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Elizabeth (Lizzy) Keen: Wooden Waif?


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The actress continues to disappoint. Three minutes with traumatized Little Lizzie demonstrated that the problem remains her casting. The little girl was interesting and I wanted to see more, every scene with MB as Lizzie leaves me wanting less. At this point, I have given up on the character being written out or the actress bring replaced. I will just settle for ff through every scene she's in. Lifting her out of the show amps up the enjoyability of the episodes.

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Per Wikipedia, her grandfather was billionaire real estate developer H. Gary Morse -- he died in 2014.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megan_Boone

Oh, jeez. You gotta love a guy who exploits a loophole to put over a billion taxpayer dollars into his own pockets and then uses the money to campaign for smaller government.

I don't see how that would help her with this show, though. Sony's a pretty Democrat-heavy environment.

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Well, I for one am enjoying Megan's performance.  She' grown just as her character has.  She is, after all, a fairly new actress.  So, how do they all get their start? they get hired on some show like Megan was.  Who cares if her family has money.  Look at Will Smith's kids and the crap they do because of who their Dad is.  Also some women do the whole casting couch thing to get a role, they all get in somehow so Megan is no different.  She did study acting in college, so let her gain some experience and enjoy her first starring role.  I think she's doing a great job.  Her hair is fine, she's doing fine and is able to benefit from working with all the other talented people on TBL.

Edited by NorCalNut
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Jack Kerouac:  You really don't see a huge improvement from season 1?  I'm not trying to be snotty, just have discourse, but I really, honestly don't see what you're saying.  She's fine.  I also wonder if she has been directed to somehow play naieve/inexperienced and at other times play super confident/almost bitchy/violent.   Perhaps that is why people are reacting the way they do?  I don't know, I just feel like she's doing fine and isn't standing out as horrible.   This will sound critical, but the one who I really "don't get" is Kaley Cuoco on The Big Bang Theory.  She seems to be pretty bad/stiff etc.  Do you think Megan is like her (better or worse?)  

Edited by NorCalNut
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As I wrote in one of the episode threads, I like Megan Boone as Lizzie and I like her pairing with Spader. I'm not sure what people are expecting to see from her...Lizzie is supposed to be naive, inexperienced, and in over her head and I feel Megan captures that. If she was clever and witty and could go toe-to-toe with Red we wouldn't have the right dynamic between the two of them. I actually love their relationship, find it believable and it is my favorite part of The Blacklist.

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Lizzie is supposed to be naive, inexperienced, and in over her head and I feel Megan captures that.

 

Except that she's not inexperienced or naive, in fact it's quite the opposite -- in the pilot episode, she stated her credentials to Director Cooper:

 

  • She's been with the FBI for 4 years
  • Head of the emergency mobile psych unit in New York
  • Board-certified in Forensic Psychology
  • Her colleagues called her 'sir' because they thought she was a bitch
  • Has deep yearning to relate to the criminal mind
  • Just graduated from profiling school at Quantico and it was her first day on the job as a profiler when Red surrendered himself

 

Except for a couple of brief moments in the pilot like when she punctured Red's artery with a pen, she has rarely shown the toughness or experience she is supposed to have.

 

And per the 2nd part of the Luther Braxton episodes, it is determined that Lizzie is 30 years old based on the fact that the fire at her house took place 26 years ago --- when she was 4.

 

Considering that she only recently graduated from profiling school, I very much doubt that she would be teaching at profiling school (as shown in the latest episode).

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(edited)

I assumed that the network really didn't like the Lizzie in the pilot who was supposed to be badass and she was toned down to dull monotony shortly afterwards. There was a behind the scenes video posted after the first episode which talked about what a competent tough agent she was, and by episodes two and three the behind the scenes videos were talking about her inexperience and insecurity. I guess the audience found Ms. Boone's lack of affect less offputting in someone who's supposed to be paralyzed with indecision.

 

AAR, as dull as I find sullen adolescent angst-ridden inexperienced Lizzie, preternaturally savvy action Lizzie is in point and laugh territory for me. I realize that mileage varies on both those points. I think, though, we can all agree that they need to pick one, because outside of a severe dissociative personality disorder, the same woman is not going to be both of those things on alternate days.

Edited by Julia
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I think, though, we can all agree that they need to pick one, because outside of a severe dissociative personality disorder, the same woman is not going to be both of those things on alternate days.

 

Bingo. They need to pick one or the other and stick with it.

 

Then we should see 'Sir' Lizzie when she's not interacting with Red, shouldn't we?

 

Yes we should.

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Then we should see 'Sir' Lizzie when she's not interacting with Red, shouldn't we?

I think we did, in flashes, with the last episode and in other episodes, like her going rogue in “Anslo Garrick” and when she tried to interrogate Tom.

I also think it would be easy to fanwank that “pilot Lizzie” got so overwhelmed by what happened that it shook her to the point where she lost her confidence and is now struggling to regain it. Red coming into her world would be such a whirlwind that I could buy that happening.

Problem is, it's just a fanwank- it's not established on-screen that is what is happening, since Lizzie doesn't open up to anyone. To me, this could be easily solved if Lizzie had at least someone on the show who she could vent to, but she doesn't. Lizzie, it seems, has no friends outside of work, and these people would at least serve the purpose of allowing her to get across her feelings so that we know what is going on. I don't think it's too late to introduce one- and the character could be nothing more than a recurring character, someone who pops up whenever Lizzie gets troubled.

The problem with Lizzie I think is the writing, since the writers forget this is TV and not a novel. In a novel, you can write about someone's mind and what they're going through- on TV, you need a sounding board, and Lizzie doesn't have one.

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moved from the episode thread

I actually like that Liz isn't super-awesome at every little thing under the sun, that she's only been a profiler for eighteen momths and that she's not an expert at it.

And that's a totally arguable position. Unfortunately, the show has effectively undermined it.

They gave up badass Agent Sir and her crew of subordinates embittered by her steely awesomeness back in episode 2. Since then, right out of school Lizzie's only qualification to do anything other than be the juniorest agent ever is her membership in a super seekrit black ops group nobody has clearance to know about (and she one way or the other got _that_ job because Red knew her dad). Every week since she's been spoonfed the answers. And yet somehow, the FBI has her teaching classes in her "specialty," which she's never actually practiced, and taking down hit teams with her jazzercise krav maga.

Even if you're OK with her acting and I (dear god) am not, perhaps we can agree that the writing for Lizzie has badly disserved both the actress and the character.

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I'll just put this here for the record (from the episode thread for 2.15): the thread title should be changed to "Elizabeth (Lizzy) Keen: I suck!"

Even if you're OK with her acting and I (dear god) am not, perhaps we can agree that the writing for Lizzie has badly disserved both the actress and the character.

That's ultimately her problem. Some episodes, she's this depraved character who isn't afraid to commit crimes or go to various lengths to seek justice. Other episodes, she's this weakling who gets beaten up, captured and scared by everything she has to do and needs her "Daddy" (Red) to hold her hand throughout. Then there's other episodes where she's stressed and overwhelmed by everything and lashes out at everyone, particularly Red, and, like a rebellious teen, tells Red "Get out of my life! I hate you and I don't need you anymore!"

She's just...all over the place, so small wonder Megan Boone is confused. I'd be able to accept it if the other characters noted how erratic she is, but none of them ever do.

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Yeah, the writing with Lizzie is all over the place.  I actually like crazy, demented Liz, (it's certainly more fun than naïve waif Liz) but if that's the goal then they need to write it and stick with it. 

 

I will say that part of the problem may be that they're trying to portray Lizzie as "divided" she loves Tom, she hates Tom.  She hates Red and doesn't trust him.  She relies on Red for everything.  Red may be a father figure, Lizzie might be developing...other feelings there.  Not that I necessarily want them to go there for the record-I'm just saying it's a little ambiguous at this point, and Kessler's line to Liz when she said that Tom was a source just like Red, "The difference is you're not in love with Reddington," may have been foreshadowing something.  Then again Tom's crack at Kessler, "What are you her boyfriend or something?" may have been foreshadowing as well and that's an even worse idea since those two have all the chemistry of two wooden planks together.  Personally the only ship for Lizzie I could get behind  would be her and Irram, (who if you think about it really  is the sweet geeky guy Tom was pretending to be) but he's got eyes for a better more badass woman.

 

Now I don't think it's actually always a bad idea to portray the main character as a woman who's constantly fighting with herself-it certainly worked for Katee Sackhoff as  Kara Thrace on Battlestar Galactica, or even Lilly on Cold Case,  but the problem is that the writing/acting here is not up to those levels. Not even close and unlike with Starbuck, no one acknowledges Liz's crazy levels.  (Or anything like the running commentary on Lilly's "ice queen" abilities.)  If they actually *did* question her mental stability for a change, (as opposed to just implying she's Red's accomplice,) this storyline would work better.  I mean one thing I liked about "Linus Creel," was they were dealing with the fact that's a got a few loose bolts there in her psych interview.  They should be following that up more, by having Liz attend mandatory shrink sessions.

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I actually like that Liz isn't super-awesome at every little thing under the sun, that she's only been a profiler for eighteen momths and that she's not an expert at it.

 

I, too, am willing to forget that "Sir" nonsense, but one of the things that kills me about Lizzie is how she interacts with people like her superiors and even senior officials of sovereign countries. She talks to them as if she is convinced for some reason that she is in command and they are expected to do whatever she says. She has that ridiculous steel in her voice, there is no decorum whatsoever when she argues with Cooper, she storms out of his office without waiting to be dismissed. I would prefer to see an unsure, inexperienced agent exhibit a little less insubordination. I suppose she could be masking her feelings of inadequacy this way, but there have been no signs that this is the case, and the show seems to be treating this as a totally normal behavior, for some reason accepted by all involved. In any case, even if there is a realistic reason behind Lizzie's work manners, they still annoy the hell out of me.

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Is there anyone anywhere who thinks Lizzie is a sympathetic character?

Moved from the episode thread for “The Longevity Initiative.”

Do I think Lizzie is sympathetic? Well...I don't think of her as one of “the bad guys”...she has noble intentions, so in that regard, yeah she's “sympathetic”.

Is she “likeable”? That's another question, and one more difficult to answer. I think there are episodes where she's an interesting character who informs the plot in intriguing ways, sometimes even as much as Red or Tom do. Then there are other episodes where I wonder why she was even considered as a character, because all she does is fill up space and ruin the plot.

For me, the writing is what has failed Lizzie the most, because they're the ones that made her hopelessly erratic. I also don't think they play to Megan Boone's strengths. Boone is great, I think, when she has to display that “quiet confidence” and be the kind of character who's sneaky and does her things in the background. She's not a “forefront” character where she has to be the “life of the party” and be the focal point of the scene at all times, like Red does. She should be feeding off what other people give her, and if she is the focal point of a scene, someone should be “guiding” her or it should be a scene where she's the only component. Boone isn't a “scene chewer” like James Spader is, or Reed Birney (Deputy Attorney General Thomas Connolly), so she shouldn't be required to be, like she has been at times in this series.

I also think Boone is much better playing the depraved, potential future criminal than she is at playing the “sweet, innocent, delicate little flower” they've tried to make her. Her emotional reactions are over the top, and she comes across as a petulant child than an actual adult. In those cases, she's more “caricature” than “character”, so I think they ought to keep those scenes to a minimum.

So...is she likeable? I think she can be...the show just has to use her right.

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This may be her first big role, but she has been in various series for quite a while now, Law & Order LA and Blue Bloods, for instance.  I don't remember her in LOLA, but I do remember that she was not good in Blue Bloods and didn't last long.  There are probably parts that would play to her strengths, but to me this is not one of them.  The role of Elizabeth Keen needs an actress with considerably more range and ability to convey emotions, in my opinion.  Agreed that the weird writing does not help, but I still feel she only shows very limited emotional or any other kind of response. Is she improving?  Maybe, but I will admit that I so dislike her at this point that I would have trouble giving her credit if she did get better.  

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(edited)

I actually like Elizabeth Keen.    Yes this will forever been Spaders and Red Reddingtons show but I really enjoy the relationship between Keen and Reddington and I really liked Elizabeth's storyline during the 2nd season and am looking forward to it during the third.    Then again I like the darker tone the show is taking her down the back half of the 2nd season.    Plus I think the show now playing to her Megan Boones strengths.   I never did understand the hate for Boone.  Yes she is a weak actress but the character she plays is and always has been entertaining the only thing she does poorly is the big emotions...which Spader overdoes which kinda makes it ever more evident.  .  The rest of the problems with her character is purely weird writing and not her fault.  

Edited by Chaos Theory
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Well, hate seems like a strong word for recognizing that she's a weak actress and wishing that an actress less weak was keeping Lizzie Keen's screen time from dragging down the show. Call it low-grade annoyance with a tinge of righteous indignation that any number of actors who are capable of doing the job competently are out there waiting tables instead.

Also, a little confused that even people who are defending her seem to be in agreeance that after two years she's really not good, although she's slightly better than when she started. Two years (or if you prefer, 40+ episodes) ago. What's enjoyable about that?

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(edited)

The rest of the problems with her character is purely weird writing and not her fault.

 

 

Unless Megan Boone has her own set of private writers who create her script separately from everyone else's, there is no way I can blame Boone's poor acting skills on the writers. Red, Ressler, Aram and the others are able to act their way out of every script, yet Boone is the only one affected by "weird writing." Really.

 

That says it all to me.

Edited by saber5055
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Unless Megan Boone has her own set of private writers who create her script separately from everyone else's, there is no way I can blame Boone's poor acting skills on the writers. Red, Ressler, Aram and the others are able to act their way out of every script, yet Boone is the only one affected by "weird writing." Really.

That says it all to me.

First of all, though I understand writing quality and acting quality are subjective, I would argue that Megan Boone isn't the only one for whom the writing has let her down- several guest stars fell flat too, and I think the show wasted the likes of Mary-Louise Parker, Peter Stromare and Ron Perlman.

Second of all, Boone doesn't need to have “her own set of writers” for the writing to have let her down- all that's needed is the very real possibility that the writers are just not capable of writing to where Boone is best. Now, I think this says a lot about the skill of James Spader, Harry Lennix or Mozhan Marno that they're able to elevate above what's given to them and Boone can't, but I'm not convinced she can't hack it out if she was given the right role.

Simply put, she's miscast. Boone should never have been the leading lady, or at least the leading lady as a FBI agent. She doesn't do empathy very well, or vulnerability, coming off as a petulant child. What she *does* do well is appearing innocent but being really completely depraved- she would be so much better as a villain, especially as someone's “scheming seductress”. She never should have been cast as “the good guy” because she just can't garner sympathy.

The way I see it is that Elizabeth Keen should have been done differently with two different options:

-Using a different actress (like maybe Amy Davidson) who can play the “the newbie with a lot of potential who just needs guidance to realize it” while still projecting the confidence and maturity that's needed to be an adult. It's like how Spencer Reid was like in the early days of Criminal Minds, where he had that big brain of his- he just needed Jason Gideon to help him use it correctly.

-Establishing, from the start, that Keen is the villain, being a schemer intent on using the FBI for some kind of goal, and Red is there to stop her. This show does schemers very well- Tom Connolly was a shining example of that- so it shouldn't be too much to use that for Keen. I also think it would have made a much more believable case as to why Red is so obsessed with her, and would have given Keen a bit more of a “central” role on the show. Plus I just think “Red vs. Lizzie” is far better than “Red and Lizzie”.

Bottom line- terrible actress? That's subjective. Miscast? I think that's more likely. Boone could have had a role on this show where she flourished- it just isn't the one they gave her.

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I just started binge watching blacklist, and I have to say that i cringe every time Megan is in a scene. At first I thought,ok maybe she is new. Then I thought, who wrote her scripts? Then i noticed every single episode end has her crying, hating red, liking red, mad at red,sad about red... I mean it got me predicting the end of every episode. Checking off on each column how she will react at the end of each. She is a terrible actress,and she has no personality whatsoever.  Every episode is mostly about her. And its boring.  Or how many times can you count her saying "my daughter?" I feel bad for the guy who plays Tom and the other actors who have to be in this show with her. They spend so much time finding Liz or finding her daughter. None of the other actors even get an episode that is all about them.

She drags down everyone.

I watch the show for Aram Tom and Ressler and that's it. Loved them using alan alda and lance henriksen. Those guys are awesome. 

I'm on season 4 epi 11. I'm guessing by reading other posts that she is still on this show?

Sigh.

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I just started binge watching the show after not getting past the first few episodes of Season 3 in the initial run. I've caught up to where I stopped before.

I find the actress terrible and the writing for her even worse. She does so much stupid shit (as do most of the characters apart from Red), it drives me to yelling at the tv. She is always standing around with her mouth hanging open, looking confused. Thank God, for James Spader.

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In the beginning I saw Liz do things but at least she questioned them  or at least she felt some guilt. But these few seasons, Liz acts like she's never wrong or never wonders if made things worse or how she crossed so many lines that she's worse than Red. At least he has a code, her mora code are all over the place.  

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Actually, Megan Boone wasn't bad when she on Blue Bloods as Danny's partner.  But this show?  She's like watching paint dry.  I'm willing to give some of the credit for how bad she is to Bokenkamp and just the dumb nature of this show.

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