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Doctor Sleep (2019)

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I am quite surprised that it seems to present itself as more of a sequel to the movie, rather than a straight adaptation of the book.

I'm not opposed to that, I'm just surprised King allowed it.

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4 hours ago, starri said:

I'm not opposed to that, I'm just surprised King allowed it.

King's just ridin' the wave right now. He seems to be in the zero fucks stage of his life.

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On 9/9/2019 at 11:46 AM, starri said:

am quite surprised that it seems to present itself as more of a sequel to the movie, rather than a straight adaptation of the book.

I asked surprised about that as well. Of course I had no idea this movie was even being made, I saw the first trailer and was shocked when I realized it was a sequel to The Shining

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Good Stephen King adaptation, and a decent horror story, with a great Rebecca Ferguson villain performance (which will make a good low-effort Halloween costume).

All of the The Shining stuff weighs it down though, and it’s much better when it’s doing its own thing. Most of the callbacks to the Kubrick movie feel off, as this is tonally completely different. It’s a similar thing to Ready Player One last year, where it just comes across as odd fan fiction.

The worst part is the early scenes, recreating parts of the original movie. Once it gets past that, it’s a much more enjoyable movie.

Doctor Sleep is an awful title though. I had the same problem with the book, where the title is basically irrelevant to the story. It's just a nickname Dan is given early on, and never mentioned after! It's not even a good nickname!

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13 hours ago, ApathyMonger said:

Doctor Sleep is an awful title though. I had the same problem with the book, where the title is basically irrelevant to the story. It's just a nickname Dan is given early on, and never mentioned after! It's not even a good nickname!

If I may quote someone on Twitter, if Ewan worked in a hospital, he wouldn't be Doctor Sleep, he'd be Doctor Dreamy. Or McDreamy.

Edited by Spartan Girl

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The scene with the “ baseball boy” will haunt me for a while. It was an important plot point and I admire the boldness of not hold back on showing the violence like most horror films involving kid victims do. But man it was hard to watch! 

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The baseball boy scene went further than I thought it would, and I agree that it was pretty shocking.

The Knot were pretty sick, but it was interesting to hear some of their backstory (the oldest and Andi's pathological hatred of men). 

I haven't seen The Shining in a while, so I was surprised at what exactly those with the powers can do.  Seeing the little girl with blue eyes was very creepy!

Now I need to re-watch The Shining.

Edited by peridot
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On 11/5/2019 at 7:03 PM, Pink ranger said:

The scene with the “ baseball boy” will haunt me for a while. It was an important plot point and I admire the boldness of not hold back on showing the violence like most horror films involving kid victims do. But man it was hard to watch! 

That scene will haunt me too.  And for some reason it being the little boy who was in Room makes just a little bit more disturbing...I'm not sure why.

I think that scene was necessary though to show just how evil those things were.  I mean up until that point, other than the scene with the little girl in the beginning, it's rather easily to like Rosie and her whole vaguely evil discount Stevie Nicks vibe she had going on.  But that scene really showed what those things were, brutal, evil, something that had to be stopped.  

I quite like the movie.  Though I admit for not caring much for the title either.  Nor have I read the book it's based on (I have read The Shinning though).  I don't recall Danny being called "Doc" by either his parents or Dick in the movie or the book The Shinning though.

Either way, I thought the performances were really strong.  McGregor is really good, and I thought him and the girl that played Aba had good chemistry.  Rebecca Ferguson was delightfully creepy throughout.  

I thought they did a good job at making this it's own thing as well.  Obviously being back at The Overlook brought you back to The Shinning, but unlike a lot of reboots/sequels of late it didn't seem to be coasting on just nostalgia to get you invested.  It wasn't screaming, "Remember that thing you liked, look we got it!"  Overall I really enjoyed it.

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All of a sudden cute innocent kids being murdered or eaten like Jacob Tremblay in Dr. Sleep and the Georgie kid from the It movies is now becoming the in thing all of a sudden in horror movies? That takes guts.

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2 hours ago, Robert Lynch said:

All of a sudden cute innocent kids being murdered or eaten like Jacob Tremblay in Dr. Sleep and the Georgie kid from the It movies is now becoming the in thing all of a sudden in horror movies? That takes guts.

Not really a new thing when it comes to Stephen King. He has never shied away from killing off kids in his books. See also It, Pet Semetary, Cujo...

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17 hours ago, Proclone said:

I don't recall Danny being called "Doc" by either his parents or Dick in the movie or the book The Shinning though.

I remember it from the book but not from the movie.   I've only seen the movie all the way through once, though I've read the book more than once.  I've never read "Doctor Sleep".

I really liked this.  I knew the Cliff Curtis character was doomed as soon as we met him and was tense while waiting for it to to happen.  I loved the use of the music from The Shining - it was used enough here and in appropriate places to hype the dread.   Overall the movie carried that dread up to the finish and I appreciated that.

Some dialogue was straight out of "The Shining" (book) as was the final scene between Abra and Danny (though in the book that scene is Jack/Danny in the boiler room).  The movie did a good job of weaving elements from The Shining book and movie while still being its own thing.  Bringing those elements to the same place isn't that easy because there are some significant changes book vs movie, but they worked here.

The performances were all good - I lurve Ewan McGregor (and we got a tiny bit of singing! yay!) and Danny's growth from dangerous drunk to stability was earned and believable.  His scenes with the hospice patients were touching.

Kyliegh Curran as Abra is good casting too.  She was fearless and determined but believably so.

Rebecca Ferguson's Rose was a perfect villain - unapologetically evil and also smart, charming and loyal to her group. 

When they showed "Jack" (Henry Thomas) at first I'm NOOOO lol but it sort of worked and didn't derail the film.  I'm glad Danny is at peace but I wanted a happier ending for him.

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18 hours ago, Proclone said:

Obviously being back at The Overlook brought you back to The Shinning,

I'm pretty sure Stephen King signed off on this, we don't have to worry about being sued.

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I thought it was excellent--it really incorporated both the movie and the book Shining and pulled them together so well. And Stephen King got his finale to the original Shining here. The one negative for me was the Jack Torrance as the new Lloyd though; the other people playing Wendy and Dick really nailed it with the inflections and stuff, but Henry Thomas did not and it stood out because he had the most iconic part to play. Also, why would Jack now be the bartender--what's the "actual" spirit Lloyd doing?

Edited by TattleTeeny
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Saw this movie last night and thought it was great. I loved the fact they got the look of wendy little danny and jack so close to the original. Jack didnt have the same edge though and that was disappointing

Rose and her crew were scary, theyre like vampires but instead of blood they take shine.  Like some said upthread stevie nicks vibe, but it worked.

The little baseball boy scene was disturbing and reminded me of a story many years ago of a little boy that was killed. The picture that was shown on the news was his little league picture.

The reunion at the end was the best for me. One chracter i didnt get was the woman in a gown. I assume it was the twins mother but not sure

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7 hours ago, tinaw said:

Saw this movie last night and thought it was great. I loved the fact they got the look of wendy little danny and jack so close to the original. Jack didnt have the same edge though and that was disappointing

Rose and her crew were scary, theyre like vampires but instead of blood they take shine.  Like some said upthread stevie nicks vibe, but it worked.

The little baseball boy scene was disturbing and reminded me of a story many years ago of a little boy that was killed. The picture that was shown on the news was his little league picture.

The reunion at the end was the best for me. One chracter i didnt get was the woman in a gown. I assume it was the twins mother but not sure

For the small cameo appearance Jacob Tremblay did, he really did sold that fear really well for a 13 year old. He has a bright career ahead of him and I hope to see more of him in the near future. 

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I totally agree that scene was disturbing. First, it is daring for someone who has charisma and good looks to sell pain like he did. It is interesting that was taken in one shot with him only and edited around the actors due to the extreme nature of the scene. I would be interested as to how they did that scene altogether in the making.

One thing about Jacob is that he is an extremely gutsy kid. First cursing in Good Boys and being violently murdered in Dr. Sleep? Total guts.

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Finally saw this tonight and screw the box office and critics that dissed it for not being "Kubrick", this was great. 

Ewan was perfect as adult Danny and the actors filling in for The Shining characters were spot on! Loved Abra and Rebecca aka Rose the Hat was an awesomely evil bitch.

The baseball boy murder really was awful.

Having read the novel, I was upset that Danny, Abra's dad and Billy all died when they lived in the book. But Danny's end made sense, because it mirrored the more heroic end Book Jack had: fighting off the spirits and blowing up the Overlook. It was scary when the ghosts possessed Dan briefly, but it was fitting. Dan's biggest fear was turning into his father and he had to face it head on to finally overcome it.

Speaking of Jack, the bar scene...oy. It makes sense for Jack to become Lloyd since the end of the first movie implied that he was part of the hotel. But oh God, Dan's reaction broke my heart. He clearly tried to find some kind of closure with his father and instead Jack basically blamed him and Wendy for his drinking. Movie Jack can rot in the hell he built for himself.

LOVED Danny setting loose the Overlook ghosts to finish off Rose. Best comeuppance since Thanos!

Edited by Spartan Girl
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On 11/9/2019 at 12:54 AM, Proclone said:

I don't recall Danny being called "Doc" by either his parents or Dick in the movie or the book The Shinning though.

You may need to reread/rewatch The Shining because they must definitely did call him Doc.  That's how we find out Dick was psychic too, because he knew about Danny's nickname.  FYI they called him "Doc" because of his love for Bugs Bunny.

I totally forgot to mention how much I loved Azzi!  Cutest death cat ever!

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5 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

I totally forgot to mention how much I loved Azzi!  Cutest death cat ever!

My cat has the same name, and most people think he's named after Gargamel's cat on The Smurfs if they even get the reference, but nope, I named him after the angel of death. (I was big into angel lore when I got him.) I feel vindicated! Thanks Doctor Sleep!

Edited by calliope1975
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1 hour ago, calliope1975 said:

My cat has the same name, and most people think he's named after Gargamel's cat on The Smurfs if they even get the reference, but nope, I named him after the angel of death. (I was big into angel lore when I got him.) I feel vindicated! Thanks Doctor Sleep!

My mother is a cat lover, so it is easy to fall in love with cats for her. My sister on the hand....that's a long story. 

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I really liked this even though I was already spoiled on a lot of the plot developments. I loved the way they filmed the scene where Rose is floating through the sky trying to track Abra. In contrast and as other people here have already pointed out, the scene with Jacob Tremblay was rough, almost too effective. It wasn't so much the visuals (as intense as they were, I don't think they showed the actual violence), as it was his screaming that I found especially hard to endure.

One of the reviews I read said this could be taken for a superhero origin story and with one of the final scenes leaving room for the possibility of more True Knot-like villains and Danny encouraging Abra not to suppress her shine, I can definitely see that. I think there was also a shot that lingers on a superhero action figure with purple hair in Abra's bedroom, and she's later shown wearing a similar purple wig when she entraps Rose.

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Whatever it is, good publicity on Jacob's part. And now a Disney role as Flounder in the new live action Little Mermaid? He is already set. Turns out that his own father is a police detective who is always on set!

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This isn't airing in the theatre I usually visit, anymore. It's only airing at a few places now. I'm hoping to see it before it leaves another theatre that's closest to me. 

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15 hours ago, Anela said:

This isn't airing in the theatre I usually visit, anymore. It's only airing at a few places now. I'm hoping to see it before it leaves another theatre that's closest to me. 

Be sure to see it. It's pretty good.

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6 hours ago, Robert Lynch said:

Be sure to see it. It's pretty good.

We ended up seeing it tonight, but I hadn't looked up how long it was. I was sitting there for almost fifty minutes, needing to go to the bathroom (and should have rushed off in a quiet moment).

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6 hours ago, Anela said:

We ended up seeing it tonight, but I hadn't looked up how long it was. I was sitting there for almost fifty minutes, needing to go to the bathroom (and should have rushed off in a quiet moment).

I should have told you that beforehand about the runtime. I'm sorry.

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9 hours ago, Robert Lynch said:

I should have told you that beforehand about the runtime. I'm sorry.

Not your fault. 🙂 I usually check that before going.

I'm glad that we saw it in the theatre, even though we couldn't really afford it this week. I can't believe the one we usually visit was no longer showing it, after only three weeks. 

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Even more than the baseball boy scene, what really effed me up was the sequence with the dead mom and her baby, and "They haven't found us yet." I wasn't sure if we were supposed to think it was real or Dan's guilty conscience handing him a nightmare, but it was exactly where my mind went as soon as he left her with the baby on the bed, so I assumed it WAS real.

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Next Stephen King remake: Needful Things! Christopher Plummer as Mr. Gaunt would be so awesome. He could be play nice characters, but he could play creepy disturbing characters as well. I could see him in that role. The Brian character could be played by Jacob Tremblay. That is one Stephen King book that deserves another remake. Possibly with this director.

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On 12/9/2019 at 11:18 AM, Robert Lynch said:

Next Stephen King remake: Needful Things! Christopher Plummer as Mr. Gaunt would be so awesome. He could be play nice characters, but he could play creepy disturbing characters as well. I could see him in that role. The Brian character could be played by Jacob Tremblay. That is one Stephen King book that deserves another remake. Possibly with this director.

I think The Outsider is an HBO show, as well. Premiering next month. 

Edited by Anela

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On 12/8/2019 at 3:14 PM, Schweedie said:

Even more than the baseball boy scene, what really effed me up was the sequence with the dead mom and her baby, and "They haven't found us yet." I wasn't sure if we were supposed to think it was real or Dan's guilty conscience handing him a nightmare, but it was exactly where my mind went as soon as he left her with the baby on the bed, so I assumed it WAS real.

Pure Trainspotting, since the baby turns towards Dan and says, "Mama?" Even if they weren't dead, Halloran's ghost urged him to at least leave the woman's money behind, so he did have something to feel guilty about.

I didn't read the book, but I really enjoyed the young actress who played Abra. Nice combination of tough and naive, especially when she was facing off against Rose and even Crow Daddy.

"I hope that hurts. A lot."

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I saw the movie over the weekend, and thought it was excellent.  I'm actually a little sad that it didn't do better at the box office, because it deserved to be seen by a bigger audience. 

I think the scenes that touched me most were the scenes where Danny acted to help facilitate his hospice patients transition to death.  I can't really say what it was, maybe the adorable cat who acted as a signal that death was coming, or just the way Danny helped make things a little less scary for the patient, but they got me very emotional. 

They also acted as a nice contrast to Rose the Hat, who made it her job to terrify and torture those children in their last moments before dying. 

As an aside, I also thought the actors who played Wendy and Halloran did a great job of imitating Shelley Duvall and Scatman Crothers' performances.   

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I didn’t care for the differences the movie made from the book, but when I realized the book was a sequel to Stephen Kings “the shining” and the movie was the sequel to stanly Kubricks “the shinging” I was able to accept it better and come to peace with it. 
 

That said I did like the movie a lot. McGregor was an excellent Dan, in fact everyone they got to play the key roles were perfect. 
 

The part with the baseball boy was tough to watch but fit the movie well, it created the stakes and made no qualms about how horrendous these beings were.

The woman they got to play Wendy looks freakishly like Shelly Duvall and I didn’t even realize it was Henry Thomas as Jack till I looked it up, crazy resemblences. 

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I caught up with this last night. It was one of those "tier two" new movies I was curious about, but not enough to see in the theatrical-release window. 

Background: I've seen the Kubrick The Shining several times, I read King's The Shining two or three times as a young person, and I saw the forgettable 1997 miniseries once. I've never read Doctor Sleep because, while I have enduring respect for King as a writer, I disembarked somewhere around Needful Things. So this was an all-new story to me. All I knew was that it picked up with Danny Torrance as an adult. 

I give the writer/director, Mike Flanagan, a lot of credit on a degree-of-difficulty level. He managed to make a respectful, even reverent sequel to both the book and the film, bridging the distance between them.

The reverence is not always in Doctor Sleep's best interests. The weakest scenes were the ones with new actors impersonating Shelley Duvall, Jack Nicholson, Danny Lloyd and Scatman Crothers circa 1980. They were good impersonations, sometimes eerily good (Alex Essoe's Wendy running toward the park bench, frantic, yelling out to Danny), but it was hard to react to them as anything but impersonations. Those scenes had a waxwork or tribute-band quality. 

The film following or surrounding those scenes was better. Something I found special and unusual about it, for a horror thriller, is that we got to see the "villains" being terrified too. There were mutual stalking and terror tactics going on. It was a real psychic war. The sympathetic characters of Abra, Dan and Billy got to get their own licks in, not just in the climax. 

As satisfying as that element was, I found I didn't even hate the members of True Knot, despite the gruesome things they did onscreen. When I thought about it, I realized they were like obligate carnivores. They didn't think of what they were doing as evil. They wanted to keep living as much as their victims did, they were facing extinction with their dwindling supplies, and they were long past being emotionally affected by the necessary sacrifices. This is a credit to King, Flanagan and the True Knot actors. 

I'm a little surprised not to read more effusive praise for Kyliegh Curran in the reactions I've seen so far. I thought she showed the presence and strength of someone who could become an important actor in adulthood. The same goes for Jacob Tremblay, whom I knew going in from Room. His big scene here is so excruciating that the viewer has to recover from it to get back into the film. Rebecca Ferguson, whom Doctor Sleep probably helped more than it did anyone else, is as great a principal antagonist as everyone said, magnetic and complex, reminding me of a beautiful Swede of an earlier generation, Lena Olin. But Ewan McGregor was only workmanlike, Some actors deepen in middle age, as the youthful glamour falls away; others grow paler, less interesting. Unfortunately, I have McGregor in the second category. He was overshadowed here, much as he was in Beginners and The Impossible

This is not a horror classic. It's slow, dense and deliberate without completely making that pay off, and it was hard for me to buy something integral to the premise: that an intact Overlook would have been shuttered after the events of Kubrick's film. In that version of the Overlook's history, would one more crazy caretaker who only successfully committed a single murder really get the place closed down? And in nearly 40 years, it was neither reopened under new owners nor demolished with something else on the site; it just sat there in a very mild state of dilapidation? 

But a solid effort, well worth seeing.

Edited by Simon Boccanegra
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