Hookian]

Did you watch the last two episodes?  It was all about baiting/mocking fans.  I just don't buy that they care all that much about Sam/Mercedes shipper's feelings when they openly mocked about every fan base out there including one where one half if the pairing was dead.  

 

You want to know the irony of that. Yes that episode mocked Klaine shippers very openly and meta'd the crap out of them...but they were actually happy with it. That confused the hell out of me and calling Sue "The Supreme". Oh boy.

So you think this tweet was him trying to be nicely let Samcedes fans down ? Seriously? I don't see it that way but whatever. 

 

Yes I do. I truly do because this episode is gonna give Samcedes closure before sinking it. Mercedes and Sam are gonna share a convo. Sam's a good guy he won't pursue Rachel completely if he knows Mercedes will be hurt by it. That's not in Sam's character.

[ComfySweater]

Do Klaine fans have a shame gene? Probably not. Moving on.

[spiritof76]

 

The more obvious conclusion is that they are simply clearing the decks for Sam/Rachel so that there is a lot less room to question their actions.  After all if Mercedes is for it who are viewers to say man that is a kind of shady?

That is it exactly. I guarantee, the thinking will be, "Well if Mercedes is cool with it, who are we to object."

 

I have to laugh at this thought that out of all of the ships in this show, RIB are trying to be oh so very, kind to Samcedes shippers. As has been stated, Samcedes was done. They went all of Season 4 not even mentioning it. They had Sam, even say, that he had really always like Brittany. So there was no needing, to provide closure to Samcedes because it was already closed. Then they spent the better half of the end of Season 5 of their relationship, for no reason. And then when they broke up, instead of having them say, "We just don't get along, or we don't really feel that way about each other, or I hate the way you chew", whatever!  They had them both declare their love to each other. While they were breaking up! Was I the only person that saw that? Was I watching another show? Only to now turn around and have Mercedes be all, "Meh, you can have him". So no, I do not think these writers care one bit about stringing "shippers" along.

 

ETA: and they have done it to just about every ship. But, i'm not going to lie the racial aspect of this really grates on me.

Edited February 2, 2015 by spiritof76

[Ceeg]

 Sam's a good guy he won't pursue Rachel completely if he knows Mercedes will be hurt by it. That's not in Sam's character.

 

I'm gonna take this over to the All Episodes Thread.

[SevenStars]

The last two episodes all about baiting/mocking fans.  I just don't buy that they care all that much about Sam/Mercedes shipper's feelings when they openly mocked about every fan base out there including one where one half if the pairing is dead.  

 

Sure Mercedes "giving her blessing" ends Sam/Mercedes but I have no illusion that they are doing it all to try and let Sam/Mercedes fans down easy.  They are doing it to clear the path for Sam/Rachel as cleanly as possible.  It is as cheap and contrived as making Brody a gigolo to clear a path for Finn/Rachel.  

 

This is what I'm saying. The last two episodes the writers spent it baiting and mocking one of, if not, the biggest ship on the show right now. So I really don't see what is so special about Samcedes fans that the writers wouldn't do the same with them, especially since they have nothing to lose or gain by doing that. 

 

By saying that the writers are showing special consideration to Samcedes fans make me feel people are just saying that so they can feel better about shipping Samchel or because they don't want people to think badly of Rachel/Sam. Because the writers are showing no consideration for either Samcedes or Mercedes fans. 

[rlj67]

That Brad tweet doesn't indicate anything definite re Samcedes, he left it wide open to interpret, unlike Ryan who after S3 said no Samcedes in s4, there is a reason why the hypnosis has not been resolved, its an out they can use

[Hookian]

That Brad tweet doesn't indicate anything definite re Samcedes, he left it wide open to interpret, unlike Ryan who after S3 said no Samcedes in s4, there is a reason why the hypnosis has not been resolved, its an out they can use

... Except if you watched the last episode you would see that Rachel literally snapped him out of it. Did you miss that part? When he goes to kiss her and she snaps her finger and he wakes up?

 

The stuff he doesn't remember is him kissing Rachel, him trying to steal Will's mail, and giving the horrible sheet music to Rachel. Everything else is him. Even the dinner date until Rachel said the trigger word was him.

 

The hypnosis is resolved. Sue let go of the "rage fork" and felt elated and happy again and closed "The Hurt Locker". Everything this point and onward is completely Sam.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Hookian

[Hana Chan]

Given that Sam pronounced love for Brittany, enough to fight Santana for her and thought that they were marrying before he got back together with Mercedes and pronounced his love for her, enough that he was willing to forgo sex until she as ready, it's hard to take this newfound love for Rachel at all seriously. Personally, if I was a Rachel fan, I would be pissed that the best that the show could come up with for a prospective love interest after the death of Cory/Finn is the sloppy seconds of every other girl in the group. Since I'm not and I have to stomach Kurt being permanently tied to that overgrown toddler he's going to get married to, let Rachel settle for Tweedle Dumber Than A Rock.

 

With Mercedes, I'm more upset as a matter of principle that again the full figured black girl is going to lose out to the petite white girl and will "graciously" bow out regardless of her own feelings so that she won't stand in the way of tru wuv (at least this incarnation of tru wuv in Sam's perspective).

[LydiaMoon1]

Well it looks like they're gonna shit all over Tike so apparently only white people get their high school sweetheart. Except Santana who'd marrying a white girl!

This is no surprise considering that in six seasons neither Tina nor Mercedes got homes or parents or families.   Hell, Mercedes had to live with TWO white guys in NY in order to stop being homeless.

 

With Mercedes, I'm more upset as a matter of principle that again the full figured black girl is going to lose out to the petite white girl and will "graciously" bow out regardless of her own feelings so that she won't stand in the way of tru wuv (at least this incarnation of tru wuv in Sam's perspective).

 

For real.  I can't even count all the distastful tropes the Glee writers are fulfilling with this BS.

 

[Ceeg]

Unless Glee does a flashforward, I think it's pretty obvious that Kurt and Blaine will end up divorced in 3 years or less, and Sam and Rachel will break-up due to whatever circumstance and Sam will move on to the next woman from Glee with a heartbeat, and no one can convince me otherwise. Tina better watch out for Sam, I think she's the last original Glee Clubber that he hasn't dated.

[camussie]

With Mercedes, I'm more upset as a matter of principle that again the full figured black girl is going to lose out to the petite white girl and will "graciously" bow out regardless of her own feelings so that she won't stand in the way of tru wuv (at least this incarnation of tru wuv in Sam's perspective).

 

 

But but she gets to sing "All About the Bass" in 607 to let us know she is full-figured, black, and don't need no man!  Meanwhile Sam/Rachel are going to sing "Time After Time."   (badly would be my guess unless the producers step back from their insistence that Lea belt when it isn't necessary).  

Edited February 2, 2015 by camussie

[Hookian]

Unless Glee does a flashforward, I think it's pretty obvious that Kurt and Blaine will end up divorced in 3 years or less, and Sam and Rachel will break-up due to whatever circumstance and Sam will move on to the next woman from Glee with a heartbeat, and no one can convince me otherwise. Tina better watch out for Sam, I think she's the last original Glee Clubber that he hasn't dated.

 

I think if Glee does a FF it will be Klaine and Sam(engaged/married) to Rachel in the audience watching Rachel win a Tony or something like that. Jesse could be in the audience as well as her co-star but i personally think he's coming back for VA.

 

One thing is for sure though and we can avoid this whole Samchel topic. Becca specifically said that in 5 weeks it's there next competition. That basically confirms that like with the front 13 the final 13 will end with Sectionals. Episode 13 is Sectionals, that's the episode Groff returns in. I doubt Will is gonna be the coach for VA at Sectionals.

[fakeempress]

 

Tina better watch out for Sam, I think she's the last original Glee Clubber that he hasn't dated.

Lol true! They are halfway there, they have macked 

Edited February 2, 2015 by fakeempress

[Hookian]

But but she gets to sing "All About the Bass" in 607 to let us know she is full-figured, black, and don't need no man!  

 

She sings All About that Bass with Roderick and is going to sound epic on it. Who cares what the context, those two voices will sound like sex together.

[Cranberry]

Clearly they're giving us Sam/Rachel now so that they can end it before the series finale -- this is a transitional relationship (a rebound, in other words) to help Rachel get back on the horse (so to speak) before she's ready to really date again. It's actually kind of perfect, because Sam is "Finn-lite," so it's a way for her to be with someone "safe" and similar to Finn for a little while until she's ready to really let go and move on to the next chapter of her life. Probably with Jesse, because we know he's coming back.

 

...see how a person can justify anything and sound absolutely certain of it? But of course I have no more proof of that ending than anyone does of a Sam/Rachel ending, so stating all of that as fact would be silly.

[camussie]

You may not care about the context but i do so that answers that question.  As for Roderick sounding epic, did he suddenly develop some passion in his singing because so far I have been much less than impressed.  He hits the notes but there is little emotion there.  

 

As for endgame I think it could go either way.  One thing that gives me pause is Rachel's first description of Sam as a romantic partner is that he is "safe."  That doesn't sound like love for the ages.  It sounds more like she feels comfortable enough with him to dip her toes into the dating pool by seeing him.  Another thing that gives me pause is after them sitting together at the wedding in 608 I don't know if any spoilers for them beyond a some group scenes with others.

 

Like I said it could go either way though.  

Edited February 2, 2015 by camussie

[jaytee1812]

But but she gets to sing "All About the Bass" in 607 to let us know she is full-figured, black, and don't need no man!  Meanwhile Sam/Rachel are going to sing "Time After Time."   (badly would be my guess unless the producers step back from their insistence that Lea belt when it isn't necessary).

It so offensive Mercedes is sing All About That Bass, especially since it's a song written by a white girl who claims she 'started the booty movement'. Yes she actually said those words.

[rlj67]

All of Sam's romantic gestures were orchestrated by Sue, Sam doesn't know it, Rachel doesn't know, therefore unresolved.  All Sam knows is he blacks out and comes on to Rachel, he may think he has real feelings LMAO. 

[Hookian]

Clearly they're giving us Sam/Rachel now so that they can end it before the series finale -- this is a transitional relationship (a rebound, in other words) to help Rachel get back on the horse (so to speak) before she's ready to really date again. It's actually kind of perfect, because Sam is "Finn-lite," so it's a way for her to be with someone "safe" and similar to Finn for a little while until she's ready to really let go and move on to the next chapter of her life. Probably with Jesse, because we know he's coming back.

 

...see how a person can justify anything and sound absolutely certain of it? But of course I have no more proof of that ending than anyone does of a Sam/Rachel ending, so stating all of that as fact would be silly.

 

If she's gonna fall in love with Sam which is the indication I highly doubt this is a rebound relationship sorry. Oh and Jesse. Jesse hasn't been on Rachel's romantic radar since S1. She used him to make Finn jealous in S2 and she hasn't spoken his name in 3 seasons on the show. Meanwhile she's actually falling in love w/ Sam. I mean... yeah sure it's a rebound relationship. *sarcasm*

[jaytee1812]

Unless Glee does a flashforward, I think it's pretty obvious that Kurt and Blaine will end up divorced in 3 years or less, and Sam and Rachel will break-up due to whatever circumstance and Sam will move on to the next woman from Glee with a heartbeat, and no one can convince me otherwise. Tina better watch out for Sam, I think she's the last original Glee Clubber that he hasn't dated.

[Cranberry]

If she's gonna fall in love with Sam which is the indication I highly doubt this is a rebound relationship sorry. Oh and Jesse. Jesse hasn't been on Rachel's romantic radar since S1. She used him to make Finn jealous in S2 and she hasn't spoken his name in 3 seasons on the show. Meanwhile she's actually falling in love w/ Sam. I mean... yeah sure it's a rebound relationship. *sarcasm*

 

You missed the entire point of my post, which was that anyone can state any old theory as fact and that doesn't make it true. I came up with that spec off the top of my head and don't believe it any more than I believe any other possible ending.

[jaytee1812]

Tina better watch out for Sam, I think she's the last original Glee Clubber that he hasn't dated.

My head canon said they had really bad sex that night and Tina's used to better from Mike so wouldn't go near him again!

[Hookian]

All of Sam's romantic gestures were orchestrated by Sue, Sam doesn't know it, Rachel doesn't know, therefore unresolved.  All Sam knows is he blacks out and comes on to Rachel, he may think he has real feelings LMAO. 

 

Yes we know this and in this episode they explore those feelings they think they may or may not have for each other and an interested third party aka Mercedes pushes things in the right direction. 

Meanwhile, despite agreeing to stay just friends, Rachel and Sam try to negotiate bigger feelings they may or may not have for each other, but it takes the advice of an interested third party to move things along

 

So that's what he and Rachel are both spending this episode on. But clearly in the next episode it's no longer thinking at all. 

Edited February 2, 2015 by Hookian

[Ceeg]

She sings All About that Bass with Roderick and is going to sound epic on it. Who cares what the context, those two voices will sound like sex together.

 

Naya sounded great on I Kissed A Girl too. That doesn't make it any less offensive.

[jaytee1812]

She sings All About that Bass with Roderick and is going to sound epic on it. Who cares what the context, those two voices will sound like sex together.

Well at least their keeping Roderick away from great songs, that's one blessing. Cos he hasn't sounded epic on anything yet, unless you mean epically bad!

[Hookian]

Can we move along to Becca's confirmation that Sectionals is in 5 weeks which points in line to episode 13, the same episode Jesse is returning in. They're ending the final 13 the way they ended the front 13, Sectionals. Since from spoilers we know that Sectionals has not been filmed yet and they're on 12 which is probably the final build up to Sectionals.

 

Will after the last episode will not be the VA coach at Sectionals, he will be fired before then. So with Jesse returning makes sense who the new coach will be and it's someone VA would probably want as their coach.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Hookian

[Cranberry]

If you're going to state things as fact (such as Will being fired or Jesse being VA's new coach), cite them. Yes, you could very well be right, but we don't know that yet, and we want to differentiate between confirmed spoilers and spec. (This goes for everyone, btw. I don't want to have to close this and make a "spoilers only, no discussion" topic.)

[Craphole Island]

For the record, Cranberry's "spec" is exactly how Samchel should go IMO! I know your post was mostly making a point, but I think that's the best way for this to go.

[jaytee1812]

Yes we know this and in this episode they explore those feelings they think they may or may not have for each other and an interested third party aka Mercedes pushes things in the right direction. 

You do understand no-one is doubting that, but it doesn't make it less offensive. It doesn't matter how this storyline goes, it's rooted in an offensive racist trope.

I thought glee had outdone itself with racist tropes during the whole Marley/Jake/Bree thing, but apparently not.

[LydiaMoon1]

Glee can (and will) always go lower.

[Lovecat]

[W]e want to differentiate between confirmed spoilers and spec. (This goes for everyone, btw. I don't want to have to close this and make a "spoilers only, no discussion" topic.)

Oh my god, please do.

[rlj67]

Yes we know this and in this episode they explore those feelings they think they may or may not have for each other and an interested third party aka Mercedes pushes things in the right direction. 

So that's what he and Rachel are both spending this episode on. But clearly in the next episode it's no longer thinking at all. 

Then y in ep7 is Sam looking at a board full of pics of mostly Mercedes, lookīng all lost as he holds a pic of Rachcedes, not so cut and dry mho.  Look how they ended 5, Kline staring at each other while stares all lovelorn at Sam who is jamming to the music not even acknowledging Rachel

 

Not doubting something is gonna happen between Sam/Rachel, they might have sex but nothing screams a great romance is a coming.

 

Judging from the ntel Chord is not in ep 9 or 10 and in 11 he has scenes with Lea and Amber together and separately, he and Amber did the park scene the Friday before last.

[fakeempress]

 

Yes we know this and in this episode they explore those feelings they think they may or may not have for each other and an interested third party aka Mercedes pushes things in the right direction.

And this is as open to discussion as anything, discussion is in the thread's heading last I checked. 

[Cranberry]

I can leave this topic and also make one for spoilers only, if you guys would like that! I wasn't sure there was any demand. It would certainly be nice to have a place to see confirmed spoilers without having to sort through pages and pages of spec and debate.

[Lovecat]

I was kind of being snarky, but yeah, if others would be interested in a spoilers without speculation thread, I'd be totally on board. Better than wading through the Sam/Rachel/Mercedes whatever for the eleventy billionth time.

[Cranberry]

Well, let's give it a try.

[ComfySweater]

It's probably bunnies.

[Hookian]

Then y in ep7 is Sam looking at a board full of pics of mostly Mercedes, lookīng all lost as he holds a pic of Rachcedes, not so cut and dry mho.  Look how they ended 5, Kline staring at each other while stares all lovelorn at Sam who is jamming to the music not even acknowledging Rachel

 

Not doubting something is gonna happen between Sam/Rachel, they might have sex but nothing screams a great romance is a coming.

 

Judging from the ntel Chord is not in ep 9 or 10 and in 11 he has scenes with Lea and Amber together and separately, he and Amber did the park scene the Friday before last.

 

Okay no no you have your facts twisted big time. 

 

1st of all I'm gonna stop and tell you Chord is indeed in episode 10. He's also in 11 and the one who did the park scene was Chord and Lea we have this confirmed from the GF source whom is legit as well as a person whom did the tour at Paramount that day and saw Chord and Lea film at the park. It was not Amber in the scene, I have no idea where you got that info but it's incorrect. 

S

omebody who went on the Paramount tour today posted on the Klaine spoiler thread. This is part of their post. There's a park area over there. Community used to use it for their quad I think.

The tour guide said Lea was filming with "one of the guys" by the theater. Since we were on the other side of the gate, we couldn't see anything at that time. However, we then caught a glimpse of Lea and Chord in front of the fountain. They walked past the fountain in front of the gate, stopped for a selfie, and then kept walking. It was really quick. I'm guessing this was probably the park scene.

 

 

http://www.gleeforum.com/index.php/topic/38659-samrachel-spoilers/page-117

 

The only scene we know Amber has filmed in 10 is a scene around a table in the teachers lounge with Darren, Chord, and Lea which was tweeted on the 23rd of January. No other scenes for her have been confirmed. She also has not been spotted on set for 11, according to the GF source whereas Chord and Lea have and have filmed multiple stuff together. Also Chord was in the studio for that episode as well. The director even posted a pic of them on instagram.

 

Also the still in the room is probably when they're all packing the room, it's scene 25. It's very likely that this scene leads into the Time After Time duet between Sam and Rachel. There is also no mention of a love triangle at all in the episode 7 synopsis just the romantic tension between Samchel boiling over. So to me it is pretty cut and dry. Samcedes gets resolved in 6 and she pushes Sam and Rachel in the right direction towards each other. 

Edited February 2, 2015 by Hookian

[camussie]

And I am going to correct you. There has not been mention of multiple Sam/Rachel scenes for 611.  There have been mention  of group scenes that include Sam and Rachel but not Sam/Rachel alone scenes.  Now there very well be some but that isn't in what we have for spoilers so far.  

 

As far as the park scene from the spoilers I read it has Sam and Rachel but there was some question if Blaine and/or Kurt were there.  Mercedes definitely wasn't though.  

Edited February 2, 2015 by camussie

[Sunshiner]

Judging from the ntel Chord is not in ep 9 or 10 and in 11 he has scenes with Lea and Amber together and separately, he and Amber did the park scene the Friday before last.

What is the intel for the chord and amber scenes, according to the gleeforum and people on a paramount tour said that Lea and chord filmed at the park no mention of amber during that filming.

 

I still think samcedes is endgame i just wonder what type of endgame they´ll get is is a quick  min scene during 613 or will it be a bigger thing idk.

I always assumed that Sectionals would be the end, especially when it was clear that there would be no original get together.

I still cannot believe that Glee will end without the orginals  - you just don´t end a series like that. They have had 12 episodes to finish the storylines and then use episode 13 to tie a pretty bow around it. They should celebrate the people that made the series the huge success that it was and that aint just rachel, sam and klaine jmo.

[jaytee1812]

I still cannot believe that Glee will end without the orginals - you just don´t end a series like that. They have had 12 episodes to finish the storylines and then use episode 13 to tie a pretty bow around it. They should celebrate the people that made the series the huge success that it was and that aint just rachel, sam and klaine jmo.

I think the people in charge do think their success is down to Rachel, Sam and Blaine, and probably Sue. I think they use Will and Kurt as secondary characters and the rest are there to be used as props.

[camussie]

On another topic given that they are doing sectionals as the last competition that means we are still in the fall of 2014.  That means from May 2014 to let's say September (4 months):

• Rachel filmed a show, it tanked, she hid out for a while, and came back to Lima
• Kurt/Blaine lived together for a hot second before it became too much and Blaine apparently flunked out of NYADA during the summer.  Then he returned to Lima and hooked up with Dave. 
• Mercedes/Sam went from declaring their love and Rachel calling them soul mates to Rachel wanting Sam for herself and Mercedes saying you go girl (all while snapping sassily).  To be fair this is a whole 5 months.

 

Up next we have Beiste transitioning to Sheldon within a few weeks. Lord they have just given up at Glee.  Not even trying to keep this show with any sense of internal logic.

Edited February 3, 2015 by camussie

[jaytee1812]

Doesn't gender reassignment surgery take years?

[camussie]

I am not sure of how long but it certainly isn't an easy process.  Takes quite a while.  Longer than 4-5 weeks.

[Sunshiner]

Doesn't gender reassignment surgery take years?

I don´t think it takes years but id go along with at least a few months until you are completly healed and ready to return to work.

 

Im not onboard with the sheldon storyline cause Glee told me for years that Beiste was a woman that felt pretty and like a real woman eventhough she didn´t maybe look like a tradiontal woman but this is Glee and things change very rapidly it seems.

[tom87]

On another topic given that they are doing sectionals as the last competition that means we are still in the fall of 2014.  That means from May 2014 to let's say September (4 months):

• Rachel filmed a show, it tanked, hid out for a while, and came back to Lima
• Kurt/Blaine lived together for a hot second before it became too much and Blaine apparently flunked out of NYADA during the summer.  Then returned to Lima and hooked up with Dave. 
• Mercedes/sam going from declaring their love and Rachel calling them soul-mates to Rachel wanting Sam for herself and Mercedes saying you go girl (all while snapping sassily).  To be fair this is a whole 5 months.

 

Up next we will have then we have Beiste transitioning to sheldon within a few weeks. Lord they have just given up at Glee at trying to keep this show with any sense of internal logic.

 

To confirm  - Sue had that stupid Klaine calendar that indicated that episode 5 was in October.

Edited February 2, 2015 by tom87

[jaytee1812]

[*]Mercedes/sam going from declaring their love and Rachel calling them soul-mates to Rachel wanting Sam for herself and Mercedes saying you go girl (all while snapping sassily). To be fair this is a whole 5 months.

Five months without a woman is decades in Sam time.