S02.E08: Dundee

[SHD]

Why do the Roys ever travel as a family? It never turns out well.

[Eyes High]

12 minutes ago, SHD said:

Why do the Roys ever travel as a family? It never turns out well.

Well, this time only one person was horribly humiliated, and this time the humiliation was entirely self-inflicted, unlike in Hungary, so...progress?

[teddysmom]

53 minutes ago, rue721 said:

And what would he care about the whistle-blower's complaints in particular? He thinks Waystar is literally burning the world to ash and he's still cashing his distribution checks and showing up to board meetings, same as every other sellout at that table.

The WB could know Ewan. People high up in a company know the people who sit on the board, esp if they want to take the company down and they know Ewan and Logan don't get along

[sistermagpie]

10 hours ago, TomGirl said:

Did anyone else think that Logan was going to decide at the last moment to announce Shiv as his successor after all?

I was worried for her there, yeah.

10 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

So I went to sleep thinking "Yay, Shiv!" and woke up thinking "Rhea played that whole damn family and staged a coup". I'm expecting the new whistleblower to be working for Rhea, and the surprise party with everybody Logan ever met to have been arranged so that the whole world knows he's turning everything over to Rhea. She herded that whole family like a sheepdog.

I don't think so. None of these people are really as smart as they'd like to think they are. They all have lucky moments and then times where they fall on their face. I think Rhea just had the element of surprise on her side for a bit and now she's genuinely set up by Shiv to deal with the Cruise ships stuff.

6 hours ago, Eyes High said:

Kendall supposedly cares so much about his father's opinion that one "awesome" too many from Jennifer was enough to get Kendall to ghost her, but he pursued a relationship with Naomi after the Pierce deal went south, knowing full well how strongly his father feels about disloyalty. So which is it?

Big difference between Disapproval and Contempt. Naomi was low-leveling threatening and there was something to that. Jennifer just came across as supremely unimpressive. He saw her through Logan's eyes and found her wanting. (Remember Roman judging his girlfriend the same way and coming out on the other side.)

Also I wonder if Rhea's flattering about how it's "always been" Kendall was working on him too. But mostly I think it's just that he thought she made him look bad. Ironic, of course, given that he just did that...rap.

6 hours ago, Eyes High said:

Logan seemed incredibly out of character. He has never been that warm and sweet with anyone in the entire show's history. He was even treating Greg as an actual human in terms of listening to his concerns and giving him an honest answer, instead of treating him like an insect as usual.

I thought he was being nice to him because he was using him against his brother. Greg was telling him that he had to leave because that was important to his grandfather so Logan turned on the "I'm your grandfather now" temporary charm. He doesn't always treat Greg badly. He's a beautiful Ichabod Crane fuck, after all!

6 hours ago, RealReality said:

Jennifer was talked into the come up and so I hope Kendall doesn't fully yank the rug out from under her and at least helps her out with a movie career or something.  I'm sure those were some luxury soaps, I'd have stowed some away too.  I love fancy soaps.

As much of a dick as he was, Jennifer shot herself in the foot abandoning a professional show, no matter how bad, to run off. That's going to get around and damage her career and she was dumb to give up a chance to be seen. People don't blame the actor for the play being bad. Kendall saw something in her when she was onstage.

6 hours ago, RealReality said:

 wonder if Rhea is sort of testing them all.  What doesnt make sense to me is that Kendall would show is hand is such a useless play.  Like, so what, you fucked Rhea with the rose suggestion.  It annoyed Logan, but accomplished little else and didn't push the needle very far at all.  It would have been better for Kendall to play his hand when he had higher stakes.  Now Rhea knows she can't trust him.

I think annoying Logan is a huge thing. Everything pretty much rests on whether or not one is annoying Logan. In a way the family did do what Shiv wanted, fucking with her from different directions.

4 hours ago, Eyes High said:

It's especially rich of Kendall, who is incredibly inarticulate and who liberally peppers his language with "fuck," "dude" and "bro," to judge someone for using "awesome" several times in the same conversation.

And just did that rap! In front of people!

1 hour ago, rue721 said:

How would Ewan and the whistleblower have even gotten into contact, though? He's some old curmudgeon on a farm in Canada, nobody knows him and nobody really wants to.

I don't think he would go for the jugular anyhow. He wasn't even willing to abstain from the loss of confidence vote against Logan last year, he came into town specifically for it and voted to help his brother out.

I agree. I don't think Ewan's playing any long, deep game. As said above, I think most of these people aren't really thinking that far ahead. They try sometimes, but always wind up having to improvise. I think Ewan just in the moment got mad at Greg and isn't getting himself so dirty as to be working with a whistle blower. 

And if he was, that would still be a terrible thing to do to his grandson, protecting him only on the condition that he obeys him to keep an inheritance. 

It does make Greg a lot more interesting, though (not that he wasn't already) to think he's the poor relationship with a distant inheritance dangled before him all his life.

52 minutes ago, SHD said:

Why do the Roys ever travel as a family? It never turns out well.

You'd think they were Real Housewives!

[Princess Sparkle]

One thing I noticed that I forgot to mention before - when Gerri said "Another round of boar on the floor", Shiv didn't seem surprised at all or even register it as being something strange. Which means either Tom told her (which I kind of doubt) or Boar on the Floor was something that happened often enough in the Roy household that she knows exactly what it is.

[ahpny]

Quote

Jeremy Strong can rap a bit.  It was meant to be embarrassing, out of place, but he won some of them over by the time he finished, at least the younger people in the crowd.

From my untrained rap-appreciative ears, his performance seems perfectly fine, but it was so spectacularly inappropriate on almost every level any performance can be. A more embarrassing tribute is hard to imagine. The look on various peoples’ faces (Geri!) said it all.

Quote

He was even treating Greg as an actual human in terms of listening to his concerns and giving him an honest answer, instead of treating him like an insect as usual.

I took that more like treating him as a pawn in a game of now I have new move to screw my good-for-nothing, sanctimonious, thankless, parasitic brother.

Quote

Rhea in previous episodes showed herself canny and manipulative enough to court Logan and sabotage Shiv but was suddenly naive enough to fall for Kendall's "friendly" suggestion of Logan's sister Rose.

Quote

I do think that Rhea, like Logan, is always several steps ahead of everyone else. So she may have been fumbling last night as part of her long-term play. she was being way too clumsy and that's not something we've seen from Rhea before.

Quote

This episode, Rhea kept getting wrong-footed, but yeah...she could be playing a long game. 

Rhea hasn’t been shown previously to be this bad at manipulating or reading people. Why would she trust the Roy kids with anything as important and personal as this, especially before the CEO announcement? It was out of character from what we’ve already seen, and nothing we’ve seen suggests she’s got some “long-term” play in her pocket to lock her in place and weather the cruise ship debacle that’s about to explode. It's hard to imagine her coming out of this well if she knew about that, but who knows? Standing there mumbling about impropriety as Marcia questioned her about her STD status wasn’t a good look for her either.

But kudos to Shiv for clearly outshining her siblings as "best manipulator" of Logan. And she did look great!

[teddysmom]

4 minutes ago, ahpny said:

A more embarrassing tribute is hard to imagine. The look on various peoples’ faces (Geri!) said it all.

Yes Gerri and those two other women were hilarious.

Agree, rapping isn't easy, so for Jeremy to pull that off, and to do it that well, is something. Yes it was totally unexpected but it wasn't bad. 

[rue721]

The rapping and lyrics were actually pretty good, but somehow that makes it even worse?

Like if it had been some playful, off-the-cuff thing, it might have been fun. But it was so uncomfortably earnest and intense...I just can't. 🤣 That guy is possibly the biggest dork in the world.

[sistermagpie]

8 minutes ago, ahpny said:

From my untrained rap-appreciative ears, his performance seems perfectly fine, but it was so spectacularly inappropriate on almost every level any performance can be. A more embarrassing tribute is hard to imagine. The look on various peoples’ faces (Geri!) said it all.

 

 

3 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

Agree, rapping isn't easy, so for Jeremy to pull that off, and to do it that well, is something. Yes it was totally unexpected but it wasn't bad. 

It was really done the perfect way. Jeremy Strong didn't make into something that was OTT ridiculous so that he was winking at the audience, but of course it also wasn't good (not sure what that would have even looked like). It was exactly what Kendall would do. Competent, because this is a guy who's listened to rap music all his life and sung along and is rich enough that he's confident enough to think of course he's cool enough to pull it off. So it wasn't that Jeremy Strong was doing a comedy routine that was genius in itself, it was just embarrassing in its uselessness and kind of boring, really. I mean, it wasn't boring to me in the audience because OMG, it was sublime, but for the people there it would have just been like, "How many verses are there?" Not so cringy that *nobody* yelled "OG" but nobody was particularly into yelling it either.

The genius is in the mediocrity.

Just now, rue721 said:

The rapping and lyrics were actually pretty good, but somehow that makes it even worse?

Like if it had been some playful, off-the-cuff thing, it might have been fun. But it was so uncomfortably earnest and intense...I just can't. 🤣 That guy is possibly the biggest dork in the world.

LOL! This posted as I was writing--exactly. Not only that, but he had that shirt made as well. 

I'll bet Willa's play was been equally mediocre but the large budget made it infinitely worse. (Honestly, who stages expensive productions on Broadway for a non-musical?)

[TimWil]

I’m pretty sure Logan said to Shiv that Jennifer had “a brain like a balloon.”

[ProudMary]

While I was watching and Ewan was giving his speech to Greg, I actually yelled out loud, "Oh my God, he's the whistleblower's backer!" But then I remembered that I'm that person who NEVER correctly sees where the plot is going so I've begun to wonder if the writers are intentionally misdirecting us. 😄

I think Kendall began to sour on Jennifer when she told him that he talks about his father A LOT. That didn't seem to sit too well with him. Her repeated use of "awesome" just sealed the deal.

Sarah Snook's wardrobe throughout the episode was perfect, capped off by her stunning formal attire. She looked incredible.

[TimWil]

1 hour ago, ProudMary said:I think Kendall began to sour on Jennifer when she told him that he talks about his father A LOT. That didn't seem to sit too well with him. Her repeated use of "awesome" just sealed the deal.

If there was ever a time anybody could ever say “He’s told me so much about you” it was Jennifer when Kendall introduced her to Logan. I was surprised she didn’t say it.

1 hour ago, ProudMary said:

I think Kendall began to sour on Jennifer when she told him that he talks about his father A LOT. That didn't seem to sit too well with him. Her repeated use of "awesome" just sealed the deal.

If there ever was the right time for someone to say “He’s told me so much about you” it was Jennifer when being introduced to Logan by Kendall. I was actually surprised she didn’t say that.

[doobiedo]

Reading all of the comments, particularly about Rhea, got me thinking about Rhea’s long game.   She’s cunning and manipulative, so her floundering seemed out of character. The thought occurred to me that the falling out with Nan was staged and that she’s working together with the Pearces with the final result being that somehow the Pearce’s actually take over Waystar - or maybe I’m just overthinking this 

[scrb]

46 minutes ago, doobiedo said:

Reading all of the comments, particularly about Rhea, got me thinking about Rhea’s long game.   She’s cunning and manipulative, so her floundering seemed out of character. The thought occurred to me that the falling out with Nan was staged and that she’s working together with the Pearces with the final result being that somehow the Pearce’s actually take over Waystar - or maybe I’m just overthinking this 

Rhea could serve as CEO for a year but she'll walk away with tens of millions.

Look they were ready to offer the whistleblower $20 million without getting Logan's explicit approval.

So she doesn't need a long game.  If she's greedy, she can try to stay in the job for years and the longer, more money.

But what is the likelihood that Holly Hunter will come back next season?  Maybe she's not booking as much movie roles as she used to but don't be surprised if she's gone after this season.

That means she's got 2 more episodes?

[luckylou]

10 hours ago, stacyasp said:

Ewan  is backing the whistleblower ? Right?

That’s my take on it.  Maybe that is why he wants Greg to quit... after all, he has known Greg was working for Logan for months. (Maybe that is why Frank et al can’t buy off the guy who is threatening to tell all.)  Did Greg burn all the copies or was there a second set?

I do find this episode puzzling.  Kendall’s behavior seems especially odd after we left him, bereft, at the home of the young man who died in the Chappaquidick style incident last week.  We last saw him dropping money through the mail slot of the parents’ house. Suddenly he is rapping, most inappropriately, stealing, then dumping Willa’s actress, misleading Rhea about sister Rose...just generally acting the heal.  We did not see him drinking booze or snorting  coke...until the final scene, when he downs a glass of champagne. Maybe this is Hamlet style craziness.

[Dminches]

I thought this was another great episode.

Shiv taking control and realizing that the best course of action was to let Rhea be the CEO when the shit hits the fan was great.  She is the only adult Roy child.  The rest are stuck in their worlds of barely holding themselves together.

Kendall’s rapping was well done.  

I think Kendall dropped his new girlfriend because he felt that she was too impressed with his dad.  That does seem odd because she also she he always talks about him.  Very confusing.

Great twist that Ewan is backing the whistle blower.  Talk about someone looking a gift horse in the mouth.

Messing with Marcia is a very dangerous path.  She will take down Rhea and Logan with one arm.

[sistermagpie]

3 minutes ago, Dminches said:

I think Kendall dropped his new girlfriend because he felt that she was too impressed with his dad.  That does seem odd because she also she he always talks about him.  Very confusing.

I think it was more the opposite--besides Logan not being impressed with her, Jessica wasn't impressed with Logan. She found it odd how much Kendall talked about him and meeting him could only say it was "awesome" because she doesn't actually care about all his accomplishments. Like if most random people met Rupert Murdock. If you don't hate his guts and aren't somebody who worships somebody like him he's just the dad of this guy you met ho runs some business. She didn't even want to meet him. He introduced her to his God and she couldn't see him.

2 hours ago, luckylou said:

That’s my take on it.  Maybe that is why he wants Greg to quit... after all, he has known Greg was working for Logan for months. (Maybe that is why Frank et al can’t buy off the guy who is threatening to tell all.)  Did Greg burn all the copies or was there a second set?

It just seems too soapy to me. Seems more in keeping with the show if the problem with the cruise ships is what the problem with the cruise ships always was--one of the people the Roys treat like garbage refusing to be treated like garbage rather than a Roy having to seek somebody out to pretend to be that guy for a big payoff. Also if Ewan was behind it I'd have expected Ewan's ranting to at least touch on that issue in some way rather than his usual stuff--the giant problem of climate change and the personal issue of Logan's empire being worth nothing. Like the other Roys, he really doesn't care about other people. It's either The World (which is theirs) or The Personal. It's always narcissistic.

Also if that was Ewan's real plan how much difference would it make if Greg was still on the payroll or not? Either he's just another person who works at the company and could quit in response to the cruise ship revelations or he's implicated in the allegations (which we know he is), in which case him quitting wouldn't change that.

[luckylou]

2 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

I think it was more the opposite--besides Logan not being impressed with her, Jessica wasn't impressed with Logan. She found it odd how much Kendall talked about him and meeting him could only say it was "awesome" because she doesn't actually care about all his accomplishments. Like if most random people met Rupert Murdock. If you don't hate his guts and aren't somebody who worships somebody like him he's just the dad of this guy you met ho runs some business. She didn't even want to meet him. He introduced her to his God and she couldn't see 

Or he saw how unimpressed Logan was with her.  And he, now that Reah has actually been named CEO, is devastated that someone besides him has actually been named.

UNCLE GRUMPY may actually be revolted about the revelations of the cruise lines; references to the news, climate change, etc., seem suspect since he has known about those things forever, and is in fact a member of the board who actually voted for Logan when Kendall challenged him.  

[Lemons]

16 hours ago, rue721 said:

The rapping and lyrics were actually pretty good, but somehow that makes it even worse?

Pretty good if you’re a 7th grader in 2005. 

[Tikichick]

10 hours ago, Dminches said:

Messing with Marcia is a very dangerous path.  She will take down Rhea and Logan with one arm.

IMO Marcia is at full on boil at this point.  I'd be watching my back if I had any hand in her feeling publicly humiliated by everyone thinking Rhea and Logan are involved, at which point Logan abruptly announces Rhea as the new (long-anticipated) CEO out of the clear blue -- in the very same speech he referenced "all of my wives".  That little aside did not sit well, not at all.  

She knows where you sleep, Logan. 

[tennisgurl]

So much to pick apart this week, but I am still reeling from Ken W.A. Oh God, my brain almost exploded about seventy times in a row! And everyone's reactions, especially Roman. "You need to stop." And I thought I would never stop losing my shit over “Grexit” but the show went and topped it.

[teddysmom]

1 hour ago, Lemons said:

Pretty good if you’re a 7th grader in 2005. 

No one said he was going to win a Grammy. 🙂 

For an out of touch white guy, who had someone at the recording company write something about his father, it was a silly fun moment that blew up the real world internet. 

[Eyes High]

32 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

So much to pick apart this week, but I am still reeling from Ken W.A. Oh God, my brain almost exploded about seventy times in a row! And everyone's reactions, especially Roman. "You need to stop." 

I thought it was oddly sweet that Roman, who usually enjoys his brother's humiliations, was completely mortified and tried to put a stop to it. I would have expected that he would be gleefully filming it right along with Tabitha as he tried to film Boar on the Floor.

3 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

No one said he was going to win a Grammy. 🙂 

For an out of touch white guy, who had someone at the recording company write something about his father, it was a silly fun moment that blew up the real world internet. 

As others have speculated, I assume Kendall's fondness for rap was another nod to James Murdoch, this time with Murdoch's love of hip hop music. James Murdoch left Harvard in the 1990s to found Rawkus Records and signed Mos Def and other artists. He later sold the company to Rupert Murdoch's News Corp. 

[sistermagpie]

9 hours ago, luckylou said:

Or he saw how unimpressed Logan was with her.  And he, now that Reah has actually been named CEO, is devastated that someone besides him has actually been named.

Oh, either way that was part of it. He cared about Logan's impression much more than Jennifer's. But I don't think he saw Jennifer being overly impressed with his father because I don't think she cared about him that much.

[Deanie87]

On 9/29/2019 at 10:48 PM, scrb said:

I thought he was kind of a wannabe in the pilot when he got down with the loud hip hop in the back of his limo.

And if I recall correctly, he was listening to Beastie Boys in that scene, which is just perfect.  I love them, but they have to be the epitome of upper class New York white boy rap. As always, RIP MCA.  I know that they said they would never tour again without him, but Kendall Roy is RIGHT THERE!  

This episode had me questioning so many things.  Like, did Kendall really think that his dad would enjoy his "tribute?"  Or was it just kind of embarrassing fuck you?

Did Roman look a tad bit...jealous when he thought that his dad may have bedded Geri?  Or just a little nauseated?  I desperately want his feelings for her to be real.

Did Shiv really think that someone like Rhea would go for someone like Tom, even as an entertaining flirtation?  Come on.  I would buy her hooking up with Gregory before I would buy her hooking up with Tom.  

I loved all of the brutal sibling interaction in this episode.  Yes to Marcia with the lines of the night.  First with STD question and then to Logan "I'm bored. You are booorrring me."  Ha! I love this show!

[tennisgurl]

Marcia was on fire this episode, she is throwing out levels of savagery that even the rest of the Roy's might gasp at! Telling Rhea that she should get tested for STDs because she still sleeps with Logan, her telling Logan that he was boring her and storming off before the plaque is given, I would not piss her off. She looked not thrilled at all about that crack about his wives, she could really throw a wrench into everything if he keeps this up. 

Was I imagining it, or did Roman look a little jealous when someone threw out Logan sleeping with Geri? Or was he just grossed out? That relationship would be Sigmund Freuds wildest dream. 

I honestly really want to see Willa's play, even if its apparently awful. So Conner has a different mom than the rest of the kids, which I didnt realize, and was institutionalized, which is probably true, even if Roman was being his usual crass self about it. With Conner losing money left and right funding Willa's artistic dreams and his other oddball pursuits and his bizarre foray into politics embarrassing the family, I wonder if Logan will try to say he inherited his mothers mental illness and try to have him committed? 

Ewan is such a hypocrite, if he think his brother and his business is so evil and worse than Hitler, why is he still on their board living off their money and not using his time and resources to clean the oceans or whatever? Why did he vote to keep his brother in charge when Kendall tried his coup? I agree that Logan is a garbage person, but Ewan isnt as great as he acts like he is. And threatening to cut Greg out of his will to manipulate him and make him quit is classic Roy rich asshole behavior. It also seems like he didnt help Greg or his mother much financially, he just keeps his will above their heads. I mean, if nothing else, Logan did give him a pretty good job when he showed up and he has gotten to move up and be involved in family/business stuff, even though he is clearly treated as a poor relation/stooge, which is more than his grandpa did. 

Speaking of Greg, he might seem like a fumbling naive dweeb, but I think he is more cunning than he seems. Telling Logan what Grandpa Grump was up to was a good move, because even though Logan certainly gives not one fuck about Greg, he does give a fuck that his brother is trying to poach relatives away from his company and is trying to get Greg to choose sides, and he is always looking to screw over Ewan and be the winner.

I wouldn't be surprised if that really was his team that Roman bought, but Logan was being a dick and decided to fuck with him. 

No Shiv, dont pimp your husband out even if its just flirting with your new rival! God why is it that the Roy sibling that treats their significant other the least like a hooker is the one dating an actual hooker! 

Kendall lost interest in his new girlfriend as soon as she wasnt wowed by his father, and even commented on how weird it was that he talked about his dad so often. I felt bad for her, but dropping a play your the star of (even a crappy one) to have an epic sex session with your new boyfriend isnt cool. Women are just Kendall's new drug of choice, specifically relationships he can disappear into. Well, that and embarrassing rap numbers. 

I mean...that rap... What really kills me is that he had a costume! He had a turn table and  a DJ! He had production values! This was a whole huge thing that he committed to fully! Everyones reactions were amazing, from Gerris complete disdain to Roman desperately trying to get Kendall to stop the madness, to Shiv taking video gleefully, to Greg's dance moves, it was a sight to see. 

[Deanie87]

33 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Was I imagining it, or did Roman look a little jealous when someone threw out Logan sleeping with Geri? Or was he just grossed out? That relationship would be Sigmund Freuds wildest dream. 

Yes, I really need to know this!  But I'm not sure how I want it to go down.  I kind of want Roman to have genuine feelings for her, but I don't want Geri getting involved with any of that mess.  I guess I could settle for a mutually affectionate power couple arrangement, but I want to know what Roman's sexual deal is.  Did he imply that he was molested by a camp counselor?  I didn't quite get what he was saying there.  

[Eyes High]

10 minutes ago, Deanie87 said:

I guess I could settle for a mutually affectionate power couple arrangement, but I want to know what Roman's sexual deal is.  Did he imply that he was molested by a camp counselor?  I didn't quite get what he was saying there.  

Roman also said that Connor sexually abused him in S1, seemingly in jest. On the other hand, Roman has an established MO of casually stating things that happen to be true that are dismissed because everyone assumes he's joking--telling everyone at breakfast in 2x05 that he had masturbated in Gerri's bathroom, for one--so who knows?

One thing that is clear is that Roman gets off on humiliation. Judging from his unconvincing denial of the rumour that his (male) personal trainer had jacked him off, I don't think it matters whether a man or woman is doing the humiliating.

Quote

I kind of want Roman to have genuine feelings for her, but I don't want Geri getting involved with any of that mess.

I'm sure that Roman has as genuine feelings for Gerri as Roman can have for anyone, although he isn't able to express those feelings without proposing mutual cannibalism. I wouldn't worry about Gerri. She's been at Waystar for a very long time, and I doubt she would have survived at the company for that length of time without a healthy self-preservation instinct. If this Roman thing gets too messy or too weird for her, I'm sure she'll crisply put a stop to it.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Eyes High

[cardigirl]

I still don't think Shiv is the end-all, be-all, but she played it well at this event. Rhea may have been out-maneuvered or not, we shall see.   But Marcia really came into her own I think. Threatening Rhea, without really saying a threat (talking about losing an eye), and telling her husband he was boring her, was great. 

Greg and Tom are still favorites to watch.  Shiv better watch how she treats Tom, although I fear he will become the sacrificial lamb for Waystar.  

And I didn't cringe during the rapping session, I was too busy enjoying the others' reactions. 

[teddysmom]

1 hour ago, Eyes High said:

I'm sure that Roman has as genuine feelings for Gerri as Roman can have for anyone, although he isn't able to express those feelings without proposing mutual cannibalism. I wouldn't worry about Gerri. She's been at Waystar for a very long time, and I doubt she would have survived at the company for that length of time without a healthy self-preservation instinct. If this Roman thing gets too messy or too weird for her, I'm sure she'll crisply put a stop to it.

I think Roman needs a mother, and he's confused about Gerri. She does seem to be more a mother/mentor figure and he is confusing his feelings with romantic love, when it's actually an older woman who isn't playing mind games or withholding, and he doesn't realize that he what he feels is what a son feels for his mother, not romantic love.

All three of the younger kids are fucked up re romantic relationships.

Also, I love Tabitha and don't want her written off the show. So we need to figure out how to not have Roman break up with her. 

Edited October 1, 2019 by teddysmom

[Deanie87]

1 hour ago, teddysmom said:

I think Roman needs a mother, and he's confused about Gerri. She does seem to be more a mother/mentor figure and he is confusing his feelings with romantic love, when it's actually an older woman who isn't playing mind games or withholding, and he doesn't realize that he what he feels is what a son feels for his mother, not romantic love.

All three of the younger kids are fucked up re romantic relationships.

Also, I love Tabitha and don't want her written off the show. So we need to figure out how to not have Roman break up with her. 

3 hours ago, Eyes High said:

I wouldn't worry about Gerri. She's been at Waystar for a very long time, and I doubt she would have survived at the company for that length of time without a healthy self-preservation instinct. If this Roman thing gets too messy or too weird for her, I'm sure she'll crisply put a stop to it.

I love that Gerri is just matter of fact about it all.  She isn't slightly flattered, she isn't nervous, she isn't overly grossed out.  She is exactly what you would expect a woman of her age and intellegence to be - someone who has seen some shit and dealt with men like Logan, Kendall, Tom, and even Roman her entire career and not much fazes her after all.  

[rue721]

She also has dealt with these particular men for a very long time. It seems like she and Frank have worked for Logan for decades and basically watched the Roy kids grow up.

[preeya]

On 9/30/2019 at 2:50 PM, TimWil said:

I’m pretty sure Logan said to Shiv that Jennifer had “a brain like a balloon.”

His exact words were: 

Logan: Seen Kendall's latest?

Shiv: Uh... Yeah.

Logan:   Mind like a balloon.   (SHIV CHUCKLES)

[scrb]

On 9/30/2019 at 1:30 PM, sistermagpie said:

I'll bet Willa's play was been equally mediocre but the large budget made it infinitely worse. (Honestly, who stages expensive productions on Broadway for a non-musical?)

I can't imagine how large the budget could be.

At most something like $20 million?

Would that wreck Conor?

Remember Stewy and Sandy offered Kendall $500 million for his stake in Waystar.  So you figure Shiv and Roman have similar stakes, worth several hundred million each, maybe over a billion.

So what is Conor worth?  Can't imagine he would only have say 1/10th of the other Roy siblings.

Big movies can have budgets approaching $100 million but how expensive could broadway plays be?

[luckylou]

7 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Marcia was on fire this episode, she is throwing out levels of savagery that even the rest of the Roy's might gasp at! Telling Rhea that she should get tested for STDs because she still sleeps with Logan, her telling Logan that 

Ewan is such a hypocrite, if he think his brother and his business is so evil and worse than Hitler, why is he still on their board living off their money and not using his time and resources to clean the oceans or whatever? Why did he vote to keep his brother in charge when Kendall tried his coup? I agree that Logan is a garbage person, but Ewan isnt as great as he acts like he is

Speaking of Greg, he might seem like a fumbling naive dweeb, but I think he is more cunning than he seems. Telling Logan what Grandpa Grump was up to was a good move, because even though Logan certainly gives not one fuck about Greg, he does give a fuck that his brother is trying to poach relatives away from his company and is trying to get Greg to choose sides, and he is always looking to screw over Ewan and be the winner.

I wouldn't be surprised if that really was his team that Roman bought, but Logan was being a dick and decided to fuck with him. 

I mean...that rap... What really kills me is that he had a costume! He had a turn table and  a DJ! He had production values! This was a whole huge thing that he committed to fully! Everyones reactions were amazing, from Gerris complete disdain to Roman desperately trying to get Kendall to stop the madness, to Shiv taking video gleefully, to Greg's dance moves, it was a sight to see. 

1)  Maybe Ewen is primarily upset about the revelations about the cruise lines. He has known about the rest of it and has backed his brother for a long time, but maybe the cruise scandal is a step too far for him.

2) Greg is a big question.  He frequently makes surprise moves that appear very savvy.  Still, Uncle Fun is not much fun.

3) Logan would never forget which was his team, and I imagine everyone but Roman also knows which team he supported, so it would be hard fib about that.

4) I agree.  Just imagine,  he actually planned the rap, practiced it, and donned a costume.  What could he have been thinking?  This seems out of character but who knows, maybe it was part of some sort of plan that he had.

[sistermagpie]

47 minutes ago, luckylou said:

1)  Maybe Ewen is primarily upset about the revelations about the cruise lines. He has known about the rest of it and has backed his brother for a long time, but maybe the cruise scandal is a step too far for him.

Am I missing something about this? Why would we even assume that Ewan knows about the whistleblower? Is the idea just that if he is funding the whistleblower that's also why he now wants Greg to quit?

[teddysmom]

10 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Is the idea just that if he is funding the whistleblower that's also why he now wants Greg to quit?

He said something to Logan along the lines of "the end of your empire". 

He just likes to boss Greg around. He's as much as asshole as Logan. Remember when he forced Greg to eat whatever the fuck that was, before Greg went to dinner with Tom and ate the little bird?  Who does that?  If someone doesn't want to eat, you don't force them. If you're worried about waste and you like what they had, have the restaurant put it in a carry out container. 

I think Ewan is uber jealous of Logan, so he acts like he's this high and mighty environmentalist, savior of the universe.  Whatever. 

[BlackberryJam]

Ewan is a total sanctimonious dick and bully, the same as Logan. 

That only makes me wonder what happened with sister Rose.

[luckylou]

13 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Am I missing something about this? Why would we even assume that Ewan knows about the whistleblower? Is the idea just that if he is funding the whistleblower that's also why he now wants Greg to quit?

I thought there had been an article in a magazine, which is how he would know about the cruise scandal.  Or did I misunderstand?  I thought they had not been able to shut that down in the episode that features the Pierce woman walking out on the deal with WayStar?  

I don’t think we have any actual evidence to believe Ewen is backing the whistleblower...  Just a hunch.  Why does he suddenly want Greg to quit?  

Maybe the whistle blower has gone to Sandy for backing.  Or, maybe he is just an uber straight arrow, uninterested in money but dedicated to revealing wrong doing.

[sistermagpie]

3 hours ago, teddysmom said:

He just likes to boss Greg around. He's as much as asshole as Logan. Remember when he forced Greg to eat whatever the fuck that was, before Greg went to dinner with Tom and ate the little bird?  Who does that?  If someone doesn't want to eat, you don't force them. If you're worried about waste and you like what they had, have the restaurant put it in a carry out container. 

And at Thanksgiving he didn't let him have lunch, had him drive him all the way to New York, then demanded to be driven back as soon as Greg was finally able to sit down at the table to eat something.

40 minutes ago, luckylou said:

I thought there had been an article in a magazine, which is how he would know about the cruise scandal.  Or did I misunderstand?  I thought they had not been able to shut that down in the episode that features the Pierce woman walking out on the deal with WayStar?

Could be and I just don't remember the details. 

40 minutes ago, luckylou said:

Maybe the whistle blower has gone to Sandy for backing.  Or, maybe he is just an uber straight arrow, uninterested in money but dedicated to revealing wrong doing.

Or the whistle blower isn't being backed by anybody and would rather go public than make a lot of money for his/her silence. 

[heavysnaxx]

On 9/30/2019 at 6:44 AM, RealReality said:

That whole thing with Jennifer and the "awesomes" was weird.  It seemed like maybe Kendall was mad that she was overly effusive towards Logan?  But she didn't even really want to meet logan!  

Kendall saw that Logan thought she was an airhead when she went over Logan's Limit on Acceptable "Awesome" Usage. If the old man doesn't like her, Kendall doesn't like her.

[heavysnaxx]

On 9/30/2019 at 8:15 PM, Dminches said:

Messing with Marcia is a very dangerous path.  She will take down Rhea and Logan with one arm.

On 10/1/2019 at 10:49 AM, tennisgurl said:

Marcia was on fire this episode, she is throwing out levels of savagery that even the rest of the Roy's might gasp at! Telling Rhea that she should get tested for STDs because she still sleeps with Logan, her telling Logan that he was boring her and storming off before the plaque is given, I would not piss her off. She looked not thrilled at all about that crack about his wives, she could really throw a wrench into everything if he keeps this up. 

Marcia is the knife in your gut while it appears the two of you are having a charming intimate chat. When she leaned/loomed over teeny little Rhea and said in that lovely French accent, "I just want to make sure you are clean."

My stars, if I were a rapping individual, I might be tempted to do something with the fact that the last three letters of "Marcia" are C-I-A.

[teddysmom]

5 hours ago, BlackberryJam said:

Ewan is a total sanctimonious dick and bully, the same as Logan. 

That only makes me wonder what happened with sister Rose.

I start getting a Dumbledore vibe from the two brothers, and the dead sister.  

[rue721]

I guess I don't see what's so badass about Marcia asking if Rhea has STDs?

Like OK, Marcia, as long as Rhea's clean, then it's no big. Come on. Logan insults her publicly left and right ("all my wives") and Marcia being kind of catty off to the side really doesn't matter a whole lot in the grand scheme. She has some power as his wife, but not in terms of controlling his behavior or controlling anything else really, just in terms of her access to great wealth/power by virtue of her often being literally, physically near it.

If I were Rhea, I would just have been all American-style cheery:  "Yup, clean as a whistle!" and moved on.

Edited October 2, 2019 by rue721

[sistermagpie]

36 minutes ago, rue721 said:

I guess I don't see what's so badass about Marcia asking if Rhea has STDs?

Like OK, Marcia, as long as Rhea's clean, then it's no big. Come on. Logan insults her publicly left and right ("all my wives") and Marcia being kind of catty off to the side really doesn't matter a whole lot in the grand scheme. She has some power as his wife, but not in terms of controlling his behavior or controlling anything else really, just in terms of her access to great wealth/power by virtue of her often being literally, physically near it.

If I were Rhea, I would just have been all American-style cheery:  "Yup, clean as a whistle!" and moved on.

Yeah, or Rhea could have pointed out Marcia was really the one who needed regular testing since apparently her husband sleeps around enough that she assumes any woman he talks to is with him that way.

[heavysnaxx]

44 minutes ago, rue721 said:

I guess I don't see what's so badass about Marcia asking if Rhea has STDs?

Like OK, Marcia, as long as Rhea's clean, then it's no big. Come on. Logan insults her publicly left and right ("all my wives") and Marcia being kind of catty off to the side really doesn't matter a whole lot in the grand scheme. She has some power as his wife, but not in terms of controlling his behavior or controlling anything else really, just in terms of her access to great wealth/power by virtue of her often being literally, physically near it.

If I were Rhea, I would just have been all American-style cheery:  "Yup, clean as a whistle!" and moved on.

Marcia is not catty, whatever that painfully gendered term even means. Marcia is f#*king menacing in that scene. Here's why:

-Marcia physically dominates the frame, practically squeezing Rhea out.

-Rhea is visibly cringing and isn't able to make eye contact with Marcia.

-Marcia has gotten in Rhea's space and is staying there with smiling self-composure.

-Marcia has just told Rhea to her face, with impeccable surface courtesy, that Rhea's vagina may not be as clean as it should be.

-Marcia's quietness makes you realize the etymological connection between "intimate" and "intimidate."

Image: Screenshot of Marcia telling Rhea, "So, I will be more relaxed to know that you are clean."

Edited October 2, 2019 by heavysnaxx

[Tikichick]

1 hour ago, heavysnaxx said:

Marcia is not catty, whatever that painfully gendered term even means. Marcia is f#*king menacing in that scene. Here's why:

-Marcia physically dominates the frame, practically squeezing Rhea out.

-Rhea is visibly cringing and isn't able to make eye contact with Marcia.

-Marcia has gotten in Rhea's space and is staying there with smiling self-composure.

-Marcia has just told Rhea to her face, with impeccable surface courtesy, that Rhea's vagina may not be as clean as it should be.

-Marcia's quietness makes you realize the etymological connection between "intimate" and "intimidate."

Image: Screenshot of Marcia telling Rhea, "So, I will be more relaxed to know that you are clean."

At the end of the day Marcia isn't even talking to Rhea about anything sexual at all.

[sugarbaker design]

One thing about these writers:  they understand alcoholism and drug addiction.  Even when KenWA isn't seemingly drinking or using he is still suffering from untreated alcoholism and addiction:  always looking for the easy way out, totally self-centered, mired in self-pity.  Ken is a fictionalized Hunter Biden.  He can't get a job on his own.  He rides his family's coattails, I'd bet Hunter performed a rap song at his Dad's birthday party!

[luckylou]

@sugarbaker design... 

the writers do do a good job of capturing the addictive personality here...

And when the “awesome” girl commented that Ken talked about his dad all the time, she really showed herself not to be a complete “balloon” head.  Ken is obsessed with his dad and by his desire to be praised by Logan.  He wants to run the company, yes, but what he really wants is Logan’s approval.  

[nb360]

Marcia is the only character I "like."