S04.E01: A Girl from Arizona

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

With Eleanor assuming the role of the architect, the group adapts to the challenges facing them when four test subjects inhabit a new neighborhood under their supervision.

Original air date: 9/26/19

[scrb]

Awesome that it's back.

Sad that it's the final season.

[Ceindreadh]

1 hour ago, scrb said:

Awesome that it's back.

Sad that it's the final season.

At least though TPTB knew in advance it was going to be a final season.  It would suck if it had been cancelled without warning.

[bros402]

They chose to end it at this point, it is going to be great.

[cpcathy]

Preview clip is up, perhaps on YouTube. I got it on Twitter.

[bethy]

Sadly, honestly, not enough Chidi. I did love his enthusiasm for the Good Place and his excitement over being able to summon books from his bookshelves. 

[shoregirl]

LOL the Bad Places song is the Kars4Kids. Seems spot on.

[Dots And Stripes]

I loved Simone's reaction to the Good Place. It seems fitting that she would look for the science behind anything. Also, Janet has developed the ability to be passive aggressive.

[Chaos Theory]

I figured Shaun was cheating with  Linda about a minute before the reveal.  My guess though was that he had managed to sneak in a honest to god bad person like a serial killer or something.  Hot shirtless demon whose name I keep forgetting was funny though.

i thought this was a good opening episode for the final season.   Loved Simone and how the one person who should have been the easiest turns out to cause the most trouble.

[Kiddvideo]

Have they always been able to summon objects? Did I miss something somewhere?

Loved the whole thing. The Kars 4 Kids might be worse than the penis bees. And loved how Derek face-planted just like Janet when she got rebooted. Mindy definitely needs some alone time.

Will have to watch it tomorrow when it streams to look at the backgrounds. Too much goes on for me to catch them first time around.

[Linny]

This seemed slightly...aimless? Like we just treaded water and didn't really get anywhere. Way too much time spent talking about the obvious demon disguised as Linda (Bad Janet's right, Eleanor's slipping if she didn't clock that from the get-go) and way too much Derek/Jason rivalry (though I did get a kick from seeing Mindy, as always). I wanted a little more from Eleanor and Chidi than just her worry over him bonding with Simone, especially since that went nowhere in this episode. Maybe I should just be patient and have faith that things will pick up in the forthcoming episodes.

All that being said, there were some genuinely great things in this one. Brent annoying everyone by spewing knowledge from the privileged douche's playbook, Simone singing Semi-Charmed Life, and Tahani name dropping Robert Downey Jr. within the first three minutes of the episode were all highlights. Tahani just wouldn't be able to bear it if Michael got a goatee, too, hee!

This was a good episode for Eleanor, too, with her attempts at team-leading and her muttered complaints about Michael. Interesting that she was able to put aside her misgivings over introducing Chidi and Simone for the greater good but was so quick to assert her territory when the judge got a little too thirsty for Chidi. I love that no matter how much she's matured, there's still roots of her trashbag Arizona upbringing poking out from time to time. And how good did Eleanor look in her SVU pantsuit and her cocktail dress? I really like seeing Eleanor in this new position of authority, where instead of reacting to each new revelation, she now knows exactly what the score is and can craft a strategy accordingly.

[phalange]

“Stonehenge was a sex thing.” Lmao

The Kars for Kids song being the official theme of the Bad Place is perfect. And of course they tried to cheat; I expect no less. Though “Linda” was nowhere near as bad as the two guys. Even Janet was 100% done. 

Poor Eleanor having to introduce Chidi to Simone. 

Jason was hilarious as always. “I don’t have time to explain and also I forgot.” 

Edited September 27, 2019 by phalange

[SammyBeBop]

I have a sneaking suspicion something hinky happened with Janet on the train at the end. Like, maybe they swapped her with a new, unevolved Janet.

[BobH]

19 minutes ago, Linny said:

This seemed slightly...aimless? Like we just treaded water and didn't really get anywhere.

I’m wondering if they expected a one hour season open like they’ve had every previous year?  Looks like it was produced as such, with a part 1 / part 2 title and same writers/director for both parts.  Given that, I’ll reserve judgement, and I have the feeling that next week might really flip the table, using stuff set up this week.

Edited September 27, 2019 by BobH

[tennisgurl]

So Stonehenge was a sex thing AND Shirley Temple assassinated JFK?!? It all makes too much sense! And Kars for Kids as the official theme of the Bad Place? That sounds pretty on brand. 

"I will remove your eyelids and make you watch videos of soldiers reuniting with their dogs."

I am so thrilled that this show is back! Its sad that its the last season, but I am happy thats its ending on its own terms and that its going out strong and not sticking around even after the show has clearly run its curse. 

[BobH]

7 minutes ago, SammyBeBop said:

Like, maybe they swapped her with a new, unevolved Janet.

Maybe Disco Janet?  You don’t introduce the concept of Disco Janet in chapter 40 and not show her by the final act...

[Enginerd]

Not enough Chidi yet, but there was an ad for almond milk during the broadcast.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

[Cerulean]

I really thought Derek’s “kids” would be wonky. Didn’t expect that Derek would himself interfere. 

[AnimeMania]

So did they completely throw out the concept that everybody in the Good Place has a "Soulmate".

[bros402]

4 hours ago, Linny said:

This seemed slightly...aimless? Like we just treaded water and didn't really get anywhere. Way too much time spent talking about the obvious demon disguised as Linda (Bad Janet's right, Eleanor's slipping if she didn't clock that from the get-go) and way too much Derek/Jason rivalry (though I did get a kick from seeing Mindy, as always). I wanted a little more from Eleanor and Chidi than just her worry over him bonding with Simone, especially since that went nowhere in this episode. Maybe I should just be patient and have faith that things will pick up in the forthcoming episodes.

All that being said, there were some genuinely great things in this one. Brent annoying everyone by spewing knowledge from the privileged douche's playbook, Simone singing Semi-Charmed Life, and Tahani name dropping Robert Downey Jr. within the first three minutes of the episode were all highlights. Tahani just wouldn't be able to bear it if Michael got a goatee, too, hee!

This was a good episode for Eleanor, too, with her attempts at team-leading and her muttered complaints about Michael. Interesting that she was able to put aside her misgivings over introducing Chidi and Simone for the greater good but was so quick to assert her territory when the judge got a little too thirsty for Chidi. I love that no matter how much she's matured, there's still roots of her trashbag Arizona upbringing poking out from time to time. And how good did Eleanor look in her SVU pantsuit and her cocktail dress? I really like seeing Eleanor in this new position of authority, where instead of reacting to each new revelation, she now knows exactly what the score is and can craft a strategy accordingly.

Keep in mind, for every other season, we saw both parts of the premiere in one night - now we don't get to see Part 2 until next week.

4 hours ago, SammyBeBop said:

I have a sneaking suspicion something hinky happened with Janet on the train at the end. Like, maybe they swapped her with a new, unevolved Janet.

I have a feeling Michael got swapped. They did remind us of the Michael suit in the Previously On

[Chaos Theory]

One of the clever things about season 4 is that Eleanor and Chidi are almost completely reversed from how they were in the pilot.   Eleanor was the most selfish girl in the world through a good part of season 1 who couldn’t even get Chidi’s name right and now she knows literally everything about him.   While Chidi knows nothing about her.

[albinerhawk]

4 hours ago, bros402 said:

Keep in mind, for every other season, we saw both parts of the premiere in one night - now we don't get to see Part 2 until next week.

I have a feeling Michael got swapped. They did remind us of the Michael suit in the Previously On

I'm wondering if both of them got swapped since they were together. If only one were swapped that would defeat the purpose, as the other one would go inform the others. There was something definitely off about the camera work around Janet when they came off the train, but I was also nervous when they initially went onto the train. 

[Bill1978]

Definitely felt like this was one half of an hour long episode, only because the ending didn't have the typical 'twist'. I kept waiting for something to happen be said but it just ended.

[Kanner]

7 hours ago, Enginerd said:

Not enough Chidi yet, but there was an ad for almond milk during the broadcast.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

OMG! I caught that and all I could think of was Chidi. So awesome.

[Catfi9ht]

I love this show so much and am so glad it's back on. I watched it before work this morning then listened to the accompanying podcast episode on my morning commute. There's definitely going to be a void when it's gone (pun intended. 😉)

I love the sheer number of subtle jokes this show continuously provides throughout the episode. There are so many lines which sound like a throw-away, but they're actually super hilarious. My favorite was probably the new toxic masculinity dude (I forget his name) describing his time at Princeton. Second would be Jason's line about how he trusts Chidi because "of his brain and his glasses make him look like the owl that went to college".

Marc Evan Jackson has got to be one of my favorite character actors. His line delivery just makes me laugh at everything he does. Case in point, I giggle every time this commercial is on, and he delivers the line, "It's happening..."

Like I mentioned last year, I'm not sure what the motivation will be for the newcomers to become better people now that they're in The Good Place. However, I trust this show to take me on a hilarious journey regardless.

[Ohiopirate02]

This episode was all set-up, but this is still funnier and better than any other network TV comedy.  I am not surprised that one of the new people was a demon, but I liked the concept of Linda with her flat affect.  

On another note, I wish that Jason could hear about Gardner Minshew II.  

[SailorGirl]

I'm wondering if the reset is secretly still for the original four and Michael. 

The judge has now set it up so they think they don't have a chance to improve anymore because everything would be motivated by moral dessert.

But, now they know there's nothing they can do, do they just cruise along or do they continue to improve and make the right moral judgments, using their new and improved morality to try to impact others -- in other words, have they truly changed? 

With each of the original four, something happened that makes me think this:

Eleanor's overcoming her resistance to introducing Chidi to Simone because as much as she didn't want to (She was VEXED!), she recognized it had to be done for the greater cause and she did it without selfishness. She's worried but she didn't turn into her selfish Arizona trashbag self and say fuck everybody else, that's my man. 

Same with Tahani -- so far, she's maintaining her changed morality (and also fortunately for us her name dropping!)  in the face of the bitchy gossip columnist -- will that last?

Jason's test is Derek competing for Janet and how Jason will handle that. Him approaching Derek and recognizing that Derek was after Janet but that Jason was going to take the high road reinforced my suspicion that the test is still for the original four. 

I think Chidi's test will ultimately be a choice between Eleanor and Simone, and because he's Chidi, his memory had to be wiped -- there's no way he would have been able to make an unbiased decision otherwise. His stomach wouldn't hurt! 

The judge didn't send a replacement for the old lady -- based on the original terms, she would have had to.  

I could be completely off base, but that's where my mind went last night.

Jeremy Bearimy, baby! 

[Enginerd]

I should have known Linda was the hot shirtless demon in disguise as soon as she asked if there was a gym. For awhile I was thinking the challenge was how to deal with someone so utterly uninterested in anything, including self-improvement. I still think that would be a good plot thread, because people like that are so irritating. Also, what are the moral implications of being so satisfied with mediocrity and so ungenerous in conversation? Would the point system say that this is nirvana, wanting nothing, and therefore morally superior? Or that being a useless lump who appreciates nothing and does nothing for others is damnable? What do we owe to each other? Not to be a joy-sucking party pooper who''s fine with never improving anything?

[Ohiopirate02]

10 minutes ago, Enginerd said:

I should have known Linda was the hot shirtless demon in disguise as soon as she asked if there was a gym. For awhile I was thinking the challenge was how to deal with someone so utterly uninterested in anything, including self-improvement. I still think that would be a good plot thread, because people like that are so irritating. Also, what are the moral implications of being so satisfied with mediocrity and so ungenerous in conversation? Would the point system say that this is nirvana, wanting nothing, and therefore morally superior? Or that being a useless lump who appreciates nothing and does nothing for others is damnable? What do we owe to each other? Not to be a joy-sucking party pooper who''s fine with never improving anything?

I would rather watch the Soul Squad deal with Linda than the other two guys.  I find there is a lot more there to mine for laughs than a mediocre sexist white dude.  On the surface she seems a better character, but I know the writers of this show are smarter than this.  I need to trust them.  

[ClareWalks]

32 minutes ago, Enginerd said:

should have known Linda was the hot shirtless demon in disguise as soon as she asked if there was a gym. 

Oh my god, yes. I can't believe I didn't clock that.

[SailorGirl]

1 hour ago, SailorGirl said:

I'm wondering if the reset is secretly still for the original four and Michael. 

The judge has now set it up so they think they don't have a chance to improve anymore because everything would be motivated by moral dessert.

But, now they know there's nothing they can do, do they just cruise along or do they continue to improve and make the right moral judgments, using their new and improved morality to try to impact others -- in other words, have they truly changed? 

With each of the original four, something happened that makes me think this:

Eleanor's overcoming her resistance to introducing Chidi to Simone because as much as she didn't want to (She was VEXED!), she recognized it had to be done for the greater cause and she did it without selfishness. She's worried but she didn't turn into her selfish Arizona trashbag self and say fuck everybody else, that's my man. 

Same with Tahani -- so far, she's maintaining her changed morality (and also fortunately for us her name dropping!)  in the face of the bitchy gossip columnist -- will that last?

Jason's test is Derek competing for Janet and how Jason will handle that. Him approaching Derek and recognizing that Derek was after Janet but that Jason was going to take the high road reinforced my suspicion that the test is still for the original four. 

I think Chidi's test will ultimately be a choice between Eleanor and Simone, and because he's Chidi, his memory had to be wiped -- there's no way he would have been able to make an unbiased decision otherwise. His stomach wouldn't hurt! 

The judge didn't send a replacement for the old lady -- based on the original terms, she would have had to.  

I could be completely off base, but that's where my mind went last night.

Jeremy Bearimy, baby! 

And here's another reason why I think the reset is still for the original four. 

On day one, things were put in place that made Eleanor realize she wasn't supposed to be there (the memory of her helping the children; the house and clowns, etc.). That was the entire premise of what kicked off the path to improvement. Its what brought Jason in, and by association Tahani and is what triggered the moral philosophy lessons, via the convenience of Eleanor's soul mate being a moral philosophy professor.  

I know its only the first episode of the season and its possible it will be introduced next week, but what is being put before the new test subjects by the Soul Squad acting as the Architects to drop hints that the new test subjects don't actually belong in the good place and begin questioning their purpose there, thereby seeking out Chidi for the morality component?

If they don't put issues in place that make the noobs question whether they're supposed to be there, there's no motivation for them to doubt they belong in the Good Place. If nothing is presented that makes you think otherwise, why would you question whether you belonged somewhere or not? 

The reset is fundamentally unequal, because the original was created by demons with a clear purpose of slow-release torture. The reset isn't based on that premise at all, so how can its purpose, value, goals, and achievements be compared to and measured against the original? 
 

Edited September 27, 2019 by SailorGirl

[Chaos Theory]

Honestly I think the funniest lines of the episode were that Shirley Temple killed JFK and that Stonehenge was a sex thing.

i mean duh on both things.   

And yeah toxic masculinity guy is gonna be interesting.  Especially if the gang are supposed to make him....better.  I mean Tahani is still basically Tahani.  She still name drops and all that but she is the best possible version of herself.   What is the best possible version of a toxic male?  

Edited September 27, 2019 by Chaos Theory

[BobH]

Hm, with the talk of possible doppelgangers, I just remembered that we know about the existence of a certain torture-master named Trent who's a dead ringer for Chidi.

[HazelEyes4325]

My initial thoughts:

1 - I like dead Simone much more than alive Simone (not that I didn't like alive Simone, but dead Simone is awesome).

2 - I want to see Disco Janet

3 - Shawn reminds me far too much of my father-in-law.

[Bruinsfan]

3 hours ago, Bill1978 said:

Definitely felt like this was one half of an hour long episode, only because the ending didn't have the typical 'twist'. I kept waiting for something to happen be said but it just ended.

Yeah, Linda turning out to be Chris was a funny revelation and all (he wore his Linda suit on top of his hunky gym rat human suit? Or is that Chris' actual native form?), but it wasn't the kind of big upset of the status quo that we've previously gotten at the end of a season premiere, and it happened too early.

[Dbolt]

1 hour ago, SailorGirl said:

And here's another reason why I think the reset is still for the original four. 

On day one, things were put in place that made Eleanor realize she wasn't supposed to be there (the memory of her helping the children; the house and clowns, etc.). That was the entire premise of what kicked off the path to improvement. Its what brought Jason in, and by association Tahani and is what triggered the moral philosophy lessons, via the convenience of Eleanor's soul mate being a moral philosophy professor.  

I know its only the first episode of the season and its possible it will be introduced next week, but what is being put before the new test subjects by the Soul Squad acting as the Architects to drop hints that the new test subjects don't actually belong in the good place and begin questioning their purpose there, thereby seeking out Chidi for the morality component?

If they don't put issues in place that make the noobs question whether they're supposed to be there, there's no motivation for them to doubt they belong in the Good Place. If nothing is presented that makes you think otherwise, why would you question whether you belonged somewhere or not? 

The reset is fundamentally unequal, because the original was created by demons with a clear purpose of slow-release torture. The reset isn't based on that premise at all, so how can its purpose, value, goals, and achievements be compared to and measured against the original? 
 

That makes a lot of sense when you consider that there is no way toxic masculinity guy will eve doubt he is not supposed to be in the good place. 

I also love the commercial with the “OK” translator. I like to think it is really Shaun and his glee is actually that he is messing with them. 

[Loandbehold]

14 hours ago, shoregirl said:

LOL the Bad Places song is the Kars4Kids. Seems spot on.

I didn't realize those were national commercials. I thought only my area of the country suffered those ads. While I can't say that I'd prefer the penis bees, some of the other tortures would make for a tough choice.

13 hours ago, Kiddvideo said:

And loved how Derek face-planted just like Janet when she got rebooted. Mindy definitely needs some alone time.

That was awesome. Although he really must work on his guilt tripping. Not even one photo of his "family."

10 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

So did they completely throw out the concept that everybody in the Good Place has a "Soulmate".

That was used so Michael could torture the four of them by putting all of them in such close proximity.

Next time I'm asked to drop some knowledge at a party, Stonehenge was a sex thing will be tops on the list.

[cpcathy]

That was a LOT to digest. It was a bit chaotic, so I'll have to rewatch. Can you guys assist me, why is Eleanor still acting as the architect? Because Michael had a meltdown last episode?

[Chippings]

There are way too many elements to have caught on one viewing, and your comments have been a huge help.

One I had was that Janet seemed flummoxed by being asked to create a popcorn river.  Really ?  She has always been able to create the most enormous things without breaking a sweat.  This caught my attention; might it have some repercussion later?  

[iMonrey]

Whoa, I need a refresher course on this show. I was completely lost this episode. Does anyone know of a good recap of the previous season? I have no idea what's going on. That's the trouble with so much content on TV right now, I forget half of what I watched.

Quote

One I had was that Janet seemed flummoxed by being asked to create a popcorn river. 

Then you see that Jason has a big tub of popcorn in the next scene, LOL.

[Catfi9ht]

AV Club has a good companion series of articles, "The Good Place, annotated". It's a great reference for visual gags or callbacks to previous episodes that might have been missed.

Here's last night's episode: https://tv.avclub.com/the-good-place-annotated-a-girl-from-arizona-part-o-1838489138

[shockermolar]

16 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Hot shirtless demon whose name I keep forgetting was funny though.

But he didn't say he was going to the gym... 

15 hours ago, SammyBeBop said:

I have a sneaking suspicion something hinky happened with Janet on the train at the end. Like, maybe they swapped her with a new, unevolved Janet.

I did notice that when Janet exited we didn't see her face, I assumed because of the dual role thing. But it was obvious enough to be noticed so maybe it was intentional?

Edited September 27, 2019 by shockermolar
cause I added something

[ClareWalks]

14 minutes ago, shockermolar said:

But he didn't say he was going to the gym... 

"Linda" asked Eleanor if there was a fitness center. That was our clue.

[AnimeMania]

41 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Whoa, I need a refresher course on this show. I was completely lost this episode. Does anyone know of a good recap of the previous season? I have no idea what's going on. That's the trouble with so much content on TV right now, I forget half of what I watched.

I watched the last 2 episodes of Season 3 and it all came back.

[bethy]

2 hours ago, Dbolt said:

That makes a lot of sense when you consider that there is no way toxic masculinity guy will eve doubt he is not supposed to be in the good place. 

But there was no way a self-absorbed name dropper like Tahani would ever doubt she was in the good place either. She got there, though.

If the idea is that humans can change, then I hope they intend to show that even those labeled by current society as "the worst" have the capacity to grow and evolve. Because I believe we all can. And it would be more interesting to me to see that process than be stuck with this caricature.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

Whoa, I need a refresher course on this show. I was completely lost this episode. Does anyone know of a good recap of the previous season? I have no idea what's going on. That's the trouble with so much content on TV right now, I forget half of what I watched.

[whiporee]

56 minutes ago, bethy said:

But there was no way a self-absorbed name dropper like Tahani would ever doubt she was in the good place either. She got there, though.

She only got there in season one because she was told. I don't know if she ever figured it out in the 300 years, but while we've seen Tahani accept she's in the bad place, we've never seen her make the actual jump herself. 

I agree with a PP -- what's missing from the new experiment is the idea that two of them KNOW they shouldn't be there -- Jason was given a different name, and Eleanor was shown an entire life that wasn't hers. Two of the four had a situational reasons for wanting to improve. We haven't seen that from the new people, so I imagine John and Brent are like Tahani was -- without any proof to the contrary, they think they deserve to be there and there's no reason to improve.

I had thought that this would be a major problem going forward, but then I remembered what show we're watching, and this whole plotline will probably be dramatically altered by episode 43 -- remember we were fundamentally done with what we thought season two was going to be by Dance Dance Resolution. This show just moves too fast, so I don't think any of these problems or guest starts will be here long. My guess is that Janet explodes or something like it and the story changes on a fundamental level, because that's what this show does. 

[Enginerd]

3 hours ago, Chippings said:

Janet seemed flummoxed by being asked to create a popcorn river.  Really ?  She has always been able to create the most enormous things without breaking a sweat.  This caught my attention; might it have some repercussion later?  

I thought that was odd, also. Even in the very first episode, she was creating/maintaining the place with seemingly no effort. You'd think after so many reboots and upgrades, she'd be so powerful that this would be nothing. Does her increasing human abilities like humor, sarcasm, and love come with increasing human challenges like fatigue and struggle?

[Bruinsfan]

IIRC, creating Derek was a pretty big thing, and now in tandem with him she's created what, hundreds or thousands of new beings of an unprecedented sort? That might involve the sort of strain that she can't quickly recover from.

It's also possible that the metaphysics of The Middle Place don't allow for the kind of effortless multitasking and virtual omnipotence that Janet was accustomed to in her corner of The Bad Place. She used to be powerless there except for the ability to summon the train, right?

[Blakeston]

While I can certainly see Eleanor being annoyed with Toxic Masculinity Guy, I'm not sure I buy him as her worst nightmare (in the way that the vindictive gossip blogger is Tahani's worst nightmare.)

I would expect that Eleanor encountered a lot of guys like that in Arizona, and while they'd irritate her somewhat, she'd know exactly how to handle them, and she'd shrug off their BS.

He seems more like the worst nightmare of this show's writers, not Eleanor.