S01.E09: Episode 9

[Tara Ariano]

As Det. Carver's heart condition worsens, his supervisor gives him 24 hours to find the killer, while Beth seeks advice from Paul Coates, and Susan Wright surprises all with a revelation.

[secnarf]

Anyone else getting the sense that Tom is a sociopath?

[Automne]

All this slo-mo is making me feel like I'm watching a Zach Snyder flick. 

 

So what hospital receptionist was willing to violate HIPPA to give Little Miss Drive A Man To Suicide Then Run Away a story?

 

Mark is such an asshole. Chris Rock really spoke truth when he said that when a man cheats, he begins to distrust his woman (if she doesn't outright dump him) because by cheating on her, he gave her a "Get Some Dick Free" card. Mark knows this and is now acting like a shithead to Beth whenever she goes near Paul the Priest. And why is he being so resistant to bereavement therapy? If you don't want to lose your wife, maybe be a little open? The odds are already stacked against you: even the most stable marriages don't survive a child's death. Add infidelity and divorce is nearly an inevitability.

 

Tom is being a little shit. What street was he living on that gives him the idea he can talk to an adult like that? Since his parents aren't reining him in, somebody has to.

 

Good job, Owen. Blackmail a cop to get an exclusive using health information you shouldn't even know (see aforementioned HIPPA). I'm pretty sure Carver could sue you for that and since you don't have the money for that, thanks to your drug-addled mother, you'll start singing who your sources are.

[Automne]

Aaaaaaahhhhhh! I knew they were going to keep Hardy's background from Broadchurch! Ugh, I hated it, it's so heartbreaking (damn near literally for Hardy/Carver). I get he wants to protect his daughter, but honestly, I would never take the heat for destroying a murder case because of my cheating spouse. His ex-wife deserves the public and private shaming and flogging for deciding to stop and have sex with your extramarital lover BEFORE DROPPING OFF THE SMOKING GUN EVIDENCE THAT WILL GUARANTEE A GUILTY VERDICT TO PUT AWAY A SERIAL KILLER FOR LIFE. She deserves her daughter hating her for life for both cheating on her father and letting a killer go loose. 

Edited December 5, 2014 by Automne

[Primetimer]

It took almost to the end, but we finally see why the show cast someone of her caliber.

Read the story

[Callaphera]

This week on Inept Police Work: Vince reaches through the bars of the cell to grab Maybe Mommy's face and start crushing it while a police officer stands there with her thumb up her ass and watches. Then she gently puts her hands out and tugs her away. Wow. I enjoy the show and the mystery, but worst police work ever.

[Morrigan2575]

I thought it was Vince from the moment Tom asked Vince to fix his skateboard and Vince acted all sketchy. However, after this episode with so.much evidence pointing towards Vince, I can't help but think he's the final red herring.

I also wondered if there was more to the Elle/Susan conversation at the end. Is it hinting that there's something going on with Joe/Tom and Elle just isn't seeing it?

There is something seriously wrong with Tom. What he's doing and how he's acting goes way beyond being sacred or hiding a minor secret about Danny.

I actually wonder if Tom killed Danny and Vince helped him cover it up.

Finally, I'm just really happy no one killed Archie. After Vince pointed a gun at the poor thing I've been really worried. When Susan was packing up, I thought she was going to kill Archie and leave him behind.

[truthaboutluv]

Anyone else getting the sense that Tom is a sociopath?

 

 

Kid totally gave me Damian from The Omen vibes tonight.

[Automne]

I'm positive Tom killed Danny. They've pretty much done the work for Ellie to get the shock of it being a member of her little family. Now they've had her say to Susan, "How could you not know?" in reference to the sexual abuse of her child by her husband. I've said it was Tom since the very beginning and I'm sticking to that. I think both Joe and Vince helped Tom clean and cover it up.

[benteen]

Aaaaaaahhhhhh! I knew they were going to keep Hardy's background from Broadchurch! Ugh, I hated it, it's so heartbreaking (damn near literally for Hardy/Carver). I get he wants to protect his daughter, but honestly, I would never take the heat for destroying a murder case because of my cheating spouse. His ex-wife deserves the public and private shaming and flogging for deciding to stop and have sex with your extramarital lover BEFORE DROPPING OFF THE SMOKING GUN EVIDENCE THAT WILL GUARANTEE A GUILTY VERDICT TO PUT AWAY A SERIAL KILLER FOR LIFE. She deserves her daughter hating her for life for both cheating on her father and letting a killer go loose. 

 

This a THOUSAND times!  I never would have covered up for my wife if she did something like that and wrecked my relationship with my kid.  What the hell was wrong with Carver for wanting to be a martyr like that?  It really shows you too what a lowlife scumbag Carver's wife is to allow their daughter to treat her father like that when she was the one who destroyed their marriage, their family and let a murderer go loose.  Carver's got some mental problems to allow something like that.

 

That scene was disappointing to because it wasn't as emotionally effective as it was on Broadchurch.  Not a knock on DT but the Hardy/Carver character was a lot more emotional and the scene was played a lot better.

 

Yeah, I'm thinking something is wrong with Tom and his one facial expression.  That kid is super creepy.

 

Overall, I enjoyed the episode and thought it was well-acted.  I laughed when Carver told Elle that she probably wasn't qualified for her job.  Elle was mostly a good cop in this one but still showed signs of incompetence, like letting Vince be able to put his hands on Susan when he was in a freakin jail cell!

 

Speaking of shoddy police work, Carver never would have been allowed to resume work on the case once he got checked into the hospital.

Edited December 5, 2014 by benteen

[truthaboutluv]

This week on Inept Police Work: Vince reaches through the bars of the cell to grab Maybe Mommy's face and start crushing it while a police officer stands there with her thumb up her ass and watches. Then she gently puts her hands out and tugs her away. Wow. I enjoy the show and the mystery, but worst police work ever.

 

 

That was pretty odd. Not only does Vince squeeze Susan's face rather forcefully, he pretty much delivered a very real and violent threat and Ellie was just casually standing by. Weird...

 

There is something seriously wrong with Tom. What he's doing and how he's acting goes way beyond being sacred or hiding a minor secret about Danny.

 

 

I'm positive Tom killed Danny.

 

 

It definitely seems that way. With all the evidence pointing Vince's way it seems too obvious and Pastor Paul looks to be the last red herring with his shady look at Carver after giving the computer and his reaction to Tom's threat about telling what happened with Danny which I'm not sure is entirely a lie. I think it probably did happen but doesn't mean he killed Danny.

 

I can see it being Tom because even though in many ways the evidence has been glaring since the beginning, I could still see it being a shock to viewers because most would not assume a 12/13 year old committed that murder, even if these things do happen. But there is clearly something very major Tom is hiding and that kid is creepy as fuck. 

 

I have to say I actually am not really sure the father does know. I actually think Ellie's "what do you do all day" comment may tie into their both being clueless at what was going on right under their nose which will tie into Ellie's "how could you not know." The reason I'm still hesitant about the dad is his obvious concern that day about letting Tom walk by himself those last few miles to school. If he knows Tom murdered Danny and helped cover it up, he wouldn't be concerned about some possible predatory murderer running around because he knows there isn't one. I also thought his reaction when Tom was holding the skateboard was kind of telling. 

 

I do think if it is Tom, that Vince is the one who helped him cover it up and the last piece of the puzzle will be whatever it was that was going on with Tom, Danny and Vince that ultimately led to whatever happened that night. I also think this theory helps explain that scene with Tom and Vince that was framed in such a way as to make it look like Tom was in momentary danger with Vince was being all shifty and asking him if his mom knew where he was. My guess is Vince looked all shifty and shut the door so they could talk about whatever happened that night. 

Edited December 5, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[mjc570]

That scene in the garage with Beth and Mark was just painful - not in the way intended by the writers but just because of the sheer awful acting.  Terrible casting on this show, without reference to Broadchurch. 

 

It looks to me like its setting up to be Tom as the killer, with Vince helping with disposal of the body.  If Vince got the "Danny" tattoo out of guilt, this makes sense to me.  Otherwise, if Vince were so fond of Danny, then why would he cover up his killing?

 

[thuganomics85]

Thanks, Tom.  You managed to make me side with Creepy Preacher Paul, of all people.  Either that kid is the true killer, or he's got something wrong with him.  With all of Ellie's talk to Susan about how she couldn't see what kind of monster her former husband was, I'm wondering how Ellie and her husband don't see that Tom is off his rocker.

 

So, the episode ends with Vince as the main suspect, and a shit ton of evidence pointing in his direction.  His behavior certainly didn't help things, either.  But, since we have one episode left, I wouldn't be surprised if there is another twist in-store for us.  Not surprised over the reveal that he's actually Susan's son.  I figured something was going on with those two.

 

Ah, the return of Asshole Mark.  Welcome back!  Yes, he cheats with Jemma and it ain't no thing, but Beth going to Paul's house for advice and comfort, totally makes her a horrid harpy.  Fuck off, Mark.  Only small solace Danny has is not having you as a father figure.  I'm sure you would have been a "great" dad to him, and showing him how to treat women you are suppose care about.  Even if she keeps the kid, I want this to end with Beth leaving him.

 

So, Renee finally leaves, only after she drops the bombshell that Carver was sick.  An asshole to the end, that Renee.  But, instead of reporting it, Owen and his boss use it to get the story what really happened in Rosemont.  Disappointing!  Really, Carver?  It was your cheating wife who lost the evidence, but you covered for her?  I'm sure your daughter would have rather known the truth, then this poor attempt at protecting her.  Ugh.

 

At least we get a proper ending next week.  Right now, I don't care who did it.  I just want it to end with them solving it, and then Carver jumps in his car (or TARDIS), gives the town the middle finger, and yell "So long, motherfuckers!", and find a better place.

[Netfoot]

I laughed when Carver told Elle that she probably wasn't qualified for her job.  Elle was mostly a good cop in this one but still showed signs of incompetence, like letting Vince be able to put his hands on Susan when he was in a freakin jail cell!

 

Speaking of shoddy police work, Carver never would have been allowed to resume work on the case once he got checked into the hospital.

 

I'm finding it really annoying that Carver keeps harping on about how every one else is incompetent and should be more professional.  In fact, he is the least effective cop on the force, and couple that with his insistence on jeopardizing their entire effort by refusing to accept his illness, I'd have to say he is the major hinderance on the force.

 

Right now, I don't care who did it.  I just want it to end with them solving it, and then Carver jumps in his car (or TARDIS), gives the town the middle finger, and yell "So long, motherfuckers!", and find a better place.

 

Well, I want them to fire his ass for incompetence, and then right after it sink in and he feels like shit, that would be a good time for him to drop dead in his tracks.  What a dick!  The best of all was the disingenuous "You could have gone after him and left me to die!" bullshit he spouted off to turn the blame on Elly, when in fact he is solely responsible for the escape of the prowler at the end of E8!

 

As for whodunnit, I just don't give a damn any more.  I started watching this because I thought there was a good chance it would turn out to be a good show, with the police gradually developing a better understanding of what's going on, finding and analyzing clues, eliminating suspects, and eventually identifying the killer.  Instead, at the end of the penultimate episode, they are still considering their original suspect (Mark), they have grabbed up Vince on the word of LoonySue, and frankly, were there two more episodes to go, I'd blow this piece of crap off tonight!

 

As there's only one more episode I will probably watch to get some closure, but you can bet that whatever the resolution, it will be some "big thrill" ending with the murderer turning out to be Elly, or Carver's wife, or some other character who hasn't raised an eyebrow's worth of suspicion all season, and getting outed by some random piece of information, or by an uncharacteristic flash of brilliance from one of the equally dense characters on the show:  Carver or Elly.

 

I'm hating it already.

[HermitsUnited]

I don't think that "body" was Danny's at all in the final scene. Surely it was an animal carcass. After blatantly establishing that Vince likes to hunt in this episode it seems almost obvious. I don't know if there's laws about these things in the States, but perhaps he's unwilling to account for his movements because he's doing something illegal? Is it poaching?

 

Also why would the killer randomly transport the body around various locations throughout the night after killing Danny? We know that the murder scene is the hut. Danny was then put into a boat and transported further down the coast where he was left at around 2am. Possibly a car was needed to transport between the hut and the sea, but that could easily be driven up to the car park outside the hut. Not that we have any idea where anything is in Gracpeoint, but why would the killer be parading the body around in a forest? That's simply ridiculous. The window of time between Danny on CCTV in the town centre and then the arrival at his body at 2/3am is surely only 2-3hours. The killer also had to clean the entire hut, find a boat and then get back to wherever they were. There's not enough time for them to be doing random stuff in forests...Why Ellie is now convinced she knows the killer, I'll never know.

 

But then Ellie is a terrible cop. As established above. Pretty sure that none of her sister's testimony would stand up in court anyway considering she's completely unreliable and was paid money to "open up".

 

All those lines. It's either Tom or Joe. Carver's "this is gonna crack open a fault line in this town" line is coming to get you Ellie.

 

I hope Julianne comes back next week. Apart from the fact that Carver was coerced into giving that story (for really shitty reasons) I really want to see the fallout.

[CarpeDiem54]

Well, frack! I turned on Fox, leaned back on the couch and promptly went into a coma. Can't watch it until tomorrow night now.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

This week on Inept Police Work: Vince reaches through the bars of the cell to grab Maybe Mommy's face and start crushing it while a police officer stands there with her thumb up her ass and watches. Then she gently puts her hands out and tugs her away. Wow. I enjoy the show and the mystery, but worst police work ever.

Not only that, but Ellie stood there while Vince blatantly told Susan to tell the police that she didn't see him the night of Danny's murder and then he threatened her. Seriously?

 

Let's just say for the sake of argument that Susan was telling the truth about everything: she didn't know her husband was having sex with their daughter, she saw Vince put Danny's body on the beach, and she is afraid that Vince will hurt someone else. How does that excuse that her telling Cathy that she knew men who would rape her? I don't care if she was trying to protect herself from having Cathy find out who she was and what happened to her family. That was just so freaking out of line. I wonder what happened to the younger daughter. If Susan was able to track down Vince, wouldn't she be able to find the surviving daughter too?

 

I agree that Vince is looking too obvious as a suspet for me to think that they're going to spend the final episode just saying, "Yup, he totally did it."

 

Paul has been creepy to me from the beginning, mostly because it's obvious that he is still in love with Beth, but ITA that Tom was so sketchy and then so threatening that I was on Paul's side.

 

Maybe I watch too much L&O, but if someone used Danny's cell phone to call the police last week, can they not at least trace the general area where the person was when the call was placed? I guess they are going to tell me that Gracepoint is a one cell phone tower kind of town. How did they get the phone number of Danny's smartphone if his parents didn't even know he had one?

 

What does Elle's husband do?  It is a valid question to ask.  If he is a stay at home dad, why wasn't he keeping an eye on Tom, when Tom was destroying the computer?.

He was inside the house talking to Ellie after dinner when Tom went outside and smashed his computer in the driveway. I don't know how neither of them heard all the racket he was making.

Edited December 5, 2014 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Netfoot]

How did they get the phone number of Danny's smartphone if his parents didn't even know he had one?

 

Telco said Danny's official phone is forwarded to his secret phone and provided the number.

 

Paul has been creepy to me from the beginning, mostly because it's obvious that he is still in love with Beth, but ITA that Tom was so sketchy and then so threatening that I was on Paul's side.

 

As it happens, only yesterday I smashed up nine of my oldest computers in my driveway, before tossing them into a skip.  I wonder: by what authority did ShamanPaul confiscate Tom's computer -- smashed or not -- and refuse to give it back? If he thought there was wrongdoing going on, why not take the computer directly to the boy's parents, or to the police?  Suspicious as tom's behaviour has been, I was totally on his side with this.  I'd have threatened him with the Rockinsock.

[LisaM]

Just spec here but is the "don't know the evil that lives in your own house" with Susan going to explode in Ellie's face? Perhaps Danny was going to expose something that Tom was doing -- and Ellie's husband (whose name I have forgotten) killed Danny to protect Tom? Vince looks too guilty to be the killer and the priest, while hot for Beth, doesn't do it for me either (although I am curious as to whether Tom said that he hit Danny in order to throw suspicion off of the real murderer?). The other situation that also fits is Chloe's boyfriend, who conveniently thanked Mark and Beth for bringing him into the family.

Susan's story about Vince being her son was a bit too much of a bombshell for me at this point. Mark Solano has no right to say anything about Beth's visit to the priest given his own affair with Gemma.

Edited December 5, 2014 by LisaM

[truthaboutluv]

He was inside the house talking to Ellie after dinner when Tom went outside and smashed his computer in the driveway. I don't know how neither of them heard all the racket he was making.

 

 

Actually I think Tom said his dad was putting the baby to sleep or he was upstairs sleeping himself - not sure which. But I'm sure Ellie was not home when Tom was smashing his computer. The time Ellie and her husband were having a conversation while Tom was doing something shady was when Tom went through her bag and found the hiker guy's number.

[benteen]

I'm finding it really annoying that Carver keeps harping on about how every one else is incompetent and should be more professional.  In fact, he is the least effective cop on the force, and couple that with his insistence on jeopardizing their entire effort by refusing to accept his illness, I'd have to say he is the major hinderance on the force.

 

 

Well, I want them to fire his ass for incompetence, and then right after it sink in and he feels like shit, that would be a good time for him to drop dead in his tracks.  What a dick!  The best of all was the disingenuous "You could have gone after him and left me to die!" bullshit he spouted off to turn the blame on Elly, when in fact he is solely responsible for the escape of the prowler at the end of E8!

 

As for whodunnit, I just don't give a damn any more.  I started watching this because I thought there was a good chance it would turn out to be a good show, with the police gradually developing a better understanding of what's going on, finding and analyzing clues, eliminating suspects, and eventually identifying the killer.  Instead, at the end of the penultimate episode, they are still considering their original suspect (Mark), they have grabbed up Vince on the word of LoonySue, and frankly, were there two more episodes to go, I'd blow this piece of crap off tonight!

 

As there's only one more episode I will probably watch to get some closure, but you can bet that whatever the resolution, it will be some "big thrill" ending with the murderer turning out to be Elly, or Carver's wife, or some other character who hasn't raised an eyebrow's worth of suspicion all season, and getting outed by some random piece of information, or by an uncharacteristic flash of brilliance from one of the equally dense characters on the show:  Carver or Elly.

 

I'm hating it already.

 

So true about Carver jeopardizing the case by going into a field with a bad heard then not accepting responsibility for it.  The police work was already shoddy at that moment because he and Elle went after that guy without any back-up.  But when it was time to arrest Susan, they arrived with half the police force.  Good lord, the detective work in both Broadchurch and Gracepoint was atrocious. 

[Beebee111]

 

I do think if it is Tom, that Vince is the one who helped him cover it up and the last piece of the puzzle will be whatever it was that was going on with Tom, Danny and Vince that ultimately led to whatever happened that night. I also think this theory helps explain that scene with Tom and Vince that was framed in such a way as to make it look like Tom was in momentary danger with Vince was being all shifty and asking him if his mom knew where he was. My guess is Vince looked all shifty and shut the door so they could talk about whatever happened that night.

 

THIS. Why would Vince have needed to close the door to his small, windowless, workshop to help fix Tom's skateboard. Although it looked like Tom was in danger, he clearly wasn't. The only viable explanation now is that they needed to have a private conversation about what happened re. Danny's murder.

 

If Tom is in fact the murderer, then the child is a sociopath - and it may have been more than just an accident. All of the contrived concern about his mother e.g., "I just want my mother back"  and the threat to the priest (which I think is probably untrue) are the signs of someone with some serious mental issues.

 

I also wonder where his bicycle ride to the cabin in the woods where the hiker, suspect (forget his name) lived was intended to plant evidence (i.e., put some of Danny's comics there) to continue to move suspicion away from him.

 

My only concern is that next week's episode will be too rushed to tie up all the loose ends as well as see Ellie's ultimate reaction to the devastation of learning that it is in fact her son who is the murderer.

Edited December 5, 2014 by Beebee111

[SFoster21]

Also, if Tom was aware of Vince as a dangerous person, why would he voluntarily arrive alone at his place?

[saber5055]

Automne hit the nail on the head by bringing up HIPPA laws. That nurse who told Rene about Carver even being in the hospital much less his diagnosis is all set up to be fired. This is a total breech of confidentiality. Medical records cannot be made public without some serious court order signed by a judge, or something close to that. Total fail for this show.

 

Also, what does Carver being sick have anything to do with how he is doing is job? When his boss said, "Why did you accept this job if you knew you were sick," I was hoping Carver would have replied: "FOR THE INSURANCE!" I know people who have taken jobs, got all their medical problems taken care of, then quit.

 

So I totally called it that Susan is Vince's real mom. Give me a pat on the back.

 

Good on Father Paul for taking the laptop away from Tom and giving it to Carver. BRAVO! Finally, someone is being proactive.

 

Yes, Dick Head Mark is back. I have to say, how he is written is the most realistic of any of the characters, as anyone who has had a cheating spouse can attest. Yes, he's a douche. But so are many husbands.

 

So I had to laugh when Ellie asked Joe what he did all day at home. Another good question, if anyone has ever had a stay-at-home husband. Woman will end up with a full-time job earning money, then doing all the work at home, too. *cough*

If Susan was able to track down Vince, wouldn't she be able to find the surviving daughter too?

 Would that be a hoot if the missing daughter were Beth?

  Actually I think Tom said his dad was putting the baby to sleep or he was upstairs sleeping himself - not sure which. But I'm sure Ellie was not home when Tom was smashing his computer.

True this. Ellie was at work. Remember, Tom was all spazzed out that his mommy was spending too much time at work instead of at home hugging on him. Tom SAID dad was inside doing something, but we don't know if that's true. Joe might have been in that cabin, wearing the Hoodie Cloak of Darkness.

 

Freaked that Vince grabbed Susan's head through the bars. I was fully expecting him to do a face smash.

 

I'm completely wondering how a skateboard can leave PAINT CHIPS in someone's closet, if the board is just being stored there. The heck? Doesn't say much for the quality of Vince's work as a painter.

 

Best part of the show: Carver telling Ellie she is basically useless. Well said. I totally agree.

 

So my dog decided she needed to go outside during Carver's speech to the newspaper guys. What was revealed about Rosemont? I completely missed that part.

[Netfoot]

Good on Father Paul for taking the laptop away from Tom and giving it to Carver. BRAVO! Finally, someone is being proactive.

 

By what authority did he confiscate Tom's computer?  There is nothing wrong with destroying an old computer.  In fact, I destroyed NINE old computers of mine only yesterday, before throwing them in a skip.  And if he thought there was something suspicious going on, why did he not take the computer directly to Tom's parents, or the police?  Instead, he took it home and began squeezing Tom for... what?  It's not like he's an investigator of some sort, and it's not like whatever Tom does with his computer is any of his business.  No, he waits at least a day, confronts Tom directly, and only when Tom threatens him with the authorities does he run to the cops to get his story in first.  I'd call that suspicious, not laudable.

[Guest]

So my dog decided she needed to go outside during Carver's speech to the newspaper guys. What was revealed about Rosemont? I completely missed that part.

Carver's wife, a detective, stopped for a quickie with her illicit lover with a necklace that was key evidence in her car and it got stolen, ruining the state's case against the killer.  Carver didn't want his daughter to know his wife's sins/screw-ups so he took the blame for it.  

By what authority did he confiscate Tom's computer?  There is nothing wrong with destroying an old computer.  In fact, I destroyed NINE old computers of mine only yesterday, before throwing them in a skip.  And if he thought there was something suspicious going on, why did he not take the computer directly to Tom's parents, or the police?  Instead, he took it home and began squeezing Tom for... what?  It's not like he's an investigator of some sort, and it's not like whatever Tom does with his computer is any of his business.  No, he waits at least a day, confronts Tom directly, and only when Tom threatens him with the authorities does he run to the cops to get his story in first.  I'd call that suspicious, not laudable.

And then when he does tell Carver, Carver doesn't tell Ellie or submit it for testing, did he?  He just asked Ellie to bring it in.  So she'll discover it's missing.  Why not just tell her and solve the damn murder without the games?  

[truthaboutluv]

Actually I'm pretty sure Carver did take the computer in for testing. After he speaks to Paul and he gives him the computer, he gets on the phone and calls someone who I assume is in the tech/IT department of the station to ask about getting data off a computer and asked him to do it discreetly likely so Ellie would not know just yet. I actually think his reason for telling Ellie to bring Tom's computer in is to see what Tom will tell Ellie when she inevitably asks him for it and I think he'll take it from there and likely tell her Paul gave him the smashed up computer. 

[Beebee111]

 

And then when he does tell Carver, Carver doesn't tell Ellie or submit it for testing, did he?  He just asked Ellie to bring it in.  So she'll discover it's missing.  Why not just tell her and solve the damn murder without the games?

Probably, to keep her from interfering in the investigation early on. If she had any sense, she would insist that they need a warrant to examine the computer. However, Carver is still giving her a subtle heads up - she should start to clue in that something is amiss with her family.

[Capricasix]

Was there a preview for next week's episode? I watched the show on Global in Canada last night, and they didn't show a preview.

[saber5055]

Thanks, Winston, for the fill-in for the part I missed. Since Carver and his wife are divorced, I'm saying his altruism goes way above and beyond for protecting both the cheating ex and his daughter, with whom he seems to have an almost nonexistent relationship anyway. Maybe this story line is to show us Carver's soft side. In any case, I do not like it!

 

Agree that Carver is getting Tom's HD restored secretly without having to deal with Ellie's meddling. Can you imagine the tizwad she'd throw if Carver even SUGGESTED her Darling Tom was destroying evidence? Plus it will be cool to see Tom's reaction (and lie) when she asks him for it. And I can't imagine him sleeping through the noise of her rifling through his room looking for it. I'd have been all about waking him up and asking him where it is. But then again, it IS her Darling Pure Tom who can Do No Wrong.

 

By what authority did he confiscate Tom's computer?  There is nothing wrong with destroying an old computer.  In fact, I destroyed NINE old computers of mine only yesterday, before throwing them in a skip.

Then for your sake I hope you are above suspicion for the murder of your "best friend." If Tom was all bent about Paul taking his mashed-up laptop, then why didn't he go tell Mommy Dearest about it instead of threatening Paul that he'd tell cops Paul struck Danny if Paul turned over the laptop? Apparently, Paul wasn't going to do anything with the laptop until Tom came over and put the evil eye on him.

[John Ramos]

Just spec here but is the "don't know the evil that lives in your own house" with Susan going to explode in Ellie's face? Perhaps Danny was going to expose something that Tom was doing -- and Ellie's husband (whose name I have forgotten) killed Danny to protect Tom? Vince looks too guilty to be the killer and the priest, while hot for Beth, doesn't do it for me either (although I am curious as to whether Tom said that he hit Danny in order to throw suspicion off of the real murderer?). The other situation that also fits is Chloe's boyfriend, who conveniently thanked Mark and Beth for bringing him into the family.

Susan's story about Vince being her son was a bit too much of a bombshell for me at this point. Mark Solano has no right to say anything about Beth's visit to the priest given his own affair with Gemma.

 

The theory about Ellie's husband is my guess too; I seem to remember hints dropped about his abusive behavior on a camping trip, but the "evil in your own house" theme cemented it for me. Tom being the culprit would be disturbing but I don't think the network would approve a child killer.

[LeGrandElephant]

I thought that whole thing about how could you not notice what was going on with your own husband and child was strongly telegraphing that Ellie's husband and/or son was the killer. The only thing is I don't see how they could be working together to cover it up - if they were, the husband would have been in on the laptop-destroying plan, and would have done a better job than to do it out on the open sidewalk where anyone could see. So maybe it was only one of them, or maybe Tom did it and the father helped cover for him without Tom being aware of it, or something like that. 

[Beebee111]

 

Susan's story about Vince being her son was a bit too much of a bombshell for me at this point. Mark Solano has no right to say anything about Beth's visit to the priest given his own affair with Gemma.

I actually suspected Susan was Vince's mother for a while, so it was good to have that confirmed - but it didn't come as a bombshell to me. WORD though, regarding Mark's anger toward Beth. I disliked that scene so much because I thought it was totally unrealistic that Beth didn't through Gemma in his face. The hypocrite.

 

I would actually be disappointed if it was Ellie's husband rather than Tom because we have seen way too little of him. The killer should be someone that we have multiple clues about and I just don't think we've gotten to know Ellie's husband that well. Besides, the scene where the skateboard was recovered should have played out very differently. But who knows, I could be proved wrong. Why did he opt to quit his job and become a SAHD? Were there motivations other than taking care of his kids?

[saber5055]

I'm hoping the network goes for the shock of having the kid Tom be the murderer, although that would be controversial. But maybe that's what they are going for? I just want Carver to be okay at the end, driving (walking?) off into the sunset, flipping the town the bird, as another poster wrote. That would be my perfect ending.

 

Yes, previews were shown for next week, except I don't remember any of what was shown, only that Danny's "good" phone was active again, pinging the cell towers, and a cop car was heading toward the coordinates.

 

Great point, that Tom was biking to Backpacker's cabin to plant one of Danny's crossword books as fake evidence against the guy. He would have gotten that lead from snooping Ellie's notepad. Then he says the crossword book is the only thing he has to remember Danny by. Yikes. Such good friends, no? I also think the killer (Tom, I hope) bashed in Danny's head with that skateboard, which is why Tom was giving it such a freaked look after Susan gave it to him.

Edited December 5, 2014 by saber5055

[Guest]

Thanks, Winston, for the fill-in for the part I missed. Since Carver and his wife are divorced, I'm saying his altruism goes way above and beyond for protecting both the cheating ex and his daughter, with whom he seems to have an almost nonexistent relationship anyway. Maybe this story line is to show us Carver's soft side. In any case, I do not like it!

 

I might be wrong but my impression is they were still married at the time?  Otherwise, she wouldn't have been cheating.

Probably, to keep her from interfering in the investigation early on. If she had any sense, she would insist that they need a warrant to examine the computer. However, Carver is still giving her a subtle heads up - she should start to clue in that something is amiss with her family.

Oh good point.  Though if the search of the laptop requires a warrant, Ellie would know that and they wouldn't be able to use anything from it as evidence.  Though I guess if just knowing who the killer is makes him confess, it's moot.  (I think.)

 

I actually suspected Susan was Vince's mother for a while, so it was good to have that confirmed - but it didn't come as a bombshell to me. WORD though, regarding Mark's anger toward Beth. I disliked that scene so much because I thought it was totally unrealistic that Beth didn't through Gemma in his face. The hypocrite.

 

I would actually be disappointed if it was Ellie's husband rather than Tom because we have seen way too little of him. The killer should be someone that we have multiple clues about and I just don't think we've gotten to know Ellie's husband that well. Besides, the scene where the skateboard was recovered should have played out very differently. But who knows, I could be proved wrong. Why did he opt to quit his job and become a SAHD? Were there motivations other than taking care of his kids?

IIRC, Joe stays home with the kids solely because Ellie makes more money and one of them had to.  Though does a cop really make a lot more than an EMT?  

[saber5055]

 

Though if the search of the laptop requires a warrant, Ellie would know that and they wouldn't be able to use anything from it as evidence.

Since supposedly Tom gave the laptop to Father and Father gave it to Carver, it's all contributed so no warrant would be required, right? I'm by no means up on legal stuff, although I'm sure some lawyer would find a way to toss out the evidence somehow if this went to trial.

 

But: What could be on the laptop that would be incriminating? And the text messages Tom deleted ... were they during Danny's skateboarding trip down Main Street to his death? Maybe the laptop held a spreadsheet for the business end of the drug dealing.

 

My favorite ending, just before Carver walks out of town, is for Tom to admit killing Danny, Joe to admit he dumped Danny's body, then Tom and Joe to skateboard off the cliffs to their demise below. *wishful thinking*

 

BTW: The EMTs I know make a cr*p wage. Don't know any cops so can't compare, but it has to be better than an EMT. I was shocked at how little they made. Around here, anyway. And daycare is outrageously expensive.

Edited December 5, 2014 by saber5055

[ZoloftBlob]

IIRC, Joe stays home with the kids solely because Ellie makes more money and one of them had to.  Though does a cop really make a lot more than an EMT?

 

EMTs make jack shit.

[Clanstarling]

 

And if he thought there was something suspicious going on, why did he not take the computer directly to Tom's parents, or the police?  Instead, he took it home and began squeezing Tom for... what?  It's not like he's an investigator of some sort, and it's not like whatever Tom does with his computer is any of his business.  No, he waits at least a day, confronts Tom directly, and only when Tom threatens him with the authorities does he run to the cops to get his story in first.  I'd call that suspicious, not laudable.

That's what I thought, Netfoot. In fact, it is what cemented him as a primary suspect, rather than just the creepy possible suspect, in my mind. I have a vague memory of the scene where they're hunting for Tom in the woods, and something Marc Solano said (I think) indicated that Danny had been hit during a camping trip. I thought it was a church/sunday school trip. But I could be wrong.

So I had to laugh when Ellie asked Joe what he did all day at home. Another good question, if anyone has ever had a stay-at-home husband. Woman will end up with a full-time job earning money, then doing all the work at home, too. *cough*

Had to laugh at that, Saber5055. Though in my case, my SAH did do most of the work, but our priorities about which work should be done were VERY different.

 

Though Vince is likely not the killer, I thought Susan's comment that he was just like his father did more than hint at inappropriate relationships with the boys (hence the sketchy look when he closed the garage door, and the Danny tattoo.) He's the one who led the charge against the old guy who killed himself - and what better way to hide his own actions?

 

As for what could be on a computer - there are endless things, videos, photos, etc. - which could lead to exposing their secrets (related to Danny's murder or not).

[Netfoot]

This editor sucks.  It just ate about 30 lines -- which I refuse to retype.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Netfoot

[CarpeDiem54]

EMTs make jack shit. My nephew is an EMT and works in a hospital's ER doing triage. When I asked him why he didn't ride in an ambulance, he told me the difference in wages. Like another poster above, I was shocked at how little the guys who arrive at your house make.

So, yeah, even in some little jerk water town like Gracepoint, cops would make a lot more.

[Guest]

Yeah, I looked it up.  BLS says median annual salary for 2012 was like $31k.  

 

And that job I wouldn't do for virtually any salary.  Cop, either.  

 

Are there really little towns that aren't expensive vacation destinations on the California coastline, even north of San Fran?  I would love a view of whales from my trailer or hut on the bluff.  

[LeGrandElephant]

Ellie's family was telegraphed. But also, it occurs to me that Chloe's boyfriend had twice added something to point the finger at someone else. One, he said the old guy touched him and other boys, which now seems not to be true. Two, he said he saw Vince hunting with Tom, and we don't know if that's true do we?

[Bebecat]

I really can't stand Miller anymore...she is so smug. Hope she gets burned soon.

Vince has been pretty much my main suspect but now I am not so sure...why reveal it this week? And what is that stupid kid of hers up to??

I hate that Carver covered for his wife...stupid and unprofessional. And obviously did nothing for the kid. Better for her to think her dad is stupid and screwed up a kid-killer case?

Kids are killing kids more and more...it would be totally realistic for Tommy to be the killer. But I think a major network is too chicken. Maybe if this was on cable.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Bebecat

[Magic]

I think we know that Tom was hunting with Vince because it got brought up to Vince when he was in jail and he didn't deny it.

 

Vince seems like the most obvious suspect.  But Danny's phone went on while Vince is in jail so that points to me it isn't Vince.

 

And I think Carver told Elle to bring in the computer because he suspects something is up with her kid and he's testing her to see how much she knows or admits.  It fits his dysfunctional personality to set something like that up.

 

At this point, there is no way they can tie up all the loose ends.  There are too many storylines and maybe like in real life, some people's secrets, like Jacks, come out in a situation like this and some don't. 

 

Tom totally creeped me out from the moment I first saw him.  But then again, so did the priest, Vince, Susan and psychic man although him a little less than the others.

 

That priest is up to something that is not good and not religious.

 

Even if the priest and Vince didn't kill Danny, they look like they are involved in evil things anyway.

 

If it ends up being Elle's husband, what a loser show.  He just looks like a guy who is having an affair of his own since obviously no one values him or thinks he is important.  But he seems otherwise pretty clueless and it it totally bad writing to keep him almost completely in the background and then suddenly he is the killer. 

 

Tom seems a lot more obvious, but if Joe helped him hide the evidence even, they are both psycho because they don't look guilty enough around each other and Joe should be the jumpy bitchy person to Elle with that kind of secret to hide not vice versa.  Vince seems the most obvious especially with that van being hidden in the trees by the cliff.  But the phone rules him out.  The priest is the other psycho with his interference, and anger, and whatever the hell he was going to do with the computer and his passive aggressive interactions with Carter including when he gave him the computer and fingered Tom.

 

The last two episodes especially this one definitely kept my attention, but in retrospect with the limited time left of one episode, I don't think there is anyway I am going to be able to have any satisfaction with how this show ends there are too many creepy sickos in this town who are going to get away with their own perversions no matter who killed Danny.

[HermitsUnited]

^ Interesting points.

 

Couple of things.

 

Firstly, I think it was Danny not Tom who went out hunting with Vince. If I recall correctly, this is what Dean told the Solano family at dinner. I don't think Tom was part of that. After all, the pair had apparently parted ways by all accounts now. The hunting thing is how Vince and Danny knew each other so well (and the slightly unbelievable reason that Vince has the Danny tattoo).

 

Secondly, I think Carver's reasoning for not telling Ellie about the computer was completely sound. He knows exactly how she works. We've seen all season how she makes excuse after excuse for the townspeople. So when Carver suddenly finds himself in possession of her son's bashed up computer (which comes with a threat against the Vicar) is he really going to be straight with her? Imagine if he had told her he'd been handed Tom's computer. She'd have become Tom's advocate within a second. That's her right as his mother of course, but she's also the second in command of a murder investigation. She can't have that sort of bias. Also if you've suddenly got evidence pointing towards the Miller family would it really be wise to tip off Ellie? It's a totally left field line of inquiry that neither Carver nor Ellie have considered previously, and as far as Carver's concerned you really can't trust anyone. He's been burned before by fellow police officers (even worse, she also happened to be his wife). Is he really going to risk blowing this case by giving Ellie a heads up? She could be in on it for all he knows - and his suspicions are bound to have been raised because he hadn't considered the Millers until now. What he's done is plant the seed of suspicion in Ellie's mind. He's letting her come round to the idea that maybe she's missing the obvious. To my mind it seems much safer, and almost kinder.

 

Finally, your points regarding Joe's possible involvement. I don't think he's a background character at all. He's been so obviously in frame all along that if it's him, we're going to feel like kicking ourselves for not considering him. In my opinion he's no less "creepy" than any of the other residents.

 

The point of Gracepoint is to show you that if there'd never been a murder in the first place, why weren't residents ever bothered by what was going on behind the scenes all along? It's like real life. Nobody pays any attention to anything until something major happens. Think about it. Nobody in Gracepoint ever would have cared about Jack's background before Danny's murder. Nobody felt the need to question his past. Nobody was aware of the soft drug dealing that the kids were involved in before the murder. Admittedly nobody is bothered with that even now...but as has been established Ellie's a forgiving cop *rolls eyes*. Gemma and Mark were carrying on behind Beth's back regardless. How many other husbands or wives are cheating in Gracepoint? If the murder had never happened Vince would still be out hunting wildlife every night. Pastor Paul would still be pining over Beth. Creepy Susan would still be attempting to reconnect with Vince. All that stuff would still have happened without the murder, it's just nobody would have cared or noticed.

 

The point is to make you think...well what goes on that I'm not aware of? It's a reminder that everybody has secrets in this world.

 

And the stuff in Gracepoint - it comes across as so bizarre because people reacted to the murder. They changed their behaviour. And admittedly some of them became creepier *coughVincecough*

[CarpeDiem54]

Finally got to watch. I said it weeks ago and say it again - Tom is skeevy and creeps me out. I hope it's him as it will serve Ellie right.

[Bebecat]

It is like they dragged out nine episodes and now will have to cram too much int number ten...

[LeGrandElephant]

When Ellie was interrogating Susan, she said that as a mother she would protect her son no matter what he did.

Edited December 6, 2014 by LeGrandElephant

[saber5055]

At the very beginning of the first episode, we are shown the Solano family and others sleeping, and the time on the bedside clocks are shown. Does anyone remember if Tom was shown? I remember Beth sitting up like she'd had a bad dream. Wouldn't that be a kicker if she were Danny's killer and she's just psycho crazy, the grief she's going through is because she killed her own son?

 

I know, I know, I'm just making things up.

 

I cannot imagine letting my spouse off the hook for screwing up a murder investigation while she's screwing someone else. And letting my kid think I'm the loser. No, altruism doesn't go nearly that far in my book. I'd roast that "other half" over an open campfire before I let that person ruin my life while she (and the killer) go Scot free.

[sarahlee]

Regarding Carver taking the heat for his ex so that his daughter didn't have to think poorly of her mother - how is that any different than her thinking poorly of her father? It made no sense to me. So he allows himself to be humiliated and run out of town in order to protect an ex who was cheating on him? Really?

As for the rest of it - I am also leaning toward Tom with an assist from either Vince or Joe or both. I thought Ellie's "What do you do all day" question was interesting timing as she seems to really not know at all what her family is up to.

Lastly, I think Carver was continuing his play when he asked Ellie for Tom's computer. It has bugged me to no end that they have not gotten Tom's phone and computer before now anyway. Ellie said that Tom and Danny used to text all the time. Danny's phone is missing. Wouldn't they at least be interested in seeing the phone of his supposed "best friend" and see if they could gather any information from it? As of right now, I don't think anyone knows that Tom deleted all the texts.