S03.E16: Forfeiture

[thewhiteowl]

The team works two related cases when Chunk takes his first client and Bull takes that client's grandfather.

[MerBearHou]

I’m glad for both outcomes, but I really, really didn’t like how Bull and in particular Benny talked to Chunk.  Tough love? I don’t think so.  It came across as rude, tyrannical, disrespectful, bullying, horrible mentoring and teaching of their colleague.  

[Ellee]

Any Person of Interest fans here? Was Darius the kid from POI that hired Reese for a quarter to find his brother’s killer?  Just all grown up.  

[meira.hand]

4 hours ago, Ellee said:

Any Person of Interest fans here? Was Darius the kid from POI that hired Reese for a quarter to find his brother’s killer?  Just all grown up.  

Yes. His name is Astro

[HurricaneVal]

I love Chunk, and I love his passion, so I was happy to see a Chunk episode.  But not the way Bull and Benny treated him.  Again, maybe they were trying to get him to toughen up, but he's supposedly their friend, and they should have cut him a little slack, because in the end, his instincts were good.

I did like the "case-of-the-week" and the twist there.  That was something I've never seen before.

[LuvMyShows]

I don't remember the specific episode, but I definitely remember Bull taking a case where the person did it, and Bull's job as defense was to explain why.  IIRC, it dealt with a topic that was a little controversial, like abortion, or abuse, or something like that (or maybe it was predicated on taking an unusual slant on something that required people to really alter their usual outlook on the subject?).  So it struck me as hypocritical to advise Chunk not to do it.  Plus, what other strategy/tactic did Chunk have?

[Dowel Jones]

I realize that courtroom procedures are routinely stretched on this show, and sometimes taken into the back room and slapped senseless, but, in real life, is a defense attorney allowed to argue that the jury acquit a defendant simply because the punishment would be too severe? It's the judge's decision on the level of punishment, and the jury is to decide only the issue of guilt or innocence, or so I thought.

Did TAC have two mirror juries going on this one?

Bull still pining for Diana. 

[Sake614]

‘Boo hoo, the big bad FBI agent made me do it. He stalked me and kept hounding me until I finally agreed to sell counterfeit merchandise.’ Between that and chunks argument that the crime didn’t hurt anyone because people Knew they were buying knock offs, I was ready to throw something st the TV.

So now any time someone gets arrested for selling counterfeit bags etc they can just argue that they were only trying to help their parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, 6th cousins etc. and they shouldn’t be convicted even though they’re  guilty.

i also didn’t get how the jury could possibly acquit when he already admitted guilt? Charge him with  a lesser count sure (if the judge allowed a lesser charge) but acquit? Yeah I don’t think so.

otoh it was nice to see Ben Vereen again 😀

[sr49ers2018]

On 2/26/2019 at 8:30 AM, HurricaneVal said:

I love Chunk, and I love his passion, so I was happy to see a Chunk episode.  But not the way Bull and Benny treated him.  Again, maybe they were trying to get him to toughen up, but he's supposedly their friend, and they should have cut him a little slack, because in the end, his instincts were good.

I did like the "case-of-the-week" and the twist there.  That was something I've never seen before.

sorry but they were right to be mad. he defied them. he is not a lawyer..Benny is. Lucky for Chunk this is a tv show..lol and the black kid got off. in real life the jury would have sent the black kid to 30 years and his uncle to chair.

[sr49ers2018]

14 hours ago, Sake614 said:

‘Boo hoo, the big bad FBI agent made me do it. He stalked me and kept hounding me until I finally agreed to sell counterfeit merchandise.’ Between that and chunks argument that the crime didn’t hurt anyone because people Knew they were buying knock offs, I was ready to throw something st the TV.

So now any time someone gets arrested for selling counterfeit bags etc they can just argue that they were only trying to help their parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, 6th cousins etc. and they shouldn’t be convicted even though they’re  guilty.

i also didn’t get how the jury could possibly acquit when he already admitted guilt? Charge him with  a lesser count sure (if the judge allowed a lesser charge) but acquit? Yeah I don’t think so.

otoh it was nice to see Ben Vereen again 😀

well i guess its ok FBI or police to trick you into committing crime (especially those in tough/poor situations). and then use it to get promotions.

they should have actually thrownt he fbi agent in jail for making him a criminal. and if you think this kind of nonsense doesnt happen with non white kids then your kidding your self. this is a country where drug users get more time in jail than rapist and murders .

[Sake614]

I’m not saying the FBI agent was right. But just because he pushed doesn’t mean the kid had to agree. He knew it was illegal but went along with it anyway because ‘everyone knows it isn’t real so there’s no harm.’  With an attitude like that, who’s to say he won’t continue to get into trouble and expect to be bailed out? Actions have consequences and I don’t think he should have been let off scot free.

[JessDVD]

I generally take the line of actions have consequences and doing the right thing means doing the right thing even when it's hard. So I think it would have been appropriate for the kid to face some level of consequence for what he did. But there has got to be some kind ethical boundary for FBI agents that doesn't involve practically stalking a kid to try to get him to do something illegal, to then turn around and arrest him and get promotions. THAT might have been a more interesting case to watch, where the kid were suing the FBI agent or something like that.

Watching people who are normally friends compete against each other like that is boring and uncomfortable. I'm not even sure it falls outside of conflict of interest to have a law student and a law student's boss managing cases that intersect like that.

All of that to say, I enjoyed watching Chunk be a lawyer and I'm hopeful for more of that. Of all the things that the writers do terribly while I continue to watch, the one area they shine IMO, is writing Benny's arguing in court (his own testifying's legal standing, notwithstanding), and I think there's a good chance they'll write Chunk well also.

[Netfoot]

23 hours ago, JessDVD said:

All of that to say, I enjoyed watching Chunk be a lawyer and I'm hopeful for more of that.

Well, it's better than when he was just a dhobi wallah...

[luvly]

This episode was just uncomfortable on so many levels. I'm annoyed that the writers laid the groundwork for what could have been an interesting look at disenfranchisement and then backed out of the opening they gave themselves. The FBI agent tried to rope Darius into the scheme multiple times, Bull pointedly mentions how much the barbershop's land will be worth in a couple of years due to the neighborhood's current gentrification and then it comes out the the agent profits from forfeiture proceedings. Nobody's going to touch that? Instead they're just going to have Bull and Benny act like Chunk is being unreasonably stubborn? And what the hell was up with them getting dangerously close to actively forcing Chunk not to work in the best interest of his client?

On 2/27/2019 at 12:30 AM, Dowel Jones said:

I realize that courtroom procedures are routinely stretched on this show, and sometimes taken into the back room and slapped senseless, but, in real life, is a defense attorney allowed to argue that the jury acquit a defendant simply because the punishment would be too severe? It's the judge's decision on the level of punishment, and the jury is to decide only the issue of guilt or innocence, or so I thought.

Jury nullification is a thing but there are laws in various jurisdictions that make it very difficult for anybody to actually inform jurors that they have that option.