S03.E15: The Waiting Room

[watcher1006]

4 minutes ago, TVForever said:

I just want to give Miguel a hug. Watching him constantly getting disregarded at best, and disrespected at worst by The Big Three is hard for me to watch. And Rebecca’s not much better. Jack has been dead for over twenty years at this point, she needs to stop subjecting Miguel to her overly fond memories of her “perfect” life with Jack. Sometimes he seems more like her caretaker than her life partner. 

Free Miguel!

I agree with the pro-Miguel comments on this thread and I was angry at Toby when he made the joke about Kate wanting to see him first. It was so cruel. Here was Miguel feeling the typical Pearson family exclusion of him and then Toby goes and makes a joke which was driven by the feeling, likely one that he agrees with, that Miguel is not quite part of the family.

[txhorns79]

5 minutes ago, TVForever said:

I just want to give Miguel a hug. Watching him constantly getting disregarded at best, and disrespected at worst by The Big Three is hard for me to watch. And Rebecca’s not much better. Jack has been dead for over twenty years at this point, she needs to stop subjecting Miguel to her overly fond memories of her “perfect” life with Jack. Sometimes he seems more like her caretaker than her life partner. 

If this was real life, I'm sure Miguel would have left Rebecca by now.  Her children are overwhelming and treat him mostly indifferently or like an interloper.  And yeah, I'd imagine it would be very tiresome to feel like you are competing with someone's "perfect" dead husband.   

[cmpbl]

I don't understand why they treat Miguel so bad. He seems like a great guy. I wish Rebecca would put them in their place when it comes to Miguel.

Edited March 13, 2019 by cmpbl

[Amethyst]

8 minutes ago, Squirrely said:

Forget Saint Jack! Miguel is the real hero of this story. 

Miguel's the saint since he actually puts up with this.  That's why I hated Toby's joke at the end.  I get that he was burned out and didn't mean to be hurtful, but given the context of the episode, it just felt cruel.  It's like kicking someone when they're already down.

[cmpbl]

Why couldn't someone tell them what was going on back there with Kate? I mean at the very least someone should have come out and told her mother what was going on.

[ShortyMac]

I was born at 24.5 weeks, weighed 1lb, 7.5oz. I spent four months in the NICU. It's so weird to look at pictures of myself as this tiny thing and I can't imagine how scared my parents were; so many unknowns. I try to stay grateful to be here and for the quality of life I have, just mild cerebral palsy, no other major issues. So many other families aren't as fortunate.

[tennisgurl]

I can get that this is a stressful situation, but the Pearson's were extra super jerkish today. rare form, Pearsons! Just never ending sniping and arguing and taking cheap shots, it was ridiculous. Except for Miguel and Rebecca, who were actually trying to help everyone keep their shit together, everyone else was just in a mood to fight. 

Dont be mean to Madison Kevin, she is Kate's best friend, of course she would want her to be there. At least he admitted right after she left that he was being an asshole, I hope we see him apologize next week. Of course, Kevin has also been careening off the wagon, so thats probably going to be first on his mind for awhile, he isnt exactly thinking of the niceties. 

Randall is just insufferable lately, and his stuff with Beth is just unbelievably selfish. I mean, has Randall cared at all about the practicalities of any of the stuff he has done to follow his bliss or whatever that has changed everything about his families life? How his "dream" has changed every three seconds? But when Beth wants to try her impossible dream, now he wants to think about logistics?! And he gets all pissy when Miguel and Rebecca want to leave so they wont be on permanent babysitting duty? Come on dude, haven't we all had enough of everyone in the family having to rearrange their lives for him and his midlife crisis? 

I really do feel so bad for Miguel, he is just such a nice man who tries so hard to be a supportive member of the family, and everyone treats him like crap. Even Toby, after a hugely emotionally draining day, has to get a crack in, even after Miguel sat around for hours to support him and his wife and kid! And whats even sadder is that this side of the family is actually nicer  to him than his asshole kids and their side of the family. 

Poor Kate, Toby, and tiny baby Jack. He is just so little, its hard to wrap your brain around the fact that its a tiny person. I am glad the baby lived, it would be super depressing if he died after all of this. He needs to play with his Ruth Bader Ginsburg doll!

There were some moments I liked. I liked Rebecca calling back to the night Jack died, some of the arguments between Randall and Kevin, while petty and badly timed, rang true to their characters and their history together, I liked Zoe trying to decide on what to do about her relationship with Kevin, and that Randall was trying to talk about what to do now that Kevin has clearly relapsed. With the baby in bad shape and Randall starting his new job, no one will really be around to help him, except for Zoe. 

With Zoe, its a tough situation. Being in a relationship with an addict is always tough, especially one mid relapse, and even more especially when Zoe has so many trust issues of her own. If she left, I wouldn't blame her, as sad as that would make me, as I like them together. But before that, she really needs to be honest with him, ghosting him or trying to just bolt is going to be bad for everyone.

[KrissyBean]

The answer to the "Ranch and Chocolate" question is chicken noodle soup! Or any non-cream based soups for that matter. Ranch would separate in the broth and be gross, right?

[coconutpie]

First of all, never have I seen so much screaming in a hospital waiting room since the Bravermans. There is no way they would allow all that nonsense. Second, at least the Bravermans made me cry happy and sad tears every episode. This was so boring and dull, I felt no emotion about the baby at all. 

[Lady Calypso]

8 minutes ago, cmpbl said:

Why couldn't someone tell them what was going on back there with Kate? I mean at the very least someone should have come out and told her mother what was going on.

Exactly. The doctor knows that any update, especially with regards to Kate getting a C-section, is the right thing to do. Obviously Toby was in no frame of mind to even thinking about updating the family, so the doctor should have sent a nurse out to let them know that Kate was going to get a C-section. 

However, then I realized that the whole episode took place in 2 hours (from 4-6am) and the doctor DID already come out with an update around 4:30am so it's not like they had been waiting for hours since the last update. 

Still, sitting around for 26 hours without getting any real information IS fairly weird writing. It was still dumb for nobody to inform the family anything useful. 

[mommalib]

Why is Kevin always directing his crap at Randall. They're adults and Kevin is still picking on the guy. Just one time I would like see Randall really unload on his ass.

[Runningwild]

Ugh. A Ruth Bader Ginsburg doll? Yikes, that was creepy. And political. Poor Miguel. Dang, Toby! That was cruel!  I thought Rebecca was going to tell them about Kyle and Dr. K, not about Jack. Sorry Kevin is relapsing, but at least that part of the show is realistic. 

[MsJamieDornan]

1 hour ago, Amethyst said:

I thought something was seriously wrong with Rebecca besides being scared.  She looked unconscious before she yelled at everyone to shut up.  She could have done that without the longwinded speech, though.  Just saying.

Rebecca seriously drove me crazy during all of this. Looking at the outlets, counting the chairs,,,enough already.  Grow up, all of you.

[willco]

I really thought for a few seconds there that Randall was going to slug Kevin ! Now, that would have been shocking.

But, not really much else was-- tiring, as others have said, is a better desciption.

[mommalib]

10 minutes ago, willco said:

I really thought for a few seconds there that Randall was going to slug Kevin ! Now, that would have been shocking.

But, not really much else was-- tiring, as others have said, is a better desciption.

Maybe he should for a change.

[WhosThatGirl]

Eh, in regard to Randall and Kevin I’m on Kevin’s side. Randall was angry that Rebecca was considering moving and Randall was all “what about me mommy?!? I’m your favorite!” All the Pearson’s were annoying yeah but that always bugs about Randall.

[twoods]

The writers continue to crap on every single character (except Miguel and maybe Beth). Do they think we want to see the insufferable, narcissist Pearsons? The first season they had their quirks but it wasn’t this bad. There has to be a reason they are throwing them all under the bus and making them so unlikable- maybe some sort of redemption arc next season after some shocking cliffhanger that makes them re-evaluate their selfishness. If there is no reason, I don’t think I can sit through anymore of this. 

Free Miguel!

[ProudMary]

Self-absorption, thy name is Pearson. 

Wow, it's one thing to get into it with your family, but Kevin and/or Randall also went at the doctor, a couple of nurses, Madison (poor Madison, I really felt bad for her), and the poor woman who dared to sit down in a PUBLIC waiting area and eat a bag of pretzels.  

Why was no one allowed in to see Kate?  Last week, both Kevin and Randall were in the room together with her. Now not even her mother is allowed in? For 26 hours? 

Run Zoe, run.  This is the family you'd be dealing with, while living with an alcoholic.  He says he's sorry for lying to you while he's got vodka in his water bottle? Get out while you can, Zoe.

Right at the opening, the first words out of my mouth were, "Now Beth is there in CA too?  Who the hell is with the kids?"  I did like that Beth was looking out for Rebecca though.

Of course the baby's name is Jack. That baby could have come out with green skin, pointed ears and a tail and he was going to be named Jack. I don't care what Rebecca said about having to see him first to decide his name, or that young Kate gave weird names to her stuffed animals per Randall.

What an awful episode.

[MsJamieDornan]

5 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

What an awful episode.

So true ! It was awful in so many ways. And not even close to being realistic. Probably the worst episode so far. It was annoying.

[truebluesmoky]

I felt horrible for Rebecca the entire episode. Not only was she dealing with the memories of Jack’s death, she also lost Kyle during an emergency delivery situation. 

[LoveLeigh]

2 hours ago, tomsmom said:

This show has really turned for me. The Pearson’s are insufferable! Kevin kicking out Madison and no one standing up for her???? Pathetic.

The last 3 episodes were pretty bad. There is just not enough going on any more. It's stagnant. 

[izabella]

I hold an unpopular opinion in that I really liked this episode.  In my head, I was congratulating the writers for showing they can write a compelling episode without resorting to flashbacks.   I like when the family is together and they are airing their dirty laundry.  That's better than all the shows where people never tell each other important things.

[buttersister]

You get an Emmy. And you get an Emmy. And you get an Emmy. And no. Just my version of Toby’s joke.

I thought SKB perfectly channeled young Randall when he apologized to his mom. Really, face and voice. And the RBG doll got me. Little Jack’s first superhero action figure!

But otherwise, I wasn’t speechless. I was imagining Toby texting Madison.

As to the sniping, this isn’t the first family who took out their stresses on each other.

[Mystery]

3 hours ago, Amethyst said:

I thought something was seriously wrong with Rebecca besides being scared.  She looked unconscious before she yelled at everyone to shut up.  She could have done that without the longwinded speech, though.  Just saying.  

I thought Miguel was answering for her because she's sick or something, and that they were going to mention it as the reason why they couldn't be responsible for watching the girls all the time. 

Too many speeches. 

[NUguy514]

Kate's naming the baby Jack was both completely expected and totally gross.  Her daddy issues give me the heebies.

Kevin's being a dick to Madison was uncalled for, and I knew the second he took that water bottle out from inside his jacket that it had liquor in it.  Zoe's swig and the very subtle reaction she had confirmed it.  His relapse isn't surprising since he's so used to suppressing everything growing up as the overlooked triplet and hasn't been quite able to overcome that.  I hope he gets the help he needs (from rehab, AA, something else, or a combination), and I hope she stays with him because I actually like them together.

Randall can go eat a bag of infinite dicks.  Ugh.

I thought Rebecca was going to have a stroke or something the way she was looking, but I did love her telling her two dipshit sons to shut the fuck up.

Toby's lame attempt at a joke at Miguel's expense was just incredibly mean and super shitty.

On the other hand, Beth's exasperated and exhausted "Miguel, I swear before God..." made me laugh so much.

I love Miguel.  #FreeMiguel

[bros402]

4 hours ago, janeyjay said:

I decided not to watch this episode in real time, because I gave birth to my kiddo at 25 weeks gestation in very similar circumstances to this. So of course I switch over right as Kate and Toby are in the NICU with Jack. Show got this part right, down to the way the baby was hooked up in the isolet. So regardless of all the other superfluous drama nonsense, this was pretty damn accurate.  Yeah, those preemies really are that tiny.

Jack looks riiight around the size I did after I was a month old (I was born at 25 weeks)

3 hours ago, Crs97 said:

Two years after my father died, my oldest was born at 26 weeks.  He was considered big at 2 pounds, 2 ounces.  He spent 10 weeks in the NICU so I had to go back to work a few weeks in to save my maternity leave for when he came home.  I remember a client asking about him, and I mentioned his weight.  She gasped, took out her tiny, teacup sized dog from his carrier and showed everyone, saying he weighed 3 pounds.  I had to say, “Yeah, my son is smaller than he is.”  I look at photos now and can’t believe how tiny he was.

We gave our son my dad’s name as his middle name.  I didn’t think I would feel comfortable saying my dad's name as I disciplined my son.  

I was born at 25 weeks, I was a bit big at 1 lb 8 oz (Though a little while later i dropped to 1 lb 1 oz, then I was tinier!) I was in the NICU for 2 1/2 months.

My mom is currently bingeing the show - she just watched Memphis the other day, this episode is probably gonna give her flashbacks to me being born - last time I was in the hospital, when one of the alarms went off in another room, both of my parents were like "Well that just brought me back to you as an infant. I will always remember those alarms."

Also, this was not a good bottle episode - it was just ugh.

Edited March 13, 2019 by bros402

[nilyank]

Everyone was so uncomfortably unpleasant. Maybe they would have been at each other throats if they had actually listened to the doctor and left the waiting room. They couldn't have taken shifts while the others could have cleaned up, eaten, and taken a nap. If anything happened they are a phone call away.

The only one missing from the asshole contest was Kate because she was busy with the c-section, but I will be honest if she had actually wanted to see Miguel first, I would have forgiven her all her crappy behavior for three seasons. It didn't even have to mean that he was one that she really wanted to see but that she was exhausted and loopy and not thinking clearly but Toby was going to do anything that she ask.

Not going to lie, I did want Kevin and Randall to blow up at each other even more. To finally clear the air.

As for Madison, I don't see any other friends that Kate has who is to spend time with her, help shop for wedding dresses, go to graduation, help her with birth plan and many other things that no one else is stepping up to do (that isn't related to Kate).

Finally, chocolate. Ranch would make it worse and is redundant to put chocolate on chocolate.

[SadieT]

My niece and nephew were both born around 27 weeks (not twins, born 2 years apart) so I totally felt the family’s terrified panic while waiting for news about Kate and the baby. My nephew was unfortunately stillborn but my niece is now a bright beautiful 7 year old, who suffered no complications as a result of her premature birth. 

I echo everyone’s sympathy for Madison, who is honestly becoming one of my favorites on this show. I wish someone had gone and dragged her back into the waiting room, which is where she belonged because Kate wanted her there. 

I understand the bickering in times of high stress and emotion but I was glad when Rebecca finally told everyone to shut the hell up. Just wish we didn’t have to endure her sad waiting room speech because try as it might, it didn’t make me feel anything. I’m actually kind of over Jack’s death, which might sound insensitive but the show has been grieving him for 3 years now and I’m tired.  

Randall was not his best self this episode. Seriously, dude was annoying. Kevin too, but I guess he at least had the "excuse" of being drunk. Randall was a sober jerk. 

Hasn’t Miguel had a similar "outsider" conversation with Toby? Miguel is like the official Pearson family ambassador who has to perform community outreach and comfort all the people the Pearson cult hurt with their “no outsiders” mentality. They’re not that great of a family, in fact as a whole they’re pretty self-involved and insensitive, so not sure why anyone even wants a seat at that table. 

[mommalib]

Out of the clear blue he had just found out that his mother was getting ready to move across the country. Yes he's a momma's boy and yes they do have a certain relationship and bond, No matter how old he is she's still his mother, so i'm not surprised he felt a type a way. What ticks me off is Kevin's continued resentment of Randall's bond with Rebecca. He needs to grow the hell up. And i'm tired of his addiction being used as an excuse. Kevin has proven he can be a jerk drunk or sober. Oh and not to mention Randall found out at a time when the stress level was at extreme as it was already.

Edited March 13, 2019 by mommalib

[ElectricBoogaloo]

That Was Us:

[debraran]

6 hours ago, cmpbl said:

I don't understand why they treat Miguel so bad. He seems like a great guy. I wish Rebecca would put them in their place when it comes to Miguel.

Yea, he's a grown man and can take care of himself, but one strong "That's enough, Miguel is my HUSBAND and I need you to respect him" from the beginning, would have been nice. They think the fans are so fragile they will revolt. I read last year he would have a larger role, more love etc. but I don't see it yet really. They show him and he constantly acts like he's fine in the shadows of Jack and the kids tolerating him. Twenty years later, this shouldn't be.

Remember when Kevin visited a long time ago and she was cuddling with Miguel and watching tiny house show and she sat up and moved away a little? Kevin told her she didn't have to do that.....really, that is so creepy. To hide from your children any affection that many years after their dad's death. Then I saw how they were going to play this.

Edited March 13, 2019 by debraran

[debraran]

2 hours ago, mommalib said:

Out of the clear blue he had just found out that his mother was getting ready to move across the country. Yes he's a momma's boy and yes they do have a certain relationship and bond, No matter how old he is she's still his mother, so i'm not surprised he felt a type a way. What ticks me off is Kevin's continued resentment of Randall's bond with Rebecca. He needs to grow the hell up. And i'm tired of his addiction being used as an excuse. Kevin has proven he can be a jerk drunk or sober. Oh and not to mention Randall found out at a time when the stress level was at extreme as it was already.

I agree on that point, they probably don't really talk to Rebecca most of the time, even there they didn't ask her about herself, it was all Randall and Beth and Kevin. They talk at her. I find a lot of children do that with parents, but mainly needy ones.

I would be upset if my Mom said that when I thought she was settled and to be honest thinking of a free part time sitter, but you never can count on something before you talk to the person. I kind of liked Kevin's line, not totally appropriate about her  being able to leave after 38 years, but it did validate she had a life.

Edited March 13, 2019 by debraran

[Blackie]

8 hours ago, Katy M said:

8 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

And did I miss who's minding Deja, Tess and Annie? 

No, they didn't say.  I imagine a friend or friends agreed to take them for a few days.  Because it was a health emergency.

8 hours ago, Eureka said:

So after all that about how are Beth and Randall going to make it work, who was staying with the girls while they (the parents) were in CA?

wow they have friends that can look after an adopted child and a newly out teen!!!

[Blackie]

8 hours ago, ams1001 said:

Guess I'm not up on the alcoholic tricks.

then you are lucky, because they have a LOT, and lying is #1 so Zoey better get used to it.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

First I'm going to be petty. I always have a charger with me because I have an iphone and the battery sucks. Because I know the battery sucks, I am always prepared because I don't want to be in a situation where my phone dies. I have a charger that I leave in my car. I have a charging cord plus a credit card sized power bank that I always have in my purse. I have another charger that I leave in my carryon bag for when I travel (along with a power strip in case there is a plug behind a chair or table). Just because I'm prepared doesn't mean I have to share my charger with anyone, RANDALL.

To be fair, Kevin was just as petty when he said, "You can see my charger but you can't use it." Funny how stress makes them revert back to their childhood dynamics of bickering (but also notice that they slipped back into their friendly mode without hesitation when they were talking about Kate's stuffed animals). There was no need for him to be rude to Madison though. She is Kate's best friend and if she wants to sit in the waiting room with you assholes, that's her choice (I loved that when she passed him on the way to the elevator, she just said, "NOPE!" and kept on walking).

Speaking of which, there was no need for everyone to side eye that grandmother in the waiting room for talking on her phone and opening a bag of pretzels. I know you're all stressed out, but you're in a waiting room, not a library.

Both Randall and Kevin were jerks to the nurse. It is not in your best interest to be rude to the gatekeeper. If she had information she could give you, she would have told you so quit hounding her. And Kevin was so terrible to the doctor earlier. Why is it so hard for this family to interact with people like polite human beings?

Jack's least favorite pie was pumpkin - finally, something we agree upon!

I rolled my eyes when Beth said the studio called to see if she could cover a class and Randall replied, "I'm sorry you had to miss that." Really? You're sorry she had to miss subbing for a class but you're not sorry about asking her to quit teaching entirely? Okay then. And five minutes later he says if she wants to teach, he's on board and he just wants her to be happy. WTF?

As much as I want Beth to be able to keep teaching dance, I loved when Randall told Rebecca and Miguel that MERRY CHRISTMAS they could provide free childcare for the girls and then Miguel dropped the "we might be moving to California" bombshell. HA!

I had mixed feelings about Rebecca's speech. On the one hand, yes, Kevin and Randall should be able to STFU for a few hours. If they were annoyed with the grandmother who had the audacity to eat pretzels in their presence, how do they think other people feel about listening to them fight and scream at each other? Oh wait, it's the Pearsons' world and we're all just living in it. On the other hand, they're stressed and trapped in a waiting room so it's not surprising that they started bickering. It shouldn't take being chastised by your mom to get you to quit yelling at each other in public.

I laughed when Rebecca said that Kate didn't want to name the baby until she saw him. Uh, no, Randall and Kevin had the correct assumption when they said she was going to name the baby Jack.

I felt bad for Zoe when Kevin put his sobriety on her by saying he couldn't do this without her. That's not her responsibility. We'll see if she sticks around now that she KNOWS he is still lying to her face (right after promising her that he wasn't drinking or lying anymore). To be fair, that's what addicts do - they lie to cover up their addiction so it's not surprising, but I would fully support her decision if she decided to leave.

Poor Miguel. He did his best to be supportive and lighten the mood and distract everyone and they spent the whole time shitting on him. Even his usual non-Pearson allies Beth and Toby!

[WhosThatGirl]

6 hours ago, MsJamieDornan said:

So true ! It was awful in so many ways. And not even close to being realistic. Probably the worst episode so far. It was annoying.

This season imho has had a lot of episodes that can be considered worst episode. It’s just been an off season for me.

[Katy M]

8 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Wow show, make me hate all the Pearson's why don't you?  It's bad enough the way they treat Miguel all the time, but a joke meant to point out just how very disliked he is, so that it would be a total shock that Kate might want to see him?  That was just mean.  I actually thought Toby was serious at first and that Kate might want to tell him something that he could break slowly to her mother.   Oh no, just Toby, not too exhausted to take a dig at a nice man, I guess.

I don't really think Toby was trying to be mean-spirited.  He was surprised that Miguel thought he was serious.  He even kind of looked like he felt bad that he hurt his feelings, he just had bigger things on his mind.  Toby feels an outsider kinship with Miguel.  If anyone else had said it, it would have been mean.  But, as for Toby, it was just a bad joke.

8 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I really didn't agree with Rebecca that everyone needed to sit in silence for 36 hours.  It might actually have been a good time for some serious discussions but I guess if she wanted to talk about light sockets the whole time it was her call.

I don't think she cared if they talked about other stuff. She just didn't want to hear them fight, and I can't blame her for that.  RAndall and Kevin were acting like 5 year olds.

[gameshowjunkie]

The doctor was a real asshole. Can't believe no one went off on him. 

I don't care for Miguel's personality, but he is an excellent husband to Rebecca. The kids should recognize it and be grateful that she has someone like him beside her as she gets older.

The vodka in the water bottle was so obvious. 

Madison is a great friend to Kate and the Pearsons were all dicks to her. I was surprised they went there with the RBG doll- the show usually stays away from politics. I remember one brief mention of Clinton's loss early on. I liked it though, both because of RBG and the boy with a doll thing.

Randall gets worse every episode with the way he is dealing with Beth. He bought a car for what, almost 200 grand for cash and now he's bitching about babysitting costs? I work full time and have a teenage son so day care is not an issue but getting him to sports, music. and math is. I am on multiple group texts with other parents to make it all work. It can be done without getting full-time help. Find another parent in the activity and carpool.

I get like Rebecca when I am sleep-deprived and stressed, so I didn't read anything medical into her behavior.

My best friend's daughter was born three months earlier. I went to see them in the hospital and burst into tears as soon as I saw her tiny body in the isolette. I thought the show captured that pretty well with Kate and Toby.

[Biggie B]

Awful episode. I have no problem with an episode which is totally dialogue-driven, I actually sometimes prefer that now and then, but this was just wretched. I really didn't want an hour of people sniping at and attacking each other. And absolutely nothing came of it. True, this wasn't a guided therapy session in a controlled setting, but still - it was just stressful and unpleasant, and made me dislike each character even more (with an exception here and there). 

Also - were we viewers ever, ever, ever supposed to even think for a SECOND that Kate's life was in peril? Unless the actress is leaving the show, we know she's staying alive. Thus, any suspense or tension over her life is effectively removed. Yeah, yeah, maybe she'll suffer some residual issues from the pregnancy, but we saw, way back in another episode, a flash forward in which Kate was just fine, walking and talking without a problem. So to write this episode as if something could go wrong with Kate was a waste of time and effort.

If anything, it seemed that something is wrong with Rebecca, cognitively. Yes, she was exhausted and hadn't eaten or slept, but still - something's off with her and haven't there been some direct and indirect mentions of some issues with her? That's something to focus on, not Kate or the baby. 

I came away from this episode less interested and less invested with this show and its characters. I realize that drama and tension and stress make for more compelling viewing - no one wants to watch happiness, it's boring - but the way it's being done and/or written is so off-putting. In order for me to care about these characters, I have to feel like they're worth fighting for, even when they're behaving in the worst possible ways. But right now, I'm not interested in rooting for any of them...there seems little chance of a decent return on my emotional investment in these characters. I'm not seeing much of a light at the end of anyone's tunnel. 

[Maximona]

8 hours ago, Katy M said:

So, I guess Zoe may be pushing Kevin away for lying to her. I get her being upset that he's lying, but they really need to sit things out and talk instead of Zoe looking at getting out, as I suspect that she will.

Why would she want to talk?  I mean, what exactly is there to say?

She must know something about Kevin's history with substances at this point.

Who would want to subject themselves to being another chapter in that?

What a ridiculous, pointless episode. I don't buy that Randall and Beth would put a stop-freeze on their own lives to fly 3,200 miles and sit in a waiting room.  Not when they knew other family members were there.  Earth to increasingly bad This Is Us writing team:  In real life, families delegate!

[truebluesmoky]

The longer I think about it, the madder I get about how Madison was treated and how no one stuck up for her. She’s Kate’s best friend and main support system in LA besides Toby. She knew more about the birth plan than any of the Pearsons and was even SUPPOSED to be there for labor and delivery per said birth plan. It was a big deal for Kate to even make and trust a female friend, so her having done so should have been a clue to the Pearsons that Madison was more than an outlier and was  an integral part of Kate’s support system. I felt bad that she left at all, but I’m glad it gave her the opportunity to bring the Ruth toy. However, once she brought that back to the hospital, she should have dug in her heels and stayed and/or SOMEONE from the family should have told her to stay.

Edited March 13, 2019 by truebluesmoky

[zillabreeze]

39 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

40 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Speaking of which, there was no need for everyone to side eye that grandmother in the waiting room for talking on her phone and opening a bag of pretzels. I know you're all stressed out, but you're in a waiting room, not a library.

Au contraire!  Pretzel Meemaw committed the heinous crime of interloping into the Braverman   Pearson vortex with her own happy news.

I guess the "shocking" twist was that Randall DIDN'T spend five minutes lecturing Pretzel Meemaw on the error of her ways.  I expected a verbal beatdown and was "speechless" went it didn't happen.

[WhosThatGirl]

54 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

First I'm going to be petty. I always have a charger with me because I have an iphone and the battery sucks. Because I know the battery sucks, I am always prepared because I don't want to be in a situation where my phone dies. I have a charger that I leave in my car. I have a charging cord plus a credit card sized power bank that I always have in my purse. I have another charger that I leave in my carryon bag for when I travel (along with a power strip in case there is a plug behind a chair or table). Just because I'm prepared doesn't mean I have to share my charger with anyone, RANDALL.

To be fair, Kevin was just as petty when he said, "You can see my charger but you can't use it." Funny how stress makes them revert back to their childhood dynamics of bickering (but also notice that they slipped back into their friendly mode without hesitation when they were talking about Kate's stuffed animals). There was no need for him to be rude to Madison though. She is Kate's best friend and if she wants to sit in the waiting room with you assholes, that's her choice (I loved that when she passed him on the way to the elevator, she just said, "NOPE!" and kept on walking).

Speaking of which, there was no need for everyone to side eye that grandmother in the waiting room for talking on her phone and opening a bag of pretzels. I know you're all stressed out, but you're in a waiting room, not a library.

Both Randall and Kevin were jerks to the nurse. It is not in your best interest to be rude to the gatekeeper. If she had information she could give you, she would have told you so quit hounding her. And Kevin was so terrible to the doctor earlier. Why is it so hard for this family to interact with people like polite human beings?

Jack's least favorite pie was pumpkin - finally, something we agree upon!

I rolled my eyes when Beth said the studio called to see if she could cover a class and Randall replied, "I'm sorry you had to miss that." Really? You're sorry she had to miss subbing for a class but you're not sorry about asking her to quit teaching entirely? Okay then. And five minutes later he says if she wants to teach, he's on board and he just wants her to be happy. WTF?

As much as I want Beth to be able to keep teaching dance, I loved when Randall told Rebecca and Miguel that MERRY CHRISTMAS they could provide free childcare for the girls and then Miguel dropped the "we might be moving to California" bombshell. HA!

I had mixed feelings about Rebecca's speech. On the one hand, yes, Kevin and Randall should be able to STFU for a few hours. If they were annoyed with the grandmother who had the audacity to eat pretzels in their presence, how do they think other people feel about listening to them fight and scream at each other? Oh wait, it's the Pearsons' world and we're all just living in it. On the other hand, they're stressed and trapped in a waiting room so it's not surprising that they started bickering. It shouldn't take being chastised by your mom to get you to quit yelling at each other in public.

I laughed when Rebecca said that Kate didn't want to name the baby until she saw him. Uh, no, Randall and Kevin had the correct assumption when they said she was going to name the baby Jack.

I felt bad for Zoe when Kevin put his sobriety on her by saying he couldn't do this without her. That's not her responsibility. We'll see if she sticks around now that she KNOWS he is still lying to her face (right after promising her that he wasn't drinking or lying anymore). To be fair, that's what addicts do - they lie to cover up their addiction so it's not surprising, but I would fully support her decision if she decided to leave.

Poor Miguel. He did his best to be supportive and lighten the mood and distract everyone and they spent the whole time shitting on him. Even his usual non-Pearson allies Beth and Toby!

Ha!! I have a battery pack charger and a car charger and I have an extra wall charger in my purse as well because I like to keep the one I use at home at home. Also I’ve been looking into getting a charging cell phone case as well because I’m always paranoid my cell phone is going to die when I really need it. This hasn’t happened yet. It happened a lot when I use to have an Android years ago and back then I didn’t have a battery pack charger and I was alwaysbat like 3% when I needed to make a phone call.

I got a laugh out of Kevin being like “yeah I’m at 70% but I’m still Using it” because it’s such a sibling/family thing to do. I can’t say me or my siblings wouldn’t make this comment either. We probably would.

I didn’t get the whole point of having the happy grandmother in the waiting room with the Pearson’s. I feel like we were not supposed to like her because she was having a good day of news and the Pearson’s weren’t? And then we were supposed to roll our eyes when the family started yelling because she walked out? Huh? I don’t.. really understand. Anyone would have walked out. 

I still liked Rebecca. Aside from Miguel, she’s the only one I liked. I didn’t even really like Beth all that much tonight either. I do wish Rebecca hadn’t made this about Jack though and like someone else said why she couldn’t have been thinking about her unborn son. She hardly ever gets to. 

I agree with what someone else said that the moment when Randall apologized to Rebecca about his outburst about her moving, he did sound and act like young Randall, more than I’ve ever been able to parallel the two.  The only other one who has been able to do this kind of well is Kate and that’s just because all three of the actress playing kate have really good similarities look wise.

[ShadowFacts]

49 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I don't really think Toby was trying to be mean-spirited.  He was surprised that Miguel thought he was serious.  He even kind of looked like he felt bad that he hurt his feelings, he just had bigger things on his mind.  Toby feels an outsider kinship with Miguel.  If anyone else had said it, it would have been mean.  But, as for Toby, it was just a bad joke.

It was a cheap shot, and an example of the writers being too cool for their own good.  A minute ago he was understandably looking shell-shocked and couldn't even explain what had happened, then he comes up with a zinger against one of the more sympathetic characters.  Now if it had been unleashed on Randall or Kevin. . . I am truly sick of the two of them and their never-ending sibling rivalry.  They bring out the worst in each other, and increasingly, I dislike their characters.  They sprinkle in the occasional supportive gesture but it never takes and there is now tedious repetition of their unresolved issues.  This episode just highlighted the worst features of the show -- the self-absorbed natures of most of them, and how Jack's death looms over everything, including a newborn and the ongoing disrespect of Miguel.  I am happy at least there were no flashbacks, probably the only thing that would have made the episode worse, as someone mentioned. 

[Katy M]

4 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I didn’t get the whole point of having the happy grandmother in the waiting room with the Pearson’s. I feel like we were not supposed to like her because she was having a good day of news and the Pearson’s weren’t? And then we were supposed to roll our eyes when the family started yelling because she walked out? Huh? I don’t.. really understand. Anyone would have walked out. 

That reminded me that I liked that Rebecca just said congratulations and smiled when the woman told her she wanted a boy, blah blah blah.  I really thought she, or someone else, was going to launch into a whole speech about Kate's woes,and how dare she want a boy when all they want is a healthy baby and for Kate to live and how Jack  something.  Then, at least Randall only whispered his pretzel bag complaint to Beth.  I thought someone was going to go off on her about that, too.  

[Jodithgrace]

I agree with pretty much everyone about how annoying this episode was. Why can't the Pearsons do anything normally? They could have taken shifts, so that various couples could take showers and have real meals. There was no need for all 400 of them to take over an entire waiting room for 26 hours. 

Also, when Madison shows up with the RBG doll, nobody told her that the baby was born! WTH?

Also, and this was the most annoying thing..every time somebody was about to say something significant about Kate or the baby, they would cut to commercial! Luckily I watch all shows on DVR and FF over commercials, but a lot of people don't and that really aggravated me. Like when Toby finally comes out, looks at everybody and gives this big sigh, which could be happy or sad and then...commercial!  Arggh! So manipulative! 

[Haleth]

I'm sorry, but it was completely ridiculous for everyone to fly across the country to sit in the waiting room.  Looking at you, Randall and Beth.  They have obligations at home and money problems, so for them both to drop everything and fly to LA does not make sense. 

I'm just not feeling this show anymore.  Too much manufactured drama and emotional manipulation.  Of course the baby survived.  Of course Kate named him Jack.  The early part of the season with the Vietnam story and Nicky was wonderful, but everything since then has been overly dramatic crap.  As other posters have said, the Big 3 are self absorbed and rude.  The acting is spot on, but the characters are insufferable.

[Ohiopirate02]

6 hours ago, izabella said:

I hold an unpopular opinion in that I really liked this episode.  In my head, I was congratulating the writers for showing they can write a compelling episode without resorting to flashbacks.   I like when the family is together and they are airing their dirty laundry.  That's better than all the shows where people never tell each other important things.

I also liked this episode.  I thought it was a good callback to the family therapy session last season.  I liked that the family still had issues that needed to be addressed and that one therapy session did not cure the family dynamic.  

[Katy M]

12 minutes ago, Haleth said:

I'm sorry, but it was completely ridiculous for everyone to fly across the country to sit in the waiting room.  Looking at you, Randall and Beth.  They have obligations at home and money problems, so for them both to drop everything and fly to LA does not make sense. 

yeah, it makes no sense to want to see your sister before she potentially dies.  

[Pallas]

Quote

Kevin's lie isn't great, but she has to realize that he has a hard time opening up as much as she does.Plus, I fear that Kevin's fear about her leaving him is being subconsciously driven through him lying and that'll cause her to really leave him. Obviously he should be honest. I just hope that Zoe won't just take off.

I love how Kevin's character has developed and been developed, and agree with Miguel about how much he resembles Jack: Jack at his best. But the question isn't whether or not Kevin, sober, can open up. Right now, Kevin's lies have nothing to do with who Kevin is, and everything to do with his relapse. Active addicts can be counted on to do two things: use and lie.

I thought the show did a great job of showing the ass that Kevin would become as alcohol withdrawal set in. The way he reverted to the snide, resentful, arrogant teen phase he tried on at 17, just before his injury and subsequent addiction. Snide with Madison, resentful with Randall, arrogant with the doctor. 

And of course that pushed Randall's buttons -- that, along with the instinctive uneasiness that sets in from being trapped with an addict in need of a fix. That desperation has an odor. Miguel may even have remembered it from Jack, and so, his gentle "One thing at a time" to Randall. What was also realistic was that no one, including Zoe, interfered or dared to go with Kevin when he went out "to get some air."  They were too tired and despondent to know what they knew.

If Zoe wants to stay, she needs her own support. A person or a program she listens to, even when she doesn't want to hear it. Someone to remind her, "Nothing gets better between you as long as he's using. Nothing. As long as he's using, he's committed to a one-way relationship with one thing only -- and it's not you."  I also loved how Zoe prepared to be devastated as she asked Kevin, "Were you drinking in Vietnam?" Kevin in Vietnam: the man who heard her out and held her close.