PODCAST S01.E16: Go Pirates! Betty and Veronica

[Primetimer]

Veronica Mars looks for answers in the desert while a betting caper gets her goat back home.

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[Primetimer]

Find out who's the number one, G.O.A.T. in our collection of the most noteworthy screenshots from S01.E16!

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[WhosThatGirl]

Goats ARE funny! Also yay friendship moment with Wallace and Veronica. Aside from that.. yeah the actual MOW is kind of.. okay.

As for season mystery, yeah this episode drags the story, and bringing in Leanne drags it down even more. Because she does?

This episode was fun but it didn’t give us any real new information except that according to Leanne, Jake knew all about the possibility of maybe being Veronica’s Dad and did nothing.

[MostlyC]

My high school had no mascot but back in the 90s pre-Columbine my school and our rival school would cheerfully call bomb threats to the other school's library on the friday before the big games (because clearly our rival team were geeks and would be studying on friday nights).  I'm pretty sure campus security snickered every time they got a call and caller-ID-ed it, and I don't ever remember hearing of either library actually being evacuated. I'm sure kids would be jailed/expelled if they tried to pull that shit today.  I grew up in the stone age of innocence, so get off my lawn.

This episode was fun, but after the whole Logan Going Off the Deep End, it felt a bit filler.  But I liked seeing Veronica in a different world where she wasn't persona non grata.  And the boy she made friends with seemed like a good guy, unfortunate haircut excepted.

I loved Veronica making the snickerdoodles and the friendship between her and Wallace.

But good call on the Pep Squad Continuity.  Too bad we never had any more Pan Shenanigans.  I liked both Polly and the Goat.

LeAnne drove me nuts- and I am sorry that

 

we never saw her after season 1.  I think it would have been cool to bring her back as a part of the Big Bad for some other season, to get some more Mother/Daughter angst/noirish flavor

.  I will go to my grave convinced LeAnne and Jake were still sleeping together.

[WhosThatGirl]

This episode was fun. It was a good light hearted one- our last one maybe? I can’t really remember but I feel like after this one, things get pretty dark and knee deep into the seasons mystery. Which it should. 

[gpgurl50]

Great podcast. I agree, the main plot was a little too intricate though it did have its moments.

I will say I do get why Jake and Celeste didn't mention Lianne. At this point in the timeline (however blurry), Keith and Lianne were still married. Keith had a friendly-ish relationship with the Kanes due to their kids and I think the Kanes thought they could use that to their advantage in the situation. If Jake or Celeste had mentioned that Jake and Lianne had been having an affair while she was with Keith and that Veronica might not be his, he could become biased against them and go after them harder; Or even more likely, he could remove himself from the case and get more officials involved who may not have loyalty to the Kane family. I think they wanted as little people as possible involved in their shady dealings given one of their employees bugged an underaged girl among other things. We also knew since the beginning of the series that Keith lost his job for accusing the Kanes of murder. Now, we are starting to have an idea of why he suspected they were involved. He knew they were lying, just not about what.

Lianne sucks but I do think her characterization is all over the place. I do think the Veronica she got in this episode was not the one she wanted. The last time she saw Veronica was before she became a detective who can't let things go.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

Quote

I do think the Veronica she got in this episode was not the one she wanted.

Perfectly put. As whiffy as Lianne's motivations can be as written, I think this is dead on.

[Affogato]

I never had a living mascot except for cheerleaders in furry costumes, but the parrot is pretty easily explained since parrots often outlive their owners. Someone who works in the office brings their dead great aunt's bird in, it goes with the pirate theme and people make it a general pet. Maybe Pan got a goat in retaliation. The sexual and rural implications of the great god Pan as a high school name, did that mean anything? That is also a lot of meat to have been taken off a goat of Billy's size. 

I don't think Veronica was on the pep squad for long. There is this flashback where Lilly tells Veronica she is joining the pep squad and V is dubious, but as of the car wash it is clear Veronica has joined the pep squad, too, which would mean she was only a member for a short period of time up until Lilly's murder and not long afterwards.  Once Keith lost his job she was busy receptionisting after school and by that time Logan would have soured the experience for her if she'd wanted to stay on the squad. She may not have been on the pep squad when basketball season was underway. 

I liked a lot of this episode. It is pretty clear that Veronica could have transferred to Pan and had a much different high school experience, while still working for her Dad, solving Lilly's murder and maybe even taking on high school cases. Of course the logical time for her to transfer would have been after Shelly Pomeroy's party so she would still have been raped and Logan would have gone after her when his mother died, or Mars Investigations, so she would have still ended with a lot of problems. She might have had more friends, though, and her returning to Neptune later in life might have been less Noir and frankly less tragic.  It is classist, though. Pan is clearly where a policeman's daughter should have gone to school, even the Sheriff. 

I'm surprised Keith wouldn't follow up on where her money went. He really is raising her as if she was a forty year old! Then he would have found the rehab place. I noticed that when she called for him he is getting tired of just being used as a source of information for her cases, like Wallace. I'm not sure if this is related to trust, as is often assumed, I think. I wonder if she is reconstructing her sense of self worth so she is not of value as a person but only valuable for her usefulness. Not sure I've got that right, though.  

When Wallace goes off to eat with the rest of the team and leaves her there the camera shot makes her seem as if she is receding into the distance. Later she eats with them, but only to get information, and she probably doesn't join them again when her case is solved. Maybe once, for cake. The snickerdoodle boxes were sweet and her transferring lockers to be near Wallace and not (presumably Lilly's old locker) is also cute. It is too bad the thing with the plant really messes things up between them. She obviously has difficulty with the relationship with Meg soon enough and generally this is the last ghosts of her having friends. It creates the void that Logan moves into and while he tries to bring her back to the 09ers that wasn't, as we've learned, even a go when Lilly was alive--and most of them weren't his friends, really.

Liane. Jake. I think Thomas still wanted to actually make Veronica Jake's daughter at some point, at least it is open ended. Whether Jake and Liane were having a sexual relationship at this point is also, I think, not clear. Jake doesn't seem like someone who would give up a lot for a drunk, even his high school sweetheart, although he might see her in a neutral location, like a hotel. I think at first it seems like she drank when Keith's lifestyle took a dive but later it is said that she had been drinking for a long time. 

Edited September 30, 2017 by Affogato
forgot Liane

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, gpgurl50 said:

Great podcast. I agree, the main plot was a little too intricate though it did have its moments.

I will say I do get why Jake and Celeste didn't mention Lianne. At this point in the timeline (however blurry), Keith and Lianne were still married. Keith had a friendly-ish relationship with the Kanes due to their kids and I think the Kanes thought they could use that to their advantage in the situation. If Jake or Celeste had mentioned that Jake and Lianne had been having an affair while she was with Keith and that Veronica might not be his, he could become biased against them and go after them harder; Or even more likely, he could remove himself from the case and get more officials involved who may not have loyalty to the Kane family. I think they wanted as little people as possible involved in their shady dealings given one of their employees bugged an underaged girl among other things. We also knew since the beginning of the series that Keith lost his job for accusing the Kanes of murder. Now, we are starting to have an idea of why he suspected they were involved. He knew they were lying, just not about what.

Lianne sucks but I do think her characterization is all over the place. I do think the Veronica she got in this episode was not the one she wanted. The last time she saw Veronica was before she became a detective who can't let things go.

Good post, although I think we were given the reason why Keith doubted them immediately when we see Lilly's death. They were washing Duncan's blood soaked clothes and the Kanes were lying to cover for Duncan, who the Kanes believed Killed Lilly. Keith picks up that they are covering something up and jumps to the conclusion (as Veronica so often does) that Jake was the killer.

[Affogato]

Billy is one beautiful goat. Someone has to say it.

I really wish she'd gone out with Leo longer. At the least he's a reminder that there is life outside of high school, life that isn't Liane.

[Petunia13]

That goat is adorable?

[Rebecca Clements]

You guys keep calling Mrs Kane Camille. She’s called Celeste on the show. As a VM fan from way back, I’m loving revisiting it with you guys, but I’m so confused about this.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

...The actress's name is Camille, I believe, so many moons ago when we started the podcast, I was calling her "Camille" because I am a dumb (and also she just looks more like a Camille than a Celeste, and they both are seven-letter names that start and end with C and e? and I am a dumb). Then it just turned into a running gag where we both call her that. 

 

NB: This will happen again with Amelia DeLongpre, whom I can't not call Amanda because see above. Sorry for the confusion! 

[paulvdb]

7 minutes ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

...The actress's name is Camille, I believe

Lisa Thornhill

[secnarf]

8 hours ago, paulvdb said:

Lisa Thornhill

I thought it was Lisa Rinna?

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, secnarf said:

I thought it was Lisa Rinna?

Lisa Rinna is Logan's mother. 

[secnarf]

1 hour ago, Affogato said:

Lisa Rinna is Logan's mother. 

Right, thanks! Too much cold medication :P

[Sarah D. Bunting]

Lisa Thornhill. Close! Totally has L in it!

 

...Not close at all. Absolutely no reason for me to keep biffing the name. As you were!

[pau]

I just listened this episode's podcast..i don't know, i buy Veronica/Lianne's relationship..granted it was never enough explored..but i bought it..you love your parent, you hold on..actually from experience i can say : when you are young..the more your parent is absent, abandon you the more you ache for them..

[Affogato]

On 9/24/2017 at 7:31 PM, PuhLeeze said:

I just finished watching season 1 on Go90. I had to go back and rewatch a scene because even days later it's bugging me. She says she's “saved every penny since working for dad” and that she had enough for “four years at San Diego State, a year at Stanford, and a semester at the Sorbonne.”  And how long's her dad been a PI? about a year? That's some serious bullshit. Maybe "my parent's had been saving since the day I was born and I've been adding to it." But really?! She's saved up that much money working for her dad, but her dad can't afford to help her go to college? Even if you add money she earns from the kids at school, there's just no way. 

Right now tuition at San Diego state is 47,100. Add fees, housing, etc and 62,400 a year.  

Assume less during show. 

I assumed she had a college fund she added to, including many side cases.  Because that’s how her dad and V talked about it  

How much would moms rehab cost?

how did the fifty thousand Jake gave factor into it? 

Honestly I never believed she skipped that test to go to trial and hear the verdict. After all the money struggles. 

Edited October 30, 2017 by Affogato

[Sarah D. Bunting]

There's just something inconsistent at the center of it that I don't buy. We'll be getting into this much more in upcoming episodes.

[absnow54]

My university mascot was a tiger as well, and they actually had a REAL TIGER that lived in the library until, like, the 1960's.

[Affogato]

On 10/30/2017 at 9:59 AM, Sarah D. Bunting said:

There's just something inconsistent at the center of it that I don't buy. We'll be getting into this much more in upcoming episodes.

There’s something inconsistent about Lynn as well. Veronica’s limited POV?