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S06.E15: Reunion, Part 1

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I thought Chelsea looked like someone’s mom. She looked about 55 last night. She also said about three syllables. 

Kathryn looked beautiful. She’s always so colorful which I love. I loved the color of her dress! 

I was so happy that Andy really took Shep on and didn’t back down. Even Shep seeing his own elitism and arrogance exposed full-force, he won’t change. It’s too deeply ingrained and more importantly, he doesn’t *really* think it’s a bad thing. 

Naomie visibly cringed when Metul was referred to as controlling. She’s in denial, and in love. But she’ll suffer emotionally if she marries him. 

Where was Eliza?? Agree that Whit didn’t show because he didn’t want to be in the hot seat over his “hookup” with Kathryn. 

I’m pretty over Cameran. She has always had disdain for everyone around her, while making sure that she was portrayed as utterly perfect in five seasons. She has her own arrogance. But now the cracks are finally showing, ha. 

Craig seemed a bit slurry. Looked a little unkempt too. But I loved the Rice Krispie treat! 

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9 hours ago, Shannah Banana said:

I got a kick out of when the Three Musketeers made a beeline for the bar on set, and all the pretty bottles, only to find them empty.  HA HA!

What gets on my nerves about Cameron (besides she's a control freak) is she looks at her kid as a JOB.  Yeah, kids are a lot of work, but I don't think you have to look at them as a JOB.  I'm pretty sure Jason pays her quite well in room and board, and maybe the occasional trinket  🙄  Maybe someday she will shut up about it.  Gawd.

It’s possible Cameran is conflicted about her “job” as stay-at-home mom because she’s never been comfortable pooling the money and becoming a team. The other issue is losing her identity as an independent professional in her mind - a lot of women have trouble with that.

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Craig and Shep both could benefit from bucketloads of therapy.

I’ll give credit to Craig for at least owning that much of his bad/irresponsible behavior stems from an issue with Adderall. He at least seems to be aware of his issues and is somewhat trying to work on them.

I can’t say the same for Shep who seemed unable to recognize that his asshole tendencies have really negatively affected other people he purports to care about and that if he really cared about them he would work on curbing that kind of behavior. It’s a shame because I’ve had a soft spot for Shep in past seasons even when he was problematic but he really seemed to double down on the douchebaggery this season. 

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Glad the Adderall issue was discussed - posters here thought that was the issue during Craig’s crazy meltdowns. What a sad, addicted society.

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4 minutes ago, nexxie said:

It’s possible Cameran is conflicted about her “job” as stay-at-home mom because she’s never been comfortable pooling the money and becoming a team. The other issue is losing her identity as an independent professional in her mind - a lot of women have trouble with that.

I've heard many women talk about raising a child as being a job - usually when complaining about how nobody recognizes that it's a job. Or for my working mom friends, they complain that they do two jobs, one unpaid. We have a society where moms are judged no matter what they do. I like that she can admit when she sees the truth about herself - being snobby and not appreciating her privilege. I'm not sure what people expect from her. I find her the least offensive of the bunch by miles. 

I don't know why they pulled up the Real World footage, but I loved it. BRAD!

Andy was really going after the dudes - and I loved it. Shep and Austen were so uncomfortable they were uncomfortable to watch. I don't think Craig knows what it's like to feel uncomfortable when a camera is on him. He seems like he'd admit to being DB Cooper if he thinks it will get him more attention for five minutes. And the Adderall makes so. much. sense. I don't know why I didn't think of it. I was assuming his power sleeping came from coke crashes - which could also be true - but the Adderall makes more sense. I'm glad he's 2 months off the stuff if it was causing him so much trouble.

And if Shep were HALF as smart as he thinks he is, he would know better than to offer his tiny sliver of experience with a man from India as a cultural example. But it's typical of the privileged. He literally doesn't have the capacity to think there's any correct world view beyond his own. I used to like Shep - boy do I feel a little dirty about it now, lol. He's just awful. 

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11 hours ago, bosawks said:

Katherine’s unabashed love of a $10 leatherette pair of Amazon yoga pants has me in the feels.

I get it.  Not quite as stylish, of course, but I have a $15.00 pair of WalMart stretch fabric capri pants that I would LIVE in if I could.

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8 hours ago, dosodog said:

I think that America is a whole bunch of cultures.  And coming from a culture of Irish and Scotch, it comes up when it comes to budgeting and being thrifty, alcohol consumption and a tendency to fight.  

Besides Catholic? Even Protestant. Cause Ireland is Green and Orange.

Never been to a prom.  Can't speak to Starry Nights.  

Re reading my post, I'm not sure how this became about American culture. It was a comment about going from one country to a new country and not abandoning what you've known all your life.  And, upon having children, passing customs to your children.

As a child born to an immigrant from Scotland, I have a passion for scones, rolling green grassy hills, stories of the wee people and bagpipes do something to my soul. Garden gnomes are known as Murphys in my household. 

 I'm American, born in the other Washington aka Seattle....,but part of my upbringing was influenced by my mom's culture.  As is Metul's. As is my former employers kids.  As all of you.

Like I said, it wasn't an observation of good vs. bad, but an observation that just because someone is born in a country does not mean their family's ancestral customs have no meaning in their upbringing.

Look at Shep.  Family heritage and ancestry shaped him into the elitist snob he admits he is.  

I think you're completely right about this.  When Naomie jokingly asked Metul what the chicken needed, his response was, "an Indian woman's cooking."  So he invoked his own cultural background, and notice he didn't say "Indian" alone, he said "Indian woman."  I'm quite sure this isn't an isolated incident.  Since Metul brought this up so casually, it is probably part of who he is.

Indian families and Pakistani families often bring their traditions to America.  The movie, The Big Sick, which was based on a true story by the man who played the lead, was all about a Pakistani man, who was American like Metul, but whose family carried on their Pakistani customs and expected their son to do the same.

So of course Metul is American.  He is also of Indian extraction, and that plays at least some role in his life, by his own word.  I don't know if it's a stretch to suggest that if one part of his life relates to Indian culture, another might.  No one was putting words in his mouth.  It was just a suggestion.

I think the one who seemed ignorant and defensive was Naomie, when she said, "well, he was born in DC, so...". So...what?  He has to leave his family's culture at Dulles Airport or something?  That doesn't appear to be what he's doing.

If an Orthodox Jewish man didn't want to shake my hand in a business deal and another Orthodox Jewish man told me that it was against the religious sect's tenants for a man to shake hands with a woman, I might mention it to my first Orthdox Jewish friend/business partner, "hey, did you not want to shake my hand the other day because I'm a woman?  I just want you to know I'm ok with that, if that's the case."  To constantly guess or judge or to think they didn't have American qualities because of their background would be weird, but damn, to ask once doesn't make someone a bigot.  

To imply that someone who doesn't carry on the traditions of their ancestry, like a person whose grandparents are from China must like Chinese food is where we start to have a problem.  There's nothing like that going on here that I can see, so I'm going to let it go.

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I also thought Chelsea looked like she was in her 50's. Her face just looked so drawn and that hairstyle did not help. 

So, when Danni makes her appearance next week, everyone will attack Madison again and Austen. What I don't understand----why doesn't anyone go after Shep for obviously blabbing to Austen??? Are they all suggesting that Austen just made all of this up and told Madison just because?? I would be laying into Shep.

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10 hours ago, Shannah Banana said:

I think she said she could drink too, but she wasn't drinking that night on WWHL. 

If those jerks are judging Kathryn because she might take a drink or two and act spacey, they can just take several seats and shut the hell up.  THEIR behavior during their frequent alcohol binges is embarrassing to watch.  Sure, Kathryn had problems drinking and dealing with Thomas, who himself is one of the worst drunks I've ever seen.  She said "I don't use marijuana"  and they all had the "oooo" looks.  I might refer Shep and the crew to the way they were acting in legal weed Colorado.  Kathryn's behavior, what little I saw of it since I never watch WWHL, was not even in the same zip code as that of the stoned out ski bunch.  

If she's using a prescription anti-depressant and/or mood shifting medication, and is abusing it, however, that's a different story.  However, the judgmental attitude of these dickheads to her made me cringe.  

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5 minutes ago, Carolina Girl said:

If those jerks are judging Kathryn because she might take a drink or two and act spacey, they can just take several seats and shut the hell up.  THEIR behavior during their frequent alcohol binges is embarrassing to watch.  Sure, Kathryn had problems drinking and dealing with Thomas, who himself is one of the worst drunks I've ever seen.  She said "I don't use marijuana"  and they all had the "oooo" looks.  I might refer Shep and the crew to the way they were acting in legal weed Colorado.  Kathryn's behavior, what little I saw of it since I never watch WWHL, was not even in the same zip code as that of the stoned out ski bunch.  

If she's using a prescription anti-depressant and/or mood shifting medication, and is abusing it, however, that's a different story.  However, the judgmental attitude of these dickheads to her made me cringe.  

I agree that the rest of them can be hypocritical when it comes to drug/alcohol use but none of the rest of them are involved in a vicious custody battle and Kathryn is. I think their “ooo” faces were more in response to knowing that she is probably lying about something that she needs to testify about or prove in court and not actually using whatever it is she might be using. I think the judgement is coming from thinking that maybe she should not appear on TV in an altered state in the middle of trying to prove her sobriety to the court. 

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11 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Also, Andy?  Cameran is not the co-host.  Don't ask for her opinion on everything.

This is so annoying, Andy really needs to stop with that. What makes her opinion so important? Her only claim to fame is that she was on the "Real World" 20 years ago and married a guy with a great job. She got lucky with this gig and now she is the voice of reason among all these chucklefucks. 

Agree about Chelsea's reunion look. Good lord, my mom wore her hair like that 40 years ago. And she's a hairstylist? 

Andy really went in on all of them, I hope he continues. He asked questions we have all been talking about all season and held their feet to the fire for explanations for their behavior/actions. This is the best hosting he has ever done on a reunion. He usually asks stupid questions and never really gets to the root of anything. Hope he keeps it up next week.  

Not looking forward to seeing Danni crying next week. She needs to toughen up. 

I don't know why I didn't put Craig and Adderall together. I thought it was coke but I have known a few people on Adderall and they behaved just like Craig. They become very argumentative especially when mixed with alcohol. I'm glad he's trying to fix that problem. 

Edited by bichonblitz
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56 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I think you're completely right about this.  When Naomie jokingly asked Metul what the chicken needed, his response was, "an Indian woman's cooking."  So he invoked his own cultural background, and notice he didn't say "Indian" alone, he said "Indian woman."  I'm quite sure this isn't an isolated incident.  Since Metul brought this up so casually, it is probably part of who he is.

Indian families and Pakistani families often bring their traditions to America.  The movie, The Big Sick, which was based on a true story by the man who played the lead, was all about a Pakistani man, who was American like Metul, but whose family carried on their Pakistani customs and expected their son to do the same.

So of course Metul is American.  He is also of Indian extraction, and that plays at least some role in his life, by his own word.  I don't know if it's a stretch to suggest that if one part of his life relates to Indian culture, another might.  No one was putting words in his mouth.  It was just a suggestion.

I think the one who seemed ignorant and defensive was Naomie, when she said, "well, he was born in DC, so...". So...what?  He has to leave his family's culture at Dulles Airport or something?  That doesn't appear to be what he's doing.

If an Orthodox Jewish man didn't want to shake my hand in a business deal and another Orthodox Jewish man told me that it was against the religious sect's tenants for a man to shake hands with a woman, I might mention it to my first Orthdox Jewish friend/business partner, "hey, did you not want to shake my hand the other day because I'm a woman?  I just want you to know I'm ok with that, if that's the case."  To constantly guess or judge or to think they didn't have American qualities because of their background would be weird, but damn, to ask once doesn't make someone a bigot.  

To imply that someone who doesn't carry on the traditions of their ancestry, like a person whose grandparents are from China must like Chinese food is where we start to have a problem.  There's nothing like that going on here that I can see, so I'm going to let it go.

I think the point she was trying to make is that people shouldn't assume that because he is Indian that he is an old country/old school chauvinist pig and that what we saw on camera is not the real him. She probably gets tired of that and I can't blame her. Is he a bit snarky? Seems so.  But he was also probably uncomfortable with the cameras, which amplified it and she acknowledged there were moments when he came off as douchey.

Cameron's stay-at-home mom issues stem from her parents' breakup and her mother having to hustle to care and provide for two children on her own, Also, now that Palmer does more than eat, poop and sleep, she's more interesting. It is unlikely that Cameron babysat as a teen, so this is probably her very first real experience with a baby and the big change plus hormones must be pretty impactful.

I don't get why people are bitching about Jason staying home with the baby during his vacation. She's not going to be away all week, he has access to babysitters and also  probably very much welcomed this time to bond with his child since he does have to work so many hours, some of them at odd hours.

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I swear Cameran's shoes were damn near the same ones Carrie was wearing when Miranda's water broke on them on Sex & The City.  They should have gone out of fashion in the last decade.

1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

When Naomie jokingly asked Metul what the chicken needed, his response was, "an Indian woman's cooking."  So he invoked his own cultural background, and notice he didn't say "Indian" alone, he said "Indian woman."

He said "Indian person".  See 0:44.  Shep was just an asshole to try to extrapolate onto Metul what one person from India's opinion is about men from that country.  A couple I am friends with are India natives; she's a high-positioned lawyer and he's a stay at home dad.  I certainly am not going to ascribe their dynamic on every individual from a country of 1.3 billion people who moves to the US.  Metul's obsession with control over sweets and exercise could just as easily come from being immersed in medical studies for a decade.  Or watching Jack LaLanne videos as a child.  Or a hatred for Snap, Crackle, and Pop.  We just didn't get into the inner life of Metul to know what his motives are.  Any dip into racial and/or ethic background to probe his motives seems dangerous and a slippery slope to xenophobia, especially by people who are not of said racial/ethnic background, such as Shep.

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I like Danni, but I’m Not looking forward to chlamydia-gate next week. Rip Austen a new one, say it never happened, and move on already. The more she protests the more I think she’s lying. 

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14 hours ago, bosawks said:
14 hours ago, bosawks said:

So, in Shep’s world his ridiculous comment about Metul now gives Naomie carte blanche to be a complete asshole to him, right?

Yes. Indeed, yes it most happily does. And please, NaomiE, do so...all of the damn time.

Remember, per Shep, ... “I don’t suffer fools, gladly.” Well, guess whut, SCHLEP ...huntin’ season is now open.

Edited by BookElitist · Reason: + statement
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MrLake was watching with me.  He asked me who the older woman was.  I thought he was referring to Patricia in the WWHL clip.  But he meant Chelsea.  He has watched the show with me.  He did not even recognize her.  Even when I realized who he was talking about he did not believe me when I said she was same age as the others on the couch.  That really was not a good look for her.

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2 hours ago, Carolina Girl said:

If she's using a prescription anti-depressant and/or mood shifting medication, and is abusing it, however, that's a different story.  However, the judgmental attitude of these dickheads to her made me cringe.  

She is abusing her adderall prescription.  It came out in the court documents Thomas presented.  There were chats screenshot of her friends trying to get her more pills because she "ran out early..."

Edited by heatherchandler
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33 minutes ago, olivia1 said:

I like Danni, but I’m Not looking forward to chlamydia-gate next week. Rip Austen a new one, say it never happened, and move on already. The more she protests the more I think she’s lying. 

I agree. the more she cries and acts all nervous the more everyone thinks she is not telling the truth. She doesn't have to address this in detail. Simply say it's not true. If Andy has the balls to keep digging I would say I given you my answer and I am not going to discuss this anymore. Why would anyone sitting on these couches want to go down this path? Seems like all of them like her. I hope Chelsea and Cameron back her up on this if Madison and Andy try to make this a topic for discussion. 

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3 hours ago, Stiggs said:

I may or may not have the same Amazon leggings (spoiler: I have them) and they are really super comfy, lol. I live in Florida so I wear them MAYBE 5 times a year during our month of winter, but I got a lot of use out of them in Iceland. 🙂 They were actually more waterproof than the expensive waterproof pants I took with me. So yeah, I traipsed around Iceland looking like Leather Tuscadero was stranded in a snow storm. 

Oh oh can you link to the pants!?? 

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I think Metul and Naomie are classic Type-A overachievers. In my experience, people like that often challenge each other to do better -- eat healthier, exercise harder, etc. I think it comes more from competitiveness and drive than anything malicious. It may seem obnoxious to others, but their relationship may thrive on it.

Edited by bencr
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2 hours ago, TeeMo said:

I agree that the rest of them can be hypocritical when it comes to drug/alcohol use but none of the rest of them are involved in a vicious custody battle and Kathryn is. I think their “ooo” faces were more in response to knowing that she is probably lying about something that she needs to testify about or prove in court and not actually using whatever it is she might be using. I think the judgement is coming from thinking that maybe she should not appear on TV in an altered state in the middle of trying to prove her sobriety to the court. 

Interesting take.  And good points!  

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1 hour ago, olivia1 said:

I like Danni, but I’m Not looking forward to chlamydia-gate next week. Rip Austen a new one, say it never happened, and move on already. The more she protests the more I think she’s lying. 

Of course she is lying. She needs to say to Madison---Did you hear this from Austen's lips? Austen--who told you this? It came from Shep? And then go after Shep!!!!!! If it is not true, I don't understand the crying. Just be mad or furious and vent. Idk. Danni bugs me. She looks so unhealthy and all of the crying. Ugh. She needs to move on.

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1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

She is abusing her adderall prescription.  It came out in the court documents Thomas presented.  There were chats screenshot of her friends trying to get her more pills because she "ran out early..."

Wonder if the Court ever addressed Thomas' habitual drinking and abusive behavior?

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30 minutes ago, bencr said:

I think Metul and Naomie are classic a-type overachievers. In my experience, people like that often challenge each other to do better -- eat healthier, exercise harder, etc. I think it comes more from competitiveness and drive than anything malicious. It may seem obnoxious to others, but their relationship may thrive on it.

If they ever get married, Naomi better not gain too much or any weight.

If they have children, he might try to deny the kid sugar while raising him or her.

Then once he or she leaves home, they're going to gorge and binge on sweets.

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1 hour ago, Lizzing said:

I swear Cameran's shoes were damn near the same ones Carrie was wearing when Miranda's water broke on them on Sex & The City.  They should have gone out of fashion in the last decade.

He said "Indian person".  See 0:44.  Shep was just an asshole to try to extrapolate onto Metul what one person from India's opinion is about men from that country.  A couple I am friends with are India natives; she's a high-positioned lawyer and he's a stay at home dad.  I certainly am not going to ascribe their dynamic on every individual from a country of 1.3 billion people who moves to the US.  Metul's obsession with control over sweets and exercise could just as easily come from being immersed in medical studies for a decade.  Or watching Jack LaLanne videos as a child.  Or a hatred for Snap, Crackle, and Pop.  We just didn't get into the inner life of Metul to know what his motives are.  Any dip into racial and/or ethic background to probe his motives seems dangerous and a slippery slope to xenophobia, especially by people who are not of said racial/ethnic background, such as Shep.

Damn, you are 100% right that Metul said "Indian person."  I was writing my post simultaneously while watching the WWHL episode where they flashed back to that scene, so I was so sure I had the language correct, but Craig, Austen or Andy must have said "woman."  So much for multitasking.  I am a dummy for getting that wrong.  

I think there is a fine line between inferring something about someone based on their heritage and inferring something based on their life, and if that life includes participation in that heritage, it's fair game.  This isn't a race issue.  Shep and Metul are the same race--Caucasian--so I don't want to tie race into this, as there is nothing determinative about race.  My husband and I are from different races, but the same culture, and we have no differences based on race (other than physical appearance).  When it comes to culture and ethnicity, there are inherent differences between people, so I think that's a very different topic, and that's what I'm discussing here.

I am not sure that Shep was assigning all of Metul's habits to him having an Indian background, like the "diabetes in Saran Wrap."  I think that one was kind of chalked up to Metul being a health nut.  If Shep had made an inference about Metul's entire personality being based on Indian heritage, that would have made me uncomfortable.  From what I remember, they were discussing specifically the trip to Colorado and why Naomie went to Hilton Head last year, but not Colorado this year and Shep said that he was speaking to, I think, his dad and his dad's friend who was Indian about the situation and the Indian man said it was a product of culture.  And Shep was playing it like he was just relaying this news to see what everyone thought.  I don't know if he was telling the truth, but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt for the moment. 

As far as India being too populous to make generalizations, I will say:  I am not an expert on India by any stretch, but I happen to be very interested in its culture, and whenever I have gotten comfortable enough with an Indian person to discuss India, I have found that because the country is so big, they have had an easy time getting to the heart of an Indian issue.  So even though it's got 1.4 billion people, I have almost never had a discussion about "India the way Americans almost never discuss "America."  If Shep was actually talking to an Indian man his father knew, the conversation was likely more nuanced, and the Indian man likely gathered some data about Metul.  Even his surname might give some insight.  

I was recently discussing India with two Indian men who came to my job to work on a project and when Meet The Patels came up, they both said that "Patel" is specific to this region of India--they showed me on a map--and Patels are famous for their ability to do business, etc.  And they were very happy and proud to talk about their country (they live in India, so it's their country; they're not American).

 My point is that if Shep actually had a conversation with an Indian, he likely provided more information about Metul than the fact that he was from India, but that wasn't conveyed on the show, and that's on Shep (or editing, but probably Shep), so It's only speculation, but it's informed speculation.

I think that since Metul already brought up his parents' culture as in influence on his life, it was ok for Shep to report what an Indian person allegedly said.  Not that the Indian person was right--that's stereotyping--but to mention in casual conversation, "yeah, someone from the culture with which you identify in part said this, what do you think?" Is alright.  I don't think we're approaching slippery slopes.  I think it's good to be honest, as long as you're extremely respectful.  

If I can illustrate the distinction by way of example:  When I was younger, I got a job clerking for an attorney through a family connection, and the attorney in question wanted me to work on complex litigation out of Ecuador.  I told him unambiguously that I did not know any Spanish past "hola." He did not believe me, which was so weird, so I went to my cousin and said, "he's fucking trying to make me do important legal work in Spanish!  This can't end well."  And my cousin was like, "oh, well, he knows Grandma.  That's why he thinks you know Spanish."  My grandmother was born and raised in Puerto Rico and thus knew Spanish.  I didn't know it though!  I took French.  There is nothing Spanish or Puerto Rican that I carry with me.  That was an unfair characterization IMO (though not a big deal to me in the greater scheme of things).

If I had shown up at the office and said that I had spent the weekend at a quincenera (and I pronounced it perfectly) or said that I had been at the Puerto Rican Day Parade or that I was planning a trip to PR to visit relatives, then there would be a case to be made that I likely (not definitely) knew some Spanish--because I was making a conscious choice to be associated with a Spanish-speaking culture, which I never did.  It just wasn't part of my experience.

So, yeah, if you don't choose to make your parents' background or your grandparents' background part of your life, it shouldn't be associated with you just by virtue of being born into a family.  If the background does inform your life, then people just need to be respectful and feel the other person out, but at some point there has got to be room for questions, or we're probably going to start making assumptions based on erroneous information.  Life would have been a lot easier for me if my boss had just said, "your grandmother is fluent in Spanish; she didn't teach any of it to you?"  The assumptions we make when we become so afraid of asking clarifying questions are worse IMO.  

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4 hours ago, nexxie said:

It’s possible Cameran is conflicted about her “job” as stay-at-home mom because she’s never been comfortable pooling the money and becoming a team. The other issue is losing her identity as an independent professional in her mind - a lot of women have trouble with that.

You don't have to pool.  You can have yours, mine and ours.  We do.

1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

She is abusing her adderall prescription.  It came out in the court documents Thomas presented.  There were chats screenshot of her friends trying to get her more pills because she "ran out early..."

Being an addict is one thing, being stupid and chatting about it is completely unacceptable. 😖

3 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

I don't know why I didn't put Craig and Adderall together.

Me neither.  It is so 80s.  Is it making a comeback?

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4 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

think you're completely right about this.  When Naomie jokingly asked Metul what the chicken needed, his response was, "an Indian woman's cooking."  So he invoked his own cultural background, and notice he didn't say "Indian" alone, he said "Indian woman."  I'm quite sure this isn't an isolated incident.  Since Metul brought this up so casually, it is probably part of who he is.

No his direct quote was “an Indian person who is good at cooking,” so I guess the person who Metul is is someone who doesn’t have strict roles about gender when it comes to cooking. He also said he makes the dish but not from scratch. 

9 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

My point is that if Shep actually had a conversation with an Indian, he likely provided more information about Metul than the fact that he was from India, but that wasn't conveyed on the show, and that's on Shep (or editing, but probably Shep), so It's only speculation, but it's informed speculation.

But Shep doesn’t appear to know anything about Metul so I would bet he said my friend is dating an Indian doctor and that was all the details he gave. 

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44 minutes ago, Carolina Girl said:

Wonder if the Court ever addressed Thomas' habitual drinking and abusive behavior?

You know he probably has the whole Charleston "good ol' boy" network behind him with all his legal battles. Fuck Thomas!

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2 minutes ago, Mr. Minor said:

You know he probably has the whole Charleston "good ol' boy" network behind him with all his legal battles. Fuck Thomas!

Thomas is also not supposed to drink when he has the kids and both submit to testing, Kathryn now has the right to request a test at anytime.

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1 hour ago, itsadryheat said:

I need to watch season 1 again to find out why I ever liked Shep

I think Shep's 1st season, 5 minutes of "southern charm" is over. 

His shine has clearly worn off. He's lazy, entitled, arrogant, mean spirited, misogynist and bigoted.

Oh and an unhealthy looking physical mess and always looks like he needs a shower.

And he's going on 40 ! 

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16 hours ago, dosodog said:

Craig just drives me nuts and makes my heart melt just a little.  Today it's more melty.  I think it's because he means no harm generally. He has temper tantrums and freak outs.  And then he can be insightful and kind.

Also the polished nail.

little rascals awww GIF
 

I worked for 4 years, for 2 gentlemen, who were born and raised in India, but had lived for 20 plus years in Canada.  I also knew their children who were born in Canada and always lived in Canada.

I'm just going to say, and I'm not putting a good or bad value to this (generally speaking I think it adds more to society), one's family heritage and culture doesn't necessarily check itself out the door just because they live somewhere else.

It felt like there was a lot of over explaining, by everyone, on behalf of Metul.

Bear with me if this is after the fact.  I feel like I got left back and stuck in the discussion about culture.  

{{deepbreath}} I can't even believe I'm about to sound like I'm sticking up for fucking Shep.  But.  What I thought he was (trying) to say was that we're a compilation of stuff not the least of which is heritage.   Excluding original dwindling tribes, American isn't a heritage for any of us, it's a nationality.   He sound-bit his answer but I want to believe that with more time he would've explained that it's not a huge leap to make to think that a young man who comes from a culture where patriarchy is heavy and strong may have (there isn't a good word to use here, chauvinistic? controlling?) tendencies because, according to his dad's best friend of the same culture, that's perfectly normal for his heritage.  Naomie's answer shouldn'tve shut him up at all.  Being American explains only one aspect of his culture.   Don't get me wrong, I will cheerfully call Shep the bigoted, pseudo-intellectual, misogynistic asshole he is whenever I get the chance, but not for saying this.   I did giggle when he called himself an elitist.  That's a choice not a condition.   So is whatever the fuck suspended adolescence is.  A suspension lasts a couple of days.  You're 40, it's not cute.

Speaking of choices.......Cam, Cam, Cam.  Oh Cam.  She was dong a great job of explaining her motherhood challenges.   I was even swinging back toward the middle.   Until "[Before Palmer] I used to think SAHMs had it easy".   Ok look, I get that it'a common (mis)perception, I get that she's acknowledging she no longer thinks so.  I just wanted to get at her Judge Judy style - Cam does it look like you're losing?  Girl hush. 

The only reason Craig is unattractive as a personality to me is I hate unreliability as a dude characteristic.   He may not be sick over Naomie anymore but if you're walking around with my favorite carb snack in your pocket, you still love me.  Let's fight.  

Kathryn is like an orchid amongst a bouquet of Whole Foods flowers.  They're nice and all.  But, you just saw an orchid.  I'm just grateful there were no ass cheeks.

5 hours ago, nexxie said:

It’s possible Cameran is conflicted about her “job” as stay-at-home mom because she’s never been comfortable pooling the money and becoming a team. The other issue is losing her identity as an independent professional in her mind - a lot of women have trouble with that.

Girl did you see the mess that was her trying to describe their checking account set up?  Lol.  Lawd Jason betnot never ever ask her to borrow $50 for gas.

I can't even be bothered going back and somebody kept interrupting Shep, what happened to his plot of swampland?

It's killing me, will somebody please just admit that Whitney didn't wanna claim Kathryn because he don't like women like that?

My favorite exchange might be: 

Andy {to the guys}: so ideally do you want a woman to stay home and raise your kids

Shep:  my mom drove all of us everywhere we had to go, she went to every game and...

Craig {straight faced}:  my mom and dad co parented equally. 
giphy.gif  

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1 hour ago, jumper sage said:

You don't have to pool.  You can have yours, mine and ours.  We do.

Being an addict is one thing, being stupid and chatting about it is completely unacceptable. 😖

Me neither.  It is so 80s.  Is it making a comeback?

It never went away. My MBA ex was addicted in the 80’s and our MBA son recently kicked his addiction. Another example of an overprescribed drug. 

I’m Team Katherine these days. I give her a lot of credit for getting her life together. That said, I always thought old Katherine seemed to be more of a Meth user than anything. That’s why it doesn’t surprise me to read she “ran out” of her Adderal prescription. I wouldn’t be surprised if this is why she goes off the radar for days/weeks like she tends to do.  If she drinking and using Adderal, even if it’s prescribed, then she’s not clean and sober. I hope she’s continuing to get help. She has so much to offer and her kids really need her because their Dad is a piece of shit. 

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28 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

No his direct quote was “an Indian person who is good at cooking,” so I guess the person who Metul is is someone who doesn’t have strict roles about gender when it comes to cooking. He also said he makes the dish but not from scratch. 

But Shep doesn’t appear to know anything about Metul so I would bet he said my friend is dating an Indian doctor and that was all the details he gave. 

Yes, I misquoted Metul and I already posted that I am aware that I'm a big dummy. I will say it again for the cheap seats:  I was wrong.  I made an incorrect and misleading assertion.  I throw myself upon the mercy of the thread. 🙂 

I also used the wrong word in my last post--I implied that culture was "deterministic" when I meant to say that culture can determine or inform some of a person's choices.  I also put the word "India" in quotes but forgot to close the quotes.  I just really hate editing my posts, like I haaaate doing it, because I feel like it looks like I changed my mind about what I wanted to say, so I let my mistakes ride unless they're brutal grammatical butchering, which they often are.

I think Shep would take the time to get to know at least a tew things about Metul because of Metul's station and status of being an up-and-coming anesthesiologist, and Shep is a snob.  For the same reason Shep dismisses Madison as a hairdresser is the same reason I think he would want to get to know Metual a little bit. 

Also, he's interested in guys, cause he sees them all as competition.  I'm sure he knows whether he's taller than Metul or not!

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2 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

think Shep would take the time to get to know at least a tew things about Metul because of Metul's station and status of being an up-and-coming anesthesiologist, and Shep is a snob.  For the same reason Shep dismisses Madison as a hairdresser is the same reason I think he would want to get to know Metual a little bit. 

He looked extremely surprised when Naomie replied that Metul was born in DC which is pretty basic info to be surprised about the fact that he isn’t from India  so I have absolutely no reason to believe that he knows anything about him. It’s even money if he even knows that he is an anesthesiologist. I would go further to say that Shep probably doesn’t even know much about his dad’s friend other than he is from India because he isn’t interested in actually getting to know people. Also, if he knew Metul he probably wouldn’t go ask a dude who doesn’t know him and who’s only known commonality is they can trace their ancestors to a country so large and diverse that it’s a subcontinent to explain his behavior.

Edited by biakbiak
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I am going to be in Charleston over Thanksgiving, I am planning on going to a few of the restaurants the cast has frequented. On Radio Andy he mentioned that the cast is usually out and about but Kathryn is hard to spot around town, does she really work at Gywnn's? If so I will go to Mt. Pleasant, shop and eat at Nico's and of course report back.

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2 hours ago, jumper sage said:

You don't have to pool.  You can have yours, mine and ours.  We do.

When one is out making money and the other is home parenting and not receiving a paycheck, resources are usually “pooled”.  Otherwise Cameran would have no money to spend and Jason would need to pay her a salary for taking care of his child. 

(If she didn’t get the show and influencer money, as biakbiak pointed out.)

Edited by nexxie
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3 minutes ago, nexxie said:

Cameran would have no money to spend and Jason would need to pay her a salary for taking care of his child. 

This may change in the future but currently Cam is making a very nice living through the show and being an influencer.

Edited by biakbiak
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For someone who "doesn't suffer fools gladly", Shep was reduced to a blubbering, stammering mess last night when asked to explain his actions. All that great words suddenly flew out of his brain when asked to be accountable??

I had to laugh at his defensive proclamation of "I only get angry when I care. I wouldn't waste any anger on you if I don't  care!" 

So you DO care about Madison, Shep! Most of your anger this season was geared towards her. You even bestowed her the "honor" of being called white trash by you, by someone who totally doesn't care. Totally. 

I found Naomie's quip during the beginning about standing up for Danni (because Kathryn won't) against Madison if Danni gets attacked again, quite interesting. IIRC, Madison is not only Patricia's hair stylist, but also Cameran's and Naomie's. She does Chelsea's sometimes too. I wonder that with all of what happened this season, if the three ladies still retain Madison as their hair stylist. I'm sure Patricia still does, but she's so far removed from the drama anyway. 

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1 minute ago, biakbiak said:

This may change in the future but currently Cam is making a very nice living through the show and being an influencer.

That’s true - but since she mentioned not getting a paycheck I went with that scenario.

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9 minutes ago, nexxie said:

That’s true - but since she mentioned not getting a paycheck I went with that scenario.

She's doing her best not to break the fourth wall.

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Just now, Sew Sumi said:

She's doing her best not to break the fourth wall.

Doing a good job - I forgot all about her tv job. lol

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Looking forward to the Madison segment - I hope she calls Shit Shep out on his obvious obsession with not being able to have her. 

(Producers must’ve been behind the private meeting between them at the party last episode - wish they hadn’t edited out all the good parts!)

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5 hours ago, kelseykixx said:

Oh oh can you link to the pants!?? 

Sadly, amazon is telling me they are no longer available - I got them a good year and a half ago, if not longer. However, I see that amazon has many leatherish leggings in the same price range. Join the Kiss Me Deadly movement, lol. Get yourself a pair! 

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7 minutes ago, Stiggs said:

Sadly, amazon is telling me they are no longer available - I got them a good year and a half ago, if not longer. However, I see that amazon has many leatherish leggings in the same price range. Join the Kiss Me Deadly movement, lol. Get yourself a pair! 

I had to check out these leather pants on Amazon last night! This didn’t come from Kathryn’s mouth as the “right” leggings but one of her Twitter followers posted this and I got me some. They were 26 bucks not ten but I still went for it...

https://www.amazon.com/Tagoo-Stretchy-Leather-Leggings-Waisted/dp/B075SYB3NF

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