Spoilers, Speculation & All Things Media!

[madmaverick]

As far as the writers having their fun I mean look you know I'm not a Nathan hater, but just like other actors he's a pain in the ass. I know how writers think so I'm pretty sue whoever in the room came up with spider torture did it gleefully. It's little things like that.

 

Do tell when you find an actor who isn't a pain. :P

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they were gleeful about the spider torture.  Possibly also gleeful about Alexis vamping it up.  I think writers generally take pleasure in 'shock and awe' (how I hate that phrase).  Spider torture was an example of that, along with the waterboarding previously.  I wish writers would write torture responsibly but... ;)  

 

OT: I think Firefly writers also had their fun when they made Nathan get naked wearing only a sock puppet over his man parts with Joss' face on it and invited an audience hee.

 

If the Castle writers really wanted to have their 'fun' with the actors, perhaps they could write a hot naked love scene so viewers could have some fun as well. ;)

[verdana]

Plus I've got news for everyone. Stana wanted this. She wanted something for her character to do, a conflict. She didn't want to play one half of a happy couple solving crimes. The fans can be mad about it all they want but she doesn't want to be Stefanie Powers 2.0

I'm glad you mentioned this because it always amuses me when I see fans weeping and wailing over poor perfect unicorn Stana being hoodwinked by the nasty network into doing this story against her will.  If I was in Stana and the showrunners told me Beckett would be given more focus, a new storyline that was ongoing all season and different actors to work with more frequently I'd be very happy indeed. 

[westwingfan]

It was a contract thing for both of them. When it was reported Stana would appear in every episode it didn't mean she would film during each one. She had one off for the movie and second one,because she just wanted it.

As far as the writers having their fun I mean look you know I'm not a Nathan hater, but just like other actors he's a pain in the ass. I know how writers think so I'm pretty sue whoever in the room came up with spider torture did it gleefully. It's little things like that.

But TPW and Hawley giving Stana a story where she feels she gets to act is not some woman hating revenge. It's giving your lead actress what she wants even if it's at the expense of fans.

I can understand the actors wanting something to do other than spew out repetitive lines, Seamus' feelings have been fairly clear for the last couple of seasons, and Tamala is always going to be known as Lividity Lanie LOL. I can't say I would have been happy about any storyline that broke up our disfunctional couple before their first wedding anniversary, but the reason they have come up with and the manner of its execution so far has me not believing that Caskett should even be a couple so toxic do I see Beckett's character now.

When Stana commented to Deadline that the season would "delve into what inspired Beckett to become a cop in the first place" I had a discussion with some friends about what more was there for us to know. Surely it was clear cut that her life had been turned upside down by her mother's murder setting her on a different path to seek justice, and after two year long bouts of therapy and Castle entering her life she was finally able to have the kind of relationship that she'd always wanted, but now we find that this is a much deeper problem so that it is going to take something spectacular from the writers to convince me that whenever Castle takes her back this isn't something that could rear it's head anytime the show needs another shake up, that's supposing I haven't given up on the show before then. All this is pretty academic I guess if S8 is the last.

[madmaverick]

I'll pose the question at midseason, but I'll be wondering whether people are more satisfied with what TPW/AH served up or what Marlowe served up during the season of wedding planning for the wedding that was never to be.  Or whatever Marlowe's worst half season was in your view.  I get that many people don't like the break up storyline, but is anyone bored yet?

 

If I was in Stana and the showrunners told me Beckett would be given more focus, a new storyline that was ongoing all season and different actors to work with more frequently I'd be very happy indeed.

 

Plus a big pay raise and more time off?  Where can I get that job? ;)

 

Hal, do you have any idea how that Aubrey Plaza voicework as Lucy came about?  Figuring that was a favour for a friend or something like that.

[KaveDweller]

It was a contract thing for both of them. When it was reported Stana would appear in every episode it didn't mean she would film during each one. She had one off for the movie and second one,because she just wanted it.

As far as the writers having their fun I mean look you know I'm not a Nathan hater, but just like other actors he's a pain in the ass. I know how writers think so I'm pretty sue whoever in the room came up with spider torture did it gleefully. It's little things like that.

But TPW and Hawley giving Stana a story where she feels she gets to act is not some woman hating revenge. It's giving your lead actress what she wants even if it's at the expense of fans.

Well in theory a good writer should be able to give their actors what they want without upsetting the fans too much. A good writer also shouldn't let actors dictate story lines (I'm not saying I think that's what happened, I just mean in general). It is all about balance. But not everyone who writes for TV is a good writer.

I agree that it's crazy to try and turn Stana into a victim. I really like Stana and all (although I'm sure she's not perfect), but some of her die-hard fans seem less then respectful of her. It's like when she was auctioning off that stuff and they bought it to give back to her because they "knew" she really wanted to keep it.

[verdana]

I hope they aren't doing something too over the top and have her go missing/rouge again. Because that would just make her look incompetent, and how can she keep her Captain rank at that point? And I don't really want to sees storyline of her totally screwing up and getting demoted either, I want her to come to her senses before anything ridiculous happens.

May be she's just gone on holiday to spend time with her dad or she has to go on a training course? I guess that's kind of boring but they could easily get rid of her and it not be a big deal. 

 

It's like when she was auctioning off that stuff and they bought it to give back to her because they "knew" she really wanted to keep it.

 

That was creepy. 

[Sara2009]

I get the feeling that all actors are somewhat narcissistic. Some are worse than others, but they all have large egos.

[westwingfan]

Not to turn this into another ratings debate and I'm keeping the promise I made not on defend the story to people I knew would hate it BUT...

The goal of a writer is to make people care. Not to make them feel good or happy. Somewhere that has gotten lost.

Now once people don't care and I mean truly...the ratings drop to below 1.0, this entire thread has no posts, no Twitter or facebook posts, low +3 numbers, then I will agree that they failed and were bad at writing Castle.

I can't sign on for bad writers across the board for these two guys yet. Marti Noxox yes, bad bad bad bad writer.

I'm struggling to care about Caskett at the moment, but I'm not sure many of us are ready to go cold turkey yet, so the discussion could go on well past the demise of the show. LOL

[KaveDweller]

I find it interesting that you can accept that even while hating the story. So that leads me to believe those things don't go hand in hand.

 

I know you weren't responding to me, but I think they definitely don't go hand in hand.  It's just a matter of being able to separate the actors from the characters.

 

May be she's just gone on holiday to spend time with her dad or she has to go on a training course? I guess that's kind of boring but they could easily get rid of her and it not be a big deal. 

 

Maybe they send her to rehab for her Obsessive Justice Disorder?

 

Not to turn this into another ratings debate and I'm keeping the promise I made not on defend the story to people I knew would hate it BUT...

The goal of a writer is to make people care. Not to make them feel good or happy. Somewhere that has gotten lost.

 

Well, the writers have definitely made me care, so we'll give them that.  And I do think that the split had added a new energy to all the Caskett scenes that I really enjoyed.  I wish they'd gone about it slightly differently, but I definitely don't feel apathy.  We'll see if that lasts all season.

[CastleSeason8]

For me everything looks sucky. The show i watch shouldnt make me sad. And sad in a way that is a longing for what once was and missed opportunities. It could be so much better...

[verdana]

And they've finished 8.08 with Baldwin and Fillion:

 

Alexi Hawley @AlexiHawley  2h2 hours ago
4 yrs later, we are wrapped on another gem with @NathanFillion and @AdamBaldwin #Castle #DetectiveSlaughterisback

https://twitter.com/AlexiHawley/status/651876953994100736

 

[verdana]

Starting 8.07 and the much anticipated Mr and Mrs Castle episode, pity about Roum. 

Andrew Bikichky ‏@AndrewBikichky  9h9 hours ago
#Castle Ep807
Dir. Jeff Bleckner
Script Christine Roum

 

[BellyLaughter]

Can't say I'm really looking forward to the return of Detective McDouchebag and his punching bag, Castle......hope the story allows Castle to grow a pair this time and stand up for himself and if there isn't a call back to Slaughter's threats to Castle about creating a character for his books based on him I will be annoyed.

[verdana]

Amanda ‏@TinkonBrink  Oct 6

Is there a campaign or petition for regular NON-WIG Beckett #HairPorn? #please #Castle

 

I see we are not alone in our desires to start a petition. 

[TWP]

Not sure if I needed to put my whole comment in spoiler tags, but I did anyway.

 

Maybe it's time for Castle to move into a secure building?  http://images.spoilertv.com/castle/Season%208/Promotional%20Episode%20Photos/Episode%208.05%20-%20The%20Nose/140736_1933.jpg.php

 

...or at least look through the peephole before answering the door?

 

No wonder Beckett worries about his safety.  But leaving him?  Not such a good way to help with that.

 

(h/t Verdana for the link to photos).

 

Question:  The guy in this photo is someone related to the case and not to Beckett and Locksat?

Edited October 8, 2015 by TVWithPity

[TWP]

The way the ratings have started this season, a Fall finale that is Beckett lite and includes Baldwin hardly sounds like the episode to revive things, more likely to be the death knell. Most likely event during the hiatus I would have thought is for ABC to announce the show will end after S8, and I would have thought, thankfully, that a spin off is not on the cards because aren't they normally launched off the back of a successful, thriving parent, which Castle hardly is at this stage. Doesn't look like Nathan will get his wish for the show to go out on top. Good luck to Nathan in his next project but it will be successful without me as I won't be watching. I can't imagine anyone else playing Castle, and I'm grateful for the enjoyment the show has given me but I have no interest in watching anything else he does in the future. The way this season is progressing then the S7 finale will sadly become my series finale.

 

I guess I was more thinking, let's spin Castle down and spin something else up for Fillion.  It doesn't have to be a true Castle spinoff. Fillion took the Castle job via a sort of open contract he had with ABC.  With his latest renewal, I heard he signed for 2 years.  If Castle ends while he has another year left in his contract, maybe they'd move him to something new. I suspect Fillion's next role will likely be fairly far outside of the Castle genre, more fantasy/sci fi.  I think that's where his passion lies, even as Castle was successful for him.  Now he has the money and fame to do what he wants.

 

I suspect Stana wants to spin something up as well, and knows that ABC wouldn't make that happen if she up and quit Castle.  It looks bad if you don't ride these things out to the end, but I have a sneaking suspicion they've agreed to transition her out.  I was looking at her upcoming movies.  None seem outside the indie category.  It'll be interesting to see what she does next.

 

I'm with you.  The show is over.  I watched x1, fast forwarded through x2 and didn't watch x3. If I want misery, I'll call my sister, LOL.  I can't wait for the PTB to figure out what you and I already know and end this so I can see what the stars do next.  I'm so curious.

Edited October 8, 2015 by TVWithPity

[Chado]

That's my whole thing. Is anger actually a bad thing? Is Castle while it's not his fault, fighting for his wife a bad thing? Instead of ya know looking bored and kissing Gates?

I thought people wanted to see a not so passive Rick. I know I read that here before ;)

Is everyone having a moment of "careful what you wish for" or just so mad about the break up that everything looks sucky?

Anger is not a bad thing, I'd prefer to see it from Castle.

 

What can be more passive than Castle essentially stuck waiting for Beckett to decide he is worth her time again?

 

It's incredible to think that they are going into a fall finale and numerous month break with an episode that doesn't feature Beckett at all.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Chado

[KaveDweller]

What can be more passive than Castle essentially stuck waiting for Beckett to decide he is worth her time again?

 

Except he's not waiting.  If he was waiting he wouldn't be showing up at her job, interfering with her cases, and continually questioning her about something she keeps saying she doesn't want to talk about.  

[WendyCR72]

And I believe it was said Ms. Katic will be in every episode. Maybe it won't be as much as some like, but no sense in borrowing trouble there.

[Chado]

Except he's not waiting.  If he was waiting he wouldn't be showing up at her job, interfering with her cases, and continually questioning her about something she keeps saying she doesn't want to talk about.  

He is. At some point he will realize that his actions are doing nothing (he doesn't even understand why it's happening) and his options are to continue to wait or walk away.

 

He's questioning her because he doesn't understand what has happened. He thinks showing her their case solving ability together is going to change something, it won't. What is left for him to do once he finds out the truth? Wait until he can convince her otherwise or admit things aren't going to change and walk away.

 

You may say he's not being passive, be he is stuck waiting. No action he does is going to change anything because he doesn't even know WHY she has left.

[Badsamaritan]

I do hate it, I did stop watching, and I am a Nielsen family.

For me it's both the idea and execution. This isn't the 90s or early 2000s, there are so many other shows on so many platforms to watch, spinning new ideas and setups that I think the tv tropes of yore are not satisfactory any longer. The audience is smarter, so showrunners going back to a well of stupid tropes is kind of insulting. And the more they talk about it in the media and try to explain their 'vision', all I hear is blah, blah, blah, bullshit.

As far as the execution, it's as I said this summer and others have stated, it's illogical that Kate would break up but still have any kind of contact with Castle. That single sticking point is what has burst the illusion and taken me out of any story they try to spin. It is the question and statement that is always at the forefront, stopping me from seeing or feeling anything else. It makes me think the showrunners think I'm completely stupid, or that they can feed me any piece of garbage and I'm just supposed to trust them.

I HATE it when a show I've invested this many years in insults my intelligence in order to play out their own hubris. Of course they have every right to do so, just like I have every right to say fuck all y'all, I'm out.

And that's why Castle viewing is no longer counted in my house. You don't get rewarded for stupid storytelling.

[Castle75]

I do hate it, I did stop watching, and I am a Nielsen family.

For me it's both the idea and execution. This isn't the 90s or early 2000s, there are so many other shows on so many platforms to watch, spinning new ideas and setups that I think the tv tropes of yore are not satisfactory any longer. The audience is smarter, so showrunners going back to a well of stupid tropes is kind of insulting. And the more they talk about it in the media and try to explain their 'vision', all I hear is blah, blah, blah, bullshit.

As far as the execution, it's as I said this summer and others have stated, it's illogical that Kate would break up but still have any kind of contact with Castle. That single sticking point is what has burst the illusion and taken me out of any story they try to spin. It is the question and statement that is always at the forefront, stopping me from seeing or feeling anything else. It makes me think the showrunners think I'm completely stupid, or that they can feed me any piece of garbage and I'm just supposed to trust them.

I HATE it when a show I've invested this many years in insults my intelligence in order to play out their own hubris. Of course they have every right to do so, just like I have every right to say fuck all y'all, I'm out.

And that's why Castle viewing is no longer counted in my house. You don't get rewarded for stupid storytelling.

Off topic, but since you brought up being a Nielsen family. How does the ratings box work? I've always been interested and would love to hear from an actual user? Connected to all tvs in the household? Does it send info daily, weekly? Thanks for any info.

[oberon55]

Not to turn this into another ratings debate and I'm keeping the promise I made not to defend the story to people I knew would hate it BUT...

The goal of a writer is to make people care. Not to make them feel good or happy. Somewhere that has gotten lost.

 

If they really think pissing their audience off is a good thing then they must consider "For Better or Worse" the best episode they have ever written.

[femmefan1946]

I suspect Fillion's next role will likely be fairly far outside of the Castle genre, more fantasy/sci fi.

 

Voting for the SPECTRUM reboot! (I've almost given up on original cast Firefly. Maybe Firefly Next Generation with Emma Washburne as pilot.)

 

It would be late to the SF/horror/supernatural/fantasy festival that network television has been immersed in for some years.

[VinceW]

I do hate it, I did stop watching, and I am a Nielsen family.

For me it's both the idea and execution. This isn't the 90s or early 2000s, there are so many other shows on so many platforms to watch, spinning new ideas and setups that I think the tv tropes of yore are not satisfactory any longer. The audience is smarter, so showrunners going back to a well of stupid tropes is kind of insulting. And the more they talk about it in the media and try to explain their 'vision', all I hear is blah, blah, blah, bullshit.

As far as the execution, it's as I said this summer and others have stated, it's illogical that Kate would break up but still have any kind of contact with Castle. That single sticking point is what has burst the illusion and taken me out of any story they try to spin. It is the question and statement that is always at the forefront, stopping me from seeing or feeling anything else. It makes me think the showrunners think I'm completely stupid, or that they can feed me any piece of garbage and I'm just supposed to trust them.

I HATE it when a show I've invested this many years in insults my intelligence in order to play out their own hubris. Of course they have every right to do so, just like I have every right to say fuck all y'all, I'm out.

And that's why Castle viewing is no longer counted in my house. You don't get rewarded for stupid storytelling.

 

I expect that the fan backlash factor will show up in the viewership numbers quickly after the next few ‘fun’ episodes. If the separation lasts beyond the extended hiatus and into the February sweeps period, Castle and Beckett will have been separated for a longer period of time than they have actually been married which is pretty ridiculous. The story that seems to be unfolding is the strangest TV marriage in recent memory. Hawley’s comment “What can we do to make this thing feel new again? “ doesn’t justify what has been presented so far to viewers, but it is definitely a new approach . In 8x3, viewers discover that none of the precinct team members know why Kate walked out on her marriage besides “to take some space”. While Beckett knows that Castle is hurt by her actions, she refuses to talk about it. I doubt that fans will have much patience with this story line given what has been forthcoming from the upcoming promos. After three episodes, viewers still have not seen Beckett working from her new office which would exemplify her promotion.

Edited October 9, 2015 by VinceW

[westwingfan]

I expect that the viewer insult factor will show up in the viewership numbers quickly after the next few ‘fun’ episodes. If the separation lasts beyond the extended hiatus and into the February sweeps period, Castle and Beckett will have been separated for a longer period of time than they have actually been married which is pretty ridiculous. The story that seems to be unfolding is the strangest TV marriage in recent memory. Hawley’s comment “What can we do to make this thing feel new again? “ can’t possibly justify what has been presented so far to viewers, but it  is definitely a new approach .  All the precinct team members know for now is that Kate  just walked out on her marriage to “take some space” and Beckett knows Castle is hurt, but she won’t talk about it. I doubt that fans will have much patience with this storyline given what has been forthcoming about the upcoming episodes. After three episodes, viewers still have not seen Beckett working from her new office which would exemplify her promotion.

I think that will be rectified in the next episode if the promo pics are anything to go by, and it appears Martha pays her a visit at the precinct too from a BTS pic during filming, not sure we will see Beckett outside the precinct much in the episode but at least she's wearing a skirt. I know, I'm very shallow. LOL

[CastleSeason8]

I get what ur saying Hal, but if u look at say TV line the Castle articles are getting triple comments compared to other shows. Id say at least 90% are extremely negative. Dont u want people to like ur show and want to watch it instead of constant bashing. Fb is teeming with neg chatter. They say any press is good press but they really cant afford any more fan loss. Maybe i just dont understand the nature of the game but when ur audience is just putting in time to get to a certain result, it doesnt make sense to me. Thats why Im not in the entertainment business!!

[VinceW]

I get what ur saying Hal, but if u look at say TV line the Castle articles are getting triple comments compared to other shows. Id say at least 90% are extremely negative. Dont u want people to like ur show and want to watch it instead of constant bashing. Fb is teeming with neg chatter. They say any press is good press but they really cant afford any more fan loss. Maybe i just dont understand the nature of the game but when ur audience is just putting in time to get to a certain result, it doesnt make sense to me.the Thats why Im not in the entertainment business!!

It is not just fan comments, but some of the once objective TV critics in both the print and digital media are adding to the negativity in a big way. Some suggesting that the show is not worth watching any longer because it appears that the new producers are ignoring the show's history.

Edited October 8, 2015 by VinceW

[madmaverick]

Castle barely gets any attention from legit TV critics, although yes, there were some comments from those about not being a fan of the break up storyline.  The other so called reviewers are just fangirls who have their own very subjective ideas about the show.  I gave up on the TV Line comment section a long time ago because it's basically crazy with the same small bunch of people posting trying to outdo each other in bashing and negativity.  I wouldn't be surprised if that same bunch of super "fans" were the same ones posting on every other Castle discussion board out there, creating an echo chamber of negativity.  Even here, we're not that great in number and I wouldn't draw any conclusions about tastes here being representative of the audience at large.  What I do note is that there is a new and shiny show out there, Blindspot, which is getting some buzz and watercooler attention, and that's always going to draw eyeballs.  Castle's never been that kind of a show.  Castle's longevity is the main reason I attribute to viewers being lost more than any storyline reason.

 

I can't speak for others of course, but I stop watching shows when the characters and storyline start boring me and I never was that invested in the characters in the first place.  It's my investment in Caskett that has kept me watching through all the mediocre episodes.  I'm still invested in Caskett this season and I haven't been bored yet, which is already an improvement on a lot of forgettable episodes in recent years.

 

If shows like Game of Thrones or The Walking Dead stopped doing the show they wanted every time they made a controversial decision with a character due to fan criticism, they'd be done for long ago.  But their ratings are higher than ever, or very high, by any standard.  I think apathy is the real show killer.

Edited October 8, 2015 by madmaverick

[WendyCR72]

I get what ur saying Hal, but if u look at say TV line the Castle articles are getting triple comments compared to other shows. Id say at least 90% are extremely negative

 

Said it before, will say it again: People may rage and hate, but people are TALKING. That still implies interest. So seeing fans engaged is still a win to TPTB. The opposite of love is not hate, but indifference.

 

Silence is the killer.

[KaveDweller]

Press still doesn't matter as much as ratings. Thats how the show makes money. I doubt ABC cares if people watch the show to complain about it or they love it. They just care if they watch.

I'm sure they'd like critical praise or awards, but beloved shows with no ratings don't get renewed all the time because they don't bring in money.

[Cyranetta]

 

Hawley’s comment “What can we do to make this thing feel new again? “ can’t possibly justify what has been presented so far to viewers, but it  is definitely a new approach .

I wonder if they would have had better luck with audience acceptance if they had made it a truly "new show" by running with the baby steps they made into fantasy territory with the hints of time travel eps and made it a new subset of the Marvel Universe. A liberal application of handwavium makes the 12th's denizens a new group of superheroes; Beckett is truly Supercop, Alexis' hyaperability at computers and detecting has a place, all-powerful villains are the norm. In a flagrantly fantastic show world, we're more likely to accept plot holes and comic-book relationship movements.

[madmaverick]

I find it sad, and a bit pathetic, frankly, that people are now literally counting the number of minutes Caskett are on screen together.  And counting all the scenes where Castle and Beckett are not in the same frame.  I don't think Nathan and Stana, or any of the cast, not being shot in the same frame, or shooting scenes with doubles is anything new.  But you'd think it was with the way some fans are obsessing over it!  I just think if you go into the show with this kind of mindset, you're never going to enjoy it.  

 

Of course some fans are also going on about Stana being written off the show just because she went away for a holiday, for what, the filming of one episode, or a little more than that.  Overdramatic, much? ;)  She's back and I'm sure she'll be in plenty of scenes in an episode called Mr and Mrs Castle.  Unless they got divorced and Castle married someone else in the interim and it's really Stana's double now doing all the filming. ;)

[westwingfan]

Beckett is actually dead and the show will now be called "The Ghost and Mr. Castle" Stana and Nathan never have to film together again because they will use a hologram of her for all the scenes.

He will avenge her killer but not out of love just friendship because Castle is actually gay with Slaughter. That's where he was those 6 weeks.

You realise after your revelations about the break up that some might take this seriously. You're not being serious, are you? Although that last bit could explain a lot. LOL

[femmefan1946]

the Castle articles are getting triple comments compared to other shows. Id say at least 90% are extremely negative. Dont u want people to like ur show and want to watch it

 

What the program does is almost irrelevant as long as there are eyeballs tuning in. The eyeballs are what is being sold.

The audience is the product.

[CastleSeason8]

Hmmm I guess i just dont get it. If i were putting something out there, Id want people excited about it, not just happy there were 'X'amount of people bashing it. Again, thats why they r in Hollywood and Im not!! Lol

[TWP]

Beckett is actually dead and the show will now be called "The Ghost and Mr. Castle" Stana and Nathan never have to film together again because they will use a hologram of her for all the scenes.

 

Sure they don't already?  CGI is getting really good!

[TWP]

I find it sad, and a bit pathetic, frankly, that people are now literally counting the number of minutes Caskett are on screen together.  And counting all the scenes where Castle and Beckett are not in the same frame.  I don't think Nathan and Stana, or any of the cast, not being shot in the same frame, or shooting scenes with doubles is anything new.  But you'd think it was with the way some fans are obsessing over it!  I just think if you go into the show with this kind of mindset, you're never going to enjoy it.  

 

Of course some fans are also going on about Stana being written off the show just because she went away for a holiday, for what, the filming of one episode, or a little more than that.  Overdramatic, much? ;)  She's back and I'm sure she'll be in plenty of scenes in an episode called Mr and Mrs Castle.  Unless they got divorced and Castle married someone else in the interim and it's really Stana's double now doing all the filming. ;)

Guilty of both counts, but not for the reason you state.  And I wasn't saying that shooting over the shoulder is new.  It's just that people always talk about the "chemistry" between the couple....for me, that credit should go to the camera crew and post-production.  In reality, Stana and Nathan are likely rarely together.  To call it chemistry is to forget that.  And I know it's not new to TV. 

 

"Mr. and Mrs. Castle" could very well be a story along the lines of "Mr. and Mrs. Smith" where the couple has secrets with each other (rather than one-sided secrets as they are now).  It may not have anything to do with the couple getting closer.

 

I think Stana should be written off the show, because I don't think Stana actually wants to be there.  That's my opinion.

 

Also, I miss the "no board on board" rule of TWOP.  Opinions are not right or wrong.  Instead of criticizing someone else's opinion, I think we should focus on stating our own.  But that's just me.   I think the definition of "overdramatic" is getting upset about a person's opinion about a TV show.  We can hide people.  Feel free to hide me.

Edited October 9, 2015 by TVWithPity

[Chado]

the Castle articles are getting triple comments compared to other shows. Id say at least 90% are extremely negative. Dont u want people to like ur show and want to watch it

 

What the program does is almost irrelevant as long as there are eyeballs tuning in. The eyeballs are what is being sold.

The audience is the product.

Comments on a website isn't translating to increased viewers either way, so I don't see what it does except make the whole online community more negative/divided. If you look at TVLine comments, it's typically 10-15 people leaving 20-30 replies each, trying to shout over each other.

 

If viewers don't like the dynamic of Castle and Beckett separated we are just going to see the ratings hit under 1.0 before the fall finale. I have my popcorn ready.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Chado

[Guest]

There is a lot of frustration about the show right now. It's understandable. However, please refrain from channeling that frustration toward your fellow posters.

Just a reminder. Thank you.

[KaveDweller]

Well when they are together, they still have chemistry, and that's MY opinion. As far as who should be written off because they don't want to be there, welp...you can't call out one half of the pairing for that. If that's the new litmus test, then we need to have the Jon and Seamus show. Who is going to watch that.

 

Nathan and Stana both signed a new contract, so part of them must want to be there.  No one forced them to do it, and I'm sure they're happy to take the money.

 

I thought they were shown in the same shot a lot in this last episode and had chemistry there.  And while I know doubles are used sometimes, but personally I think it's a bit much to assume every single scene where we can't see both faces is a double.  If you watch bloopers you can tell that often the person you can't see is the actual actor. And I know that is just a few scenes, but still.  

[verdana]

Also posted in spoilers thread.

#Castle 8x04 Sneak Peek #1 “What Lies Beneath" Season 8 Episode 4 #CastleSeason8

Edited October 9, 2015 by verdana

[verdana]

First sneak out.

#Castle 8x04 Sneak Peek #1 “What Lies Beneath" Season 8 Episode 4 #CastleSeason8

[turnitwayup]

I notice Castle's reaction to blond guy's explanation that "compulsive and pathological lying is a mental disorder cause by physiological trauma". Maybe Castle is gonna realize that Beckett has Obsessive Justice Disorder in this ep. Anyways someone wrote a paper on Justice Obsessive Syndrome. 4 eps in and Castle is getting insults left and right about his writing so far this season.

[MaryM47]

Felt bad for Castle getting crap for his books again, and part of me wonders if that may foretell the end of the Nikki Heat series. Which for good might mean the start of his well-received future literary career as foretold by time travel guy, or for bad might signify the dissolution of the writer/muse relationship. 

[cappuccino]

I see we are not alone in our desires to start a petition. 

Well that thing is way too distracting and has to go !

[madmaverick]

Guilty of both counts, but not for the reason you state.  And I wasn't saying that shooting over the shoulder is new.  It's just that people always talk about the "chemistry" between the couple....for me, that credit should go to the camera crew and post-production.  In reality, Stana and Nathan are likely rarely together.  To call it chemistry is to forget that.  And I know it's not new to TV.

 

The comment wasn't meant to offend; it came from a place of wanting to understand how comparing screen time and assessing whether Nathan and Stana filmed a scene together (as opposed to Castle and Beckett being in a scene together) was instructive towards one's enjoyment of an episode.  YMMW of course, but I feel tearing an episode apart to that degree isn't constructive.

 

Naturally, the writer, director, DP, editor etc. all play important roles in generating the final product, but I feel it does the actors an injustice to say they are not largely responsible for the chemistry that has sustained the show for the past 7 seasons.  If the actors weren't important for generating that rare and intangible 'chemistry', why do networks bother with chemistry reads between actors in auditions in the first place?  

 

I thought they were shown in the same shot a lot in this last episode and had chemistry there.  And while I know doubles are used sometimes, but personally I think it's a bit much to assume every single scene where we can't see both faces is a double.  If you watch bloopers you can tell that often the person you can't see is the actual actor.

 

Agree with what KaveDweller said, both about the last episode and not assuming that doubles are used whenever faces are not seen, or actors are not in the same frame, which is the way the show has been shot for a long time.  After 7 seasons, one can often tell by an actor's profile and silhouette, the shape of the ear, the back of the hair etc. whether it really is the actor in the scene.  Only on a few occasions did I find it noticeable that a double was being used and none of those instances were what I would call pivotal scenes.  But I also don't go actively looking for scenes where the actors may or may not be shooting with each other.  If I'm bored by the story, I start noticing any ugly wardrobe choices, which I wish I didn't have to heh, not this.

 

At the end of the day, as long as we see Castle and Beckett, the characters, playing out a story, does it really matter how it was filmed?  The whole business of Hollywood is to use artifice and trickery to create and make us believe stories. 

 

I think Stana should be written off the show, because I don't think Stana actually wants to be there.  That's my opinion.

 

Which you're entitled to.  But I fail to see how it can be said that Stana doesn't want to be there when she chose to sign a contract of her own volition.  Or are we implying that she was under duress, undue influence, or some other conspiracy theory? ;)  Stana's a big girl, with her team of professionals advising her, and this isn't her first negotiation of contracts on Castle or for other projects.  She's doing what she wants to do.  It's a disservice to her to imply otherwise in my opinion.

 

 I think the definition of "overdramatic" is getting upset about a person's opinion about a TV show.  

 

Not upset in the least.  More like mild amusement and the urge for a Beckett eye roll at the disproportionate reaction to something like Stana taking something like a week or so off and the wild assumptions made about what that meant.  It was the same thing when she wasn't present for much of the filming of 801, and the same thing when some people were fearing Capt. Beckett would be sidelined from the show in her office.  But oh look, Beckett was in 801, driving the story in 802 and been more out in the field than in the office to date.  Fandom, thy name is unnecessary drama.  Just my opinion.

Edited October 9, 2015 by madmaverick

[madmaverick]

Beckett is actually dead and the show will now be called "The Ghost and Mr. Castle" Stana and Nathan never have to film together again because they will use a hologram of her for all the scenes.

 

That, or he can just film with her wig.  Since we supposedly never see their faces together anyway.  We can even still have Beckett Hair Porn.

 

He will avenge her killer but not out of love just friendship because Castle is actually gay with Slaughter. That's where he was those 6 weeks.

 

They made a typo with the episode title.  Should be Mr. & Mr. Castle.

[Cyranetta]

 

Felt bad for Castle getting crap for his books again, and part of me wonders if that may foretell the end of the Nikki Heat series. Which for good might mean the start of his well-received future literary career as foretold by time travel guy, or for bad might signify the dissolution of the writer/muse relationship.

Of course what's kind of head-spinning is wondering what happens with the "Richard Castle" books that one can actually buy -- will the Nikki Heat series continue? Will the 'Richard Castle" attempt to have a more literary career in real-world Barnes &  Noble?

[verdana]

Felt bad for Castle getting crap for his books again, and part of me wonders if that may foretell the end of the Nikki Heat series. Which for good might mean the start of his well-received future literary career as foretold by time travel guy, or for bad might signify the dissolution of the writer/muse relationship.

So do I but it's par for the course these days. Castle is belittled and made a figure of fun too much for my liking and I wish someone would come up to him and say how much they enjoy his books, the poor guy needs a boost given current circumstances. Regarding the Nikki Heat series, if they wanted to increase the drama they could have Castle announce to his readers he's going to ditch Nikki and look for fresh sources of inspiration, it might give Beckett something to worry about lol.